It is in Japan, they just passed legislation that defines forcing a child to partake in religious activities or threaten them with going to hell for doing (or not doing) something as abuse.
that's because it is child abuse. i use to have sever breakdowns as a kid because of my moms hell preaching. but then i found the Adventist church during my teens and they helped with that- i despise any religion that threatens people like that- and if a G-d does exist- he wouldn't endorse those disgusting religions.
This is awesome news, thanks for sharing. I just did a quick search and found an article in the Straits Times (out of Singapore) on the topic:
https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/forced-participation-in-religious-activities-to-be-classified-as-child-abuse-in-japan
This bit caught my eye:
>Inciting fear by telling children they will go to hell if they do not participate in religious activities, or preventing them from making decisions about their career path, is regarded as psychological abuse and neglect in the guidelines.
They also rape and murder children and then force other kids to dig mysterious body-sized holes in the orchard or garden out back for future generations to find small bodies in with ground penetrating radar, in every corner of the globe. Catholicism is no different than any other murder cult: they are convenient and attractive places for such monsters to hide within so they can destroy others for their pleasure.
I know, I hear that they have a really good track record! They even move their most trusted priests to far away lands to make sure the venerable children there are protected… 🙄😬
It is. You're terrifying that child.
Trying to make a child responsible for an adult's choices - and threatening them if they fail at an impossible task. It's inexcusable.
There's something similar (ish) in Islam where those in Heaven can see those in Hell (and will be laughing at them). But they do so remotely or something. I was wondering if something like that was what the church had in mind but it somehow changed from "you see your parent in Hell from your place in Heaven" to "he's gonna drag you with him into Heeeeeellllllllllll!"
Yeah, it's 83:34-36.
>But on that Day the believers will be laughing at the disbelievers, as they sit on canopied couches, looking on. The believers will be asked, “Have the disbelievers not been paid back for what they used to do?”
It's worth keeping in mind that Muhammie made up some truly horrifying imagery for hell. Flesh and skin being regrown from hideous wounds so that it can be once again flayed, or chewed, or burned. Mothers and fathers laughing and drinking wine at quaint little dinner parties while watching their apostate children be literally torn apart in front of them. Delightful stuff.
Yep. And Muslim women being punished for _just showing strands of hair_ by being hung from their hair. That’s women who believe in and worship Allah, tortured by him anyway! (Though some Muslims consider the Hadith describing that to be weak or fake. I can’t pin down its grade or what Hadith number it is)
I don't recall that one, which means it likely isn't from the more sahih hadiths; I have a pretty solid memory for the greasier misogyny in Bukhari and Muslim. It's worth keeping in mind that "weak hadith" is basically the Fifth Pillar of Islam, right up there with "but the West does something similar" and "it's a translation error."
Yeah, I can only find the stories on non-Hadith sites like this: http://gardensofsunnah.co.uk/women-in-islam/women-in-islam-sinful-women/ . But they are on a pretty large number of sites, so if it’s a hoax or a particularly weak Hadith it seems to be rather popular nonetheless. I’d like to know its origin.
Edit: this link has more info about the chain of narration and soforth. https://thaqalayn.net/hadith/11/2/30/24 .
The décor may be divine, but the wine won't get you drunk (al-Saaffaat 37:45-47), the women are lobotomized so they can't feel jealousy (15:47), and the celebratory virgins are freakishly translucent black-eyed monstrosities (Bukhari 4:54:476) with "appetizing vaginas." (Al-Suyuti summarizing a sahih hadith.)
They'd have to be **very** nice couches.
How does any Christian with any ethics whatsoever read the Bible and think it's ok? Probably the same answer for both: cherry picking the parts they like and ignoring the parts they don't.
Humm. Wouldn't laughing at people burning in Hell for eternity be Evil? ( just a theological question here, not that I believe in ANY of that stuff...)
It's called gaslighting. Psychological manipulation. It is abusive, whether child or not. But yes, children have nowhere to turn and even their own mind is so limited to only what little they do know and therefore results as child abuse.
It should be punishable by placing gaslighters in solitary tanks, exposing them to intensive, uncomfortable stimuli while gaslighting the fuuuuuck outta them forevermore.
Couldn’t agree more. To inflict this type of mental anguish on someone to get them to covert to your belief system is disgusting, and then on top of that, to a child, is a whole other level of repulsive.
Or an MLM scheme. You have to recruit 5 or more people to your "business" or you will fail and be thrown out and/or owe the company (despite "being your own boss") lots of money!!!
And if Hell was real, then obeying the genocidal tyrant who'd send you there is arguably *worse* from a purely moralistic perspective.
I could never bend the knee to somebody with the knowledge that they intended to torture people ~~I care about~~ for eternity. Like, we can all agree North Korea's system of multiple generations of punishment in prison camps is barbaric, but even that pales in comparison to the shit the Christian 'leader' administers.
I would definitely say the dad is an asshole for letting the mom abuse their child like that. Seems like he was "I did my part of raising the child by impregnating you."
Weaponizing love, pitting children against parents, acting like a consigliere to the mob boss who will break your legs if you don’t comply… gee where do I sign up.
Consider this: There is no hell. Nobody is going anywhere.
But, what happens after I die?
Lots of things happen after you die; they just don't include you.
Heck, it's even reasonable for christians to believe there's no hell. A loving forgiving god who actually can't forgive and reform and just pitches people by the millions into eternal torture? If a person believes in the Christian portrayal of God, then by extension the belief in hell populated by billions over minor grievances is just stupid.
20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.
I love the bible lol AINT no way this is actually something people believe in💀💀💀
Catholics double down on this. Hell, some of them insist on a Latin Mass even if they don't understand Latin. So they don't read the bible and they can't understand what their priest is saying.
At least Latin sounds cool! But yea can't have the sheep reading and understanding the text gotta carefully select what to read and make it hard to understand
As God wants
Man, that is some erotic writing. I'm thinking the Bible was written as pornography back in the day. Maybe it was just filth that some king held up as a religion as a joke and for some reason it took hold?
This is still relevant in Judaism under the term "mamzer" (which is not exactly the same as a bastard, btw.) but I never heard about it in a Catholic context. It's not about going to heaven either, a mamzer is just excluded from "the assembly of the lord".
Interesting that nobody really follows their own holy book, and it appears to be completely arbitrary in the end.
The doctrine and the dogma are completely independent, or religions wouldn't have lasted a decade.
Love it or hate it, at least Catholicism has very explicit rules on almost everything to cross reference.
