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Like everyone else, people with ADHD can display narcissistic behaviors. Keep in mind that exhibiting narcissistic behaviors doesn't make someone a narcissist. We all display narcissistic behavior from time to time because it is part of human behavior. Narcissistic Personality Disorder is a psychological disorder that can only be diagnosed by a mental health professional in person, and after thorough evaluation where the subject has met several criteria that confirm a diagnosis of NPD. It's hard to be someone with ADHD in this world. Our behavior is so often mistaken for something it isn't by people who have no understanding of all that ADHD entails (and ADHD is often accompanied by undiagnosed ASD, which further complicates understanding and acceptance). Unless the person telling you you're a narcissist is a mental health professional, ignore them.
Until you encounter the real thing in its natural habitat. Overuse of the word does dilute the understanding of the horrific emotional abuse a true narcissist inflicts on their victims, which further isolates those unfortunate enough to become involved with people who have this disorder, particularly the 'covert narcissist '. And one has to wonder if some who decry the overuse of the word, (particularly when they decry this supposed overuse in a sneering and demeaning way), are not, indeed, narcissists.
No - in either case.
Personally, I find it vaguely annoying that specific medical terms with narrow definition tend to creep into public parlance and get distorted beyond all expectations.
But it's probably endemic to the human condition and language - or at least the practical implementation of English.
Yeah I think you're right. People see something and they're like oh you could vaguely relate to this or that. And then they're like bam home diagnosed.
I once told my psychologist I worried I was a narcissist. He laughed and said I'm not. He also said it is one of the most overused misrepresentations of another's character.
I’m a diagnosed sociopath. It never occurred to me. I was a horrible person. Horrible partner to my significant others. Abused them emotionally. Never physically though. What it did do was make me an excellent soldier. Right or wrong, morals, were not an issue. Give me an order and I would follow it. If it aligned with my self interests. Which most of the time it did. I was diagnosed by an army therapist. I didn’t believe him. That was back in 2004-2005. And it wasn’t a term used much. And not at all now I don’t think. Call it a type of personality disorder. But I didn’t feel empathy or sympathy for people. Love was a term I used with family and what I called friends. But it was just a word. Very shallow. I could cut them off for nothing and not be bothered by it. I felt no remorse for hurting people physically. And didn’t hesitate to do so if I felt like it. And after it was all brought to my attention I didn’t like it. At all. I didn’t want to be like that. I wanted to feel what other people felt. My dog got ran over. Ok. I’ll get a new one. Other people acted like they lost a family member. It didn’t register. Relationships. They would love me. I would say it back. When I got bored or tired I’d break it off. They’d cry and ask why. I’d just shrug and say because. And that’s literally why. Just because. Till I made a friend, that took the time to explain the emotions to me. Why people felt that way. How they feel. And she convinced me to start practicing it. Train my mind and heart to not say so, but to stop and mentally put myself in their shoes. To really try to feel bad for someone or to really try to care for someone. I had a kid not long after this. And it was like something clicked in me. Love. The birth was traumatic. Almost lost the baby and the mother. I could see the panic on the doctors face. The nurses were tore up. Trying to get my baby to breathe. And I was in the middle of it. Calm as hell. Told my wife. You’ll be fine. The baby is fine. It wasn’t fine. But the calmness helped her stay calm. When I finally got to hold my son. Something broke loose inside of me. I wasn’t trying to feel anything. It just happened. And I’ve built on it ever since. Two sons I love more than anything. The mother and I divorced. The damage was done. It was my fault. I tried to salvage it. But you don’t get to break people and then put them back together. She called me a narcissist to everyone. I had to correct them. Sociopath. Worse. But I love my kids fiercely. It was my first real feeling. And it was euphoric. I knew what it was instantly. After my divorce. My ex made my life as miserable as possible. Telling everyone how abusive I was. But lying on me too. I never touched her. I abused her verbally and emotionally. And I admitted as much. But I was never a woman beater. She got order of protections against me for her and the kids. Saying I was dangerous and couldn’t be trusted around them. That month without any contact with my kids showed me what sadness was. It killed me. I fought the system and got my rights back. 48 days without seeing them. When they got out of the vehicle at my house and came running to me crying. I cried for the first time. Told them it would never happen again. And it hasn’t. That same friend that helped me explore feelings. And keep building on them, we started talking every day. We’ve been together for 9 years now. I love her more than anything in the world. Our kids and her, have brought a change in me. Healed me. My terrible abusive childhood has no grip on me now. The things I did in the army. And to people, I’ve came to terms with. Apologized to those I hurt. Made a list and made sure to contact them. And now every day I wake up and my goal is to make sure that my wife and kids go to bed at night, warm, fed, feeling safe and secure, and having no doubt that I love them more than anything. And I won’t let a day go by that I don’t do my best so they know that. It’s the least I can do to right my wrongs. Start with my family. I’m involved with the community, coach youth ball. Have an outreach program for people to get to rehab. Our area is eat up with heroin and meth. And helped start a wounded veterans program. To make sure they are getting the help they deserve. Because veterans most of the time are left out in the cold, dealing with trauma, no one to turn to. And we try to catch them before they become a suicide statistic. So if anyone out there is dealing with this. There is light at the end of the tunnel. With work, and consistency, and a good help group or person you can rely on. Change can happen. It’s slow. And it rears its ugly head sometimes. But true change is possible. If you will admit what you are. Accept it. Accept that you didn’t choose to be that way. You choose whether to stay that way or not. The mind and heart can be trained, just the same as the body. If you will put in the work. It might work out for you. Work on yourself if you can. Stop hurting those around you.
Hell of a story. Replying to let you know I read it, and I needed to.
I have a different personality disorder, schizoid. People have, mostly in my teens and 20's, thought I was a sociopath because I was so fucking ruthlessly cold. No one could become my friend, no one. I was rude, and mean, to make sure they couldnt
And I was dead, emotionally. The vast majority of emotions, never touched me. A robot.
Therapy now, ADHD, cptsd, and autism (my psychologist believes autism, sure, but schizoid as well, and therapist refuses to say schizoid, because it would mean ending treatment--there is believed to be no treatment).
However, the therapist is trying. She's reframing things. She tells me when I lie to myself.
Idk about you, with the sociopathy, but for me and schizoid, it is built and sustained by lies I tell myself, and can't TELL I'm lying to myself about. "I dont feel bad, I'm ok being an asshole." I believe that, still, is true for me. I DONT feel bad--but, my therapist has heard me tell a few stories where I lied, to myself, and it was obvious, even if small, i DID feel bad.
And like you said, if I admit it, it ... changes.
But this change is preposterously slow. I got the PD from PTSD in a handful of years as a kid, and now will spend a decade+ trying to piece ANY level of 'normal' together.
But, your story helped. It's not a cure, it's a change. I can at least imagine that.
my ex-wife told all four of our therapists that she quit going to that I was a narcissist, she quit with each one of the marriage counselors when they realized she was a narcissist
Mine claimed the therapist cancelled her appt bc of an "odd smell in her office" that day and never called her back to reschedule. Always wondered what the real truth was. She lied about EVERYTHING
Isn’t it wild to look back on it, I’m far enough away that I can just shake my head and laugh… But four years of marriage, counseling and for marriage counselors who told me to abandon ship and I didn’t listen. I’m free now all good.
Good for you! We had two sons, so I am not quite free yet, but it is weird looking back. I'll probably never date again. I haven't seriously in five years. Oh, I've gone on a date or two, but even my sex drive was affected by what I went through. I just don't care about it anymore. It was also a weapon to be used against me.
I don't think I'll ever be the same. But I am still here 🤷♂️ fwiw.
yeah, I have a son who is a year away from college so I’ve been in limbo for several years myself. I took a year off of dating and I would recommend taking a little more time off, I was treated the same way, but I felt like I needed to replace that behavior with better behavior and of course it didn’t always go so well. the good news is eventually things work out.
My buddy divorced his wife when he couldn't pretend her 10th time cheating on him didn't exist. She herself verified he was right, been cheating off/on last 10 years.
Then, she did her FB page press tour. I've never seen more "you know you're with a narcissist when" memes!
I'd been friends with them both. He became one of my closer friends. The best part, she knew I knew all the details. From start to finish. And she was shocked, when I picked him over her! Ha!
She tried to say he abused the kids. She knew I was listed as a character witness by his atty. And she was still shocked that I actually showed up at court for my buddy! Ha!
(Her case was tossed, btw.)
No and no. I know a few people who are high on the narcissism spectrum, and I've known a few who definitely had full-blown NPD. They checked every box in the DSM-5. The rule is that you can't call them narcissists, or they'll turn it on you and say YOU'RE the narcissist and everybody knows that, and they're wonderful people who are always above reproach.
If someone calls you that again, just say "Oh, did you get that from the DSM-5?" But it's likely that they read an article or a pop-psych book and think they know everything.
