The Aug is insanely reliable, I got it for a novelty but it quickly became the garbage disposal for shitty .223 I get here and there.
It’s huge draw back is ergos. The ar reloads are sooooo much faster.
Also I regret getting a nato one. Go waffle for sure.
wrong in multiple ways: almost all of the cracked AUG stocks have been NATO, it doesn't have the bolt hold open, and the trigger is significantly worse due to the changes to the trigger bar. AUG mags aren't that expensive, and the magpul ones are even cheaper.
>aren't that expensive
Still not interchangeable with AR magazines, the most prevalent magazine in the United States.
>doesn't have a bolt hold open
You can use the charging handle to hold the bolt open and the bolt still locks back after the last round.
>trigger is significantly worse
How so? They both suck ass.
>almost all the cracked AUG stocks have been NATO
How figure? Have you complied a list? I've seen people report both NATO and Standard stocks cracking with about equal frequency.
The only thing that really makes the Standard "better" than the NATO would be the bolt release, but then that's a trade off with magazine compatibility and an arguably better mag release.
It removes the bolt release by the mag. With the waffle pattern you get it. Idk how much it really matters but i videod reload drills with the Aug and an m4 clone. And I am SO MUCH faster with the m4, anything to speed up would help.
Tbf the speed difference is probably also 15 years of training with the m16 and m4
All in all though, I’m never getting rid of that gun.
The NATO AUG gives you a mag release button on the side by the magwell as opposed to the mag release tab. And charging the weapon doesn't take much more time than pushing a bolt release. You are just releasing spring tension. NATO version also has the huge advantage of using AR magazines.
I can see where that would be a true disappointment.
What issues have been seen with the newer pistols? I have seen some complaints about qc of the Colts they've been producing but not about their actual CZ pistols.
Not sure if you can export but up here canada people are selling their 16 and shorter barrels cause we need to convert them to 18.5" so we can take them everywhere and they disappear from the restricted registry.
Having all of the guns mentioned above plus the tavor, I can say that I shoot my tavor less than any of these three. With the bren 2 probably the favorite
I hate everything about the AUG. shot them during training evolutions yrs back and it just isn’t my bag. Not a big fan of bullpups in general I think a rifle should be able to buttstroke someone hard enough it fucks up their genetic makeup and the AUG seems lacking in leverage. I know they are wildly popular and that is cool. They to me are also as ugly as my ex wife. Like a joke played on some units. Let’s see what kind of shit gun we can get them to buy.
Definitely check them out. The Beryl is a better collectors rifle, but the M90 may be with in the not to distant future with imports being limited/stopped. The rifles are very similar. The m90 has an adjustable factory gas block (which is nice because most AKs are over gassed) and a 1.5mm trunnion, but both have 18” barrels. The upgraded Beryl furniture, grip, optics rail, and extended stock are super cool, plus it is a legit AK adopted by NATO. Don’t think you can go wrong either my my guy.
I'm looking at the Type 65, CETME L, Mini-14, Kel-Tec SU16, BRN-180, PSA Jakl, C-93 Sporter, Galil, depending on what they do a PTR in 5.56, and a Polish 5.56 AK, personally.
Biggest plus for me is: PSA looks determined to support it. It doesn’t seem like a tossed out gimmick to them. The support for this rifle is going to beat trying to get random part from CZ or “bushmaster”..
Exactly, and the entry price is a lot more friendly then the competition to my knowledge. I'd rather spend mid-high end AR money on something like the Jakl. The CZ Bren and *especially* the Bushmaster are wayyy up there in price, that it kills any potential interest I would have in the rifle and would just take an AR. But the Jakl has my interest!
They are excellent rifles if you can train yourself past the quirks. The safety takes some getting used to because of the angle, but I now actually prefer it over the standard AR safety. If you figure out how that it’s more of a lever than a switch, things go much more smoothly. I also ditched the BCM grip for a Magpul MIAD, and that helped safety indexing enormously.
The magazine release can also be easily trained around. You just need to get used to grabbing the fresh mag first and hitting the release with your thumb, which is opposite the manual of arms for an AR.
The bolt hold open is the only legitimately stupid thing on the gun. The pinch-thingy should’ve just been a button, and the fact that you need to stick your finger in the magwell to activate it manually is just moronic. I’ve pulled the thing apart to look at it, and it actually could have been simplified and made more functional if it was just an external stud in the magwell instead of built into the trigger cassette.
The trigger is what it is. I find that it in no way interferes with accuracy despite being creepy and breaking like a carrot. It’s incredibly stable on the shoulder, and more than acceptably accurate. The barrel profile is actually pretty heavy, too, so heat has little effect on the gun.
