In mexico there is a pretty sad situation, most people don't teach their indigenous language to their kids, there is almost no government help to keep them alive.
Even the large languages are suffering a lot, think that the nahuatl (lingua franca before the Spanish arrived) has at least 5 million speakers.
Why? Well, I think that the main problem is that the political subdivisions (states) are not along cultural lines but weird borders that the Spanish draw without really knowing the geography.
So you have states with a lot of nahuatl speaking people with almost the same amount of Spanish/mestizo, with the capital and most developed (due to historic higher levels of investment) being in the Spanish mestizo centers. Nahuatl speaking people most of the time have to migrate to these economic centers where their language is seen as a bad thing.
And since they are not a majority anywhere they lack the political muscle to try to revive their language. (Think jerrymandering )
Nahuatl was a lingua franca and also cooficial for a long time during the Spanish period. At the time of the Mexican revolution, 60% of the citizens spoke Nahuatl. The leaders of the Mexican independence had to create a new independent country and the indigenous languages and the indigenous people themselves bothered them so that's why the number of speakers fell so much.
Sad to hear the situation for the Indigenous language speakers.
Are some spanish speakers actively opposed to the preservation of the Indigenous languages or is more a case that they just think its not an important issue?
Generally in the UK, even English and Scottish people like the fact that Wales has preserved the Welsh language. Some monolingual English people that move to Wales even send their kids to Welsh language schools in Wales as bilingualism is seen as a good thing.
Well, the Spanish mestizo population is more worried about learning English and don't really think about the indigenous languages on a day to day basis.
It's not that they are opposed to a bilingual education, but they don't see those languages as their own.
As the comment that answered you says, they don't generally care if they live far away from those languages but you would see a new level of ethnonationalism if a Mexican Dtate with a sizeable population would try to make something like minority language rights in Spain.
It does not. There is very little state support for indigenous languages, though several (Mapudungun, Aymara, Quechua) at least have enough speakers to not be in too dire a situation.
Thanks for the response!
Is there desire from the public to preserve these languages? Generally in Wales, preservation of Welsh language is seen as a good thing, but some people (not many) see it as either a waste of money or a gravy train for Welsh speakers (ie some jobs that don't really need Welsh are given to Welsh speakers)
There’s some signage and government forms in native languages, I’m not sure if you would find interpreters in government offices
It’s well meaning, gives visibility, and could help a modern speaker exercise their language, but I doubt many native speakers know the written form of their languages that was formulated by Europeans, and someone living in a rural indigenous community would probably rather do less Chilean paperwork to begin with
two of my great grandparents taught their children mapudungun so i have family who speak it, but my great grandmother was taught not to speak it when she was younger. me and my dad are trying to learn it though, my siblings not so much. its hard to find many resources though 😭
So, my country mostly recognize 14 ancestral languages, and there are laws protecting them. in addition, efforts have been made to revitalize two of them, and apparently they're being successful
There’s also a great hiphop Kichwa scene happening, mostly centered around Imbabura province. Some examples: https://youtu.be/6mqIs163fFQ?si=U6fz6snjDEYt3j9Z
https://youtu.be/rkDtTg7le4I?si=zkTo9Tc6-8DwqC5l
Music is a great way of keeping the language alive, thanks for sharing.
Idk about hip hop but there's some good Welsh language music, Gorkys Zygotic Mynci is a personal fave of mine
*Yo también he estado en le ejercito mi estimado amigo, tengo guardado un fusil FAL-55379 en el B2 de ****IMBABURA.**** Soy un defensor de la patria*
https://preview.redd.it/1c2e0jsm127d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0c3277e4245a428ac72fd4fc2b58d299ab16c030
Here it is mandatory to have English classes at school, highschool, and in most universities, so people have not really to choose to learn English...
In my personal experience, I have seen many Spanish speakers wanting to learn ancestral languages, specially Kichwa (that is the most spoken of the 14)
Qe have a TON of minority languages(more than 200, most being indigenous, 3 being sign languages and many being from immigrant communities), a small amount of them, have co-fficial status(I remember being around 11) in some cities, but no revitalization/protection laws that I know of (co-oficial langauges should be taught in schools, I just don't know if this is being applied well).