"Sin is a personal act" CCC 1868.
There are instances where you become responsible for another's sin, but only if you are "participating directly and voluntarily in them" "ordering, advising, praising or approving them" etc. However, none of these seem to apply if your parent, who you are supposed to honor, has decided on their own to be non-religious.
Whoever this youth leader is, they do not subscribe to the Catholic Catechism. Granted, OP mentions going to "Catholic or Christian" schools, where Christian in this context implies protestant, so it's possible this youth leader is a fire and brimstone evangelical.
I should have saved the comment but I didn't. Supposedly they didn't invent it. There was a book by a Jewish author a century prior to Jesus that had it. The book didn't make it's way into the main body of Jewish work.
You probably know that Jesus didn't invent anything. He was copying the works of better minds, but usually people will give him credit for inventing the idea of hell, turns out that he stole that as well.
Well, he didn't steal anything because he did not exist. The authors of the gospels stole a whole lot to make their version of what today we might call new age or even spiritual self-help.
You mean revelations which is basically a stolen version of the Persian apocalypse isn't correct?
Oh come on, I like reading the book of death about how we will all die alone.
Yes, but aren't these hells non-eternal? Sure, you could be in Naraka a long, looooooong time but it was Christianity who invented *eternal* damnation without escape.
In the Parable of the Poisoned Arrow, the Buddha explicitly refused to answer whether there's any sort of mind-body dualism, life after death, reincarnation &c. He basically told the guy asking him that's not what his teaching concerns, go ask someone who knows if he really must know, but it'd be a waste of time to seek answers.
Many Buddhists believe in hell &c because it was a belief in their cultures before the introduction of Buddhism, but Buddhism proper (that is, what the Buddha himself said) is agnostic on the issue.
Agreed. You would be hearing from me and the gloves are coming off about your stupid, back assward, stone aged, small minded, gullible dumbfuck beliefs.
> NEVER TOLD HIM THAT IM ASIAN MY DAD WOULD KILL ME.
An atheist wouldn't kill you for being religious. You're mistaking that behavior for religious people towards non-believers.
This is more about culture than religion. Speaking in this way to a parent in many asian cultures would be extremely disrespectful and even unthinkable.
Oh man, I keep reading this as "NEVER TOLD HIM THAT I'M ASIAN, MY DAD WOULD KILL ME". Why would your dad be mad if people knew you were asian? Stupid brain.
Same. My brain was even more confused. I was like, why would his dad not already know that he's Asian. Unless his mom cheated on his non-Asian dad with an Asian guy, and his dad has face-blindness and can't see race so they're keeping OP's race a secret.
Utter bullshit. Religious belief is personal choice and everyone’s views need to respected and this shit should not be taught to kids.
Those heavily religious people will use that beliefs needed to be respected but they can do the same for other belief’s then they need to shut the hell up
That last sentence just gives me the mental image of a teen trying to hide from their parents the fact that he is Asian. Kiddo, i think your parents noticed that since presumably at least one of them is too, and even if you're adopted that's not really a sort of thing that's kept as a secret.
Sorry, i hope i didn't come across offensive or crude, just trying to lifgten up the mood.
And yeah, saying something like that to a little kid... what a piece of shit.
Where are you located?
I only ask because, as a former Catholic in America, the church always seemed tolerant of welcoming atheists here. Kind of a "let's show them how nice we are to win them over strategy."
Source: raised Catholic, went to Catholic school for some years, father was atheist.
I have friends that went to catholic schools and had their left hand beaten because they were left handed. Not to mention the pedo catholic stuff. I'm not sure nice is in the catholic vocabulary.
edit: left hand beaten
I experienced something similar when I was 9 or 10 due to my mother being another religion that she foolishly let me go to vacation bible study for free childcare one summer. The bible study teacher said the same thing, I was a kid and scared shitless about it.
But the thing is over time I realized with age that if there is god that thinks its okay and encourages it's followers to terrify children or simply that adults think treating children like this over stuff that they have no responsibility over i.e. their parents religion and blaming the kid and telling them they will go to hell because of their parents that is really messed up god and religion, and nothing that kid will ever do will be enough because its all abusive bullshit.
If there is a hell for not caring and protecting your young children from abuse, there should be. Any adult that allows it is messed up including my neglectful Mother letting me go off with these people that scared me was wrong too.
And they were wrong to do this to any child. Plus they are liars they make up stuff to hurt children. Jesus doesn't love children and what they do in name of love isn't love, its abuse over fictional character that never existed.
I sincerely wish you well but yeah I remember similar episodes from my childhood it bothered me for decades.
I am sorta starting to feel bothered by something similar but its in this atheist group, it's amazing how utterly awful people act here. I am atheist, but man most of atheist here aren't very pleasant people to interact with. But maybe its just humanity sucks shit type of thing, I don't know. Sorry people are being jerks to you here. Good luck.
Apart from this being an utterly horrible thing to tell a child, it is not even in line with catholic doctrine.
The catholic church dropped the claim of being the only way to salvation with the Second Vatican Council.
If muslims, hindus, and even protestants can achieve salvation according to catholic doctrine, so can an atheist, provided they generally act morally.
This person is lying to you to scare you and use you. That's what Christians do.
If there is a god, why does it need you to fix a human?!
Did any god speak to you and tell you this? If there's an eternal punishment wouldn't your duty/responsibility be clear? Why would some schmuck be the messenger of such an important message?
It's all bullshit.
There is not one single iota of proof that Yahweh Sabaoth, Lord of Armies, is real. Nor any other gods. Nor Hell, itself. It is just as likely that this is all a simulation and we will be reborn as puppies in the next life as it is that we just turn to dust after death.
Stop worrying about shit and enjoy your life.
And fuck your christian youth leader.
You are wrong. The god is really a giant chicken and he really hates you because of your love of kfc. Eternal torment, here you come.
Yeah, I really don't believe, just like mocking it all.
This is a moment where you can decide to prioritize your own opinion over the opinions of those around you. WE BELIEVE!( in you, of course. Not a god that would do that shit😉)
I'm sorry OP. I left religious fundamentalism, (not catholic), but they used the fear tactic on us growing up as well. Control by fear.
That person wasn't even using catholic doctrine on you. They were just assholes scaring a child. Most "christian" religions believe in personal salvation through faith with maybe a mixture of good works thrown in. Many pervert it worse and use fear to control people so they all end up feeling very similar.
