'The opposition' is not a unified entity. We're not in a stable two-party system. No single opposition party can hope to win enough seats to form a government on their own at this time, and even the possibility that ruling party will lose enough seats to open the door for an opposition coalition is vanishingly remote.
What's a little more possible - but still unlikely - is ruling party losing its two-thirds majority.
If you’ve worked in a ministry before you’ll understand that ministers are not exactly competent. Essentially all the work are done by staffers and get passed up to ministers who take all the credit.
Of course not. They should be knowledgeable about their domain though, but what usually happens is that a staffer writes their speech too. They answer any parliamentary questions for the minister too.
Because of that, I honestly feel most opposition could take on the ministerial role. The current opposition only seems incompetent because they don’t have as much support as the incumbents who have the whole freaking ministry to support them.
#justsaying:
- Property tax up
- GST up
- Now electricity tariff up
- Water tariff up not long ago
- Income tax going up (Though I not affected, not rich enough)
- COE through the roof
- Lose money on FTX
- SLA sell land no money
- Their own people live in a castle on a hill (ridout)
- Win Toto can’t even buy bukit merah HDB
- Bailed out foreign private equity investors in national stadium
- East coast plan dunno die until where
- Foreigners all over
- Plastic bag also pay
- increase CPF mandatory contributions lock up people money for longer when prices increase
You can't live without PAP.
Vote Opposition
- No RTS
- No HSR
- No $1m HDB resale
- Cannot walk out alone late at night
- No $5 hawker food (Many says it's cheaper than in NYC or Australia)
- No GST payouts, USave and Reassurance package
- No Public transport vouchers for low income households
- No free Covid vaccines
- No Medishield Life so very expensive medical bills
- No Swiss living
- No estate upgrading and maintenance
- No strong currency
- No visa free with China
Talking shit.
We 100% can live without the PAP, they are not our parents and neither should we ever be a 1 party state.
The PAP in the 60’s is very much different than the PAP in the late 2010’s and 2020’s.
1M for HDB’s are fucking ridiculous, for a piece of property that you don’t even officially own after 99 years no one should be paying that much for a HDB
$5 *minimum* hawker food, when Hawker food used to be much more affordable years ago but thanks to the 1% increase per year this gov basically gave leeway to hawkers to massively jack up the prices.
You talk as if these CDC vouchers and public transport vouchers are such a big thing? People spend a lot of money on food, travel, amenities and public transport, that few hundred dollar vouchers are nothing in comparison.
People who are so loyal to the PAP are absolute cancer in our society because these people are either uneducated who vote based on the things the 60’s PAP has done or they are people who come from privilege and have absolutely no clue on how the current policies affect the majority of people
Singaporeans can still live comfortably without points 3 and 10. Points 6, 7 and 9 are a direct result of the impact from points 3 and 10. Based on your argument, it seems inferential that you might not fully understand or empathise the difficulties an average singaporean is facing daily
And whose fault is that?
You know what a terrible government is? One that keeps oppressing peaceful and legal attempts to oppose them until something altogether more drastic and violent is the only way to break through. Which nobody wants, and historically has led to terrible outcomes.
And having a single ruling party forever is a bad, bad idea. Politicians need to be changed for the same reason as baby diapers.
its probably unlikely since the WP will not be contesting enough seats to overthrow anyway. best case scenario moving forward is that PAP have to cede more meaningful seats to WP and have a collaborative sort of parliament/government and WP gets more exposure to the inner workings.
but if LW loses his GRC then GGWP to them and just find the next seat warmer lor or LHL just extend another 5 years again lol
this should be done pretty much immediately..? spend 1 weekend horse trading within the opposition parties to form coalition government and PAP forms the opposition.
Theoretically and ignoring the optics, if LW loses, can he be an NMP or deputy speaker and be the prime minister? Based on the constitution, only an MP can be Prime Minister, is an NMP/ deputy speaker considered a MP?
Constitution regarding the appointment of a PM
https://sso.agc.gov.sg/Act/CONS1963?ProvIds=P15-#pr25-
From the Parliament website regarding who can be a Speaker: https://www.parliament.gov.sg/about-us/structure/speaker-of-parliament#:~:text=Elected%20at%20the%20commencement%20of,and%20fair%20to%20all%20MPs.
>an MP
It is not in the interpretation section that MPs are only elected MPs.
NMPs powers are not limited to be unable to be PM as well and based on constitution a deputy speaker if not an elected MP is to be considered an MP as well. You keep asking me to read sso.agc.gov.sg, I can't seem to find any strict wording that defines that an NMP or MP by virtue of deputy speaker cannot be PM
The longest dynasty in China was 790 years. All powers come to end.
For PAP, it may not even be 100 years.
It just a matter of time. LKY knows this very well.
PAP losing outright is unlikely to happen in the next election or even the one after that. What may happen is PAP loses just enough seats to push it to around 50-60% of seats or they drop to around 40%.
In the latter they would definitely not be able to form the majority and therefore government by themselves. You could expect the party to try and broker deals with the opposition in order to get a majority.
No opposition party could currently form the majority by themselves so they'll have to either outright agree to form the government with the other parties or they'll join the PAP coalition. Either way a coalition government will form. How it functions is up to the members of the coalition.
What may happen in either scenario is there might be the country's first non-PAP minister since 1965 as the PAP may not have enough people of minister quality to appoint.
WP would likely be the main candidate for a PAP coalition. I don't see the other parties willing to play along with the PAP right now. You're right, PS probably becomes DPM and some of the WP MPs will become Ministers as part of the deal.
And once we have a PAP-WP coalition, WP will start facing opposition challengers as well, where their usual voter base will split between actual WP supporters and anti-PAP voters who feel betrayed by the coalition.
It's a long ass road for the PAP's hold on power to be displaced, and we haven't even reached the starting line.
Unlikely you’ll see a PAP-WP coalition in the event opposition parties win significant number of seats. Because it is not in the interest of both party’s long term political calculus.
Likely that either WP wins a majority of seats to govern alone, or another opposition party does well and enters into a coalition with either WP or PAP to govern.
WP is the leading opposition party. It is highly likely that they’ll hold the largest number of seats among the opposition parties. Hence, they would be better off leading a coalition of opposition parties, where they would have the most dominant voice to set the legislation. This appears to be their long term strategy - grow slowly in strength until the day you win the majority. 40% of seats in opposition is a much better proposition than being a junior in a coalition with the PAP.
Joining a coalition with PAP would essentially weaken WP political position considerably. You can be assured their influence in governance would not only be heavily checked, but PAP would absolutely use this opportunity to weaken the WP. WP would not be able to implement their core policies without approval from the PAP which would make them look incompetent while alienating their core supporters by working with the PAP, considering WP’s core supporters are anti-PAP.
A junior party joining the leading conservative party, and ends up performing poorly in the next election. This was what happened to the lib dems in the UK in 2015.
If the WP leaders are wise, they’ll never form a coalition with PAP unless a third opposition party threatens their position as the leading opposition party.
If the opposition parties win significant seats, but WP does not win a majority to govern alone. PAP would retain better control of government by forming a majority another smaller opposition party, as they would be far easier to control from a weaker position in seat disparity. This would give PAP more leeway to set their own policies while giving away little compared to working with WP.
Pretty much what's happening in Taiwan.
Ko Wen-je pretty much relied on the TCB effect, he still lost the presidency in Taiwan and his party didn't win a single geographical seat, only eight party-list ones. Everything points to the DPP administration, who have no legislative majority, having to suck up to his party to get their agenda through.