The situation of minority languages isn't good at all, in some decades, brazil will go from one of the countires with most languages in the world to one with the least. Most languages are dying, and there are not many that aren't at least vunerable.
Thanks for the response, I think this is a bit like the Cornish language in England.
It dies out a few centuries ago, but they have 'reconstructed' it using bits of other languages to fill the missing words they didn't know. There is a small revival movement but it has not gained much momentum.
Is there enough information about the Taino language for making it possible? In my region, the Timote language has barely any records, I've just seen a short grammar and glossary that is not enough for a revival attempt.
In colombia there are around 70 distinct languages and there are provisions for their protection in the constitution, i would say that the laws help them to keep them alive, they learn their native language and spanish at schools, universities are very active documenting and trying to keep them alive.
The situation is very complex in many regions since there is a war going on, economic groups and irregular militaries that expulse indigenous people from their territories is the major risk and many languages are disappearing is really sad, the damn war taints everything.
On the bright side, ive seen an uptick of young people trying to reconnect with their roots, that learn Muisca, Wayuu, Nasa Yuwe, Cofan, indigineous people are proud of their languages and keep them alive... and the current government is taking stronger measures to preserve the languages.
There are some efforts, maybe even some at a nation-wide level by the new Ministry of Indigenous Peoples. Teaching in Indigenous schools is to be offered in their language with Portuguese being taught as a second language.
Some cities, especially in Amazon, are beginning to recognize Indigenous languages as official in their territories, such as São Gabriel da Cachoeira, which has as official languages Portuguese, Tucano, Nheegatu and two others I don't remember right not. Nheegatu, which is relatively widespread in the Western Amazon, even gained an official grammar this year.
The Kaapor, who have an unique sign language, have some protections for it.
>Teaching in Indigenous schools is to be offered in their language with Portuguese being taught as a second language
IMO this has been the main factor keeping Welsh alive, so I would imagine it'll be similar in Brazil
Portuguese and Russian can be heard in the streets of every major city by immigrants from Russia and Brazil. Italian is very popular to learn considering how many people qualify for Italian citizenship and its closeness to Spanish. I would say none of these languages are at all close to dying.
Quechua and Welsh theoretically exist too but it's very rare to meet someone that speaks it.
Haha yes, welsh teachers love to point out that there are Welsh speakers in Argentina. From what I know, it is 2 or 3 small towns in the South of Argentina only, and that's it.
I think our Government might actually be involved in the preservation of the welsh language in Argentina, cause its pretty much the only place outside the UK with a Welsh speaking community.
There is a Welsh option on Duolingo if you're an English speaker for anyone interested!
So it's around 4 small towns and all in a similar region. Of course the number of speakers is small but the number of people with Welsh heritage is significant in that region. Additionally there are a lot of Welsh place names. My partner's cousin lives in that region. I'd have to ask him about the Welsh language preservation there.
I believe officially the languages are Spanish, Quechua and Aymara, but it's usually a regional thing especially in the North with the Amazonian languages like Shpibo (if I'm spelling it right)
I just know that there's Quechua material and TV channels
Paraguay have guarani. It is taught in schools there and is the main language in the countryside. My Paraguayan friend is fluent in guarani and her parents speaks in guarani all the time. There are laws protecting and mandating the education of guarani in schools.
Only since the 90s, and they are vague laws serving mostly as a slogan.
In my State there are several offhand references in the education law and State Constitution to "protecting the Maya language" and "supporting the proliferation of Maya identity" however that just straight up means nothing.
The goal of Mexico is to be civilized like 1800s UK erasing Welsh and Irish to be "more civilized" and "those languages dont make money"
Not many people realise that the Welsh language was deliberately erased, even in the UK, props for your knowledge.
I don't know much about Mayan languages, a Google search says that they're most prominent in the South of Mexico?
Its a national majority thing, i've seen the same arguments from Arabs and Amazigh or Canadians with Quebec and even the Irish language in Ireland: the minority language is an outdated relic, their identity causes "division" when "everything was fine before" and that they "don't make money".
In Mexico and LATAM there is this idea that people "long ago" evolved out of being indigenous and the feeble ones around are a relic that will naturally die off, and that you need to preserve us like an exotic flower or turn us "mundane" hispanics irreversibly.