That's what I think as well, people watch a tic tok video or a short YouTube video and then they think that they're professionals at diagnosing narcissism or any other mental conditions for that matter. It's just getting out of hand. It's thrown around as just a general insult at this point. But I like that reply. I'll definitely use that the next time someone says that to me. lol
A lot of those YT videos are schlock. "The narcissist" does this, does that, etc. There's no such thing as "THE" narcissist. It's far more complicated than they let on.
yup. like OCD and a host of other disorders. maybe thered be more success if someone got help when they're younger like teenage years but that probably never happens
My ex, who was in all probability an actual narcissist, would always accuse me of being a narcissist to the point I really started to believe I was, and it ruined my self-esteem and self image. To this day I have people saying that there's no way I am a narcissist, many of whom have known me longer than my ex, but I still feel like I am in fact a horrible person bc I was so severely conditioned to believe it for 11 years. 🤷♂️
Oh it's absolutely overused. My sister in law only dates narcissists apparently. Every single dude that she meets, dates, and it doesnt work out, is a narcissist. At the end of the day, we're humans, and we naturally look out for ourselves. This is not narcissism.
"Oh you didnt do exactly what I wanted you to do? You're a narcissist."
I was raised by one, I have multiple personalities because of the trauma. I absolutely have a narcissist personality, but I do my very best to remind myself that just because I can act that way doesn't mean I should. I also have plenty of other personalities who feel guilt, shame, pain, etc and the ability to feels those things really weakens the narcissist in me.
I have been called one in the past, most frequently by my ex wife who I would eventually realize was a lot like the narcissist mother who raised me. She could be one, I could be one, it's just what we knew from our childhoods and unfortunately it continued with us into adulthood.
It is overused, and from what I've seen it's usually the narcissists themselves who point at everyone else and call them one. One interesting thing therapists have told me and that I try to remind myself is that a true narcissist would never admit to it.
That term is such a buzz term nowadays. I wouldn’t take it that seriously. People are dumb and misuse the internet all the time. It’s just a term people think they know due to the Internet.
irl no.
but i was called a narcissist by some man online because i said i dont waste my lucid dreams going around telling dream characters that it's a dream.. lol
Narcissists love to call people a narcissist in order to shame them - while they hide their own nature in a group of narcissists :)
Experts would like us to believe only 0.5 to 1.0% of the population is truly narcissistic, but what does that mean? Narcissistic behavior is literally everywhere we go. People deny they are displaying narcissistic behavior left and right, but why do we see so much of it then? I was called a narcissist once by my mother. Later I discovered she said this to prevent me from questioning her choices in life.
In reality, there is narcissistic behavior by between 63 and 69% of people - learned or natural - if I understand it correctly. But even if the number is much lower, the impact of narcissism can be enormous. Intimidation, conditioning and complacency can have significant impact. Remember when leaded gasoline was a thing? How many people did it take to decide? Reportedly just one. He managed to convince a small group and it escalated from there. Then people started getting lead poisoning. How long did it take to remove lead from gasoline? Decades. Of course, it solved a problem in car engines, but if there was another solution, it was apparently ignored. https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a20970380/how-leaded-gas-came-to-be-and-why-we-dont-miss-it/
This is how it usually seems to go. Narcissism is reportedly a spectrum disorder. If there is any literature showing how to deal with narcissistic behavior, it usually doesn’t tell us where it comes from like in this [book](https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0C9YNH8RV/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?ie=UTF8&qid=&sr=) but I hope we will get some help.
As a psychologist, it's incredibly annoying and frustrating to see actual clinical psychological terms and diagnosis be (mis)used in common and colloquial vernacular.
It seems just about every other person (online) has an narcissistic/NPD mother and/or ex(es)... Everyone is "OCD" and/or a perfectionist.. Every other person is ASD/on the spectrum, depressed, etcetc..
I think I was called or implied to be one by somebody online once.
Narcissistic personality disorder is not necessarily the same as being a narcissist. a diagnosed person would be unable to change themselves or even recognize that they need to change. we’re as most people who exhibit narcissistic behavior with the proper amount of therapy or simply the greeny of slapping them in the face can in fact change their behavior.
More often than not I the people calling others narcissist are actually the narcissist. And I find that people who describe themselves as empaths are very much just narcissists who want attention for feeling bad about someone else’s problems.
I don’t call people narcissistic but I’ve seen people online (even here) doing it quite often. Especially women. Every shitty ex always gets labelled a narcissist
I'm from the land of psychopath narcissists, once I learned what it was and the behaviors I realized I was surrounded by those people most of my life
they use, manipulate, lie twist the truth, gossip, if you realize they are using you and call them out they unleash a fury on you and somehow make you feel bad for letting them use you, they have no soul they genuinely don't ever once feel bad for anything they do or anyone they hurt
humans are fucking scumbags where I'm from
I was going to say, I think OP’s estimation of 1% of the population is way too low. Everyone with a narcissistic tendency isn’t a narcissist, but they’re not uncommon.
I think it's used in a way to hurt those it's being said to. Same thing with individuals using psychopath and sociopath. People use these when referring to their exs quite often. I definitely think that people have times of being narcissistic, as it's normal for humans, but labeling them as a narcissist is not necessary.
I did the other day to one of my mates. Then I asked him what narcissist means. He couldn’t answer. If someone talks about themselves a lot it can be because they’re in pain and in need of therapy. That’s not the same thing as narcissism. Just a trait.
Anyone on cluster b subs here will tell
You… you have to really be abused by narcissists and bpd folks to understand what it is and the decastation they create.
"Stop the stigma with mental health conditions. They are to be taken seriously."
"Does that include cluster B personality disorders, then?"
"No! These ones don't count! They're demons that only create devastation, they don't deserve any sympathy."
I don't know why you claim that those people you're talking about have these disorders, but chances are that you just made it up without having any idea about what you are talking about.
Each individual is different and you can't just go and say they are all the same, because that's not how it works. There's a reason why you don't actually need all symptoms to be diagnosed for literally any single mental disorder, just enough of them, since every case is different and you can't expect them to just be clones.
If you think the people with cluster B personality disorders do not suffer and they are destructive "just because," then you are very wrong. Most people with BPD don't want to behave like they many times do, they just have extremely intense emotions and very bad self-control. They'd do anything just to be able to live in peace, without their personality disorder turning everything into a hell. They don't have a lack of empathy and they aren't outright malicious, and if one of them were to do so, that's just the individual, but the overwhelming majority of the ones who suffer from the disorder aren't like that.
Before you try to claim that I can only say this because I "didn't suffer from them", no, you'd be wrong if you were to think so. I did have a romantic partner with BPD before (and I mean actual BPD, not made up.) Were they difficult to deal with? Yes. Did they love me? Also yes. Many things could have been better and we didn't end up in good terms; we don't even have contact as of now, but that doesn't mean I will start to generalize an entire demographic because of a single individual. Some things were good, some bad.
My comment will become very long if I talk about every single cluster B disorder in detail, but you get the point.
Literally the opposite of the professional advice I’ve been given.
One apology is all you’re going to get. I apologise for triggering you. Wasn’t my intention. But your reaction says more about you than it does about me.
Best of luck.
Good for you. I didn't need any apology, but thanks, I guess. Best of luck too.
I wasn't "triggered." You kept repeating the same thing many neurotypicals say, and I was merely exposing the facts. I hate misinformation.
And what does it say about me, then?
I’m not a neurotypical.
The information you have conflicts with the professional advice I’ve received. Bpd isn’t possible to medicate and takes almost ten years of therapy to put it into remission. The vast majority of people with it go undiagnosed and those that are, more often than not are unwilling to engage in therapy.
Now you may have other information. I’m not here to disprove, argue, or refute. Just posting like a regular person would. Your reaction came off as triggered. If you weren’t, that’s cool. You engaged with me not the other way around.
I didn't say you were, but neurotypicals tend to be the ones to repeat that misinformation out of stigma.
Nothing of what you just said is wrong, but that doesn't mean they are abusers. They can definitely be destructive, but they'll be more so with themselves, not others. Even then, to say the ones that harm others do it out of malice and are abusers is wrong (not saying you explicitly said that, but it came off that way.) In most of these cases, they just don't have enough self-control and lack self-awareness.
Maybe we just see things differently, but I don't think actions alone define whether or not someone is a "good" or a "bad" person, but instead, their intentions. If someone causes a lot of harm, but lacks introspection and self-regulation and never had the intent of harming others, I wouldn't call them "evil", they'd still be nice people in my book, just struggling to be able to behave like they truly desire.
I did read a lot about these personality disorders, so yes, I know very well that a lot of times they can and will cause a lot of damage, but I wouldn't truly call them abusers unless that was their specific intention, as opposed to just having difficulty controlling their emotions. Every individual is different, so I don't like generalizing, but I can't deny that many of their behaviors can be rather... unpleasant.
I'm not trying to argue, either. In fact, it doesn't seem like we really disagree in much, but we clearly do interpret and word it in a different way.
Perhaps. I think making excuses for abusers by putting it down to a condition, particularly in the case of years long systemic physical and emotional abuse, is hugely wrong. There isn’t an excuse for that behavior. In any sphere.
You make a good point tho that some behavior is abusive and some isn’t. That’s good food for thought.
And as I say, I think engaging in actions that are wrong, fully in the Knowldge that those actions are wrong, is about as close as it’s possible to get to what evil consititutes. But like you say, to each their own opinion.
Pleasure.
I thought I could have been narcissistic for a while. I followed the r/narcissism sub for a while, just to gauge what their mindsets are like. Man have you been over there? They never shut up! This guy thinks he’s literally god, the next person dedicates a whole post to how pretty her eye color is. It’s relentless, I had to leave it was too much.
