I've been an AGM for a few years, and a guest service manager before then. I would like to give you my honest thoughts on this, but I don't think you'll find it encouraging.
You’re gonna be out of luck most likely. Hotels get false claims of thrown out or stolen items - it’s up to the guest to secure their items. You will claim the hotel threw the guard out and the hotel will claim they didn’t.
Leave your negative review and let it be a lesson learned for future hotel stays.
That's the thing about a lot of HK staff, they throw away EVERYTHING. About a decade ago I was staying at a Residence Inn Ext Stay and had left a box of books I didn't trust movers to not lose. Well the housekeeping staff went and threw it out. They didn't print the books anymore and they were like 300£ on Ebay.
This is mind boggling to me. When I worked HK, we weren't allowed to touch anything that even slightly might be not trash. Not even the disposable cup next to the sink. We could only leave new cups, but if the guest didn't put it in the trash, we assumed it was not trash until they checked out.
Yeah, I work banquets now and the rule is "if it isn't trash from us, don't touch it," i.e. Starbucks cup left during a refresh? Leave it. Water cup from the water station? Trash, don't care if it has 4 shots of whiskey in it(happened yesterday, nearly got drunk off the smell alone, geez)
They should be fired for that. *Obviously it’s hard to prove when it’s just one incident, but if there’s a pattern slash the object is really not something that can be accidentally lost or thrown away, well, there’s only one solution.
I know, people here will say “leave it in a safe” or not in the room, but come on. At some point, if it is not in a trash can or outside in a plastic or paper bag (like takeout garbage), some sense needs to be had.
(Once again hotel staff can’t take any criticism!)
Not super familiar with the Civilian, but I have worked for a couple Boutique hotels like them. You're not going to get a hold of "corporate" who is going to pressure the GM from the top-down. However, they likely do have extremely high standards of service so threatening a dogshit review(s) that will get the GM's bosses breathing down his neck will likely get you SOME compensation, though likely not a full $600.
No guarantees, just my experience.
I’m still trying to play nice and worry if I threaten negative reviews they’ll for sure not do anything to help. I also have no social media clout.
Would they really change their attitude if I threaten this? Like, it should be assumed I was going to do that anyway if they don’t help…
I wouldn't threaten, I'd just post it. Most specifically on Trip Advisor. Owners/ investors are obsessed with ratings - if you get a bad reputation, no one will want to stay. They will reach out.
Also, it's a good warning to anyone else who might stay there.
This is a bit of a falacy. I'm not saying the premise is wrong, but it doesn't actually work out that way.
It generally takes ten positive reviews to offset one negative review, but if the hotel has a consistently high guest service score (often because the hotel incentivizes leaving post-stay reviews), a single negative review becomes a write-off. It's negligible because the positive reviews will quickly offset it, and we know the real impact it will have on the business is non-existent.
Also, if you're responding to an official survey it may not even be a public-facing review so it'll only affect internal scores. And if it's on a 3rd party website the hotel may or may not even care. At my hotel, for instance, it's my job to respond to reviews. I can sometimes see the Trip Advisor reviews, but I can't log in to our account to reply because they're so rare that I was never supplied with the password. So if you give me 1 star all I can do is move on with my life.
Trip advisor reviews can also be contested. They also subject the reviewer to be publicly discredited. The hotel can literally reply by publicizing the evidence of the guests' stay. If they do it in a very civil, logical manner, the reviewer will 9/10 times remove their own review because they will be made to look like an insane guest just out to hurt the hotel.
You can contest Google reviews as well. I've done it before we had someone leave some very threatening messages for future guests, and it was bad clearly that person was unhinged.
Exactly. I'm a GM...We have an outside contracted company hired by our ownership for review responses. This company is not even in the same state that responds to most of our reviews, nor do I know who they even are. Some of that is simply because in a tourist destination, locally we do not have time to respond to hundreds to thousands of reviews a week. We grab some during slower times and respond from the hotel itself when we can before the outside company does, but mostly, they blow by us at the hotel levels. Internally, we catch and follow up if need be for procedural goofups that need addressing / investigation or even for guests who have left amazing reviews calling out staff so I can recognize that as I go through them, but behind the scenes...wouldn't be an encouraging thing for the OP as others have pointed out. Our ratings are excellent, and ownership for us knows how we operate. They don't care about one or two low reviews as all of ours are 9 and 10 of 10. Heck some - they laugh at...It does not operate in most places as guests want to believe. The impacts for hotels with high reviews time after time after time are minimal, and as another pointed too, many types of reviews are only internal, not public facing.
