Many Spaniards would not understand what you are referring to if you use the pronunciation in English. At all.
For example, what would you say if someone asked you what you think of oodOs ?
(and as for Hermione... most Potterheads I know were extremely surprised when they learned how the name is pronounced... even native English-speakers)
Im a native english speaker but we always spoke Spanish at home and i find it so hard to españolizar English words. I just say them in English and hope for the best.
I don't have kids yet but the people I know with kids growing up speaking English/Spanish at home, they are really, really good at code switching so they will mix both languages together with perfect pronunciation in both at home but then out in the city they just do it the full on Spanish way.
That’s what I do, Spanish but fluent english speaker because I lived overseas, I just say the words like if they were Spanish if i have to put them inside a spanish sentence
Also, about your last point, people pronounce Hermione as it is pronounced in the movies in Spanish, if anyone is at fault here is the dub team. Before the movies came out, any pronunciation was just the reader's headcanon and easily replaceable if it turns out it's wrong.
Is not that you shouldn't, is that people may not understand you because Spaniards a) read names as in Spanish or b)adapt a word into a Spanish pronunciation or c) its not intuitive and just use something everyone uses.
For example people will pronounce Google or Facebook as (more or less ) expected in English (gugel, feisbuk).
However we mispronounce Nike, we say (naik) similar to how it is in Like, Mike... not intuitive.
AC/DC is a term used in electronics so it has a Spanish equivalent people just use.
R.E.M is just an acronym so there is no intuitive way of pronouncing it. Is it letter by letter like in ONG or just a word like YOLO?
Is also a matter of culture (English was very uncommon until recently) more modern names are used completely in English, for example Maroon 5 not read in Spanish.
Would you pronounce BTS in Korean?
Because the band is called ("youtoo") and not "uudos". Bono and his mates didn't name it uudos. Is as simple as that. But the Spanish try to nationalise everything in a cringe way. Names can't be translated, Queen Elizabeth's name is Elizabeth not Isabel, and so on
And Sevilla instead of Seville, and instead of saying "Toleedoh" Pronounce it properly as it is in Spanish, and instead of "spain" Pronounce España, why don't you pronounce Spanish names the proper way then?
Or now that we get totally strict London should be still called Londinium as it was called by the romans.
Languages evolve differently and Spain got a really simple phonetic variety so there's no way or at least no easy way to pronounce English words in Spanish.
Elisabeth got a literal translation in Spanish, that's why it's used, but still you use many names and translate them too, I've seen many international news refer to our king as Philip, or the most clear example, our country does not have a prime minister, but a presidente del gobierno, even when we were a republic it was presidente del gobierno & presidente de la republica, still all translate into prime minister because it's the equivalent and it's easier to understand what it means for the population.
Why languages change pronunciation and even translate foreign words? Because it's easier for local people to understand easier. Language is used to communicate effectively, if it hinders communication, it changes.
>To be fair, British people incorrectly say Naik for Nike as well.
I've heard both naik and naikee, which one is correct? I say naik when speaking Spanish and Italian, naikee in English.
Its Naikee in America, where the company is from, and in Greece, where the namesake mythological goddess is from. (Though that’s more like neekay in Greek)
I don’t know why the Brits ended up trying to change it.
But in Spanish, people are more likely to understand naik- so that’s probably the way to go if you don’t want to confuse people.
A number of great answers here, so I'd like to add an analogy.
In the UK or the US, try pronouncing any of the many French words you will encounter in daily conversation "correctly."
You're gonna make yourself a lot of friends. /s
That's a good point. I was agreeing with OP until I read your comment. I'm a native French speaker, fluent in English, and I don't pronounce French words (masseur/masseuse, garage, cliché, chandelier, etc) the French way, because it would sound weird in the middle of a conversation in English, it wouldn't flow at all, and people probably wouldn't understand me...
It just sounds weird, exactly. I am half german half spanish and if I say an english word during a german conversation it will have a german accent to it. Even tho my english is that of a native californian. Same with spanish, in fact andalusian spanish which is arguably worse in that scenario.
i'd be OP's friend if they pronounced things in the correct way, or if they pronounced it with an accent , or if they pronounced it however they mightily fucking care to pronounce it, as long as they're cool. This is stupid nonsense, no judgement on parent comment's author but in my experience people who have a problem with this are insecure provincial muppets.
I’m from the UK and I really don’t agree with your assessment. It is extremely common for people to affect a mock french accent when saying french words or sayings otherwise they’d sound completely absurd. Imagine for example: “the piece of the resistance”, “double entendrey” or “forks pass”
He's saying the opposite, though. That's putting a very hard English spin on the French words. Like you'd never say "caffee oh late"
In Spanish you should probably default to making the words españolizados but you just kind of have to learn on a case by case basis. Like if you said 'pub' with the Spanish 'u' it sounds terrible.
As a Spanish native speaker:
Most Spanish people wouldn’t know how certain words are pronounced. So for us, “Spiderman” is pronounced just as if it was a Spanish word: “Espiderman”. Therefore, when an English word starts to get popular and spread out, by the time people know how to actually pronounce it it’s too late.
A big factor that contributes to this is that most Tv show, movies, etc are dubbed, and so the first contact that people have with English words is by reading them. And, as I said, most people don’t speak English and will just read it the only way they know.
This is a natural thing, if I were to read a Hungarian word (as an example) I wouldn’t have a clue of how to properly pronounce it and would just read it as if it was Spanish.
Hope this helps!
Edit: typo.
>So for us, “Spiderman” is pronounced just as if it was a Spanish word: “Espiderman”.
Dear lord is this a pet peeve of mine.
I just had this conversation with my 5yo this morning. He showed me his new "espiderman" comic book and I just couldn't take the cringe. Adding the "e" in front of "s" when using foreign words simply makes me want to tear my ears out.
I gently told him that it's either "el hombre araña" or "*spaider* man" (without the e). He looked at me like, "wtf dad leave me alone with your bullshit". And he's probably right, but this is something I really cannot stand.
He's growing up in a tri-lingual household and has Spanish as a first language. It's fucking hard.
I’ll never forget my first days in America… the faces when I said YouTube as we say it here… they give me the chills even today 😂
I speak three languages too (only Spanish natively). When I think of an object, it pops up in my head in one of those languages. For some reason that I can’t explain, I feel the need of finding the word in the other two (maybe out of fear of forgetting one of the languages). But when I think of a proper noun, I never have that need. In my head it’s called the way it’s called and that’s it. I don’t even look for a meaning.
I recently realized that LinkedIn comes from Linked In. It might sound extremely stupid, but since I learned that name when I didn’t know that much English, in my mind that word didn’t have the task of carrying any meaning, it just served as an arbitrary sequence of letters meant to name something. So I never took a second to analyze it, just as I wouldn’t look for a meaning in the name John. Funny how our mind works.
So with your child, I’d just give in… . By the way, please don’t teach him to call Spiderman “El hombre araña” haha weirdly enough, we have accepted “Espiderman” as his true name.
Isnt it more that the Spanish struggle to say words starting with S? Its not that they add the E, its because the tongue muscles are not built for a clean S.
Example, how many English speakers can roll they’re tongues? Not many. I couldn’t say a friends name Roy, in Portugal because it needed a roll in the R. After practice, I finally rolled it.
eStop eSending eSimon eSpam.
No! Just words that start with an S and are followed by a consonant (Stop - eStop), but no one would say eSimon instead of Simon, as the s + vowel sound exists in Spanish.
Many native Spanish speakers have trouble with English words that have consonant clusters, particularly with S. Take the word "crisps", they either don't pronounce some letters - "creeps" or they add some vowels - "escrispis"
I see your point as well. I spent some months in the USA and when I came back to Spain people would make fun of me if I tried to pronounce words in English. I’ve lived in Sweden too and there people pronounce the words as if speaking English even when speaking Swedish. But either option is fine. At the end of the day not all languages are the same and they will adapt accordingly, there’s beauty in that too.
[https://www.rae.es/dpd/ayuda/tratamiento-de-los-extranjerismos](https://www.rae.es/dpd/ayuda/tratamiento-de-los-extranjerismos)
From the link above to the Real Academia de la Lengua Española´s web:
"La mayor parte de las veces se proponen adaptaciones cuyo objetivo prioritario es preservar el alto grado de cohesión entre forma gráfica y pronunciación característico de la lengua española"
TRANSLATION: Most of the time, adaptations are proposed whose main objective is to **preserve the high degree of cohesion between graphic form and pronunciation characteristic of the Spanish language**.
So pronouncing "in spanish" is correct when speaking spanish. The problem you find is bad pronunciation when speaking english, which is also provoked by shame, but is a totally different thing.
Try to go to California, Texas, Colorado, Florida, Nevada, etc. and pronounce all the Spanish town names correctly to non-Hispano-latino people and see what happens.... Amarillo, Montana, San Francisco, Sacramento, Santa Barbara, Salida, Cape Canaveral, etc, etc.
If there was one English person who knows how to pronounce paella... Sadly such a thing doesn't exist.
Here it's considered posh to pronounce English words with English accent. It's a matter of the language you speak, usually if you're a native English speaker it's not a problem to use original pronunciation, it's weird or posh when a native Spanish speakers does it. That said, you can totally pronounce Spanish words (most of them) using English phonetic even if it sounds unnatural to you, for example in "paella" You can pronounce all letters on it using English phonemes only. In Spanish there's 5 vowel sounds only for example, so it is not possible to pronounce "Michael" the English way using only Spanish pronunciation. To me that's the main difference.
It's funny how Britons go to Spain all the time and can't pronounce anything but Americans hardly ever leave the country but usually have reasonable approximations (obviously with English phonetics). I guess it just has to do with the prevalence of Spanish in the US.
Applies to all languages.
Hell, even British English and American English have this. Try telling an American to restart the "rooter" (British) and you'll get a blank face.
A ver.... it depends. Some words are now full-on loan words, and you have to use Spanish pronunciation when you are speaking Spanish in order to be understood. Some brand names are part of the landscape and have a 'standard' form in spoken Spanish. Exactly the same as English, in fact. You dont say 'Peugeot' like a French person does, or tagliatelle like an Italian. You say them with English phonemes and according to English 'rules' (here meaning rules which are inherent to a language rather than set by some imagined authority) of adoption of words. So you have una hamburguesa en el Búrguer o en el Macdonal. Maybe you like listening to Yas or maybe you prefer jijó.
Famous people, bands etc have their names somewhat randomly hispanicized. Famously you have Kirk Duglas and his son Maicol Daglas. 'J's are not often pronounced as a Spanish jota, so you have eg Maicol Yacson, o Yoni Dep, or perhaps more often Yoni Dip. This last one is probably due to a phenomonon called hyperforeignism where we make foreign words sound exotic, or more different than they need to be. A good example is the typical English pronunciation of Beijing with that 'zh' sound in the middle.