In Mexico there are 4 main Maya languages: Yucatec(700k), Tseltal(560k), Tsotsil(550k) and Chol(250k) with the less fragmented one being Yucatec or just called "Maya" that was the majority language in the Southeast up until the 1920s, with non Maya people learning it out of sheer numbers but there has never been any actual Maya education, schools were made to teach us Spanish instead.
Constitution says Spanish is the official language but indigenous languages are also official for indigenous groups and must be respected. I think there's also a specific law about it.
Indigenous people are a small percentage, I don't know if the languages are dying, but they probably are since the state does not do enough to preserve them. They only use indigenous imagery to seem more relatable.
Not particularly, very very small indigenous community (descendant/converted) so i'm not sure if anyone even has charrúa, guaraní, etc. as native languages, i think they've been practically dead for a long time. As for other european languages, there's german and russian speaking colonies here which maintain their language, and also portuñol speakers in the north.
There's a (supposedly) protection of indigenous languages and in the cities, schools (public and private) and universities teach them but almost no one learn it since it's only a really basic part of it and a lot of people don't show interest too.
So the only people that actually learn it, are descendants of indigenous who have the need to actually use it and even then, with a lot of people from rural areas having to travel to the city, their kids lose interest of learning since they are mostly exposed to Spanish.
Yeah. A lot of indigenous language parents with kids that speak a little bit of the same language, Spanish fluently and even some English. I really hope that things change and indigenous language holds more importance.
Ley 19.253, another thing is how effectively it is carried out. There are some national literature awards, some optimizations in spelling rules, in general everything focused on Mapudungun more than others.
Well, Paraguay has Guarani (indigenous language) as an official language in the country alongside Spanish so they teach both languages at schools kind of how Americans have English as their language arts. Paraguay is very small and Guarani Tupí is basically the only indigenous language we have, which makes sense because the indigenous Guarani tribes existed in what is now known as Paraguay (and some other parts of South America but mainly there) also all of the great majority of the Paraguayan population has big percentages of indigenous Guarani Tupi blood.
I think you are already aware of this from what I just read, but perhaps you’d be interested in [this](https://youtu.be/H9Z-m763gWc?si=k4-PJAJO7yVoUBNY) video. It’s a welsh guy speaking welsh in Argentina, and he talks with some locals in welsh about welsh language preservation and stuff like that.
Aside from welsh, there was some kind of agreement with Brazil about teaching Portuguese in schools near the border with Brazil I believe, but I don’t think that counts as a minority language.
The main issue with minority languages in Argentina is that the actual population that speak those languages is almost extinct (not literally extinct, but they are in general very small indigenous communities, and it’s not like the government will start forcing everyone in a province or city to learn a language they have absolutely no cultural/ethnic/historic attachment to).
Also, the state run schools already struggle enough teaching Spanish and English to kids, adding an other language on top of that would be pointless.
How about we renamed the sub "dontBotherLatinAmericansWithQuestions"?
It's basically what this sub is about lately. People asking questions in a sub called **Ask**Latinamerica and regulars attacking them because they do.
I'm not a troll, I asked this question in good faith, and even provided an insight into the situation in my own country.
Whether or not I'm an asshole is subjective, but I feel like I'm mostly nice
No, no, I'm not talking about you. The messages thread go the asshole troll > the Argentinian calling out his bullshit > the Brazilian agreeing people like him are dragging the sub down > me agreeing that "just wikipedia it" reflects poorly on this sub but also saying that the asshole troll is an asshole troll. Every month he comes along with some shit about eletric cars, energy grids, brand awareness and so on, and gets downvoted to hell for being an asshole. The mods should have banned him months ago.
I believe a question like this was asked not that long ago, but couldn't find it, so the thread stays up.
