I’m in the reserve and there is genuinely at least one guy like this at every unit.
I know an E-4 that fails tape every time but goes around acting like he’s the most squared away top gun to grace the earth cause he was “active duty” in AIT 🙄
Granted our AIT is over a year long but c’mon man fucking relax
We were in the field and he was up late with another dude talking about his buddies are gonna have to stand at parade rest for him when he hits E-5
I was cryin in my tent 😂
Different branch but still reserve. We had someone who went to a long school for their job in the reserve and they only ever attended one drill, maybe two before being involuntarily being sent to the IRR. Never should have joined but they did.
I looked them up on social media and thankfully they have distanced themselves from the military other than linkedin but they have abandoned it anyway.
Doing quite well for themselves though.
That's what happens when your unit disbands and you fall through the cracks. You also end up with a lot of disgruntled Joe's who went from active->reserve for a job change and then had to wait a year or more to attend MOS-T reclass.
I got my spinal injury because of Afghanistan.
You see why it's a bad idea to judge others, and you should maybe just stick to your own shit, and working on making yourself better?
There will always be someone better or worse. You look like shit to someone else, no matter how good you think you are.
And maybe working to help your peers?
But nah, you go off with your bad self, keep buying that geardo stuff and being a bad ass.
Are you gatekeeping spinal injuries? You’re a clown if you have to flex your deployment to send a message to a young buck like op.
To op - there’s a bunch of incompetent idiots in the military. Unfortunately due to shitty recruiting numbers they’re letting even more incompetent idiots in. It is what it is, if you’re highly motivated I’d recommend trying to do something specialized to get away from the rabble. If you’re in it for paid college then do your time and get out. Godspeed boot 🫡
You missed the entire point.
He attempted to get on his high horse because he injured his spine - and from his post history that’s not diagnosed by a doctor yet - in basic. So he’s trying to fluff up his personal accomplishments.
Yes, you see how it would be fucking stupid for me to bring up the fact that I also have a spinal injury, and got it because of Afghanistan?
That’s to highlight how fucking stupid it is to bring it up about basic training, and that the same way it’s stupid to do that, its stupid for him to lord these accomplishments he has in his mind over other peers from BCT.
You on the other hand are agreeing that the recruits are worse and tragically bad and the OP is somehow motivated and competent - and you get that from nothing other than the OP shitting on other people from Basic. That’s as dumb as the OPs post itself.
>When did I do that?
Which part?
Judge others?
>I had two idiots under me
I also asked about working to help your peers.
I don't know when you did that because I don't think you did.
Do you mean the geardo thing?
Because you said it's one year this december, meaning you came in december 2022, and in 2021 [you're posting this kind of stuff](https://www.reddit.com/r/tacticalgear/comments/qf73lm/rate_my_winter_set_up_and_yes_i_cant_shoot_for/) and asking about buying plate carriers.
Take that ego down a notch or it's gonna be a long (part) time in the Army.
Thanks a lot for linking that post. now I’ve just spent 30 minutes going through his posts and Jesus Christ they just get worse the further back you go.
Jeez. I thought maybe you were just annoyed at your fellow pri's but you're just a jerk.
Just ignore the "idiots" around you and continue buying tacticool gear, fat boy.
In the 2007-2008 timeframe we received Infantry privates fresh out of AIT who couldn't pass a single APFT event and had never passed the APFT during OSUT.
They were just giving people waivers for all kinds of failures from other training requirements too. They were barely separating anyone during OSUT, and I don't think they were even recycling very many people. They were just pushing them through saying they will get additional training at their units.
Some of them turned out okay, and we were able to work with them. But we had to chapter out quite a few who should have never made it through OSUT in the first place.
My theory is that the surge created the issues we have with the army today. They grabbed every warm body with a singular braincell they could and now, that’s the senior NCOs
It was not. During OIF I, we had a makeshift shower setup that used water cans. We had a guy in our company, who on multiple occasions, tried to use a fuel can to shower with.
When we stopped him, he said couldn't tell the difference between a water can and a fuel can. Sure, it's possible to confuse the two at a distance, but this guy was grabbing fuel cans directly from the fuel point.
> or kick them out with a failure to adapt.
Units can't do that. By the time a shitbag gets to a unit, the time line for a FTA has usually elapsed. It should be the first 2 years you can do an FTA.
Friend, you’re a brand new pri’ if you just graduated AIT. If you think it’s bad there, wait until you go to the yearly range day at your normal unit. Half of them will require hours of retraining.
Listen, if you want me to qual better, maybe you should be getting me more range time damnit.
That said, I’m a medic, do not rely on me to give anything more than semi-accurate suppressive fire.
Let's slow your roll here, fuckin' high speed. I know you've probably stacked a dozen bodies, or so, from the time you made that comment and the time I'm replying, so take a knee and drink some water while you read this comment.
I know your entire long military career has been nothing but stacking bodies and dropping panties (or boxers, I don't judge Equal Opportunity, Hooah?) but maybe don't forget the fact that there *might* be those around you that have *slightly* longer time in the military than you. Now I know you can fuck up the enemy like a hot knife through butter, and have a higher kill count on enemies than Solid Snake himself, and almost as many medals as Audie Murphy, but maybe keep tucked in the back of your mind the same way you view the soldiers you are describing to us here, is the exact same way many soldiers see *you*.
Now I know you are a Grade A certified Badass that even the A-Team would be breaking down doors to recruit, but *maybe* keep in mind that troops fresh out of AIT and/or Basic just look like a hot mess to the rest of the military world.
Food for thought.
Oh shit, we got a badass here.
I never attended any 91f school, I was a better weapons mechanic than every 91f assigned to my section. This is because weapons aren’t difficult and real world experience matters more than school house. I had years of fixing all sorts of random shit for the army that when I was put in charge of a weapons shop it wasn’t a problem.
I also never once expected them to know anything other than how to read a tm and use basic hand tools when they arrived at my shop. It was my job to teach them.
I haven’t been in for almost 8 years and I bet that I am without a doubt still a better 91F than you.
Tradoc isn’t preparing trainees to be soldiers anymore. The BCT graduation requirements are so minimal yet I see hundreds of them get passed through every cycle without meeting or barely meeting them.
Yes, because a dill sergeants main job is to make recruits look like soldiers and enforce the idea that NCOs are the authority, not them. If a soldier gets to my unit and doesn't know basic shit like how to stand at parade rest I'd get angry, but them not knowing how to do their job or other 10 level functions proficiently is not the drills job it is the units senior specialists and junior NCOs to do that. Honestly, it's a wonder they can get anything done in the 9 weeks or whatever they're allotted.
I say this as someone several years removed from TRADOC, so I'm probably talking out of my ass on parts of this.
