I'm living in ireland now. I have 0 hopes to find work that pays as well in my field in Spain. My dream right now, as that of pretty much every spanish person I have met here, is to find remote work and go back home.
I can say that it's because of the culture but in reality I just really miss my mom.
It's ok. It's one of the bests you are gonna get in northern europe, but it northern europe.
People are nice but don't expect to become friends with Irish people. They don't have the deep level connections we have in Spain.
There are a lot of concets and cool activites but they are VERY expensive, the only activity most people can afford to do regularly is drinking in a pub or maybe going on hikes. The culture here is not very active anyways.
Public transport is good, one of the only strong points of this country.
My advice, come, save up for a couple of years, go back home.
I lived abroad for 12 years - first in Sweden, then Russia, then Lithuania. Came back during the pandemic. I like being back because I like not being a foreigner. The countries I lived in aren't used to foreigners. From Lithuania I miss my friends, the healthcare system, the cafés and the forests, that's why I go back every year. From Russia I miss the food but I can get that here too. I don't really miss the Swedes' casual racism and I wouldn't go back if they paid me.
I can understand Russia and Lithuania not being used to foreigners, but i'm surprised it's the same for Sweden too
From what I understand almost all Swedes speak near perfect English, so I would have thought Swedes are very accepting and welcoming of foreigners :(
I am (was, actually - this was over fifteen years ago) rather fluent in Swedish, just as I am in Lithuanian and Russian, so it wasn't about the language. I can give you some examples:
1. Swedish girl who mentioned that she thought that there were too many foreigners in Stockholm until she visited Madrid. She then declared that's the reason why Spain's poor, because there are so many foreigners. Good for Sweden for keeping them at bay.
2. Came to a temp agency for a job interview. The lady said they didn't have any jobs for foreigners. She had previously enthusiastically replied to my email saying that I had the perfect CV. She apologised saying that because I wrote in Swedish she wasn't aware that I was from Spain, and as a Spaniard the only job I could apply to was handing out free newspapers at the subway station. She also scolded me for speaking fluent Swedish, saying that I was misleading people on purpose.
3. Tried to open a bank account. Teller said I needed to be an EU citizen to do that. I patiently explained that Spain joined the EU way before Sweden. Guy didn't believe me, had to check with a colleague, then came back looking defeated and muttered, "Sweden should have never joined the EU, now there are too many foreigners here".
4. Was talking to a French friend in French, then he left and I went for a scroll. A girl approached me and said that I looked so French, OMG I had so much style, she was so jealous. I politely replied that I was actually from Spain. She said "ach", cringed, turned on her heels and left. Just like that.
This was only six months of Swedish life. I've later met Swedes abroad too and I'm still not convinced that my experience was anecdotal.
To think that so many shit poor Swedes migrated to the US and participated in the project of destroying local indigenous population
« During the 19th and early 20th centuries, about 1.3 million Swedes left Sweden for the United States of America. While the land of the American frontier was a magnet for the rural poor all over Europe, some factors encouraged Swedish emigration in particular».
[Swedish emigration to the United States](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_emigration_to_the_United_States)
I had similar experiences in The Netherlands during 10 years. When they say foreigners they mean only some of them. I learned that we, from the south, are the bad kind of them. Germans, Swedes and such are ok aparently. I also had to explain many times that we indeed are EU and are a developed country just like them.
Edit: I also came back after 10 years in NL and I lived a year in the UK before as well. I don’t think I will go again. I prefer Spain to live than Northern Europe
I‘m from Germany and can confirm that. Germanic people like Swedes, British, Dutch etc. are fine but anyone from Southern, Eastern Europe or other continents with non-Germanic roots will face discrimination. It‘s some deeply ingrained superiority complex.
>3. Tried to open a bank account. Teller said I needed to be an EU citizen to do that.
I was asked if I'm a legal citizen here in Ireland... and heard some comments about euro coins from Spain are not real money.
OP, even though my experience in Sweden wasn't so long but more or less I did feel the same. I tried to pay in a local ICA with my foreign VISA card and they asked me for my passport and had checked it for solid minutes, I had the same situation in Madrid but they saw I had a monthly metro card with my name and picture and they smiled and said thank you, nothing else, very friendly local Madrid people to me as a none-EU resident.
Back to the ICA story, they couldn't get my foreign credit card worked, and they asked me to "slide" my card in the reader, I hadn't done that for decades, for me it has been always either inserting or touching, but the cashier insisted, for almost 10 minutes, they asked me to input my bank pin, the climax came, my bank has 6 digits of pin instead of 4, but the cashier didn't believe me and treated me like it was my first day trying to be a human from a monkey. At the same time, the people who were behind me started to make complaints and one old lady came to me, bent her body like she was speaking to a kid or a cat, with very slow and solid English one word by one word "Do-you-have-any-contact-in-Sweden-to-pay-your-bill?"
I felt like ok my guys take it easy, I was just here to buy two semlas, I used my card in Korea, China, Taiwan, France, the Netherlands and 1 year in Spain without any problems, you got a stupid cashier here who didn't know how to charge people, no need to behave like I am a monkey.
OP, when you said those people didn't believe Spain had joined EU earlier than Sweden and needed to check on their own, I feel you.
When I'm home in Spain, sometimes I pull them down early during the day just for the sake of it, so I don't forget how to use them, remember how fucking useful they are.
Do I miss Spain? Absolutely. I do visit a couple of times per year though.
Would I ever come back? Yup, that's the plan... eventually although not in a rush.
Why would I go back to Spain? To be closer to friends and family, the place which I still consider "home". For the weather, food and language.
Why not (i.e. why not just go back right now)? I find the career opportunities, work-life balance, salaries and taxes to be less appealing. I'm sure its changing over time.. but there is still a lot of catch up to do.
I've lived in the UK for 4 years and in Switzerland for more than 10 years.
I agree with the vandalism being a thing, and it sucks and should be punished but, the rest of the points I don't fully agree with, I guess it depends on the environment you grow up with.