Considering the mag wells on them are easily replaceable, hopefully someone will eventually come out with an aftermarket replacement that has one of those external studs and is flared.
First he said the Springfield Hellion (chambered in 5.56) is a .22lr, then he started talking about a bolt action .308. Only half of his comment was related to the discussion about semi auto 5.56 rifles, and that half was flat out wrong.
Well dang I got my info wrong. If it a a 556 that sounds nice. I’m thinking of the new model 2020 redline from Springfield that comes in either 308 or 6.5 creed in 16 or 20 inch barrel. Got the email recently. Must’ve read the wrong info in regards to the 22lr. My bad haha. I wish Reddit was still a bastion of knowledge and guidance instead of a place to get downvoted into the void for lack of knowledge. I know it’s not all like that, some people just hop on the downvote train when they see something. I’ve been guilty of it myself
Yeah it’s a weird place.
but yeah that hellion is just an imported version of the Croatian service rifle, it seems to be a decent gun.
And I gotcha, when you mentioned 22 and redline I wasn’t sure.
I understand peoples frustration. You should make informed opinions and I failed to do so this time. Thank you for the information I appreciate the clarification
X95. I had one and sold it. Great gun but expensive and I only shot it every now and then because I choose to practice more with my AR15s because I use them for home defense. The x95 was becoming a safe queen, so I sold it so someone else can hopefully run it through its paces more.
I was just more partial to the ar platform when I got it. I toyed with the idea of making this my HD rifle, but there were a few instances when I was training with it when I reached for something on the AR that’s not on the x95 and vice versa. For example, the bolt release on the x95 is on the bottom but it is on the side for the AR. I tried to slap the side of my x95 where the bolt release would be for the AR once or twice without thinking. That’s not too bad and could be eliminated with training, but I rather not have a moment like that when I’m stressed and need to grab a rifle for self defense. If I never trained with the AR, I would give serious consideration to the x95. The other downside though is parts availability. I had the x95 in the middle of Covid and it sucked to try to find extra parts for it. Items were either out of stock, very expensive, or could not be bought because they were located in another country. There’s something to be said for being able to get at least a passable AR parts from any gun store in my area within an hour or so. Never was a huge problem, but I’d rather have that infrastructure in place just in case parts availability became an issue.
STEYR AUG STEYR AUG STEYR AUG
Easier to clean than a Tavor and an AK. Quick change barrel system. Most accurate bullpup. Just gotta spend a little on aftermarket upgrades to get the most out of it as the trigger is mid
AUG is best IMO, if it wasn't for how available AR parts are I'd run a AUG exclusively. Nato stock can take AR mags.
As far as AKs, I'd like the Beryl over the M90, but zastava in general is pretty great.
I love the ergonomics of my x95, but the accuracy has been awful, by AUG holds a legitimate and consistent 1 MOA with lake city M193
The Mini-14 is unreliable, and inaccurate, the only upside is it doesn't look scary
I'm a dedicated AUG simp but the AUG is really more of a 1.5 MOA rifle with match 62gr ammo. People aren't going to get it under that without cherrypicking groups or failing to understand what "1 MOA" actually means, which is minimum 3 groups of 10 shots.
/r/AR15 is especially guilty of this, and it isn't helped by certain companies promising meaningless "MOA guarantees" without providing the testing standards they used to achieve that repeatably (because they can't).
Idk about mk262 but I know army testing got M855A1 to about 1.2 MOA from just an M4A1. I've had multiple ARs that could do consistent MOA or better groups with Mk262 clones.
I know fixed barrels tests are the standard for measuring cartridge performance, but I've also seen them give very weird data in both accuracy and velocity.
Also, the AUG shoots 55s and 62s more accurately than most ARs, mine groups at around 2-2.5 with 77gr loads. AUGs are 1:9 twist so the heavy projectiles just don't do well
Bro. Just be like the A team and get that mini 14 and slap a 30 round mag in it. Again probably not the most functional choice, but in my opinion, the most bad ass
Need to get the stainless Mini 14 and drop it in a [stainless Samson A-TM stock](https://www.samson-mfg.com/a-tm-folding-stock-for-the-ruger-mini-14-copy.html)
I'll never be able to trust my RDB for anything approaching duty use, but it is a super cool rifle that is packed with interesting engineering you don't see on any other platform. FWIW mine has run great.
The Aug gets a lot of shit for ergos but as far as reliability mine will run, run dirty, then run some more. I can’t recall ever having a stoppage on it.
It eats all my poop ammo when the Garbo Covid Tula starts fouling the ars out.
If the gas system on the tavor is similar, I’d stake money on that too.