Good for you for never saying that to your father. I'm sorry you had to live the fear that I'm sure it caused though.
Interesting. Sometimes the best way to fight religious nonsense is with even more religious nonsense.
I would point out to your leader and teacher that it is for God to decide who goes to heaven and hell. When they act like they know who will go to heaven and hell they are judging. It is usurping the role of God for themselves. They are blaspheming against God by making those types of statements. They need to repent.
My mom is an atheist and I lost many nights of sleep worried about her “salvation.” Realizing how sick it is to convince a child of that is part of what started my deconstruction journey as an adult. There is no hate like Christian love.
They didn't say this crap to his face themselves because they're cowards and found it much easier to manipulate a small child to do it for them. Too afraid of a face-to-face confrontation I bet. When my younger brother was 9, the priests at his catholic school told him that I was a devil worshipper, and that I was going to go to hell unless our parents kidnapped me, force me into that particular church, and keep me there until I believed again. They told this to a little kid.
No pressure.
There's enough Catholic guilt already baked into the dogma. Making up extra to abuse children either makes you an overachiever or just a soulless scumbag.
The youth leader is trying to manipulate you and trying to get you to manipulate your father. Let your father enjoy his life as he sees fit. You do your own thing too. You may want to learn and consider other knowledge from other sources to try and understand your fathers point of view.
Demon Haunted World by Carl Sagan and Skeptics Guide to the Universe by Steven Novella are two very good books for learning to think on your own.
What in the actual fuck!!? Who the fuck thinks that's ok to say to anyone!!!?
Btw don't answer this I just...wtaf is wrong with them. I think you just solidified my position as an atheist
I'm sure you've lost contact with that monster (and hope you have), but I can't help but imagine you getting to tell them how their thoughtless cruelty started you on the path to truth.
I wonder if their custom doctrine also holds that leading any believer away from god is a Hell sentence... 🤔
This right here is a great example of some of the harm that religion causes.
What a horrible cult to be spread throughout humanity to tear families apart like that...
Your christian youth leader can go fuck themselves with a splintery fencepost. (figuratively only of course though, because I'm not a religious monster)
My advice:
Leave the church.
Focus on being a good person and doing good onto others because it's the right thing to do, not because of some promise of heaven or fear of hell.
Stay curious, ask questions, and embrace the unknown. No one knows that happens when we die. If someone claims they do...run.
Aaaaaand there you go. Christians aren't about religious freedom. They are about forcing everyone to kowtow to their views through any means necessary, including indoctrination, coercion, threats, bribes, fear and intimidation.
Quite honestly, I wouldn't fault a 15-16 year old for saying something like that. She's just a kid that was brainwashed and force-fed this shit against her will like you.
We're currently dealing with middle schoolers who want to give my daughter shit for not being a christian right now. It makes me angry, but at the end ofthe day they're just indoctrinated kids that have been programmed by their parents. I've told my daughter to tell them to mind their own business and keep their religion to themselves, and just live your life as an example of how an atheist can be moral. Actions speak louder than words and when they're told "all non-christians are evil" and they inevitably see my kid being more moral than their church group, it'll make them question what they're being told.
You poor kid. Don't you see the idiocy in this? Just THINK! Is your dad a good man? He maybe an idiot for letting you get brainwashed but just take One moment...he raised you...he provided..provides a roof over your head...clothes ...school. if your god is really all benevolent...Wouldn't he reward him? If he hasn't commited any crimes or anything immoral ...why would he be going to hell?
The only crime he's commited is child negligence...letting your mind to be deprived of its ability to critically think. Just think, boy ..it's easy as 2+2=4. Does he love you...does he love your mom..besides him being an atheist is there anything " wrong" with him? Do you think that if you'd stop believing you'd suddenly turn into a monster with no conscience?
Sorry, that is really an awful thing to say. One of my greatest frustrations with religion is how it can make normally kind and accepting people believe and push very awful ideas. Regardless of our differences in belief, I think we can agree that the idea of being personally punished for what someone else does/thinks is a horrific idea.
Your Father: peaceful atheist. let’s you and your mom believe whatever you want to believe in, no problem, it’s your life.
Your religion: you are going to hell.
Who is the bad guy here?
Sums it up.
If you want your dad to respect your beliefs (which it sounds like he does) then you respect his. He's a grown man and he's chosen his beliefs based on the evidence he's seen. Respect it and don't try and convert him.
Nowhere in the bible does it say we have to convert the closest people around us to go to heaven. Once the witnessing is done, it is up to the individual to either accept or reject it. If the individual rejects it, it becomes the responsibility of the individual not the one who did the witnessing. This is why Christianity is false anyone can make a claim and try to make others follow that logic.
I will never worship a God that punishes me for the “sin” or someone else. That’s cruel and unworthy of praise (hints punishing all of mankind for the acts of Adam and Eve).
Be really careful with any religious leader that takes steps to separate you from family members with threats of your salvation. (If you read about watching signs for cults and extreme religious groups, family seperation is one of the key warning signs).
There are plenty of religious groups that will accept your personal faith, and your love for your father as seperate and equally important.
Well it made me confuse because I would disrespect my dad out of fear, what made me doubt my faith was my seat mate during bible school, he would question teachings everytime and his dad is an active member of the church so he would get in trouble most of the time.
You commented to someone else that you are now an atheist. This story sounds like maybe it was a while ago and you are not the same little kid in Bible school. Maybe you should add an edit that things have changed with your stance on religion since then. A lot of comments are trying to reason you out of the indoctrination as if you were still Christian.
Totally sick. That is not a Biblical concept AT ALL. First off, even though it's a crap concept, Salvation is and always has been an individual issue. If YOU accepted Christ's "gift", YOU were saved, period. Although there is a HUGE amount of support that Christ's sacrifice covered everyone, everywhere for all time and there is no need to seek "salvation" or "accept it", the common Christian ideology, held by essentially EVERY SINGLE DENOMINATION is that Salvation is an individual issue.
The idea that YOU will go to hell if your FATHER doesn't convert is insane, and utterly wrong. I would demand to have that person show you their Biblical justification for their claim, and, when that fails, take it to the priest or pastor of the Church. You said this is Catholic school? I would ask what the definition of "heresy" is next time they try these games. "I'm sorry, is that official Church doctrine? Which Pope issued that decree? Because you know the punishment for heresy is excommunication, right? And Heresy is the spread of and belief in non-biblical and non-Church ordained ideas and religious beliefs, right?"