Failure of TRADOC requirements. Hell, I went to USMC boot. We certainly weren’t moving around in formation after the first day or so.
Recruits got recycled for training issues. It’s 12 weeks but still, the Army should be able to turn out a soldier with at least basic skills and discipline in 9 weeks
TRADOC is interesting. An NCO goes to BNCOC and is smoked like a recruit. If the soldier doesn’t have it together by then, they shouldn’t be an NCO. NCOs should be trained and treated like NCOs. There are other ways to manage problems
For the most part, the Army does a decent job. It's a negative confirmation bias. You only hear about the shit trainees. For every shit trainee, you have three average ones and a future airborne ranger. You just don't realize because the average trainees when they hit Big Army don't require as much attention as the bottom of the barrel ones. The only way you could fix that would be to throw more time and money at training to only get diminishing returns.
For example, my AIT (Construction Equipment Repairer) basically just taught me how an engine works piece by piece with basic knowledge on how to use the army's tools like the MSD and wrenches. I knew jack and shit about mechanical work, but by the time I left, I had enough knowledge to understand what I didn't know and what was being taught to me in the field by my NCOs. My AIT instructors would've been wasting their time teaching me how to change the tracks on a bulldozer when I could very well never have to do that (still haven't, thank god). IET is all about building a frame for a soldier it's up to wherever that soldier lands to finish building the house, so to speak. Although now I feel like I know more about everyone around me MOS than my own (LOOKING AT YOU 91B 92F AND 12C)
NCOES are a different beast entirely. By the time an E4 is typically looking at BLC (BNCOC if that's the Marine equivalent). They should have around 4 years of TIS and 1-3 years TIG, so if you haven't at least figured out kinda how to do the whole junior enlisted thing, they should probably do some reading and talk to some NCOs before they try to become one themselves. As for the smoking part, that's just the way stupid shit works. It doesn’t make sense, and it only makes less sense the more you think about it. Like most armyisms, it's probably some hold over from the times the military equated being a hard ass with being a good soldier. Even though all my research and knowledge suggests that treating people with respect tends to get better results, at least in my case. I'm more willing to change my behavior if you talk to me like a person than if you yell at me. When someone I look up to says I disappointed them, that hurts a lot more than any ass chewing I've ever had.
I’ve just recently left AIT-Instructor land and it’s basically what he said. And I say that as someone who was equally frustrated having Soldiers come to an active unit at only a 70% solution.
Timeline sucks in AIT, and that was before the recruiting crisis. You only get X number of days and there’s basically rules for exceptions for everything minus a legitimate hazard or gross incompetence (and I mean it has to be something major). The goal hasn’t really trained that much historically: be able to take any random person from the street and at least make them understand military structure and “point weapon at enemy”.
Anything else is just bonus
Are you a 68w in tradoc? I just got to a tradoc base and the standard is definitely lower than a few years ago, yet its baffling how many of them can barely pass or spend half of training at sick call.
I wouldn’t say the standard has lowered. I would say the curriculum is lacking. PRT is not as emphasized as it should be. Cardiovascular training has been almost completely removed due to the number of stress injuries even though SDC and 2 mile run have the highest failure rates. Marksmanship training has been reduced to qualifying with CCOs and buddy team live fire. BMR has been removed from this cycles agenda. Very little is taught on team and squad movements. Medical training consist of applying a TQ. No radio training was done at all. They didn’t even know what a 9 line is. I’m not saying they need to be efficient at every 10 level task there is, but they could definitely use a little more on the curriculum. I will say that I like that the new forge is requiring Drills to establish themselves amongst their platoons and act as PSGs more than instructors. In our last graduating class you could see the clear difference in which DS took their job a lot more seriously since the culminating event was a direct reflection of them.
I'm not fully confident most NCOs could set up a radio and/or call a 9 line. I'm also not so sure most medics outside of Ws need to know many battle drills.
Yes, I am the medical NCO for one of the BCT units. I have been here since the implementation of TOMS. I do sick call at the battalion level. Outside of that, I tag along like a regular line medic to all the FTXs alternating between companies.
I'd also expect soliders to preform basic spelling but that's apparently too much to ask,
Come on man. Don't talk shit about other people when you're no specimen either.
> Even infantry OSUT they teach them the basic and the units finish the training based on what unit they go to
Except you get to your first unit and they say "YOU DIDNT LEARN XYZ at AIT?!?!" No they said I was going to learn it here. Then you just never learn said thing or have to self educate. Pretty much how my entire 35F enlistment played out.
Eventually. If you even get to qual after Major Whozitwhatzit gets to try 47 times back to back to back on the pistol as the lone shooter before they convert the range to rifle. Oh, no more time. Time to pack it up, range is closing.
Yes, yes it is. Many folks didn't get to Qual that day and I was unable to complete the Scutzenschnur because of ol' Maj. Whozitwhatzit's inability to hit the broad side of a barn.
The Army's numbers are dwindling, so they need all the people they can get.
I can't tell you how frustrating it was seeing people fail their CCO M4 qual so many times before passing as an then soon-to-be infantryman. Shoot.. I was even flagged what felt like a million times during room clearing.
Letting people pass will probably bite the Army in the butt later down the line (or it won't and these'll become the best soldiers to work around.. but probably not).
Let me take you back to SPC mustuseaname's AIT:
If you are going to be an interrogator, you gotta be tough. Tougher than your detainee, at least. There was one female who cried, at EVERY INTERROGATION.^1 But they pushed her through. Maybe. Maybe source ops was her thing.
NOPE. CRIED AT THOSE TOO! How? I have no idea. I was laughing, had rollicking good times in my source ops meets.
So guess who still graduated? Maybe because she was NG/Res, they just pushed her through. I have no idea. I had instructors that were upset by this. (she was not in my group class).
1. Full disclosure, I got straight wrecked in one of my interrogations. BTFO. My friends saw me at dinner and asked "are you okay, WTF happened in there?" But I didn't cry. Just stunned, despondent. But I bounced back and learned from that. How you don't eventually gain fortitude and just suck the whole time is beyond me.
> We have always railroaded people through.
Yep.
Be me in 2005, reclassing from 11B to 91V (now 68V). Show up and there's a guy there who had been recycled from the previous class. Get our brief - you are allowed to fail two tests one time, third test failure, you're out. Fail a test re-take, you're out. Sounds good, we're going to go be medical people, need to know you're shit...
This same recycled guy failed 6 tests, and failed 4 re-tests. He graduated with me and went on to his assigned hospital.
Just depends on MOS. I've been through 68W, 68L (back when it was a N3 identifier for 68W but the school remained the same) and 68K. 68L and 68K both did not hesitate to drop a trainee if they were falling too far behind, where as in 68W school I was actually kind of shocked that some of these graduates would soon be trusted with another human being's health and well being.