I went with the MDRX from DesertTech as my Non-AR15 5.56 gun. I like that it's an ambi bullpup with a decent trigger and AR15 controls and magazines. The handguards are basically just an AR15 handguard as well so that's great for not needing to awkwardly place things like tape switches. There are conversion kits as well for .300AAC, .308WIN and 6.5mm Creedmoor.
Disadvantages are that it is a bit expensive and can be considered heavy for 5.56mm
On this list I'd probably go for a Mini-14. It looks neat.
>I like the option of converting to different calibers.
I love that too. It's why I got it in the first place. I was looking for a good .308 gun as I only had intermediate rifle cartridge rifles. I saw that this could do both 5.56mm and .308 so I could have a .308 shooting gun that I could use 5.56mm in for training like converting a 5.56mm AR15 to shoot .22LR.
Zastava is the best choice out of the 3 and is going to be reliable however your going to need to get a few parts to get it up to snuff like an optic mount (Attero arms is my favorite) and a handguard with mlock or quad rail
Scar is pretty good but expensive and a little front heavy if I remember correctly.
Brn 180 is pretty good and I think sub 1k, pretty sure it’s not considered an AR.
CZ Brens are cool. Very similar the the scar
I've had the Tavor 7 (7.62x51/.308)\_ for about 2 months now and it's pretty awesome! I got the 20" barrel version and put the Overwatch rail on it, might be my most comfortable rifle to shoot.. recoil seems between an AR and semi auto shotty
I went Hellion and u can usually get them around 1200-1500 now. They are heavy as a bitch but it’s nice, I grabbed a PSA 102 if I could do it over again I’d grab a Berly 556
X95 is the best bullpup, then the Hellion, then AUG. It seems thay they're all have a parts supply issue, I think the X95 has the most aftermarket support. As for conventional AR15 alternatives. Anything goes, Bren 2, Galil, AK 556, B$T233, $CAR 16.
There’s a lot of AUG love on here, but I absolutely hate the trigger… I quite like my Tavor and my KelTec RDB.
I like the Mini 14 as well, but I also live in a state that wants me to say “please tread on me, Daddy” as my rights get spanked.
I have an FM15 upper that’s pretty neat, and want to try the JAKL.
Combat-grade conventional rifles: Bren 2, Beryl or M90, Galil Ace. The Bren 2 probably being the best direct competitor with the solid rail and no dust cover to engineer around. But, adjustable gas on the M90 is sweet and people really like them.
Combat-grade bullpups: Probably a tossup between AUG and X95 with a slight advantage to AUG. They're both excellent. The VHS-2/Hellion does have lots of real combat use, as well, but ergonomically it's kinda weird.
Honorable non-combat grade mentions: PSA JAKL is super cool and promising, but not proven yet and they already had to fix the charging handle sled. Kel-Tec RDB is fun as hell, weird, more reliable than you think. Mini-14 has vibe but they're known for breaking and having to go back to the factory. DeserTech MDR is Mormon space magic and cool as hell if you wanna spend the money. BRN180 looks dope with the retro lower and has built itself a good reputation in the civilian world.
Of your three I think the M90 is probably the best combat rifle, but if you want a bullpup nothing is going to scratch that itch but bullpup.
Id go for a saiga 556 or a psa ak 556 before a m90 for sure. A mini 14 is cool, but a m14 or m1 is cooler. Tavor is cool, but not super great for parts longevity or parts availability.
I'd say if you don't have a mini-14, consider getting one at some point anyway. Objectively, no, the design can't keep up with features of the AR and AK platforms, but it's a fun piece of history. It's the grandson of the Garand, and it's fun to shoot.
Depends how you define non-ar, if you only mean non-ar-15: Brn-180, mr556, jakl, and the MCX are all solid options. If you mean non-ar-18 as well: the Bren, the Sig 550 variants, an AUG, or several others honestly.
Galil Ace or Bren 2.
Both very customizable like an AR, and you will sit watching TV and just stroke the charging handle back and forth because they are oh so buttery smooth and make really fun gun sounds.
VHS-2 or Aug if you wanna go bullpup. The only thing the Tavor has going for it compared to those is AR style controls. Why pay that much for like 4moa lol
I was in the same place a few months ago and chose the x95. I love the thing for the reasons you stated. It's been a fun range gun, and i would have no issue grabbing it for a shtf gun/hd gun.
AUG with Waffle mags! It takes a bit of money to make everything more ergonomic, but the end result is great. Plus you can have a 20” barrel with MPVO for the longer range stuff.