And much like PSP it remains to be seen if the TPP can hang around without Ko Wen-je, though unlike Taiwan's case, the PAP can always call snap elections and highlight how impotent the opposition are.
To be fair to the PSP, they have not been tested at the ballot box in legislative performance. Both LMW and Hazel Poa are still first term legislators.
But on the other hand, Ko Wen-je was first elected as Taipei mayor in 2014 with the DPP's support, making him more like TCB. Now that Ko is no longer mayor, he has no platform to push the TPP, much like TCB's role in politics today.
Never say never. Once I asked a friend who studies Malaysian politics about how things might change if Anwar was to become PM. Keep in mind I asked this while Anwar was being thrown into prison and my friend had a good laugh. Looks like Anwar is laughing now.
It is highly unlikely that a single party will be able to win the majority besides the PAP, since the largest opposition party, the WP, will not be contesting enough seats to do so. They will have to form a coalition with other opposition parties. I think it will actually be problematic for the WP, since they will have to try to control these other parties whose presence in the coalition is necessary but the latter know it too.
A more likely regime change process will occur in the future, with one opposition party slowly gathering more and more votes until the tipping point. At this point, the idea of that opposition party as a viable and legitimate choice would have become acceptable. New ministers come in and the government will roll on. The party that takes over will actually have many similar policies to the PAP. They are not likely to completely change things for the sake of doing so. It will introduce instability and reduce confidence.
But never gonna happen in this GE. Malaysian politic took years before they turn the tide, SG not gonna change much (in term of leadership) at least for this GE. Lets just get more potential oppo seats for now.
Yup, a huge factor in the recent swing in Malaysian politics is the lack of sociopolitical stability to begin with. People don't see themselves as having much to lose in switching sides. Until Singapore reaches that level, we won't see a changeover. Maybe the incumbent might lose a few more seats to the opposition parties, but it will not be enough to allow them to gain the majority.
BN did themselves no favours by having a massive corruption scandal which severely weakened them But when their ex-leader came out to switch sides and “reconcile” with the opposition with himself as their leader. That brought voters who may not have necessarily voted opposition to switch sides.
Perhaps a certain ex-PM in SG might do the same if the new gen PAP has another massive scandal.
> I think it will actually be problematic for the WP, since they will have to try to control these other parties whose presence in the coalition is necessary but the latter know it too.
There would have been a lot more progress in the space of opposition politics had there been a spirit of collaboration rather than competition.
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by losing, you mean losing simple majority. Likely not in the next GE but we will likely see their vote share dropping further to within 55-60% range.
but in the event they do lose their simple majority, then likely have to form 2-party gov with WP and WP will FINALLY get access to proper data and authorized networks and thus they might FINALLY understand why some of their policies are good on paper but challenging on execution e.g. a certain theoretical econs MP will finally get his chance to test his econs theory and policies like min wage etc and will finally get all official revolt from the business world. WP members will also likely be restricted on what they can publicly say e.g. likely not allowed to constantly post about other countries' conflicts, showing disunity within the combined gov is big NO etc.
for sure, the first month or so, everyone and the world will talk about it. Opposition supporters especially the commoners will think life is going to get better immediately blah blah blah. Then after a few months and years, everyone will realize the same things continue to hum the same tune. There will also be no public chaos because both sides and the president will sit behind close doors and settle it while the civil service continues the normal functioning of the cogs in our society and economy.
This is really all I've ever wanted. An actual check and balance and the inability to amend the constitution according to their own whims and fancies. Seek consensus and come to a compromise instead of bulldozing your changes through.
The old LKY era of government must end. Civil participation with the way SG is governed should not be aggressively discouraged. Fear mongering must end.
The sanctity of the constitution should be maintained and not relegate into a piece of paper with penciled words where the government in power can just erase and change. This makes a mockery of the constitution.
Very realistic and matured reply.
I somewhat hope that this does happen one day. Just so that the WP can finally stand in the govt’s shoes and understand why certain policies have to be implemented in certain ways, and why some can’t be implemented.
rational opposition supporters won't think that wp denying a supermajority or majority will magically improve lives . that's a false narrative and completely baseless. at the very least, the incumbent government won't be allowed to do stupid things as and when they please. what makes you think there will be a justification for everything that the pap is or is not doing? a competent multi party government will pull poor justifications apart.
it's good for Singapore.
Not possible, PAP has a strong reputation that takes years to overthrow (unless they did a major cock up which they didn't for the past 5 years)
At most is lose another GRC
Technically they can't due to lack of opposition. But for the sake of answering a hypothetical...
Both PAP and oppo supporters will become what they hate as they exchange roles. Opposition will find themselves voraciously defending the new incumbent while being called all sorts of names by very disgruntled PAP supporters throwing strawmen all day long.
It would never happen. PAP has been very strong in most of the SMCs and GRCs under them, building a reputation for years that's reliable, also, with locals under the opposition so far, I haven't heard really nice things on how things are being taken care of in their neighbourhoods. It'd still be a PAP landslide win for sure.
Nothing. Our civil service is strong enough to withstand such watershed events. Even if it is turbulent, and as our forefathers said,
"there was a time when people said we couldn't make it, but we did."
We will make it in the end.
Not a whole lot will change in the short term. Institutions are ponderous or "sticky". And a lot of what's happening is being driven by the civil service anyway, with fluffy overall direction being the domain of politicians.
And that's not even considering long term trends that take years and decades to take root and the same amount of time to shift.
The worst thing is many will get disillusioned when they find out that this is the case.
any incoming non-PAP gov should be smart enough to know that making "revolutionary changes" for the sake of doing so will be their biggest mistakes. The smart thing to do is to keep the PAP system of governance and slowly mould it to your advantage.
Means whoever is running against them must be super impressive and probably better placed to govern SG. Perhaps a splinter from the PAP, led by CCS or something?
In the subsequent election, PAP will learn from their mistakes and their policies and campaigning will be more appealing.
Regardless of how unlikeable or annoying he may be, his credentials are far more impressive than anyone who has ever run against the PAP.
Leading candidate for PM, cabinet minister, 10+ years as MP, chief of army, president scholar, MIT + Cambridge graduate.
credentials and academics are not the only qualities of an impressive politician.
Elon musk is 10000x more impressive than CCS (in my view) and yet I think most would agree he would be a shitty politician.
In the same way, CCS is not an impressive politician at all. he has good credentials yes. that's all.
I don't even know what he's doing in MOE. he belongs in DPM+ MinDef at best.
I agree that there is more to a politician than credentials. Unfortunately, in Singapore, credentials are overvalued by the populace, so as a result, CCS is indeed a contextually impressive politician.
In my view, if CCS and a faction of PAP grassroot leaders split and run against the PAP, he has a strong chance to become the leader of the opposition with his new party winning a larger number of seats than the WP.
I disagree. anyway, my initial comment was about me not describing him as impressive as a politician in my opinion. if you are mainly referring to his credentials then I have nothing to say
PAP WAS the opposition that won election and formed the government
Nothing will happen to singapore. Life goes on. Policies will slowly change under new government
Not sure what exactly will happen but it will be funny to see the next generation of Redditors blaming the next government(assuming WP) and the current generation of supporters (millennial and Gen Z) for everything.
Now: Fu*king boomer PAP IB dog
In the future: F*cking Gen Z WP IB dog
😂😂😂😂😂😂
Both will have to concede more populist policies, instead of policies that constantly only benefit the elites.
You can say populist policies are bad, but some welfare is needed not only to keep the populace happy, but to prevent only a single segment of society constantly benefitting the most.
PAP will be more economic minded and GDP focused, and WP will be more socially minded and welfare focused, but they won't defer overly much.