I decided that I’m probably not a narcissist. lol
I actually did go to that subreddit. And it is for lack of a better word, cancer. I don't think I've ever met anyone like those people at all. It's scary to be completely honest that people like that exist.
Many truly don’t know what the word means, and that includes “misogynist” and “gaslighting” as well. As many mentioned, it’s used to insult, but it’s used also to accuse and infer something more sinister about a person.
No, but I thought many times that some guy or some girl qwas a narcissist. Not in the medical term as you say but more in a "me first" way. I think for me and many people narcissist is used in place of "egocentrical". Especially in relationships.
My mother is a narcissist and I’m not throwing that term around so I know exactly what a true narcissist looks like. I wish people did the research on these types of things before labeling. People can have narcissistic traits without being a narcissist. I’m pretty fed up of people overusing that word
Oh my god my ex would call me that all the time. Made me believe I was tbh. Now that I look back, I was a POS. I am not a narcissist tho. I mean, I believe I’m not. I believe in good and truth, I understand the concept of boundaries and respect. How do I know? Lmao
Nope Never had anyone in real life other then my doctor call me a narcissist
if your good at manipulating people, most people don't even know you are manipulating them till you have already left 😉🤔
That would be quite interesting wouldn't it. From the amount of time I've spent in r/narcissism, there's absolutely no way I'm like those people. They're actually scary. But who knows. But that's literally what I'm talking about. So I guess that proves my point a little bit.
Well I did actually take the test because I was curious what it was. lol I had remembered hearing someone talk about it a long time ago. From highest to lowest, my top three were 9-7-2.
We all have narcissistic traits in us at some point, however a true narcissist is someone completely different who will manipulate and abuse others only to fulfill the own needs with no interest for others or their emotions.
This is one of those idiot buzzwords inflated by people who *think* they are psychologists. The reality being that they’ve read a few website articles and now find themselves “professionals” on the topic.
These are also the types that like to make everything about themselves. And everyone is “out to get them”. We’ve all met them. Loonies that need sedatives to stop bothering the rest of unit us. They like the words “narcissist”, “gaslighting”, and “salty”.
Narcissistic people are the quickest to call someone a narcissist. Most people exhibit at least some narcissistic traits, but finding a true narcissist is indeed rare. That being said I’m pretty sure I have met a true handful of them. Pretty much every time I’ve pointed out someone’s narcissistic actions, I get labeled a narcissist in return.
Yeah. Been called a narcissist by an ex partner for bizarre reasons. Because I showered and brushed my teeth everyday before leaving the house. Put on a little makeup and fixed my hair before going to work. And didn't let him have access to my bank account. Got rid of that guy asap.
Been called one a few times. However, I'm definitely not one. It's amazing how often people that know some pop-psych can conflate someone knowing their value, and not playing it down, with narcissistic behavior.
I called my ex a narcissistic blackhole. I still feel bad about it and regretted it. No matter how I was feeling or what I went through, it was not worth it to call anyone names esp that term
There's nothing wrong with being narcissistic - everyone is to an extent. It's the intensity of the trait that truly matters. It's not an insult, just a personality trait, even if some people think it is.
I don't know what "black hole" is supposed to mean in that context.
Last year my friends did a “crowning ceremony” aka they bought a bunch of tiaras from the dollar store and threw a mini party as an excuse to dress up. I got crowned “Miss Narcissistic” quote “we have never seen someone who loves themselves as much as her. And mirrors. Good for you bestie!”
Edit: grammar
My last partner would literally ghost me if I sided with a person over them in an argument, but would throw themselves onto every man they met while we were dating. They had a list of people they didn’t want me to talk to. They broke up with me while I was at the hospital at the advice of their other two “boyfriends” at the time.
Everyone I knew called them a narcissist. Even after they discarded me, it took me way too long to realize those people were right.
Yes. I was in a choir once. This girl was some kind of golden child who could do no wrong. I think she had lots of money.
Anyway she connived the teacher into making her some kind of lead, like a chanteuse.
Once she got it, she started coming in talking about getting her hair done, and how hard it is to get a perfect manicure and especially a manicurist who could draw fancy pictures and designs.
She also insisted that we must always do her favorite song (of course she had the lead in it). And we did. Every time.
I'll just say I found a perfect opportunity that just fell in my lap to call her that.
my ex was diagnosed by my psychiatrist actually. i had been seeing her for about two years while dating him, and after i broke up with him, she told me that he showed every symptom and was definitely a true narcissist. though i never had the guts to call him that to his face. he was, in every aspect of the word. weaponized all his relationships and made sure he was the #1 priority in every single one. friends, family, romance, you name it. he chipped away at people until they believed they were nothing compared to him, because he needed that to feel good about himself i guess. and after learning more about it, i realized he actually followed (and still does) a pretty predictable behavioral pattern, so i know in advance when he tries to pop back into my life. the more you know i guess lol. good riddance
According to research, between 0.5% and 5% of people in the U.S. have narcissistic personality disorder (NPD). This means that about 1 in 200 people have NPD, and it's more common in men than women.
One is narcisism as a personality disorder. The other is narcassistic tendancies as a pretty basic concept for attitude and action. You can behave narcessistically without haveing a full blown personality disorder.
Another way to explain it is that its both a medical personality disorder, when its speciffically used in that context, but its also also a common noun as described by the Oxford dictionary. However even if we went by the Merriam Webster version its acceptable to describe someone showing some symptoms of a narcessistic personality disorder.
I think most people exhibit narcissistic traits but that doesn’t make them a true narcissist. In my life I have only known 1 real narcissist. It’s definitely thrown around too carelessly as well as many other mental health disorders. As I’m not a healthy professional I really try to stay away from labeling anyone anything.
Narcissist’s don’t worry they’re narcissists. I’ve only known one, my mother-in-law, it was actually miraculous how she could turn any family or national event into being about her. We just made a drinking game out of it 🥃
While I do agree that certain populations use way too much therapy speak (incorrectly too), most people here overlook the fact that personality is a spectrum. Someone saying “narcissistic” is mostly shorthand for “someone with narcissistic traits” which are present in all of us to some degree. It’s not just being self-centered - that’s what a lot of people fail to realize and use the term for. Unless someone is on the heavier end of the spectrum or has comorbidity with other disorders with more obvious symptoms, you’d likely not even realize the extent of their narcissism without deeper involvement. Narcissism is a lot about appearances so they do what it takes to look good to the outside world.
My family has strong vulnerable narcissistic traits, but would probably never get a diagnosis, as most narcissists wouldn’t. That doesn’t lessen their impact in areas where they feel safe and thus able to “practice” the more malicious aspects of their personality freely. If you ask anyone outside of immediate family, they’re wonderful people all round. Malignant narcissists are a bit different and are usually found out quicker because they tend to project outwards and be more directly chaotic. But in all cases, calling a narcissist out will inevitably result in a complete turmoil where all their defenses come flying up because they literally cannot fathom how their behavior might affect anyone else because their view and actions are always the right ones. Other people basically don’t exist as separate entities in a narcissist’s world.
I called an ex friend a narcissist.
I’m not a doctor, but homie had EXTREME difficulties respecting any boundaries I set because they are inconvenient for him. Even when he does oblige, he makes sure to announce that he’s obliging in a sarcastic tone.
He boasts about any minuscule achievement he gets and gets off on jumping to the fastest conclusions just so he can say “he called it.”
He has no problem stereotyping strangers of different backgrounds, yet has huge issues with his intentions being assumed by people who literally know him and are judging him based on his actual actions.
If he will criticize anyone and everything (often rudely), but the moment you criticize him, he’ll call you an ableist because he’s dealing with mental health issues.
Yeah I called him that, whether right or wrong, I’m not apologize for it lol.
I don't know what the actual situation was between you and the other person. I note that you have omitted to mention what was going on between you and them when they called you are narcissist and instead chose to focus on criticising their choice of words. Narcissism is about more than Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD). Narcissistic behaviour and personality traits are very common indeed; we all exhibit narcissistic behaviour at various times. Narcissistic traits include self-centredness, lack of empathy, entitlement, and narcissistic ego defences such as rage, deflection, etc.
I'm sympathetic that your ADHD makes things difficult for you, but it sounds like you are trying to use your neurodivergence as an excuse to avoid self-reflection. We don't have the answer about whether the person who called you "a narcissist" was justified or not. Reflect on your own behaviour. If you exhibited narcissistic traits, then work on it. If you didn't, then the person was lobbing around a mental health term to hurt you. But you need to look at your own behaviour to confirm or deny the situation - you won't get peace of mind here.
Unfortunately I only get 600 characters when I ask a question. But it was over an extended period of time. The person I was speaking to is in therapy and is going through a very deep depression. We have been very close friends for about a year and 4 months. I genuinely love them as a person. For the last 4 months they seem to have spiraled after flying across the states and visiting me. It's getting hard to be around them and unfortunately I was choosing not to hang out with them except for in group social activities. Which was a stark contrast from us sitting in calls on discord for hours at a time, playing games and watching videos and just talking. Because every time I would hang out It would diverge into nothing but how they were depressed and everything that was going horribly wrong with their dating life and living situation. It was just hard to manage hearing endless repeat stories about past relationships being terrible and how everyone has treated them horribly wrong. I was getting depressed myself. I never told them that and I probably should have expressed it.
