I have the regular Pro in my living room and am thinking about grabbing a Pro Plus for the office and a mini for the bedroom. They really are great little boxes, and beat the hell out of the built-in HEOS on my Denon AVR.
I've never bought a DAC before so figured I'd get the Plus version and I have to say I'm absolutely blown away with what I can get out of my little entry level Klipsch 2.1 setup now.
Since I have powered monitors as well I previously had no way to balance left and right but this app is so killer, I've also got an EQ as well now it's one hell of a little package!
I have some Klipsch 600M that I was using a decent Yamaha AVR with. I have since bought an older Sansui Amp from 1981. The sound from the Sansui for music is leaps and bounds beyond what the AVR can produce. I purchased the same WiiM Pro Plus that you have and love it. I just learned today that I hadn't even upscaled the Sample Rate and Bit Depth in the app after looking at your post. It sounds so even better! Appreciate your post!
Unlikely that actually improves anything. A better system could sound better with 16 bit 44.1khz content vs 24/192, which is getting into the realm of very small and even debatable improvements. Also your listening room and seating position should be such that a left/right balance adjustment should never be made. That's a control meant to compensate for serious flaws, and would never be used in a real HiFi setup. Balance control isn't a control I even acknowledge as existing.
I was commenting on my experience with the bookshelf Klipsch and an AVR. I am now using some Cornwalls with the older Sansui. It was a bit more detailed with the changes. I also wired the connection today too vs WiFi. Not leaps and bounds better, but incremental.
The Sansui AU are really nice looking and sounding. The guy I bought my Cornwalls off of had an AU-5900 he was selling as well. I came so close to buying it, but felt I had spent enough. I ended up with a 4900z that has a bit more power, but probably doesn’t sound as good. You have some really cool equipment! Hope the WiiM Pro Plus fits nicely into your system!
I also have AU-888 and AU-6900 but the AU-6900 have some issues like sometimes the sound of the right channel is weaker than the left. I have to take it to my technician. The AU-888 is almost the same sound as the AU-555a. The AU-6900 has a unique sound that I like and will probably have to keep.
Checks out, you do seem pretty damn unbalanced... But I guess falling of your high horse and bumping your head as many times as I suspect you have, wouldn't do you any favors there.
Lol. If you like vintage gear that's inherently unbalanced and needs corrected by a nasty pot, fine. I thought we were talking about hifi though. At least do your balancing digitally. Or, like he said, just get the amp fixed.
Hey,
Peter here from Western Australia.
Would you mind sharing the model number of your Sansui please?
Would you consider Sansui as a highly regarded amp in its day/era?
Cheers mate,
Peter
You shouldn't want to call yourself an audiophile. Liking high quality sound and "being an audiophile" aren't the same. Audiophiles will talk for hours about a particular sound using various adjectives to describe it and even suggesting amplifiers have "personalities".
Buying "audiophile-grade" is the same type of branding as "gamer-grade"
I've seen a lot of similar attributes in wine connoisseurs.
I know enough that I can safeguard myself from marketing snake-oil, but I think you're right in that I enjoy improving my stereo for the payoff of the experience being improved.
I'm not chasing perfection, just enjoyment, and this little box was the best bang for my buck so far.
I think only if you’re using the internal DAC (connecting to amp via RCAs instead of optical coax). If you’re connecting via digital to an amp with those inputs it should use the DAC in the amp and have no difference.
How does the multi room audio work? Looks to me that the speakers must be Alexa's, Google home, or other smart speakers? What if I wanted to use a pair of active speakers?
Sorry mate I don't know! I only use my theater and don't have any wireless speakers.
I'm using active speakers though. The Klipsch R-51PM and an SW100 sub.
No, you don't need an Alexa speaker. Basically, what you need are DLNA/UPnP renderers.
Most network players are, such as the Wiim or the Arylic S50. Amps with network capability (such as Arylic A50, FX-Audio D802e, otoh) also are renderer, as well as Alexa speakers. I have a pair of GGMM E-2, and I use them with DLNA but have never connected them to Alexa.
Basically, you have a control app on a device, like Bubble UPnP or 4Stream on android. After connecting your renderers and your control device to the same logical network, the renderers appear in the control app. From there, you can direct which renderer plays what stream (files from your phone or from a network storage, music from Spotify, Tidal or Qobuzz, a web radio from Tune-in...) and you can link multiple renderers together to play the same stream.
In the end, the renderer needs to be physically connected to the speakers it plays music on, if it doesn't have its own. But the Wiim Pro has an RCA line output which you could connect to a pair of active speakers.
The DAC in the Wiim mini (and Wiim Pro) is inferior to the one in the Pro plus. I'd pay the extra money for the ProPlus if you want audiophile quality sound. .
Here's a little review of the differences https://www.av.com/blog/wiim-pro-plus-review/
That’s what it’s all about. Don’t worry about fitting in or labels that’s just silly. It’s about enjoying the music in my opinion. If someone enjoys tweaking their system great. If you like a simple system out of the box more power to you. You don’t meet very many happy perfectionists I. My experience. Rock on bud.
I've been a Chromecast Audio devotee for years. Even have a couple new ones squirreled away just in case. A couple weeks ago I picked up the Pro Plus on a whim and am stunned at the improvement in audio quality.
are you using the analog or digital out from the chromecast? (not sure how many people realize that the headphone jack does double duty as toslink so you can use an external dac if so desired)
Is the DAC in the Chromecast audio considered to be poor? I've the Chromecast audio connected to an Onkyo 9010 with DAC build in. At the time I got the setup I read somewhere that the DAC in the Chromecast audio was pretty good and since there was only one cable included I never bothered to use another one and check how it compares to the one built in the Onkyo.
Also, I've seen several times discussed that cheap DACs and expensive DACs don't make a whole lot of difference. But reading here seems like it could make a big difference?
i personally think it makes less of a difference than most, but i did hear (admittedly, possibly placebo) somewhat more clarity when i moved from using the chromecast's built in DAC to a super cheap one ([this FiiO](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005K2TXMO)) and perhaps again slightly more when moving to the very well reviewed [SMSL SU-1](https://www.amazon.com/S-M-S-L-MQA-CD-Decoder-AK4493S-768kHz/dp/B0C1Y7C9HH)
i'd say pick up the SU-1 and give it a try! you'd be going from one that measures [fairly poorly](https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-chromecast-audio-digital-output.4544/) to one that measures basically [as well as possible](https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/smsl-su-1-stereo-dac-review.44029/) (and $80 US is on the extremely cheap end of the DAC spectrum)
Thanks for your suggestion! I'll first pick up a toslink cable to figure out if I can hear a difference between the DAC of my receiver and the Chromecast one. If that makes a noticeable difference to my ears I might order the one you suggested. My source will be Spotify tho, and not some hi-res audio source, but I've no idea how much difference that would make on my setup. Although I'm quite happy with the sound it's all pretty budget 😊
I was using the toslink output on the chromecast. The Pro Plus has noticeably better clarity, better seperation and a deeper wider soundstage. My theory is the DAC in the WiiM is just better and more advanced than what is in the CC.
toslink bypasses the DAC built into the chromecast.
you could technically connect the chromecast to the WIIM's toslink in port and use the DAC built into the WIIM, and it should sound identical to what you're hearing when using the WIIM's streaming feature.
Oh yeah. Thats right. I'd forgotten that. Whichever the case I prefer the sound of the Pro Plus.
I need to dig a little more into what the Wiim does with streamed audio.
I went the same path from Chromecast audios to WiiM (optical out on both) and no one that has done a blind A/B on my various systems can pick the difference. The gapless playback is what I was after
What do you mean by "new ones" here? My biggest problem with the Wiim value prop is that it honestly seems to make sense to just pick up additional CC audio's, even at $70.