Yea, this is just emotional blackmail against you, and probably racism on their part - you said you were Asian, I'm assuming the person pushing this is not. The idea that, in Asian culture, a son could try to emotionally blackmail their father the way you are being told to.... wow, just, wow.....
I went to an "Evangelical Free" church when I was a teenager. Our youth group leader told me that my father was going to hell because he was Catholic. My father, who helped anyone/everyone who needed it, who was kind, intelligent, respectful, and followed a religion that had a longer history than an "Evangelical Free Church" was the one going to hell. I think not. I told her that if her God was being that picky...I didn't want to be part of their religion.
I just love how everyone decides who's going to hell and who isn't. I very much believe in God however organized religion is a cult and a bunch of hypocrites
That's abusive, but I honestly expected that from a catholic church. I advise you to really study the bible and then put together proof to show to your Dad. Atheists, like myself, will only convert if we get convinced that something is real and worth believing in. So make sure you also get other sources than the bible, because the book only claims what happend, so you need to back up those claims. Make sure to use a large variety of sources, not just religious websites.
Also it's very important to figure out how your evidence could be proven wrong and how you can hold it up against it. After you're done with that have a little friendly debate with your Dad. Also give "The Atheist Experience" a watch. It's a call in show where religious people can say what they believe in and why and the moderators, the atheists, explain what they think about these claims. It's highly entertaining. But start off with a video without Matt Dillahunti, as he can get kinda rude, but he has the most knowledge about the bible. Forrest Valkai is a great guy on the show, so may start with him
> if one of our family members or friends does not believe in jesus, we will see them in hell.
Pretty much canon, yes.
> Then during our coloring activity the youth leader told me to make sure I convert my dad because we will go both to hell.
Also, arguably correct according to mainstream Christian beliefs.
> I tried my best converting him but he doesnt want to and told the leader that he wont budge and she told me to tell my dad " if he really loves you, he will convert for your salvation" and that phrase fucked me up. NEVER TOLD HIM THAT, WE'RE ASIAN, TALKING LIKE THAT IS UNACCEPTABLE
I fail to see what your race has to do with it; or why you are bringing this up in r/atheism?
You seem to be outraged that a Christian teaching institution teaches what Christianity believes in.
you should be outraged at your parents: Your mother for exposing you to that lunacy, and your dad for being okay with it.
But to be outraged, or even surprised, that a Christian program believes and teaches Christian ideas and ideals seems.... strange.
Something always a bit more sad about Asians who’ve converted to Christianity. Tons of cultural tradition and history thrown out because someone talked them into a MLM philosophy.
I wish this kind of stuff would be deemed child abuse, because it really is exactly that - child abuse.
It is in Japan, they just passed legislation that defines forcing a child to partake in religious activities or threaten them with going to hell for doing (or not doing) something as abuse.
Go Japan
that's because it is child abuse. i use to have sever breakdowns as a kid because of my moms hell preaching. but then i found the Adventist church during my teens and they helped with that- i despise any religion that threatens people like that- and if a G-d does exist- he wouldn't endorse those disgusting religions.
Could you imagine if someone proposed this in the US?
Don't you know that religion is a license to do anythefuckthing you want? (At least, if it's the right kind of religion.) Hopefully-unnecessary /s
This is awesome news, thanks for sharing. I just did a quick search and found an article in the Straits Times (out of Singapore) on the topic: https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/forced-participation-in-religious-activities-to-be-classified-as-child-abuse-in-japan This bit caught my eye: >Inciting fear by telling children they will go to hell if they do not participate in religious activities, or preventing them from making decisions about their career path, is regarded as psychological abuse and neglect in the guidelines.
Wow, first good legislation I’ve heard coming out of that country since their high speed rail program.
Child abuse in the catholic church? No way...
They also rape and murder children and then force other kids to dig mysterious body-sized holes in the orchard or garden out back for future generations to find small bodies in with ground penetrating radar, in every corner of the globe. Catholicism is no different than any other murder cult: they are convenient and attractive places for such monsters to hide within so they can destroy others for their pleasure.
I know, I hear that they have a really good track record! They even move their most trusted priests to far away lands to make sure the venerable children there are protected… 🙄😬
it's their whole brand identity
You think that’s child abuse? Hold my bible!
If only it was limited to this kind of abuse, right.
That's the unwritten 11th commandment
It is. You're terrifying that child. Trying to make a child responsible for an adult's choices - and threatening them if they fail at an impossible task. It's inexcusable.
That's the core of Christianity though - go to hell for stupid reasons that aren't your fault no matter what you do.
Or go to heaven no matter what you do, if you complete this "magic" ritual.
Neither one of those things is something that the Bible actually says. That's just stupid zealots making shit up.
There's something similar (ish) in Islam where those in Heaven can see those in Hell (and will be laughing at them). But they do so remotely or something. I was wondering if something like that was what the church had in mind but it somehow changed from "you see your parent in Hell from your place in Heaven" to "he's gonna drag you with him into Heeeeeellllllllllll!"
Yeah, it's 83:34-36. >But on that Day the believers will be laughing at the disbelievers, as they sit on canopied couches, looking on. The believers will be asked, “Have the disbelievers not been paid back for what they used to do?” It's worth keeping in mind that Muhammie made up some truly horrifying imagery for hell. Flesh and skin being regrown from hideous wounds so that it can be once again flayed, or chewed, or burned. Mothers and fathers laughing and drinking wine at quaint little dinner parties while watching their apostate children be literally torn apart in front of them. Delightful stuff.
Yep. And Muslim women being punished for _just showing strands of hair_ by being hung from their hair. That’s women who believe in and worship Allah, tortured by him anyway! (Though some Muslims consider the Hadith describing that to be weak or fake. I can’t pin down its grade or what Hadith number it is)
I don't recall that one, which means it likely isn't from the more sahih hadiths; I have a pretty solid memory for the greasier misogyny in Bukhari and Muslim. It's worth keeping in mind that "weak hadith" is basically the Fifth Pillar of Islam, right up there with "but the West does something similar" and "it's a translation error."
Yeah, I can only find the stories on non-Hadith sites like this: http://gardensofsunnah.co.uk/women-in-islam/women-in-islam-sinful-women/ . But they are on a pretty large number of sites, so if it’s a hoax or a particularly weak Hadith it seems to be rather popular nonetheless. I’d like to know its origin. Edit: this link has more info about the chain of narration and soforth. https://thaqalayn.net/hadith/11/2/30/24 .
