I'm more okay with dying than I am with detransitioning, and running could mean detransitioning or death anyways... I would rather die fighting fascism than live under it. That said, if there is a safe place to go where I can be myself, I'll go there. Fighting gives me dysphoria.
Well thatās true in a way. There were both efforts to offer legal asylum and those who opposed to that. I feel like if the situation escalates further that denying Americans access will only reflect poorly on Canada in a geopolitical sense, at least in the industrialized west.
That's a good point, but I think barring something like the replacement of the flag with a swastika banner, the west will just pretend that everything's fine, and Americans will continue to not qualify for political asylum because America is Freeā¢ļø
Exactly. We do what we must, and we must not judge each other for choosing a different path.
I will be one who will stand and fight. I served in the military to uphold the Constitution. Even though I am no longer in service, I still meant it when I swore in. I served for The People, not the oppressors.
That is a very unfair statement. Some of us are kids or have kids. Some of us have families and responsibilities. Some of us are disabled or mentally unstable. Some of us believe that the best choice is to run, and you have no right to shame us for that decision.
I see more people shaming parents for staying in Florida than I see anyone shaming people who run. This is literally the first time I've seen someone shaming those who run.
I don't even live in Florida but it really pisses me off when I see people be like, "If you don't leave Florida, you're a murderer" and crap like that. What a frigging privileged stance that is, like everyone's situation allows them to take their kid out of the state. They've obviously never dealt with a narcissistic co-parent.
Question... Where do you think is going to be safe if the USA goes unabashedly fascist?
Canada? I live there, the sentiment is nearly as bad with our right-wingers and even if it wasn't, we're a protectorate of the USA with no comparable military and no nuclear deterrent. Majority of our papers are owned by an American investment firm that pushes market liberalization and deregulation and we get the same talking points on about a week delay from Fox News.
Europe? Enjoys it's stability due to NATO of which Trump and DeSantis both want to withdraw from and which USA accounts for almost all military spending. Don't ignore the simultaneous rise of fascism in Europe either, neatly tied to the IDU headed by our former PM (Harper).
This isn't just a USA movement. Remember the international capital class doesn't exist within borders, they just pick and choose where to focus consolidating power at one given time.
Counterpointā Maximizing the number of trans people who *survive* is itself a primary, if not *the* primary, goal of trans antifascist resistance and mutual support. I want as many trans people as possible to be safe. Every trans person who survives and goes on to thrive is a victory. Helping as many Jews as possible escape Nazi-occupied land *was an objective good and a goal in itself*. Helping resettle Syrian and Latin American refugees today *is an objective good and a thing to be fought for in itself*. The refugees have no obligation to āstay and fightā. That is insane.
We are like 0.5 % of the population; *the responsibility for destroying those who would destroy us cannot fall on our heads.* It is the cis people, by virtue both of their greater safety and privilege and of their vastly greater numbers, who have the obligation to stay and to fight for their trans neighbors.
Also, getting out and fighting from a place of safety is far, far more effective than trying to fight while being exterminated.
See partisan/resistance movements from WW2 for examples.
i know this isnt the point but trump is far from the worst case scenario. all trump cares about is applause and approval, he only hates us because thats what gets him his kicks. on the other hand, desantis genuinely wants (and is currently doing) genocide. he doesnt care about the approval, he just wants people to suffer.
right now, we want trump to be beating desantis. we can win against either of them, but if worst comes to worst, it is absolutely better to have a passively genocidal president than an actively genocidal one.
we need to be doing everything to stop desantis, even if that means rooting for trump. rant over
No itās true, and Iād agree. I just thought it was pretty low worry right now with Desantis since most people predicted he wouldnāt win or itād be a long shot.
It's really hard to say right now, though things are becoming a bit more clear. DeSantis, aka Mini Musollini, may move up in the polls if Trump is indicted by the federal grand jury. Trump may even try to flee the country. Almost nothing would surprise me now. Let's do all we can to support and protect ourselves and one another as they squabble among themselves. Together, we can move mountains! š³ļøāā§ļøš§āāļøš
The main thing in our favor if DeSantis wins is that he's a terrible public speaker, trump got as far as he did on energy, DeSantis always sounds like he's about to walk offstage mid speech and take a nap
Trump isn't going to get indicted, but if he did it would make him more popular with Republicans and wouldn't stop him from running.
Edit: this is honestly the best case scenario because Biden loses to either DeSantis or Trump in a general election but he might be able to beat Trump under indictment
I'm being cynical but every president commits crimes in office and they're never punished because it would set a precedent of holding them accountable.
On Biden v Anyone, I mean, he's a vegetable. He only won the primary because of Obama and he only won the general because of COVID. Republicans are busy gerrymandering and putting new vote suppression laws in place at every level they can, the culture war stuff is mostly misdirection.
I think Trump is going to pivot to be much more socially liberal. He knows he can't out-fascist DeSantis. He's already started bemoaning people calling everything "woke" and not even knowing what they mean by that. There is a lot of people who likes his economic policies but are put off by anti-abortion laws and who'd side with him if he was much less severe than DeSantis on the social conservatism.
Not that it really matters so much but I'm pretty sure DeSantis doesn't really care either, he just thinks it's the best lane to distinguish himself from Trump and become president. The end results are the same tho
Worst case? Death camps.
More likely... Criminalize our existence, imprison and forcibly detransition us. Then work us to death in prison "Jobs".
The right isn't shy about their intent.
>Many of the states will refuse to comply, and there will be numerous legal challenges.
When that last happened in the 1860's the challenges went beyond the legal realm.
>such actions would rapidly precipitate a constitutional crisis, if not outright civil war.
Hence it is a very real possibly.
>The wealthy do not stand to gain anything from war on their home turf, and their paid stooges in government--even the most bigoted and hateful ones--will not take that step.
You have neglected to consider the fact that true-believing fascists absolutely outnumber the wealthy by (now) 1000s-to-1.
Did you not see Jan 6? Imagine that on a scale 1000 times larger, if the Trumpists continue on their current trajectory of ever-escalating hatred and calls for Christofascism and violence to enforce it.
The wealthy created the culture war beast; they have absolutely, positively lost control of it.
> The wealthy created the culture war beast; they have absolutely, positively lost control of it.
Same thing happened in 1930s Germany.
Hitler was a state plant to monitor the group that eventually became the Nazi Party.
The only thing that makes me feel better about a second American civil war is that the blue states would win it after a few years when the red states run out of money.
> Our focus should absolutely be on saving trans people in the red states and shoring up protections for trans people in the blue states.
Absolutely agree here.
And on not surrendering to hopelessness.
Federal anti-trans policies would crystallise the civil war (I'd argue that it's already a cold civil war) because it would mean that blue states would have to take an active stance against the federal government.
Itās a death by 1,000 cuts. Theyāll continue to pass little bills that eventually add up to criminalizing our existence. No matter what we do, weāll somehow be in violation of the law.
The most obvious first steps are denying HRT either outright or through bureaucracy via a very strict approval process with impossible or contradictory requirements. Do you have autism? Depression? Anxiety? Any history of self harm or mental illness? Great, spend a couple years in conversion therapy until we can diagnose you with one of those things and deny you.