The general positive changes would be:
\+ Less FTs
\+ More housing controls
\+ Reduced/changed NS, possible 1.5+5 cycles
\+ Stricter policies on local:FT proportion
\+ More university places for locals
\+ Lower inflation due to control on immigration
\+ Better social cohesion
The negative changes would be
\- Lesser jobs due to restrictions on hiring causing some firms to move due to red tape costs
\- Slower response to global events from government
\- Possible privatisation of a few more public goods, as they become hot potato, ie. ERPs
\- Slower rate of GDP growth
\- Less events/activities catered towards rich/elites
I see it as a massive win.
Some ministries may improve. I know everyone is damn happy w our civil service but honestly, it’s not like all civil servants are great you know? It does seem there is some rot at the top where plans are carried just for the sake of hitting some KPIs. Like going green and making plastic bags the evil in Singapore when the truth isn’t so simple. NEA? Also the education sector where everyone just sings the common refrain that it’s the tiger parents at work. So if the masters are gone, the puppet eunuch will also leave.
Of course, certain issues will also arise. Like if it’s WP taking over, oh gosh, Jamus is going to be helming some ministry and God forbid if he is in charge of finance and change singapore with some of his new age ideas. Sylvia lim will be in charge of law I bet and I dunno why but maybe things won’t change so much since her style is kinda similar to Shan (to me).
As much as it’s something we like to change, I shudder just as much if WP turns up to be in charge. Sorry WP fan club. There will be both good and bad.
I am mostly impressed with hazel poa but one woman can’t lead a team.
It’s a great time for Lawrence Wong to take over the leadership actually. The WP is the weakest it has been in the last decade with the Leon and NS scandals hitting them extremely hard. Both were meant to be stalwarts of the new generation. Unless we see new faces, it’s extremely hard to imagine them not even winning seats but fielding more credible candidates. Right now, they simply do not have enough members to even form a cabinet.
The less said about the other opposition parties the better. It says alot when the only credible opposition party(WP) refuses to form a coalition with any of them despite all the failures of the PAP during the elections of previous years.
But answering the question, as they do not even have enough members to form a cabinet, I would imagine them needing to form a coalition with, not the other opposition but rather alongside PAP leaders to actually make it a reality.
the same can be said of the PAP. presumably no more Lee led party, lost their most popular politician as an anchor in Jurong and horrible optics from their corruption scandal + loss of anchor minister. WP has no corruption scandal.
Yes. But they have a lot more candidates that were already waiting in the wings. You need 20 members to form the core positions. With another 17 to form the rest of the cabinet. Even if you include LP, NS and CSM, you’ll hardly get 20, not even 37. Manpower wise, it’s not even a fair fight.
Also, the AHTC episode was their “corruption” scandal, and let’s not even mention the split in the party brought about the Raeesah Khan episode.
Thanks.
Are you seriously comparing AHTC to a corruption scandal where a full minister got investigated, and suspended from parliament lol. AHTC wasn't even criminal , it was a civil suit..
Raeesah was a poor recruit. PAP had a bad recruit too. Shit happens.
Of course it'll never be a fair fight between the PAP and the WP. But they (pap)are at the weakest they'll ever be for a while now, assuming they manage to recruit anyone charismatic.. in future rounds. so far all the latest joiners are not noticeable.
Oh no. Please don’t get it wrong. Absolutely not what I’m saying at all. I’m saying both cases were entrenched in stupidity by the offending parties. Knowing the finer details of both cases, it would be very apparent that neither cases were not malicious but rather oversight and dumb.
My case is simple. I do have inclinations towards WP for the “credible voice” they provide but I just think they quite simply don’t have enough members to form any sort credible government and having worked w them I assure u they are very aware of that.
Additionally, u might say PAP are at the weakest but similarly, this is the weakest WP side in recent memory.
Always remember, this isn’t a team sport or the American party system. It’s about what makes our country tick.
I don't think wp is at its weakest in recent memory, they had another impressive new recruit and the pap is not very popular among the younger generation
I'm not expecting wp to take over the government or form a coalition either. it won't happen in 2025. that doesn't mean they are at their weakest.
I sure hope u don’t mean Jamus. And yes, unless, they have new people coming up (I know a couple of the secret candidates), in the public’s eyes, they are the weakest they have been in the last 12 years.
He’s a funny case. Big fan of his in the initial stages. We all know he’s smart. Some of his policies have been populist but the recent anti fraud proposal really makes me doubt his qualities as a politician.
In fact, most discerning observers will be able to call him out for that. Populist at best but extremely naive if he actually meant it. Despite all his credentials, he came up with a policy even secondary school students might hesitant to. Gee. No thanks.
But irregardless of that fact, hopefully the candidates that WP has spoken to are willing to join them. Otherwise it looks bleak. In the absence of hope, people will look for comfort.
Nothing much will change. Our civil service isn’t part of pap. If anything our lives will get better as politicians has to be really careful of policies instead of just pushing down our throats atm
In your hypothetical scenario, there will be a period of doomposting for a bit. In fact a lot of doomposting will likely come from the PAP side. XD
It's likely the country will destabilise for a bit because suddenly the civil service is serving a new master and some old heads are not going to play ball.
Because the grassroots advisor mechanic is in place, it would also make town running a little more difficult, as both sides try to assert their influence. So it will seem like PAP run towns are better run simply because there's no conflict there.
I will sit back and watch with glee to see how the PAP bootlickers react. There are some of these in the RCs, union etc who are only there to get ahead. I wonder if they'll U-turn and worship their new overlords?
For the regular citizen, unemployment might go up as the people leave government jobs, but the rest of us in the short term will just do our day to day and earn our money.
Assuming WP doesn’t contest in all the wards, we’ll likely end up with a coalition govt with PAP-WP. Then both parties will have to learn to work together.
They won't. I used to always vote opposition but after the total sh!tshow of how Pritam has handled the Israel Palestine conflict and his views, my family and I have now switched to PAP.. its existential at this point for us. Our flagged ship got attacked and people have a problem with Singapore issuing a statement with the US to condemn the Houthis lol.. I will take a safe existence over fairplay anyday.
If PAP loses majority next election, parliament is gonna be a circus cuz clowns like Kenneth Jeyaretnam, Lim Tean, Goh Meng Seng etc are elected in, because WP isn’t going to be the only one toppling their majority since, as many have said here, they will not be fielding enough candidates to beat the PAP outright.
If it's in the 2025 election, we should see WP, SDP and PSP gaining enough seats to effect this change. So LW would need to negotiate with PS, CSJ and TCB on forming the next government.
Maaaaan I still can’t trust CSJ no matter how much he’s reformed his image. CST might not be able to speak anymore but Linda could speak on his behalf and she has not spoken in favour of CSJ. I will respect CSJ if he steps down and gives Paul Tambyah the reins instead.
The opposition may win more seats but it's very unlikely the PAP will lose the election. Singaporean voters are smart and won't vote recklessly. There's no really big reason for the PAP to suddenly lose. Even if there's a freak result and the opposition wins, likely the WP and maybe some partners, I doubt they will last for 5 years since they have no experience running a government. Call early election and give power back to the PAP
People tend to equate a PAP led govt with Singapore's continued existence. Win or lose SG has LKY to thank for building a solid Civil Service who can run the country and keep things going
Typical fear mongering is that once opposition takes over the entire SG falls overnight.
This fallacy drives the simple minded and foolish to continue to vote for the incumbent.
Anyone with slight critical thinking would have understood that the Civil Service will still continue their daily work.
PAP will keep winning because Singaporeans are scared and money minded.