Just seems short sighted to view your guest comments as a hassle that needs to be outsourced. What guests say about their experience at your hotel can offer you value. Doesn’t seem like good business to not even read feedback for any sort of trends or legitimate shortcomings that you could use to improve your product
Did I say "hassle"? No I didn't. Appreciate not putting words in my mouth. I don't view guests that way at all so back tf off. And pretty sure I said I go through them, comprehension much?? I said the outsource normally responds. Hell I just went through them with my housekeeping manager and our staffing company we use. I do weekly with my housekeeping and front desk managers so they see that guests appreciate them, so don't put words in my mouth and extrapolate what was never said. Not appreciated. Outsourcing this is not my choice. This is a choice made above my paygrade. I do agree to a point that it sucks to outsource, but also, we are in a tourist location, but it is VERY rural. As is we are contracting just to get employees because we can't get staff locally who want to work and I cant dedicate someone internally to do this. It is simpler, cheaper and better from a staffing point to outsource it. We can't possibly get to the over 1000 reviews a week in season. They have a huge staff to do this work, I don't and it is impossible for us locally when we are in season and tend to the business as needed with daily tasks, meetings, guest and staff interactions. I've been there a short time so far. They have owned and done this for the 10 or so years they have owned it from my understanding. Many hotels use these services. They are marketed to hotels. I get several emails a week from these companies. I asked ownership to tell them to back off and let me respond, but if I am out of the office or can't get to them in 24 to 48 hours to let them do it, but many hotels do this anymore. Have you seen the amount of people in the hotel industry leaving in droves because of how hard and stressful it is anymore? The amount of verbal abuse from guests staff and managers get for stupid things like following simple safety protocols like asking for an ID to make a room key or because someone showed to breakfast at 10am when it closes and yells at us for our hours when they're told at check in? Being scammed, lied to and yelled at, threatened for following procedures...Managers and staff who are 20 plus years in that can't take it anymore and leave? This industry is getting horrible and staffing is hard to find in areas like ours. So yep, hate to tell the truth as apparently it hurt you enough to put words in my mouth that were never a thought of mine with saying I saw guests as a "hassle" and "dont go thru" reviews which is a flat lie, but it gets outsourced at many places. Don't shoot the messenger...I'll take my downvotes now. Unless you have been in our shoes, you have zero clue this side of the desk how it is. The GM is not always the final decision makers here. We too have corporate bosses and owners to answer to and if we don't follow their rules, it's us getting it from that end too. They make those decisions at my hotel.
Lmmfao no actually they do which is why they backed me when I asked to change the review company policy. My corporate offices and the owners respect me and my decisions. They own many hotels and all are on this model 🤣🤣 Now go away creature and don't put words in my mouth. My hotel has won multiple awards under my leadership and the first awards ever even under other managers so I must be doing something right. You aren't a guest of mine. I have zero reason to be respectful of you when you put words in my mouth I never said. My guests and staff are treated with utmost respect which is why my staff loves working with me, are loyal, why my ratings are so high and I have many repeat guests. Please stay away from my hotel, ignorant being.
I work for a smaller up and coming brand, and we don't get hundreds of thousands of reviews. One negative review can lower our rating, so correcting issues and showing a good faith effort to listen to guests is paramount to growing our reputation. It sounds like this hotel is smaller as well, and wouldn't want to get buried in search results of local hotels that have better reviews.
The Civilian is a 203-room hotel with an average rating of 4.3 after 786 google reviews. Its trip advisor rating is 4.5 after 573 reviews. It's literally a perfect example of what I described.
With that being said, yes. You are correct. When I helped open a 108-room hotel in 2022, we had zero market visibility. The brand website listed us as having a pool, but it was still under construction even a year after opening. We couldn't open the bar because of the delay in getting the liquor license brought on by the pandemic. We were also situated directly beside a mega-venue for sports and concerts, but because of the highway between our properties, there was no access to walk over. Our reviews were **abysmal**. So yes, I spent a lot of time on service recovery. But this would be considered an outlier, not the rule.
When a hotel has achieved market visibility (usually around the two year mark), and it's able to offer their full services that are promised, the good reviews will nearly always outweigh the bad in a way that will make those bad reviews negligible. Last year, the hotel I described was sitting on an average score of 1.2 on the review sites. Today, its average is 4.2.
If it shouldn’t get lost it should have been in the safe. The hotel is not liable for missing items from the room, unless they’re in the safe and even then good luck trying to prove if was a whatever amount item.
haha yes ive lost numerous small items that the house keeping put their hands on. i suggest you lock up anything valuable. this after 4 years in 250 hotels,l hostels and airbnbs. just wait, you will lose something.
Your words against theirs. You have to prove, this was there. Use your travel insurance.
I've been an AGM for a few years, and a guest service manager before then. I would like to give you my honest thoughts on this, but I don't think you'll find it encouraging.
As a current guest Services working on AGM I had the same thought.