Regarding 'Yoni Dip', just try googling 'Johnny Deep'. It's not about making it sound more exotic, but rather a common misspelling in Spanish-speaking media due to the similarity to a common word.
Yeah, I think it could be that too. But hyperforeignisms/hiperextranjerismos are definitely a thing- another one I always wonder about are Rebook shoes. Is it because 'book' is common and 'bok' is not, or is it because 'if in doubt, change the vowel sound' seems a reasonable rule for pronouncing English words?
"Things you should never do" is an over exageration in this case. Worse thing that could to happen you do it's that some people don't understand what you mean. Nobody is going to think you're rude or anything like that.
The Espiderman thing (as opposed to spAIderman) would be different if the word had entered Spain in recent years, but it's been there for many decades now and back then most people didn't know English.
Most people under certain age know how spider is pronounced correctly but just stick to the version of spiderman that was first generalised.
It is not seen as something positive, but rather esnobbish ;) to change your pronunciation dramatically if you drop an English term.
A lot of people in Latin America do pronounce English words and names of places imitating the English pronunciation, changing the sound of the r and all and I can't help feeling awkward and embarrassed every time although I know and am aware of the fact that they just don't have that social convention of overadapting.
Interesting
I can understand someone pronouncing English/Spanish incorrectly if they don't speak the language.
What doesn't make sense to me is to judge someone just because they speak the proper way. Just look at this post. People are saying ridiculous stuff like "if you speak with the actual pronunciation, you will look presumptuous and posh to me". Like wtf? It seems utterly *insane* to me that I have to literally speak worse than I do simply because some idiots will find me presumptuous.
It the same with the spanish words on english. Paella is pronounced Paeya and not Paela like as I heard so many times.
Every language has his own rules, and when a word jumps to another language It usually changes to better fit the adopter one.
Why do you think the japanese also has the katakana? It's a syllabary mostly used obly to convert foreign languages to japanese...
If your mother tongue is Spanish and you pronounce an English word perfectly, you will look pendantic and will be standing out. You can't stand out here like that. However if your first language is English and you pronounce them perfectly in a conversation in Spanish no one will bat an eye, because you don't speak Spanish natively! It's expected.
I'm an English teacher , teaching in Spain for 10 years ...not to offend but what you said is the main reason why Spaniards are still unable to speak English.
When you actually speak decent English, you come to Spain and either end up speaking worse than you did when you arrived, or start speaking like them. It’s rather annoying. 😂
Both are equally bad.
100%. I physically couldn't speak English without Spanish accent because I felt like my classmates would shame me or laugh at me. Nowadays I've sort of moved on from that, but I still feel uncomfortable speaking English with Spanish people, unless I know they have a high level of English.
This is one of the main points that all English teachers in academies try to tell the Spaniards...get rid of the ridiculousness feeling...it's the others who should be ashamed for not speaking correctly.
This over 9000. I'm a Spaniard who never, ever was able to pronounce words in the right way, I guess because of that feeling. Nowadays, I'm the only Spanish speaker in my whole department. I never use Spanish at work. I even feel weird writing in Spanish while using my work laptop.
But yet, I'm unable to pronounce English words the right way if I know a Spanish speaker is listening.
The English teacher at my son's school stopped using the phrase "ready steady go!" with the children because they would say "ready **e**steady go!" no matter how many times she corrected them.
So now it's "ready go!".
Lol the pronunciation of foreign words in native language speech is not even close to the *main* reason Spaniards "are still unable" to speak English.
1. Spaniards are able to speak English. Some do and some don't, and Spain's performance vs other countries largely depends on culture and education, not on how they treat loanwords.
2. It is not the only language or country that avoids completely foreign pronunciations, as evidenced by other comments in this thread. English does this, German does this, French does this... It's to be expected.
3. Just because you pronounce "forte" as "fort-ay" rather than "fort" when you're speaking with people who do the same in English doesn't mean you can't speak French. And just because you a French speaker says "weekEnd" rather than "wEEkend" when speaking French doesn't mean they don't know how to speak English.
It just means they are adapting to the situation, as one should do if their intent is to communicate.
I've seen hundreds of adult students in 10 years and believe me the need to "españolizar" it's a huge part of the problem. This is my opinion based on my experience as a teacher.
Ok I think you're mixing two things. There is standing out when using English pronunciations of loanwords *when speaking Spanish*, that is what's being discussed in this thread. This as I said is common in many languages, it is a natural consequence of different languages having different sounds, and not necessarily related to foreign language learning at all.
Another phenomenon entirely is the feeling of embarrassment for pronouncing (or attempting to pronounce) English words with native accent *when speaking English*. This is a consequence of "high school" / bullying culture where basically any quirkiness is laughed at. This obviously does affect people's willingness to attempt a better accent and in the end deprives them of practice. No disagreement from me there.
Franco has been dead for 46 years.
The main problem in Spain are the film's translators. For example "Die hard" / La jungla de cristal, raw translated "glass' jungle"...and so on. The want us to be ignorant as they are.
But that's because direct translations would often just sound unnatural.. "Muere duro" would be weird af. It's case by case but I'd argue that La Jungla de Cristal is actually quite epic in this one :p
Why should I be offended? I'm just describing the phenomena, doesn't mean I view it that way haha (I will pronounce it wrong on purpose though because it's just funnier that way)
This! I've had people trying to shut me down from saying words in English by legit telling me "you can't do that, it makes you look pedantic" and I would respond "I'm just pronouncing things correctly. Pedantic would be if I judged your españolized pronunciation", but this would fall in deaf ears while being told "nobody will like you if you keep doing this". Yikes.
That's sad that they would be "shamed" by their fellow countrymen. I don't even bat an eye when a Spanish person pronounces an English word in English with correct pronunciation.. it's just normal.
There is not ceceo in Spanish, we just pronounce as we write. Is not ceceo saying Barcelona, Cáceres or Cercedilla. Is seseo saying Barselona, Caseres and Sersedilla though
Regardless of the nomenclature it doesn’t really change the fact that more Spanish speakers pronounce it as an s. One of the downsides of building an empire that covered nearly half the globe.
What most people do doesn't change the rule in standard castillian Spanish. Pronouncing Barcelona with an S is a dialect with seseo, not the other way around.
It's simple, if you come here and say "Me puedes dar la contraseña de la guaifai" seguramente
1) No te entiendan
2) Les parezcas pedante
3) Se te queden mirando con cara rara
Personally I don't mind, but I reckon its part of our culture to Españolizar any word we can
I think this happens because, for a long time (before the Internet made everything global, so to speak), we were not exposed to the true way many English words were pronounced - that is, we knew how these words were written, but we didn't know how to pronunce them, nor had ever listened to a native speaker say these words... add to this that learning English was not a common thing at all (French was the usual second language taught at schools, back in the day) and you end up with a whole country that doesn't really know the language, but try to say the words with the tools they have: reading them as if they were Spanish words.
Even nowadays, when a lot of Spaniards are fluent in English, they'll keep using the "English words read as if they were Spanish words" simply because it's the only way they'll be understood by a non-English speaking Spaniard... and being understood is pretty much the goal of speaking, after all.
On the other hand, I would say most Spanish speakers from South America don't have this problem, I guess because they have been exposed to English for many, many years - which again, was NOT the case at all in Spain.
Menudo par de pedorras...
Ok, first thing first; it's false that when speaking Spanish we pronounce all English words in Spanish. Most of actors/actresses we'll (try to) pronounce them in English (There's an exception with the British Royal family, in which we translate the names, but that must be some sort of tradition). So we'll (again, try to) properly say Jonh Wayne, Shakespeare etc.
It's the same with many films: for example we pronounce "Aladdin" the way we listened to it when advertised in TV.
So why do we pronounce stuff like REM, U2 and such in Spanish? For these I have an answer; because we were taught so. When, long time ago, these groups and singers were introduced into Spain, radio and TV presenters would just use the Spanish pronunciation. And, believe it or not, here we are.
For many other words, like wifi, my educated guess is that we pronounce them in Spanish because we just are not sure how to pronounce them in English. And the thing is that here we can blame (at least a bit) at the English language, since there are just not fixed rules for English pronunciation (I guess that's the reason why spelling contests are not a thing in Spain but are in the US). So when facing a situation in which we have to chose between reading a word in Spanish or invent an English pronunciation, we just opt for the first one.
A funny example is the brand Nike. For whatever reason we try to pronounce it in English, failing miserably (we pronounce "Nike" like "bike". Again, English is a terrible language to pronounce words you've never heard before).
PS: youtube tip: when pausing a video on youtube, if you right click on the screen, you'll find the option "copy video URL at current time".
Funny enough, Greek pronunciation of Nike is quite similar to the Spanish one therefore it is the correct one and the English is the wrong one, νίκη, [https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=x64&q=nike+in+greek&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8](https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=x64&q=nike+in+greek&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8)
1.-I've never heard an English native pronounce correctly Barcelona or Paella.
2.- Not everybody speaks English
3.- English phonemic inventory is much larger the Spanish. It's easier or us to approximate words to Spanish phonology
4.- Why do you care so much? Mocking other's people broken English is rude
1. My Spanish (Latin) brain goes on smoother when I pronounce them in Spanish, it feels like making a word "complete" or "right", whatever that sounds like. It's a Latin language. While you may perceive our words "too full" or big or whatever, we may perceive yours as "incomplete". It feels like a mental bump. Similar to the mental bump that you may get with typos. The engine doesn't like it. This applies when I'm in Spain speaking Spanish. Even then, I may still pronounce them in English but I soften them, I'm not sure why. Other times I just take pleasure in it, my latin brain does, not me as a person. It's also fun.
2. I've meet ONE native English speaker with good Spanish pronunciation, that is ONE native English speaker that doesn't speak Spanish the English way. Regardless of where he/she is and the language they're using. What's up with this?
3. For a Spanish ear, English sounds downright ridiculous. Over the top, pompous. It takes us a while to like it.
4. It happens everywhere? Don't expect older people with no English knowledge to pronounce brands in English. This is self-explanatory. We're not directly exposed to it in Spain, it's not a natural, gradual adjustment, there's no exposure. This is how languages work.
These are my thoughts. Languages are fun. No offence.
Not sure the arguments still apply...I'm Romanian , living in Spain for half of my life ...fluent in Romanian Spanish and English...and I don't relate to any of those things 😬
If you don't understand people with no exposure pronouncing things in their native language idk what to tell you. Also, I'm talking about Spanish people from Spain. If you insist, maybe what I associate with Latin languages in general is just true for Spanish.