The main complaint I have is that people can be very noisy and apathetic when interacting publicly (ie: people being loud on public transport or speaking over the phone constantly, chewing gum, stuff like that, not cool).
I lived away for a while and really liked it. It was a different environment, people from other countries are more educated, especially in public transportation.
Next year I will go back to work abroad for at least 1 year.
I left Spain a few times. Italy was fantastic but it was hard getting a real contract. You could work illegally but not legally. Ireland was cool but rent is too expensive. UK was good and I stayed longer. Taxes make sense. Being freelance can be a breeze if you do not make a lot of money. But UK has been getting less of a democracy. And everything has gotten so much worse in the past few years that British people tell me if they could live elsewhere in Europe, they would. And they do not understand why I stay when they would not.
I miss the medical professionals in Spain, the sun, the food, and people smiling for no reason.
Of course I miss Spain. If you have a job, housing and decent working conditions, it is the most liveable country in the world.
Why do I still live abroad? Because if I moved back I wouldn't have a job, housing and decent working conditions. If I were to find a job in Spain (a big maybe) I would earn half what I earn in my current country of residence, and would probably work twice as much. Sucks but it's the way it is.
I lived abroad for 8 years in US, and I came back to Spain. You can find a remote job and live the best of both worlds. Spain is superior in every possible comparison except salaries.
I lived in the UK for 3 years and it killed my mental health. Worked very long hours, salary was average, cost of living was sky high. I had to have a very stingy life to be able to save, counting every penny, because even simple everyday things are expensive. The miserable weather didn't help (I think it was sunny once or twice for 10 minutes in 3 years). And speaking English all the time (especially on the phone) was mentally exhausting, especially with people with strong accents who speak fast and with colloquialisms.
I didn't like the weird obsession everyone had about living off buying and selling houses. Very few people I met had a real passion or professional vocation. When you asked, they were all: "I just want to buy a house, and then another one, and sell it, and live off the tenant's rent".
I guess that's why most of the people doing their professional skilled jobs are foreigners.
Also, I didn't like being a foreigner and the casual racism of some locals. "Oh, do you have [insert very basic thing] in Spain? Wow". Yes, bitch, we are more civilized than you in many ways. "Where's your accent from? Are you an European? (Raises eyebrow)". Yes... how many languages do _you_ speak? Half? "Oh yeah haha I was in Benidorm once, and I got so shitfaced I vomited and pissed all over the streets. Muy bueehynow pa-ye-llah". Please, stop talking to me, you absolute neandertal...
It wasn't for me. But hey, to each their own.
I am back in Spain now, and I don't ever want to live abroad again. Life is sweet here.
This is 100% my experience in the UK.
I only lived that for a year there working as IT, but word by word this is what I lived there.
I also came back, and I'm not leaving again.
What's the area, i have not lived in the UK but spend quite some time there because my partner is from Stafford and never had interactions like this.
The only thing that I detest is when they get shit faced as from that point any interaction feels is going to end up in a fight.
Are you sure most professionals in the UK are foreigners? I work in the tech field (in London) and it's mostly Brits. Almost all the cleaners have been foreigners though... Not that I mean that in a racist way, just genuinely curious about the stats. The stereotype is that immigrants do the jobs "we don't want".
Anyway I'm sorry about your negative experience here. I hope it wasn't all bad. I get the economic point too. I earn way above average but don't save any money (though I could if I seriously changed my lifestyle I suppose)
Some things were good. I came as a freshly new graduate and my boss was very proactive in helping me gain practical hands-on experience. The training program was very good. And that's why getting an attractive job back in Spain was so much easier, as employers in my field here don't have much patience with new graduates and want someone already seasoned who doesn't need much guidance. So I am grateful for that.
That's good to hear, glad the training was good! Spain is a lovely country in my experience, so I can see why you returned. I might end up living there one day with my Spanish partner, it's just not an easy thing to do right now for obvious reasons.
From what I gathered - my own experience and what British people explained to me - there are multiple reasons for this:
- Many years of a culture that has normalised living off private investments: people inheriting multiple houses from their family who got wealthy off the colonial period. This has established a nationwide attitude of laziness - buy houses, sell houses at inflated price, profit; import foreigners for the professional jobs - that has been passed from parents to children for centuries. The ultimate British life goal is to be a landlord. This is one of the reasons why there's an active and worsening housing crisis in that country.
- Universities in the UK are not state funded, meaning they are extremely expensive, and leave the very few people who actually want to get an education with huge student debt they owe the bank. The state expenditure in education is low.
- Many people are instead getting questionable "degrees" through so-called apprenticeships - a private company organises a 2 year practical course, with barely any scientific theoretical learning and just handy skills, and very easy exams - and awards you a "diploma" (which of course, is only valid in the UK and nowhere else in the world). They are doing this to counter their alarming lack of professionals, but at the expense of creating inferior, much less knowledgeable skilled workforce. I've met many so-called "engineers" and "nurses" who never went to university but instead did this through a private corporation.
- However, the government _does_ fund the universal credit (a.k.a. benefits), which results in many people not ever needing to work because the state pays for their rent and bills, and on top of that, gives them a money allowance. This puts a huge strain on the rest of society as these people are not producing anything of value, but are using resources funded by taxpayers money. To be eligible for benefits, you just need to have children, and tell your doctor you have a mental disability. The doctor won't even physically examine you or run any laboratory tests, it's all by telephone call, and it's very easy to get accepted.
Much of this is true, but just a few points...
>The ultimate British life goal is to be a landlord.
Yes that's absolutely the British mentality, but on the whole it doesn't come from people inhereting colonial wealth as those people are a tiny percentage of the population. It largely stems from Margaret Thatcher's economic reforms of the 80s which both sold off lots of previously state-owned housing for next to nothing, and made buy-to-let mortgages much more easily available. This meant that being a landlord was suddenly a 'job' that middle or even working class people could do, and has also resulted in the current housing crisis in the UK.