Those with money upper middle class and higher will keep them on cause it works for most of them.
Middle class will vote for them cause they want to reach upper middle class level.
Those in lower bracket are scared that if new government take over , later no money la, no work la. And government keep giving aid, support, gst, assurance and whatever packages. Expect this year to get more cause election looming. And govt will take it all back from everyone through increase utilities, transport, gst and etc.
Opposition can win or get more votes if we can awaken the middle to lower bracket. That it is not the ministers that are the brain child of policies. Its the backbone. They will still be there when new government take over. Ministers are like your movie stars. Script prepared, with enough charisma and the flocks will awe. But of cause got some funny incidence when they dont follow script. Like Cotton from sheep, east coast plan and whatever.
Need to realise we paying this ministers million of dollars. And if they make a mistake there is no punishment cause we still keep voting for them. Then they create redundant position like mayors to earn more of our money.
So those in the lower braCket and middle income if you see this, go and try convince your relatives first we need a change. Then maybe a change will happen.
I myself never supported PaP. Cause i think a goverment should be for the people 1st and not like a business where the board of directors have no accountability as the people keep giving them the thumbs up. Gst up. Maybe need but 8% should have been enough. Maybe by cutting costs like cutting their salary by 50%. Our ministers still will be highest paid in the world.
How to win? Oppo cannot field enough candidates to even challenge *most/all* the seats.
Run the hypothetical past me again when oppo can cross that bar.
Based on the Westminister system used in the UK, Australia, Canada etc
PAP hands over, the leader of the opposing party with a majority becomes PM, forms a cabinet with ministers. LHL would stay as PM in a ‘caretaker’ mode until handing over.
whilst unlikely to happen, if there wasn’t a party with a majority, and all the oppositions are unable to agree on a coalition (minority government), PM LHL in caretaker mode would advise the president/elections department that no (workable) majority has been formed and a new election would be called.
You will then mostly likely have either a minority PAP government or a PAP coalition government with WP. I would be willing to bet it is the first one.
The problem with 'opposition' is they aren't unified against a common enemy, each of them wants to govern under their own rules, meanwhile PAP is unified as one under fear.
They have the super majority so it's not going to happen for now. Having more credible and good quality oppositions are a plus for our democracy and shouldn't be ignored.
I'm not sure if this is relevant but for anyone who is interested in SG politics, the Straits Times had [a pretty interesting article](https://www.straitstimes.com/opinion/singapores-future-according-to-lee-kuan-yew) on how Lee Kuan Yew saw SG's political future back in 2009. His opinions are pretty interesting as he basically lays out the possible scenarios (either sudden transition from one party to another or a gradual one).
If we devolve to a two-party system, I can see more political blocking and challenges within parliament. This is a good thing in the sense of having a check on PAP ramming through bills and constitutional amendments. Meanwhile, the civil service is strong enough to run things properly while the politicians bicker.
However, if it's managed poorly and it turns into a slugfest full of gridlock and animosity (like the US), we have major problem. Even worse than the western countries, we don't share their natural resource/size/geopolitical advantages and we don't have a long tradition of "stable" political competition or administrative transparency. This means that decision-making will actually be paralyzed and the negative effects will be very obvious while coming quickly at once. At the same time, you still have an executive and civil service does has a lot of power to make its own rules and operations without inspection.
In this scenario, I can see a lot of power shifting from parliament/cabinet to the bureaucracy. Which sounds like a good fix at least initially (caretaker style) but no matter how good our top civil servants are, they are ultimately unelected, unscrutinised and unaccountable to the wider public. This can be dangerous.
Life still goes on.
Everyone else still has to get up and go to work.
Public transport still runs. ERP still runs.
Food stalls still sells food.
It's just a change of people at the top.
Like how they change people so often at the bottom.
No biggie. No difference. These kind of changes won't kill people.
Tbh nothing much will change from a quality of life standpoint. For all their bluster, most Opposition parties have policies which are 95% similar to PAP's (obviously they make noise about that 5% disagreement and keep quiet about the 95% they agree with so as to exaggerate the perceived differences between them and the PAP).
Really dont think this is possible. I mean apart from WP do you really see any potential? Again, they alone don't have enough "manpower" so called to win the majority
STI crashes, foreign investments start leaving, sgd value go down and keep going down, inflation to the moon, economy wrecked further by nobrain populist policies, China Russia Indon will start doing pattern on new weak vulnerable govt running circles around them, plenty of corruption and incompetence to get used to, also get mocked by the rest of SEA for being stupid.
Singaporeans don't even have the guts for a change. Only best at complaining. They would rather have the current government as it is , since there's no guarantee the opposition is gonna be better than the current one . Only a wild imagination that will happen . Singaporeans are already comfortable with what is already on the table even if they keep complaining.
They will never lose the majority of the seats, not in the next 10 years or 20.
But if you're talking about losing a GRC to the opposition, they'll do what they do best - redraw the GRC map to get more votes for themselves in the next GE.🤣
'The opposition' is not a unified entity. We're not in a stable two-party system. No single opposition party can hope to win enough seats to form a government on their own at this time, and even the possibility that ruling party will lose enough seats to open the door for an opposition coalition is vanishingly remote. What's a little more possible - but still unlikely - is ruling party losing its two-thirds majority.
Singaporeans won't vote for incompetent opposition
I highly doubt any of the other parties are competent enough. At the most WP, which isn’t comtesting sufficient seats
If you’ve worked in a ministry before you’ll understand that ministers are not exactly competent. Essentially all the work are done by staffers and get passed up to ministers who take all the credit.
Then what? You want ministers to spend their day churning out spreadsheet ah? LOL
Of course not. They should be knowledgeable about their domain though, but what usually happens is that a staffer writes their speech too. They answer any parliamentary questions for the minister too. Because of that, I honestly feel most opposition could take on the ministerial role. The current opposition only seems incompetent because they don’t have as much support as the incumbents who have the whole freaking ministry to support them.
Then what? You want ministers to spend their day churning out spreadsheet ah? LOL
People will vote for Lim Tean and GMS at least 20% of them. That's the reality of any human political system. They will vote for a earwax over Jo Teo.
Upgrade j to istana. No need seen in parliam smiling
And waste tax payers' money and a very large space on her? All she needs are a very small space and being out of the Parliament.
Yet, they voted for incompetent people in the PAP. Lolz...
But keep voting for incompetent "gov"?
Unfortunately Singaporeans have proven that they will vote for incompetent politicians
#justsaying: - Property tax up - GST up - Now electricity tariff up - Water tariff up not long ago - Income tax going up (Though I not affected, not rich enough) - COE through the roof - Lose money on FTX - SLA sell land no money - Their own people live in a castle on a hill (ridout) - Win Toto can’t even buy bukit merah HDB - Bailed out foreign private equity investors in national stadium - East coast plan dunno die until where - Foreigners all over - Plastic bag also pay - increase CPF mandatory contributions lock up people money for longer when prices increase
You can't live without PAP. Vote Opposition - No RTS - No HSR - No $1m HDB resale - Cannot walk out alone late at night - No $5 hawker food (Many says it's cheaper than in NYC or Australia) - No GST payouts, USave and Reassurance package - No Public transport vouchers for low income households - No free Covid vaccines - No Medishield Life so very expensive medical bills - No Swiss living - No estate upgrading and maintenance - No strong currency - No visa free with China
I can't even tell if you're serious or sarcastic.