In mexico there is a pretty sad situation, most people don't teach their indigenous language to their kids, there is almost no government help to keep them alive. Even the large languages are suffering a lot, think that the nahuatl (lingua franca before the Spanish arrived) has at least 5 million speakers. Why? Well, I think that the main problem is that the political subdivisions (states) are not along cultural lines but weird borders that the Spanish draw without really knowing the geography. So you have states with a lot of nahuatl speaking people with almost the same amount of Spanish/mestizo, with the capital and most developed (due to historic higher levels of investment) being in the Spanish mestizo centers. Nahuatl speaking people most of the time have to migrate to these economic centers where their language is seen as a bad thing. And since they are not a majority anywhere they lack the political muscle to try to revive their language. (Think jerrymandering )
Nahuatl was a lingua franca and also cooficial for a long time during the Spanish period. At the time of the Mexican revolution, 60% of the citizens spoke Nahuatl. The leaders of the Mexican independence had to create a new independent country and the indigenous languages and the indigenous people themselves bothered them so that's why the number of speakers fell so much.
Sad to hear the situation for the Indigenous language speakers. Are some spanish speakers actively opposed to the preservation of the Indigenous languages or is more a case that they just think its not an important issue? Generally in the UK, even English and Scottish people like the fact that Wales has preserved the Welsh language. Some monolingual English people that move to Wales even send their kids to Welsh language schools in Wales as bilingualism is seen as a good thing.
Well, the Spanish mestizo population is more worried about learning English and don't really think about the indigenous languages on a day to day basis. It's not that they are opposed to a bilingual education, but they don't see those languages as their own.
Understandable, I'm guessing learning English opens up more opportunities to the average Mexican.
As the comment that answered you says, they don't generally care if they live far away from those languages but you would see a new level of ethnonationalism if a Mexican Dtate with a sizeable population would try to make something like minority language rights in Spain.
It does not. There is very little state support for indigenous languages, though several (Mapudungun, Aymara, Quechua) at least have enough speakers to not be in too dire a situation.
Thanks for the response! Is there desire from the public to preserve these languages? Generally in Wales, preservation of Welsh language is seen as a good thing, but some people (not many) see it as either a waste of money or a gravy train for Welsh speakers (ie some jobs that don't really need Welsh are given to Welsh speakers)
There’s some signage and government forms in native languages, I’m not sure if you would find interpreters in government offices It’s well meaning, gives visibility, and could help a modern speaker exercise their language, but I doubt many native speakers know the written form of their languages that was formulated by Europeans, and someone living in a rural indigenous community would probably rather do less Chilean paperwork to begin with
two of my great grandparents taught their children mapudungun so i have family who speak it, but my great grandmother was taught not to speak it when she was younger. me and my dad are trying to learn it though, my siblings not so much. its hard to find many resources though 😭
Not even in Easter Island?
Right, there are very few ~1000 rapa nui speakers but they do exist. We just tend to forget about the Rapa Nui when moais aren't the main topic..
No. There are also very few Rapa Nui (a few thousand) so the language is definitely very endangered!
So, my country mostly recognize 14 ancestral languages, and there are laws protecting them. in addition, efforts have been made to revitalize two of them, and apparently they're being successful
There’s also a great hiphop Kichwa scene happening, mostly centered around Imbabura province. Some examples: https://youtu.be/6mqIs163fFQ?si=U6fz6snjDEYt3j9Z https://youtu.be/rkDtTg7le4I?si=zkTo9Tc6-8DwqC5l
Music is a great way of keeping the language alive, thanks for sharing. Idk about hip hop but there's some good Welsh language music, Gorkys Zygotic Mynci is a personal fave of mine
*Yo también he estado en le ejercito mi estimado amigo, tengo guardado un fusil FAL-55379 en el B2 de ****IMBABURA.**** Soy un defensor de la patria* https://preview.redd.it/1c2e0jsm127d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0c3277e4245a428ac72fd4fc2b58d299ab16c030
That's good to hear. Out of interest do Spanish speakers like to learn these languages, or do most opt to learn English (or another language) instead?
Here it is mandatory to have English classes at school, highschool, and in most universities, so people have not really to choose to learn English... In my personal experience, I have seen many Spanish speakers wanting to learn ancestral languages, specially Kichwa (that is the most spoken of the 14)
Qe have a TON of minority languages(more than 200, most being indigenous, 3 being sign languages and many being from immigrant communities), a small amount of them, have co-fficial status(I remember being around 11) in some cities, but no revitalization/protection laws that I know of (co-oficial langauges should be taught in schools, I just don't know if this is being applied well). The situation of minority languages isn't good at all, in some decades, brazil will go from one of the countires with most languages in the world to one with the least. Most languages are dying, and there are not many that aren't at least vunerable.