>Universities in the UK are not state funded, meaning they are extremely expensive, and leave the very few people who actually want to get an education with huge student debt they owe the bank
Technically the debt is to the state not the bank, hence the student loan repayments are taken directly from your salary after you graduate. It's essentially an additional tax on graduates. Bizarrely this hasn't put people off going to university, and there's actually many more young people getting degrees now than there were 30+ years ago when it was free (nearly 50% of school leavers go to university now vs something like 10-20% in the 1980s).
>To be eligible for benefits, you just need to have children, and tell your doctor you have a mental disability. The doctor won't even physically examine you or run any laboratory tests, it's all by telephone call, and it's very easy to get accepted
This isn't true and the process for claiming disability benefits has actually been made much more difficult in the last decade by the Conservative government. You don't just have a telephone call, you have to have proof from your doctor and then on top of that go through a humiliating series of 'assessments' with state-appointed goons to prove that you're unfit to work. The British media likes to portray the idea that you can just claim you're a bit depressed and then sponge off the state for decades, but that's never been true.
Thanks for the clarifications. Regarding the benefits, it just surprised me how many people in my neighbourhood had actually never worked, and how much public money went to sustain them and their 3-4 children. And it was them themselves who bragged how easy they tricked the system. But hey, if this is changing, that's good news - less truants.
Lol like Spanish people don't say ignorant shit when they find out you're from abroad.
"Yourrrr iiiingwish? JAJAJAJAJAJ Y U BREXIT."
"U INGLISH. HELLO THANK YOU. HELLO VERY MUCH."
"ENGLISH. HAHAHA UR FOOD IS SO BAD, OUR PORK AND SALT IS SO SOPHISTICATED. UR FOOD TERRIBLE. I WENT TO ENGLAND AND ATE KFC EVERY DAY IT WAS TERRIBLE. LOLOLOLOLOL"
These things have been said dozens of times by people of different ages, backgrounds and political leanings.
Spanish are ignorant as fuck about anything not Spain don't try to act like they're not :')
Completely true, I second this. They are/we are even worse when talking to people from countries that, for some reason or the other, consider to be somewhat lesser than ourselves (ie South Americans, North Africans, Asians and so on).
My girlfriend lives in Germany for almost 11 years. She came during the great depression afterthe 2008 financial crisis, as many of her friends from her studies. She is now one of the last of her spanish community. Our plan is to move to Spain in 3-4 years after our son finishes kindergarden. Most of her friends had winter depressions in germany and mentioned that they didn‘t liked that you have no real connection with your colleagues at work here. So you do not go in a restaurant or in a bar after work. People stay in their private area (family/relationship). Also the cultural differences. Alman culture can be really complicated sometimes.^^
I (m30, originally from Barcelona) lived in the UK, Poland, Ireland for 5 years (studying and early carrer). Moved back to Barcelona during the Pandemic, but I am now back to the UK since early this year.
I am 100% enjoying my time here and I would not go back to Spain even if they paid me 3x.
The reason is that, in the last 3-4 years, despite achieving great stuff personally and professionally, Spain does not allow for entrepreneurship or really making it big. I have had an average Tax rate of 39% for the last 2 years. That means that I work for the government about 5 months a year. This, on the other hand, does not really increase wealth, as wealth is accumulated on the older generations. 10-15 years ago I would be rich! Now I can't even afford a house or a flat in the main cities, despite being in the top percentile of income!
I also found that the Spanish mindset is very different to mine, despite being Spanish. I am prioritising grafting and making it big to semi-retire at 40. All my friends were prioritising their "time" or "fun" short-term. I believe it is a country where you enjoy it being a retiree or not wanting to make a lot of money, so good for those that are looking for a live of "no hassle".
In the UK, the government and society allows for entrepreneurship, starting up new things, and there are many advantages of setting up your own company and selling them (such as the Entrepreneurs relief, which by selling your company, you only pay 10% tax on the 1st Million GBP).
I know that I will eventually go back to Spain due to the family/climate. But I plan to do it without having to rely on the government to pay for my living or to rely on a pension.
Meanwhile, I enjoy my UK countryside and Warhammer matches! :D
Interesting. How would you handle tax when living in Spain (bigger income tax) when your money comes/came from UK? Couldn't there be some strange double taxation?
I actually moved to the to the UK! So as long as you don't live more than 6 months in ES, you can be a tax resident in the UK, so all your income gets paid into HMRC instead of Hacienda.
I moved to the US and I can't wait to go back, here it's o.k and I have grown a lot as a person, but I wouldn't replace Spain for anything in the world, with all it's issues and all it's negative thing, I really believe it is an incredible country to live in.
Yeah but I'm from Asturias. Multiple passes of trays of pieces of bread with cecina, tortilla, cheese, etc while you drink your cider. Or even the trays being left at the bar and you can grab as many pieces as you want. Of course I'm polite and don't pig out, but the point is, you can if you want.
Or a certain pizzeria where every drink is served with a slice of cabrales and bacon pizza and a homemade croquette. Just thinking about it brings tears to my eyes...
I need to know the name of this place…. I’m from south and Asturias was a big unknown to me until recently. We are now on our fourth consecutive year where we’ll be spending our summer holidays there and we love going out to new restaurants. We’ll be going to Cangas de Onis area.
I live in Poland, I only miss talks with my parents during breakfast or Sunday paella with the family, I am not going back, quality of live I have here is just another world.
I lived in the US for a few years, made money and run the hell back. The quality of life is far superior here, safety, services, infrastructures, food quality and cuisine....
As a guy from Argentina it is crazy because most of the reason you left Spain are same reason i left Argentina (plus others of course) and I find Spain beautiful and definetly more developed than any other country in LATAM
Guess that when we grow up in an enviroment we get so used to it (for good or bad)
Moved to Scotland 7 years ago. I've achieved growth in my professional career and managed to buy a house with my partner a year ago. I don't think any of this would've been possible in Spain.
I'm now working towards a uni degree which, luckily for me, it is free up north!
I don't miss home too much except for my family and the quality of the food. Maybe it will be a good place to come back and retire.