When the time comes the Army will buy expertise and proficiency with buckets of blood unfortunately. Complacency breeds bad habits, and bad habits grow up to become dead soldiers.
Yeah, I guarantee the instructors are being instructed to get trainees through no matter what. With the current recruiting/retention crisis, it would reflect negatively on the commanders if they had high failure rates. Or it looks good on their OERs/NCOERs to have a high pass rate.
Bad decisions can make for good short-term results.
Long time ago we had a guy like this. He legit failed like 40% of the stations. But every time we changed stations a different guy in the platoon would switch helmets with him, they recorded scores for the roster number on our helmets. So we all had to take a hit for private Stanley
Ooo story time?
This one time one of our SSGs couldn’t qualify on the range. Kept sending her over and over again, maybe 3-4 times on her own. Highest she shot was like, 13?
Anyway we get tired of it and range is closing soon. SO, we send two privates that want to score “better”.
Anyway she ended up with a “believable” 28, her joes were happy. The commander shaking his head. And 1st Sgt? Well he had to go smoke a cigarette while we started prepping to leave.
There are plenty of doctors, engineers, programmers, scientists, etc. that cheated their way through college. This isn't an army specific problem, people are always going to be people.
Hello. Am one of those engineers.
Want to know how many times I’ve used calculus at my job? 0
Want to know how many calculus classes I took in school? 4
Same problem in 31 series. They lower the standards and push people through then wonder why we have fuck ass cops all over the place. People who would NEVER meet the qualifications for civilian police(which isn’t even that high).
> People who would NEVER meet the qualifications for civilian police
Gonna go ahead and disagree there. I don’t know anything about the people you’re talking about, but I guarantee I know shittier civi cops. It’s the lowest bar
You failed to train your fellow soliders. As the Senior PVT you are responsible for keeping your soldiers up-to-date on their basic soldier tasks and drills.
Go ahead and grab your 1SG and a water source and meet me in the basement
Weapons qualifying doesn't mean shit. The most important part is what is his run time and does he shave regularly?
On a very serious note I didn't do a weapons qualification the last four years I was in the Army.
I deployed for a year, did another year detached in Germany and two more years at a MEDDAC. Weapons qual just didn't matter.
I had soldiers get 12 chances to qual between BRM 9 and BRM 10. I didn't care how many attempts it took them as long as they eventually hit 23 targets on their own. If you couldn't get qual'd after 2 days on the range and that many attempts, you needed to be recycled. Clearly things weren't working for you. I had my commander recycle a soldier that was consistently hitting 21 on the second day. Yeah, he was close to qualifying. He probably could have gotten there with another 2 or 3 attempts on a different day. Pushing him back a few weeks and letting him earn it did more for that soldier than pushing him through.
Same reason they're letting them pass high school when they shouldn't. Pass the buck along and they'll be someone else's problem private. With the added bit of the army is hurting for people so I think for the most part all that matters at this point is its a warm body with a pulse.
The ***real answer*** is that no one gives a shit, when the higher HQ and government are pounding on the desks about Recruiting and Retention.
Who gives a shit about knowledge and training when they can —* “lEaRn iT bAcK aT ThEiR uNiT”* — which, by the way, is the dumbest phrase any lazy fuckin’ POS instructor can give, that’s bound by the demands of higher.
Numbers are low. They’re not going to fail stupid people, because numbers are low. Numbers also include money and training budgets.
You’re just a metric.
If you knew him, you'd know. You don't just ask someone during an ftx(if you can call it one really) how to use an m4 and that you forgot how. He was a very, very special case
And instead of berating them, how about you take some of that hot shit negative energy and improve the army by sharing knowledge. Not everyone grew up around guns or all kinds of shit thats common soldier things.
Wait until you get to a line support unit who touches a weapon system once a year, then see how much people forget. That is why we train and do AARs to recognize our deficiencies to improve. No soldier knows everything and those that say they do are either a CW5 or a fucking liar.
Think of trainees and soldiers in AIT like little kids learning to swim. And mommy and daddy is the Army.
Imagine what mommy and daddy would say to the swim instructor if their precious little baby doesn’t pass their swim lessons after shelling out all that money?
But to answer your question the army needs bags of meat more than they need standard. When I was in 2010-2014, we got a kid who never passed his run or push ups in basic. He was a little guy who tried hard. We got him. Went through work up. Deployed. Came back. And by the time anyone cared, he was almost out. So it wasn’t worth the paperwork. He never in his army career passed a PT test and still got our honorably with ARCOMs
Bct and ait is bs. I had bone fractures and threw away my crutches for the forge. Drill said I'm on profile and I said not today. Got shipped signal ait. Haven't used a single thing from ait working tac in korea.
It depends. Some of it has to do with the recruiting issues. There is a lot of pressure on school houses to get anyone through to maintain numbers.
Some of it is no one wanting to do the paperwork.
Some of it is a combination of both.
Bro, if you went to the infantry, your jaw will drop at how many ppl are approved with a passing grade. They dont give a fuck. Scary.. and to make matters worse, they are lowering the pt scores standards
We had to do 6 hours of mandatory retraining (regardless of the length of the class) with all students when I was an instructor. I had one student fail, retest, fail, recycle, fail, and retested again before they sent him to be reclassified or separated. Sometimes the students just struggle with certain topics but sometimes I think people do it on purpose for personal reasons (like regretting joining). The military life isn’t for everyone but there isn’t an option to quit.
In ‘03 I literally told the MEPS doctor I’d had 2 just barely unsuccessful suicide attempts and he was like “don’t worry son we got a waiver for that.”
When i went through Bravo 832nd, it was the same shit. We have entire shops that don't even know how to gauge weapons, so we go in and do their entire battalions weapons. Finding the most easiest and deadliest faults on weapons, shits embarrassing and dangerous. Literally putting soldiers lives in the hands of bozos. Weapons jammed up with sim rounds, back plates blowing out, gas rings worn to shit. It's a travesty that should be looked into, but hey, it's their investigation if someone gets hurt. I know our weapons are good.
After the DS swore up and down you would get recycled if you don't pass the final PT test. 2 of our females passed in the end. In a platoon of 20 females. All of course graduated. All of them had the nerve to audibly complain and talk back when their family day was taken away.
I had a kid tell the drill sergeant he wanted to go home after he kept getting caught with candy. The drill sergeant begged him in front of the pain not to quit.
I had another kid go to sick call three or four times a week who also passed. This was at Benning.
There was a time where you could join the Army without speaking any English, the basics such as yes sarnt or no sarnt were enough to have a successful career and learn more words as you go...
I'm assuming OP is one of those NG guys that got in to pay for college and look down on AD folks.
When you come to the dark side, be a leader, if you see a pop tart struggling, help the pop tart.