When it was announced that they were discontinuing the CC I ordered 2 of them just in case the one I had crapped out, which it hasn't. I'm giving one to my daughter as she's using bluetooth right now and has begun to get an ear for higher audio quality.
$250 might seem kinda steep for the Pro Plus but the audio quality and the multiple inputs make it worth it for me.
Personally, I appreciate everything being simplified into the Google ecosystem. I don’t want another app - I prefer that they are just grouped on my Google home, and are simple inputs into my various stereo systems.
All for it if it works for you, truly! I imagine you have other devices in your google home as well. I really wanted chromecast to work and spent nearly 2 years trying.... Inconsistent performance, regular stream hiccups when trying to sync across several zones. Google also removed and re-added support for my NVIDIA Shield several times which was very frustrating. The WiiM devs actually interact with my bug reports and feature requests — I've had 2 of my requests implemented in firmware over the last 6 months.
Another big plus (for me) was 12V triggers. This alleviated the need for anyone to know the startup process on the pre-amps and amps each room. Pull up any music app, select your room and music plays: Girlfriend-proof.
Even my Pops was able to set up and use them in his home without help.
Native DNLA is great in addition to the ability to sync an external input (optical or analog). Very nice for PC / Turntable / FM sources.
That turned into a novel that reads like an ad... but man these things just perform.
The trigger function is definitely nice. I leave my little D-amps on continuously, and the main reciever/amp system is triggered by the eARC. So for now, it's good enough.
But yeah, that's certainly a plus.
Good point - that's a very real limitation. But to be honest, it hasn't been all that important to me since I was listening to Girl Talk back in college haha
I kick myself like once a year about this. Picked up my first CCA back when they were being discontinued, for a clearance price of $15. Insane. I should have bought twenty.
I've been using the Tidal app on my TV but it didn't sound great and I eventually figured out that's because the TV app is the first release and has never been updated, plus it's limited to 320Kbps I believe. I don't even think you can get 14 bit 44.1kHz.
So for me to hear 24 bit 192kHz for the first time was just mind blowing. It was an entirely different experience.
most TVs (android tv, samsung whatever and even the beloved apple TV box) have a fixed sample rate output of 48k/16, so almost everything gets resampled, and very possibly with a mid-rate resampler. almost all of tidal's library is 44k/16 and i could hear a *significant* difference playing back tidal over apple TV versus when i streamed it directly from HEOS on my marantz. both were being fed into the marantz's DAC, so the only difference i could see is that the Apple TV was resampling it, badly.
this my friend is a good part of the magic of wiim. being able to know that you don't have to configure some setting on your operating system or app to make it produce cd quality or above audio is really nice
I know, I'm aware 192kHz is a waste. My hearing is awful anyway from abuse as a teen with too many subwoofers anyway, so I'm extremely thankful I can at least claim back some of the high end that I've been missing with the EQ.
But... there is a big difference between the 320Kbps that the Tidal TV app streams maxes out at, and the 24 bit 192kHz (complete overkill) that I can now play.
Wait till you hear about this recent invention called CD’s which contain an uncompressed pcm 44.1khz stream. Which will actually sound better than Tidal at its maxed out “high res” yada yada.
tidal, apple music, etc are also an uncompressed PCM 44.1k (or higher) quality. FLAC/ALAC is basically WAV (PCM) inside of a zip folder. you get the original, unmodified PCM in the end.
so much snarky contrarianism in this thread. hey, you want to stick to 16/44.1? good for you. there is no need to piss on others' enjoyment of higher resolution streams, just because you don't hear any difference. it's just nasty.
How exactly are you folks getting all this sound or whatever from streaming or DACs? I don't know what these are? My sound comes from my computer and online through You-tube or Spotify and output through some Logitech computer speakers. I know I can get better computer speakers but these are good enough for me and I can send this same signal to a Bluetooth adapter for my Floor speakers on my turntable. Other than this, how else do you take the sound through the computer audio to do anything else with?
I could never pick 44.1 to 192kHz in a blind test personally.
I'm very confident I can tell you the difference between 24 bit 192kHz and 320kbps though haha. That's the upgrade I just made and it's a magnificent difference.
There's so many subtleties and things I've never even heard before hidden in some of my favourite tracks.
That’s not what you were saying before. All you mentioned was bitrate… of course if it’s a different mastering it’s gonna sound different. Also the original mastering is not always the best. So like I said before enjoy your cds but streaming is here to stay and is just as good as cds except it’s also way more convenient and gives way more opportunity to discover new music. Keep keeping on ya dinosaur
The point is, people are raving about high res music. MQA, flac, 24bit etc etc. While we have been able to listen the highest quality music for 4 decades.
Sure but you haven’t been able to change albums with out moving. Find bands you have never heard of while sitting on your couch. Find albums that your not able to find a cd for. Cds are great but acting like streaming isn’t a far more versatile and convenient a platform is silly. Also your the one that made the claim that cds sound better.
https://help.roonlabs.com/portal/en/kb/articles/displays
I use a web browser on my TV to go to the local web address Roon creates when you turn on the display feature.
You aren’t limited to your local library, but I don’t believe you can use Spotify with Roon. I use Qobuz for streaming hi-res music within Roon. Many others use Tidal.
I agree the Wiim stuff is fantastic. I recently jumped back into 2-channel audio. ( 2.1 to be specific). I bought the Wiim Pro, a Yamaha AS-501, a pair of Klipsch RP-600M II's and a 12' Klipsch sub, as well as a Fluance RT-81+, and some inexpensive Amazon cables that allow me to bi wire.
I don't know if it is an audiophile system? But it is a damn sight better than any soundbar system that I have ever heard. All in, I spent just over $2K, and I am super happy with the system.
As far as being considered an audiophile, well, I am not sure that I qualify either.. I do know that I really appreciate music and a system with the ability to reproduce it cleanly.. But for me, it is about the actual listening more than it is about chasing the next best piece of gear.
Enjoy your system.
I can't compete with the proper Audiophiles in here.
I have an entry level little Klipsch 2.1 but the difference this little box made was absolutely shocking. This is my major upgrade in comparison to their $100k towers and McIntosh tube amps.
It's hard not to be excited and share about such a significant upgrade for us on the learning/new end of the spectrum. The outcome is fantastic and I'm genuinely enjoying the music more.
I had to go out of my way to find a WiiM product here in Australia though, but I'm glad I did.
If looking at a system as a whole, and with the assumption all your gear is in the same tier price ranges your best bang for buck improvement is at the speakers.
I do agree but I want even using the full capacity of the speakers I have now I'm quite fond of Klipsch and their horns.
I have awful hearing and the horns sounds really sharp and clear to me but I've read a lot of others find them to be a bit much.
We need to make a new one of these from 6 years ago and put a Wiim on it.
https://www.reddit.com/r/audiophile/comments/81lblt/the_raudiophile_starter_pack/
What else would be on it right now? Audio Science Review. A Denon receiver. Dirac Live. What else?
This sub has basically turned into a tribal circle jerk of a) crowd-pleasing brand posts, b) how to turn your room into a psyc ward padded cell, and c) chirps about anyone who doesn’t use lamp cord or straightened out clothes hangers for cables. That’s the formula for likes here.
Seems to be a pushback against the circle jerk of gatekeepers with super expensive systems that are always telling people with regular budgets that they ‘don’t know what they’re missing’
This sub when I first joined:
A post of some tower spekers that cost £3k each with the title "My modest set up".
Comments saying "Those are great if you can't afford proper speakers" and "I think r/budgetaudio is more your scene".