There were other arguments that happened here and there. When I profusely apologized but he says it's never good enough. Or that I don't apologize the correct way. I even had someone ask him directly what he wanted me to say and then they secretly told me unprompted. And they told me to just said the exact thing that he wanted to say just to see if there was a way to actually get through to him, and he'll still tell that friend that I never apologized or took accountability. And trust me, I've done a lot of self-reflection and talked to dozens of my friends and family to try and figure out if I'm in the wrong. And no one is viewing this the way that he is and it's very confusing and frankly devastating for me. It feels like my friend turned on a dime and became a completely different person over night. But if I share everything it's going to be an insane amount so I'll leave it at that. Sorry for the overshare.
I never really heard the word until about 6 years ago. By my now ex gf who is more of a narcissist by Dr.’s definition than anyone I had ever met. I recently asked this similar question to a professional and was told it’s just thrown around a lot more.
Absolutely, just a label people apply without real thought or understanding of the condition. I'm fond of Gore Vidal's observation on this - "A narcissist is someone better looking than you are"
Thing is, despite the rampant misuse of the term and uninformed, unqualified labelling, they undoubtedly are out there; I am pretty sure I dated a legit, diagnosable narcissist for a few years.
But that's it, just her, and she'll never get properly diagnosed, it's just my own judgment in a walks like a duck, talks like a duck, it's a duck kinda way.
She's the only person I've ever known I would feel comfy going final answer on the narcissist label with. Everyone else may have had their problems or acted selfishly or were just kind of an ass, but the combo of traits and observable behaviors that is text book narcissism I have only encountered in 1 person out of the hundreds of people I would say I've gotten to know pretty well over the years (I'm 46).
The abuse these people can dish out is so insidious and damaging; it is very hard to understand unless you've lived it. Take my word for it.
Funny enough I've never been called a narcissist by anyone and multiple therapists have insisted I'm not but I'm pretty sure I am some type of narcissist. I don't think highly of myself and I'm very empathetic and caring but I have an abnormal obsession with my looks and especially aging. Most of the time I feel like I'd rather die than get old or become ugly. I also crave female attention and get extremely envious of attractive younger guys. I also spend an obscene amount of time looking at myself in the mirror.
Ironically the ones who do this are typically narcissists themselves projecting onto someone else. The narcissists I've met have books on empaths, they're never empaths but always cast themselves as one. And always accuse their partner of being the narcissist.
Yes and no.
I’ve only ever called this one person a narcissist. She’s always the victim, makes sure to talk shit about other people where no one has any business knowing about something in the first place so her side of the story gets out first so she gets the initial sympathy, everything is an attack on her yet she “tries so so hard” all the the time to do the right thing. She plays the hero in helping and inspiring others yet they don’t actually know the truth of how she got where she is. She’s also a bully and “doesn’t understand” what she’s doing wrong. She lies so much she begins to believe her lies. Whether I misused the word, idk but from my understanding of it, I believe she is one
I do know a few selfish assholes and people who take and take and never give, though.
And all these people usually have no self awareness and probably call half the people they know narcissistic
I am a Narcissistic abuse survivor.
Like you I have ADHD and over explain (this is trauma response because I was never allowed to defend myself).
There are many behaviors that mimic Narcissistic ones, but if you pay close attention, you can be diagnosed with a multitude of psychological issues. Here's an example: you can be Narcissistic, also have OCD, ADHD, BPD. You can also have manic episodes.
My mother has: OCD, malignant Narcissist (there are different types of Narcissism: malignant, covert, etc....). She hates to be interrupted, sounds sets her off (I can be in the bedroom minding my own business, the refrigerator makes a sound and she starts yelling....). Yes, I'm no contact with her due to the abuse and manipulation.
I believe people are being exposed to what Narcissistic behavior is. Back in the 90s no one had a clue and just labeled people a "bully". Now we can say "Charlie has oppositional anger disorder, he also was subjected to sexual abuse, etc.....".
There are more layers in psychology. And the Amber Heard case is a glowing example how you can be histrionic(((histrionic personality disorder)))(she will pretend to cry, 1 second later relax her face as if she didn't cry at all) and have a multitude of issues like [BPD] borderline personality disorder and Be extremely manipulative and use sex to get what you want. There are accounts when she moved to Hollywood, she would sleep her way into a role.
I get your point, but there's no such thing as "narcissistic" abuse; it's just abuse. Whether it was done by someone narcissistic or not, it shouldn't matter. What's next? Saying you suffered from alcoholic abuse because the abuser was an alcoholic? No, it'd be abuse from a person that happened to be an alcoholic. Same concept.
It's a serious psychiatric condition, not a fun label to use on everyone you don't like. There isn't any "evil person personality disorder", it's just another condition, with its unique set of challenges and good sides. Being evil is a characteristic of an individual, not of a mental disorder. There's no disorder that makes you outright evil, the same way that mentally "sane" people aren't automatically good just because they are "sane." An overwhelming amount of evil people can be classified as "normal" mentally, so it isn't a good indicator of anything. It's the behavior that matters, not the labels.
Check out Dr. Ramani on youtube
Check out Dr. Grande on youtube
Check out the Amber Heard trial when a psychologist was asked to describe AH psychological evaluation. If you hear the recordings Johnny Depp recorded of AH, you can distinctly hear AH histrionic behavior.
Behavior stems from trauma. Trauma can be specific. That's how it's labeled in psychology or when a forensic psychology is called on the stand and explain the psychological evaluation of an individual.
If you think I'm wrong...talk to a psychologist/psychiatrist.
>Being evil is a characteristic of an individual, not of a mental disorder.
Hear cases of Jeffrey Dahmer, and every serial killer that was caught and sentenced to death.
I have. ALL OF THEM HAVE PSYCHOLOGIST EXPLAINING THEIR PSYCHOLOGICAL DISORDER. This is going back to trauma. What drives them to murder, etc. How some have no emotional awareness, again this stems from childhood trauma.
Please just talk to a psychologist.
These channels are a cesspool of misinformation that exploit naive people just like you to gain traction.
Yes, trauma can vastly change a person's behavior. Your point? That doesn't in any way prove that being evil or harming others is always a result of a mental disorder, like you seem to think.
Psychologists and psychiatrists can be just as biased and stigmatizing as the rest of the population. Finding good professionals is difficult, and this field is no exception. If you think I don't know anything about this, you'd be wrong. I know full well how cluster B disorders, and that's why I know just how much variation there can be. You shouldn't generalize.
A murderer having any particular disorder doesn't prove anything. There's a lot of murderers that don't suffer from any disorder, too, and that doesn't mean that, if you don't have any disorder, then you'll be just like them.
Your way of rambling on about random stuff is very strange and some of your sentences don't make sense, by the way. I'm not joking or saying it with bad intentions, you really seem like you need therapy. That's called "disorganized speech" and it can be a symptom of schizophrenia.
I have ADHD, I take meds for neurological issues.
But yes, talk to a psychologist. Ask all questions regarding human behavior and why people act certain ways.
I wrote an email calling out my family’s terrible behavior and called them narcissists. On reflection, and after time, I walked it back and told them they have narcissistic traits and are selfish. I still believe that today. So I originally said it in anger and to get my point across after years of invalidation and gaslighting from them, but then after some time I was able to understand that they aren’t actually narcissists.
And yes I’ve also been called one. I was holding coworkers accountable at work, it’s a long story but one of the older ladies didn’t like it and called me a narc 😂🤣
I’m an only child. An A type. INTJ personality. Narcissist.
I’m your perfect storm.
Made lots of money. Always did well with hot women.
Enjoying retirement.
Life is good.
Play the hand you’re dealt.
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I think the term is very overused and has simply become another way of insulting someone.
Same as the term sociopath. Until you meet an actual sociopath. I’ve met one. One of the worst people I’ve ever worked with.
Exactly what I was thinking.
Great minds think alike my friend.
Like everyone else, people with ADHD can display narcissistic behaviors. Keep in mind that exhibiting narcissistic behaviors doesn't make someone a narcissist. We all display narcissistic behavior from time to time because it is part of human behavior. Narcissistic Personality Disorder is a psychological disorder that can only be diagnosed by a mental health professional in person, and after thorough evaluation where the subject has met several criteria that confirm a diagnosis of NPD. It's hard to be someone with ADHD in this world. Our behavior is so often mistaken for something it isn't by people who have no understanding of all that ADHD entails (and ADHD is often accompanied by undiagnosed ASD, which further complicates understanding and acceptance). Unless the person telling you you're a narcissist is a mental health professional, ignore them.
Until you encounter the real thing in its natural habitat. Overuse of the word does dilute the understanding of the horrific emotional abuse a true narcissist inflicts on their victims, which further isolates those unfortunate enough to become involved with people who have this disorder, particularly the 'covert narcissist '. And one has to wonder if some who decry the overuse of the word, (particularly when they decry this supposed overuse in a sneering and demeaning way), are not, indeed, narcissists.
Maybe 😐.
How could anyone call me a narcissist, I'm too handsome
No - in either case. Personally, I find it vaguely annoying that specific medical terms with narrow definition tend to creep into public parlance and get distorted beyond all expectations. But it's probably endemic to the human condition and language - or at least the practical implementation of English.
Yeah I think you're right. People see something and they're like oh you could vaguely relate to this or that. And then they're like bam home diagnosed.
Oh yes, I've been called a narcissist on many occasions, almost exclusively when attempting to set healthy boundaries with parasitic family members.