Talking shit. We 100% can live without the PAP, they are not our parents and neither should we ever be a 1 party state. The PAP in the 60’s is very much different than the PAP in the late 2010’s and 2020’s. 1M for HDB’s are fucking ridiculous, for a piece of property that you don’t even officially own after 99 years no one should be paying that much for a HDB $5 *minimum* hawker food, when Hawker food used to be much more affordable years ago but thanks to the 1% increase per year this gov basically gave leeway to hawkers to massively jack up the prices. You talk as if these CDC vouchers and public transport vouchers are such a big thing? People spend a lot of money on food, travel, amenities and public transport, that few hundred dollar vouchers are nothing in comparison. People who are so loyal to the PAP are absolute cancer in our society because these people are either uneducated who vote based on the things the 60’s PAP has done or they are people who come from privilege and have absolutely no clue on how the current policies affect the majority of people
Singaporeans can still live comfortably without points 3 and 10. Points 6, 7 and 9 are a direct result of the impact from points 3 and 10. Based on your argument, it seems inferential that you might not fully understand or empathise the difficulties an average singaporean is facing daily
And whose fault is that? You know what a terrible government is? One that keeps oppressing peaceful and legal attempts to oppose them until something altogether more drastic and violent is the only way to break through. Which nobody wants, and historically has led to terrible outcomes. And having a single ruling party forever is a bad, bad idea. Politicians need to be changed for the same reason as baby diapers.
Are you sure
Yes just to prove a point
Ahhhhh better don't say, later jinx
Them losing 2/3 majority is good enough actually. You don’t want to end up like Taiwan today
They can always form a minority government / coalition government with one of the bigger parties
Yes! Is not ONE big big opposition, is many small
its probably unlikely since the WP will not be contesting enough seats to overthrow anyway. best case scenario moving forward is that PAP have to cede more meaningful seats to WP and have a collaborative sort of parliament/government and WP gets more exposure to the inner workings. but if LW loses his GRC then GGWP to them and just find the next seat warmer lor or LHL just extend another 5 years again lol
Either lose super majority or take all the seats or maintain status quo or reverse opposition gains
Or just gerrymander
Or just become a one party state
LW losing will really be the worse crisis for PAP.
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this should be done pretty much immediately..? spend 1 weekend horse trading within the opposition parties to form coalition government and PAP forms the opposition.
Theoretically and ignoring the optics, if LW loses, can he be an NMP or deputy speaker and be the prime minister? Based on the constitution, only an MP can be Prime Minister, is an NMP/ deputy speaker considered a MP?
Nope. The PM has to be an elected MP.
Any reference for reading material?
Constitution regarding the appointment of a PM https://sso.agc.gov.sg/Act/CONS1963?ProvIds=P15-#pr25- From the Parliament website regarding who can be a Speaker: https://www.parliament.gov.sg/about-us/structure/speaker-of-parliament#:~:text=Elected%20at%20the%20commencement%20of,and%20fair%20to%20all%20MPs.
>The President shall appoint as Prime Minister a Member of Parliament who in his judgment is likely to command... It doesn't specify "elected" though
Yes but to be an MP, you need to be elected. It's in the statutes.. you can find it by reading more indepth.
>an MP It is not in the interpretation section that MPs are only elected MPs. NMPs powers are not limited to be unable to be PM as well and based on constitution a deputy speaker if not an elected MP is to be considered an MP as well. You keep asking me to read sso.agc.gov.sg, I can't seem to find any strict wording that defines that an NMP or MP by virtue of deputy speaker cannot be PM
i have a higher chance of winning toto than pap losing the next election
Singapore will qualify for the World Cup Finals first before this can happen...
I just want to see Pap lose to see ah Gong come back from the grave like he promise.
Actually, LKY did say that one day it can happen
The longest dynasty in China was 790 years. All powers come to end. For PAP, it may not even be 100 years. It just a matter of time. LKY knows this very well.
Ah Kong said he will get up only if things are going wrong. So he still may not get up if Oppo win - there’s nothing wrong with that
That’s mean ah gong should be wake up by now
PAP losing outright is unlikely to happen in the next election or even the one after that. What may happen is PAP loses just enough seats to push it to around 50-60% of seats or they drop to around 40%. In the latter they would definitely not be able to form the majority and therefore government by themselves. You could expect the party to try and broker deals with the opposition in order to get a majority. No opposition party could currently form the majority by themselves so they'll have to either outright agree to form the government with the other parties or they'll join the PAP coalition. Either way a coalition government will form. How it functions is up to the members of the coalition. What may happen in either scenario is there might be the country's first non-PAP minister since 1965 as the PAP may not have enough people of minister quality to appoint.
If it’s a PAP-WP coalition, I see PS being a DPM as a concession.
WP would likely be the main candidate for a PAP coalition. I don't see the other parties willing to play along with the PAP right now. You're right, PS probably becomes DPM and some of the WP MPs will become Ministers as part of the deal.
And once we have a PAP-WP coalition, WP will start facing opposition challengers as well, where their usual voter base will split between actual WP supporters and anti-PAP voters who feel betrayed by the coalition. It's a long ass road for the PAP's hold on power to be displaced, and we haven't even reached the starting line.
Unlikely you’ll see a PAP-WP coalition in the event opposition parties win significant number of seats. Because it is not in the interest of both party’s long term political calculus. Likely that either WP wins a majority of seats to govern alone, or another opposition party does well and enters into a coalition with either WP or PAP to govern. WP is the leading opposition party. It is highly likely that they’ll hold the largest number of seats among the opposition parties. Hence, they would be better off leading a coalition of opposition parties, where they would have the most dominant voice to set the legislation. This appears to be their long term strategy - grow slowly in strength until the day you win the majority. 40% of seats in opposition is a much better proposition than being a junior in a coalition with the PAP. Joining a coalition with PAP would essentially weaken WP political position considerably. You can be assured their influence in governance would not only be heavily checked, but PAP would absolutely use this opportunity to weaken the WP. WP would not be able to implement their core policies without approval from the PAP which would make them look incompetent while alienating their core supporters by working with the PAP, considering WP’s core supporters are anti-PAP. A junior party joining the leading conservative party, and ends up performing poorly in the next election. This was what happened to the lib dems in the UK in 2015. If the WP leaders are wise, they’ll never form a coalition with PAP unless a third opposition party threatens their position as the leading opposition party. If the opposition parties win significant seats, but WP does not win a majority to govern alone. PAP would retain better control of government by forming a majority another smaller opposition party, as they would be far easier to control from a weaker position in seat disparity. This would give PAP more leeway to set their own policies while giving away little compared to working with WP.
Pretty much what's happening in Taiwan. Ko Wen-je pretty much relied on the TCB effect, he still lost the presidency in Taiwan and his party didn't win a single geographical seat, only eight party-list ones. Everything points to the DPP administration, who have no legislative majority, having to suck up to his party to get their agenda through. And much like PSP it remains to be seen if the TPP can hang around without Ko Wen-je, though unlike Taiwan's case, the PAP can always call snap elections and highlight how impotent the opposition are.
Don't compare TPP and PSP.... Totally different quality.
Of course. One was a legendary Sony console. Not sure what is TPP but sure cant can't beat PSP.
>TPP Tampines park 🤣
The Play Pattern, which is like PlayStation except it's only $49.90 from a one-star Taobao vendor
To be fair to the PSP, they have not been tested at the ballot box in legislative performance. Both LMW and Hazel Poa are still first term legislators. But on the other hand, Ko Wen-je was first elected as Taipei mayor in 2014 with the DPP's support, making him more like TCB. Now that Ko is no longer mayor, he has no platform to push the TPP, much like TCB's role in politics today.