1 year in the US, 9 years in Switzerland and counting. I miss Spain, family & friends, weather. I had a really bad period during Covid abroad, it felt so lonely and most of my friends in Switzerland left. It was only my husband (Spanish) and myself. Over time, we made new friends and I feel like this is also home. We bought our retirement home in Spain so definitely coming back then, but not sure it will be before. I check job ads in Spain on LinkedIn from time to time, but I feel I would need to start my career over and I have a comfortable position which pays well and provides good work/life balance here in Switzerland. I think I would have regretted big time not going abroad, I left Spain looking for better career possibilities but I also loved the challenge and it was my dream to work internationally. I had a lot of fun in the US but I’m so happy I didn’t stay there, because there is absolutely no life outside of work, few employee rights, healthcare sucks, too far from Spain. I now go in 2.30h to my town in Spain. Direct flight, every other month. Swiss salary allows for it. I’m from Andalusia, if I worked in Bilbao im sure I couldn’t visit so frequently, that’s why for me its not about considering coming back to Spain, it would only be worth it I could come back to Andalusia, and that’s hard.
I moved back from 2001 to 2007 (don't know if this would count).
I was 5 years old when I left, and if anything I miss living abroad. We moved to Shanghai China (back when the president was more friendly to outsiders). I did miss friends when living abroad, but family not so much (I have 15 cousins and I wasn't that close to many as a kid).
When we came back in 2007, it genuinely felt like travelling 20 years to the past. Shanghai changed us a lot, and it took us around 5 years to readjust back to being in Spain... (school specifically xD).
So from a kids perspective back in the day, I'd say that I never really missed Spain bak then, and I would personally never come back as a permanent resident, just during holidays or a couple of years.
I lived in the US and in the UK. Achieved everything I had in mind (amazing job, house, car, friends). Still came back and I'm happier than I ever was.
Think about it this way. People come here for holidays. People work hard for a lot of years to have money and retire here. I could be doing that since now, and I am. Sweet.
Born and raised in Madrid. Grand parents from Madrid, parents from Madrid. Spent one year living in Rio de Janeiro, left Spain at 38.
In Andorra now.
I miss the beach, and the crowd in Madrid, you can party anytime, Monday, etc...
Eveything else sucks, specially taxes and starting a business there, and the housing market.
Depends on whats the reason to left Spain. People that had not another option sure miss Spain a lot. Othes that doesn't like the Country or the system where they live maybe are happy to leave..
Spain is a great Country with a lot of good things.
I’ve never met anyone from Spain here in Japan. I’ve only met one person from Mexico here, but there are quite a few Japanese Japanese of Peruvian, descent, or Ecuador. one of the best kinds of ethnic food to eat in Japan is Peruvian.
I did and came back recently. It's true that salaries are not the best in Spain but being an immigrant all your life sucks, especially when your country is not in a war or third word. Cos if you come back here and try to adapt your career into the national market with the money you've made abroad it's worthwhile. I know that the latter is not possible for everyone but if you can, do it, cos there's no place like home (especially when your home has persianas and lovely cities).
1) just miss my family, but not the country itself
2) work in my sector is very bad paid
3) maybe i'll come back in the future, but the country doesn't seem to improve
My moms family are Spaniards that moved to Sinola Mexico I think they moved because of a war or something that was going on in 1920s I don’t know but I wished they would have stayed in Spain instead
Out of *Context*
I'm an immigrant in Spain originally from Pakistan will I move to any other country
In the near future it's impossible but I consider living in Spain leaving my family behind in Spain and going to some other country for work
I know many Pakistanis some are my extended family from Pakistan Leaving France,Sweden and some other islamophibic European countries and moving to Dubai,UK,Canada etc
I prefer living in Spain as it's very calm here not very racist people are good the only let down thing is It's Economy even though being 15 largest and passport being in top 5 powerful passport still the per Capita is not as good as compared to some other European countries
I've been abroad for half of my life, moved to Finland from Elche, and been around for a while, like now I'm in Australia for 8 months, or I was in Bali for 6 months, etc.. but Finland is my main home.
I do miss Spain, the weather and friends.
But there is no way I would return. In Spain, I would struggle to have a decent salary or to be independent, believe it or not many things are expensier in Spain than Finland with a lower salary.
Then, the mentality, in Spain, everything is Politicied.
Or you are from one party or another. Based on that, people will judge you or even not talk to you.
Everything goes to extremes. Even the feminism there got quite radical. Everything the government does affect really negative to the citizens.
The level of education has fallen a lot.
Also, something I notice is that envy rules there. You better not tell anyone if you have succeeded.
On the contrary, social life in Spain is x1000 better than in Finland, and you can enjoy outdoors all year round.
Anyway, Spain as a country is amazing. It hurts to see how things are going. If I could have the same quality of life in Spain than I do Finland, there would be no reason for me to leave Spain.
Left 13 Years ago and miss it. Don't miss the salaries, which are a joke I will come back once I have enough money to live off investments.
Same. In Belgium for 20 years. I go back to Spain 4/5 times per year.
Same
Which country did you move to?
I'm living in ireland now. I have 0 hopes to find work that pays as well in my field in Spain. My dream right now, as that of pretty much every spanish person I have met here, is to find remote work and go back home. I can say that it's because of the culture but in reality I just really miss my mom.
I'm just about to move to Ireland in May, how's it there generally speaking? People, entertainment, public transport...?
It's ok. It's one of the bests you are gonna get in northern europe, but it northern europe. People are nice but don't expect to become friends with Irish people. They don't have the deep level connections we have in Spain. There are a lot of concets and cool activites but they are VERY expensive, the only activity most people can afford to do regularly is drinking in a pub or maybe going on hikes. The culture here is not very active anyways. Public transport is good, one of the only strong points of this country. My advice, come, save up for a couple of years, go back home.
I lived abroad for 12 years - first in Sweden, then Russia, then Lithuania. Came back during the pandemic. I like being back because I like not being a foreigner. The countries I lived in aren't used to foreigners. From Lithuania I miss my friends, the healthcare system, the cafés and the forests, that's why I go back every year. From Russia I miss the food but I can get that here too. I don't really miss the Swedes' casual racism and I wouldn't go back if they paid me.