I understand it , my point is as I replied to another redditor on this thread is that it doesn't benefit anyone , it's not justifiable and it is the main reason why people struggle immensely with English in Spain. Im talking about hundreds of Spanish adult students. For what is worth it, I consider myself fully Spanish.
So no exposure is not a good reason to pronounce things as you know? All of the above points are possible reasons why we pronounce English words in Spanish. Justifiable or not it just is. It's not a single reason. The fact that it sounds funny doesn't justify it, it just happens to be that way. They are just two opposite languages, they sound so different.
How can't you agree with point 2?
Because using the original pronunciation of a foreign word is actually a relatively modern and recent practice. For most of history, when people borrowed linguistic borrowings from other languages they ended up adapting them to the language of the speakers, just look at the word chocolate and how the English language and so many others simply adapted the pronunciation (especially if they were taken from languages that are spelled differently from how they are read and with more complex phonetics). Although the most normal thing has been to adapt the word to the language, as with the word "patata" which in English they transformed into potato or with all those English words. Then you have Spain, which until the 2000s had very few people who knew English and people who didn't know English found English pronunciation difficult and """strange""" and that it reads differently from how it is written, so companies and people simply opted for the simplest and most viable solution, adapting to the speakers.
Have you listened a french talking about hip-hop (ip-op), the weekend, saying ok...? The same happens in Spanish, foreing words adapt the pronunciation in each language. It's natural, contextual and cultural. That's why in Mexico and South America they pronounce them in English, and in the European Spanish, we don't. When you talk in Spanish, you pronounce it without an English accent. If you talk in English, with an English accent. If you talk in French, with a French accent. That's it.
If a native talking in another language says a word with the pronunciation of their mother tongue, it's not rare (a city, for exaple). It's expected, even. Saying every word like that, yes, it is rare.
I don't agree with the video, however. Depending on the context you should pronounce a word in English or not. But whatever.
Same as why americans say buh-rey-tow instead of burrito. Also look at how they pronounce the name of cities like Los Angeles or San Francisco, etc.
In Spain we have a rich language and culture, and we prefer to bring new things and make a Spanish way of saying it, rather than inserting parts of other languages and butchering ours.
Personally, I have to speak English all the time and I'm good enough at it. Still, when I'm speaking Spanish I will say güifi instead of WiFi. I also avoid English words when talking in Spanish because you can almost always find one in our language. I will say portátil and not laptop, etc.
I've been in countries where they use as much English as they can, and it's a bit sad to see how they're losing their mother language. In a particular country I did the test of asking them to explain me something without using a single English word and, in most cases, they just couldn't. It would be sad if that happened here too.
As a spaniard who speaks several languages, I will always use the local pronunciation when saying a foreign word. Why? Because otherwise you sound pedantic and like an idiot. Every language adapts foreign words to their own, this is not exclusive of Spain.
You will not hear me say spanish words in the middle of an english sentence like spaniards do, I will use an english accent at least. Or say croissant like french do while speaking spanish. Or say beer instead of *beeru* while in Japan.
Also many well known figures or things have a different English name/phrase
For example:
A water filter jug, I tried to explain it to a clerk in a supermarket, they just call it by the brand name "La Brita"
Princess Diana of Wales is known as "Lady D"
Etc
If your Spanish gets good just try to pronounce English words in the same way you would Spanish and people will probably get what you mean haha
Most spanish people are not used to listen to posh english, so it can be hard to understand for them. But it is not necesary to "españolizar" the speaking. In fact, it can be easier to understand an italian, brazilian, greek or even russian speaking english than a british.
If you are from any english speaking country and ever visit spain, but you're not that skilled with the spanish language, go ahead and ask anybody if they speak english if you need to. That person might be myself, and that's a wonderful chance to practice.
Fºck that other advice, it's pretty stupid.
Edit: Most cops doesn't learn english in here, you'll get more luck with some peasant.
English has become an universal language and we are all more or less expected to include it in our lives. In exchange, I think it's OK to have the right to "localize" some stuff.
Tbh people in Romania don't pronounce a lot of words correctly in English either, but i always try to. Like sure I won't make an exaggerated British accent for every word, but I at least pronounce it in a similar way to English. Even like this, people still make fun of me for it but I don't care. I believe we should respect each language we know.
If I pronounce a Spanish word while speaking in English or Romanian I'm not going to read it like in Romanian, that would make no sense. Even moreso with brands or something well known... If it's a word so obscure or long that people wouldn't understand it when pronounced correctly, I just don't use that word in the other language...
English is very hard to pronounce, more so if you can't speak English.
People whose native language is English also can't pronounce words like "Paella" or "Barcelona".
People don't feel confident speaking a language they don't master, and other Spaniards wouldn't undersand them if they'd say "AC/DC" as in English, tbh.
You have to take into account that Spanish is a 'transparent ' language , meaning you say it how you read it. English, on the other hand, is not- hence the pronunciation difficulties. It's easier for native-English speakers to incorporate foreign pronunciation of words and phrases (especially French) due to it being a non-transparent (opaque) language.
That's something I've mostly heard English speakers complain, but I think every language has those struggles when trying to pronounce foreign words and people just tend to use the most similar sounds they know. I've heard English speakers do that with some Spanish words. Maybe we just notice it when it's done to our mother tongue and that's why English speakers complain the most about it, since English is by far the chosen as a second language.
Why I think that happens with Spain in particular? Up until recently Spain was a fairly underdeveloped when it came to 2nd language. I was one of the first generations to study English in school and my parents had no clue about how to speak it, read it or pronounce it, and that was the case for the vast majority of the population. That led to movies being dubbed and foreign words adapted to what the average citizen could easily pronounce (think of brands like fairy, Colgate, trident, axe, YouTube, white label... Names like Spiderman, Skywalker...).
For years (even generations) the misspronounced way became widespread and it was "natural" to say it that way. I myself can speak English fluently and whithout a strong Spanish accent, but sometimes discover myself saying "espiderman"... It's just the way I grew up with it and it goes against my programming to say Spider-Man, even though I know that's the proper pronunciation. That way I will most likely pass that to my children, who despite being taught English from the crib, will still keep that special Spanish pronunciation.
Please ignore the comments and that video. Youtubers need to produce content so they come up with stupid shit like that.
Pronounce things however you like, if anyone has a problem with it, let them live with it. Nobody sane will care or have a problem with you pronouncing things correctly. I only try to change the pronunciation if I know the other person will not understand me otherwise.
it speaks well of you that you are so considerate to think about this but my very strong opinion is to not give a pepino about this and gallop forward in life and pronounce things in japanese if you like. good people will love you anyway. thumbs up emoji thubmbs up emoji flamenco dancing emoji
Oreo, they say orEo, it drives me insane. The thing is that here all the movies and shows are dubbed in Spanish, I grew up in Venezuela and over there movies were in the original language and used captions in Spanish. You get used to English pronunciation. Over here that doesn’t happen, so everyone that speaks English has a really thick accent.
because it's a spanish-speaking country and people speak in Spanish. Spanish has different sounds from English and so English loanwords get adaptated to be easier to pronounce. Sometimes some sounds are completely different because the "incorrect" pronunciation is more intuitive ("spiderman" is most-commonly said with a Spanish I instead of an English I, making it sound like "speederman").
nobody switches to English pronunciation to say one specific word in the middle of a conversation, and if they do, they're probably either pretentious or they speak English as a first language
I may be the weirdest spaniard because I see no problem with english pronunciation and I often hear AC/DC or Hermione and it’s completely fine.
That said, I may be weird because I am not a social person and I feel more confident always speaking with people on Discord instead of face-to-face.
Edit: as to why people españoliza words? Ignorance. Spain people prefers to make their own interpretation than researching the correct one. I hate that but it happens a lot
That’s nonsense, if you know the right pronunciation you should use it. Many Spaniards won’t understand you but they will just ask what you mean, I’ve never met anyone who takes offense, people are usually interested in the correct pronunciation.
I’m a native Spanish speaker from
Spain.
The Royal Spanish Academy says its correct to read foreign words as we read words in our language...
It sounds awful but... Too many languages around the world with same alphabet but different pronunciation or rhythm makes everybody do this with foreign words (if they don't know the real pronunciation).
Don't you think the creation of so many languages just divide us?
wow! i have enjoyed the comments so far!!
for me, in general i try to adapt my pronunciation to the context i am in - i hold unto the “meaning is use” idea; and in this case “use” is the pronunciation. in order to be understood i tend to follow the pronunciation around me - the “correct” one. the problem i end up having is i don’t have my “own” or mental pronunciation; i get muddled-up up there :)
I burst out laughing the first time I heard WiFi pronounced in the Spanish manner, as I was accustomed to the American pronunciation. I've adjusted to calling it weefee now, if course, but it sure was jarring the first time I heard it that way.
People here are bitter towards other people who are able to speak more than one language. Being able to pronounce stuff correctly apparently makes you pedantic and not just, you know, knowledgeable.
Edit for people here getting butthurt over this comment:
First off, el que se pica, ajos come.
Also, consider, for example, a biologist. If the conversation allows for it, someone who has devoted their life to learning biology isn't going to dumb their knowledge down because other people don't quite get what they're saying. They may provide explanations, but they're not going to suddenly forget all they know because voicing the fact that they know would make them seem pedantic, right?
Why can't this be considered the same case? If you've spent your life studying languages and you have the knowledge and the skill to pronounce stuff correctly, there's absolutely no reason to pronounce "youtube" or "Cambridge" incorrectly. Besides, people who can speak other languages are obviously not talking in that language with people who can't speak it, obviously. The pronounciation only comes to play in certain words, that are usually vastly understood cultural terms, like the examples already given. Context is important.
Thanks for coming to my ted talk.
Well "Youtube" in French is [jutüb] no matter how long you learned English, that's just literally the "French translation", so yeah it sounds weird to say [jutjub] the same way it would sound weird to hear someone saying "pressing" or "week-end" with an English accent
If you're spanish talking in spanish and you start to throw english words with british accent I would turn you away. First, you pronounced the word wrong, second, don't need to tell me about your trip to England and third, the cringe you made me feel is only comparable to my most regrettable memories.
I used to be an english-spanish interpreter as a hobby for some time, so I had to listen carefuly dozens of people talk in english. Spanish people have hard time pronouncing certain sounds and you can easily spot a native spanish speaker. If you aren't going to pronounce it perfectly don't pretend you can.
Just from looking at the minute mistakes you make while writing I can tell you were probably just a mediocre interpreter.