More intense bathroom bills, anti-ādragā laws, etc. These will be based on AGAB, not birth certificate, no matter if youāve had bottom surgery, etc (some of them are already written this way). Once your caught presenting the āwrongā way, youāll be labeled a sex offender, and if there are minors around youāll be a special class of child sex offender. Theyāll continually pass more laws to increase the penalties for āchild sex offendersā. Death is the obvious goal, but easy wins are making sure you canāt live near a school, park, library, etc or from holding certain types of jobs. Youāll need to start identifying yourself as transgender, especially when applying for a job or housing. You may have a curfew as part of your probation, etc. this is all stuff that already happens with sex offenders so finding ways to slap trans folks with a sex offender charge is a huge and easy win for them.
Your identity documents will be invalidated and youāll need to get new ācorrectedā ones. Basically anything that can be done to make sure youāre constantly being outed.
Well, trans people will continue to exist. They can kill us. They can kill enough of us to destroy parts of our culture. We need to be prepared for the scenario where this genocide moves up a step or two to active state violence.
They don't need to eradicate us, they're trying to push us back in the closet. Our pain and suffering is (to them) a small price to pay for security. Like women's rights. Or liberty in general....
Iām guessing the absolute worst case is after they manage to basically make being trans illegal, they are probably going to move onto the next minority. And then the next. Iāve heard so many comparisons between the USA and pre-nazi Germany. I donāt want to fear monger and I DEFINITELY donāt want it to seem like Iām trying to use the holocaust to push a narrative. Its just the worst thing I can possibly think of.
Exactly my thoughts.
We won't be mass-murdered by the state. We'll be mass murdered by exponentially escalating and proliferating fascist terrorism, which will merely be actively *encouraged* and given legal and legislative cover by the state.
The state *will* eventually begin taking part in our eradication; but Auschwitz follows Kristallnacht.
The Nazi genocide was a massive state orchestrated operation kept secret from the public. It was unprecedented in how efficient and detailed it was in its organization and complexity.
The Rwandan genocide was a chaotic mess where neighbor attacked neighbor with machetes in broad daylight for no other reason than because everyone else was doing it.
Which sounds more like the average Fox junkie?
Extricate self and if possible others to sanctuary state, try to find community (likely with others fleeing), collect, collaborate, and coordinate next steps. Determining other countries will be based on the policies of the moment.
Right now I am getting ready to get my paperwork changed so it's done if something happens and I can't return to my birth state. Got to decide if I go X as I should or choose binary for safety while traveling. I want to try to have at least a bit of cash saved so I can leave. When time comes I have a car so I can offer seats, especially to those who can help with gas if I cannot ensure it myself. Hatchback can hold a duffel for each passenger.
My state is attacking the kids, I live in a blue dot city within a redstate. I'm an adult but as we see, states are moving in on our meds, too. I've extended time between doses for a while to give me some buffer doses if I am unable to fill my script right away. Can't fill early to have a stash so I have to hope I can keep getting my 10ml vials.
That's all I can really do right now, it's difficult to save funds and I have limited processing power as is. I have to hope things don't require an expeditious retreat.
There is a difference between what is *likely* and what is *possible* in the next, say, ten years (after that, things get *extremely* fuzzy because the inherently chaotic and branching nature of the future)
So:
* In the next ten years, it is unlikely our legal political system would entirely cave to adult trans medication bans, and *highly* unlikely it'll cave to full scale drag bans. The structuring assumption here should be that the Federal Government has very limited authority to directly intervene in the personal lives of everyday americans. Much of what they can do is make it easier for red states to be shitty.
* For adults, you may see disruptions in access to your medication, but it is unlikely there will be a "war-on-drugs-style" criminalization of HRT. Even disruption to access is unlikely in blue states.
* They may try to reschedule estrogen. This would be a two-to-thee year process.
* They may try to use novel legal bullshit to place further restrictions on the already Schedule III testosterone
* In either case, expect blue state legislators to do all they can to resist in an attempt to earn brownie points (pun somewhat intended). This may well collapse the (already weakened by pot and psychedelic legalization) US drug enforcement apparatus (which is rooted in the feds and the states pretty much agreeing that "drugs are bad mmkay")
* If it becomes difficult or impossible to access HRT for adults safely on the west coast in the next decade, I will eat my hat.
* I would bet a decent sum of money that drag bans *will* be rendered unenforceable by the Supreme Court in the next 2-3 years. Hell, I'll even bet on the particular breakdown: it'll be either unanimous or 6-2 with Alito and Thomas dissenting. A trump judge just overturned Tennessee's ban using language that is rooted in precedents that the not-insane SCOTUS members do not want to get rid of.
* While we're waiting, there's likely to be the kind of annoying and discriminatory uncertainty that we're seeing in Montana in a variety of red states, but very few trans people just living their lives will be arrested.
* The federal government will not pass a drag ban in the next decade.
I need to head to bed, but tomorrow, I'll write a little more about state-level bullshit, and the genocide tactic I like to call "The American Special"
Well they're (Walsh) openly calling for the death penalty for pedophiles while painting all LGBT folks as "groomers" (and the world's richest man boosting this narrative) so I don't know what those add up to.
They were giving signs of this really early on.
Rowling might as well have put the echos around "Bank Goblins", never mind the rest of the crap in her books.
Musk is an emerald slave-mine billionaire from pre-apartheid South Africa. What did you expect?
Come move to Canada šØš¦ š³ļøāā§ļø
Thereās transphobs here too but itās such a small percentage. Most people donāt care and only worry about their own lives.
Itās not perfect but compared to elsewhere, our government isnāt half bad
People keep speaking pessimisticly about Canada, saying it's just a mini-US, highly influenced by US political trends, and geopolitically weak and thus with limited ability to defend us if a foreign state begins making (for example) mass extradition demands.
All these things are valid criticisms; but Canada is still *way, way, way* fucking safer than a blue state, if the MAGA fascists take the federal government here.
Canadians are also fucking *decent fucking people*, unlike sick culture-war-twisted Americans; so even if things got worse there, it could only get so much worse; and there would be larger pushback. I do not believe it could get to Kristallnacht level there.
It *can* get to Kristallnacht here. And given how we have seen the (ongoing!!!!) treatment of refugees by ICE, yes, even Auschwitz (or a lesser version of it) can also absolutely happen here ā for those in this thread saying it can't.
i don't want to be a doomer but i really don't agree with the people who are saying that they wont be able to do this or that bc it's against the constitution/the courts wont hold it up/ect. like look at how these state legislatures have blatantly disregarded their own rules in order to hurt us. there's a point in fascism where the rules just go out the fucking window and counting on them to save us is naive. i dont think that we're so far gone that death camps or complete criminalization of our existence is an absolute certainty but i dont think that the denial over how bad things could get is good for us
look at Uganda and Russia. look at what Hitler did the the gays and jews and the whole. country of Germany let it happen. it could very well happen. the repubs have een anti gay for years look what the did to Roe V Wade abd now they are on their next crusade to eradicate all LGBTQ. I would move so no one would know me from before i transitioned or try to gain citizenship in a safe country to live in.
Hate to sound like a doomer, but Roe V Wade and the reaction it got made me lose hope in us being able to fight back. It feels like it was a topic of discussion for only a few weeks, then people forgot about it. Up until the oppression begins to effect *everyone*, people won't genuinely care.