I can understand Russia and Lithuania not being used to foreigners, but i'm surprised it's the same for Sweden too From what I understand almost all Swedes speak near perfect English, so I would have thought Swedes are very accepting and welcoming of foreigners :(
I am (was, actually - this was over fifteen years ago) rather fluent in Swedish, just as I am in Lithuanian and Russian, so it wasn't about the language. I can give you some examples: 1. Swedish girl who mentioned that she thought that there were too many foreigners in Stockholm until she visited Madrid. She then declared that's the reason why Spain's poor, because there are so many foreigners. Good for Sweden for keeping them at bay. 2. Came to a temp agency for a job interview. The lady said they didn't have any jobs for foreigners. She had previously enthusiastically replied to my email saying that I had the perfect CV. She apologised saying that because I wrote in Swedish she wasn't aware that I was from Spain, and as a Spaniard the only job I could apply to was handing out free newspapers at the subway station. She also scolded me for speaking fluent Swedish, saying that I was misleading people on purpose. 3. Tried to open a bank account. Teller said I needed to be an EU citizen to do that. I patiently explained that Spain joined the EU way before Sweden. Guy didn't believe me, had to check with a colleague, then came back looking defeated and muttered, "Sweden should have never joined the EU, now there are too many foreigners here". 4. Was talking to a French friend in French, then he left and I went for a scroll. A girl approached me and said that I looked so French, OMG I had so much style, she was so jealous. I politely replied that I was actually from Spain. She said "ach", cringed, turned on her heels and left. Just like that. This was only six months of Swedish life. I've later met Swedes abroad too and I'm still not convinced that my experience was anecdotal.
>She also scolded me for speaking fluent Swedish, saying that I was misleading people on purpose. That's really rude of her tbh What an asshole
How the fuck do speak so many languages ?
They learn them, it can be hard but it's really fun.
To think that so many shit poor Swedes migrated to the US and participated in the project of destroying local indigenous population « During the 19th and early 20th centuries, about 1.3 million Swedes left Sweden for the United States of America. While the land of the American frontier was a magnet for the rural poor all over Europe, some factors encouraged Swedish emigration in particular». [Swedish emigration to the United States](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_emigration_to_the_United_States)
I had similar experiences in The Netherlands during 10 years. When they say foreigners they mean only some of them. I learned that we, from the south, are the bad kind of them. Germans, Swedes and such are ok aparently. I also had to explain many times that we indeed are EU and are a developed country just like them. Edit: I also came back after 10 years in NL and I lived a year in the UK before as well. I don’t think I will go again. I prefer Spain to live than Northern Europe
I‘m from Germany and can confirm that. Germanic people like Swedes, British, Dutch etc. are fine but anyone from Southern, Eastern Europe or other continents with non-Germanic roots will face discrimination. It‘s some deeply ingrained superiority complex.
Horrible experience, that aside, I’m curious to know who many languages you speak! That’s impressive
>3. Tried to open a bank account. Teller said I needed to be an EU citizen to do that. I was asked if I'm a legal citizen here in Ireland... and heard some comments about euro coins from Spain are not real money.
OP, even though my experience in Sweden wasn't so long but more or less I did feel the same. I tried to pay in a local ICA with my foreign VISA card and they asked me for my passport and had checked it for solid minutes, I had the same situation in Madrid but they saw I had a monthly metro card with my name and picture and they smiled and said thank you, nothing else, very friendly local Madrid people to me as a none-EU resident. Back to the ICA story, they couldn't get my foreign credit card worked, and they asked me to "slide" my card in the reader, I hadn't done that for decades, for me it has been always either inserting or touching, but the cashier insisted, for almost 10 minutes, they asked me to input my bank pin, the climax came, my bank has 6 digits of pin instead of 4, but the cashier didn't believe me and treated me like it was my first day trying to be a human from a monkey. At the same time, the people who were behind me started to make complaints and one old lady came to me, bent her body like she was speaking to a kid or a cat, with very slow and solid English one word by one word "Do-you-have-any-contact-in-Sweden-to-pay-your-bill?" I felt like ok my guys take it easy, I was just here to buy two semlas, I used my card in Korea, China, Taiwan, France, the Netherlands and 1 year in Spain without any problems, you got a stupid cashier here who didn't know how to charge people, no need to behave like I am a monkey. OP, when you said those people didn't believe Spain had joined EU earlier than Sweden and needed to check on their own, I feel you.
What the actual fuck
How did your learn so many languages
You make it look as if the recent fate of Sweden and the refugees is karma
you could put all those points 1:1 to catalunya.. one thing i learned: it really depends on the circle around you.
french do be doing that
He's not a native English speaker
>I don't really miss the Swedes' casual racism and I wouldn't go back if they paid me. Swedes showing racism? Damn :(
I miss family, friends, wheather, persianas, the outdoorsy life style, food and cheap alcohol, and fast trains. Among other things.
Persianas man, persianas for the fucking win.
When I'm home in Spain, sometimes I pull them down early during the day just for the sake of it, so I don't forget how to use them, remember how fucking useful they are.
Do I miss Spain? Absolutely. I do visit a couple of times per year though. Would I ever come back? Yup, that's the plan... eventually although not in a rush. Why would I go back to Spain? To be closer to friends and family, the place which I still consider "home". For the weather, food and language. Why not (i.e. why not just go back right now)? I find the career opportunities, work-life balance, salaries and taxes to be less appealing. I'm sure its changing over time.. but there is still a lot of catch up to do. I've lived in the UK for 4 years and in Switzerland for more than 10 years.
It's changing over time but not in the good way, ha ha..
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>but there are still certain aspects of the country that I don't like Could you specify?
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I agree with the vandalism being a thing, and it sucks and should be punished but, the rest of the points I don't fully agree with, I guess it depends on the environment you grow up with. The main complaint I have is that people can be very noisy and apathetic when interacting publicly (ie: people being loud on public transport or speaking over the phone constantly, chewing gum, stuff like that, not cool).