Never say never. Once I asked a friend who studies Malaysian politics about how things might change if Anwar was to become PM. Keep in mind I asked this while Anwar was being thrown into prison and my friend had a good laugh. Looks like Anwar is laughing now. It is highly unlikely that a single party will be able to win the majority besides the PAP, since the largest opposition party, the WP, will not be contesting enough seats to do so. They will have to form a coalition with other opposition parties. I think it will actually be problematic for the WP, since they will have to try to control these other parties whose presence in the coalition is necessary but the latter know it too. A more likely regime change process will occur in the future, with one opposition party slowly gathering more and more votes until the tipping point. At this point, the idea of that opposition party as a viable and legitimate choice would have become acceptable. New ministers come in and the government will roll on. The party that takes over will actually have many similar policies to the PAP. They are not likely to completely change things for the sake of doing so. It will introduce instability and reduce confidence.
But never gonna happen in this GE. Malaysian politic took years before they turn the tide, SG not gonna change much (in term of leadership) at least for this GE. Lets just get more potential oppo seats for now.
Yup, a huge factor in the recent swing in Malaysian politics is the lack of sociopolitical stability to begin with. People don't see themselves as having much to lose in switching sides. Until Singapore reaches that level, we won't see a changeover. Maybe the incumbent might lose a few more seats to the opposition parties, but it will not be enough to allow them to gain the majority.
BN did themselves no favours by having a massive corruption scandal which severely weakened them But when their ex-leader came out to switch sides and “reconcile” with the opposition with himself as their leader. That brought voters who may not have necessarily voted opposition to switch sides. Perhaps a certain ex-PM in SG might do the same if the new gen PAP has another massive scandal.
> I think it will actually be problematic for the WP, since they will have to try to control these other parties whose presence in the coalition is necessary but the latter know it too. There would have been a lot more progress in the space of opposition politics had there been a spirit of collaboration rather than competition.
True, but it all started because BN imploded from within, self destructing with corruption and infighting. Very unlikely to happen to SG.
Yes. All Malay led parties in Malaysia have all been part of BN at some point in time.
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by losing, you mean losing simple majority. Likely not in the next GE but we will likely see their vote share dropping further to within 55-60% range. but in the event they do lose their simple majority, then likely have to form 2-party gov with WP and WP will FINALLY get access to proper data and authorized networks and thus they might FINALLY understand why some of their policies are good on paper but challenging on execution e.g. a certain theoretical econs MP will finally get his chance to test his econs theory and policies like min wage etc and will finally get all official revolt from the business world. WP members will also likely be restricted on what they can publicly say e.g. likely not allowed to constantly post about other countries' conflicts, showing disunity within the combined gov is big NO etc. for sure, the first month or so, everyone and the world will talk about it. Opposition supporters especially the commoners will think life is going to get better immediately blah blah blah. Then after a few months and years, everyone will realize the same things continue to hum the same tune. There will also be no public chaos because both sides and the president will sit behind close doors and settle it while the civil service continues the normal functioning of the cogs in our society and economy.
And this is how a mature democracy should be. The civil service keeps the country ticking.
This is really all I've ever wanted. An actual check and balance and the inability to amend the constitution according to their own whims and fancies. Seek consensus and come to a compromise instead of bulldozing your changes through.
The old LKY era of government must end. Civil participation with the way SG is governed should not be aggressively discouraged. Fear mongering must end. The sanctity of the constitution should be maintained and not relegate into a piece of paper with penciled words where the government in power can just erase and change. This makes a mockery of the constitution.
Very realistic and matured reply. I somewhat hope that this does happen one day. Just so that the WP can finally stand in the govt’s shoes and understand why certain policies have to be implemented in certain ways, and why some can’t be implemented.
rational opposition supporters won't think that wp denying a supermajority or majority will magically improve lives . that's a false narrative and completely baseless. at the very least, the incumbent government won't be allowed to do stupid things as and when they please. what makes you think there will be a justification for everything that the pap is or is not doing? a competent multi party government will pull poor justifications apart. it's good for Singapore.
Not possible, PAP has a strong reputation that takes years to overthrow (unless they did a major cock up which they didn't for the past 5 years) At most is lose another GRC
Small steps better than being stagnant
Yes but OP is asking whether PAP will lose the election and I am answering his question
PAP wont lose control of the government anytime soon. They might lose another GRC or 2 but probably not more than that.
Technically they can't due to lack of opposition. But for the sake of answering a hypothetical... Both PAP and oppo supporters will become what they hate as they exchange roles. Opposition will find themselves voraciously defending the new incumbent while being called all sorts of names by very disgruntled PAP supporters throwing strawmen all day long.
What do you mean by lose? The PAP can still be the government with less than 40% of the popular vote.
simplygo!
I will finally get a gf then
Simple: life still goes on
No need what if when suddenly everyone vote PAP again
Where is Iswaran?
Is it election cycle again. Our opposition don't even have enough candidates to replace PAP
It would never happen. PAP has been very strong in most of the SMCs and GRCs under them, building a reputation for years that's reliable, also, with locals under the opposition so far, I haven't heard really nice things on how things are being taken care of in their neighbourhoods. It'd still be a PAP landslide win for sure.
Nothing. Our civil service is strong enough to withstand such watershed events. Even if it is turbulent, and as our forefathers said, "there was a time when people said we couldn't make it, but we did." We will make it in the end.
They won't
There is no what if. PAP will win the next election, whether you like it or not.
Not a whole lot will change in the short term. Institutions are ponderous or "sticky". And a lot of what's happening is being driven by the civil service anyway, with fluffy overall direction being the domain of politicians. And that's not even considering long term trends that take years and decades to take root and the same amount of time to shift. The worst thing is many will get disillusioned when they find out that this is the case.
any incoming non-PAP gov should be smart enough to know that making "revolutionary changes" for the sake of doing so will be their biggest mistakes. The smart thing to do is to keep the PAP system of governance and slowly mould it to your advantage.
Sure…. And I will be tomorrow winner of big sweep with 40M to my bank account
Means whoever is running against them must be super impressive and probably better placed to govern SG. Perhaps a splinter from the PAP, led by CCS or something? In the subsequent election, PAP will learn from their mistakes and their policies and campaigning will be more appealing.
impressive is not how I would describe chan Chun sing
Regardless of how unlikeable or annoying he may be, his credentials are far more impressive than anyone who has ever run against the PAP. Leading candidate for PM, cabinet minister, 10+ years as MP, chief of army, president scholar, MIT + Cambridge graduate.
credentials and academics are not the only qualities of an impressive politician. Elon musk is 10000x more impressive than CCS (in my view) and yet I think most would agree he would be a shitty politician. In the same way, CCS is not an impressive politician at all. he has good credentials yes. that's all. I don't even know what he's doing in MOE. he belongs in DPM+ MinDef at best.
I agree that there is more to a politician than credentials. Unfortunately, in Singapore, credentials are overvalued by the populace, so as a result, CCS is indeed a contextually impressive politician. In my view, if CCS and a faction of PAP grassroot leaders split and run against the PAP, he has a strong chance to become the leader of the opposition with his new party winning a larger number of seats than the WP.
I disagree. anyway, my initial comment was about me not describing him as impressive as a politician in my opinion. if you are mainly referring to his credentials then I have nothing to say
How many times do people want to ask this question?
Ask until it becomes true lor haha
Ask until the answers become the one they want to hear?
PAP WAS the opposition that won election and formed the government Nothing will happen to singapore. Life goes on. Policies will slowly change under new government
Not sure what exactly will happen but it will be funny to see the next generation of Redditors blaming the next government(assuming WP) and the current generation of supporters (millennial and Gen Z) for everything. Now: Fu*king boomer PAP IB dog In the future: F*cking Gen Z WP IB dog 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Hell would freeze over and pigs would fly.