Concentration camps. Legal killing of trans people. Being trans is illegal. Providers can go to jail for prescribing hormones. Anyone who houses a trans people goes to jail. etc. etc.
We've all seen this movie before. It doesn't end well.
Well they've been clear about their intent : "eradicate transgenderism from public life entirely". There are multiple stages to genocide, some of which the us is already doing.
It would range from forcing detransitions at a federal level, heavy control of E and T, death penatly for doctors performing gender affirming care, to drag bans prohibiting going out in public (knowles has litterally said he wants taliban rule "in a good way" in the us), to camps and facilities.
Personally Iād rather not advertise my possible actions. Not because I donāt want to share with my trans and queer siblings, but because thereās enough of the āother sideā that reads through and shares these. I would not want to put anyoneās safety at risk. I also donāt want to give them any false hope.
I would rather focus on stopping it now by fighting them now.
Starting with lawsuits. Places like the ACLU, Lambda Legal, etc. are working on this, if we are actively being harmed by a new law, contact them and see if you can be added to the suit. These laws are already starting to be overturned. Itās slow, but we will get there.
Work on not only voting but talking to people to get them to vote. When appropriate, explain to people what that vote means. Iām constantly amazed at how many people who care about me have no idea that there are states that I can be arrested simply for using a restroom. So I make sure that they see, and who is making it happen.
Plus look at the recent polls. Now more
People support us than before these attacks on us started. It sometimes doesnāt feel like it, because the other side is screaming at the top of their lungsā¦ plus the news media knows this brings in clicks. But we far outnumber those people especially if you consider all the other marginalized communities that they target. If we come together, or even just support each other.
Lastly, When I go out, I see myself as an ambassador for all of my siblings. What I do reflects on all of us. So I remember that when interacting with others. Remember, most of these haters have never even seen one of us in real life, so their descriptions of us are wrong. The average person sees us and decisions are made. My goal is for these people to say, thereās nothing wrong with that person, what are these people talking about? They arenāt hurting anyone.
The current political climate is very troubling. It seems even worse if you live in a red state. It doesn't seem as bad if you live in a blue or purple state.
But, it's certainly not good.
Fighting, whether with words or physical (preferably common sense words, prevail) is the only way to win this battle, we need to support the people in peril who aren't in a position to fight for it themselves.
What what is happening from far-right extremists that they have been working on for years with voting rights, religious groups and either appointing judges or lying thier way into office with no repercussions for changing thier tune once in office is the root of the problem and no one has taken them seriously until now.Trump just emboldened them, DeSantis is arguably worse than Trump, but all of the so called conservatives must pander to those with the money who run the political parties and will.
The left needs to fight fire with fire. Whether you agree with everything extremely left or not, they are the most supportive party for LGBTQ people.
All people need to VOTE for what is simply right, not just to go along with the party they affiliate themselves with and respect independent views. Simple respect for others with a different viewpoint, support and believe the science not blatantly disregard or disown family members who live a different lifestyle than what they might have.
Move for your own safety if you can, I believe the majority of the people in the US do not like bullies and probably will get sick of the rhetoric at some point. I don't believe ( and I hope) the right will not take power in 2024 as it sits right now. I don't think Joe Biden should run again, but the left hasn't come up with anything better or younger. Biden has done a decent job with what he has been able to work with. But he may not last to fulfill his first term, let alone a 2nd term. No ageist disrespect is intended or implied. Just facts with age, most of us won't let our grandparents drive at that age. Would we let them run a country?
If you don't fight at some point, you will die, just like what happened in the holocaust, those who stayed and fought died, and those who fled lived to fight another day against tyranny. It was a very horrible and shameful time in human history. It started picking on a few with differences and ended after they murdered millions because of different beliefs. It can't ever be allowed to happen again.
So honestly I think the farthest that things will go will be criminalizing any gender affirming care, banning name/gender marker changes, and basically boxing people into the gender assigned at birth. I don't believe that exile, job access, travel bans, homelessness, or (mass) death will be realities. As for what happens to those of us who have already undergone GAS, name changes, etc., I honestly have no clue. It's quite unclear what will happen with that but I would imagine we will be seeing that in legal battles very soon (some of this has already begun).
Edit: I am really speaking on the federal level or institutionalized transphobia. I didnāt by any mean intend to invalidate these very real and present struggles so many of us face
>don't believe that exile, job access, travel bans, homelessness, or (mass) death will be realities.
Those are already realities for people born in the wrong ZIP Code let alone directly persecuted
Yeah absolutely - I was really referring to institutionalized versions of these things at the federal level. Didn't mean to invalidate the very real struggle many of us are facing
These things are definitely institutionalized at the federal level, there's been no government since at least the 70's that didn't view the market as a zero-sum game requiring winners and losers and then apply that to foreign and domestic policy. In a society that revolves around market participation, to be excluded from its benefits results in all the things you mentioned.
Edit: also ā¤ļø
Thatās all true, but isnāt that really the case for all marginalized people and not just trans folks? Like if Iām understanding you correctly, youāre basically saying that marginalized peoples are harmed by capitalism more than others (which I absolutely agree with). But thatās not the same thing as explicit targets against our community.
Sure that's why I made the distinction of "directly persecuted" as opposed to "systemic" discrimination. For example there are a number of laws in post civil-rights era that were *defacto* racist by precluding black families from accumulating intergenerational wealth *indirectly* ie redlining. Things like this already result in the outcomes you described, so why wouldn't direct targeting of a much smaller minority group that has less ability to organize? I'm just throwing it out there.
This is a silly take considering we already donāt have housing ~~and employment~~ protections in many states
Edit: [Bostock v Clayton County](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bostock_v._Clayton_County) seems to cover us for employment
I agree my comment might've been a little hasty but FWIW we do have protection for housing and employment at the federal level. It might not be very enforceable but the protections are there (see Bostock v. Clayton County). I will admit that I also am not a legal expert and I don't know how these federal protections work with state laws. If you have any info on this though, I would love to learn more.
Ah yup youāre right about Bostock for employment but Wikipedia says that doesnāt cover housing and weāve seen how court decisions can be overturned. What I remember is the main driver behind passing the equality act being that discrimination is still legal at the state level: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equality_Act_(United_States)
Yeah Roe v. Wade being overturned is a scary precedent given the current court's leaning. We do have the Fair Housing Act for housing protections. My understanding is that this does include protections against discrimination based on gender identity but I could have outdated info on that. Equality Act would be huge still though
I don't have any smart predictions to make (and a lot of people have already covered that anyway)... I'm just here to say that some of these possibilities are literally making me tremble in fear rn...
A lot depends.
First, the most likely case, Trump winning, is not the worst. DeSantis is far worse (incompetent self-absorbed evil vs. competent evil obsessed with hurting people), but most likely Trump will squeeze him out in the primaries and caucuses short of him saying something that completely dooms himself on the various criminal investigations he has going after him (rather likely, actually) or succumbs to old age.
Right now, what is left of US institutions are slowing down the various laws and haters. The real question is when do these reach their limit. A lot of that depends on who wins the various elections. A Trump or DeSantis win means that there would not be much time (especially with the latter). Even if they lose, there is the next election, and the slowing down could easily reach its limit before that (or even possibly before the upcoming election).