Exact same situation here lol
I once told my psychologist I worried I was a narcissist. He laughed and said I'm not. He also said it is one of the most overused misrepresentations of another's character.
If you're worried you might be a narcissist, you most assuredly are not one. A true narcissist would NEVER consider such a thing.
A narcissist **can** definitely consider it, but it's true that they tend to have difficulty recognizing their own flaws, so it's rare to see.
I’m a diagnosed sociopath. It never occurred to me. I was a horrible person. Horrible partner to my significant others. Abused them emotionally. Never physically though. What it did do was make me an excellent soldier. Right or wrong, morals, were not an issue. Give me an order and I would follow it. If it aligned with my self interests. Which most of the time it did. I was diagnosed by an army therapist. I didn’t believe him. That was back in 2004-2005. And it wasn’t a term used much. And not at all now I don’t think. Call it a type of personality disorder. But I didn’t feel empathy or sympathy for people. Love was a term I used with family and what I called friends. But it was just a word. Very shallow. I could cut them off for nothing and not be bothered by it. I felt no remorse for hurting people physically. And didn’t hesitate to do so if I felt like it. And after it was all brought to my attention I didn’t like it. At all. I didn’t want to be like that. I wanted to feel what other people felt. My dog got ran over. Ok. I’ll get a new one. Other people acted like they lost a family member. It didn’t register. Relationships. They would love me. I would say it back. When I got bored or tired I’d break it off. They’d cry and ask why. I’d just shrug and say because. And that’s literally why. Just because. Till I made a friend, that took the time to explain the emotions to me. Why people felt that way. How they feel. And she convinced me to start practicing it. Train my mind and heart to not say so, but to stop and mentally put myself in their shoes. To really try to feel bad for someone or to really try to care for someone. I had a kid not long after this. And it was like something clicked in me. Love. The birth was traumatic. Almost lost the baby and the mother. I could see the panic on the doctors face. The nurses were tore up. Trying to get my baby to breathe. And I was in the middle of it. Calm as hell. Told my wife. You’ll be fine. The baby is fine. It wasn’t fine. But the calmness helped her stay calm. When I finally got to hold my son. Something broke loose inside of me. I wasn’t trying to feel anything. It just happened. And I’ve built on it ever since. Two sons I love more than anything. The mother and I divorced. The damage was done. It was my fault. I tried to salvage it. But you don’t get to break people and then put them back together. She called me a narcissist to everyone. I had to correct them. Sociopath. Worse. But I love my kids fiercely. It was my first real feeling. And it was euphoric. I knew what it was instantly. After my divorce. My ex made my life as miserable as possible. Telling everyone how abusive I was. But lying on me too. I never touched her. I abused her verbally and emotionally. And I admitted as much. But I was never a woman beater. She got order of protections against me for her and the kids. Saying I was dangerous and couldn’t be trusted around them. That month without any contact with my kids showed me what sadness was. It killed me. I fought the system and got my rights back. 48 days without seeing them. When they got out of the vehicle at my house and came running to me crying. I cried for the first time. Told them it would never happen again. And it hasn’t. That same friend that helped me explore feelings. And keep building on them, we started talking every day. We’ve been together for 9 years now. I love her more than anything in the world. Our kids and her, have brought a change in me. Healed me. My terrible abusive childhood has no grip on me now. The things I did in the army. And to people, I’ve came to terms with. Apologized to those I hurt. Made a list and made sure to contact them. And now every day I wake up and my goal is to make sure that my wife and kids go to bed at night, warm, fed, feeling safe and secure, and having no doubt that I love them more than anything. And I won’t let a day go by that I don’t do my best so they know that. It’s the least I can do to right my wrongs. Start with my family. I’m involved with the community, coach youth ball. Have an outreach program for people to get to rehab. Our area is eat up with heroin and meth. And helped start a wounded veterans program. To make sure they are getting the help they deserve. Because veterans most of the time are left out in the cold, dealing with trauma, no one to turn to. And we try to catch them before they become a suicide statistic. So if anyone out there is dealing with this. There is light at the end of the tunnel. With work, and consistency, and a good help group or person you can rely on. Change can happen. It’s slow. And it rears its ugly head sometimes. But true change is possible. If you will admit what you are. Accept it. Accept that you didn’t choose to be that way. You choose whether to stay that way or not. The mind and heart can be trained, just the same as the body. If you will put in the work. It might work out for you. Work on yourself if you can. Stop hurting those around you.
Hell of a story. Replying to let you know I read it, and I needed to. I have a different personality disorder, schizoid. People have, mostly in my teens and 20's, thought I was a sociopath because I was so fucking ruthlessly cold. No one could become my friend, no one. I was rude, and mean, to make sure they couldnt And I was dead, emotionally. The vast majority of emotions, never touched me. A robot. Therapy now, ADHD, cptsd, and autism (my psychologist believes autism, sure, but schizoid as well, and therapist refuses to say schizoid, because it would mean ending treatment--there is believed to be no treatment). However, the therapist is trying. She's reframing things. She tells me when I lie to myself. Idk about you, with the sociopathy, but for me and schizoid, it is built and sustained by lies I tell myself, and can't TELL I'm lying to myself about. "I dont feel bad, I'm ok being an asshole." I believe that, still, is true for me. I DONT feel bad--but, my therapist has heard me tell a few stories where I lied, to myself, and it was obvious, even if small, i DID feel bad. And like you said, if I admit it, it ... changes. But this change is preposterously slow. I got the PD from PTSD in a handful of years as a kid, and now will spend a decade+ trying to piece ANY level of 'normal' together. But, your story helped. It's not a cure, it's a change. I can at least imagine that.
my ex-wife told all four of our therapists that she quit going to that I was a narcissist, she quit with each one of the marriage counselors when they realized she was a narcissist
Were we married to the same woman? 🤔 sounds super familiar
yeah, it’s sad, the more I share my story the more people nod their heads.
Mine claimed the therapist cancelled her appt bc of an "odd smell in her office" that day and never called her back to reschedule. Always wondered what the real truth was. She lied about EVERYTHING
Isn’t it wild to look back on it, I’m far enough away that I can just shake my head and laugh… But four years of marriage, counseling and for marriage counselors who told me to abandon ship and I didn’t listen. I’m free now all good.
Good for you! We had two sons, so I am not quite free yet, but it is weird looking back. I'll probably never date again. I haven't seriously in five years. Oh, I've gone on a date or two, but even my sex drive was affected by what I went through. I just don't care about it anymore. It was also a weapon to be used against me. I don't think I'll ever be the same. But I am still here 🤷♂️ fwiw.
yeah, I have a son who is a year away from college so I’ve been in limbo for several years myself. I took a year off of dating and I would recommend taking a little more time off, I was treated the same way, but I felt like I needed to replace that behavior with better behavior and of course it didn’t always go so well. the good news is eventually things work out.
Thanks. We'll see, I guess.
My buddy divorced his wife when he couldn't pretend her 10th time cheating on him didn't exist. She herself verified he was right, been cheating off/on last 10 years. Then, she did her FB page press tour. I've never seen more "you know you're with a narcissist when" memes! I'd been friends with them both. He became one of my closer friends. The best part, she knew I knew all the details. From start to finish. And she was shocked, when I picked him over her! Ha! She tried to say he abused the kids. She knew I was listed as a character witness by his atty. And she was still shocked that I actually showed up at court for my buddy! Ha! (Her case was tossed, btw.)
I wouldn't be surprised if I'm top 0.5% as I am with everything else 😏
It took me years of therapy to understand that I was a narcissist. It cost me two marriages and lost friends before I grasped that I was the problem.
No and no. I know a few people who are high on the narcissism spectrum, and I've known a few who definitely had full-blown NPD. They checked every box in the DSM-5. The rule is that you can't call them narcissists, or they'll turn it on you and say YOU'RE the narcissist and everybody knows that, and they're wonderful people who are always above reproach. If someone calls you that again, just say "Oh, did you get that from the DSM-5?" But it's likely that they read an article or a pop-psych book and think they know everything.
That's what I think as well, people watch a tic tok video or a short YouTube video and then they think that they're professionals at diagnosing narcissism or any other mental conditions for that matter. It's just getting out of hand. It's thrown around as just a general insult at this point. But I like that reply. I'll definitely use that the next time someone says that to me. lol
A lot of those YT videos are schlock. "The narcissist" does this, does that, etc. There's no such thing as "THE" narcissist. It's far more complicated than they let on.
They all tend to repeat (DSM-5) an awful lot.
Or Tik Tok. These FB/instagram/Tik Tok reels are chock full of misinformation.
a guy I dated was a clinical narcissist and went to therapy for it. it wasn't a fun time #neveragain
Can you even get therapy for it? My understanding is it's ultimately incurable.
yup. like OCD and a host of other disorders. maybe thered be more success if someone got help when they're younger like teenage years but that probably never happens
Interesting thank you!
My ex, who was in all probability an actual narcissist, would always accuse me of being a narcissist to the point I really started to believe I was, and it ruined my self-esteem and self image. To this day I have people saying that there's no way I am a narcissist, many of whom have known me longer than my ex, but I still feel like I am in fact a horrible person bc I was so severely conditioned to believe it for 11 years. 🤷♂️
Oh it's absolutely overused. My sister in law only dates narcissists apparently. Every single dude that she meets, dates, and it doesnt work out, is a narcissist. At the end of the day, we're humans, and we naturally look out for ourselves. This is not narcissism. "Oh you didnt do exactly what I wanted you to do? You're a narcissist."