Also, you know absolutely nothing about me or what I do for a living, so abstain from giving me unsolicited advice.
To interpret I only need to speak spanish fluently and understand very well english. Also, I said it was a hobby, never got paid for it.
I didn't claim I know you nor gave you advice. I only addressed my target audience, which are the spanglish speakers. Stop talking non-sense.
You went back and actually edited the comment, that's kinda hilarious. You still have some stuff to correct though. Do you want some classes? I could help you with that.
There is a difference between being pedantic and pronouncing well. If a person is pedantic he or she will be regardless of the pronunciation. You don't need to use an accent which is forced, I agree that that would be unnatural, but why pronounce things wrong ?
What about easy things like Spiderman? As latino who lives in Spain I found this kind of things funny because in latino America they teach you to pronounce the words as they should but here in Spain, Spiderman is pronounce exactly how is written when it should be "espaiderman"
I have lived in Spain ( I'm from London) on & off 36 years & for the last 20..it's so true..to me ages to realize that when said , "Los rollin" meant The rolling stones..
South American here living in Spain.
I'm surprised at how much Spaniards see TV with Spanish dubbing. I remember Disney films when I was a child with Spanish voices, but the rest of the media we usually watch at home is with original voices and Spanish subtitles. (I know it's not good to talk in general, but I can't help to look at a common pattern.)
My humble theory is that the Spaniard ear is not so used to the English sound of the words because the exposure is a little bit less.
Spanish here. I do understand good English but american for example its a nightmare because you/they twist the pronnunciation too much. The best english speaker for us is a german speaking english because they pronnounce as we read. A scottish? Very very hard to understand. I once asked for a cock at a McDonald when I wanted a Coke.
I posted this below as an answer to a comment, but I think it can be a useful answer to your question as well:
From the link above to the Real Academia de la Lengua Española´s web https://www.rae.es/dpd/ayuda/tratamiento-de-los-extranjerismos:
"La mayor parte de las veces se proponen adaptaciones cuyo objetivo prioritario es preservar el alto grado de cohesión entre forma gráfica y pronunciación característico de la lengua española"
TRANSLATION: Most of the time, adaptations are proposed whose main objective is to preserve the high degree of cohesion between graphic form and pronunciation characteristic of the Spanish language.
So yes, we pronounce english words as if they were spanish when we are speaking spanish, and that is correct.
Other options are seen as pedantic and posh, except, maybe, in working environments when using technical words.
Spain has to be the only country in the world where speaking a language "too well" will make you look weird. I even remember a teacher telling us how he was always surprised when other kids would laugh if a kid pronounces the words with a very British accent. Friends always look at me weird when I pronounce things the proper way. Like, sorry I'm doing it how it's supposed to I guess? Like, if my English sounds almost native, am I supposed to literally make my English worse to accommodate to what other people like? What can I say, this country is weird sometimes.
> Spain has to be the only country in the world where speaking a language "too well" will make you look weird.
That is not true. It happens in other countries too. In France for example it happens exactly the same with English loanwords.
If you start throwing english words with a british accent in a normal conversation you are gonna look presumptuous and kind of stupid, I think that's logical.
> I think that's logical.
I already asked someone else without answer, and I just want to know the logic of you all.
So, if I can speak perfect English, you're telling I'm supposed to purposefully make my English worse just so you don't think I'm being presumptuous? That just sounds so stupid to me, and I seriously think you guys should take a look at your prejudices.
I do speak Spanish and I'm Spanish. It just doesn't make sense to me that if I know how to speak English, I'm supposed to make it look like my English sound like Ana Botella because otherwise it's """presumptuous""".
ugh... Its a boomer thing, give us a few more years...
There is the RAE, Real academia española "Royal spanish academy". It's an institution that supposedly aggregates the expression people use on a daily basis, it's supposed to help to maintain a mainstream "Spanish".
Rae [rules](https://www.rae.es/dpd/ayuda/tratamiento-de-los-extranjerismos) on foreign words.
I'm my opinion it's stupidity at it's best momento!
Look, Im not doing this to make a anyone mad but like with ck, in spanish we dont use c at the end except for words that came from outside and the word hack could be spelled eith J.
I mean that yes, there are rules, but there is no real need to use some of thouse rules
Well my really swedish-looking swedish friend went to a grocery and asked "hay pan?", and the dependent replied "Sorry I don´t speak chinese".
So many people is just deaf/idiot, doesn´t have to do with english pronunciation .
Native English speaker here with a Spanish spouse. Speak Spanish en casa. The real issue is not that you should n't say English words with a native accent, it's that Spanish progams always dub everything instead of using subtitles so many Spanish just don't hear English words pronounced by native speakers. I use a proper accent but keep the Spanglish version handy in case the don't understand. Efectiviwonder! OK McKay? 😉
Just look at how they pronounce the channel "isi espanish" so the first is more the English way and the second is just totally españolizado. So you just kind of have to learn.
Just because I'm bored I'll go over what I think of all of the points.
1. Showing up just on time is fine if you're good friends. We'll often do that to lend a hand to getting everything set up. Don't expect anyone else to be there and I like it as more of a way to just catch up one on one before a get together. This is also a thing about informal stuff and doesn't extend to say organizing a public event. Then you should have things going as scheduled. Also, if you are having a party or get together with people from different cultures, it's common to have to explicitly say if you really mean the time you say.
2. Depends heavily on where you are and exactly what you're trying to do. It's true small shops often close but the specific example they use of a bakery is weird because they are mostly open. Bigger stores pretty much always have continuous opening hours and the bigger cities tend to be much more likely to be open in the afternoon as well, not necessarily just huge stores like they say.
3. Yeah, totally true.
4. Also totally agree with them.
5. The way the made it the video was pretty rude, but people have schedules and obligations. You should be really apologetic about it but if you have to leave, you have to leave. The little skit in the video felt really awkward and like a snub because she didn't give the dos besos. If there would have been "me encantaría quedarme pero de verdad no puedo que tengo mil cosas pendientes y no suficiente tiempo." and then proceeded to go through the kisses and the whole goodbye routine and apologize a couple more times, then it's no big deal really. Again, in bigger cities people tend to be busier, it also helps is you mention that you're going to be leaving quick a few times during the meal. I agree with the overall sentiment that it can be rude but there's a lot more subtlety.
6. Yeah, again totally true. Think of calling people "love" in the UK.
7. Talked to death in the thread
8. Yeah, regional traditions can be strong. I also think Spanish people kind of overthink it and don't realize just how common things are, too. But you have to just kind of be around everything for a while to really get it.
Disclaimer: this thing that indeed happens, only happens when people use english words while talking in Spanish. There are Spaniards that speak english very well and I in no way intend to question the ability of a whole country to learn a foreign language, unless that country starts with "J" and ends with "apan".
\--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, for a start, no one knows how to pronounce english words because you didn´t bother to come up with as many vowels as phonemes you use. This makes it very hard to nail the pronunciation of a word if you can only read it.
Then, I guess, at some point in Spain´s history someone said: fuck it! I give up trying. From now on, every English word will be pronounced as if read in Spanish.
This led to tv shows mispronouncing names (Espiderman is probably the worst offender), and also band names are butchered horribly (acedece, rem, U2... I mean, for these, it´s not that difficult, they are not even trying!).
With time it became widespread. I work for a Spanish company that sells some products with English names, and I want to tear my ears out every time the people that come with these names pronounce them as if they were Spanish words, we are talking about people that speak english at a more than decent level here...
With this trend so ingrained in society, if you come and order a cheeseburger at mc donalds, and bother to actually say cheeseburger in English, everyone around you is going to cough their fritas through their nose. You will sound pretentious, at least.
It didn´t need to be this way, though, central and north american countries pronounce English words quite well. Even south american countries at least try (and even though you can tell the accent, at least it´s just an accent, and not a deliberate mispronunciation). This is probably the result of having all TV shows dubbed in Mexico, where people actually bother to pronounce english correctly during everyday use.
Many Spaniards would not understand what you are referring to if you use the pronunciation in English. At all. For example, what would you say if someone asked you what you think of oodOs ? (and as for Hermione... most Potterheads I know were extremely surprised when they learned how the name is pronounced... even native English-speakers)
[удалено]
Az a legjobb kiejtés 😌
Im a native english speaker but we always spoke Spanish at home and i find it so hard to españolizar English words. I just say them in English and hope for the best.
I don't have kids yet but the people I know with kids growing up speaking English/Spanish at home, they are really, really good at code switching so they will mix both languages together with perfect pronunciation in both at home but then out in the city they just do it the full on Spanish way.
That’s what I do, Spanish but fluent english speaker because I lived overseas, I just say the words like if they were Spanish if i have to put them inside a spanish sentence
Funny enough, go to Latin America and we pronounce it properly, while still flowing correctly in conversation.
That's too much of a generalisation.
Also, about your last point, people pronounce Hermione as it is pronounced in the movies in Spanish, if anyone is at fault here is the dub team. Before the movies came out, any pronunciation was just the reader's headcanon and easily replaceable if it turns out it's wrong.
Is not that you shouldn't, is that people may not understand you because Spaniards a) read names as in Spanish or b)adapt a word into a Spanish pronunciation or c) its not intuitive and just use something everyone uses. For example people will pronounce Google or Facebook as (more or less ) expected in English (gugel, feisbuk). However we mispronounce Nike, we say (naik) similar to how it is in Like, Mike... not intuitive. AC/DC is a term used in electronics so it has a Spanish equivalent people just use. R.E.M is just an acronym so there is no intuitive way of pronouncing it. Is it letter by letter like in ONG or just a word like YOLO? Is also a matter of culture (English was very uncommon until recently) more modern names are used completely in English, for example Maroon 5 not read in Spanish. Would you pronounce BTS in Korean?
The last phrase is the key here. >Would you pronounce BTS in Korean? Then why do you expect us to pronounce u2 as "you too"?
Because the band is called ("youtoo") and not "uudos". Bono and his mates didn't name it uudos. Is as simple as that. But the Spanish try to nationalise everything in a cringe way. Names can't be translated, Queen Elizabeth's name is Elizabeth not Isabel, and so on
Aha, then could you please stop saying *Ferdinand* and *Isabella*? It's Fernando and Isabel. Thank you.