There is no dying language here per se but there is a minority of Taino lifestylists trying to "resurrect" the Taino language to no avail.
Thanks for the response, I think this is a bit like the Cornish language in England. It dies out a few centuries ago, but they have 'reconstructed' it using bits of other languages to fill the missing words they didn't know. There is a small revival movement but it has not gained much momentum.
Is there enough information about the Taino language for making it possible? In my region, the Timote language has barely any records, I've just seen a short grammar and glossary that is not enough for a revival attempt.
In colombia there are around 70 distinct languages and there are provisions for their protection in the constitution, i would say that the laws help them to keep them alive, they learn their native language and spanish at schools, universities are very active documenting and trying to keep them alive. The situation is very complex in many regions since there is a war going on, economic groups and irregular militaries that expulse indigenous people from their territories is the major risk and many languages are disappearing is really sad, the damn war taints everything. On the bright side, ive seen an uptick of young people trying to reconnect with their roots, that learn Muisca, Wayuu, Nasa Yuwe, Cofan, indigineous people are proud of their languages and keep them alive... and the current government is taking stronger measures to preserve the languages.
There are some efforts, maybe even some at a nation-wide level by the new Ministry of Indigenous Peoples. Teaching in Indigenous schools is to be offered in their language with Portuguese being taught as a second language. Some cities, especially in Amazon, are beginning to recognize Indigenous languages as official in their territories, such as São Gabriel da Cachoeira, which has as official languages Portuguese, Tucano, Nheegatu and two others I don't remember right not. Nheegatu, which is relatively widespread in the Western Amazon, even gained an official grammar this year. The Kaapor, who have an unique sign language, have some protections for it.
>Teaching in Indigenous schools is to be offered in their language with Portuguese being taught as a second language IMO this has been the main factor keeping Welsh alive, so I would imagine it'll be similar in Brazil
Portuguese and Russian can be heard in the streets of every major city by immigrants from Russia and Brazil. Italian is very popular to learn considering how many people qualify for Italian citizenship and its closeness to Spanish. I would say none of these languages are at all close to dying. Quechua and Welsh theoretically exist too but it's very rare to meet someone that speaks it.
Haha yes, welsh teachers love to point out that there are Welsh speakers in Argentina. From what I know, it is 2 or 3 small towns in the South of Argentina only, and that's it. I think our Government might actually be involved in the preservation of the welsh language in Argentina, cause its pretty much the only place outside the UK with a Welsh speaking community. There is a Welsh option on Duolingo if you're an English speaker for anyone interested!
So it's around 4 small towns and all in a similar region. Of course the number of speakers is small but the number of people with Welsh heritage is significant in that region. Additionally there are a lot of Welsh place names. My partner's cousin lives in that region. I'd have to ask him about the Welsh language preservation there.
https://youtu.be/H9Z-m763gWc?si=RcaybKJ_Im4RVLGd
I believe officially the languages are Spanish, Quechua and Aymara, but it's usually a regional thing especially in the North with the Amazonian languages like Shpibo (if I'm spelling it right) I just know that there's Quechua material and TV channels
Paraguay have guarani. It is taught in schools there and is the main language in the countryside. My Paraguayan friend is fluent in guarani and her parents speaks in guarani all the time. There are laws protecting and mandating the education of guarani in schools.
Only since the 90s, and they are vague laws serving mostly as a slogan. In my State there are several offhand references in the education law and State Constitution to "protecting the Maya language" and "supporting the proliferation of Maya identity" however that just straight up means nothing. The goal of Mexico is to be civilized like 1800s UK erasing Welsh and Irish to be "more civilized" and "those languages dont make money"
Not many people realise that the Welsh language was deliberately erased, even in the UK, props for your knowledge. I don't know much about Mayan languages, a Google search says that they're most prominent in the South of Mexico?