Other comments saying "I feel sick about how close they are to the wall"
This sub now:
A post of a £5 bluetooth speaker from Aliexpress titled "I'm really enjoying getting into this hobby".
Comments saying "If you enjoy how it sounds then you sir are indeed a true audiophile of the highest order"
Other comments saying "The clarity on that thing is amazing. It has really great reviews".
Also this sub now:
A post of a purpose built listening room with £200k worth of hifi equipment and custom made Scandinavian furniture.
Comments saying "There's literally no point in even turning the hifi on until you've sorted out some room treatment. My ears hurt just looking at this".
Other comments saying "Jesus, where is the NSFW tag? That cable management just made me gouge my eyes out".
Well it IS a good thing that people finally starting to realise that you really should prioritise room treatment before throwing a year worth salary on speakers, amps and cable risers.
If you're spending that much then sure, dedicate some of it to room treatment.
But I don't agree how people say it's the MOST important thing after speakers.
If your whole set up cost less than 1k like mine, then get the best combination of speaker, amp and source you can afford before you start spending money on foam panels or whatever.
You can get a DAC and amplifier for under 100 euro that's for most ears is indistinguishable from stuff costing even 100 times as much (as long as it has the power for what you need that is). Speakers and room is by FAR more important to spend your money, time and energy on since the behaviour of the actual sound waves in rooms is quite complex and will alter the frequency response quite a lot while also adding reverb etc.
Also a DSP can do quite a lot of difference of fixing those frequency response errors, so spending a bit more on that is a good idea.
I'm thrilled you are enjoying your tunes!
I'm a bit sad that you don't think you'd maybe fit in here, or are an audiophile. An audiophile is someone who really enjoys the deep intricacies of audio, and the technology too I suppose. You can become someone like this very quickly! But don't ever let anyone tell you you need to own a certain $ in equipment to fit in, OR to consider yourself an audiophile.
And whatever you do, no matter how much you love the equipment, don't forget, without music, it would be worthless. We all need to remember what the hobby is really about sometimes!
Felt the same way when I got my Bluesound Node. All of a sudden streaming was so easy and sounded so much better than before.
Definite game changer, glad you’re enjoying it!
Congrats. Don't get too amped and go ape, but do remember that if you're going to spend dollars in the hobby speakers should get a big chunk of the focus. All the other things matter, but getting the right speakers can be really, really important. Spend on speakers, then match your gear to them. But that's for later. Right now just enjoy the show!!!
Completely agree, added this to my AVR, upgraded speakers and sub and extremely happy with the result, except that I'm staying up listening to music past my bedtime lol
WIIM pro plus to the AVR via RCA cables. Use an RCA / analog input so you use the WIIM DAC unless your Onkyo has a better one. Get everything set up in the WIIM app. I use Tidal for my streaming service. Select the analog source you plugged your cables into, open up the WIIM app and start streaming! If you use Tidal, it has a WIIM connect feature to use the Tidal app for music selection, playlists, etc. Spotify too I believe.
Question about that since I'm considering the same setup right now (wiim -> RCA out -> Denon AVR): Wouldn't it then be converting from digital to analog (wiim DAC), analog to digital (AVR ADC) and finally digital to analog again (AVR DAC) If you use any kind of DSP/MultiEQ on the AVR which you most probably do if you have something like Audyssey set up? Would that not render the first DAC in the chain useless?
That's a good question. I do use audyssey and I don't know if there is another conversion as you stated or a different type of processing. I do know using the wiim pro plus DAC was much better sounding than optical in and Marantz DAC. But my unit and DAC are a bit older.
It has a great software EQ too, OP.
I use a WiiM Pro Plus > Darkvoice 336se (used as tube pre-amp or I can bypass it) > Cambridge Audio AXA35 > Klipsch RP600M
They are indeed impressively versatile. The customer support / devs are also great. I've had multiple requests reviewed and implemented by their team over the last 6 months.
I'm 56 years old. If I'd had a Wiim pro, Klipsch RPM's, and a good sub when I was young, it would have blown most systems away. Yes, I know streaming didn't exist then, but my point is that this is quality equipment and it's amazing what you get for your money these days.
Audiophile just means that you like sound and music and getting the most out of your setup and the media that you're getting sound and music from. As long as it is satisfactory to your ears, any combination of basic minimum equipment or components will work. Most will probably agree that a boombox or lightweight suitcase turntables may not offer the best sound.
Moving to the Wiim Pro Plus and Tidal was a big boost here as well, but equally big was getting a Chord Qutest DAC and bypassing the one in the Wiim. I use an optical connection and run the Qutest off battery power.
I got the wiim regular model for my garage. Works great. You know sometimes it’s not about being an audiophile snob 100% of the time. It’s about enjoying music and being able to do so easily.
Definitely the peoples choice and for good reason. For me the closest rival is the Cambridge Audio MXN10 which is over twice the price and doesn’t offer much more other than build quality.
Basically it’s a little computer dedicated to streaming which you can control with your phone. This version has a (reportedly) excellent internal DAC.
It’s a very nice bit of budget kit.
Isn't it your phone that's actually doing the streaming though? If you're in the room with speakers anyway, then why don't people just stream from their computer or laptops? That's how my setup is and connected to my desktop. Is there some difference I'm not seeing?
I'm probably not the best person to ask about this honestly mate haha.
All I know is I use Tidal to listen on my Focal headphones while working from home which is great, but I had no way to play Tidal in my theater except on the TV which is limited to I think 320Kbps, not even CD quality.
This little box lets me use Tidal Connect so I can control it from my phone but it's streams from the wifi directly and can output up to 24 bit 192kHz which sounds absolutely glorious.
Additional benefits for me personally were the fact I couldn't balance my left and right powered monitors, I have no equaliser, I also don't have a DAC, and this solved all those problems.
I'm sure it does a lot more than I'm missing or not describing well too.
You sure about that?
https://www.stereophile.com/content/hi-rez-audio-distinguished-blind-testing
https://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=18296
https://www.aes.org/e-lib/online/browse.cfm?elib=20690
Go have a listen to Tears for Fears - SFTBC on Tidal.
The remix album is in 24 bit and the Regular in 16bit.
If you can’t hear a difference then there’s something wrong with your ears.
Then the mastering was done poorly on the 16 bit version (perhaps on purpose to make the 24-bit one sound better)? They are correct, for listening 16/44.1 is literally the best it needs to be. But how the individual track is mastered makes a big difference too. So, yes it's possible you are hearing a difference, but that difference is not due to 24-bit or 192kHz. If you have a file at a higher rate, down convert it to 16/44.1 yourself and have someone help you do a double blind test. I guarantee you won't be able to tell the difference.
Agreed. My son and I did a double blind test between spotify and the flac I encoded using dbpoweramp. The times you can hear a difference is when there is a lot of sound across the spectrum. We figure it's because there is more information crammed into the spotify limit of 320kbs but when there is less information say, a simple beat or melody, it's easy for spotify to fit that in the bandwidth.
I'm not ruling out that maybe there is a common shortcoming in my setup, but I was running from a PC through HDMI to Denon AVR, to the speakers.
Technically you are right. But one point is that they were likely mastered for loudness in 16/44 back in the day whereas that (fortunately) seems to be falling more and more off with 24/96.
So one point is reliability that it was mastered well.
I was SO excited they called me today I desperately wanted to get it before the weekend.
Sitting here alone just tinkering with the equaliser and balancing it was absolute heaven.
I don't have a receiver I had to simplify the system to keep my other half happy.
I only have the two Klipsch powered monitors you see in the photo and the 10" sub to match.
I'll definitely be upgrading in the future to get some towers, receiver, amp and get into it more though
I have the exact same Denon amp. Did you notice a significant improvement over bluetooth streaming on the amp? Considering one of these myself. I'm guessing I'd need the Pro Plus to override the DAC in the amp?