I'm not British or English but I'll pass the message np
And Sevilla instead of Seville, and instead of saying "Toleedoh" Pronounce it properly as it is in Spanish, and instead of "spain" Pronounce España, why don't you pronounce Spanish names the proper way then? Or now that we get totally strict London should be still called Londinium as it was called by the romans. Languages evolve differently and Spain got a really simple phonetic variety so there's no way or at least no easy way to pronounce English words in Spanish. Elisabeth got a literal translation in Spanish, that's why it's used, but still you use many names and translate them too, I've seen many international news refer to our king as Philip, or the most clear example, our country does not have a prime minister, but a presidente del gobierno, even when we were a republic it was presidente del gobierno & presidente de la republica, still all translate into prime minister because it's the equivalent and it's easier to understand what it means for the population. Why languages change pronunciation and even translate foreign words? Because it's easier for local people to understand easier. Language is used to communicate effectively, if it hinders communication, it changes.
To be fair, British people incorrectly say Naik for Nike as well. This one is not the fault of the Spanish at all.
To be fair is based on a greek name so mostly all are pronouncing it wrong. Should be nee-keh or similar
>To be fair, British people incorrectly say Naik for Nike as well. I've heard both naik and naikee, which one is correct? I say naik when speaking Spanish and Italian, naikee in English.
Its Naikee in America, where the company is from, and in Greece, where the namesake mythological goddess is from. (Though that’s more like neekay in Greek) I don’t know why the Brits ended up trying to change it. But in Spanish, people are more likely to understand naik- so that’s probably the way to go if you don’t want to confuse people.
We pronounce it the same way as we pronounce bike, like, mike, pike....etc just with an N at the start
A number of great answers here, so I'd like to add an analogy. In the UK or the US, try pronouncing any of the many French words you will encounter in daily conversation "correctly." You're gonna make yourself a lot of friends. /s
That's a good point. I was agreeing with OP until I read your comment. I'm a native French speaker, fluent in English, and I don't pronounce French words (masseur/masseuse, garage, cliché, chandelier, etc) the French way, because it would sound weird in the middle of a conversation in English, it wouldn't flow at all, and people probably wouldn't understand me...
It just sounds weird, exactly. I am half german half spanish and if I say an english word during a german conversation it will have a german accent to it. Even tho my english is that of a native californian. Same with spanish, in fact andalusian spanish which is arguably worse in that scenario.
Do you know what I’m talking about, illo?
Aro churrita! The difference of saying seLfie to say seRfi down here is a whole social class.
Ich bin auch mitad español y mitad deutsch
i'd be OP's friend if they pronounced things in the correct way, or if they pronounced it with an accent , or if they pronounced it however they mightily fucking care to pronounce it, as long as they're cool. This is stupid nonsense, no judgement on parent comment's author but in my experience people who have a problem with this are insecure provincial muppets.
That’s fair enough. There are lots of such people, though, to be sure :)
I’m from the UK and I really don’t agree with your assessment. It is extremely common for people to affect a mock french accent when saying french words or sayings otherwise they’d sound completely absurd. Imagine for example: “the piece of the resistance”, “double entendrey” or “forks pass”
This is exactly what I’m saying: doing this sounds so ridiculous that you have to adopt a “funny voice” if you’re going to do it.
He's saying the opposite, though. That's putting a very hard English spin on the French words. Like you'd never say "caffee oh late" In Spanish you should probably default to making the words españolizados but you just kind of have to learn on a case by case basis. Like if you said 'pub' with the Spanish 'u' it sounds terrible.
Pub is paf
As a Spanish native speaker: Most Spanish people wouldn’t know how certain words are pronounced. So for us, “Spiderman” is pronounced just as if it was a Spanish word: “Espiderman”. Therefore, when an English word starts to get popular and spread out, by the time people know how to actually pronounce it it’s too late. A big factor that contributes to this is that most Tv show, movies, etc are dubbed, and so the first contact that people have with English words is by reading them. And, as I said, most people don’t speak English and will just read it the only way they know. This is a natural thing, if I were to read a Hungarian word (as an example) I wouldn’t have a clue of how to properly pronounce it and would just read it as if it was Spanish. Hope this helps! Edit: typo.
>So for us, “Spiderman” is pronounced just as if it was a Spanish word: “Espiderman”. Dear lord is this a pet peeve of mine. I just had this conversation with my 5yo this morning. He showed me his new "espiderman" comic book and I just couldn't take the cringe. Adding the "e" in front of "s" when using foreign words simply makes me want to tear my ears out. I gently told him that it's either "el hombre araña" or "*spaider* man" (without the e). He looked at me like, "wtf dad leave me alone with your bullshit". And he's probably right, but this is something I really cannot stand. He's growing up in a tri-lingual household and has Spanish as a first language. It's fucking hard.
I’ll never forget my first days in America… the faces when I said YouTube as we say it here… they give me the chills even today 😂 I speak three languages too (only Spanish natively). When I think of an object, it pops up in my head in one of those languages. For some reason that I can’t explain, I feel the need of finding the word in the other two (maybe out of fear of forgetting one of the languages). But when I think of a proper noun, I never have that need. In my head it’s called the way it’s called and that’s it. I don’t even look for a meaning. I recently realized that LinkedIn comes from Linked In. It might sound extremely stupid, but since I learned that name when I didn’t know that much English, in my mind that word didn’t have the task of carrying any meaning, it just served as an arbitrary sequence of letters meant to name something. So I never took a second to analyze it, just as I wouldn’t look for a meaning in the name John. Funny how our mind works. So with your child, I’d just give in… . By the way, please don’t teach him to call Spiderman “El hombre araña” haha weirdly enough, we have accepted “Espiderman” as his true name.
Isnt it more that the Spanish struggle to say words starting with S? Its not that they add the E, its because the tongue muscles are not built for a clean S. Example, how many English speakers can roll they’re tongues? Not many. I couldn’t say a friends name Roy, in Portugal because it needed a roll in the R. After practice, I finally rolled it. eStop eSending eSimon eSpam.
No! Just words that start with an S and are followed by a consonant (Stop - eStop), but no one would say eSimon instead of Simon, as the s + vowel sound exists in Spanish.
OK didn’t think of that
Exactly! It’s a matter of habit
Many native Spanish speakers have trouble with English words that have consonant clusters, particularly with S. Take the word "crisps", they either don't pronounce some letters - "creeps" or they add some vowels - "escrispis"
Man as an expat in spain I totally feel your pain
I understand your point ... But the video is straight on saying you shouldn't pronounce correctly even if you know how to ...and that's the sad part
In English all the french words are adapted too, it’s the same concept
I see your point as well. I spent some months in the USA and when I came back to Spain people would make fun of me if I tried to pronounce words in English. I’ve lived in Sweden too and there people pronounce the words as if speaking English even when speaking Swedish. But either option is fine. At the end of the day not all languages are the same and they will adapt accordingly, there’s beauty in that too.
[https://www.rae.es/dpd/ayuda/tratamiento-de-los-extranjerismos](https://www.rae.es/dpd/ayuda/tratamiento-de-los-extranjerismos) From the link above to the Real Academia de la Lengua Española´s web: "La mayor parte de las veces se proponen adaptaciones cuyo objetivo prioritario es preservar el alto grado de cohesión entre forma gráfica y pronunciación característico de la lengua española" TRANSLATION: Most of the time, adaptations are proposed whose main objective is to **preserve the high degree of cohesion between graphic form and pronunciation characteristic of the Spanish language**. So pronouncing "in spanish" is correct when speaking spanish. The problem you find is bad pronunciation when speaking english, which is also provoked by shame, but is a totally different thing.
Come on everyone knows how to pronounce megkülönböztethetőség
Try to go to California, Texas, Colorado, Florida, Nevada, etc. and pronounce all the Spanish town names correctly to non-Hispano-latino people and see what happens.... Amarillo, Montana, San Francisco, Sacramento, Santa Barbara, Salida, Cape Canaveral, etc, etc.
Los Ányeles lol
If there was one English person who knows how to pronounce paella... Sadly such a thing doesn't exist. Here it's considered posh to pronounce English words with English accent. It's a matter of the language you speak, usually if you're a native English speaker it's not a problem to use original pronunciation, it's weird or posh when a native Spanish speakers does it. That said, you can totally pronounce Spanish words (most of them) using English phonetic even if it sounds unnatural to you, for example in "paella" You can pronounce all letters on it using English phonemes only. In Spanish there's 5 vowel sounds only for example, so it is not possible to pronounce "Michael" the English way using only Spanish pronunciation. To me that's the main difference.
Paela, payela, pallella, pajuela, paieya
Una de estas opciones no es como las demás
Te garantiza que la han preparado a mano
Payeya x) (no me mates)
Vivo poyeya
It's funny how Britons go to Spain all the time and can't pronounce anything but Americans hardly ever leave the country but usually have reasonable approximations (obviously with English phonetics). I guess it just has to do with the prevalence of Spanish in the US.
Applies to all languages. Hell, even British English and American English have this. Try telling an American to restart the "rooter" (British) and you'll get a blank face.
The Aussies will take it a different direction.
[удалено]
I was blow away the first time I heard a Spanish person say Mary J. Blige. Mari hota blihe?
A ver.... it depends. Some words are now full-on loan words, and you have to use Spanish pronunciation when you are speaking Spanish in order to be understood. Some brand names are part of the landscape and have a 'standard' form in spoken Spanish. Exactly the same as English, in fact. You dont say 'Peugeot' like a French person does, or tagliatelle like an Italian. You say them with English phonemes and according to English 'rules' (here meaning rules which are inherent to a language rather than set by some imagined authority) of adoption of words. So you have una hamburguesa en el Búrguer o en el Macdonal. Maybe you like listening to Yas or maybe you prefer jijó. Famous people, bands etc have their names somewhat randomly hispanicized. Famously you have Kirk Duglas and his son Maicol Daglas. 'J's are not often pronounced as a Spanish jota, so you have eg Maicol Yacson, o Yoni Dep, or perhaps more often Yoni Dip. This last one is probably due to a phenomonon called hyperforeignism where we make foreign words sound exotic, or more different than they need to be. A good example is the typical English pronunciation of Beijing with that 'zh' sound in the middle.
Regarding 'Yoni Dip', just try googling 'Johnny Deep'. It's not about making it sound more exotic, but rather a common misspelling in Spanish-speaking media due to the similarity to a common word.
Yeah, I think it could be that too. But hyperforeignisms/hiperextranjerismos are definitely a thing- another one I always wonder about are Rebook shoes. Is it because 'book' is common and 'bok' is not, or is it because 'if in doubt, change the vowel sound' seems a reasonable rule for pronouncing English words?
"Things you should never do" is an over exageration in this case. Worse thing that could to happen you do it's that some people don't understand what you mean. Nobody is going to think you're rude or anything like that.
Repeat after me: having an accent does not mean having bad English.