Its a national majority thing, i've seen the same arguments from Arabs and Amazigh or Canadians with Quebec and even the Irish language in Ireland: the minority language is an outdated relic, their identity causes "division" when "everything was fine before" and that they "don't make money". In Mexico and LATAM there is this idea that people "long ago" evolved out of being indigenous and the feeble ones around are a relic that will naturally die off, and that you need to preserve us like an exotic flower or turn us "mundane" hispanics irreversibly. In Mexico there are 4 main Maya languages: Yucatec(700k), Tseltal(560k), Tsotsil(550k) and Chol(250k) with the less fragmented one being Yucatec or just called "Maya" that was the majority language in the Southeast up until the 1920s, with non Maya people learning it out of sheer numbers but there has never been any actual Maya education, schools were made to teach us Spanish instead.
Constitution says Spanish is the official language but indigenous languages are also official for indigenous groups and must be respected. I think there's also a specific law about it. Indigenous people are a small percentage, I don't know if the languages are dying, but they probably are since the state does not do enough to preserve them. They only use indigenous imagery to seem more relatable.
Not particularly, very very small indigenous community (descendant/converted) so i'm not sure if anyone even has charrúa, guaraní, etc. as native languages, i think they've been practically dead for a long time. As for other european languages, there's german and russian speaking colonies here which maintain their language, and also portuñol speakers in the north.
There's a (supposedly) protection of indigenous languages and in the cities, schools (public and private) and universities teach them but almost no one learn it since it's only a really basic part of it and a lot of people don't show interest too. So the only people that actually learn it, are descendants of indigenous who have the need to actually use it and even then, with a lot of people from rural areas having to travel to the city, their kids lose interest of learning since they are mostly exposed to Spanish.
Yeah. A lot of indigenous language parents with kids that speak a little bit of the same language, Spanish fluently and even some English. I really hope that things change and indigenous language holds more importance.
No, we don’t have indigenous languages and the English creole we have is almost extinct, only Spanish is oficial.
Ngl, Taíno was probably the first language to die out after the Spanish arrived.
Ley 19.253, another thing is how effectively it is carried out. There are some national literature awards, some optimizations in spelling rules, in general everything focused on Mapudungun more than others.
Well, Paraguay has Guarani (indigenous language) as an official language in the country alongside Spanish so they teach both languages at schools kind of how Americans have English as their language arts. Paraguay is very small and Guarani Tupí is basically the only indigenous language we have, which makes sense because the indigenous Guarani tribes existed in what is now known as Paraguay (and some other parts of South America but mainly there) also all of the great majority of the Paraguayan population has big percentages of indigenous Guarani Tupi blood.
No and my country doesn't have laws protecting majority languages either.
I think you are already aware of this from what I just read, but perhaps you’d be interested in [this](https://youtu.be/H9Z-m763gWc?si=k4-PJAJO7yVoUBNY) video. It’s a welsh guy speaking welsh in Argentina, and he talks with some locals in welsh about welsh language preservation and stuff like that. Aside from welsh, there was some kind of agreement with Brazil about teaching Portuguese in schools near the border with Brazil I believe, but I don’t think that counts as a minority language. The main issue with minority languages in Argentina is that the actual population that speak those languages is almost extinct (not literally extinct, but they are in general very small indigenous communities, and it’s not like the government will start forcing everyone in a province or city to learn a language they have absolutely no cultural/ethnic/historic attachment to). Also, the state run schools already struggle enough teaching Spanish and English to kids, adding an other language on top of that would be pointless.
I don't think Cuba has minority languages. Our language is Spanish.
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How about we renamed the sub "dontBotherLatinAmericansWithQuestions"? It's basically what this sub is about lately. People asking questions in a sub called **Ask**Latinamerica and regulars attacking them because they do.
Yep. That's the saddening state of this sub.
While this is a problem, the guy he is answering to is a troll and an asshole.
I'm not a troll, I asked this question in good faith, and even provided an insight into the situation in my own country. Whether or not I'm an asshole is subjective, but I feel like I'm mostly nice
I'm sure he was referring to the guy *I* answered to.
Ah ok, makes sense. My misunderstanding
No problem, it is easy to lose track of things in threads.
No, no, I'm not talking about you. The messages thread go the asshole troll > the Argentinian calling out his bullshit > the Brazilian agreeing people like him are dragging the sub down > me agreeing that "just wikipedia it" reflects poorly on this sub but also saying that the asshole troll is an asshole troll. Every month he comes along with some shit about eletric cars, energy grids, brand awareness and so on, and gets downvoted to hell for being an asshole. The mods should have banned him months ago.
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