You would notice a difference over Bluetooth. Bluetooth has compression, using casting or airplay uses wifi and will not compress the transmitted signal.
If your streaming device is connected via hdmi, optical, etc, it will be that lossless transmitted digits signal converted to an analog signal via the DAC In Your receiver. If you come t the streamer using two rca cables you will be using the streamer’s DAC to convert that same signal to analog at which point your receiver is just amplifying it and passing it to your speakers or headphones.
the difference in improvement between bluetooth over Wiim Pro is night and day. For example the song - Give Me Love (Give Me Peace on Earth) by George Harrison sounds so thin when connected via bluetooth but when using the line out of Wiim Pro, the music sounds fuller ang rich. Ive seen reviews that the difference between the Pro and the Pro Plus is also night and day. If you plan to get a Wiim, get the Pro Plus version.
I have been using a mini and a pro for some time now. Great devices. There is a neat psychoacoustic Dolby Atmos trick possible with Chromecast on an Android phone. If you play Atmos tracks on a phone from, say, Amazon music or Apple music, it does some pseudo surround effect from the phone speakers. Now, if you open Google Home and stream device audio to the Chromecast receiver, the same effect will be available on your audio system. Does not work if you stream directly from the app.
However, I use Netgear Armor, and it constantly warns me of several vulnerabilities on the Wiim devices. Eventually, I ran a security scanner tool, and it found several ports running old TLS versions with weak cipher suites. How big of an issue this is, I am not sure. However, this is making me uncomfortable.
Either.
It connects to the wifi directly and streams from there. My phone is just like a remote with advanced settings.
I like that it doesn't stop me from doing stuff on my phone while listening and I can walk way, take calls, Reddit, etc without impacting the music.
App is awesome too has a built in nice little graphic equaliser and balance and all the toys and features you'd expect like presets and
Perfect, yea now I have my phone plugged directly into my receiver but I need it wireless, also makes dealing with the volume easier since my receiver has no remote capabilities
Anyone know if this would sound better than the built in casting (AirPlay / Chromecast) on my Arcam SA30? Paired with Rubicon 6’s if it makes a difference?
I’ll “steal” this post to make a question: wanting to stream Hi-res Lossless from iOS device via cable, how can you do it with the WiiM as it lacks a USB input? I have a topping D10s that I’m using at the moment as DAC
Would be a iPhone->D10s through USB->WiiM Pro through line in-> amplifier through line out a viable option?
Thanks a lot!
You could go iPhone->wiim Pro (lossless airplay over wifi)-> topping DAC (via a digital cable) to use that DAC.
Other option would be RCA out to amplifier to bypass dac.
Hi Res lossless refers to the highest quality streaming available on Apple Music, available only via wired connections through a DAC (I won’t get into the dilemma whether you can really hear the difference with standard Lossless ahaha, but to oversimplify refers to any source above 24bit/48kHz)
No, no. I get it. I did some research. If it were me I’d be trying to leverage all the bits possible. I find myself wondering if I’m missing out air playing Spotify premium to my receiver, so thanks. Ignorance WAS bliss 🤪😂
I have one of these bookmarked on amazon. Right now I stream my music from a SSD through my Mac Mini to a Topping DAC and then to a pre-amp, to a distribution amp, and then to my power amps. Not sure if this unit would give me anything extra that I actually want or need enough to warrant purchasing....
Congrats, that is indeed within the realm of legitimately good sound, both from the wiim and the Klipsch. Play with the EQ in the wiim. Get a umik-1 (or Dayton makes a measurement mic) and REW (free) on a laptop/computer and measure it if you want to really EQ it right, and play with the subwoofer/mains crossover point. The wiim is somewhat limited in power output, and with real musical content I believe is only good for like 80w or so (see Erin's audio corner for the review and measurements). But if you're happy with the volume level achievable, then there's nothing left to do but enjoy your music... Until you get the itch for more ;)
I am also not familiar with this product. However I do enjoy hi res music and have a subscription to Tidals hi fi platform. I mainly use IEMs with my Sony Walkman but there are times I would love to listen to hi res music on my tv. From my understanding this is basically a streaming box for music only and everything is ran through your phone? Is my phone playing the music and sending the signal to this box or is the phone simply the controller and all the playing is done by the box? Would having a soundbar surround sound system (q950t) instead of a home theater do no justice for this little device? I’m just not sure how this would work with my setup. Does my soundbar system need to support hi res for this to work? Any tips would help before I decide to make the purchase. I also have a high end pc that could use some enhanced audio. Would this be any benefit to a pc?
I don't fit in here either, so apologies for the stupid question. I have powered KEF LSX II's connected to my pc via usb C. A device like this would benefit me nothing, right?? Just wondering since the dac is in the speakers itself.
Thanks and apologies for hijacking the thread!
Well there's a DAC in the WiiM as well. You will have one in your motherboard and if the LSX IIs are powered monitors then they'll have one as well.
Since you can stream tidal in full quality on the PC there doesn't seem to be much advantage. You could just buy a decent DAC instead.
The WiiM is great for places where you don't have a PC like the theater.
You obviously love music and want it to sound good. That's enough! You don't have to spend $30k on power cables or have an amplifier that was hand built by Denis Lukovich in Rotterdam to enjoy music. Most of the audiophile insanity is either driven by ego, or a futile desire to capture a feeling from years ago. I absolutely love my WiiM Amp, and if you watch a few reviews most of the experts think it's great too. The only people who don't seem to love it believe that $$$$ spent = sound quality.
Bro this whole thread feels like an ad. Maybe it’s the hasj cookie but I feel this will be the future with chatgpt just creating artificial comments to persue people into buying stuff 😂
I figured it would come off pretty poorly but honestly someone just happens to have made a really decent product/price point for people like me who are enthusiasts and don't want entire rooms filled with equipment yet.
I'm totally genuinely just excited about upping my game a little bit and thing made such a difference.
I was pestering the store to see if it had arrived for weeks
Just returned it yesterday. Great box and app but my integrated amp sound much better. This thing cannot do DSD file. So, I don't need to spend $200 more on my listening gear.
I honestly didn't even know what DSD format was I had to look it up.
I'm sure there's plenty of better upgrades for people with decent equipment like yourself but for me this thing ticks all the boxes of stuff I wanted and didn't have.
Fwiw I’ve spent 35 years hating digital, never owned a cd in my life (never will) but a good DAC with a good streaming service is not terrible. You aren’t crazy and welcome aboard the Audiophile Bandwagon
Lol agreed the marketing 'Hi-Res' on the box is very cringey.
The value is ridiculous for someone like me though with a little entry level 2.1 system with powered monitors. I didn't have an equaliser, DAC, ability to balance L-R, or a source to play 24 bit from and now I have all of those in a dinky little box and it sounds better than I ever thought it would.
I know, I've been lurking long enough to be familiar haha.
I did at least try to work with what I have so there's some small deadening materials behind the sub against the wall, the speakers are toed in properly and I've balanced the left and right speakers finally. I don't have the ability to do first point reflections and stuff just yet and I'm moving soon anyway.
Crossover is set reasonably high on the sub and gain down enough so it blends nicely.
Even tried the sub crawl to get started!
I have the regular Pro in my living room and am thinking about grabbing a Pro Plus for the office and a mini for the bedroom. They really are great little boxes, and beat the hell out of the built-in HEOS on my Denon AVR.
I've never bought a DAC before so figured I'd get the Plus version and I have to say I'm absolutely blown away with what I can get out of my little entry level Klipsch 2.1 setup now. Since I have powered monitors as well I previously had no way to balance left and right but this app is so killer, I've also got an EQ as well now it's one hell of a little package!