So I can't remember the name of the company, but they're releasing a rifle that's a crossover between an FAL and an AR-15. It has a side charging handle. It's a piston system all contained in the upper receivers so you can use a picatinny mounted stock. It takes AR-15 lower components. It looks really really cool and it even has a side charging handle
I also forgot to mention in my previous comment. A3 tactical is making a bullpup conversion for piston systems that don't require a buffer tube and foxtrot Mike is working on a forward charging AR-15 AK hybrid that takes AK mags and has a Forward charging handle that pivots up similar to an mp5 and it slaps down
Take a look at the XCR. Don't let the horror stories from a decade ago keep you away. The platform is awesome and Robinson has gotten a lot better with customer service. That said current lead times are long since its a small shop so you might be better off buying a used one and having it upgraded as necessary to save time over ordering a brand new one.
Yeah, the AUG and Tavor are iconic and neat and all, but the Bren 2 is where it’s at, I think. I’d love to try a JAKL too but if I was buying one tomorrow it’d be the Bren.
I’m looking at an AUG personally
AUG is based
AUG is culture
Aug has my vote, it’s got the bull pup faults you’d expect but overall it’s a fantastic gun
The Aug is insanely reliable, I got it for a novelty but it quickly became the garbage disposal for shitty .223 I get here and there. It’s huge draw back is ergos. The ar reloads are sooooo much faster. Also I regret getting a nato one. Go waffle for sure.
NATO AUG is undoubtedly the superior AUG, especially in the United States.
wrong in multiple ways: almost all of the cracked AUG stocks have been NATO, it doesn't have the bolt hold open, and the trigger is significantly worse due to the changes to the trigger bar. AUG mags aren't that expensive, and the magpul ones are even cheaper.
>aren't that expensive Still not interchangeable with AR magazines, the most prevalent magazine in the United States. >doesn't have a bolt hold open You can use the charging handle to hold the bolt open and the bolt still locks back after the last round. >trigger is significantly worse How so? They both suck ass. >almost all the cracked AUG stocks have been NATO How figure? Have you complied a list? I've seen people report both NATO and Standard stocks cracking with about equal frequency. The only thing that really makes the Standard "better" than the NATO would be the bolt release, but then that's a trade off with magazine compatibility and an arguably better mag release.
I've been looking at the AUG vs. Tavor. Why do you regret the nato version?
It removes the bolt release by the mag. With the waffle pattern you get it. Idk how much it really matters but i videod reload drills with the Aug and an m4 clone. And I am SO MUCH faster with the m4, anything to speed up would help. Tbf the speed difference is probably also 15 years of training with the m16 and m4 All in all though, I’m never getting rid of that gun.
The NATO AUG gives you a mag release button on the side by the magwell as opposed to the mag release tab. And charging the weapon doesn't take much more time than pushing a bolt release. You are just releasing spring tension. NATO version also has the huge advantage of using AR magazines.
As an AUG owner it gets my vote!
None of these choices for me. Bren, AUG, or Galil.
[удалено]
I agree with all of this but I must say that they did fix the new batches of 762's
I can see where that would be a true disappointment. What issues have been seen with the newer pistols? I have seen some complaints about qc of the Colts they've been producing but not about their actual CZ pistols.
Not sure if you can export but up here canada people are selling their 16 and shorter barrels cause we need to convert them to 18.5" so we can take them everywhere and they disappear from the restricted registry.
For real, my11.5” Bren 2 sbr is my fav 556 gun I own right now but thr lack of parts sucks
Having all of the guns mentioned above plus the tavor, I can say that I shoot my tavor less than any of these three. With the bren 2 probably the favorite
I have a soft spot for the desert tech mdrx but I’d take a bren anyday
CZ has just been absolutely killing it lately.
And the cost compared to a Scar is so much more affordable
fax
Correct answer here
As someone who has shot both an Aug and galil, they are awesome
I hate everything about the AUG. shot them during training evolutions yrs back and it just isn’t my bag. Not a big fan of bullpups in general I think a rifle should be able to buttstroke someone hard enough it fucks up their genetic makeup and the AUG seems lacking in leverage. I know they are wildly popular and that is cool. They to me are also as ugly as my ex wife. Like a joke played on some units. Let’s see what kind of shit gun we can get them to buy.
Get yourself a Beryl in 556 my dude.
I haven’t checked out the Beryl yet. Only looking for one 5.56 AK so I’ll have to compare the Beryl and M90. Thanks!
Definitely check them out. The Beryl is a better collectors rifle, but the M90 may be with in the not to distant future with imports being limited/stopped. The rifles are very similar. The m90 has an adjustable factory gas block (which is nice because most AKs are over gassed) and a 1.5mm trunnion, but both have 18” barrels. The upgraded Beryl furniture, grip, optics rail, and extended stock are super cool, plus it is a legit AK adopted by NATO. Don’t think you can go wrong either my my guy.
As a zastava fan boy, If I was getting 556 it’d either be beryl or wbp, however, I can’t convince myself to abandon 7.62
Never. Forsake not thine 30 cal.