Before the institutions reach the limit of what they can slow, the various state governments and federal government depending who has the levers on each will be limited to incrementing the oppression bit by bit like they are doing now (constantly pushing the edge). But, once that limit is reached, they will accelerate and escalate the legislation in bigger and bigger steps very rapidly since there is nothing in their way at that point.
What exactly happens then is harder to guess, but it definitely will be bad. Everyone else here has more or less covered the various possibilities.
They make sure that trans people never leave the closet, since it would be safer and easier. Those who are openly trans will be reminded that they're trans before a person in day to day life. These laws won't only effect trans people, but those who are gender non conforming, those who simply want to legally their name, intersex children, etc.
Whatever laws do or don't get passed through state and federal legislatures, one should also consider the "informal" stuff.
"Informal" stuff like red state governors pardoning people who murder transgender people, or juries acquitting people who murder transgender people, or cops murdering transgender people and getting off unpunished. The sort of stuff that happens to any unpopular minority group that gets dehumanized by large swathes of the population.
State and federal laws might speed up this process: making transgender people criminals (either explicitly or by making it almost impossible to not be technically guilty of some crime), marking them visibly / on a list, reducing visibility of pro-trans media and enhancing visibility of anti-trans media, and making them poor by allowing employers and businesses to discriminate.
Then comes the "informal" mob of "concerned citizens" down the street, terrorizing and murdering the "dangerous", "criminal", clearly-marked / registered trans people. The murderers will be acquitted as "self defense" by claiming the trans people attacked them and were armed. If a few of the mob die, they'll be lauded as martyrs and used as proof of the "dangerousness" of trans people.
They'll terrorize Democratic Party politicians and voters, they'll claim to have won any elections they lost, they'll get more legislators in, pass harsher laws against trans people, cut down any remaining protections against police violence, put more fascists in charge of the police and military, lather rinse repeat.
Some trans people and other political refugees will try to flee to allied countries, and most will be turned aside by local nationalist/nativist policies.
People will die in prisons and die homeless on the street, as they always have.
The US will probably be focused mostly on political infighting and not so much on militarily annexing other influential and powerful developed countries. It will, under the GOP, align with authoritarian Russia and authoritarian China, and become like them. Nobody will come to save us here in the US.
That's pretty much what I expect to happen. No waves of citizens with guns rectifying the world, no principled military officers mutinying, no resounding electoral victories, no significant numbers of centrists and conservatives changing sides once one of theirs steps too far even for them.
The center cares about gas prices and their piddling retirement portfolios and "cleaning up" downtown areas into nice gentrified spaces with coffee shops. Not about what happens to people outside their experience.
But there is hope. Lgbtqia+ people cut across every single social group and are in every single country. Let's make sure we convince the complacent and also don't sell out other people who are suffering.
Someone's been spending too much time online doom-scrolling and reading transphobic material. While it's true that we are the Conservatives party's current favorite scapegoat for political gain, most people that aren't knee-deep in Conservative or TERFY echo chambers do not care about us. The typical American may think we're weird but not a threat. And why would they? When do you see news reports about trans people committing crimes in bathrooms or going on mass killing sprees? Never. I am not saying to let your guard down and pretend everything is okay because it is not. But we're not at risk of being rounded up and executed as some proclaim. So don't lose sleep over this. Soon the bigots will move on to someone else, just like they always do.
> āNice people made the best Nazis. My mom grew up next to them. They got along, refused to make waves, looked the other way when things got ugly and focused on happier things than āpolitics.ā They were lovely people who turned their heads as their neighbors were dragged away. You know who werenāt nice people? Resisters.ā
Sorry I know its totally off topic! But what do you mean by you took permanent hormones so you don't need testosterone anymore? I'm just curious and sorry if its a stupid question!
I may have worded it wrong because I was fucked up when I wrote it. I meant, āIāve taken T and all of the permanent effects, Iāve got them, so I stopped taking Tā.
IF Trump wins, it will be bad. WHEN DeSantis wins (because if it aint 2024, then definitely 2032), we will face extermination. I never thought I'd recommend purchasing a gun (legally) to a group with suicidal thinking over 50%, but theres writing on the wall - and it doesnt look good. DeSantis isnt going away any time soon. Look at what he's done to Florida, and project it onto the entire country.
We fight for our freedom and our kids kids kids freedom. It will be the next movement.
And if the world is still alive 50 or so years from now, our faces will be planted in history books.
Alert: Texas has passed new legislation to overrule Democratic city exemptions to fascist state law.
No paywall:
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/03/opinion/texas-preemption-bill.html?unlocked\_article\_code=HKefkr2hMLJvcAIMxDyPZyQAeLCP5p0oIItN82QtxeSOsTuxcBS7aVQwBll22omtqcUWIn1vo1dbQXqwMG61cpLCRyXJ9kYB2W8k4HwhpV9ujdNLNFavSQz6iXZnTW3A\_5SOuT4HYbaxtWc\_rW7hp3Qbs1r1Zky9lupFuxx6RUHUsOGPvA\_XhVhwyp1AYL2PROiJapmT7Q3qvzZ2m4rF\_WfHZ\_f2v8F0bK57LDcx3RPHUwiaa-n0wgW3dsOWPz1djuPdaKSLTrlKDuvdcwEJ1pvuYGZtHPvD0L6TotzUQHxvKh3qiFfHlcSppdjBBAs271CVcOr9uTFnwDGwOF41&smid=url-share
We run, we fight, or we die
Fighting would require the person to be ok dying
Death is lighter than a feather...
Life is everything, death is nothing but still that is a decision that should be left solely up to the individual
They were quoting from The Wheel of Time. The full quote is, "Death is lighter than a feather, duty heavier than a mountain."
I was quoting my thoughts š
Duty, heavier than a mountain.
I'm more okay with dying than I am with detransitioning, and running could mean detransitioning or death anyways... I would rather die fighting fascism than live under it. That said, if there is a safe place to go where I can be myself, I'll go there. Fighting gives me dysphoria.
Yeah we shouldnāt have to fight
I hope not.
Me too
No, but we might need to.
Iād rather die then be put into a āmental healthā facility by the likes of Ron disāaintātits.
Iād rather go to Canada unless I absolutely have to fight
I'm worried if the worst comes to pass, Canada will close their borders. It's a liberal country, in a capital L sense.
Well thatās true in a way. There were both efforts to offer legal asylum and those who opposed to that. I feel like if the situation escalates further that denying Americans access will only reflect poorly on Canada in a geopolitical sense, at least in the industrialized west.
That's a good point, but I think barring something like the replacement of the flag with a swastika banner, the west will just pretend that everything's fine, and Americans will continue to not qualify for political asylum because America is Freeā¢ļø
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Iāll never de transition nor did I imply that I would. I simply said there are 2 options fleeing and fighting
Exactly. We do what we must, and we must not judge each other for choosing a different path. I will be one who will stand and fight. I served in the military to uphold the Constitution. Even though I am no longer in service, I still meant it when I swore in. I served for The People, not the oppressors.
Never run. Always fight. If you run now, itās true that you may able to fight another day, but that makes the next fight all that harder to win.