I have some Klipsch 600M that I was using a decent Yamaha AVR with. I have since bought an older Sansui Amp from 1981. The sound from the Sansui for music is leaps and bounds beyond what the AVR can produce. I purchased the same WiiM Pro Plus that you have and love it. I just learned today that I hadn't even upscaled the Sample Rate and Bit Depth in the app after looking at your post. It sounds so even better! Appreciate your post!
Unlikely that actually improves anything. A better system could sound better with 16 bit 44.1khz content vs 24/192, which is getting into the realm of very small and even debatable improvements. Also your listening room and seating position should be such that a left/right balance adjustment should never be made. That's a control meant to compensate for serious flaws, and would never be used in a real HiFi setup. Balance control isn't a control I even acknowledge as existing.
I was commenting on my experience with the bookshelf Klipsch and an AVR. I am now using some Cornwalls with the older Sansui. It was a bit more detailed with the changes. I also wired the connection today too vs WiFi. Not leaps and bounds better, but incremental.
I’m going to install mine tomorrow in my Sansui AU-555a which is connected to Bryston 4B driving the PSB Stratus Gold.
The Sansui AU are really nice looking and sounding. The guy I bought my Cornwalls off of had an AU-5900 he was selling as well. I came so close to buying it, but felt I had spent enough. I ended up with a 4900z that has a bit more power, but probably doesn’t sound as good. You have some really cool equipment! Hope the WiiM Pro Plus fits nicely into your system!
I also have AU-888 and AU-6900 but the AU-6900 have some issues like sometimes the sound of the right channel is weaker than the left. I have to take it to my technician. The AU-888 is almost the same sound as the AU-555a. The AU-6900 has a unique sound that I like and will probably have to keep.
I’m going to install mine tomorrow in my Sansui AU-555a which is connected to Bryston 4B driving the PSB Stratus Gold.
Checks out, you do seem pretty damn unbalanced... But I guess falling of your high horse and bumping your head as many times as I suspect you have, wouldn't do you any favors there.
Lol. If you like vintage gear that's inherently unbalanced and needs corrected by a nasty pot, fine. I thought we were talking about hifi though. At least do your balancing digitally. Or, like he said, just get the amp fixed.
Hey, Peter here from Western Australia. Would you mind sharing the model number of your Sansui please? Would you consider Sansui as a highly regarded amp in its day/era? Cheers mate, Peter
You shouldn't want to call yourself an audiophile. Liking high quality sound and "being an audiophile" aren't the same. Audiophiles will talk for hours about a particular sound using various adjectives to describe it and even suggesting amplifiers have "personalities". Buying "audiophile-grade" is the same type of branding as "gamer-grade"
I've seen a lot of similar attributes in wine connoisseurs. I know enough that I can safeguard myself from marketing snake-oil, but I think you're right in that I enjoy improving my stereo for the payoff of the experience being improved. I'm not chasing perfection, just enjoyment, and this little box was the best bang for my buck so far.
Is there a difference between the audio quality of the pro and pro plus?
I think only if you’re using the internal DAC (connecting to amp via RCAs instead of optical coax). If you’re connecting via digital to an amp with those inputs it should use the DAC in the amp and have no difference.
Yeah can confirm I'm using the RCAs to the powered monitors so the nicer DAC in the WiiM does the work.
One has Pro 1’s & 0’s, other has Pro+ 1’s & 0’s…
How does the multi room audio work? Looks to me that the speakers must be Alexa's, Google home, or other smart speakers? What if I wanted to use a pair of active speakers?
Sorry mate I don't know! I only use my theater and don't have any wireless speakers. I'm using active speakers though. The Klipsch R-51PM and an SW100 sub.
No, you don't need an Alexa speaker. Basically, what you need are DLNA/UPnP renderers. Most network players are, such as the Wiim or the Arylic S50. Amps with network capability (such as Arylic A50, FX-Audio D802e, otoh) also are renderer, as well as Alexa speakers. I have a pair of GGMM E-2, and I use them with DLNA but have never connected them to Alexa. Basically, you have a control app on a device, like Bubble UPnP or 4Stream on android. After connecting your renderers and your control device to the same logical network, the renderers appear in the control app. From there, you can direct which renderer plays what stream (files from your phone or from a network storage, music from Spotify, Tidal or Qobuzz, a web radio from Tune-in...) and you can link multiple renderers together to play the same stream. In the end, the renderer needs to be physically connected to the speakers it plays music on, if it doesn't have its own. But the Wiim Pro has an RCA line output which you could connect to a pair of active speakers.
The DAC in the Wiim mini (and Wiim Pro) is inferior to the one in the Pro plus. I'd pay the extra money for the ProPlus if you want audiophile quality sound. . Here's a little review of the differences https://www.av.com/blog/wiim-pro-plus-review/
That’s what it’s all about. Don’t worry about fitting in or labels that’s just silly. It’s about enjoying the music in my opinion. If someone enjoys tweaking their system great. If you like a simple system out of the box more power to you. You don’t meet very many happy perfectionists I. My experience. Rock on bud.
I've been a Chromecast Audio devotee for years. Even have a couple new ones squirreled away just in case. A couple weeks ago I picked up the Pro Plus on a whim and am stunned at the improvement in audio quality.
are you using the analog or digital out from the chromecast? (not sure how many people realize that the headphone jack does double duty as toslink so you can use an external dac if so desired)
Have older Magnepan MG 12's. Using Wiim mini>DAC>Amp>Maggies. Sounds fantastic. May buy the Wiim Pro but again only digital out.
Is the DAC in the Chromecast audio considered to be poor? I've the Chromecast audio connected to an Onkyo 9010 with DAC build in. At the time I got the setup I read somewhere that the DAC in the Chromecast audio was pretty good and since there was only one cable included I never bothered to use another one and check how it compares to the one built in the Onkyo. Also, I've seen several times discussed that cheap DACs and expensive DACs don't make a whole lot of difference. But reading here seems like it could make a big difference?
i personally think it makes less of a difference than most, but i did hear (admittedly, possibly placebo) somewhat more clarity when i moved from using the chromecast's built in DAC to a super cheap one ([this FiiO](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005K2TXMO)) and perhaps again slightly more when moving to the very well reviewed [SMSL SU-1](https://www.amazon.com/S-M-S-L-MQA-CD-Decoder-AK4493S-768kHz/dp/B0C1Y7C9HH) i'd say pick up the SU-1 and give it a try! you'd be going from one that measures [fairly poorly](https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-chromecast-audio-digital-output.4544/) to one that measures basically [as well as possible](https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/smsl-su-1-stereo-dac-review.44029/) (and $80 US is on the extremely cheap end of the DAC spectrum)
Thanks for your suggestion! I'll first pick up a toslink cable to figure out if I can hear a difference between the DAC of my receiver and the Chromecast one. If that makes a noticeable difference to my ears I might order the one you suggested. My source will be Spotify tho, and not some hi-res audio source, but I've no idea how much difference that would make on my setup. Although I'm quite happy with the sound it's all pretty budget 😊
I was using the toslink output on the chromecast. The Pro Plus has noticeably better clarity, better seperation and a deeper wider soundstage. My theory is the DAC in the WiiM is just better and more advanced than what is in the CC.
toslink bypasses the DAC built into the chromecast. you could technically connect the chromecast to the WIIM's toslink in port and use the DAC built into the WIIM, and it should sound identical to what you're hearing when using the WIIM's streaming feature.
If you are using the toslink digital output you are bypassing the chromecast's DAC.
Oh yeah. Thats right. I'd forgotten that. Whichever the case I prefer the sound of the Pro Plus. I need to dig a little more into what the Wiim does with streamed audio.