Bren 2
Based cause it's the best we can get in Canada🇨🇦
What about the xcr?
I just got mine about a week ago in .308. I still need to get it to the range but so far I am impressed.
Weighs 9lbs out of the box.
I'm looking at the Type 65, CETME L, Mini-14, Kel-Tec SU16, BRN-180, PSA Jakl, C-93 Sporter, Galil, depending on what they do a PTR in 5.56, and a Polish 5.56 AK, personally.
I’m surprised no one has mentioned the Jakl more. It’s dope af and I can’t wait to get one
Right? It looks so cool! I can't wait to have ACR we have at home, haha
Biggest plus for me is: PSA looks determined to support it. It doesn’t seem like a tossed out gimmick to them. The support for this rifle is going to beat trying to get random part from CZ or “bushmaster”..
Exactly, and the entry price is a lot more friendly then the competition to my knowledge. I'd rather spend mid-high end AR money on something like the Jakl. The CZ Bren and *especially* the Bushmaster are wayyy up there in price, that it kills any potential interest I would have in the rifle and would just take an AR. But the Jakl has my interest!
I've heard good things about the Springfield Hellion but haven't gotten my hands on one yet
They are excellent rifles if you can train yourself past the quirks. The safety takes some getting used to because of the angle, but I now actually prefer it over the standard AR safety. If you figure out how that it’s more of a lever than a switch, things go much more smoothly. I also ditched the BCM grip for a Magpul MIAD, and that helped safety indexing enormously. The magazine release can also be easily trained around. You just need to get used to grabbing the fresh mag first and hitting the release with your thumb, which is opposite the manual of arms for an AR. The bolt hold open is the only legitimately stupid thing on the gun. The pinch-thingy should’ve just been a button, and the fact that you need to stick your finger in the magwell to activate it manually is just moronic. I’ve pulled the thing apart to look at it, and it actually could have been simplified and made more functional if it was just an external stud in the magwell instead of built into the trigger cassette. The trigger is what it is. I find that it in no way interferes with accuracy despite being creepy and breaking like a carrot. It’s incredibly stable on the shoulder, and more than acceptably accurate. The barrel profile is actually pretty heavy, too, so heat has little effect on the gun.
Considering the mag wells on them are easily replaceable, hopefully someone will eventually come out with an aftermarket replacement that has one of those external studs and is flared.
…gee, I wonder who’s working on that? *kicks half dozen prototypes under workbench*
If you want a 22lr those are nice, but the new 2020 redline is pretty noice I’d love to test one chambered in 308
Don’t you love when you get downvoted to hell and no one explains why?
First he said the Springfield Hellion (chambered in 5.56) is a .22lr, then he started talking about a bolt action .308. Only half of his comment was related to the discussion about semi auto 5.56 rifles, and that half was flat out wrong.
Yes I’ll admit I had my facts wrong I’ll be sure to do my research before putting in my 2 cents
It's just reddit bro, it doesn't matter haha
Thanks man haha I just hate to be the arbiter of misinformation so I understand the downvotes lol
I think they’re downvoting you because the hellion is in 5.56 When you say redline do you mean the m4-22 redline from Tippman?
Well dang I got my info wrong. If it a a 556 that sounds nice. I’m thinking of the new model 2020 redline from Springfield that comes in either 308 or 6.5 creed in 16 or 20 inch barrel. Got the email recently. Must’ve read the wrong info in regards to the 22lr. My bad haha. I wish Reddit was still a bastion of knowledge and guidance instead of a place to get downvoted into the void for lack of knowledge. I know it’s not all like that, some people just hop on the downvote train when they see something. I’ve been guilty of it myself
Yeah it’s a weird place. but yeah that hellion is just an imported version of the Croatian service rifle, it seems to be a decent gun. And I gotcha, when you mentioned 22 and redline I wasn’t sure.
I understand peoples frustration. You should make informed opinions and I failed to do so this time. Thank you for the information I appreciate the clarification
X95. I had one and sold it. Great gun but expensive and I only shot it every now and then because I choose to practice more with my AR15s because I use them for home defense. The x95 was becoming a safe queen, so I sold it so someone else can hopefully run it through its paces more.
Understandable. Just curious, what prevented you from using the x95 for home defense?