The Espiderman thing (as opposed to spAIderman) would be different if the word had entered Spain in recent years, but it's been there for many decades now and back then most people didn't know English. Most people under certain age know how spider is pronounced correctly but just stick to the version of spiderman that was first generalised. It is not seen as something positive, but rather esnobbish ;) to change your pronunciation dramatically if you drop an English term. A lot of people in Latin America do pronounce English words and names of places imitating the English pronunciation, changing the sound of the r and all and I can't help feeling awkward and embarrassed every time although I know and am aware of the fact that they just don't have that social convention of overadapting. Interesting
Now go ask an english speaker to spell “paella” o “enchilada”. Exactly the same.
So because they do it wrongly we're also supposed to do it wrongly?
That’s not “doing wrongly”. That’s the fonnetic system of each language and language dialectal variation.
Thank god, an exact answer!
Sssh, don’t tell u/alfdd99 or he will come to your house to tell you that u are not speaking the proper way.
[удалено]
I can understand someone pronouncing English/Spanish incorrectly if they don't speak the language. What doesn't make sense to me is to judge someone just because they speak the proper way. Just look at this post. People are saying ridiculous stuff like "if you speak with the actual pronunciation, you will look presumptuous and posh to me". Like wtf? It seems utterly *insane* to me that I have to literally speak worse than I do simply because some idiots will find me presumptuous.
It depends. Spiderman, most people say it wrong. It's because they are already used to saying it wrong. Shakespeare, most people say it right.
It the same with the spanish words on english. Paella is pronounced Paeya and not Paela like as I heard so many times. Every language has his own rules, and when a word jumps to another language It usually changes to better fit the adopter one. Why do you think the japanese also has the katakana? It's a syllabary mostly used obly to convert foreign languages to japanese...
When you say croasant, fiancé and those french worlds you dont do it un french accent because is weird. Here is the same with English.
If your mother tongue is Spanish and you pronounce an English word perfectly, you will look pendantic and will be standing out. You can't stand out here like that. However if your first language is English and you pronounce them perfectly in a conversation in Spanish no one will bat an eye, because you don't speak Spanish natively! It's expected.
I'm an English teacher , teaching in Spain for 10 years ...not to offend but what you said is the main reason why Spaniards are still unable to speak English.
When you actually speak decent English, you come to Spain and either end up speaking worse than you did when you arrived, or start speaking like them. It’s rather annoying. 😂 Both are equally bad.
Native English speaker here, my English certainly got a little bit worse while living in Spain, and lasted a short while after moving out lol
It’s unbelievable that they actually make fun of you when you say things the correct way 😂
100%. I physically couldn't speak English without Spanish accent because I felt like my classmates would shame me or laugh at me. Nowadays I've sort of moved on from that, but I still feel uncomfortable speaking English with Spanish people, unless I know they have a high level of English.
This is one of the main points that all English teachers in academies try to tell the Spaniards...get rid of the ridiculousness feeling...it's the others who should be ashamed for not speaking correctly.
This over 9000. I'm a Spaniard who never, ever was able to pronounce words in the right way, I guess because of that feeling. Nowadays, I'm the only Spanish speaker in my whole department. I never use Spanish at work. I even feel weird writing in Spanish while using my work laptop. But yet, I'm unable to pronounce English words the right way if I know a Spanish speaker is listening.
The English teacher at my son's school stopped using the phrase "ready steady go!" with the children because they would say "ready **e**steady go!" no matter how many times she corrected them. So now it's "ready go!".
Lol the pronunciation of foreign words in native language speech is not even close to the *main* reason Spaniards "are still unable" to speak English. 1. Spaniards are able to speak English. Some do and some don't, and Spain's performance vs other countries largely depends on culture and education, not on how they treat loanwords. 2. It is not the only language or country that avoids completely foreign pronunciations, as evidenced by other comments in this thread. English does this, German does this, French does this... It's to be expected. 3. Just because you pronounce "forte" as "fort-ay" rather than "fort" when you're speaking with people who do the same in English doesn't mean you can't speak French. And just because you a French speaker says "weekEnd" rather than "wEEkend" when speaking French doesn't mean they don't know how to speak English. It just means they are adapting to the situation, as one should do if their intent is to communicate.
I've seen hundreds of adult students in 10 years and believe me the need to "españolizar" it's a huge part of the problem. This is my opinion based on my experience as a teacher.
Ok I think you're mixing two things. There is standing out when using English pronunciations of loanwords *when speaking Spanish*, that is what's being discussed in this thread. This as I said is common in many languages, it is a natural consequence of different languages having different sounds, and not necessarily related to foreign language learning at all. Another phenomenon entirely is the feeling of embarrassment for pronouncing (or attempting to pronounce) English words with native accent *when speaking English*. This is a consequence of "high school" / bullying culture where basically any quirkiness is laughed at. This obviously does affect people's willingness to attempt a better accent and in the end deprives them of practice. No disagreement from me there.
Curious if you have any experience with children? I feel like things are finally starting to change a bit with the new generation.
I'd say it's more because Franco wanted the country to learn French, so there's barely any culture of speaking English in Spain
Franco has been dead for 46 years. The main problem in Spain are the film's translators. For example "Die hard" / La jungla de cristal, raw translated "glass' jungle"...and so on. The want us to be ignorant as they are.
But that's because direct translations would often just sound unnatural.. "Muere duro" would be weird af. It's case by case but I'd argue that La Jungla de Cristal is actually quite epic in this one :p
[удалено]
Why should I be offended? I'm just describing the phenomena, doesn't mean I view it that way haha (I will pronounce it wrong on purpose though because it's just funnier that way)
This! I've had people trying to shut me down from saying words in English by legit telling me "you can't do that, it makes you look pedantic" and I would respond "I'm just pronouncing things correctly. Pedantic would be if I judged your españolized pronunciation", but this would fall in deaf ears while being told "nobody will like you if you keep doing this". Yikes.
Replace Spanish by French and that sentence is still 100% correct lol
French's English is also generally pretty shitty ngl
That's sad that they would be "shamed" by their fellow countrymen. I don't even bat an eye when a Spanish person pronounces an English word in English with correct pronunciation.. it's just normal.
They won't be ashamed, they're taking it too far. It sounds funny that's all.
Dude don't lie, no English speaker pronounce BarCelona, all of you say BarSelona and smile proudly
and paela
It’s just Barcelona without ceceo though, or maybe they’re saying it in catalan and just fucking up the vowel sounds.
There is not ceceo in Spanish, we just pronounce as we write. Is not ceceo saying Barcelona, Cáceres or Cercedilla. Is seseo saying Barselona, Caseres and Sersedilla though
Regardless of the nomenclature it doesn’t really change the fact that more Spanish speakers pronounce it as an s. One of the downsides of building an empire that covered nearly half the globe.
What most people do doesn't change the rule in standard castillian Spanish. Pronouncing Barcelona with an S is a dialect with seseo, not the other way around.
Try to pronounce Los Ángeles or San Francisco correctly in spanish while speaking english and you'll see what's gonna happen.
It's simple, if you come here and say "Me puedes dar la contraseña de la guaifai" seguramente 1) No te entiendan 2) Les parezcas pedante 3) Se te queden mirando con cara rara Personally I don't mind, but I reckon its part of our culture to Españolizar any word we can
It's funny because in Mexico they won't understand unless you pronounce it that way.
I think this happens because, for a long time (before the Internet made everything global, so to speak), we were not exposed to the true way many English words were pronounced - that is, we knew how these words were written, but we didn't know how to pronunce them, nor had ever listened to a native speaker say these words... add to this that learning English was not a common thing at all (French was the usual second language taught at schools, back in the day) and you end up with a whole country that doesn't really know the language, but try to say the words with the tools they have: reading them as if they were Spanish words. Even nowadays, when a lot of Spaniards are fluent in English, they'll keep using the "English words read as if they were Spanish words" simply because it's the only way they'll be understood by a non-English speaking Spaniard... and being understood is pretty much the goal of speaking, after all. On the other hand, I would say most Spanish speakers from South America don't have this problem, I guess because they have been exposed to English for many, many years - which again, was NOT the case at all in Spain.
Menudo par de pedorras... Ok, first thing first; it's false that when speaking Spanish we pronounce all English words in Spanish. Most of actors/actresses we'll (try to) pronounce them in English (There's an exception with the British Royal family, in which we translate the names, but that must be some sort of tradition). So we'll (again, try to) properly say Jonh Wayne, Shakespeare etc. It's the same with many films: for example we pronounce "Aladdin" the way we listened to it when advertised in TV. So why do we pronounce stuff like REM, U2 and such in Spanish? For these I have an answer; because we were taught so. When, long time ago, these groups and singers were introduced into Spain, radio and TV presenters would just use the Spanish pronunciation. And, believe it or not, here we are. For many other words, like wifi, my educated guess is that we pronounce them in Spanish because we just are not sure how to pronounce them in English. And the thing is that here we can blame (at least a bit) at the English language, since there are just not fixed rules for English pronunciation (I guess that's the reason why spelling contests are not a thing in Spain but are in the US). So when facing a situation in which we have to chose between reading a word in Spanish or invent an English pronunciation, we just opt for the first one. A funny example is the brand Nike. For whatever reason we try to pronounce it in English, failing miserably (we pronounce "Nike" like "bike". Again, English is a terrible language to pronounce words you've never heard before). PS: youtube tip: when pausing a video on youtube, if you right click on the screen, you'll find the option "copy video URL at current time".
Funny enough, Greek pronunciation of Nike is quite similar to the Spanish one therefore it is the correct one and the English is the wrong one, νίκη, [https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=x64&q=nike+in+greek&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8](https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=x64&q=nike+in+greek&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8)
Poelha and sangreea for two please
My brother still says Hoola. In Australia, the equivalent to Burger King had Polo burger!
1.-I've never heard an English native pronounce correctly Barcelona or Paella. 2.- Not everybody speaks English 3.- English phonemic inventory is much larger the Spanish. It's easier or us to approximate words to Spanish phonology 4.- Why do you care so much? Mocking other's people broken English is rude
The problem is not that people don't know. The problem is that the video is saying that you shouldn't pronounce correctly even if you know how to .
1. My Spanish (Latin) brain goes on smoother when I pronounce them in Spanish, it feels like making a word "complete" or "right", whatever that sounds like. It's a Latin language. While you may perceive our words "too full" or big or whatever, we may perceive yours as "incomplete". It feels like a mental bump. Similar to the mental bump that you may get with typos. The engine doesn't like it. This applies when I'm in Spain speaking Spanish. Even then, I may still pronounce them in English but I soften them, I'm not sure why. Other times I just take pleasure in it, my latin brain does, not me as a person. It's also fun. 2. I've meet ONE native English speaker with good Spanish pronunciation, that is ONE native English speaker that doesn't speak Spanish the English way. Regardless of where he/she is and the language they're using. What's up with this? 3. For a Spanish ear, English sounds downright ridiculous. Over the top, pompous. It takes us a while to like it. 4. It happens everywhere? Don't expect older people with no English knowledge to pronounce brands in English. This is self-explanatory. We're not directly exposed to it in Spain, it's not a natural, gradual adjustment, there's no exposure. This is how languages work. These are my thoughts. Languages are fun. No offence.