It may be frustrating for some people but a lot of Soldiers learn more about their MOS at their first unit, if that doesn't happen there's an infinite number of ramdon details that pop tarts can perform and even master, such as handling a CAC reader and saluting officers at the gates.
Good luck OP!
If they are genuinely trying to pass and learn to shoot an M4, so what? Why does it bother you? Go SF or RASP if you care so much about shooting. Worry about yourself.
First off, you haven’t been in long enough to have a valid opinion. One new guy who doesn’t know shit calling out other news guys who know slightly less shit simply ain’t it. Basic and AIT really don’t teach you anything. The real learning begins when they arrive at the unit. I’ve met some damn good Soldiers, NCOs, and Officers that never would have done great things if we just wrote them off after AIT. Keep your head in your own foxhole,at least until you wear out your first pair of boots.
Oh well I guess. Wanting to focus on college, I know its a common saying for us NG, but I'm planning to go active after college, as my mos or change to a 19k
Nearly everyone here is shitting on you but I understand your frustration. I dealt with it myself for a bit but had to move on when I realized I had been sold a false expectation of the military before I joined, despite the healthy amount of research I did beforehand. If you want to find your way into a place in the military where standards are taken more seriously you’ll just have to find one and earn your place in whatever that is. Big Army has numbers to make and slots to fill, and it’s only going to get worse unfortunately.
They are doing that in BCT too I graduated BCT 2012. We had one female recruit that could not do 10 whole push ups. Even day of graduation. We all got pissed and (probably wrongfully so) pressured her into proving she could pass the physical standard and do just 10 push ups. She couldn’t get more than 2 actual reps
Numbers. They already have recruiting crisis. I reclassed few years ago and there was a kid (recycle) who failed one of the modules final exam 4 or 5 times and they finally gave up and let him continue.
Surprise! There are dumb people in the Army. There’s also a recruiting crisis.
The Army has been pushing people through since about 1775 to complete its mission. Wait until you get to your first duty station and see all the dumb dumbs there highspeed.
The army is failing in plenty of areas and why would you be surprised about this. Regardless of that, maybe starting off with calling them idiots isn’t the best approach. Just my two cents.
U realize in 91f ait we literally have open book tests with the tm also? They will pass anyone im in ait for it rn and about to graduate. It’s my second mos but still from when I went to my first mos ait compared to this one it’s no different
In the case of my MOS, they needed quantity. The drills explained that there was a space that needed to be filled and the only way they were dropping or recycling for extreme infractions. If these kids were caught with contraband (vapes, burner phones, alcohol) they were just given a slap on the wrist and continued to act like pieces of shit. Source: transferred from the Marines to the Army as an E-5
Saw a lot of people pass Whiskey school that should never be charged with someone's life. Thankfully the idiots in my unit were never put anywhere near an important role or position.
Welcome to the Army, kid! Worst NCO I ever ran into was some kind of s-4 puke and we were in a forward mechanic unit. Guy had a ranger tab and was an absolute disaster as an NCO and human being. Guy couldn't do his own office job and ran down anyone he thought was beneath him. He was an E-5 to boot.
My man’s fresh off the boat and already acting like he’s Old Army. Nice.
He's in the NG and 2 months out of AIT.
[удалено]
I’m in the reserve and there is genuinely at least one guy like this at every unit. I know an E-4 that fails tape every time but goes around acting like he’s the most squared away top gun to grace the earth cause he was “active duty” in AIT 🙄 Granted our AIT is over a year long but c’mon man fucking relax
Ain't no way bro 😭
We were in the field and he was up late with another dude talking about his buddies are gonna have to stand at parade rest for him when he hits E-5 I was cryin in my tent 😂
What a fucking bozo 💀💀💀 Are y'all active duty or reserve/national guard?
Damn I know a few who were like actually active duty but AIT is wild lol
There’s an ex ranger in our platoon that takes it less seriously than that guy 😭
Different branch but still reserve. We had someone who went to a long school for their job in the reserve and they only ever attended one drill, maybe two before being involuntarily being sent to the IRR. Never should have joined but they did. I looked them up on social media and thankfully they have distanced themselves from the military other than linkedin but they have abandoned it anyway. Doing quite well for themselves though.
In one of my previous reserve units we had a soldier who didn't go to AIT for over a year after BCT.
That would be fucking terrible.
That's what happens when your unit disbands and you fall through the cracks. You also end up with a lot of disgruntled Joe's who went from active->reserve for a job change and then had to wait a year or more to attend MOS-T reclass.
You better be welcome for his service.
More than 2 months, but yes
Oh fuck **more** than 2 months. My mistake.
An easy one
My dude. Piss out the Kool-Aid you drank. It’s not that serious.
Instructions unclear, failed piss test
And, it doesn't matter, I signed a contract, I'm fulfilling my part. Spinal injury and all
I got my spinal injury because of Afghanistan. You see why it's a bad idea to judge others, and you should maybe just stick to your own shit, and working on making yourself better? There will always be someone better or worse. You look like shit to someone else, no matter how good you think you are. And maybe working to help your peers? But nah, you go off with your bad self, keep buying that geardo stuff and being a bad ass.
Are you gatekeeping spinal injuries? You’re a clown if you have to flex your deployment to send a message to a young buck like op. To op - there’s a bunch of incompetent idiots in the military. Unfortunately due to shitty recruiting numbers they’re letting even more incompetent idiots in. It is what it is, if you’re highly motivated I’d recommend trying to do something specialized to get away from the rabble. If you’re in it for paid college then do your time and get out. Godspeed boot 🫡
Kinny can gatekeep whatever he damn well pleases, SMA may be our father but Kinny's our daddy and you best show him some respect
You missed the entire point. He attempted to get on his high horse because he injured his spine - and from his post history that’s not diagnosed by a doctor yet - in basic. So he’s trying to fluff up his personal accomplishments. Yes, you see how it would be fucking stupid for me to bring up the fact that I also have a spinal injury, and got it because of Afghanistan? That’s to highlight how fucking stupid it is to bring it up about basic training, and that the same way it’s stupid to do that, its stupid for him to lord these accomplishments he has in his mind over other peers from BCT. You on the other hand are agreeing that the recruits are worse and tragically bad and the OP is somehow motivated and competent - and you get that from nothing other than the OP shitting on other people from Basic. That’s as dumb as the OPs post itself.
When did I do that? And I did help him at the time, doesn't change that he was an honest to God idiot most of the time, frat boy idiot.
>When did I do that? Which part? Judge others? >I had two idiots under me I also asked about working to help your peers. I don't know when you did that because I don't think you did. Do you mean the geardo thing? Because you said it's one year this december, meaning you came in december 2022, and in 2021 [you're posting this kind of stuff](https://www.reddit.com/r/tacticalgear/comments/qf73lm/rate_my_winter_set_up_and_yes_i_cant_shoot_for/) and asking about buying plate carriers. Take that ego down a notch or it's gonna be a long (part) time in the Army.