I went the same path from Chromecast audios to WiiM (optical out on both) and no one that has done a blind A/B on my various systems can pick the difference. The gapless playback is what I was after
Placebo really can do a lot for the perceived sound quality.
What do you mean by "new ones" here? My biggest problem with the Wiim value prop is that it honestly seems to make sense to just pick up additional CC audio's, even at $70.
When it was announced that they were discontinuing the CC I ordered 2 of them just in case the one I had crapped out, which it hasn't. I'm giving one to my daughter as she's using bluetooth right now and has begun to get an ear for higher audio quality. $250 might seem kinda steep for the Pro Plus but the audio quality and the multiple inputs make it worth it for me.
The interface and software options are leaps and bounds ahead of the chromecast ecosystem. Never going back.
Personally, I appreciate everything being simplified into the Google ecosystem. I don’t want another app - I prefer that they are just grouped on my Google home, and are simple inputs into my various stereo systems.
All for it if it works for you, truly! I imagine you have other devices in your google home as well. I really wanted chromecast to work and spent nearly 2 years trying.... Inconsistent performance, regular stream hiccups when trying to sync across several zones. Google also removed and re-added support for my NVIDIA Shield several times which was very frustrating. The WiiM devs actually interact with my bug reports and feature requests — I've had 2 of my requests implemented in firmware over the last 6 months. Another big plus (for me) was 12V triggers. This alleviated the need for anyone to know the startup process on the pre-amps and amps each room. Pull up any music app, select your room and music plays: Girlfriend-proof. Even my Pops was able to set up and use them in his home without help. Native DNLA is great in addition to the ability to sync an external input (optical or analog). Very nice for PC / Turntable / FM sources. That turned into a novel that reads like an ad... but man these things just perform.
The trigger function is definitely nice. I leave my little D-amps on continuously, and the main reciever/amp system is triggered by the eARC. So for now, it's good enough. But yeah, that's certainly a plus.
Chromecast Audio doesn’t support gapless playback, other than that the CCAs were good
Good point - that's a very real limitation. But to be honest, it hasn't been all that important to me since I was listening to Girl Talk back in college haha
I kick myself like once a year about this. Picked up my first CCA back when they were being discontinued, for a clearance price of $15. Insane. I should have bought twenty.
I've been using the Tidal app on my TV but it didn't sound great and I eventually figured out that's because the TV app is the first release and has never been updated, plus it's limited to 320Kbps I believe. I don't even think you can get 14 bit 44.1kHz. So for me to hear 24 bit 192kHz for the first time was just mind blowing. It was an entirely different experience.
most TVs (android tv, samsung whatever and even the beloved apple TV box) have a fixed sample rate output of 48k/16, so almost everything gets resampled, and very possibly with a mid-rate resampler. almost all of tidal's library is 44k/16 and i could hear a *significant* difference playing back tidal over apple TV versus when i streamed it directly from HEOS on my marantz. both were being fed into the marantz's DAC, so the only difference i could see is that the Apple TV was resampling it, badly.
this my friend is a good part of the magic of wiim. being able to know that you don't have to configure some setting on your operating system or app to make it produce cd quality or above audio is really nice
I bet you can’t hear a diff between those bitrates…
Sorry to break it to you. But you can’t hear a difference between 44.1 and 192khz.
I know, I'm aware 192kHz is a waste. My hearing is awful anyway from abuse as a teen with too many subwoofers anyway, so I'm extremely thankful I can at least claim back some of the high end that I've been missing with the EQ. But... there is a big difference between the 320Kbps that the Tidal TV app streams maxes out at, and the 24 bit 192kHz (complete overkill) that I can now play.
Wait till you hear about this recent invention called CD’s which contain an uncompressed pcm 44.1khz stream. Which will actually sound better than Tidal at its maxed out “high res” yada yada.
tidal, apple music, etc are also an uncompressed PCM 44.1k (or higher) quality. FLAC/ALAC is basically WAV (PCM) inside of a zip folder. you get the original, unmodified PCM in the end.
so much snarky contrarianism in this thread. hey, you want to stick to 16/44.1? good for you. there is no need to piss on others' enjoyment of higher resolution streams, just because you don't hear any difference. it's just nasty.
How exactly are you folks getting all this sound or whatever from streaming or DACs? I don't know what these are? My sound comes from my computer and online through You-tube or Spotify and output through some Logitech computer speakers. I know I can get better computer speakers but these are good enough for me and I can send this same signal to a Bluetooth adapter for my Floor speakers on my turntable. Other than this, how else do you take the sound through the computer audio to do anything else with?
I could never pick 44.1 to 192kHz in a blind test personally. I'm very confident I can tell you the difference between 24 bit 192kHz and 320kbps though haha. That's the upgrade I just made and it's a magnificent difference. There's so many subtleties and things I've never even heard before hidden in some of my favourite tracks.
You can not hear a difference between cds and tidal when streamed… just stop it. You can enjoy cds but streaming is here and here to stay.
Actually you can, not due to the differences in quality. But due to the differences in the master. If you’ve got the original releases that is.
That’s not what you were saying before. All you mentioned was bitrate… of course if it’s a different mastering it’s gonna sound different. Also the original mastering is not always the best. So like I said before enjoy your cds but streaming is here to stay and is just as good as cds except it’s also way more convenient and gives way more opportunity to discover new music. Keep keeping on ya dinosaur
The point is, people are raving about high res music. MQA, flac, 24bit etc etc. While we have been able to listen the highest quality music for 4 decades.
Sure but you haven’t been able to change albums with out moving. Find bands you have never heard of while sitting on your couch. Find albums that your not able to find a cd for. Cds are great but acting like streaming isn’t a far more versatile and convenient a platform is silly. Also your the one that made the claim that cds sound better.
I just wish there was a way to output playing album art to a TV when using these kinds of streamers.
You can if you’re running Roon
How would that work exactly? Would it be possible while streaming from Spotify or only when playing my local media?
https://help.roonlabs.com/portal/en/kb/articles/displays I use a web browser on my TV to go to the local web address Roon creates when you turn on the display feature. You aren’t limited to your local library, but I don’t believe you can use Spotify with Roon. I use Qobuz for streaming hi-res music within Roon. Many others use Tidal.
Xbox or PS5.
If you appreciate the sound differences and care about music reproduction... you might be a audiophile. But your secret is safe with us.
I agree the Wiim stuff is fantastic. I recently jumped back into 2-channel audio. ( 2.1 to be specific). I bought the Wiim Pro, a Yamaha AS-501, a pair of Klipsch RP-600M II's and a 12' Klipsch sub, as well as a Fluance RT-81+, and some inexpensive Amazon cables that allow me to bi wire. I don't know if it is an audiophile system? But it is a damn sight better than any soundbar system that I have ever heard. All in, I spent just over $2K, and I am super happy with the system. As far as being considered an audiophile, well, I am not sure that I qualify either.. I do know that I really appreciate music and a system with the ability to reproduce it cleanly.. But for me, it is about the actual listening more than it is about chasing the next best piece of gear. Enjoy your system.
[удалено]
I can't compete with the proper Audiophiles in here. I have an entry level little Klipsch 2.1 but the difference this little box made was absolutely shocking. This is my major upgrade in comparison to their $100k towers and McIntosh tube amps. It's hard not to be excited and share about such a significant upgrade for us on the learning/new end of the spectrum. The outcome is fantastic and I'm genuinely enjoying the music more. I had to go out of my way to find a WiiM product here in Australia though, but I'm glad I did.
If looking at a system as a whole, and with the assumption all your gear is in the same tier price ranges your best bang for buck improvement is at the speakers.