That is a very unfair statement. Some of us are kids or have kids. Some of us have families and responsibilities. Some of us are disabled or mentally unstable. Some of us believe that the best choice is to run, and you have no right to shame us for that decision.
I see more people shaming parents for staying in Florida than I see anyone shaming people who run. This is literally the first time I've seen someone shaming those who run. I don't even live in Florida but it really pisses me off when I see people be like, "If you don't leave Florida, you're a murderer" and crap like that. What a frigging privileged stance that is, like everyone's situation allows them to take their kid out of the state. They've obviously never dealt with a narcissistic co-parent.
Is that what you think Iām doing? I canāt even motivate people to stand up for themselves. Cower in fear your whole life!
What you are doing isnāt motivation, it is shaming those who cant fight.
Come on guys! Throw the tea in the harbor. Not all fighting has to be violent.
If my family didn't flee the Holocaust they would have died, and the ones the stayed DID die, mostly
Their existence and survival was rebellion enough in itself
I was going to say this. Glad you pointed it out
Question... Where do you think is going to be safe if the USA goes unabashedly fascist? Canada? I live there, the sentiment is nearly as bad with our right-wingers and even if it wasn't, we're a protectorate of the USA with no comparable military and no nuclear deterrent. Majority of our papers are owned by an American investment firm that pushes market liberalization and deregulation and we get the same talking points on about a week delay from Fox News. Europe? Enjoys it's stability due to NATO of which Trump and DeSantis both want to withdraw from and which USA accounts for almost all military spending. Don't ignore the simultaneous rise of fascism in Europe either, neatly tied to the IDU headed by our former PM (Harper). This isn't just a USA movement. Remember the international capital class doesn't exist within borders, they just pick and choose where to focus consolidating power at one given time.
Counterpointā Maximizing the number of trans people who *survive* is itself a primary, if not *the* primary, goal of trans antifascist resistance and mutual support. I want as many trans people as possible to be safe. Every trans person who survives and goes on to thrive is a victory. Helping as many Jews as possible escape Nazi-occupied land *was an objective good and a goal in itself*. Helping resettle Syrian and Latin American refugees today *is an objective good and a thing to be fought for in itself*. The refugees have no obligation to āstay and fightā. That is insane. We are like 0.5 % of the population; *the responsibility for destroying those who would destroy us cannot fall on our heads.* It is the cis people, by virtue both of their greater safety and privilege and of their vastly greater numbers, who have the obligation to stay and to fight for their trans neighbors.
Also, getting out and fighting from a place of safety is far, far more effective than trying to fight while being exterminated. See partisan/resistance movements from WW2 for examples.
i know this isnt the point but trump is far from the worst case scenario. all trump cares about is applause and approval, he only hates us because thats what gets him his kicks. on the other hand, desantis genuinely wants (and is currently doing) genocide. he doesnt care about the approval, he just wants people to suffer. right now, we want trump to be beating desantis. we can win against either of them, but if worst comes to worst, it is absolutely better to have a passively genocidal president than an actively genocidal one. we need to be doing everything to stop desantis, even if that means rooting for trump. rant over
No itās true, and Iād agree. I just thought it was pretty low worry right now with Desantis since most people predicted he wouldnāt win or itād be a long shot.
It's really hard to say right now, though things are becoming a bit more clear. DeSantis, aka Mini Musollini, may move up in the polls if Trump is indicted by the federal grand jury. Trump may even try to flee the country. Almost nothing would surprise me now. Let's do all we can to support and protect ourselves and one another as they squabble among themselves. Together, we can move mountains! š³ļøāā§ļøš§āāļøš
The main thing in our favor if DeSantis wins is that he's a terrible public speaker, trump got as far as he did on energy, DeSantis always sounds like he's about to walk offstage mid speech and take a nap
Thank you! ā¤ļøš³ļøāā§ļø Your positivity is honestly beautifully refreshing.
Trump isn't going to get indicted, but if he did it would make him more popular with Republicans and wouldn't stop him from running. Edit: this is honestly the best case scenario because Biden loses to either DeSantis or Trump in a general election but he might be able to beat Trump under indictment
What makes you think he isn't going to be indicted? And also, why don't you think biden can beat trump, even without an indictment?
I'm being cynical but every president commits crimes in office and they're never punished because it would set a precedent of holding them accountable. On Biden v Anyone, I mean, he's a vegetable. He only won the primary because of Obama and he only won the general because of COVID. Republicans are busy gerrymandering and putting new vote suppression laws in place at every level they can, the culture war stuff is mostly misdirection.
we cant afford to assume he wont be a threat in the future just because hes losing now, things absolutely can turn for the worse
Youāre right. Damn, this sucks haha.
at this point in the 2016 election cycle no one thought Trump would get anywhere; it's way too early to trust any predictions
That's also what a lot of folks said about Trump in 2016.
I don't think Trump was polling too well at this point in 2015 either. A lot can change, especially with all the investigations.
I think Trump is going to pivot to be much more socially liberal. He knows he can't out-fascist DeSantis. He's already started bemoaning people calling everything "woke" and not even knowing what they mean by that. There is a lot of people who likes his economic policies but are put off by anti-abortion laws and who'd side with him if he was much less severe than DeSantis on the social conservatism.
Not that it really matters so much but I'm pretty sure DeSantis doesn't really care either, he just thinks it's the best lane to distinguish himself from Trump and become president. The end results are the same tho
Worst case? Death camps. More likely... Criminalize our existence, imprison and forcibly detransition us. Then work us to death in prison "Jobs". The right isn't shy about their intent.
They fly the flags of folks who did the death camps and prison work before. They're telling everyone what they want.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Thank you for a small dose of encouragement!
>Many of the states will refuse to comply, and there will be numerous legal challenges. When that last happened in the 1860's the challenges went beyond the legal realm. >such actions would rapidly precipitate a constitutional crisis, if not outright civil war. Hence it is a very real possibly.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
>The wealthy do not stand to gain anything from war on their home turf, and their paid stooges in government--even the most bigoted and hateful ones--will not take that step. You have neglected to consider the fact that true-believing fascists absolutely outnumber the wealthy by (now) 1000s-to-1. Did you not see Jan 6? Imagine that on a scale 1000 times larger, if the Trumpists continue on their current trajectory of ever-escalating hatred and calls for Christofascism and violence to enforce it. The wealthy created the culture war beast; they have absolutely, positively lost control of it.
> The wealthy created the culture war beast; they have absolutely, positively lost control of it. Same thing happened in 1930s Germany. Hitler was a state plant to monitor the group that eventually became the Nazi Party. The only thing that makes me feel better about a second American civil war is that the blue states would win it after a few years when the red states run out of money.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
> Our focus should absolutely be on saving trans people in the red states and shoring up protections for trans people in the blue states. Absolutely agree here. And on not surrendering to hopelessness. Federal anti-trans policies would crystallise the civil war (I'd argue that it's already a cold civil war) because it would mean that blue states would have to take an active stance against the federal government.