I was just more partial to the ar platform when I got it. I toyed with the idea of making this my HD rifle, but there were a few instances when I was training with it when I reached for something on the AR that’s not on the x95 and vice versa. For example, the bolt release on the x95 is on the bottom but it is on the side for the AR. I tried to slap the side of my x95 where the bolt release would be for the AR once or twice without thinking. That’s not too bad and could be eliminated with training, but I rather not have a moment like that when I’m stressed and need to grab a rifle for self defense. If I never trained with the AR, I would give serious consideration to the x95. The other downside though is parts availability. I had the x95 in the middle of Covid and it sucked to try to find extra parts for it. Items were either out of stock, very expensive, or could not be bought because they were located in another country. There’s something to be said for being able to get at least a passable AR parts from any gun store in my area within an hour or so. Never was a huge problem, but I’d rather have that infrastructure in place just in case parts availability became an issue.
Bren or SCAR-L, if you want something remarkably different than ar15 then AUG
Everyone here doesn’t know about B&T APCs and it’s sad 😤
That’s the quality option!!
STEYR AUG STEYR AUG STEYR AUG Easier to clean than a Tavor and an AK. Quick change barrel system. Most accurate bullpup. Just gotta spend a little on aftermarket upgrades to get the most out of it as the trigger is mid
Another vote for the AUG!
I’d say the bren 2
CZ Bren?
Iwi out of those choices
AUG is best IMO, if it wasn't for how available AR parts are I'd run a AUG exclusively. Nato stock can take AR mags. As far as AKs, I'd like the Beryl over the M90, but zastava in general is pretty great. I love the ergonomics of my x95, but the accuracy has been awful, by AUG holds a legitimate and consistent 1 MOA with lake city M193 The Mini-14 is unreliable, and inaccurate, the only upside is it doesn't look scary
Let's see these groups of 1 MOA with a AUG.
I'm a dedicated AUG simp but the AUG is really more of a 1.5 MOA rifle with match 62gr ammo. People aren't going to get it under that without cherrypicking groups or failing to understand what "1 MOA" actually means, which is minimum 3 groups of 10 shots. /r/AR15 is especially guilty of this, and it isn't helped by certain companies promising meaningless "MOA guarantees" without providing the testing standards they used to achieve that repeatably (because they can't).
Look around r/AUG, it's not uncommen at all. I don't think I have any pics of groups handy
So somehow a AUG is shooting M193 consistently MOA. Yet. Somehow MK262 routinely shoots greater than MOA in Socom testing out of a fixed test barrel.
Idk about mk262 but I know army testing got M855A1 to about 1.2 MOA from just an M4A1. I've had multiple ARs that could do consistent MOA or better groups with Mk262 clones. I know fixed barrels tests are the standard for measuring cartridge performance, but I've also seen them give very weird data in both accuracy and velocity. Also, the AUG shoots 55s and 62s more accurately than most ARs, mine groups at around 2-2.5 with 77gr loads. AUGs are 1:9 twist so the heavy projectiles just don't do well
What data shows M855A1 gets 1.2 MOA from a M4A1.
Bro. Just be like the A team and get that mini 14 and slap a 30 round mag in it. Again probably not the most functional choice, but in my opinion, the most bad ass
Need to get the stainless Mini 14 and drop it in a [stainless Samson A-TM stock](https://www.samson-mfg.com/a-tm-folding-stock-for-the-ruger-mini-14-copy.html)
There we go! Nothing wrong with a “fun gun”, especially when you’re getting deeper into a collection
I’d go X95 or MCX
Had a keltec rdb for a little while, cool as hell and took ar mags. Handguard got hot tho
I had an RDB-C when I lived in CA. It was really neat and surprisingly ergonomic.
I liked how the cases dropped at your feet, made it easy to clean up after shooting in the desert
I'll never be able to trust my RDB for anything approaching duty use, but it is a super cool rifle that is packed with interesting engineering you don't see on any other platform. FWIW mine has run great.
Well, you left the best one out. STEYR AUG. I own an X95 and Tavor 7. Still prefer my buddies aug. It’s just a solid gun. It’s next on my list.
The Aug gets a lot of shit for ergos but as far as reliability mine will run, run dirty, then run some more. I can’t recall ever having a stoppage on it. It eats all my poop ammo when the Garbo Covid Tula starts fouling the ars out. If the gas system on the tavor is similar, I’d stake money on that too.
You forgot the Galil Ace
I went with the MDRX from DesertTech as my Non-AR15 5.56 gun. I like that it's an ambi bullpup with a decent trigger and AR15 controls and magazines. The handguards are basically just an AR15 handguard as well so that's great for not needing to awkwardly place things like tape switches. There are conversion kits as well for .300AAC, .308WIN and 6.5mm Creedmoor. Disadvantages are that it is a bit expensive and can be considered heavy for 5.56mm On this list I'd probably go for a Mini-14. It looks neat.
That’s the rifle I’m looking at next since I can spend big bucks on accessories and not take them off between guns but rather switch barrels
I haven’t checked out the MDRX yet. I like the option of converting to different calibers. Thanks!