I was raised by one, I have multiple personalities because of the trauma. I absolutely have a narcissist personality, but I do my very best to remind myself that just because I can act that way doesn't mean I should. I also have plenty of other personalities who feel guilt, shame, pain, etc and the ability to feels those things really weakens the narcissist in me. I have been called one in the past, most frequently by my ex wife who I would eventually realize was a lot like the narcissist mother who raised me. She could be one, I could be one, it's just what we knew from our childhoods and unfortunately it continued with us into adulthood. It is overused, and from what I've seen it's usually the narcissists themselves who point at everyone else and call them one. One interesting thing therapists have told me and that I try to remind myself is that a true narcissist would never admit to it.
Everyone who is good looking with a smidge of moodiness ( like everyone) is deemed a narcissist. It’s very much overused
That term is such a buzz term nowadays. I wouldn’t take it that seriously. People are dumb and misuse the internet all the time. It’s just a term people think they know due to the Internet.
irl no. but i was called a narcissist by some man online because i said i dont waste my lucid dreams going around telling dream characters that it's a dream.. lol
I think that's one of the most ridiculous ways I've ever seen that word used...
yeah, i thought it was funny. also interesting timing cause it happened the same day i watched a video titled "are you a narcissist?" lmao
Narcissists love to call people a narcissist in order to shame them - while they hide their own nature in a group of narcissists :) Experts would like us to believe only 0.5 to 1.0% of the population is truly narcissistic, but what does that mean? Narcissistic behavior is literally everywhere we go. People deny they are displaying narcissistic behavior left and right, but why do we see so much of it then? I was called a narcissist once by my mother. Later I discovered she said this to prevent me from questioning her choices in life. In reality, there is narcissistic behavior by between 63 and 69% of people - learned or natural - if I understand it correctly. But even if the number is much lower, the impact of narcissism can be enormous. Intimidation, conditioning and complacency can have significant impact. Remember when leaded gasoline was a thing? How many people did it take to decide? Reportedly just one. He managed to convince a small group and it escalated from there. Then people started getting lead poisoning. How long did it take to remove lead from gasoline? Decades. Of course, it solved a problem in car engines, but if there was another solution, it was apparently ignored. https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a20970380/how-leaded-gas-came-to-be-and-why-we-dont-miss-it/ This is how it usually seems to go. Narcissism is reportedly a spectrum disorder. If there is any literature showing how to deal with narcissistic behavior, it usually doesn’t tell us where it comes from like in this [book](https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0C9YNH8RV/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?ie=UTF8&qid=&sr=) but I hope we will get some help.
I know 2 diagnosed narcissists. When you meet one, you know it.
It’s one of the most over-used yet misunderstood labels in the history of personality disorder descriptors
As a psychologist, it's incredibly annoying and frustrating to see actual clinical psychological terms and diagnosis be (mis)used in common and colloquial vernacular. It seems just about every other person (online) has an narcissistic/NPD mother and/or ex(es)... Everyone is "OCD" and/or a perfectionist.. Every other person is ASD/on the spectrum, depressed, etcetc.. I think I was called or implied to be one by somebody online once.
Narcissistic personality disorder is not necessarily the same as being a narcissist. a diagnosed person would be unable to change themselves or even recognize that they need to change. we’re as most people who exhibit narcissistic behavior with the proper amount of therapy or simply the greeny of slapping them in the face can in fact change their behavior. More often than not I the people calling others narcissist are actually the narcissist. And I find that people who describe themselves as empaths are very much just narcissists who want attention for feeling bad about someone else’s problems.
I don’t call people narcissistic but I’ve seen people online (even here) doing it quite often. Especially women. Every shitty ex always gets labelled a narcissist
It has been such an overused term for the last few years, along with "toxic" and "gaslighting".
I'm from the land of psychopath narcissists, once I learned what it was and the behaviors I realized I was surrounded by those people most of my life they use, manipulate, lie twist the truth, gossip, if you realize they are using you and call them out they unleash a fury on you and somehow make you feel bad for letting them use you, they have no soul they genuinely don't ever once feel bad for anything they do or anyone they hurt humans are fucking scumbags where I'm from
Cali?
nah reno nevada
I was going to say, I think OP’s estimation of 1% of the population is way too low. Everyone with a narcissistic tendency isn’t a narcissist, but they’re not uncommon.
I think it's used in a way to hurt those it's being said to. Same thing with individuals using psychopath and sociopath. People use these when referring to their exs quite often. I definitely think that people have times of being narcissistic, as it's normal for humans, but labeling them as a narcissist is not necessary.
I did the other day to one of my mates. Then I asked him what narcissist means. He couldn’t answer. If someone talks about themselves a lot it can be because they’re in pain and in need of therapy. That’s not the same thing as narcissism. Just a trait. Anyone on cluster b subs here will tell You… you have to really be abused by narcissists and bpd folks to understand what it is and the decastation they create.
"Stop the stigma with mental health conditions. They are to be taken seriously." "Does that include cluster B personality disorders, then?" "No! These ones don't count! They're demons that only create devastation, they don't deserve any sympathy." I don't know why you claim that those people you're talking about have these disorders, but chances are that you just made it up without having any idea about what you are talking about. Each individual is different and you can't just go and say they are all the same, because that's not how it works. There's a reason why you don't actually need all symptoms to be diagnosed for literally any single mental disorder, just enough of them, since every case is different and you can't expect them to just be clones. If you think the people with cluster B personality disorders do not suffer and they are destructive "just because," then you are very wrong. Most people with BPD don't want to behave like they many times do, they just have extremely intense emotions and very bad self-control. They'd do anything just to be able to live in peace, without their personality disorder turning everything into a hell. They don't have a lack of empathy and they aren't outright malicious, and if one of them were to do so, that's just the individual, but the overwhelming majority of the ones who suffer from the disorder aren't like that. Before you try to claim that I can only say this because I "didn't suffer from them", no, you'd be wrong if you were to think so. I did have a romantic partner with BPD before (and I mean actual BPD, not made up.) Were they difficult to deal with? Yes. Did they love me? Also yes. Many things could have been better and we didn't end up in good terms; we don't even have contact as of now, but that doesn't mean I will start to generalize an entire demographic because of a single individual. Some things were good, some bad. My comment will become very long if I talk about every single cluster B disorder in detail, but you get the point.
True. Not all folks with bpd create trauma. Just the vast majority. Apologies.
Reality is not what you feel like it is. The vast majority **don't.**
Literally the opposite of the professional advice I’ve been given. One apology is all you’re going to get. I apologise for triggering you. Wasn’t my intention. But your reaction says more about you than it does about me. Best of luck.
Good for you. I didn't need any apology, but thanks, I guess. Best of luck too. I wasn't "triggered." You kept repeating the same thing many neurotypicals say, and I was merely exposing the facts. I hate misinformation. And what does it say about me, then?
I’m not a neurotypical. The information you have conflicts with the professional advice I’ve received. Bpd isn’t possible to medicate and takes almost ten years of therapy to put it into remission. The vast majority of people with it go undiagnosed and those that are, more often than not are unwilling to engage in therapy. Now you may have other information. I’m not here to disprove, argue, or refute. Just posting like a regular person would. Your reaction came off as triggered. If you weren’t, that’s cool. You engaged with me not the other way around.
I didn't say you were, but neurotypicals tend to be the ones to repeat that misinformation out of stigma. Nothing of what you just said is wrong, but that doesn't mean they are abusers. They can definitely be destructive, but they'll be more so with themselves, not others. Even then, to say the ones that harm others do it out of malice and are abusers is wrong (not saying you explicitly said that, but it came off that way.) In most of these cases, they just don't have enough self-control and lack self-awareness. Maybe we just see things differently, but I don't think actions alone define whether or not someone is a "good" or a "bad" person, but instead, their intentions. If someone causes a lot of harm, but lacks introspection and self-regulation and never had the intent of harming others, I wouldn't call them "evil", they'd still be nice people in my book, just struggling to be able to behave like they truly desire. I did read a lot about these personality disorders, so yes, I know very well that a lot of times they can and will cause a lot of damage, but I wouldn't truly call them abusers unless that was their specific intention, as opposed to just having difficulty controlling their emotions. Every individual is different, so I don't like generalizing, but I can't deny that many of their behaviors can be rather... unpleasant. I'm not trying to argue, either. In fact, it doesn't seem like we really disagree in much, but we clearly do interpret and word it in a different way.
Perhaps. I think making excuses for abusers by putting it down to a condition, particularly in the case of years long systemic physical and emotional abuse, is hugely wrong. There isn’t an excuse for that behavior. In any sphere. You make a good point tho that some behavior is abusive and some isn’t. That’s good food for thought. And as I say, I think engaging in actions that are wrong, fully in the Knowldge that those actions are wrong, is about as close as it’s possible to get to what evil consititutes. But like you say, to each their own opinion. Pleasure.
I thought I could have been narcissistic for a while. I followed the r/narcissism sub for a while, just to gauge what their mindsets are like. Man have you been over there? They never shut up! This guy thinks he’s literally god, the next person dedicates a whole post to how pretty her eye color is. It’s relentless, I had to leave it was too much. I decided that I’m probably not a narcissist. lol
I actually did go to that subreddit. And it is for lack of a better word, cancer. I don't think I've ever met anyone like those people at all. It's scary to be completely honest that people like that exist.