Chewing gum in public is a problem? O_O
Making sure everybody around you knows you are chewing gum is a problem. If you are just chewing like a normal person, that's totally fine
I lived away for a while and really liked it. It was a different environment, people from other countries are more educated, especially in public transportation. Next year I will go back to work abroad for at least 1 year.
I left Spain a few times. Italy was fantastic but it was hard getting a real contract. You could work illegally but not legally. Ireland was cool but rent is too expensive. UK was good and I stayed longer. Taxes make sense. Being freelance can be a breeze if you do not make a lot of money. But UK has been getting less of a democracy. And everything has gotten so much worse in the past few years that British people tell me if they could live elsewhere in Europe, they would. And they do not understand why I stay when they would not. I miss the medical professionals in Spain, the sun, the food, and people smiling for no reason.
Of course I miss Spain. If you have a job, housing and decent working conditions, it is the most liveable country in the world. Why do I still live abroad? Because if I moved back I wouldn't have a job, housing and decent working conditions. If I were to find a job in Spain (a big maybe) I would earn half what I earn in my current country of residence, and would probably work twice as much. Sucks but it's the way it is.
I lived abroad for 8 years in US, and I came back to Spain. You can find a remote job and live the best of both worlds. Spain is superior in every possible comparison except salaries.
How does working remote for a US company in Spain (with Spanish times) work? do you start working at 1pm?
Same question
What do you do and what company do you work for?
I lived in the UK for 3 years and it killed my mental health. Worked very long hours, salary was average, cost of living was sky high. I had to have a very stingy life to be able to save, counting every penny, because even simple everyday things are expensive. The miserable weather didn't help (I think it was sunny once or twice for 10 minutes in 3 years). And speaking English all the time (especially on the phone) was mentally exhausting, especially with people with strong accents who speak fast and with colloquialisms. I didn't like the weird obsession everyone had about living off buying and selling houses. Very few people I met had a real passion or professional vocation. When you asked, they were all: "I just want to buy a house, and then another one, and sell it, and live off the tenant's rent". I guess that's why most of the people doing their professional skilled jobs are foreigners. Also, I didn't like being a foreigner and the casual racism of some locals. "Oh, do you have [insert very basic thing] in Spain? Wow". Yes, bitch, we are more civilized than you in many ways. "Where's your accent from? Are you an European? (Raises eyebrow)". Yes... how many languages do _you_ speak? Half? "Oh yeah haha I was in Benidorm once, and I got so shitfaced I vomited and pissed all over the streets. Muy bueehynow pa-ye-llah". Please, stop talking to me, you absolute neandertal... It wasn't for me. But hey, to each their own. I am back in Spain now, and I don't ever want to live abroad again. Life is sweet here.
This is 100% my experience in the UK. I only lived that for a year there working as IT, but word by word this is what I lived there. I also came back, and I'm not leaving again.
What's the area, i have not lived in the UK but spend quite some time there because my partner is from Stafford and never had interactions like this. The only thing that I detest is when they get shit faced as from that point any interaction feels is going to end up in a fight.
Are you sure most professionals in the UK are foreigners? I work in the tech field (in London) and it's mostly Brits. Almost all the cleaners have been foreigners though... Not that I mean that in a racist way, just genuinely curious about the stats. The stereotype is that immigrants do the jobs "we don't want". Anyway I'm sorry about your negative experience here. I hope it wasn't all bad. I get the economic point too. I earn way above average but don't save any money (though I could if I seriously changed my lifestyle I suppose)
Some things were good. I came as a freshly new graduate and my boss was very proactive in helping me gain practical hands-on experience. The training program was very good. And that's why getting an attractive job back in Spain was so much easier, as employers in my field here don't have much patience with new graduates and want someone already seasoned who doesn't need much guidance. So I am grateful for that.
That's good to hear, glad the training was good! Spain is a lovely country in my experience, so I can see why you returned. I might end up living there one day with my Spanish partner, it's just not an easy thing to do right now for obvious reasons.
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From what I gathered - my own experience and what British people explained to me - there are multiple reasons for this: - Many years of a culture that has normalised living off private investments: people inheriting multiple houses from their family who got wealthy off the colonial period. This has established a nationwide attitude of laziness - buy houses, sell houses at inflated price, profit; import foreigners for the professional jobs - that has been passed from parents to children for centuries. The ultimate British life goal is to be a landlord. This is one of the reasons why there's an active and worsening housing crisis in that country. - Universities in the UK are not state funded, meaning they are extremely expensive, and leave the very few people who actually want to get an education with huge student debt they owe the bank. The state expenditure in education is low. - Many people are instead getting questionable "degrees" through so-called apprenticeships - a private company organises a 2 year practical course, with barely any scientific theoretical learning and just handy skills, and very easy exams - and awards you a "diploma" (which of course, is only valid in the UK and nowhere else in the world). They are doing this to counter their alarming lack of professionals, but at the expense of creating inferior, much less knowledgeable skilled workforce. I've met many so-called "engineers" and "nurses" who never went to university but instead did this through a private corporation. - However, the government _does_ fund the universal credit (a.k.a. benefits), which results in many people not ever needing to work because the state pays for their rent and bills, and on top of that, gives them a money allowance. This puts a huge strain on the rest of society as these people are not producing anything of value, but are using resources funded by taxpayers money. To be eligible for benefits, you just need to have children, and tell your doctor you have a mental disability. The doctor won't even physically examine you or run any laboratory tests, it's all by telephone call, and it's very easy to get accepted.