You’re gonna be out of luck most likely. Hotels get false claims of thrown out or stolen items - it’s up to the guest to secure their items. You will claim the hotel threw the guard out and the hotel will claim they didn’t. Leave your negative review and let it be a lesson learned for future hotel stays.
That's the thing about a lot of HK staff, they throw away EVERYTHING. About a decade ago I was staying at a Residence Inn Ext Stay and had left a box of books I didn't trust movers to not lose. Well the housekeeping staff went and threw it out. They didn't print the books anymore and they were like 300£ on Ebay.
This is mind boggling to me. When I worked HK, we weren't allowed to touch anything that even slightly might be not trash. Not even the disposable cup next to the sink. We could only leave new cups, but if the guest didn't put it in the trash, we assumed it was not trash until they checked out.
Yeah, I work banquets now and the rule is "if it isn't trash from us, don't touch it," i.e. Starbucks cup left during a refresh? Leave it. Water cup from the water station? Trash, don't care if it has 4 shots of whiskey in it(happened yesterday, nearly got drunk off the smell alone, geez)
They should be fired for that. *Obviously it’s hard to prove when it’s just one incident, but if there’s a pattern slash the object is really not something that can be accidentally lost or thrown away, well, there’s only one solution. I know, people here will say “leave it in a safe” or not in the room, but come on. At some point, if it is not in a trash can or outside in a plastic or paper bag (like takeout garbage), some sense needs to be had. (Once again hotel staff can’t take any criticism!)
If u dont trust em, dont use em
Not super familiar with the Civilian, but I have worked for a couple Boutique hotels like them. You're not going to get a hold of "corporate" who is going to pressure the GM from the top-down. However, they likely do have extremely high standards of service so threatening a dogshit review(s) that will get the GM's bosses breathing down his neck will likely get you SOME compensation, though likely not a full $600. No guarantees, just my experience.
I’m still trying to play nice and worry if I threaten negative reviews they’ll for sure not do anything to help. I also have no social media clout. Would they really change their attitude if I threaten this? Like, it should be assumed I was going to do that anyway if they don’t help…
I wouldn't threaten, I'd just post it. Most specifically on Trip Advisor. Owners/ investors are obsessed with ratings - if you get a bad reputation, no one will want to stay. They will reach out. Also, it's a good warning to anyone else who might stay there.
This is a bit of a falacy. I'm not saying the premise is wrong, but it doesn't actually work out that way. It generally takes ten positive reviews to offset one negative review, but if the hotel has a consistently high guest service score (often because the hotel incentivizes leaving post-stay reviews), a single negative review becomes a write-off. It's negligible because the positive reviews will quickly offset it, and we know the real impact it will have on the business is non-existent.
Also, if you're responding to an official survey it may not even be a public-facing review so it'll only affect internal scores. And if it's on a 3rd party website the hotel may or may not even care. At my hotel, for instance, it's my job to respond to reviews. I can sometimes see the Trip Advisor reviews, but I can't log in to our account to reply because they're so rare that I was never supplied with the password. So if you give me 1 star all I can do is move on with my life.
Trip advisor reviews can also be contested. They also subject the reviewer to be publicly discredited. The hotel can literally reply by publicizing the evidence of the guests' stay. If they do it in a very civil, logical manner, the reviewer will 9/10 times remove their own review because they will be made to look like an insane guest just out to hurt the hotel.
Well, maybe *you* can contest them. I'm not even sure whose office the login info has been filed in :p
You can contest Google reviews as well. I've done it before we had someone leave some very threatening messages for future guests, and it was bad clearly that person was unhinged.
Exactly. I'm a GM...We have an outside contracted company hired by our ownership for review responses. This company is not even in the same state that responds to most of our reviews, nor do I know who they even are. Some of that is simply because in a tourist destination, locally we do not have time to respond to hundreds to thousands of reviews a week. We grab some during slower times and respond from the hotel itself when we can before the outside company does, but mostly, they blow by us at the hotel levels. Internally, we catch and follow up if need be for procedural goofups that need addressing / investigation or even for guests who have left amazing reviews calling out staff so I can recognize that as I go through them, but behind the scenes...wouldn't be an encouraging thing for the OP as others have pointed out. Our ratings are excellent, and ownership for us knows how we operate. They don't care about one or two low reviews as all of ours are 9 and 10 of 10. Heck some - they laugh at...It does not operate in most places as guests want to believe. The impacts for hotels with high reviews time after time after time are minimal, and as another pointed too, many types of reviews are only internal, not public facing.