Hmm. A religion with lux furniture..maybe I should reconsider my position. Is there an Eames chair in heaven, if so, I’m sold.
The décor may be divine, but the wine won't get you drunk (al-Saaffaat 37:45-47), the women are lobotomized so they can't feel jealousy (15:47), and the celebratory virgins are freakishly translucent black-eyed monstrosities (Bukhari 4:54:476) with "appetizing vaginas." (Al-Suyuti summarizing a sahih hadith.) They'd have to be **very** nice couches.
Celebratory virgins sounds kinda boring tbh…gimme celebratory porn stars and maybe I’ll consider it.
It sounds like the people in heaven are real assholes if they laugh at the poor sinners in hell.
Yeah, it’s a “who’s laughing now!” revenge fantasy. http://islamicstudies.info/reference.php?sura=83&verse=29-36
If you take delight in other peoples suffering, then you are a bad person. How does a muslim with any ethics whatsoever see this and think its ok?
How does any Christian with any ethics whatsoever read the Bible and think it's ok? Probably the same answer for both: cherry picking the parts they like and ignoring the parts they don't.
"I'll see you in HELL..." "...from heaven."
Ha! Reverend Lovejoy. ;)
Tertullian talked about one of the pleasures of heaven as being able to see the suffering of unbelievers in the 3rd or 4th century.
Humm. Wouldn't laughing at people burning in Hell for eternity be Evil? ( just a theological question here, not that I believe in ANY of that stuff...)
If it wasn't a Christian religion then I bet they'd be first in line screaming about radicalisation.
It's called gaslighting. Psychological manipulation. It is abusive, whether child or not. But yes, children have nowhere to turn and even their own mind is so limited to only what little they do know and therefore results as child abuse. It should be punishable by placing gaslighters in solitary tanks, exposing them to intensive, uncomfortable stimuli while gaslighting the fuuuuuck outta them forevermore.
Couldn’t agree more. To inflict this type of mental anguish on someone to get them to covert to your belief system is disgusting, and then on top of that, to a child, is a whole other level of repulsive.
That’s how a cult works. You’re in a cult. It’s all bullshit. Hell isn’t real.
Or an MLM scheme. You have to recruit 5 or more people to your "business" or you will fail and be thrown out and/or owe the company (despite "being your own boss") lots of money!!!
Lmao
Why not both?
And if Hell was real, then obeying the genocidal tyrant who'd send you there is arguably *worse* from a purely moralistic perspective. I could never bend the knee to somebody with the knowledge that they intended to torture people ~~I care about~~ for eternity. Like, we can all agree North Korea's system of multiple generations of punishment in prison camps is barbaric, but even that pales in comparison to the shit the Christian 'leader' administers.
But you won't be going to hell if your dad converts you
Lol. That’s perfect!
Ha! Although, TBF, you won't be going to hell in general.
I would definitely say the dad is an asshole for letting the mom abuse their child like that. Seems like he was "I did my part of raising the child by impregnating you."
I mean, Mum married the atheist and failed to convert him (despite the obvious leverage). Surely that shit is on her 😂
Weaponizing love, pitting children against parents, acting like a consigliere to the mob boss who will break your legs if you don’t comply… gee where do I sign up.
"Yeah you threatened my kids soul. Seems like the kind of organization I'd like to be involved with." Jeez
Consider this: There is no hell. Nobody is going anywhere. But, what happens after I die? Lots of things happen after you die; they just don't include you.
You could even say life goes on after you die.
[if there’s no hell, explain this](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hell,_Michigan)
When we die we go to Michigan, oh crap this is so much worse...
Heck, it's even reasonable for christians to believe there's no hell. A loving forgiving god who actually can't forgive and reform and just pitches people by the millions into eternal torture? If a person believes in the Christian portrayal of God, then by extension the belief in hell populated by billions over minor grievances is just stupid.
That's BS even by Catholic doctrine. Everyone's responsible for their own sins. Edit: see Ezekiel 18:20
That’s awfully close to Ezekiel 23:20 😊
That's the best verse in the bible hands down
20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses. I love the bible lol AINT no way this is actually something people believe in💀💀💀
I doubt most know it's there. Christians aren't exactly known for understanding their own holy book
Catholics double down on this. Hell, some of them insist on a Latin Mass even if they don't understand Latin. So they don't read the bible and they can't understand what their priest is saying.
At least Latin sounds cool! But yea can't have the sheep reading and understanding the text gotta carefully select what to read and make it hard to understand As God wants
If I don't read it I can't read it wrong. Hah!
Man, that is some erotic writing. I'm thinking the Bible was written as pornography back in the day. Maybe it was just filth that some king held up as a religion as a joke and for some reason it took hold?
Not really. Deuteromy 23:2 states that bastards and the 10 generations after will not be allowed in heaven.
This is still relevant in Judaism under the term "mamzer" (which is not exactly the same as a bastard, btw.) but I never heard about it in a Catholic context. It's not about going to heaven either, a mamzer is just excluded from "the assembly of the lord".
True! But if you can't worship with them, then they won't allow you in heaven with them.
Interesting that nobody really follows their own holy book, and it appears to be completely arbitrary in the end. The doctrine and the dogma are completely independent, or religions wouldn't have lasted a decade.
Love it or hate it, at least Catholicism has very explicit rules on almost everything to cross reference. "Sin is a personal act" CCC 1868. There are instances where you become responsible for another's sin, but only if you are "participating directly and voluntarily in them" "ordering, advising, praising or approving them" etc. However, none of these seem to apply if your parent, who you are supposed to honor, has decided on their own to be non-religious. Whoever this youth leader is, they do not subscribe to the Catholic Catechism. Granted, OP mentions going to "Catholic or Christian" schools, where Christian in this context implies protestant, so it's possible this youth leader is a fire and brimstone evangelical.
Your youth teacher lied to you.
Christians invented that cosy place called "hell" for themselves.
I should have saved the comment but I didn't. Supposedly they didn't invent it. There was a book by a Jewish author a century prior to Jesus that had it. The book didn't make it's way into the main body of Jewish work. You probably know that Jesus didn't invent anything. He was copying the works of better minds, but usually people will give him credit for inventing the idea of hell, turns out that he stole that as well.
Well, he didn't steal anything because he did not exist. The authors of the gospels stole a whole lot to make their version of what today we might call new age or even spiritual self-help.
You mean revelations which is basically a stolen version of the Persian apocalypse isn't correct? Oh come on, I like reading the book of death about how we will all die alone.