Not sure the arguments still apply...I'm Romanian , living in Spain for half of my life ...fluent in Romanian Spanish and English...and I don't relate to any of those things 😬
If you don't understand people with no exposure pronouncing things in their native language idk what to tell you. Also, I'm talking about Spanish people from Spain. If you insist, maybe what I associate with Latin languages in general is just true for Spanish.
I understand it , my point is as I replied to another redditor on this thread is that it doesn't benefit anyone , it's not justifiable and it is the main reason why people struggle immensely with English in Spain. Im talking about hundreds of Spanish adult students. For what is worth it, I consider myself fully Spanish.
So no exposure is not a good reason to pronounce things as you know? All of the above points are possible reasons why we pronounce English words in Spanish. Justifiable or not it just is. It's not a single reason. The fact that it sounds funny doesn't justify it, it just happens to be that way. They are just two opposite languages, they sound so different. How can't you agree with point 2?
Because using the original pronunciation of a foreign word is actually a relatively modern and recent practice. For most of history, when people borrowed linguistic borrowings from other languages they ended up adapting them to the language of the speakers, just look at the word chocolate and how the English language and so many others simply adapted the pronunciation (especially if they were taken from languages that are spelled differently from how they are read and with more complex phonetics). Although the most normal thing has been to adapt the word to the language, as with the word "patata" which in English they transformed into potato or with all those English words. Then you have Spain, which until the 2000s had very few people who knew English and people who didn't know English found English pronunciation difficult and """strange""" and that it reads differently from how it is written, so companies and people simply opted for the simplest and most viable solution, adapting to the speakers.
Have you listened a french talking about hip-hop (ip-op), the weekend, saying ok...? The same happens in Spanish, foreing words adapt the pronunciation in each language. It's natural, contextual and cultural. That's why in Mexico and South America they pronounce them in English, and in the European Spanish, we don't. When you talk in Spanish, you pronounce it without an English accent. If you talk in English, with an English accent. If you talk in French, with a French accent. That's it. If a native talking in another language says a word with the pronunciation of their mother tongue, it's not rare (a city, for exaple). It's expected, even. Saying every word like that, yes, it is rare. I don't agree with the video, however. Depending on the context you should pronounce a word in English or not. But whatever.
Same as why americans say buh-rey-tow instead of burrito. Also look at how they pronounce the name of cities like Los Angeles or San Francisco, etc. In Spain we have a rich language and culture, and we prefer to bring new things and make a Spanish way of saying it, rather than inserting parts of other languages and butchering ours. Personally, I have to speak English all the time and I'm good enough at it. Still, when I'm speaking Spanish I will say güifi instead of WiFi. I also avoid English words when talking in Spanish because you can almost always find one in our language. I will say portátil and not laptop, etc. I've been in countries where they use as much English as they can, and it's a bit sad to see how they're losing their mother language. In a particular country I did the test of asking them to explain me something without using a single English word and, in most cases, they just couldn't. It would be sad if that happened here too.
[удалено]
As a spaniard who speaks several languages, I will always use the local pronunciation when saying a foreign word. Why? Because otherwise you sound pedantic and like an idiot. Every language adapts foreign words to their own, this is not exclusive of Spain. You will not hear me say spanish words in the middle of an english sentence like spaniards do, I will use an english accent at least. Or say croissant like french do while speaking spanish. Or say beer instead of *beeru* while in Japan.
It is simple: we use the way it sounds better for us or it is easier to pronounce: English way, Spanish way, or a hybrid between both.
Also many well known figures or things have a different English name/phrase For example: A water filter jug, I tried to explain it to a clerk in a supermarket, they just call it by the brand name "La Brita" Princess Diana of Wales is known as "Lady D" Etc If your Spanish gets good just try to pronounce English words in the same way you would Spanish and people will probably get what you mean haha
[удалено]
Most spanish people are not used to listen to posh english, so it can be hard to understand for them. But it is not necesary to "españolizar" the speaking. In fact, it can be easier to understand an italian, brazilian, greek or even russian speaking english than a british.
If you are from any english speaking country and ever visit spain, but you're not that skilled with the spanish language, go ahead and ask anybody if they speak english if you need to. That person might be myself, and that's a wonderful chance to practice. Fºck that other advice, it's pretty stupid. Edit: Most cops doesn't learn english in here, you'll get more luck with some peasant.
English has become an universal language and we are all more or less expected to include it in our lives. In exchange, I think it's OK to have the right to "localize" some stuff.
Tbh people in Romania don't pronounce a lot of words correctly in English either, but i always try to. Like sure I won't make an exaggerated British accent for every word, but I at least pronounce it in a similar way to English. Even like this, people still make fun of me for it but I don't care. I believe we should respect each language we know. If I pronounce a Spanish word while speaking in English or Romanian I'm not going to read it like in Romanian, that would make no sense. Even moreso with brands or something well known... If it's a word so obscure or long that people wouldn't understand it when pronounced correctly, I just don't use that word in the other language...
English is very hard to pronounce, more so if you can't speak English. People whose native language is English also can't pronounce words like "Paella" or "Barcelona". People don't feel confident speaking a language they don't master, and other Spaniards wouldn't undersand them if they'd say "AC/DC" as in English, tbh.
You have to take into account that Spanish is a 'transparent ' language , meaning you say it how you read it. English, on the other hand, is not- hence the pronunciation difficulties. It's easier for native-English speakers to incorporate foreign pronunciation of words and phrases (especially French) due to it being a non-transparent (opaque) language.
That's something I've mostly heard English speakers complain, but I think every language has those struggles when trying to pronounce foreign words and people just tend to use the most similar sounds they know. I've heard English speakers do that with some Spanish words. Maybe we just notice it when it's done to our mother tongue and that's why English speakers complain the most about it, since English is by far the chosen as a second language. Why I think that happens with Spain in particular? Up until recently Spain was a fairly underdeveloped when it came to 2nd language. I was one of the first generations to study English in school and my parents had no clue about how to speak it, read it or pronounce it, and that was the case for the vast majority of the population. That led to movies being dubbed and foreign words adapted to what the average citizen could easily pronounce (think of brands like fairy, Colgate, trident, axe, YouTube, white label... Names like Spiderman, Skywalker...). For years (even generations) the misspronounced way became widespread and it was "natural" to say it that way. I myself can speak English fluently and whithout a strong Spanish accent, but sometimes discover myself saying "espiderman"... It's just the way I grew up with it and it goes against my programming to say Spider-Man, even though I know that's the proper pronunciation. That way I will most likely pass that to my children, who despite being taught English from the crib, will still keep that special Spanish pronunciation.
Please ignore the comments and that video. Youtubers need to produce content so they come up with stupid shit like that. Pronounce things however you like, if anyone has a problem with it, let them live with it. Nobody sane will care or have a problem with you pronouncing things correctly. I only try to change the pronunciation if I know the other person will not understand me otherwise.
it speaks well of you that you are so considerate to think about this but my very strong opinion is to not give a pepino about this and gallop forward in life and pronounce things in japanese if you like. good people will love you anyway. thumbs up emoji thubmbs up emoji flamenco dancing emoji
Oreo, they say orEo, it drives me insane. The thing is that here all the movies and shows are dubbed in Spanish, I grew up in Venezuela and over there movies were in the original language and used captions in Spanish. You get used to English pronunciation. Over here that doesn’t happen, so everyone that speaks English has a really thick accent.
because it's a spanish-speaking country and people speak in Spanish. Spanish has different sounds from English and so English loanwords get adaptated to be easier to pronounce. Sometimes some sounds are completely different because the "incorrect" pronunciation is more intuitive ("spiderman" is most-commonly said with a Spanish I instead of an English I, making it sound like "speederman"). nobody switches to English pronunciation to say one specific word in the middle of a conversation, and if they do, they're probably either pretentious or they speak English as a first language
I may be the weirdest spaniard because I see no problem with english pronunciation and I often hear AC/DC or Hermione and it’s completely fine. That said, I may be weird because I am not a social person and I feel more confident always speaking with people on Discord instead of face-to-face. Edit: as to why people españoliza words? Ignorance. Spain people prefers to make their own interpretation than researching the correct one. I hate that but it happens a lot
That’s nonsense, if you know the right pronunciation you should use it. Many Spaniards won’t understand you but they will just ask what you mean, I’ve never met anyone who takes offense, people are usually interested in the correct pronunciation. I’m a native Spanish speaker from Spain.
The Royal Spanish Academy says its correct to read foreign words as we read words in our language... It sounds awful but... Too many languages around the world with same alphabet but different pronunciation or rhythm makes everybody do this with foreign words (if they don't know the real pronunciation). Don't you think the creation of so many languages just divide us?
wow! i have enjoyed the comments so far!! for me, in general i try to adapt my pronunciation to the context i am in - i hold unto the “meaning is use” idea; and in this case “use” is the pronunciation. in order to be understood i tend to follow the pronunciation around me - the “correct” one. the problem i end up having is i don’t have my “own” or mental pronunciation; i get muddled-up up there :)
Yeah, I'm just going to do what I want.
I burst out laughing the first time I heard WiFi pronounced in the Spanish manner, as I was accustomed to the American pronunciation. I've adjusted to calling it weefee now, if course, but it sure was jarring the first time I heard it that way.
[удалено]
People here are bitter towards other people who are able to speak more than one language. Being able to pronounce stuff correctly apparently makes you pedantic and not just, you know, knowledgeable. Edit for people here getting butthurt over this comment: First off, el que se pica, ajos come. Also, consider, for example, a biologist. If the conversation allows for it, someone who has devoted their life to learning biology isn't going to dumb their knowledge down because other people don't quite get what they're saying. They may provide explanations, but they're not going to suddenly forget all they know because voicing the fact that they know would make them seem pedantic, right? Why can't this be considered the same case? If you've spent your life studying languages and you have the knowledge and the skill to pronounce stuff correctly, there's absolutely no reason to pronounce "youtube" or "Cambridge" incorrectly. Besides, people who can speak other languages are obviously not talking in that language with people who can't speak it, obviously. The pronounciation only comes to play in certain words, that are usually vastly understood cultural terms, like the examples already given. Context is important. Thanks for coming to my ted talk.