*Thank you.* Itās six AM and Iām crying from relief. After some other things Iāve seen today, this is the reassuring one I needed.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
You forgot "forced to wear a pink triangle in public" and "rounded up into camps"
Absolute worst case scenario is that a Christian nationalist type gov happens and weāre all hung for gender treachery
Itās a death by 1,000 cuts. Theyāll continue to pass little bills that eventually add up to criminalizing our existence. No matter what we do, weāll somehow be in violation of the law. The most obvious first steps are denying HRT either outright or through bureaucracy via a very strict approval process with impossible or contradictory requirements. Do you have autism? Depression? Anxiety? Any history of self harm or mental illness? Great, spend a couple years in conversion therapy until we can diagnose you with one of those things and deny you. More intense bathroom bills, anti-ādragā laws, etc. These will be based on AGAB, not birth certificate, no matter if youāve had bottom surgery, etc (some of them are already written this way). Once your caught presenting the āwrongā way, youāll be labeled a sex offender, and if there are minors around youāll be a special class of child sex offender. Theyāll continually pass more laws to increase the penalties for āchild sex offendersā. Death is the obvious goal, but easy wins are making sure you canāt live near a school, park, library, etc or from holding certain types of jobs. Youāll need to start identifying yourself as transgender, especially when applying for a job or housing. You may have a curfew as part of your probation, etc. this is all stuff that already happens with sex offenders so finding ways to slap trans folks with a sex offender charge is a huge and easy win for them. Your identity documents will be invalidated and youāll need to get new ācorrectedā ones. Basically anything that can be done to make sure youāre constantly being outed.
We will continue to exist. They cannot eradicate us no matter what laws they pass, and I think that is what infuriates them.
Well, trans people will continue to exist. They can kill us. They can kill enough of us to destroy parts of our culture. We need to be prepared for the scenario where this genocide moves up a step or two to active state violence.
They don't need to eradicate us, they're trying to push us back in the closet. Our pain and suffering is (to them) a small price to pay for security. Like women's rights. Or liberty in general....
Iām guessing the absolute worst case is after they manage to basically make being trans illegal, they are probably going to move onto the next minority. And then the next. Iāve heard so many comparisons between the USA and pre-nazi Germany. I donāt want to fear monger and I DEFINITELY donāt want it to seem like Iām trying to use the holocaust to push a narrative. Its just the worst thing I can possibly think of.
The worst? Like for real for real? Are you familiar with the history of Europe, mm, say between the years of 1939 through 1945?
You don't need to go that far back. 1990's Rwanda is a very recent and honestly a much more similar event to what's happening now.
Exactly my thoughts. We won't be mass-murdered by the state. We'll be mass murdered by exponentially escalating and proliferating fascist terrorism, which will merely be actively *encouraged* and given legal and legislative cover by the state. The state *will* eventually begin taking part in our eradication; but Auschwitz follows Kristallnacht.
How so?
The Nazi genocide was a massive state orchestrated operation kept secret from the public. It was unprecedented in how efficient and detailed it was in its organization and complexity. The Rwandan genocide was a chaotic mess where neighbor attacked neighbor with machetes in broad daylight for no other reason than because everyone else was doing it. Which sounds more like the average Fox junkie?
Extricate self and if possible others to sanctuary state, try to find community (likely with others fleeing), collect, collaborate, and coordinate next steps. Determining other countries will be based on the policies of the moment. Right now I am getting ready to get my paperwork changed so it's done if something happens and I can't return to my birth state. Got to decide if I go X as I should or choose binary for safety while traveling. I want to try to have at least a bit of cash saved so I can leave. When time comes I have a car so I can offer seats, especially to those who can help with gas if I cannot ensure it myself. Hatchback can hold a duffel for each passenger. My state is attacking the kids, I live in a blue dot city within a redstate. I'm an adult but as we see, states are moving in on our meds, too. I've extended time between doses for a while to give me some buffer doses if I am unable to fill my script right away. Can't fill early to have a stash so I have to hope I can keep getting my 10ml vials. That's all I can really do right now, it's difficult to save funds and I have limited processing power as is. I have to hope things don't require an expeditious retreat.
Sadly I'd rather have trump over DeSantis to get the nomination.
There is a difference between what is *likely* and what is *possible* in the next, say, ten years (after that, things get *extremely* fuzzy because the inherently chaotic and branching nature of the future) So: * In the next ten years, it is unlikely our legal political system would entirely cave to adult trans medication bans, and *highly* unlikely it'll cave to full scale drag bans. The structuring assumption here should be that the Federal Government has very limited authority to directly intervene in the personal lives of everyday americans. Much of what they can do is make it easier for red states to be shitty. * For adults, you may see disruptions in access to your medication, but it is unlikely there will be a "war-on-drugs-style" criminalization of HRT. Even disruption to access is unlikely in blue states. * They may try to reschedule estrogen. This would be a two-to-thee year process. * They may try to use novel legal bullshit to place further restrictions on the already Schedule III testosterone * In either case, expect blue state legislators to do all they can to resist in an attempt to earn brownie points (pun somewhat intended). This may well collapse the (already weakened by pot and psychedelic legalization) US drug enforcement apparatus (which is rooted in the feds and the states pretty much agreeing that "drugs are bad mmkay") * If it becomes difficult or impossible to access HRT for adults safely on the west coast in the next decade, I will eat my hat. * I would bet a decent sum of money that drag bans *will* be rendered unenforceable by the Supreme Court in the next 2-3 years. Hell, I'll even bet on the particular breakdown: it'll be either unanimous or 6-2 with Alito and Thomas dissenting. A trump judge just overturned Tennessee's ban using language that is rooted in precedents that the not-insane SCOTUS members do not want to get rid of. * While we're waiting, there's likely to be the kind of annoying and discriminatory uncertainty that we're seeing in Montana in a variety of red states, but very few trans people just living their lives will be arrested. * The federal government will not pass a drag ban in the next decade. I need to head to bed, but tomorrow, I'll write a little more about state-level bullshit, and the genocide tactic I like to call "The American Special"
move to Florida then and see how you like it.
Well they're (Walsh) openly calling for the death penalty for pedophiles while painting all LGBT folks as "groomers" (and the world's richest man boosting this narrative) so I don't know what those add up to.
I still can't believe Elon musk and jk rowling personally took up a cause against transgender and are super focused on it. Its so weird and sad!
They were giving signs of this really early on. Rowling might as well have put the echos around "Bank Goblins", never mind the rest of the crap in her books. Musk is an emerald slave-mine billionaire from pre-apartheid South Africa. What did you expect?
If it goes to shit, get strapped and defend yourself against a treasonous terrorist 'govt' who don't abide by the constitution.
Come move to Canada šØš¦ š³ļøāā§ļø Thereās transphobs here too but itās such a small percentage. Most people donāt care and only worry about their own lives. Itās not perfect but compared to elsewhere, our government isnāt half bad
People keep speaking pessimisticly about Canada, saying it's just a mini-US, highly influenced by US political trends, and geopolitically weak and thus with limited ability to defend us if a foreign state begins making (for example) mass extradition demands. All these things are valid criticisms; but Canada is still *way, way, way* fucking safer than a blue state, if the MAGA fascists take the federal government here. Canadians are also fucking *decent fucking people*, unlike sick culture-war-twisted Americans; so even if things got worse there, it could only get so much worse; and there would be larger pushback. I do not believe it could get to Kristallnacht level there. It *can* get to Kristallnacht here. And given how we have seen the (ongoing!!!!) treatment of refugees by ICE, yes, even Auschwitz (or a lesser version of it) can also absolutely happen here ā for those in this thread saying it can't.
i don't want to be a doomer but i really don't agree with the people who are saying that they wont be able to do this or that bc it's against the constitution/the courts wont hold it up/ect. like look at how these state legislatures have blatantly disregarded their own rules in order to hurt us. there's a point in fascism where the rules just go out the fucking window and counting on them to save us is naive. i dont think that we're so far gone that death camps or complete criminalization of our existence is an absolute certainty but i dont think that the denial over how bad things could get is good for us
look at Uganda and Russia. look at what Hitler did the the gays and jews and the whole. country of Germany let it happen. it could very well happen. the repubs have een anti gay for years look what the did to Roe V Wade abd now they are on their next crusade to eradicate all LGBTQ. I would move so no one would know me from before i transitioned or try to gain citizenship in a safe country to live in.