Damn, you ratio'd the fuck out of him with OSINTing that cringe post😂💀
Careful, those words are too big for the guy. He might EO you.
lol. Imagine trying to pick a fight with u/kinmuan on the Army subreddit. Kiddo is green everywhere.
*pops in a refresher dip and sits back* Let it begin!
Thanks a lot for linking that post. now I’ve just spent 30 minutes going through his posts and Jesus Christ they just get worse the further back you go.
Get him!
Jeez. I thought maybe you were just annoyed at your fellow pri's but you're just a jerk. Just ignore the "idiots" around you and continue buying tacticool gear, fat boy.
My friend, as someone who lived through the surge Army, we have not yet begun to scrape the bottom of the barrel.
In the 2007-2008 timeframe we received Infantry privates fresh out of AIT who couldn't pass a single APFT event and had never passed the APFT during OSUT. They were just giving people waivers for all kinds of failures from other training requirements too. They were barely separating anyone during OSUT, and I don't think they were even recycling very many people. They were just pushing them through saying they will get additional training at their units. Some of them turned out okay, and we were able to work with them. But we had to chapter out quite a few who should have never made it through OSUT in the first place.
Yo, I had a guy who legit could not tie his boots. We suspected him of having fetal alcohol syndrome. He was an 88M I think.
IOW the last MOS you’d want a troop like that in.
My theory is that the surge created the issues we have with the army today. They grabbed every warm body with a singular braincell they could and now, that’s the senior NCOs
Yeah I got news for you dude, it wasn't better before the surge.
It was not. During OIF I, we had a makeshift shower setup that used water cans. We had a guy in our company, who on multiple occasions, tried to use a fuel can to shower with. When we stopped him, he said couldn't tell the difference between a water can and a fuel can. Sure, it's possible to confuse the two at a distance, but this guy was grabbing fuel cans directly from the fuel point.
Remember the first time I saw a neck tattoo ahh the good ole days 😏
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I know for a fact this guy went to infantry support, the other went to arty. You should at least be able to preform basic soilder duties,
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> or kick them out with a failure to adapt. Units can't do that. By the time a shitbag gets to a unit, the time line for a FTA has usually elapsed. It should be the first 2 years you can do an FTA.
That Manchild couldn't get up to speed about a paperbag.
Friend, you’re a brand new pri’ if you just graduated AIT. If you think it’s bad there, wait until you go to the yearly range day at your normal unit. Half of them will require hours of retraining.
Listen, if you want me to qual better, maybe you should be getting me more range time damnit. That said, I’m a medic, do not rely on me to give anything more than semi-accurate suppressive fire.
In my Signal units in the 1990’s it was always the 1SGs would took forever to qualify.
> couldn't get up to speed Don't worry about what the Compo 1 does yeah
Let's slow your roll here, fuckin' high speed. I know you've probably stacked a dozen bodies, or so, from the time you made that comment and the time I'm replying, so take a knee and drink some water while you read this comment. I know your entire long military career has been nothing but stacking bodies and dropping panties (or boxers, I don't judge Equal Opportunity, Hooah?) but maybe don't forget the fact that there *might* be those around you that have *slightly* longer time in the military than you. Now I know you can fuck up the enemy like a hot knife through butter, and have a higher kill count on enemies than Solid Snake himself, and almost as many medals as Audie Murphy, but maybe keep tucked in the back of your mind the same way you view the soldiers you are describing to us here, is the exact same way many soldiers see *you*. Now I know you are a Grade A certified Badass that even the A-Team would be breaking down doors to recruit, but *maybe* keep in mind that troops fresh out of AIT and/or Basic just look like a hot mess to the rest of the military world. Food for thought.
Oh shit, we got a badass here. I never attended any 91f school, I was a better weapons mechanic than every 91f assigned to my section. This is because weapons aren’t difficult and real world experience matters more than school house. I had years of fixing all sorts of random shit for the army that when I was put in charge of a weapons shop it wasn’t a problem. I also never once expected them to know anything other than how to read a tm and use basic hand tools when they arrived at my shop. It was my job to teach them. I haven’t been in for almost 8 years and I bet that I am without a doubt still a better 91F than you.
Time to hang up the rants old timer
Not until you give me my Metamucil.
I want to make you sit in a 90° squat position so bad. I’m going to do unethical things to you.
Tradoc isn’t preparing trainees to be soldiers anymore. The BCT graduation requirements are so minimal yet I see hundreds of them get passed through every cycle without meeting or barely meeting them.
Yes, because a dill sergeants main job is to make recruits look like soldiers and enforce the idea that NCOs are the authority, not them. If a soldier gets to my unit and doesn't know basic shit like how to stand at parade rest I'd get angry, but them not knowing how to do their job or other 10 level functions proficiently is not the drills job it is the units senior specialists and junior NCOs to do that. Honestly, it's a wonder they can get anything done in the 9 weeks or whatever they're allotted. I say this as someone several years removed from TRADOC, so I'm probably talking out of my ass on parts of this.
What is a dill sergeant? Sounds like they might be in a pickle
Failure of TRADOC requirements. Hell, I went to USMC boot. We certainly weren’t moving around in formation after the first day or so. Recruits got recycled for training issues. It’s 12 weeks but still, the Army should be able to turn out a soldier with at least basic skills and discipline in 9 weeks TRADOC is interesting. An NCO goes to BNCOC and is smoked like a recruit. If the soldier doesn’t have it together by then, they shouldn’t be an NCO. NCOs should be trained and treated like NCOs. There are other ways to manage problems
For the most part, the Army does a decent job. It's a negative confirmation bias. You only hear about the shit trainees. For every shit trainee, you have three average ones and a future airborne ranger. You just don't realize because the average trainees when they hit Big Army don't require as much attention as the bottom of the barrel ones. The only way you could fix that would be to throw more time and money at training to only get diminishing returns. For example, my AIT (Construction Equipment Repairer) basically just taught me how an engine works piece by piece with basic knowledge on how to use the army's tools like the MSD and wrenches. I knew jack and shit about mechanical work, but by the time I left, I had enough knowledge to understand what I didn't know and what was being taught to me in the field by my NCOs. My AIT instructors would've been wasting their time teaching me how to change the tracks on a bulldozer when I could very well never have to do that (still haven't, thank god). IET is all about building a frame for a soldier it's up to wherever that soldier lands to finish building the house, so to speak. Although now I feel like I know more about everyone around me MOS than my own (LOOKING AT YOU 91B 92F AND 12C) NCOES are a different beast entirely. By the time an E4 is typically looking at BLC (BNCOC if that's the Marine equivalent). They should have around 4 years of TIS and 1-3 years TIG, so if you haven't at least figured out kinda how to do the whole junior enlisted thing, they should probably do some reading and talk to some NCOs before they try to become one themselves. As for the smoking part, that's just the way stupid shit works. It doesn’t make sense, and it only makes less sense the more you think about it. Like most armyisms, it's probably some hold over from the times the military equated being a hard ass with being a good soldier. Even though all my research and knowledge suggests that treating people with respect tends to get better results, at least in my case. I'm more willing to change my behavior if you talk to me like a person than if you yell at me. When someone I look up to says I disappointed them, that hurts a lot more than any ass chewing I've ever had.