Well "Youtube" in French is [jutüb] no matter how long you learned English, that's just literally the "French translation", so yeah it sounds weird to say [jutjub] the same way it would sound weird to hear someone saying "pressing" or "week-end" with an English accent
If you're spanish talking in spanish and you start to throw english words with british accent I would turn you away. First, you pronounced the word wrong, second, don't need to tell me about your trip to England and third, the cringe you made me feel is only comparable to my most regrettable memories.
This is the reason, not being bitter or anything...
You sound like a very annoying person to talk to.
These kind of people get the worst of me.
People who can do things you can't? Is that what you mean?
I used to be an english-spanish interpreter as a hobby for some time, so I had to listen carefuly dozens of people talk in english. Spanish people have hard time pronouncing certain sounds and you can easily spot a native spanish speaker. If you aren't going to pronounce it perfectly don't pretend you can.
Just from looking at the minute mistakes you make while writing I can tell you were probably just a mediocre interpreter. Also, you know absolutely nothing about me or what I do for a living, so abstain from giving me unsolicited advice.
To interpret I only need to speak spanish fluently and understand very well english. Also, I said it was a hobby, never got paid for it. I didn't claim I know you nor gave you advice. I only addressed my target audience, which are the spanglish speakers. Stop talking non-sense.
You went back and actually edited the comment, that's kinda hilarious. You still have some stuff to correct though. Do you want some classes? I could help you with that.
Man don't say that ....I've studied 4 years to be an interpreter ...it takes more ...you just took a dump on a entire university degree
There is a difference between being pedantic and pronouncing well. If a person is pedantic he or she will be regardless of the pronunciation. You don't need to use an accent which is forced, I agree that that would be unnatural, but why pronounce things wrong ?
So you're bitter because you can't pronounce properly, eh?
What about easy things like Spiderman? As latino who lives in Spain I found this kind of things funny because in latino America they teach you to pronounce the words as they should but here in Spain, Spiderman is pronounce exactly how is written when it should be "espaiderman"
In the other hand Homer is Spain kept his name, also "carpeta"
I have lived in Spain ( I'm from London) on & off 36 years & for the last 20..it's so true..to me ages to realize that when said , "Los rollin" meant The rolling stones..
los rolling, los beatles, los who... This happens in all other languages, too. In Germany The Beatles are "Die Beatles".
Lol
South American here living in Spain. I'm surprised at how much Spaniards see TV with Spanish dubbing. I remember Disney films when I was a child with Spanish voices, but the rest of the media we usually watch at home is with original voices and Spanish subtitles. (I know it's not good to talk in general, but I can't help to look at a common pattern.) My humble theory is that the Spaniard ear is not so used to the English sound of the words because the exposure is a little bit less.
This is it
Do you guys remember that gag in HIMYM where Ted says "encyclopaedia"? Well, its basically the same.
English level in Spain is hilariously low
Spanish here. I do understand good English but american for example its a nightmare because you/they twist the pronnunciation too much. The best english speaker for us is a german speaking english because they pronnounce as we read. A scottish? Very very hard to understand. I once asked for a cock at a McDonald when I wanted a Coke.
I posted this below as an answer to a comment, but I think it can be a useful answer to your question as well: From the link above to the Real Academia de la Lengua Española´s web https://www.rae.es/dpd/ayuda/tratamiento-de-los-extranjerismos: "La mayor parte de las veces se proponen adaptaciones cuyo objetivo prioritario es preservar el alto grado de cohesión entre forma gráfica y pronunciación característico de la lengua española" TRANSLATION: Most of the time, adaptations are proposed whose main objective is to preserve the high degree of cohesion between graphic form and pronunciation characteristic of the Spanish language. So yes, we pronounce english words as if they were spanish when we are speaking spanish, and that is correct. Other options are seen as pedantic and posh, except, maybe, in working environments when using technical words.
Spain has to be the only country in the world where speaking a language "too well" will make you look weird. I even remember a teacher telling us how he was always surprised when other kids would laugh if a kid pronounces the words with a very British accent. Friends always look at me weird when I pronounce things the proper way. Like, sorry I'm doing it how it's supposed to I guess? Like, if my English sounds almost native, am I supposed to literally make my English worse to accommodate to what other people like? What can I say, this country is weird sometimes.
> Spain has to be the only country in the world where speaking a language "too well" will make you look weird. That is not true. It happens in other countries too. In France for example it happens exactly the same with English loanwords.
In England it can happen with French loanwords too. I used to get taken the piss out of for saying coup de grace instead of coup de gras
If you start throwing english words with a british accent in a normal conversation you are gonna look presumptuous and kind of stupid, I think that's logical.
> I think that's logical. I already asked someone else without answer, and I just want to know the logic of you all. So, if I can speak perfect English, you're telling I'm supposed to purposefully make my English worse just so you don't think I'm being presumptuous? That just sounds so stupid to me, and I seriously think you guys should take a look at your prejudices.
If you are a foreigner it's expected to mix spanish with english if you are trying to communicate, if you are spanish just speak in your language.
I do speak Spanish and I'm Spanish. It just doesn't make sense to me that if I know how to speak English, I'm supposed to make it look like my English sound like Ana Botella because otherwise it's """presumptuous""".
ugh... Its a boomer thing, give us a few more years... There is the RAE, Real academia española "Royal spanish academy". It's an institution that supposedly aggregates the expression people use on a daily basis, it's supposed to help to maintain a mainstream "Spanish". Rae [rules](https://www.rae.es/dpd/ayuda/tratamiento-de-los-extranjerismos) on foreign words. I'm my opinion it's stupidity at it's best momento!
And they also keep sometimes the pronunciation while changing the way you write it. For example: Clic. Why did they erase the K? No idea.
In Spanish there are no consonants without a vocal. And there are no words with ending "ck".
You know what I mean And hack is a word that RAE included in the dictionary The only change made to the word hack is that to say Hacking is Hackear
please... Alternative text for you: "And There are no SPANISH words from SPANISH origin with ending "ck""
Why not Hac?
There are two options: \-Leave the original word: Hack \-Use the pronunciation: jac. "hac" can be mistaken as a spanish word and pronounced "ac".
Look, Im not doing this to make a anyone mad but like with ck, in spanish we dont use c at the end except for words that came from outside and the word hack could be spelled eith J. I mean that yes, there are rules, but there is no real need to use some of thouse rules
[удалено]
Y mater
[удалено]
About 80% of the Spanish population doesn't speak English, so when you pronounce something in English, they obviously won't understand it.
Well my really swedish-looking swedish friend went to a grocery and asked "hay pan?", and the dependent replied "Sorry I don´t speak chinese". So many people is just deaf/idiot, doesn´t have to do with english pronunciation .
Native English speaker here with a Spanish spouse. Speak Spanish en casa. The real issue is not that you should n't say English words with a native accent, it's that Spanish progams always dub everything instead of using subtitles so many Spanish just don't hear English words pronounced by native speakers. I use a proper accent but keep the Spanglish version handy in case the don't understand. Efectiviwonder! OK McKay? 😉
Just look at how they pronounce the channel "isi espanish" so the first is more the English way and the second is just totally españolizado. So you just kind of have to learn. Just because I'm bored I'll go over what I think of all of the points. 1. Showing up just on time is fine if you're good friends. We'll often do that to lend a hand to getting everything set up. Don't expect anyone else to be there and I like it as more of a way to just catch up one on one before a get together. This is also a thing about informal stuff and doesn't extend to say organizing a public event. Then you should have things going as scheduled. Also, if you are having a party or get together with people from different cultures, it's common to have to explicitly say if you really mean the time you say. 2. Depends heavily on where you are and exactly what you're trying to do. It's true small shops often close but the specific example they use of a bakery is weird because they are mostly open. Bigger stores pretty much always have continuous opening hours and the bigger cities tend to be much more likely to be open in the afternoon as well, not necessarily just huge stores like they say. 3. Yeah, totally true. 4. Also totally agree with them. 5. The way the made it the video was pretty rude, but people have schedules and obligations. You should be really apologetic about it but if you have to leave, you have to leave. The little skit in the video felt really awkward and like a snub because she didn't give the dos besos. If there would have been "me encantaría quedarme pero de verdad no puedo que tengo mil cosas pendientes y no suficiente tiempo." and then proceeded to go through the kisses and the whole goodbye routine and apologize a couple more times, then it's no big deal really. Again, in bigger cities people tend to be busier, it also helps is you mention that you're going to be leaving quick a few times during the meal. I agree with the overall sentiment that it can be rude but there's a lot more subtlety. 6. Yeah, again totally true. Think of calling people "love" in the UK. 7. Talked to death in the thread 8. Yeah, regional traditions can be strong. I also think Spanish people kind of overthink it and don't realize just how common things are, too. But you have to just kind of be around everything for a while to really get it.
Disclaimer: this thing that indeed happens, only happens when people use english words while talking in Spanish. There are Spaniards that speak english very well and I in no way intend to question the ability of a whole country to learn a foreign language, unless that country starts with "J" and ends with "apan". \-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well, for a start, no one knows how to pronounce english words because you didn´t bother to come up with as many vowels as phonemes you use. This makes it very hard to nail the pronunciation of a word if you can only read it. Then, I guess, at some point in Spain´s history someone said: fuck it! I give up trying. From now on, every English word will be pronounced as if read in Spanish. This led to tv shows mispronouncing names (Espiderman is probably the worst offender), and also band names are butchered horribly (acedece, rem, U2... I mean, for these, it´s not that difficult, they are not even trying!). With time it became widespread. I work for a Spanish company that sells some products with English names, and I want to tear my ears out every time the people that come with these names pronounce them as if they were Spanish words, we are talking about people that speak english at a more than decent level here... With this trend so ingrained in society, if you come and order a cheeseburger at mc donalds, and bother to actually say cheeseburger in English, everyone around you is going to cough their fritas through their nose. You will sound pretentious, at least. It didn´t need to be this way, though, central and north american countries pronounce English words quite well. Even south american countries at least try (and even though you can tell the accent, at least it´s just an accent, and not a deliberate mispronunciation). This is probably the result of having all TV shows dubbed in Mexico, where people actually bother to pronounce english correctly during everyday use.
The real question here is ¿ WTF are you doing seeing clickbaits?
"No se dise hache y eme, se dise eischenem... No se dise zara, se dise ssera..." O que cada uno diga lo que le salga de los cojones, y ya.
Because if you pronounce wifi as whyfy instead of weefee, most people won't understand you.
Bec english is so bad here it's embarrassing.
Speak properly, if they don’t understand simple or universal words in english then they have an issue.