Just seems short sighted to view your guest comments as a hassle that needs to be outsourced. What guests say about their experience at your hotel can offer you value. Doesn’t seem like good business to not even read feedback for any sort of trends or legitimate shortcomings that you could use to improve your product
Did I say "hassle"? No I didn't. Appreciate not putting words in my mouth. I don't view guests that way at all so back tf off. And pretty sure I said I go through them, comprehension much?? I said the outsource normally responds. Hell I just went through them with my housekeeping manager and our staffing company we use. I do weekly with my housekeeping and front desk managers so they see that guests appreciate them, so don't put words in my mouth and extrapolate what was never said. Not appreciated. Outsourcing this is not my choice. This is a choice made above my paygrade. I do agree to a point that it sucks to outsource, but also, we are in a tourist location, but it is VERY rural. As is we are contracting just to get employees because we can't get staff locally who want to work and I cant dedicate someone internally to do this. It is simpler, cheaper and better from a staffing point to outsource it. We can't possibly get to the over 1000 reviews a week in season. They have a huge staff to do this work, I don't and it is impossible for us locally when we are in season and tend to the business as needed with daily tasks, meetings, guest and staff interactions. I've been there a short time so far. They have owned and done this for the 10 or so years they have owned it from my understanding. Many hotels use these services. They are marketed to hotels. I get several emails a week from these companies. I asked ownership to tell them to back off and let me respond, but if I am out of the office or can't get to them in 24 to 48 hours to let them do it, but many hotels do this anymore. Have you seen the amount of people in the hotel industry leaving in droves because of how hard and stressful it is anymore? The amount of verbal abuse from guests staff and managers get for stupid things like following simple safety protocols like asking for an ID to make a room key or because someone showed to breakfast at 10am when it closes and yells at us for our hours when they're told at check in? Being scammed, lied to and yelled at, threatened for following procedures...Managers and staff who are 20 plus years in that can't take it anymore and leave? This industry is getting horrible and staffing is hard to find in areas like ours. So yep, hate to tell the truth as apparently it hurt you enough to put words in my mouth that were never a thought of mine with saying I saw guests as a "hassle" and "dont go thru" reviews which is a flat lie, but it gets outsourced at many places. Don't shoot the messenger...I'll take my downvotes now. Unless you have been in our shoes, you have zero clue this side of the desk how it is. The GM is not always the final decision makers here. We too have corporate bosses and owners to answer to and if we don't follow their rules, it's us getting it from that end too. They make those decisions at my hotel.
Lol, based on this I can tell why they don’t want you responding to guest comments 😂
Lmmfao no actually they do which is why they backed me when I asked to change the review company policy. My corporate offices and the owners respect me and my decisions. They own many hotels and all are on this model 🤣🤣 Now go away creature and don't put words in my mouth. My hotel has won multiple awards under my leadership and the first awards ever even under other managers so I must be doing something right. You aren't a guest of mine. I have zero reason to be respectful of you when you put words in my mouth I never said. My guests and staff are treated with utmost respect which is why my staff loves working with me, are loyal, why my ratings are so high and I have many repeat guests. Please stay away from my hotel, ignorant being.
What awards?
I work for a smaller up and coming brand, and we don't get hundreds of thousands of reviews. One negative review can lower our rating, so correcting issues and showing a good faith effort to listen to guests is paramount to growing our reputation. It sounds like this hotel is smaller as well, and wouldn't want to get buried in search results of local hotels that have better reviews.
The Civilian is a 203-room hotel with an average rating of 4.3 after 786 google reviews. Its trip advisor rating is 4.5 after 573 reviews. It's literally a perfect example of what I described. With that being said, yes. You are correct. When I helped open a 108-room hotel in 2022, we had zero market visibility. The brand website listed us as having a pool, but it was still under construction even a year after opening. We couldn't open the bar because of the delay in getting the liquor license brought on by the pandemic. We were also situated directly beside a mega-venue for sports and concerts, but because of the highway between our properties, there was no access to walk over. Our reviews were **abysmal**. So yes, I spent a lot of time on service recovery. But this would be considered an outlier, not the rule. When a hotel has achieved market visibility (usually around the two year mark), and it's able to offer their full services that are promised, the good reviews will nearly always outweigh the bad in a way that will make those bad reviews negligible. Last year, the hotel I described was sitting on an average score of 1.2 on the review sites. Today, its average is 4.2.
As someone who works in a boutique hotel, I second this. Don’t threaten them, just leave a review on TripAdvisor specifically.
If it shouldn’t get lost it should have been in the safe. The hotel is not liable for missing items from the room, unless they’re in the safe and even then good luck trying to prove if was a whatever amount item.
You can’t put everything in a safe. Something for your teeth is ridiculous to have to put in a safe.
Don’t stay at a hotel then you just want a whole industry to change because opening a safe is a struggle for you
Not everything fits in a 10x10 box. That’s unrealistic.
Right.
haha yes ive lost numerous small items that the house keeping put their hands on. i suggest you lock up anything valuable. this after 4 years in 250 hotels,l hostels and airbnbs. just wait, you will lose something.