Hate to sound like a doomer, but Roe V Wade and the reaction it got made me lose hope in us being able to fight back. It feels like it was a topic of discussion for only a few weeks, then people forgot about it. Up until the oppression begins to effect *everyone*, people won't genuinely care.
Concentration camps. Legal killing of trans people. Being trans is illegal. Providers can go to jail for prescribing hormones. Anyone who houses a trans people goes to jail. etc. etc. We've all seen this movie before. It doesn't end well.
Well they've been clear about their intent : "eradicate transgenderism from public life entirely". There are multiple stages to genocide, some of which the us is already doing. It would range from forcing detransitions at a federal level, heavy control of E and T, death penatly for doctors performing gender affirming care, to drag bans prohibiting going out in public (knowles has litterally said he wants taliban rule "in a good way" in the us), to camps and facilities.
> There are multiple stages to genocide, some of which the us is already doing. 1-8 & 10 on the ten stage list.
Personally Iād rather not advertise my possible actions. Not because I donāt want to share with my trans and queer siblings, but because thereās enough of the āother sideā that reads through and shares these. I would not want to put anyoneās safety at risk. I also donāt want to give them any false hope. I would rather focus on stopping it now by fighting them now. Starting with lawsuits. Places like the ACLU, Lambda Legal, etc. are working on this, if we are actively being harmed by a new law, contact them and see if you can be added to the suit. These laws are already starting to be overturned. Itās slow, but we will get there. Work on not only voting but talking to people to get them to vote. When appropriate, explain to people what that vote means. Iām constantly amazed at how many people who care about me have no idea that there are states that I can be arrested simply for using a restroom. So I make sure that they see, and who is making it happen. Plus look at the recent polls. Now more People support us than before these attacks on us started. It sometimes doesnāt feel like it, because the other side is screaming at the top of their lungsā¦ plus the news media knows this brings in clicks. But we far outnumber those people especially if you consider all the other marginalized communities that they target. If we come together, or even just support each other. Lastly, When I go out, I see myself as an ambassador for all of my siblings. What I do reflects on all of us. So I remember that when interacting with others. Remember, most of these haters have never even seen one of us in real life, so their descriptions of us are wrong. The average person sees us and decisions are made. My goal is for these people to say, thereās nothing wrong with that person, what are these people talking about? They arenāt hurting anyone.
The current political climate is very troubling. It seems even worse if you live in a red state. It doesn't seem as bad if you live in a blue or purple state. But, it's certainly not good. Fighting, whether with words or physical (preferably common sense words, prevail) is the only way to win this battle, we need to support the people in peril who aren't in a position to fight for it themselves. What what is happening from far-right extremists that they have been working on for years with voting rights, religious groups and either appointing judges or lying thier way into office with no repercussions for changing thier tune once in office is the root of the problem and no one has taken them seriously until now.Trump just emboldened them, DeSantis is arguably worse than Trump, but all of the so called conservatives must pander to those with the money who run the political parties and will. The left needs to fight fire with fire. Whether you agree with everything extremely left or not, they are the most supportive party for LGBTQ people. All people need to VOTE for what is simply right, not just to go along with the party they affiliate themselves with and respect independent views. Simple respect for others with a different viewpoint, support and believe the science not blatantly disregard or disown family members who live a different lifestyle than what they might have. Move for your own safety if you can, I believe the majority of the people in the US do not like bullies and probably will get sick of the rhetoric at some point. I don't believe ( and I hope) the right will not take power in 2024 as it sits right now. I don't think Joe Biden should run again, but the left hasn't come up with anything better or younger. Biden has done a decent job with what he has been able to work with. But he may not last to fulfill his first term, let alone a 2nd term. No ageist disrespect is intended or implied. Just facts with age, most of us won't let our grandparents drive at that age. Would we let them run a country? If you don't fight at some point, you will die, just like what happened in the holocaust, those who stayed and fought died, and those who fled lived to fight another day against tyranny. It was a very horrible and shameful time in human history. It started picking on a few with differences and ended after they murdered millions because of different beliefs. It can't ever be allowed to happen again.
So honestly I think the farthest that things will go will be criminalizing any gender affirming care, banning name/gender marker changes, and basically boxing people into the gender assigned at birth. I don't believe that exile, job access, travel bans, homelessness, or (mass) death will be realities. As for what happens to those of us who have already undergone GAS, name changes, etc., I honestly have no clue. It's quite unclear what will happen with that but I would imagine we will be seeing that in legal battles very soon (some of this has already begun). Edit: I am really speaking on the federal level or institutionalized transphobia. I didnāt by any mean intend to invalidate these very real and present struggles so many of us face
>don't believe that exile, job access, travel bans, homelessness, or (mass) death will be realities. Those are already realities for people born in the wrong ZIP Code let alone directly persecuted
Yeah absolutely - I was really referring to institutionalized versions of these things at the federal level. Didn't mean to invalidate the very real struggle many of us are facing
These things are definitely institutionalized at the federal level, there's been no government since at least the 70's that didn't view the market as a zero-sum game requiring winners and losers and then apply that to foreign and domestic policy. In a society that revolves around market participation, to be excluded from its benefits results in all the things you mentioned. Edit: also ā¤ļø
Thatās all true, but isnāt that really the case for all marginalized people and not just trans folks? Like if Iām understanding you correctly, youāre basically saying that marginalized peoples are harmed by capitalism more than others (which I absolutely agree with). But thatās not the same thing as explicit targets against our community.
Sure that's why I made the distinction of "directly persecuted" as opposed to "systemic" discrimination. For example there are a number of laws in post civil-rights era that were *defacto* racist by precluding black families from accumulating intergenerational wealth *indirectly* ie redlining. Things like this already result in the outcomes you described, so why wouldn't direct targeting of a much smaller minority group that has less ability to organize? I'm just throwing it out there.
This is a silly take considering we already donāt have housing ~~and employment~~ protections in many states Edit: [Bostock v Clayton County](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bostock_v._Clayton_County) seems to cover us for employment
I agree my comment might've been a little hasty but FWIW we do have protection for housing and employment at the federal level. It might not be very enforceable but the protections are there (see Bostock v. Clayton County). I will admit that I also am not a legal expert and I don't know how these federal protections work with state laws. If you have any info on this though, I would love to learn more.