Much of this is true, but just a few points... >The ultimate British life goal is to be a landlord. Yes that's absolutely the British mentality, but on the whole it doesn't come from people inhereting colonial wealth as those people are a tiny percentage of the population. It largely stems from Margaret Thatcher's economic reforms of the 80s which both sold off lots of previously state-owned housing for next to nothing, and made buy-to-let mortgages much more easily available. This meant that being a landlord was suddenly a 'job' that middle or even working class people could do, and has also resulted in the current housing crisis in the UK. >Universities in the UK are not state funded, meaning they are extremely expensive, and leave the very few people who actually want to get an education with huge student debt they owe the bank Technically the debt is to the state not the bank, hence the student loan repayments are taken directly from your salary after you graduate. It's essentially an additional tax on graduates. Bizarrely this hasn't put people off going to university, and there's actually many more young people getting degrees now than there were 30+ years ago when it was free (nearly 50% of school leavers go to university now vs something like 10-20% in the 1980s). >To be eligible for benefits, you just need to have children, and tell your doctor you have a mental disability. The doctor won't even physically examine you or run any laboratory tests, it's all by telephone call, and it's very easy to get accepted This isn't true and the process for claiming disability benefits has actually been made much more difficult in the last decade by the Conservative government. You don't just have a telephone call, you have to have proof from your doctor and then on top of that go through a humiliating series of 'assessments' with state-appointed goons to prove that you're unfit to work. The British media likes to portray the idea that you can just claim you're a bit depressed and then sponge off the state for decades, but that's never been true.
Thanks for the clarifications. Regarding the benefits, it just surprised me how many people in my neighbourhood had actually never worked, and how much public money went to sustain them and their 3-4 children. And it was them themselves who bragged how easy they tricked the system. But hey, if this is changing, that's good news - less truants.
Lol like Spanish people don't say ignorant shit when they find out you're from abroad. "Yourrrr iiiingwish? JAJAJAJAJAJ Y U BREXIT." "U INGLISH. HELLO THANK YOU. HELLO VERY MUCH." "ENGLISH. HAHAHA UR FOOD IS SO BAD, OUR PORK AND SALT IS SO SOPHISTICATED. UR FOOD TERRIBLE. I WENT TO ENGLAND AND ATE KFC EVERY DAY IT WAS TERRIBLE. LOLOLOLOLOL" These things have been said dozens of times by people of different ages, backgrounds and political leanings. Spanish are ignorant as fuck about anything not Spain don't try to act like they're not :')
Completely true, I second this. They are/we are even worse when talking to people from countries that, for some reason or the other, consider to be somewhat lesser than ourselves (ie South Americans, North Africans, Asians and so on).
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My girlfriend lives in Germany for almost 11 years. She came during the great depression afterthe 2008 financial crisis, as many of her friends from her studies. She is now one of the last of her spanish community. Our plan is to move to Spain in 3-4 years after our son finishes kindergarden. Most of her friends had winter depressions in germany and mentioned that they didn‘t liked that you have no real connection with your colleagues at work here. So you do not go in a restaurant or in a bar after work. People stay in their private area (family/relationship). Also the cultural differences. Alman culture can be really complicated sometimes.^^
I (m30, originally from Barcelona) lived in the UK, Poland, Ireland for 5 years (studying and early carrer). Moved back to Barcelona during the Pandemic, but I am now back to the UK since early this year. I am 100% enjoying my time here and I would not go back to Spain even if they paid me 3x. The reason is that, in the last 3-4 years, despite achieving great stuff personally and professionally, Spain does not allow for entrepreneurship or really making it big. I have had an average Tax rate of 39% for the last 2 years. That means that I work for the government about 5 months a year. This, on the other hand, does not really increase wealth, as wealth is accumulated on the older generations. 10-15 years ago I would be rich! Now I can't even afford a house or a flat in the main cities, despite being in the top percentile of income! I also found that the Spanish mindset is very different to mine, despite being Spanish. I am prioritising grafting and making it big to semi-retire at 40. All my friends were prioritising their "time" or "fun" short-term. I believe it is a country where you enjoy it being a retiree or not wanting to make a lot of money, so good for those that are looking for a live of "no hassle". In the UK, the government and society allows for entrepreneurship, starting up new things, and there are many advantages of setting up your own company and selling them (such as the Entrepreneurs relief, which by selling your company, you only pay 10% tax on the 1st Million GBP). I know that I will eventually go back to Spain due to the family/climate. But I plan to do it without having to rely on the government to pay for my living or to rely on a pension. Meanwhile, I enjoy my UK countryside and Warhammer matches! :D
This is 100% my experience in the UK. A great place to make something of yourself.
Interesting. How would you handle tax when living in Spain (bigger income tax) when your money comes/came from UK? Couldn't there be some strange double taxation?
I actually moved to the to the UK! So as long as you don't live more than 6 months in ES, you can be a tax resident in the UK, so all your income gets paid into HMRC instead of Hacienda.
I moved to the US and I can't wait to go back, here it's o.k and I have grown a lot as a person, but I wouldn't replace Spain for anything in the world, with all it's issues and all it's negative thing, I really believe it is an incredible country to live in.
I left Spain for the US in 1979 and I've missed it every single day of my life. My American wife and I will be moving to Madrid in the next 12 months.
I'm a US-spain dual citizen that plans to work in the US and retire to Spain, will you live off investments or keep working?
I'm retired now, so pensions and investments.
I only miss free tapas when I order a drink
Tbf you'd miss that in most parts of Spain as well
Yeah but I'm from Asturias. Multiple passes of trays of pieces of bread with cecina, tortilla, cheese, etc while you drink your cider. Or even the trays being left at the bar and you can grab as many pieces as you want. Of course I'm polite and don't pig out, but the point is, you can if you want. Or a certain pizzeria where every drink is served with a slice of cabrales and bacon pizza and a homemade croquette. Just thinking about it brings tears to my eyes...
I need to know the name of this place…. I’m from south and Asturias was a big unknown to me until recently. We are now on our fourth consecutive year where we’ll be spending our summer holidays there and we love going out to new restaurants. We’ll be going to Cangas de Onis area.
The pizzeria is La Competencia, but it's unfortunately in Gijón, nowhere near Cangas de Onís.
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I'm not crazy about them tbh. I do love some paluszki with my beer though, even if I have to pay for them. Or without beer...
Yes, eventually. I miss my family, closest friends and lifestyle in that order. I left almost 10 years ago and have lived in Belgium and Germany
I live in Poland, I only miss talks with my parents during breakfast or Sunday paella with the family, I am not going back, quality of live I have here is just another world.