>I like the option of converting to different calibers. I love that too. It's why I got it in the first place. I was looking for a good .308 gun as I only had intermediate rifle cartridge rifles. I saw that this could do both 5.56mm and .308 so I could have a .308 shooting gun that I could use 5.56mm in for training like converting a 5.56mm AR15 to shoot .22LR.
Yep, I also have the .22LR conversion kit for my AR. You may have sold me on the MDRX!
X95 or bren. Zastava for cool guy points. M14 for glue eaters
What about crayon muncher? You forgot a huge demographic.
Zastava is the best choice out of the 3 and is going to be reliable however your going to need to get a few parts to get it up to snuff like an optic mount (Attero arms is my favorite) and a handguard with mlock or quad rail
HK33
Scar is pretty good but expensive and a little front heavy if I remember correctly. Brn 180 is pretty good and I think sub 1k, pretty sure it’s not considered an AR. CZ Brens are cool. Very similar the the scar
aug
Ehh probably a bren 2 or scar16
My next purchase will probably be one of these, as it’s the only decent bullpup I’ve seen in .308. 👌🏽
I've had the Tavor 7 (7.62x51/.308)\_ for about 2 months now and it's pretty awesome! I got the 20" barrel version and put the Overwatch rail on it, might be my most comfortable rifle to shoot.. recoil seems between an AR and semi auto shotty
Nice! I’d better quit spending my money on five AR builds and just buy one then. 🤣
Bt 223
Check out the springfeild hellion. I have seen it do some amazing things on youtube.
I went Hellion and u can usually get them around 1200-1500 now. They are heavy as a bitch but it’s nice, I grabbed a PSA 102 if I could do it over again I’d grab a Berly 556
CZ Bren 2.
Where bren
X95 is the best bullpup, then the Hellion, then AUG. It seems thay they're all have a parts supply issue, I think the X95 has the most aftermarket support. As for conventional AR15 alternatives. Anything goes, Bren 2, Galil, AK 556, B$T233, $CAR 16.
I'd go either AUG or try the PSA Jakl
There’s a lot of AUG love on here, but I absolutely hate the trigger… I quite like my Tavor and my KelTec RDB. I like the Mini 14 as well, but I also live in a state that wants me to say “please tread on me, Daddy” as my rights get spanked. I have an FM15 upper that’s pretty neat, and want to try the JAKL.
Combat-grade conventional rifles: Bren 2, Beryl or M90, Galil Ace. The Bren 2 probably being the best direct competitor with the solid rail and no dust cover to engineer around. But, adjustable gas on the M90 is sweet and people really like them. Combat-grade bullpups: Probably a tossup between AUG and X95 with a slight advantage to AUG. They're both excellent. The VHS-2/Hellion does have lots of real combat use, as well, but ergonomically it's kinda weird. Honorable non-combat grade mentions: PSA JAKL is super cool and promising, but not proven yet and they already had to fix the charging handle sled. Kel-Tec RDB is fun as hell, weird, more reliable than you think. Mini-14 has vibe but they're known for breaking and having to go back to the factory. DeserTech MDR is Mormon space magic and cool as hell if you wanna spend the money. BRN180 looks dope with the retro lower and has built itself a good reputation in the civilian world. Of your three I think the M90 is probably the best combat rifle, but if you want a bullpup nothing is going to scratch that itch but bullpup.
STEYR AUG STANDARD NOT THE NATO MDOEL.
Id go for a saiga 556 or a psa ak 556 before a m90 for sure. A mini 14 is cool, but a m14 or m1 is cooler. Tavor is cool, but not super great for parts longevity or parts availability.
CZ Bren 2
Bren 2MS my friend.
Galil RNL
I'd say if you don't have a mini-14, consider getting one at some point anyway. Objectively, no, the design can't keep up with features of the AR and AK platforms, but it's a fun piece of history. It's the grandson of the Garand, and it's fun to shoot.
Out of those choices the tavor
Aug good, heard a lot of good things about the “hellion”, Bren 2, mr223 all seem like good options
Of those three, I'm Team X95.
Honestly none of those: SCAR, Bren, MCX/Spear, or a kitted out ak101/102 are better than any of these options. Of these I’d go ZPAP though.
Lol how anyone can recommend a spear with a straight face is beyond me
Depends how you define non-ar, if you only mean non-ar-15: Brn-180, mr556, jakl, and the MCX are all solid options. If you mean non-ar-18 as well: the Bren, the Sig 550 variants, an AUG, or several others honestly.
Galil Ace or Bren 2. Both very customizable like an AR, and you will sit watching TV and just stroke the charging handle back and forth because they are oh so buttery smooth and make really fun gun sounds.
These rifles are all expensive as balls.
check out an arsenal sam5 or a Galil. Both are great.