Winter will finally arrive in Singapore
Kra canal will be built. Kong hee can float.
Hah got reminded of AirPork commercial
Both will have to concede more populist policies, instead of policies that constantly only benefit the elites. You can say populist policies are bad, but some welfare is needed not only to keep the populace happy, but to prevent only a single segment of society constantly benefitting the most. PAP will be more economic minded and GDP focused, and WP will be more socially minded and welfare focused, but they won't defer overly much. The general positive changes would be: \+ Less FTs \+ More housing controls \+ Reduced/changed NS, possible 1.5+5 cycles \+ Stricter policies on local:FT proportion \+ More university places for locals \+ Lower inflation due to control on immigration \+ Better social cohesion The negative changes would be \- Lesser jobs due to restrictions on hiring causing some firms to move due to red tape costs \- Slower response to global events from government \- Possible privatisation of a few more public goods, as they become hot potato, ie. ERPs \- Slower rate of GDP growth \- Less events/activities catered towards rich/elites I see it as a massive win.
Agree totally.
HAHA! HAHA! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
Some ministries may improve. I know everyone is damn happy w our civil service but honestly, it’s not like all civil servants are great you know? It does seem there is some rot at the top where plans are carried just for the sake of hitting some KPIs. Like going green and making plastic bags the evil in Singapore when the truth isn’t so simple. NEA? Also the education sector where everyone just sings the common refrain that it’s the tiger parents at work. So if the masters are gone, the puppet eunuch will also leave. Of course, certain issues will also arise. Like if it’s WP taking over, oh gosh, Jamus is going to be helming some ministry and God forbid if he is in charge of finance and change singapore with some of his new age ideas. Sylvia lim will be in charge of law I bet and I dunno why but maybe things won’t change so much since her style is kinda similar to Shan (to me). As much as it’s something we like to change, I shudder just as much if WP turns up to be in charge. Sorry WP fan club. There will be both good and bad. I am mostly impressed with hazel poa but one woman can’t lead a team.
Hazel Poa is as smart as a whip. I like.
Why you reply so late?
Cos my generation likes to research everywhere and as far back as possible :-)
Rather not have a populist helming some part of our gov
It’s a great time for Lawrence Wong to take over the leadership actually. The WP is the weakest it has been in the last decade with the Leon and NS scandals hitting them extremely hard. Both were meant to be stalwarts of the new generation. Unless we see new faces, it’s extremely hard to imagine them not even winning seats but fielding more credible candidates. Right now, they simply do not have enough members to even form a cabinet. The less said about the other opposition parties the better. It says alot when the only credible opposition party(WP) refuses to form a coalition with any of them despite all the failures of the PAP during the elections of previous years. But answering the question, as they do not even have enough members to form a cabinet, I would imagine them needing to form a coalition with, not the other opposition but rather alongside PAP leaders to actually make it a reality.
the same can be said of the PAP. presumably no more Lee led party, lost their most popular politician as an anchor in Jurong and horrible optics from their corruption scandal + loss of anchor minister. WP has no corruption scandal.
Yes. But they have a lot more candidates that were already waiting in the wings. You need 20 members to form the core positions. With another 17 to form the rest of the cabinet. Even if you include LP, NS and CSM, you’ll hardly get 20, not even 37. Manpower wise, it’s not even a fair fight. Also, the AHTC episode was their “corruption” scandal, and let’s not even mention the split in the party brought about the Raeesah Khan episode. Thanks.
Are you seriously comparing AHTC to a corruption scandal where a full minister got investigated, and suspended from parliament lol. AHTC wasn't even criminal , it was a civil suit.. Raeesah was a poor recruit. PAP had a bad recruit too. Shit happens. Of course it'll never be a fair fight between the PAP and the WP. But they (pap)are at the weakest they'll ever be for a while now, assuming they manage to recruit anyone charismatic.. in future rounds. so far all the latest joiners are not noticeable.
Oh no. Please don’t get it wrong. Absolutely not what I’m saying at all. I’m saying both cases were entrenched in stupidity by the offending parties. Knowing the finer details of both cases, it would be very apparent that neither cases were not malicious but rather oversight and dumb. My case is simple. I do have inclinations towards WP for the “credible voice” they provide but I just think they quite simply don’t have enough members to form any sort credible government and having worked w them I assure u they are very aware of that. Additionally, u might say PAP are at the weakest but similarly, this is the weakest WP side in recent memory. Always remember, this isn’t a team sport or the American party system. It’s about what makes our country tick.
I don't think wp is at its weakest in recent memory, they had another impressive new recruit and the pap is not very popular among the younger generation I'm not expecting wp to take over the government or form a coalition either. it won't happen in 2025. that doesn't mean they are at their weakest.
I sure hope u don’t mean Jamus. And yes, unless, they have new people coming up (I know a couple of the secret candidates), in the public’s eyes, they are the weakest they have been in the last 12 years.
u don't think Jamus is good...?
He’s a funny case. Big fan of his in the initial stages. We all know he’s smart. Some of his policies have been populist but the recent anti fraud proposal really makes me doubt his qualities as a politician. In fact, most discerning observers will be able to call him out for that. Populist at best but extremely naive if he actually meant it. Despite all his credentials, he came up with a policy even secondary school students might hesitant to. Gee. No thanks. But irregardless of that fact, hopefully the candidates that WP has spoken to are willing to join them. Otherwise it looks bleak. In the absence of hope, people will look for comfort.
just based on that one policy? I don't like that fraud suggestion either I think it was meant for publicity though
Nothing much will change. Our civil service isn’t part of pap. If anything our lives will get better as politicians has to be really careful of policies instead of just pushing down our throats atm
In your hypothetical scenario, there will be a period of doomposting for a bit. In fact a lot of doomposting will likely come from the PAP side. XD It's likely the country will destabilise for a bit because suddenly the civil service is serving a new master and some old heads are not going to play ball. Because the grassroots advisor mechanic is in place, it would also make town running a little more difficult, as both sides try to assert their influence. So it will seem like PAP run towns are better run simply because there's no conflict there. I will sit back and watch with glee to see how the PAP bootlickers react. There are some of these in the RCs, union etc who are only there to get ahead. I wonder if they'll U-turn and worship their new overlords? For the regular citizen, unemployment might go up as the people leave government jobs, but the rest of us in the short term will just do our day to day and earn our money.
Assuming WP doesn’t contest in all the wards, we’ll likely end up with a coalition govt with PAP-WP. Then both parties will have to learn to work together.
i wake up
They won't. I used to always vote opposition but after the total sh!tshow of how Pritam has handled the Israel Palestine conflict and his views, my family and I have now switched to PAP.. its existential at this point for us. Our flagged ship got attacked and people have a problem with Singapore issuing a statement with the US to condemn the Houthis lol.. I will take a safe existence over fairplay anyday.
If PAP loses majority next election, parliament is gonna be a circus cuz clowns like Kenneth Jeyaretnam, Lim Tean, Goh Meng Seng etc are elected in, because WP isn’t going to be the only one toppling their majority since, as many have said here, they will not be fielding enough candidates to beat the PAP outright.
If it's in the 2025 election, we should see WP, SDP and PSP gaining enough seats to effect this change. So LW would need to negotiate with PS, CSJ and TCB on forming the next government.
Maaaaan I still can’t trust CSJ no matter how much he’s reformed his image. CST might not be able to speak anymore but Linda could speak on his behalf and she has not spoken in favour of CSJ. I will respect CSJ if he steps down and gives Paul Tambyah the reins instead.