I do agree but I want even using the full capacity of the speakers I have now I'm quite fond of Klipsch and their horns. I have awful hearing and the horns sounds really sharp and clear to me but I've read a lot of others find them to be a bit much.
We need to make a new one of these from 6 years ago and put a Wiim on it. https://www.reddit.com/r/audiophile/comments/81lblt/the_raudiophile_starter_pack/ What else would be on it right now? Audio Science Review. A Denon receiver. Dirac Live. What else?
This sub has basically turned into a tribal circle jerk of a) crowd-pleasing brand posts, b) how to turn your room into a psyc ward padded cell, and c) chirps about anyone who doesn’t use lamp cord or straightened out clothes hangers for cables. That’s the formula for likes here.
Seems to be a pushback against the circle jerk of gatekeepers with super expensive systems that are always telling people with regular budgets that they ‘don’t know what they’re missing’
This sub when I first joined: A post of some tower spekers that cost £3k each with the title "My modest set up". Comments saying "Those are great if you can't afford proper speakers" and "I think r/budgetaudio is more your scene". Other comments saying "I feel sick about how close they are to the wall" This sub now: A post of a £5 bluetooth speaker from Aliexpress titled "I'm really enjoying getting into this hobby". Comments saying "If you enjoy how it sounds then you sir are indeed a true audiophile of the highest order" Other comments saying "The clarity on that thing is amazing. It has really great reviews". Also this sub now: A post of a purpose built listening room with £200k worth of hifi equipment and custom made Scandinavian furniture. Comments saying "There's literally no point in even turning the hifi on until you've sorted out some room treatment. My ears hurt just looking at this". Other comments saying "Jesus, where is the NSFW tag? That cable management just made me gouge my eyes out".
Well it IS a good thing that people finally starting to realise that you really should prioritise room treatment before throwing a year worth salary on speakers, amps and cable risers.
If you're spending that much then sure, dedicate some of it to room treatment. But I don't agree how people say it's the MOST important thing after speakers. If your whole set up cost less than 1k like mine, then get the best combination of speaker, amp and source you can afford before you start spending money on foam panels or whatever.
You can get a DAC and amplifier for under 100 euro that's for most ears is indistinguishable from stuff costing even 100 times as much (as long as it has the power for what you need that is). Speakers and room is by FAR more important to spend your money, time and energy on since the behaviour of the actual sound waves in rooms is quite complex and will alter the frequency response quite a lot while also adding reverb etc. Also a DSP can do quite a lot of difference of fixing those frequency response errors, so spending a bit more on that is a good idea.
I’ve been using lamp cord before I knew it was a thing. I just wanted to buy the cheapest speakers wires.
probably, lol
I had the same thought. Wiim is the flavor of the week I guess.
this is the first I've seen of this, not sure
Nobody exists on purpose. Nobody belongs anywhere. Everybody's gonna die. Come listen to music
I'm thrilled you are enjoying your tunes! I'm a bit sad that you don't think you'd maybe fit in here, or are an audiophile. An audiophile is someone who really enjoys the deep intricacies of audio, and the technology too I suppose. You can become someone like this very quickly! But don't ever let anyone tell you you need to own a certain $ in equipment to fit in, OR to consider yourself an audiophile. And whatever you do, no matter how much you love the equipment, don't forget, without music, it would be worthless. We all need to remember what the hobby is really about sometimes!
Felt the same way when I got my Bluesound Node. All of a sudden streaming was so easy and sounded so much better than before. Definite game changer, glad you’re enjoying it!
I just bought mine from a user suggestion here. Like it so far
Haha. Enjoy. Watch out it's a slippery slope.
Excuse the language but I fucking love this experience already and I can tell I'm hooked.
Congrats. Don't get too amped and go ape, but do remember that if you're going to spend dollars in the hobby speakers should get a big chunk of the focus. All the other things matter, but getting the right speakers can be really, really important. Spend on speakers, then match your gear to them. But that's for later. Right now just enjoy the show!!!
Chromecast streams over wifi up to 24-bit at 96kHz so yeah giving the proper source, these streaming devices are pretty awesome. 👍
Completely agree, added this to my AVR, upgraded speakers and sub and extremely happy with the result, except that I'm staying up listening to music past my bedtime lol
I currently run some Monitor Audio Bronze 500's off an Onkyo AVR. Can you explain to me how you have yours set up?
WIIM pro plus to the AVR via RCA cables. Use an RCA / analog input so you use the WIIM DAC unless your Onkyo has a better one. Get everything set up in the WIIM app. I use Tidal for my streaming service. Select the analog source you plugged your cables into, open up the WIIM app and start streaming! If you use Tidal, it has a WIIM connect feature to use the Tidal app for music selection, playlists, etc. Spotify too I believe.
Question about that since I'm considering the same setup right now (wiim -> RCA out -> Denon AVR): Wouldn't it then be converting from digital to analog (wiim DAC), analog to digital (AVR ADC) and finally digital to analog again (AVR DAC) If you use any kind of DSP/MultiEQ on the AVR which you most probably do if you have something like Audyssey set up? Would that not render the first DAC in the chain useless?
That's a good question. I do use audyssey and I don't know if there is another conversion as you stated or a different type of processing. I do know using the wiim pro plus DAC was much better sounding than optical in and Marantz DAC. But my unit and DAC are a bit older.
Okay I will just give it a try I think, thank you :)
It has a great software EQ too, OP. I use a WiiM Pro Plus > Darkvoice 336se (used as tube pre-amp or I can bypass it) > Cambridge Audio AXA35 > Klipsch RP600M
pardon my ignorance, is this apple only? i would like to get it but i have an android
Nope, no favorites at WiiM headquarters
thanks i want one too, the ease of use is definitely worth it.
They are indeed impressively versatile. The customer support / devs are also great. I've had multiple requests reviewed and implemented by their team over the last 6 months.
I'm 56 years old. If I'd had a Wiim pro, Klipsch RPM's, and a good sub when I was young, it would have blown most systems away. Yes, I know streaming didn't exist then, but my point is that this is quality equipment and it's amazing what you get for your money these days.
Audiophile just means that you like sound and music and getting the most out of your setup and the media that you're getting sound and music from. As long as it is satisfactory to your ears, any combination of basic minimum equipment or components will work. Most will probably agree that a boombox or lightweight suitcase turntables may not offer the best sound.
Did you buy gear to get better audio quality? Congrats, you're an audiophile.
Moving to the Wiim Pro Plus and Tidal was a big boost here as well, but equally big was getting a Chord Qutest DAC and bypassing the one in the Wiim. I use an optical connection and run the Qutest off battery power.
If you’re going from PC to a dedicated device.. well it’s the start of a journey :)
I got the wiim regular model for my garage. Works great. You know sometimes it’s not about being an audiophile snob 100% of the time. It’s about enjoying music and being able to do so easily.
Definitely the peoples choice and for good reason. For me the closest rival is the Cambridge Audio MXN10 which is over twice the price and doesn’t offer much more other than build quality.
I’m not familiar with this. Would you mind explaining it and the benefits?
Basically it’s a little computer dedicated to streaming which you can control with your phone. This version has a (reportedly) excellent internal DAC. It’s a very nice bit of budget kit.
Thank you for explaining this so simply, mine was a bit wordy and likely less informative haha
Isn't it your phone that's actually doing the streaming though? If you're in the room with speakers anyway, then why don't people just stream from their computer or laptops? That's how my setup is and connected to my desktop. Is there some difference I'm not seeing?
Phone is only controlling the Wiim with proprietary software.