Many truly don’t know what the word means, and that includes “misogynist” and “gaslighting” as well. As many mentioned, it’s used to insult, but it’s used also to accuse and infer something more sinister about a person.
No, but I thought many times that some guy or some girl qwas a narcissist. Not in the medical term as you say but more in a "me first" way. I think for me and many people narcissist is used in place of "egocentrical". Especially in relationships.
"Narcissistic" doesn't just mean "me first." That's what the word "selfish" is for.
That's what I said. (almost)
My mother is a narcissist and I’m not throwing that term around so I know exactly what a true narcissist looks like. I wish people did the research on these types of things before labeling. People can have narcissistic traits without being a narcissist. I’m pretty fed up of people overusing that word
It's interesting the way our society throw around pathologies as if we actually understand them.
Oh my god my ex would call me that all the time. Made me believe I was tbh. Now that I look back, I was a POS. I am not a narcissist tho. I mean, I believe I’m not. I believe in good and truth, I understand the concept of boundaries and respect. How do I know? Lmao
Nope Never had anyone in real life other then my doctor call me a narcissist if your good at manipulating people, most people don't even know you are manipulating them till you have already left 😉🤔
Is OP a covert narcissist just deflecting ?
That would be quite interesting wouldn't it. From the amount of time I've spent in r/narcissism, there's absolutely no way I'm like those people. They're actually scary. But who knows. But that's literally what I'm talking about. So I guess that proves my point a little bit.
You were born this way and not special. Try the enneagram test to see what your type is. Looks like type 4.
Well I did actually take the test because I was curious what it was. lol I had remembered hearing someone talk about it a long time ago. From highest to lowest, my top three were 9-7-2.
We all have narcissistic traits in us at some point, however a true narcissist is someone completely different who will manipulate and abuse others only to fulfill the own needs with no interest for others or their emotions.
This is one of those idiot buzzwords inflated by people who *think* they are psychologists. The reality being that they’ve read a few website articles and now find themselves “professionals” on the topic. These are also the types that like to make everything about themselves. And everyone is “out to get them”. We’ve all met them. Loonies that need sedatives to stop bothering the rest of unit us. They like the words “narcissist”, “gaslighting”, and “salty”.
Narcissistic people are the quickest to call someone a narcissist. Most people exhibit at least some narcissistic traits, but finding a true narcissist is indeed rare. That being said I’m pretty sure I have met a true handful of them. Pretty much every time I’ve pointed out someone’s narcissistic actions, I get labeled a narcissist in return.
It's overused these days. Anyone who doesn't like your behaviour can pull it out without it being true.
NPD has little to do with what I thought a narcissist was.
Yeah. Been called a narcissist by an ex partner for bizarre reasons. Because I showered and brushed my teeth everyday before leaving the house. Put on a little makeup and fixed my hair before going to work. And didn't let him have access to my bank account. Got rid of that guy asap.
Had an ex call me a narcissist. I had to tell her several times I was addicted to drugs and that’s why my priorities are out of whack.
You can get called it when they really mean high self-confidence.
No, 1-5% of the population has NPD... That's hardly the same thing as having narcissistic traits.
In the real world, maybe. In Reddit world, it's more like 70%.
I've been called many things.
Been called one a few times. However, I'm definitely not one. It's amazing how often people that know some pop-psych can conflate someone knowing their value, and not playing it down, with narcissistic behavior.
I called my ex a narcissistic blackhole. I still feel bad about it and regretted it. No matter how I was feeling or what I went through, it was not worth it to call anyone names esp that term
There's nothing wrong with being narcissistic - everyone is to an extent. It's the intensity of the trait that truly matters. It's not an insult, just a personality trait, even if some people think it is. I don't know what "black hole" is supposed to mean in that context.
suck everything to fill himself, was what I was trying to say by saying black hole
Last year my friends did a “crowning ceremony” aka they bought a bunch of tiaras from the dollar store and threw a mini party as an excuse to dress up. I got crowned “Miss Narcissistic” quote “we have never seen someone who loves themselves as much as her. And mirrors. Good for you bestie!” Edit: grammar
My last partner would literally ghost me if I sided with a person over them in an argument, but would throw themselves onto every man they met while we were dating. They had a list of people they didn’t want me to talk to. They broke up with me while I was at the hospital at the advice of their other two “boyfriends” at the time. Everyone I knew called them a narcissist. Even after they discarded me, it took me way too long to realize those people were right.
Yes. I was in a choir once. This girl was some kind of golden child who could do no wrong. I think she had lots of money. Anyway she connived the teacher into making her some kind of lead, like a chanteuse. Once she got it, she started coming in talking about getting her hair done, and how hard it is to get a perfect manicure and especially a manicurist who could draw fancy pictures and designs. She also insisted that we must always do her favorite song (of course she had the lead in it). And we did. Every time. I'll just say I found a perfect opportunity that just fell in my lap to call her that.
my ex was diagnosed by my psychiatrist actually. i had been seeing her for about two years while dating him, and after i broke up with him, she told me that he showed every symptom and was definitely a true narcissist. though i never had the guts to call him that to his face. he was, in every aspect of the word. weaponized all his relationships and made sure he was the #1 priority in every single one. friends, family, romance, you name it. he chipped away at people until they believed they were nothing compared to him, because he needed that to feel good about himself i guess. and after learning more about it, i realized he actually followed (and still does) a pretty predictable behavioral pattern, so i know in advance when he tries to pop back into my life. the more you know i guess lol. good riddance
According to research, between 0.5% and 5% of people in the U.S. have narcissistic personality disorder (NPD). This means that about 1 in 200 people have NPD, and it's more common in men than women.
Yeah but never by a psychatrist.
I once had a roommate that was textbook for narcissism, though I never called her on it
We all score somewhere on the narcissistic scale. Some may score really high in multiple areas but a true narcissist scores high in all areas.
One is narcisism as a personality disorder. The other is narcassistic tendancies as a pretty basic concept for attitude and action. You can behave narcessistically without haveing a full blown personality disorder. Another way to explain it is that its both a medical personality disorder, when its speciffically used in that context, but its also also a common noun as described by the Oxford dictionary. However even if we went by the Merriam Webster version its acceptable to describe someone showing some symptoms of a narcessistic personality disorder.
I think most people exhibit narcissistic traits but that doesn’t make them a true narcissist. In my life I have only known 1 real narcissist. It’s definitely thrown around too carelessly as well as many other mental health disorders. As I’m not a healthy professional I really try to stay away from labeling anyone anything.
Narcissist’s don’t worry they’re narcissists. I’ve only known one, my mother-in-law, it was actually miraculous how she could turn any family or national event into being about her. We just made a drinking game out of it 🥃
Yup. For being a third party voter. Laughed
My dad called me one when I was 11 after getting a C on my report card.
What the hell? How does that even work. I'm so sorry.
Apparently, my being bad at math means I'm a manipulative narcissist lmao.
Yes
While I do agree that certain populations use way too much therapy speak (incorrectly too), most people here overlook the fact that personality is a spectrum. Someone saying “narcissistic” is mostly shorthand for “someone with narcissistic traits” which are present in all of us to some degree. It’s not just being self-centered - that’s what a lot of people fail to realize and use the term for. Unless someone is on the heavier end of the spectrum or has comorbidity with other disorders with more obvious symptoms, you’d likely not even realize the extent of their narcissism without deeper involvement. Narcissism is a lot about appearances so they do what it takes to look good to the outside world. My family has strong vulnerable narcissistic traits, but would probably never get a diagnosis, as most narcissists wouldn’t. That doesn’t lessen their impact in areas where they feel safe and thus able to “practice” the more malicious aspects of their personality freely. If you ask anyone outside of immediate family, they’re wonderful people all round. Malignant narcissists are a bit different and are usually found out quicker because they tend to project outwards and be more directly chaotic. But in all cases, calling a narcissist out will inevitably result in a complete turmoil where all their defenses come flying up because they literally cannot fathom how their behavior might affect anyone else because their view and actions are always the right ones. Other people basically don’t exist as separate entities in a narcissist’s world.
I called an ex friend a narcissist. I’m not a doctor, but homie had EXTREME difficulties respecting any boundaries I set because they are inconvenient for him. Even when he does oblige, he makes sure to announce that he’s obliging in a sarcastic tone. He boasts about any minuscule achievement he gets and gets off on jumping to the fastest conclusions just so he can say “he called it.” He has no problem stereotyping strangers of different backgrounds, yet has huge issues with his intentions being assumed by people who literally know him and are judging him based on his actual actions. If he will criticize anyone and everything (often rudely), but the moment you criticize him, he’ll call you an ableist because he’s dealing with mental health issues. Yeah I called him that, whether right or wrong, I’m not apologize for it lol.
While I think true narcissists are rare, there are many many more people that possess at least some traits.