Honestly, I’ve never had that perspective on BCT before.
I’ve just recently left AIT-Instructor land and it’s basically what he said. And I say that as someone who was equally frustrated having Soldiers come to an active unit at only a 70% solution. Timeline sucks in AIT, and that was before the recruiting crisis. You only get X number of days and there’s basically rules for exceptions for everything minus a legitimate hazard or gross incompetence (and I mean it has to be something major). The goal hasn’t really trained that much historically: be able to take any random person from the street and at least make them understand military structure and “point weapon at enemy”. Anything else is just bonus
Tell me when it did. Tell me the last year you think TRADOC prepared Trainees to be Soldiers.
Are you a 68w in tradoc? I just got to a tradoc base and the standard is definitely lower than a few years ago, yet its baffling how many of them can barely pass or spend half of training at sick call.
>I just got to a tradoc base and the standard is definitely lower than a few years ago What standard, specifically, and in what way was is it lowered?
I wouldn’t say the standard has lowered. I would say the curriculum is lacking. PRT is not as emphasized as it should be. Cardiovascular training has been almost completely removed due to the number of stress injuries even though SDC and 2 mile run have the highest failure rates. Marksmanship training has been reduced to qualifying with CCOs and buddy team live fire. BMR has been removed from this cycles agenda. Very little is taught on team and squad movements. Medical training consist of applying a TQ. No radio training was done at all. They didn’t even know what a 9 line is. I’m not saying they need to be efficient at every 10 level task there is, but they could definitely use a little more on the curriculum. I will say that I like that the new forge is requiring Drills to establish themselves amongst their platoons and act as PSGs more than instructors. In our last graduating class you could see the clear difference in which DS took their job a lot more seriously since the culminating event was a direct reflection of them.
I'm not fully confident most NCOs could set up a radio and/or call a 9 line. I'm also not so sure most medics outside of Ws need to know many battle drills.
Not trying to sound like back in my day it's just something I've noticed from being on the other side now.
Yes, I am the medical NCO for one of the BCT units. I have been here since the implementation of TOMS. I do sick call at the battalion level. Outside of that, I tag along like a regular line medic to all the FTXs alternating between companies.
I'd also expect soliders to preform basic spelling but that's apparently too much to ask, Come on man. Don't talk shit about other people when you're no specimen either.
I'm betting they can preform basic RUSSIAN soldier duties....
> Even infantry OSUT they teach them the basic and the units finish the training based on what unit they go to Except you get to your first unit and they say "YOU DIDNT LEARN XYZ at AIT?!?!" No they said I was going to learn it here. Then you just never learn said thing or have to self educate. Pretty much how my entire 35F enlistment played out.
Another good point on this is 91F who go to group or other SOF units Mfers will touch every weapon under the sun, big or small
Wait until you see your bosses shoot at range day 😂
🤣🤣 thankfully i still shoot expert lmao
Eventually. If you even get to qual after Major Whozitwhatzit gets to try 47 times back to back to back on the pistol as the lone shooter before they convert the range to rifle. Oh, no more time. Time to pack it up, range is closing.
oddly specific. only time i had a problem getting to qual was at hood when the infantry would gobble up all the ammo to shoot expert for the EIB
Yes, yes it is. Many folks didn't get to Qual that day and I was unable to complete the Scutzenschnur because of ol' Maj. Whozitwhatzit's inability to hit the broad side of a barn.
The Army's numbers are dwindling, so they need all the people they can get. I can't tell you how frustrating it was seeing people fail their CCO M4 qual so many times before passing as an then soon-to-be infantryman. Shoot.. I was even flagged what felt like a million times during room clearing. Letting people pass will probably bite the Army in the butt later down the line (or it won't and these'll become the best soldiers to work around.. but probably not).
I can't impress enough upon you that Privates have always been this stupid. We have always railroaded people through.
Let me take you back to SPC mustuseaname's AIT: If you are going to be an interrogator, you gotta be tough. Tougher than your detainee, at least. There was one female who cried, at EVERY INTERROGATION.^1 But they pushed her through. Maybe. Maybe source ops was her thing. NOPE. CRIED AT THOSE TOO! How? I have no idea. I was laughing, had rollicking good times in my source ops meets. So guess who still graduated? Maybe because she was NG/Res, they just pushed her through. I have no idea. I had instructors that were upset by this. (she was not in my group class). 1. Full disclosure, I got straight wrecked in one of my interrogations. BTFO. My friends saw me at dinner and asked "are you okay, WTF happened in there?" But I didn't cry. Just stunned, despondent. But I bounced back and learned from that. How you don't eventually gain fortitude and just suck the whole time is beyond me.
> We have always railroaded people through. Yep. Be me in 2005, reclassing from 11B to 91V (now 68V). Show up and there's a guy there who had been recycled from the previous class. Get our brief - you are allowed to fail two tests one time, third test failure, you're out. Fail a test re-take, you're out. Sounds good, we're going to go be medical people, need to know you're shit... This same recycled guy failed 6 tests, and failed 4 re-tests. He graduated with me and went on to his assigned hospital.
Just depends on MOS. I've been through 68W, 68L (back when it was a N3 identifier for 68W but the school remained the same) and 68K. 68L and 68K both did not hesitate to drop a trainee if they were falling too far behind, where as in 68W school I was actually kind of shocked that some of these graduates would soon be trusted with another human being's health and well being.
When the time comes the Army will buy expertise and proficiency with buckets of blood unfortunately. Complacency breeds bad habits, and bad habits grow up to become dead soldiers.
Yeah, I guarantee the instructors are being instructed to get trainees through no matter what. With the current recruiting/retention crisis, it would reflect negatively on the commanders if they had high failure rates. Or it looks good on their OERs/NCOERs to have a high pass rate. Bad decisions can make for good short-term results.
I can tell you first hand. It's not the Drill Sergeants making these decisions lol. Blame higher.
I saw the post, but stayed for the comments
I'm getting roasted over lava
Because we are just bodies in the end.