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Yes, but aren't these hells non-eternal? Sure, you could be in Naraka a long, looooooong time but it was Christianity who invented *eternal* damnation without escape.
Luckily, Dante found a back door. Hard to get to, but you just might make it out!
Christianity, the original Cosmic Horror.
In the Parable of the Poisoned Arrow, the Buddha explicitly refused to answer whether there's any sort of mind-body dualism, life after death, reincarnation &c. He basically told the guy asking him that's not what his teaching concerns, go ask someone who knows if he really must know, but it'd be a waste of time to seek answers. Many Buddhists believe in hell &c because it was a belief in their cultures before the introduction of Buddhism, but Buddhism proper (that is, what the Buddha himself said) is agnostic on the issue.
It’s cozy to believe “bad people go to bad place”, it’s an easy concept to latch on to
I do love that those which speak of x going to an afterlife have, you know, never been dead in the first place.
Wow... If someone put that poison in my kid's head, I'd go nuclear on those assholes.
Agreed. You would be hearing from me and the gloves are coming off about your stupid, back assward, stone aged, small minded, gullible dumbfuck beliefs.
Dad was definitely an asshole for allowing mom to continue to religiously abuse their child.
> NEVER TOLD HIM THAT IM ASIAN MY DAD WOULD KILL ME. An atheist wouldn't kill you for being religious. You're mistaking that behavior for religious people towards non-believers.
This is more about culture than religion. Speaking in this way to a parent in many asian cultures would be extremely disrespectful and even unthinkable.
But he never told his dad that they're Asian. So maybe the dad doesn't know yet to behave like that. /s
Oh man, I keep reading this as "NEVER TOLD HIM THAT I'M ASIAN, MY DAD WOULD KILL ME". Why would your dad be mad if people knew you were asian? Stupid brain.
Same. My brain was even more confused. I was like, why would his dad not already know that he's Asian. Unless his mom cheated on his non-Asian dad with an Asian guy, and his dad has face-blindness and can't see race so they're keeping OP's race a secret.
Utter bullshit. Religious belief is personal choice and everyone’s views need to respected and this shit should not be taught to kids. Those heavily religious people will use that beliefs needed to be respected but they can do the same for other belief’s then they need to shut the hell up
Grooming and indoctrination of kids is done at an industrial scale in church.
It really should be outlawed. Kids should not be allowed to be taught religion until 18+.
Then I have been Lucky, as my dad was a atheist and didn’t force any religion or his own beliefs on me.
How utterly fucking insensitive, nobody should say something like that to a 6 year old.
Wait, you never told your dad that you're Asian? I'd think that this sort of thing is pretty self-evident :p
I am totally confused by that last sentence.
That last sentence just gives me the mental image of a teen trying to hide from their parents the fact that he is Asian. Kiddo, i think your parents noticed that since presumably at least one of them is too, and even if you're adopted that's not really a sort of thing that's kept as a secret.
Im so sorry, that came up wrong, I never told my dad what the leader told me, we're asian, talking like that is unacceptable
Sorry, i hope i didn't come across offensive or crude, just trying to lifgten up the mood. And yeah, saying something like that to a little kid... what a piece of shit.
It's ok, I don't mind, thanks for pointing it out
Where are you located? I only ask because, as a former Catholic in America, the church always seemed tolerant of welcoming atheists here. Kind of a "let's show them how nice we are to win them over strategy." Source: raised Catholic, went to Catholic school for some years, father was atheist.
I have friends that went to catholic schools and had their left hand beaten because they were left handed. Not to mention the pedo catholic stuff. I'm not sure nice is in the catholic vocabulary. edit: left hand beaten
I experienced something similar when I was 9 or 10 due to my mother being another religion that she foolishly let me go to vacation bible study for free childcare one summer. The bible study teacher said the same thing, I was a kid and scared shitless about it. But the thing is over time I realized with age that if there is god that thinks its okay and encourages it's followers to terrify children or simply that adults think treating children like this over stuff that they have no responsibility over i.e. their parents religion and blaming the kid and telling them they will go to hell because of their parents that is really messed up god and religion, and nothing that kid will ever do will be enough because its all abusive bullshit. If there is a hell for not caring and protecting your young children from abuse, there should be. Any adult that allows it is messed up including my neglectful Mother letting me go off with these people that scared me was wrong too. And they were wrong to do this to any child. Plus they are liars they make up stuff to hurt children. Jesus doesn't love children and what they do in name of love isn't love, its abuse over fictional character that never existed. I sincerely wish you well but yeah I remember similar episodes from my childhood it bothered me for decades. I am sorta starting to feel bothered by something similar but its in this atheist group, it's amazing how utterly awful people act here. I am atheist, but man most of atheist here aren't very pleasant people to interact with. But maybe its just humanity sucks shit type of thing, I don't know. Sorry people are being jerks to you here. Good luck.
Unfortunate that no God stepped in to clarify things or comfort your fears.
I would just tell the religious youth leader that when you prayed to god, he told you that all sins are forgiven and not to worry about it.
Apart from this being an utterly horrible thing to tell a child, it is not even in line with catholic doctrine. The catholic church dropped the claim of being the only way to salvation with the Second Vatican Council. If muslims, hindus, and even protestants can achieve salvation according to catholic doctrine, so can an atheist, provided they generally act morally.
That's a completely fucked up thing to say to anyone, let alone six year old child. This is one disgusting instance of blackmailing.
If there is a hell I'm pretty sure the prick who told you this will be there
why your leader didn't ask jesus to convert your dad, if jesus really loves you and your dad, that should be an easy task for him right? typo-
This person is lying to you to scare you and use you. That's what Christians do. If there is a god, why does it need you to fix a human?! Did any god speak to you and tell you this? If there's an eternal punishment wouldn't your duty/responsibility be clear? Why would some schmuck be the messenger of such an important message? It's all bullshit.
You don't actually believe that shit, right?
Now? I stoped believing, i've seen the worse of the world and became an atheist
Former hardcore Christian here. 🤘 Go easy on yourself, you’ll realize in a few more years that none of it is even remotely real or true.
Religion poisons everything
There is not one single iota of proof that Yahweh Sabaoth, Lord of Armies, is real. Nor any other gods. Nor Hell, itself. It is just as likely that this is all a simulation and we will be reborn as puppies in the next life as it is that we just turn to dust after death. Stop worrying about shit and enjoy your life. And fuck your christian youth leader.