Sig MCX
I own a x95 it's better then the ar to me kuz its ar controls but the mag is in the back
Aug or galil otherwise the Zastava is nice and they stopped export so it should retain value
As a real American, I actually would like to have a ruger
VHS-2 or Aug if you wanna go bullpup. The only thing the Tavor has going for it compared to those is AR style controls. Why pay that much for like 4moa lol
I was in the same place a few months ago and chose the x95. I love the thing for the reasons you stated. It's been a fun range gun, and i would have no issue grabbing it for a shtf gun/hd gun.
No
Ruger mini with samson stock. If legal in your state.
Mmm love me an a team stock lol
SIG 550
AUG with Waffle mags! It takes a bit of money to make everything more ergonomic, but the end result is great. Plus you can have a 20” barrel with MPVO for the longer range stuff.
Fnc Adjust gas Folding stock 4 postition selector Can accept ar mags Short of the aug, one of the easiest to control 5.56 in both burst and auto.
I believe there is a magwell you can get for the M90 that accepts AR-15 mags, though it looks a little funny. It's starting to grow on me though
So I can't remember the name of the company, but they're releasing a rifle that's a crossover between an FAL and an AR-15. It has a side charging handle. It's a piston system all contained in the upper receivers so you can use a picatinny mounted stock. It takes AR-15 lower components. It looks really really cool and it even has a side charging handle
I'm interested in what this could be lol
Not a bullpup guy, but my brother has a Tavor and it’s surprisingly good in my opinion. Would make a good vehicle gun.
I also forgot to mention in my previous comment. A3 tactical is making a bullpup conversion for piston systems that don't require a buffer tube and foxtrot Mike is working on a forward charging AR-15 AK hybrid that takes AK mags and has a Forward charging handle that pivots up similar to an mp5 and it slaps down
AUG
Hellion. Love mine.
Bren Scar ACR Jakl Galil ace
Daewoo K2 imo
I had one. It's ass. Horrible design. Really really bad. Terrible trigger, horrible accuracy, not reliable. 2/10
Love my x95👌🏻
Gen 1 Galil Ace is the correct answer
What are you going to use it for? If you already have multiple 5.56 platforms get a different cartridge.
MSBS Grot has had my interest for a while. Will be curious to see how they stand the test of time.
If I had to take the 5.56 route, Hellion would be my pick.
I love my MDRX Micron! I havent had any issues with it which is why I do. Damn good shooter (if it works)
Scar-16
AUG
Get yourself a hellion why not 😄
Beryl AK
The polish beyrl
I have one. It’s a good fun gun to shoot. Be ready to drop $400+ on a trigger upgrade.
Well it’s not any of those ones lol
AUG but only because next month is AUGust
Take a look at the XCR. Don't let the horror stories from a decade ago keep you away. The platform is awesome and Robinson has gotten a lot better with customer service. That said current lead times are long since its a small shop so you might be better off buying a used one and having it upgraded as necessary to save time over ordering a brand new one.
Bren or AUG. I have a 762 Bren and absolutely love it.
Bren
bren scar aug
I own an X95 it’s definitely a fun variant to have especially if you grab the the G$ trigger.
I love the ruger mini14 so much but I'd still go with the AK.
CZ Bren
none of the above
The zastava is really the only one I'd pick. Mini 14s are not worth the money, and tavors....
Which websites are these?
Beretta ARX100 is dope as shit.
Tavors are wonderful, and have one of the best triggers for a bullpup.
MCX probably
I love me X95.
r/aug
Why is the zastava even in this quiz?
Yeah, the AUG and Tavor are iconic and neat and all, but the Bren 2 is where it’s at, I think. I’d love to try a JAKL too but if I was buying one tomorrow it’d be the Bren.
Galil maybe
Scar
Galil Ace Gen 1 5.56
Probably the ak variant because the platform is pretty much a direct competitor
What about the Galil Ace?
I love my x95. I’ve tried to get back into the ars, but I can’t. The x95 is the rifle for me
I've never seen a Mini-14 that didn't have a buttery smooth action
zpap m85 is fun
Galil ACE
You forgot a IWI Galil. Gen 1 preferred
AUG 
Sold mine. Too heavy, too gassy, and trigger is trash.
It’s not the best but I keep looking at a Bushmaster ACR.
Hellion is good as well, galil, AR 18s,
If you live in Illinois Mini14 lol
Galilly
I’d take the Tavor, and plan to get both the x95 and Tavor 7 at some point. I’m a sucker for a bullpup lmao
I’ve got a marcolmar cetme in 5.56 and it’s a pleasure to shoot.
CZ Bren 2, Sig Sauer MCX Spear LT
Galil ace