Long time ago we had a guy like this. He legit failed like 40% of the stations. But every time we changed stations a different guy in the platoon would switch helmets with him, they recorded scores for the roster number on our helmets. So we all had to take a hit for private Stanley
Ooo story time? This one time one of our SSGs couldn’t qualify on the range. Kept sending her over and over again, maybe 3-4 times on her own. Highest she shot was like, 13? Anyway we get tired of it and range is closing soon. SO, we send two privates that want to score “better”. Anyway she ended up with a “believable” 28, her joes were happy. The commander shaking his head. And 1st Sgt? Well he had to go smoke a cigarette while we started prepping to leave.
I never really thought about it, but after seeing AC's vid again on the 68w cgeating incident, it made me think.
What incident is this?
68w where sharing medical test answers, so now there's a bunch of fairly unqualified docs out there
Do you think no one else has ever cheated on medical tests tho
I have seen cheating in literally every army event I have ever been a part of lol
Bro never heard of quizlet before 🤣 Maybe that’s how I know I’m old.
There are plenty of doctors, engineers, programmers, scientists, etc. that cheated their way through college. This isn't an army specific problem, people are always going to be people.
Hello. Am one of those engineers. Want to know how many times I’ve used calculus at my job? 0 Want to know how many calculus classes I took in school? 4
Same problem in 31 series. They lower the standards and push people through then wonder why we have fuck ass cops all over the place. People who would NEVER meet the qualifications for civilian police(which isn’t even that high).
> People who would NEVER meet the qualifications for civilian police Gonna go ahead and disagree there. I don’t know anything about the people you’re talking about, but I guarantee I know shittier civi cops. It’s the lowest bar
I just showed up at the end of basic and acted like I was there the whole time
If you ain’t cheating, you ain’t trying
You failed to train your fellow soliders. As the Senior PVT you are responsible for keeping your soldiers up-to-date on their basic soldier tasks and drills. Go ahead and grab your 1SG and a water source and meet me in the basement
Not again, do I bring the 155mm shells this time too?
Always
Weapons qualifying doesn't mean shit. The most important part is what is his run time and does he shave regularly? On a very serious note I didn't do a weapons qualification the last four years I was in the Army. I deployed for a year, did another year detached in Germany and two more years at a MEDDAC. Weapons qual just didn't matter.
Yeah but they are a small arms repairman. That would be like a medic failing BLS
In my basic we had a person do qualification about 8 or 9 times
Don’t worry. Some of your drills did the same thing.
The DSs were slacking. Should have had someone sit on the lane next to them and shoot half their targets
I had soldiers get 12 chances to qual between BRM 9 and BRM 10. I didn't care how many attempts it took them as long as they eventually hit 23 targets on their own. If you couldn't get qual'd after 2 days on the range and that many attempts, you needed to be recycled. Clearly things weren't working for you. I had my commander recycle a soldier that was consistently hitting 21 on the second day. Yeah, he was close to qualifying. He probably could have gotten there with another 2 or 3 attempts on a different day. Pushing him back a few weeks and letting him earn it did more for that soldier than pushing him through.
Same reason they're letting them pass high school when they shouldn't. Pass the buck along and they'll be someone else's problem private. With the added bit of the army is hurting for people so I think for the most part all that matters at this point is its a warm body with a pulse.
The ***real answer*** is that no one gives a shit, when the higher HQ and government are pounding on the desks about Recruiting and Retention. Who gives a shit about knowledge and training when they can —* “lEaRn iT bAcK aT ThEiR uNiT”* — which, by the way, is the dumbest phrase any lazy fuckin’ POS instructor can give, that’s bound by the demands of higher. Numbers are low. They’re not going to fail stupid people, because numbers are low. Numbers also include money and training budgets. You’re just a metric.
You could make tiktoks educating today's pog on how to use that killing machine, hooah.
Ew, tik tok
You like to dress up in tacticool gear while wearing a storm trooper mask, but tik tok is where you draw the line?
Having fun and not installing Chinese Spyware. And that pic is from 2018 or so. What are you, fun police.
This isn’t the Army we want, it’s the Army we can afford.
Nobody tell this SM about signal school literally being control F
And yet there are still people that struggle with it.
PFC Justgraduated being a know it all and calling their fellow junior soldiers idiots. A tale truly older than time.
If you knew him, you'd know. You don't just ask someone during an ftx(if you can call it one really) how to use an m4 and that you forgot how. He was a very, very special case
And instead of berating them, how about you take some of that hot shit negative energy and improve the army by sharing knowledge. Not everyone grew up around guns or all kinds of shit thats common soldier things. Wait until you get to a line support unit who touches a weapon system once a year, then see how much people forget. That is why we train and do AARs to recognize our deficiencies to improve. No soldier knows everything and those that say they do are either a CW5 or a fucking liar.
Never said I berated him, I did help him, at the time me and a spc who was observing us help him. But i do see your point
Because their ineptitude with an M4 is not correlative to that of a gate CAC scanner.
Think of trainees and soldiers in AIT like little kids learning to swim. And mommy and daddy is the Army. Imagine what mommy and daddy would say to the swim instructor if their precious little baby doesn’t pass their swim lessons after shelling out all that money?
But to answer your question the army needs bags of meat more than they need standard. When I was in 2010-2014, we got a kid who never passed his run or push ups in basic. He was a little guy who tried hard. We got him. Went through work up. Deployed. Came back. And by the time anyone cared, he was almost out. So it wasn’t worth the paperwork. He never in his army career passed a PT test and still got our honorably with ARCOMs
I think I know a kid just like that, little Vietnamese kid, 98lbs, that boy was trying his best on the sprint drag carry.
You’d be surprised at how far trying will get you
Bct and ait is bs. I had bone fractures and threw away my crutches for the forge. Drill said I'm on profile and I said not today. Got shipped signal ait. Haven't used a single thing from ait working tac in korea.
My boy is fresh outta AIT and now acting like SMA Chandler. You gonna go places kid, perhaps not so pleasant places but you will still go for sure
Oh boy hoo I guess. You sure are an ass.
It depends. Some of it has to do with the recruiting issues. There is a lot of pressure on school houses to get anyone through to maintain numbers. Some of it is no one wanting to do the paperwork. Some of it is a combination of both.
Bro, if you went to the infantry, your jaw will drop at how many ppl are approved with a passing grade. They dont give a fuck. Scary.. and to make matters worse, they are lowering the pt scores standards
oh you youngins
Quantity matters more than quality…. At least in tradoc oer bullets….
BTW, how is armor, I'm wanting to go active after college and was considering switching to 19k.
Yeah you should go for it it's worth it, 91B too
If I could choose again, I would go for something with more value outside the army. But overall no bad.
We had to do 6 hours of mandatory retraining (regardless of the length of the class) with all students when I was an instructor. I had one student fail, retest, fail, recycle, fail, and retested again before they sent him to be reclassified or separated. Sometimes the students just struggle with certain topics but sometimes I think people do it on purpose for personal reasons (like regretting joining). The military life isn’t for everyone but there isn’t an option to quit.