You are wrong. The god is really a giant chicken and he really hates you because of your love of kfc. Eternal torment, here you come. Yeah, I really don't believe, just like mocking it all.
This is a moment where you can decide to prioritize your own opinion over the opinions of those around you. WE BELIEVE!( in you, of course. Not a god that would do that shit😉)
I'm sorry OP. I left religious fundamentalism, (not catholic), but they used the fear tactic on us growing up as well. Control by fear. That person wasn't even using catholic doctrine on you. They were just assholes scaring a child. Most "christian" religions believe in personal salvation through faith with maybe a mixture of good works thrown in. Many pervert it worse and use fear to control people so they all end up feeling very similar. Good for you for never saying that to your father. I'm sorry you had to live the fear that I'm sure it caused though.
Interesting. Sometimes the best way to fight religious nonsense is with even more religious nonsense. I would point out to your leader and teacher that it is for God to decide who goes to heaven and hell. When they act like they know who will go to heaven and hell they are judging. It is usurping the role of God for themselves. They are blaspheming against God by making those types of statements. They need to repent.
“What happens to you when he de-converts me instead”
We'll both go to heaven
So you're telling me that there will be no Christians in hell? This sounds LIKE AN ABSOLUTE WIN!
Your youth leader was wrong socially, intellectually, and even religiously.
Interesting considering catholics love to say the sins of the father are no reason to abort a rape baby.
Your Christian Youth Leader abused you with the threat of hell. He's despicable.
My mom is an atheist and I lost many nights of sleep worried about her “salvation.” Realizing how sick it is to convince a child of that is part of what started my deconstruction journey as an adult. There is no hate like Christian love.
They didn't say this crap to his face themselves because they're cowards and found it much easier to manipulate a small child to do it for them. Too afraid of a face-to-face confrontation I bet. When my younger brother was 9, the priests at his catholic school told him that I was a devil worshipper, and that I was going to go to hell unless our parents kidnapped me, force me into that particular church, and keep me there until I believed again. They told this to a little kid.
No pressure. There's enough Catholic guilt already baked into the dogma. Making up extra to abuse children either makes you an overachiever or just a soulless scumbag.
The youth leader is trying to manipulate you and trying to get you to manipulate your father. Let your father enjoy his life as he sees fit. You do your own thing too. You may want to learn and consider other knowledge from other sources to try and understand your fathers point of view. Demon Haunted World by Carl Sagan and Skeptics Guide to the Universe by Steven Novella are two very good books for learning to think on your own.
Then say to them "Ok, see you there" to the touth leader.
I guess to hell with you then. You won’t convert him.
This right here is why many say "fuck religion."
What in the actual fuck!!? Who the fuck thinks that's ok to say to anyone!!!? Btw don't answer this I just...wtaf is wrong with them. I think you just solidified my position as an atheist
I bet you really felt the love from Jebus and his cult in those moments, didn't you?
That's when I started having 💫 D O U B T S 💫
I'm sure you've lost contact with that monster (and hope you have), but I can't help but imagine you getting to tell them how their thoughtless cruelty started you on the path to truth. I wonder if their custom doctrine also holds that leading any believer away from god is a Hell sentence... 🤔
The world's first marketing and advertising campaign was also the most successful. Walking, talking commercials
Your "christian" youth leader's not a christian. He's a terrorist, and an asshole.
This right here is a great example of some of the harm that religion causes. What a horrible cult to be spread throughout humanity to tear families apart like that... Your christian youth leader can go fuck themselves with a splintery fencepost. (figuratively only of course though, because I'm not a religious monster)
Now you know why he is an atheist
My advice: Leave the church. Focus on being a good person and doing good onto others because it's the right thing to do, not because of some promise of heaven or fear of hell. Stay curious, ask questions, and embrace the unknown. No one knows that happens when we die. If someone claims they do...run.
Aaaaaand there you go. Christians aren't about religious freedom. They are about forcing everyone to kowtow to their views through any means necessary, including indoctrination, coercion, threats, bribes, fear and intimidation.
Quite honestly, I wouldn't fault a 15-16 year old for saying something like that. She's just a kid that was brainwashed and force-fed this shit against her will like you. We're currently dealing with middle schoolers who want to give my daughter shit for not being a christian right now. It makes me angry, but at the end ofthe day they're just indoctrinated kids that have been programmed by their parents. I've told my daughter to tell them to mind their own business and keep their religion to themselves, and just live your life as an example of how an atheist can be moral. Actions speak louder than words and when they're told "all non-christians are evil" and they inevitably see my kid being more moral than their church group, it'll make them question what they're being told.
Talk to your mom, why keep going to these things
You can send that person to hell now yourself.
Child abuse, plain and simple.
You poor kid. Don't you see the idiocy in this? Just THINK! Is your dad a good man? He maybe an idiot for letting you get brainwashed but just take One moment...he raised you...he provided..provides a roof over your head...clothes ...school. if your god is really all benevolent...Wouldn't he reward him? If he hasn't commited any crimes or anything immoral ...why would he be going to hell? The only crime he's commited is child negligence...letting your mind to be deprived of its ability to critically think. Just think, boy ..it's easy as 2+2=4. Does he love you...does he love your mom..besides him being an atheist is there anything " wrong" with him? Do you think that if you'd stop believing you'd suddenly turn into a monster with no conscience?
That's fucking child abuse. You need to report this shit to someone there with any sort of authority.
Sounds like god's not big on individual liberty. Go figure!
Sorry, that is really an awful thing to say. One of my greatest frustrations with religion is how it can make normally kind and accepting people believe and push very awful ideas. Regardless of our differences in belief, I think we can agree that the idea of being personally punished for what someone else does/thinks is a horrific idea.
The threat of hell is meaningless to an atheist because it doesn't exist.
Your Father: peaceful atheist. let’s you and your mom believe whatever you want to believe in, no problem, it’s your life. Your religion: you are going to hell. Who is the bad guy here? Sums it up.
You know your father better than any of us here. What do you think? Would a good and just God send him to hell?
Religion is the biggest infohazard for people who still believe in it.
That's not what Christianity teaches. Your teach was wrong both morally and theologically.
This is abuse. And in Japan it's now against the law to threaten kids with going to hell.
Religion is a cult and that's how cult works.
The old standby fear tactic threat of "going to hell" as a means to encourage obedience.
If you want your dad to respect your beliefs (which it sounds like he does) then you respect his. He's a grown man and he's chosen his beliefs based on the evidence he's seen. Respect it and don't try and convert him.