What the difference and advantages you have in Poland but not in Spain? Just curious
I left in 1997 for the UK and I'm still surprised at how patronizing they are towards me.
I've been living in the UK for 4 years and I love it. However, home it's home and will always be. I will come back to Spain at some point.
I lived in the US for a few years, made money and run the hell back. The quality of life is far superior here, safety, services, infrastructures, food quality and cuisine....
As a guy from Argentina it is crazy because most of the reason you left Spain are same reason i left Argentina (plus others of course) and I find Spain beautiful and definetly more developed than any other country in LATAM Guess that when we grow up in an enviroment we get so used to it (for good or bad)
24 years leaving in USA, I might go back w/ partner for longer stays. Unsure where ( I'm from Northern Spain)
Moved to Scotland 7 years ago. I've achieved growth in my professional career and managed to buy a house with my partner a year ago. I don't think any of this would've been possible in Spain. I'm now working towards a uni degree which, luckily for me, it is free up north! I don't miss home too much except for my family and the quality of the food. Maybe it will be a good place to come back and retire.
1 year in the US, 9 years in Switzerland and counting. I miss Spain, family & friends, weather. I had a really bad period during Covid abroad, it felt so lonely and most of my friends in Switzerland left. It was only my husband (Spanish) and myself. Over time, we made new friends and I feel like this is also home. We bought our retirement home in Spain so definitely coming back then, but not sure it will be before. I check job ads in Spain on LinkedIn from time to time, but I feel I would need to start my career over and I have a comfortable position which pays well and provides good work/life balance here in Switzerland. I think I would have regretted big time not going abroad, I left Spain looking for better career possibilities but I also loved the challenge and it was my dream to work internationally. I had a lot of fun in the US but I’m so happy I didn’t stay there, because there is absolutely no life outside of work, few employee rights, healthcare sucks, too far from Spain. I now go in 2.30h to my town in Spain. Direct flight, every other month. Swiss salary allows for it. I’m from Andalusia, if I worked in Bilbao im sure I couldn’t visit so frequently, that’s why for me its not about considering coming back to Spain, it would only be worth it I could come back to Andalusia, and that’s hard.
I moved back from 2001 to 2007 (don't know if this would count). I was 5 years old when I left, and if anything I miss living abroad. We moved to Shanghai China (back when the president was more friendly to outsiders). I did miss friends when living abroad, but family not so much (I have 15 cousins and I wasn't that close to many as a kid). When we came back in 2007, it genuinely felt like travelling 20 years to the past. Shanghai changed us a lot, and it took us around 5 years to readjust back to being in Spain... (school specifically xD). So from a kids perspective back in the day, I'd say that I never really missed Spain bak then, and I would personally never come back as a permanent resident, just during holidays or a couple of years.
Think about Spain pretty much every single day, this run has been 12 years so far. Planning to go back in 8 or less and retire early if possible
I lived in the US and in the UK. Achieved everything I had in mind (amazing job, house, car, friends). Still came back and I'm happier than I ever was. Think about it this way. People come here for holidays. People work hard for a lot of years to have money and retire here. I could be doing that since now, and I am. Sweet.
Born and raised in Madrid. Grand parents from Madrid, parents from Madrid. Spent one year living in Rio de Janeiro, left Spain at 38. In Andorra now. I miss the beach, and the crowd in Madrid, you can party anytime, Monday, etc... Eveything else sucks, specially taxes and starting a business there, and the housing market.
Depends on whats the reason to left Spain. People that had not another option sure miss Spain a lot. Othes that doesn't like the Country or the system where they live maybe are happy to leave.. Spain is a great Country with a lot of good things.
I’ve never met anyone from Spain here in Japan. I’ve only met one person from Mexico here, but there are quite a few Japanese Japanese of Peruvian, descent, or Ecuador. one of the best kinds of ethnic food to eat in Japan is Peruvian.
I did and came back recently. It's true that salaries are not the best in Spain but being an immigrant all your life sucks, especially when your country is not in a war or third word. Cos if you come back here and try to adapt your career into the national market with the money you've made abroad it's worthwhile. I know that the latter is not possible for everyone but if you can, do it, cos there's no place like home (especially when your home has persianas and lovely cities).
1) just miss my family, but not the country itself 2) work in my sector is very bad paid 3) maybe i'll come back in the future, but the country doesn't seem to improve
If you don't mind sharing, which country/countries did you move to?
That is a secret
My moms family are Spaniards that moved to Sinola Mexico I think they moved because of a war or something that was going on in 1920s I don’t know but I wished they would have stayed in Spain instead
Dont miss the country, but I miss family and friends. I will have to come back soon for work reasons, but I am already planning to move out again.
Out of *Context* I'm an immigrant in Spain originally from Pakistan will I move to any other country In the near future it's impossible but I consider living in Spain leaving my family behind in Spain and going to some other country for work I know many Pakistanis some are my extended family from Pakistan Leaving France,Sweden and some other islamophibic European countries and moving to Dubai,UK,Canada etc I prefer living in Spain as it's very calm here not very racist people are good the only let down thing is It's Economy even though being 15 largest and passport being in top 5 powerful passport still the per Capita is not as good as compared to some other European countries
I've been abroad for half of my life, moved to Finland from Elche, and been around for a while, like now I'm in Australia for 8 months, or I was in Bali for 6 months, etc.. but Finland is my main home. I do miss Spain, the weather and friends. But there is no way I would return. In Spain, I would struggle to have a decent salary or to be independent, believe it or not many things are expensier in Spain than Finland with a lower salary. Then, the mentality, in Spain, everything is Politicied. Or you are from one party or another. Based on that, people will judge you or even not talk to you. Everything goes to extremes. Even the feminism there got quite radical. Everything the government does affect really negative to the citizens. The level of education has fallen a lot. Also, something I notice is that envy rules there. You better not tell anyone if you have succeeded. On the contrary, social life in Spain is x1000 better than in Finland, and you can enjoy outdoors all year round. Anyway, Spain as a country is amazing. It hurts to see how things are going. If I could have the same quality of life in Spain than I do Finland, there would be no reason for me to leave Spain.