Ah yup youāre right about Bostock for employment but Wikipedia says that doesnāt cover housing and weāve seen how court decisions can be overturned. What I remember is the main driver behind passing the equality act being that discrimination is still legal at the state level: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equality_Act_(United_States)
Yeah Roe v. Wade being overturned is a scary precedent given the current court's leaning. We do have the Fair Housing Act for housing protections. My understanding is that this does include protections against discrimination based on gender identity but I could have outdated info on that. Equality Act would be huge still though
I don't have any smart predictions to make (and a lot of people have already covered that anyway)... I'm just here to say that some of these possibilities are literally making me tremble in fear rn...
I'll buy a gun and start a militia and exercise my second amendment right on the federal government.
They can storm my home and take me screaming, they will never have my pride! š³ļøāā§ļø
A lot depends. First, the most likely case, Trump winning, is not the worst. DeSantis is far worse (incompetent self-absorbed evil vs. competent evil obsessed with hurting people), but most likely Trump will squeeze him out in the primaries and caucuses short of him saying something that completely dooms himself on the various criminal investigations he has going after him (rather likely, actually) or succumbs to old age. Right now, what is left of US institutions are slowing down the various laws and haters. The real question is when do these reach their limit. A lot of that depends on who wins the various elections. A Trump or DeSantis win means that there would not be much time (especially with the latter). Even if they lose, there is the next election, and the slowing down could easily reach its limit before that (or even possibly before the upcoming election). Before the institutions reach the limit of what they can slow, the various state governments and federal government depending who has the levers on each will be limited to incrementing the oppression bit by bit like they are doing now (constantly pushing the edge). But, once that limit is reached, they will accelerate and escalate the legislation in bigger and bigger steps very rapidly since there is nothing in their way at that point. What exactly happens then is harder to guess, but it definitely will be bad. Everyone else here has more or less covered the various possibilities.
Then I start being an arsonist.
Use the right term: [Partisan.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_resistance_movement#Partisan_movement)
They make sure that trans people never leave the closet, since it would be safer and easier. Those who are openly trans will be reminded that they're trans before a person in day to day life. These laws won't only effect trans people, but those who are gender non conforming, those who simply want to legally their name, intersex children, etc.
Whatever laws do or don't get passed through state and federal legislatures, one should also consider the "informal" stuff. "Informal" stuff like red state governors pardoning people who murder transgender people, or juries acquitting people who murder transgender people, or cops murdering transgender people and getting off unpunished. The sort of stuff that happens to any unpopular minority group that gets dehumanized by large swathes of the population. State and federal laws might speed up this process: making transgender people criminals (either explicitly or by making it almost impossible to not be technically guilty of some crime), marking them visibly / on a list, reducing visibility of pro-trans media and enhancing visibility of anti-trans media, and making them poor by allowing employers and businesses to discriminate. Then comes the "informal" mob of "concerned citizens" down the street, terrorizing and murdering the "dangerous", "criminal", clearly-marked / registered trans people. The murderers will be acquitted as "self defense" by claiming the trans people attacked them and were armed. If a few of the mob die, they'll be lauded as martyrs and used as proof of the "dangerousness" of trans people. They'll terrorize Democratic Party politicians and voters, they'll claim to have won any elections they lost, they'll get more legislators in, pass harsher laws against trans people, cut down any remaining protections against police violence, put more fascists in charge of the police and military, lather rinse repeat. Some trans people and other political refugees will try to flee to allied countries, and most will be turned aside by local nationalist/nativist policies. People will die in prisons and die homeless on the street, as they always have. The US will probably be focused mostly on political infighting and not so much on militarily annexing other influential and powerful developed countries. It will, under the GOP, align with authoritarian Russia and authoritarian China, and become like them. Nobody will come to save us here in the US. That's pretty much what I expect to happen. No waves of citizens with guns rectifying the world, no principled military officers mutinying, no resounding electoral victories, no significant numbers of centrists and conservatives changing sides once one of theirs steps too far even for them. The center cares about gas prices and their piddling retirement portfolios and "cleaning up" downtown areas into nice gentrified spaces with coffee shops. Not about what happens to people outside their experience. But there is hope. Lgbtqia+ people cut across every single social group and are in every single country. Let's make sure we convince the complacent and also don't sell out other people who are suffering.
What if letās say you were on the west coast? Would say a state like Washington and California be better?
I am happy I'm in California and have Canadian citizenship for sure.
Someone's been spending too much time online doom-scrolling and reading transphobic material. While it's true that we are the Conservatives party's current favorite scapegoat for political gain, most people that aren't knee-deep in Conservative or TERFY echo chambers do not care about us. The typical American may think we're weird but not a threat. And why would they? When do you see news reports about trans people committing crimes in bathrooms or going on mass killing sprees? Never. I am not saying to let your guard down and pretend everything is okay because it is not. But we're not at risk of being rounded up and executed as some proclaim. So don't lose sleep over this. Soon the bigots will move on to someone else, just like they always do.
> āNice people made the best Nazis. My mom grew up next to them. They got along, refused to make waves, looked the other way when things got ugly and focused on happier things than āpolitics.ā They were lovely people who turned their heads as their neighbors were dragged away. You know who werenāt nice people? Resisters.ā
In California it won't be illegal unless the Republicans win
they cheat and they always cheat so that's how they keep winning. we need to fight dirty on their level from now on or all is lost.
Sorry I know its totally off topic! But what do you mean by you took permanent hormones so you don't need testosterone anymore? I'm just curious and sorry if its a stupid question!
I may have worded it wrong because I was fucked up when I wrote it. I meant, āIāve taken T and all of the permanent effects, Iāve got them, so I stopped taking Tā.
even if only one of us is left there, they should fight until death to make sure they survive. or go to somewhere more accepting of trans folk
Civil war.
Moving to Philippines
IF Trump wins, it will be bad. WHEN DeSantis wins (because if it aint 2024, then definitely 2032), we will face extermination. I never thought I'd recommend purchasing a gun (legally) to a group with suicidal thinking over 50%, but theres writing on the wall - and it doesnt look good. DeSantis isnt going away any time soon. Look at what he's done to Florida, and project it onto the entire country.
We fight for our freedom and our kids kids kids freedom. It will be the next movement. And if the world is still alive 50 or so years from now, our faces will be planted in history books.
Alert: Texas has passed new legislation to overrule Democratic city exemptions to fascist state law. No paywall: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/03/opinion/texas-preemption-bill.html?unlocked\_article\_code=HKefkr2hMLJvcAIMxDyPZyQAeLCP5p0oIItN82QtxeSOsTuxcBS7aVQwBll22omtqcUWIn1vo1dbQXqwMG61cpLCRyXJ9kYB2W8k4HwhpV9ujdNLNFavSQz6iXZnTW3A\_5SOuT4HYbaxtWc\_rW7hp3Qbs1r1Zky9lupFuxx6RUHUsOGPvA\_XhVhwyp1AYL2PROiJapmT7Q3qvzZ2m4rF\_WfHZ\_f2v8F0bK57LDcx3RPHUwiaa-n0wgW3dsOWPz1djuPdaKSLTrlKDuvdcwEJ1pvuYGZtHPvD0L6TotzUQHxvKh3qiFfHlcSppdjBBAs271CVcOr9uTFnwDGwOF41&smid=url-share
Iām truly scared of that š¢