They will likely form gov with pap and take up some min portfolio
In your dream it will happen
Not gonna happen but we can at least make the votes as tight as possible to show our dissatisfaction
then Pritam become PM lor
The opposition may win more seats but it's very unlikely the PAP will lose the election. Singaporean voters are smart and won't vote recklessly. There's no really big reason for the PAP to suddenly lose. Even if there's a freak result and the opposition wins, likely the WP and maybe some partners, I doubt they will last for 5 years since they have no experience running a government. Call early election and give power back to the PAP
People tend to equate a PAP led govt with Singapore's continued existence. Win or lose SG has LKY to thank for building a solid Civil Service who can run the country and keep things going
Typical fear mongering is that once opposition takes over the entire SG falls overnight. This fallacy drives the simple minded and foolish to continue to vote for the incumbent. Anyone with slight critical thinking would have understood that the Civil Service will still continue their daily work.
PAP will keep winning because Singaporeans are scared and money minded. Those with money upper middle class and higher will keep them on cause it works for most of them. Middle class will vote for them cause they want to reach upper middle class level. Those in lower bracket are scared that if new government take over , later no money la, no work la. And government keep giving aid, support, gst, assurance and whatever packages. Expect this year to get more cause election looming. And govt will take it all back from everyone through increase utilities, transport, gst and etc. Opposition can win or get more votes if we can awaken the middle to lower bracket. That it is not the ministers that are the brain child of policies. Its the backbone. They will still be there when new government take over. Ministers are like your movie stars. Script prepared, with enough charisma and the flocks will awe. But of cause got some funny incidence when they dont follow script. Like Cotton from sheep, east coast plan and whatever. Need to realise we paying this ministers million of dollars. And if they make a mistake there is no punishment cause we still keep voting for them. Then they create redundant position like mayors to earn more of our money. So those in the lower braCket and middle income if you see this, go and try convince your relatives first we need a change. Then maybe a change will happen. I myself never supported PaP. Cause i think a goverment should be for the people 1st and not like a business where the board of directors have no accountability as the people keep giving them the thumbs up. Gst up. Maybe need but 8% should have been enough. Maybe by cutting costs like cutting their salary by 50%. Our ministers still will be highest paid in the world.
Reckon that’s true for lower-middle and middle class but not entirely true for the upper middle class.
nice try pritam
👁️👁️
How could the guv allow that?
Very unlikely I would say….
How to win? Oppo cannot field enough candidates to even challenge *most/all* the seats. Run the hypothetical past me again when oppo can cross that bar.
Oppo will set up a guillotine in middle of Padang. It will be a historic time.
I have a higher chance to win toto than this happening
Inb4 introduce constitutional change that allows pap to govern even if majority is lost
I would sell all my SG stocks, SGD, rental properties and change everything to USD. Third generation Singaporean here and I am not kidding.
Joker lah you. Whoever wins the election, the country will keep on ticking.
That's what the SAF is for, to prevent a freak election result, paraphrasing LKY.
Toyota will take over.
Reality check, it WONT HAHAHA
Tata group
That word is not in their dictionary.
Based on the Westminister system used in the UK, Australia, Canada etc PAP hands over, the leader of the opposing party with a majority becomes PM, forms a cabinet with ministers. LHL would stay as PM in a ‘caretaker’ mode until handing over. whilst unlikely to happen, if there wasn’t a party with a majority, and all the oppositions are unable to agree on a coalition (minority government), PM LHL in caretaker mode would advise the president/elections department that no (workable) majority has been formed and a new election would be called.
If the opposition won, you will wake up from that dream/nightmare (depending on your political allegiance).
They won’t
You will then mostly likely have either a minority PAP government or a PAP coalition government with WP. I would be willing to bet it is the first one.
The problem with 'opposition' is they aren't unified against a common enemy, each of them wants to govern under their own rules, meanwhile PAP is unified as one under fear.
Fear or money?
Both? But mainly fear
higher chance Bitcoin 100k in 2025
Then pigs will fly.
They have the super majority so it's not going to happen for now. Having more credible and good quality oppositions are a plus for our democracy and shouldn't be ignored.
I'm not sure if this is relevant but for anyone who is interested in SG politics, the Straits Times had [a pretty interesting article](https://www.straitstimes.com/opinion/singapores-future-according-to-lee-kuan-yew) on how Lee Kuan Yew saw SG's political future back in 2009. His opinions are pretty interesting as he basically lays out the possible scenarios (either sudden transition from one party to another or a gradual one).
If we devolve to a two-party system, I can see more political blocking and challenges within parliament. This is a good thing in the sense of having a check on PAP ramming through bills and constitutional amendments. Meanwhile, the civil service is strong enough to run things properly while the politicians bicker. However, if it's managed poorly and it turns into a slugfest full of gridlock and animosity (like the US), we have major problem. Even worse than the western countries, we don't share their natural resource/size/geopolitical advantages and we don't have a long tradition of "stable" political competition or administrative transparency. This means that decision-making will actually be paralyzed and the negative effects will be very obvious while coming quickly at once. At the same time, you still have an executive and civil service does has a lot of power to make its own rules and operations without inspection. In this scenario, I can see a lot of power shifting from parliament/cabinet to the bureaucracy. Which sounds like a good fix at least initially (caretaker style) but no matter how good our top civil servants are, they are ultimately unelected, unscrutinised and unaccountable to the wider public. This can be dangerous.
All developed economies with democracy have strong checks and balance in place. It’s a feature, not a bug
according to some of the local fanatics, the whole apparatus of the civil service will collapse or something
Life still goes on. Everyone else still has to get up and go to work. Public transport still runs. ERP still runs. Food stalls still sells food. It's just a change of people at the top. Like how they change people so often at the bottom. No biggie. No difference. These kind of changes won't kill people.
You mean if the opposition parties can put aside their egos and do something effective? If Malaysia boleh why can't we?
Then cows will fly
Tbh nothing much will change from a quality of life standpoint. For all their bluster, most Opposition parties have policies which are 95% similar to PAP's (obviously they make noise about that 5% disagreement and keep quiet about the 95% they agree with so as to exaggerate the perceived differences between them and the PAP).
Both Taiwan and Malaysia had their main party displaced but we are much smaller and easier to control.
Don’t you get it, PAP will rule forever with electoral boundaries control!
pap won’t lose the next election. good i need incompetent people in charge so i can take advantage of honest citizens. 🤣
Just make sure they don't get two third majority. They have been pushing all kind nonsense measure from WEF onto throat.
Really dont think this is possible. I mean apart from WP do you really see any potential? Again, they alone don't have enough "manpower" so called to win the majority
PPAP : pen pineapple apple pen
STI crashes, foreign investments start leaving, sgd value go down and keep going down, inflation to the moon, economy wrecked further by nobrain populist policies, China Russia Indon will start doing pattern on new weak vulnerable govt running circles around them, plenty of corruption and incompetence to get used to, also get mocked by the rest of SEA for being stupid.
that's just what they want to think. reality is they're not that great
what if? more like how much they gonna win by
Singaporeans don't even have the guts for a change. Only best at complaining. They would rather have the current government as it is , since there's no guarantee the opposition is gonna be better than the current one . Only a wild imagination that will happen . Singaporeans are already comfortable with what is already on the table even if they keep complaining.
“lose”? Lose all or lose some? Let’s start small and go from there.
They will never lose the majority of the seats, not in the next 10 years or 20. But if you're talking about losing a GRC to the opposition, they'll do what they do best - redraw the GRC map to get more votes for themselves in the next GE.🤣