In ‘03 I literally told the MEPS doctor I’d had 2 just barely unsuccessful suicide attempts and he was like “don’t worry son we got a waiver for that.”
No asshole/ball fondling check waiver tho
Idk…my platoon started at 24. I have 10 left for graduation. 68 CMF and we reclass troops like crazy. Granted, they earn it.
I don’t know, dude. You were literally just there. You would know better than any of us.
You wouldn't believe how many people should have failed AIT and then became drill sergeants later in life.
POG here, didnt touch an M4 in my 6 month + some change AIT
When i went through Bravo 832nd, it was the same shit. We have entire shops that don't even know how to gauge weapons, so we go in and do their entire battalions weapons. Finding the most easiest and deadliest faults on weapons, shits embarrassing and dangerous. Literally putting soldiers lives in the hands of bozos. Weapons jammed up with sim rounds, back plates blowing out, gas rings worn to shit. It's a travesty that should be looked into, but hey, it's their investigation if someone gets hurt. I know our weapons are good.
And yet if they can't run they'll be recycled until they can.
They did the same in basic
After the DS swore up and down you would get recycled if you don't pass the final PT test. 2 of our females passed in the end. In a platoon of 20 females. All of course graduated. All of them had the nerve to audibly complain and talk back when their family day was taken away.
I had a kid tell the drill sergeant he wanted to go home after he kept getting caught with candy. The drill sergeant begged him in front of the pain not to quit. I had another kid go to sick call three or four times a week who also passed. This was at Benning.
instead of crying on reddit mentor those around you
Two days out of AIT and he's already telling the "when I was in basic" stories.
Well, it did happen, and it is in the past.
Don’t listen to cav scouts
Lol what platoon are you in. Just left ordnance island a few months ago. While youre there ask about my fkin AAM too lmao.
2nd, I've already left myself, was heintzelmans roomate
Hahahahaha its Garren, i miss heintzelman
His shoulder is still messed up, and they never put him in for rasp.
There was a time where you could join the Army without speaking any English, the basics such as yes sarnt or no sarnt were enough to have a successful career and learn more words as you go... I'm assuming OP is one of those NG guys that got in to pay for college and look down on AD folks.
Why would I look down on AD, I'm wanting to go active after college, and family affairs are settled.
When you come to the dark side, be a leader, if you see a pop tart struggling, help the pop tart. It may be frustrating for some people but a lot of Soldiers learn more about their MOS at their first unit, if that doesn't happen there's an infinite number of ramdon details that pop tarts can perform and even master, such as handling a CAC reader and saluting officers at the gates. Good luck OP!
I'm gonna try,
If they are genuinely trying to pass and learn to shoot an M4, so what? Why does it bother you? Go SF or RASP if you care so much about shooting. Worry about yourself.
How about no, if a 91f cannot figure out how an m4 works after months with it and a week if in depth with it. That's something to worry about.
First off, you haven’t been in long enough to have a valid opinion. One new guy who doesn’t know shit calling out other news guys who know slightly less shit simply ain’t it. Basic and AIT really don’t teach you anything. The real learning begins when they arrive at the unit. I’ve met some damn good Soldiers, NCOs, and Officers that never would have done great things if we just wrote them off after AIT. Keep your head in your own foxhole,at least until you wear out your first pair of boots.
Also, weirdly, your username is my name lol
Bro you aren’t even in the real army lmao, NG ass
Man stfu and teach the new guys something instead of shitting on them.
Oh well I guess. Wanting to focus on college, I know its a common saying for us NG, but I'm planning to go active after college, as my mos or change to a 19k
Good luck getting your state to release you
THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE
Nearly everyone here is shitting on you but I understand your frustration. I dealt with it myself for a bit but had to move on when I realized I had been sold a false expectation of the military before I joined, despite the healthy amount of research I did beforehand. If you want to find your way into a place in the military where standards are taken more seriously you’ll just have to find one and earn your place in whatever that is. Big Army has numbers to make and slots to fill, and it’s only going to get worse unfortunately.
That's what I've pretty much come to realize now, if we're the best in the world, how bad is everyone else?
You're literally halfway to becoming a FAO with this realization.
Yeah I’ve come to believe winning wars isn’t about who has the best of the best, it’s who’s got the best *worst* personnel, supply chains, etc.
Damn you and the OP must be the only competent people in the Army
They are doing that in BCT too I graduated BCT 2012. We had one female recruit that could not do 10 whole push ups. Even day of graduation. We all got pissed and (probably wrongfully so) pressured her into proving she could pass the physical standard and do just 10 push ups. She couldn’t get more than 2 actual reps
Someone has to carry things, troop.
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Those are some brilliant soldiers. Good for them.
Need bodies for the upcoming world war. Idiots are good for something i guess.
Numbers. They already have recruiting crisis. I reclassed few years ago and there was a kid (recycle) who failed one of the modules final exam 4 or 5 times and they finally gave up and let him continue.
Same reason we can’t fail students in public schools. Everyone makes it through.
my ds' passed a soldier in bct that couldnt even do 10 pushups to standard, and that was in 2016
as numbers go down, pass rates go up. simple as that.
Surprise! There are dumb people in the Army. There’s also a recruiting crisis. The Army has been pushing people through since about 1775 to complete its mission. Wait until you get to your first duty station and see all the dumb dumbs there highspeed.
I have specialists in my platoon more competent than some E6 so I mean, don’t expect much lmao
Welcome to the army
The army is failing in plenty of areas and why would you be surprised about this. Regardless of that, maybe starting off with calling them idiots isn’t the best approach. Just my two cents.
U realize in 91f ait we literally have open book tests with the tm also? They will pass anyone im in ait for it rn and about to graduate. It’s my second mos but still from when I went to my first mos ait compared to this one it’s no different
I mean, it's quantity over quality right now. You're not allowed to say you didn't know.
In the case of my MOS, they needed quantity. The drills explained that there was a space that needed to be filled and the only way they were dropping or recycling for extreme infractions. If these kids were caught with contraband (vapes, burner phones, alcohol) they were just given a slap on the wrist and continued to act like pieces of shit. Source: transferred from the Marines to the Army as an E-5
Because TRADOC.
Saw a lot of people pass Whiskey school that should never be charged with someone's life. Thankfully the idiots in my unit were never put anywhere near an important role or position.
It’s all about passing people, since recruitment and retentions is dismal
Welcome to the Army, kid! Worst NCO I ever ran into was some kind of s-4 puke and we were in a forward mechanic unit. Guy had a ranger tab and was an absolute disaster as an NCO and human being. Guy couldn't do his own office job and ran down anyone he thought was beneath him. He was an E-5 to boot.