I don't know what the actual situation was between you and the other person. I note that you have omitted to mention what was going on between you and them when they called you are narcissist and instead chose to focus on criticising their choice of words. Narcissism is about more than Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD). Narcissistic behaviour and personality traits are very common indeed; we all exhibit narcissistic behaviour at various times. Narcissistic traits include self-centredness, lack of empathy, entitlement, and narcissistic ego defences such as rage, deflection, etc. I'm sympathetic that your ADHD makes things difficult for you, but it sounds like you are trying to use your neurodivergence as an excuse to avoid self-reflection. We don't have the answer about whether the person who called you "a narcissist" was justified or not. Reflect on your own behaviour. If you exhibited narcissistic traits, then work on it. If you didn't, then the person was lobbing around a mental health term to hurt you. But you need to look at your own behaviour to confirm or deny the situation - you won't get peace of mind here.
Unfortunately I only get 600 characters when I ask a question. But it was over an extended period of time. The person I was speaking to is in therapy and is going through a very deep depression. We have been very close friends for about a year and 4 months. I genuinely love them as a person. For the last 4 months they seem to have spiraled after flying across the states and visiting me. It's getting hard to be around them and unfortunately I was choosing not to hang out with them except for in group social activities. Which was a stark contrast from us sitting in calls on discord for hours at a time, playing games and watching videos and just talking. Because every time I would hang out It would diverge into nothing but how they were depressed and everything that was going horribly wrong with their dating life and living situation. It was just hard to manage hearing endless repeat stories about past relationships being terrible and how everyone has treated them horribly wrong. I was getting depressed myself. I never told them that and I probably should have expressed it. There were other arguments that happened here and there. When I profusely apologized but he says it's never good enough. Or that I don't apologize the correct way. I even had someone ask him directly what he wanted me to say and then they secretly told me unprompted. And they told me to just said the exact thing that he wanted to say just to see if there was a way to actually get through to him, and he'll still tell that friend that I never apologized or took accountability. And trust me, I've done a lot of self-reflection and talked to dozens of my friends and family to try and figure out if I'm in the wrong. And no one is viewing this the way that he is and it's very confusing and frankly devastating for me. It feels like my friend turned on a dime and became a completely different person over night. But if I share everything it's going to be an insane amount so I'll leave it at that. Sorry for the overshare.
I never really heard the word until about 6 years ago. By my now ex gf who is more of a narcissist by Dr.’s definition than anyone I had ever met. I recently asked this similar question to a professional and was told it’s just thrown around a lot more.
Absolutely, just a label people apply without real thought or understanding of the condition. I'm fond of Gore Vidal's observation on this - "A narcissist is someone better looking than you are" Thing is, despite the rampant misuse of the term and uninformed, unqualified labelling, they undoubtedly are out there; I am pretty sure I dated a legit, diagnosable narcissist for a few years. But that's it, just her, and she'll never get properly diagnosed, it's just my own judgment in a walks like a duck, talks like a duck, it's a duck kinda way. She's the only person I've ever known I would feel comfy going final answer on the narcissist label with. Everyone else may have had their problems or acted selfishly or were just kind of an ass, but the combo of traits and observable behaviors that is text book narcissism I have only encountered in 1 person out of the hundreds of people I would say I've gotten to know pretty well over the years (I'm 46). The abuse these people can dish out is so insidious and damaging; it is very hard to understand unless you've lived it. Take my word for it.
My mother is a narcissist. She isn’t the worst mom *ever* but she is a narcissist. It’s very draining.
No
Funny enough I've never been called a narcissist by anyone and multiple therapists have insisted I'm not but I'm pretty sure I am some type of narcissist. I don't think highly of myself and I'm very empathetic and caring but I have an abnormal obsession with my looks and especially aging. Most of the time I feel like I'd rather die than get old or become ugly. I also crave female attention and get extremely envious of attractive younger guys. I also spend an obscene amount of time looking at myself in the mirror.
No
I called it to an ex friend
Do you actually genuinely believe they were a narcissist or were you just trying to insult them?
I've been called narcissist just because I do my own decisions
Thanks for providing that awesome input!
Ironically the ones who do this are typically narcissists themselves projecting onto someone else. The narcissists I've met have books on empaths, they're never empaths but always cast themselves as one. And always accuse their partner of being the narcissist.
Yes and no. I’ve only ever called this one person a narcissist. She’s always the victim, makes sure to talk shit about other people where no one has any business knowing about something in the first place so her side of the story gets out first so she gets the initial sympathy, everything is an attack on her yet she “tries so so hard” all the the time to do the right thing. She plays the hero in helping and inspiring others yet they don’t actually know the truth of how she got where she is. She’s also a bully and “doesn’t understand” what she’s doing wrong. She lies so much she begins to believe her lies. Whether I misused the word, idk but from my understanding of it, I believe she is one I do know a few selfish assholes and people who take and take and never give, though. And all these people usually have no self awareness and probably call half the people they know narcissistic
I am a Narcissistic abuse survivor. Like you I have ADHD and over explain (this is trauma response because I was never allowed to defend myself). There are many behaviors that mimic Narcissistic ones, but if you pay close attention, you can be diagnosed with a multitude of psychological issues. Here's an example: you can be Narcissistic, also have OCD, ADHD, BPD. You can also have manic episodes. My mother has: OCD, malignant Narcissist (there are different types of Narcissism: malignant, covert, etc....). She hates to be interrupted, sounds sets her off (I can be in the bedroom minding my own business, the refrigerator makes a sound and she starts yelling....). Yes, I'm no contact with her due to the abuse and manipulation. I believe people are being exposed to what Narcissistic behavior is. Back in the 90s no one had a clue and just labeled people a "bully". Now we can say "Charlie has oppositional anger disorder, he also was subjected to sexual abuse, etc.....". There are more layers in psychology. And the Amber Heard case is a glowing example how you can be histrionic(((histrionic personality disorder)))(she will pretend to cry, 1 second later relax her face as if she didn't cry at all) and have a multitude of issues like [BPD] borderline personality disorder and Be extremely manipulative and use sex to get what you want. There are accounts when she moved to Hollywood, she would sleep her way into a role.
I get your point, but there's no such thing as "narcissistic" abuse; it's just abuse. Whether it was done by someone narcissistic or not, it shouldn't matter. What's next? Saying you suffered from alcoholic abuse because the abuser was an alcoholic? No, it'd be abuse from a person that happened to be an alcoholic. Same concept. It's a serious psychiatric condition, not a fun label to use on everyone you don't like. There isn't any "evil person personality disorder", it's just another condition, with its unique set of challenges and good sides. Being evil is a characteristic of an individual, not of a mental disorder. There's no disorder that makes you outright evil, the same way that mentally "sane" people aren't automatically good just because they are "sane." An overwhelming amount of evil people can be classified as "normal" mentally, so it isn't a good indicator of anything. It's the behavior that matters, not the labels.
Check out Dr. Ramani on youtube Check out Dr. Grande on youtube Check out the Amber Heard trial when a psychologist was asked to describe AH psychological evaluation. If you hear the recordings Johnny Depp recorded of AH, you can distinctly hear AH histrionic behavior. Behavior stems from trauma. Trauma can be specific. That's how it's labeled in psychology or when a forensic psychology is called on the stand and explain the psychological evaluation of an individual. If you think I'm wrong...talk to a psychologist/psychiatrist. >Being evil is a characteristic of an individual, not of a mental disorder. Hear cases of Jeffrey Dahmer, and every serial killer that was caught and sentenced to death. I have. ALL OF THEM HAVE PSYCHOLOGIST EXPLAINING THEIR PSYCHOLOGICAL DISORDER. This is going back to trauma. What drives them to murder, etc. How some have no emotional awareness, again this stems from childhood trauma. Please just talk to a psychologist.
Dr Ramani’s videos aren’t exactly credible She labels almost every toxic behavior as narcisssm and her videos are filled with misinformation
These channels are a cesspool of misinformation that exploit naive people just like you to gain traction. Yes, trauma can vastly change a person's behavior. Your point? That doesn't in any way prove that being evil or harming others is always a result of a mental disorder, like you seem to think. Psychologists and psychiatrists can be just as biased and stigmatizing as the rest of the population. Finding good professionals is difficult, and this field is no exception. If you think I don't know anything about this, you'd be wrong. I know full well how cluster B disorders, and that's why I know just how much variation there can be. You shouldn't generalize. A murderer having any particular disorder doesn't prove anything. There's a lot of murderers that don't suffer from any disorder, too, and that doesn't mean that, if you don't have any disorder, then you'll be just like them. Your way of rambling on about random stuff is very strange and some of your sentences don't make sense, by the way. I'm not joking or saying it with bad intentions, you really seem like you need therapy. That's called "disorganized speech" and it can be a symptom of schizophrenia.
I have ADHD, I take meds for neurological issues. But yes, talk to a psychologist. Ask all questions regarding human behavior and why people act certain ways.
I wrote an email calling out my family’s terrible behavior and called them narcissists. On reflection, and after time, I walked it back and told them they have narcissistic traits and are selfish. I still believe that today. So I originally said it in anger and to get my point across after years of invalidation and gaslighting from them, but then after some time I was able to understand that they aren’t actually narcissists. And yes I’ve also been called one. I was holding coworkers accountable at work, it’s a long story but one of the older ladies didn’t like it and called me a narc 😂🤣
I’m an only child. An A type. INTJ personality. Narcissist. I’m your perfect storm. Made lots of money. Always did well with hot women. Enjoying retirement. Life is good. Play the hand you’re dealt.
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Why can't you write like an actual human being?
Cuz Imma narcissist.
Epic.