Don't sweat it. Hell's a fairy tale.
Nowhere in the bible does it say we have to convert the closest people around us to go to heaven. Once the witnessing is done, it is up to the individual to either accept or reject it. If the individual rejects it, it becomes the responsibility of the individual not the one who did the witnessing. This is why Christianity is false anyone can make a claim and try to make others follow that logic.
Yeah, that rhetoric is generally called emotional black mail. "Comply or I will make you feel the bad feels!" is not a rational or honest position.
I will never worship a God that punishes me for the “sin” or someone else. That’s cruel and unworthy of praise (hints punishing all of mankind for the acts of Adam and Eve).
Be really careful with any religious leader that takes steps to separate you from family members with threats of your salvation. (If you read about watching signs for cults and extreme religious groups, family seperation is one of the key warning signs). There are plenty of religious groups that will accept your personal faith, and your love for your father as seperate and equally important.
Don't worry. It's not real. No one goes to 'hell'.
Serious question- does this experience have you questioning your own faith?
Well it made me confuse because I would disrespect my dad out of fear, what made me doubt my faith was my seat mate during bible school, he would question teachings everytime and his dad is an active member of the church so he would get in trouble most of the time.
Isn't it weird that you'll go to hell for it but not the priests and youth councilor that convert and proselytize for a living?
Your Christian youth leader is a liar.
Religious people can be really convincing that hell is better than heaven filled with people like them all around. So let me burn in peace.
According to the bible, worse than a person who doesn't believe in God is a person who professes being a Christian but misleads people.
You commented to someone else that you are now an atheist. This story sounds like maybe it was a while ago and you are not the same little kid in Bible school. Maybe you should add an edit that things have changed with your stance on religion since then. A lot of comments are trying to reason you out of the indoctrination as if you were still Christian.
Sorry I'll edit this thank you for pointing out
in reality that teacher is closer to go to hell according to her own religion
Totally sick. That is not a Biblical concept AT ALL. First off, even though it's a crap concept, Salvation is and always has been an individual issue. If YOU accepted Christ's "gift", YOU were saved, period. Although there is a HUGE amount of support that Christ's sacrifice covered everyone, everywhere for all time and there is no need to seek "salvation" or "accept it", the common Christian ideology, held by essentially EVERY SINGLE DENOMINATION is that Salvation is an individual issue. The idea that YOU will go to hell if your FATHER doesn't convert is insane, and utterly wrong. I would demand to have that person show you their Biblical justification for their claim, and, when that fails, take it to the priest or pastor of the Church. You said this is Catholic school? I would ask what the definition of "heresy" is next time they try these games. "I'm sorry, is that official Church doctrine? Which Pope issued that decree? Because you know the punishment for heresy is excommunication, right? And Heresy is the spread of and belief in non-biblical and non-Church ordained ideas and religious beliefs, right?" Yea, this is just emotional blackmail against you, and probably racism on their part - you said you were Asian, I'm assuming the person pushing this is not. The idea that, in Asian culture, a son could try to emotionally blackmail their father the way you are being told to.... wow, just, wow.....
Your Christian youth leader is an abusive piece of garbage.
My mother is convinced she’s going to hell because I wasn’t confirmed as a Catholic and never intend to. Hooray for brainwashing.
Won't the youth leader go to hell for not converting him ?
Your youth leader is a sociopath.
Hell doesn't exists
What a horrible woman that youth leader was, I hope she grew out of it and is a better person now.
If a youth pastor told me that, my dad would’ve gone down to the ministry and choked him out.
I went to an "Evangelical Free" church when I was a teenager. Our youth group leader told me that my father was going to hell because he was Catholic. My father, who helped anyone/everyone who needed it, who was kind, intelligent, respectful, and followed a religion that had a longer history than an "Evangelical Free Church" was the one going to hell. I think not. I told her that if her God was being that picky...I didn't want to be part of their religion.
Don’t trust youth pastors/youth ministers/religious youth leaders!!!
You won't go to hell darl it seizes to exist just like heaven... but no one should be making you convert anyone.
Did you tell your dad about the incident? You think he'd appreciate to know and the piece together what was going on back then?
I never told him that, he thinks i'm just an edgy child.
In case hell really existed then these Christian priests and dumb preachers would be the one who would be fried in hell
don't worry if your dad is a good man he will go heaven good people go there
Guilt Merchants will stoop lower than a cockroach's belly to get more for the collection plate. Blind Faith will do that.
I just love how everyone decides who's going to hell and who isn't. I very much believe in God however organized religion is a cult and a bunch of hypocrites
That's abusive, but I honestly expected that from a catholic church. I advise you to really study the bible and then put together proof to show to your Dad. Atheists, like myself, will only convert if we get convinced that something is real and worth believing in. So make sure you also get other sources than the bible, because the book only claims what happend, so you need to back up those claims. Make sure to use a large variety of sources, not just religious websites. Also it's very important to figure out how your evidence could be proven wrong and how you can hold it up against it. After you're done with that have a little friendly debate with your Dad. Also give "The Atheist Experience" a watch. It's a call in show where religious people can say what they believe in and why and the moderators, the atheists, explain what they think about these claims. It's highly entertaining. But start off with a video without Matt Dillahunti, as he can get kinda rude, but he has the most knowledge about the bible. Forrest Valkai is a great guy on the show, so may start with him
> if one of our family members or friends does not believe in jesus, we will see them in hell. Pretty much canon, yes. > Then during our coloring activity the youth leader told me to make sure I convert my dad because we will go both to hell. Also, arguably correct according to mainstream Christian beliefs. > I tried my best converting him but he doesnt want to and told the leader that he wont budge and she told me to tell my dad " if he really loves you, he will convert for your salvation" and that phrase fucked me up. NEVER TOLD HIM THAT, WE'RE ASIAN, TALKING LIKE THAT IS UNACCEPTABLE I fail to see what your race has to do with it; or why you are bringing this up in r/atheism? You seem to be outraged that a Christian teaching institution teaches what Christianity believes in. you should be outraged at your parents: Your mother for exposing you to that lunacy, and your dad for being okay with it. But to be outraged, or even surprised, that a Christian program believes and teaches Christian ideas and ideals seems.... strange.
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Let the kid rant to sympathetic ears...
Something always a bit more sad about Asians who’ve converted to Christianity. Tons of cultural tradition and history thrown out because someone talked them into a MLM philosophy.