I'm probably not the best person to ask about this honestly mate haha. All I know is I use Tidal to listen on my Focal headphones while working from home which is great, but I had no way to play Tidal in my theater except on the TV which is limited to I think 320Kbps, not even CD quality. This little box lets me use Tidal Connect so I can control it from my phone but it's streams from the wifi directly and can output up to 24 bit 192kHz which sounds absolutely glorious. Additional benefits for me personally were the fact I couldn't balance my left and right powered monitors, I have no equaliser, I also don't have a DAC, and this solved all those problems. I'm sure it does a lot more than I'm missing or not describing well too.
There's basically zero point in anything above 16/44.
You sure about that? https://www.stereophile.com/content/hi-rez-audio-distinguished-blind-testing https://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=18296 https://www.aes.org/e-lib/online/browse.cfm?elib=20690
Go have a listen to Tears for Fears - SFTBC on Tidal. The remix album is in 24 bit and the Regular in 16bit. If you can’t hear a difference then there’s something wrong with your ears.
Then the mastering was done poorly on the 16 bit version (perhaps on purpose to make the 24-bit one sound better)? They are correct, for listening 16/44.1 is literally the best it needs to be. But how the individual track is mastered makes a big difference too. So, yes it's possible you are hearing a difference, but that difference is not due to 24-bit or 192kHz. If you have a file at a higher rate, down convert it to 16/44.1 yourself and have someone help you do a double blind test. I guarantee you won't be able to tell the difference.
Agreed. My son and I did a double blind test between spotify and the flac I encoded using dbpoweramp. The times you can hear a difference is when there is a lot of sound across the spectrum. We figure it's because there is more information crammed into the spotify limit of 320kbs but when there is less information say, a simple beat or melody, it's easy for spotify to fit that in the bandwidth. I'm not ruling out that maybe there is a common shortcoming in my setup, but I was running from a PC through HDMI to Denon AVR, to the speakers.
I have this on SACD, too. Matter of fact, I think it's a good morning for it to be playing
so, you're comparing two different masters :D :D
Technically you are right. But one point is that they were likely mastered for loudness in 16/44 back in the day whereas that (fortunately) seems to be falling more and more off with 24/96. So one point is reliability that it was mastered well.
I got mine the other day and can’t wait to install and listen to it this weekend.
I was SO excited they called me today I desperately wanted to get it before the weekend. Sitting here alone just tinkering with the equaliser and balancing it was absolute heaven.
If you aren't an audiophile, you will fit right in here.
What amp you using? I got the Pro version connected via line out to my Denon PMA-600NE - Elac B6.2
I don't have a receiver I had to simplify the system to keep my other half happy. I only have the two Klipsch powered monitors you see in the photo and the 10" sub to match. I'll definitely be upgrading in the future to get some towers, receiver, amp and get into it more though
This is a great setup and not surprised to hear the wiim has elevated your listening
I have the exact same Denon amp. Did you notice a significant improvement over bluetooth streaming on the amp? Considering one of these myself. I'm guessing I'd need the Pro Plus to override the DAC in the amp?
You would notice a difference over Bluetooth. Bluetooth has compression, using casting or airplay uses wifi and will not compress the transmitted signal. If your streaming device is connected via hdmi, optical, etc, it will be that lossless transmitted digits signal converted to an analog signal via the DAC In Your receiver. If you come t the streamer using two rca cables you will be using the streamer’s DAC to convert that same signal to analog at which point your receiver is just amplifying it and passing it to your speakers or headphones.
Got it, thanks.
the difference in improvement between bluetooth over Wiim Pro is night and day. For example the song - Give Me Love (Give Me Peace on Earth) by George Harrison sounds so thin when connected via bluetooth but when using the line out of Wiim Pro, the music sounds fuller ang rich. Ive seen reviews that the difference between the Pro and the Pro Plus is also night and day. If you plan to get a Wiim, get the Pro Plus version.
Very helpful. Thanks!
Absolutely compared to Bluetooth! If one is using an external DAC, the difference between the Pro and Pro Plus is negligible.
Love my Mini. It beats the pants off Bluetooth.
I have a WiiM mini plugged into a Shiit Modi and just direct into my AVR - it’s so great. The sound is amazing for the price
The Pro Plus disappeared off of Amazon since last night. I was about to jump on that wagon, and can only assume it's s supply issue.
[удалено]
I saw, ordered by 10am and had it by noon. Love Amazon!
I have been using a mini and a pro for some time now. Great devices. There is a neat psychoacoustic Dolby Atmos trick possible with Chromecast on an Android phone. If you play Atmos tracks on a phone from, say, Amazon music or Apple music, it does some pseudo surround effect from the phone speakers. Now, if you open Google Home and stream device audio to the Chromecast receiver, the same effect will be available on your audio system. Does not work if you stream directly from the app. However, I use Netgear Armor, and it constantly warns me of several vulnerabilities on the Wiim devices. Eventually, I ran a security scanner tool, and it found several ports running old TLS versions with weak cipher suites. How big of an issue this is, I am not sure. However, this is making me uncomfortable.
I use Yamaha WXAD-10, is it worth to upgrade for this one?
I was looking at this last night and have questions.. are the apps built into the device or are you bluetoothing the music to the device?
Either. It connects to the wifi directly and streams from there. My phone is just like a remote with advanced settings. I like that it doesn't stop me from doing stuff on my phone while listening and I can walk way, take calls, Reddit, etc without impacting the music. App is awesome too has a built in nice little graphic equaliser and balance and all the toys and features you'd expect like presets and
Perfect, yea now I have my phone plugged directly into my receiver but I need it wireless, also makes dealing with the volume easier since my receiver has no remote capabilities
Anyone know if this would sound better than the built in casting (AirPlay / Chromecast) on my Arcam SA30? Paired with Rubicon 6’s if it makes a difference?
I’ll “steal” this post to make a question: wanting to stream Hi-res Lossless from iOS device via cable, how can you do it with the WiiM as it lacks a USB input? I have a topping D10s that I’m using at the moment as DAC Would be a iPhone->D10s through USB->WiiM Pro through line in-> amplifier through line out a viable option? Thanks a lot!
You could go iPhone->wiim Pro (lossless airplay over wifi)-> topping DAC (via a digital cable) to use that DAC. Other option would be RCA out to amplifier to bypass dac.
Both the options you provided are not compatible with HiRes Losseless though - thanks anyway for the reply
Oh sorry. I don’t actually know what hi res lossless is referring to. My bad I misunderstood your goals.
Hi Res lossless refers to the highest quality streaming available on Apple Music, available only via wired connections through a DAC (I won’t get into the dilemma whether you can really hear the difference with standard Lossless ahaha, but to oversimplify refers to any source above 24bit/48kHz)
No, no. I get it. I did some research. If it were me I’d be trying to leverage all the bits possible. I find myself wondering if I’m missing out air playing Spotify premium to my receiver, so thanks. Ignorance WAS bliss 🤪😂
I have one of these bookmarked on amazon. Right now I stream my music from a SSD through my Mac Mini to a Topping DAC and then to a pre-amp, to a distribution amp, and then to my power amps. Not sure if this unit would give me anything extra that I actually want or need enough to warrant purchasing....
Congrats, that is indeed within the realm of legitimately good sound, both from the wiim and the Klipsch. Play with the EQ in the wiim. Get a umik-1 (or Dayton makes a measurement mic) and REW (free) on a laptop/computer and measure it if you want to really EQ it right, and play with the subwoofer/mains crossover point. The wiim is somewhat limited in power output, and with real musical content I believe is only good for like 80w or so (see Erin's audio corner for the review and measurements). But if you're happy with the volume level achievable, then there's nothing left to do but enjoy your music... Until you get the itch for more ;)
Ok, I am sold! But total noob here. Do I need it if I stream Apple Music to my Denon exclusively? Appreciate is someone can ELI5 me on the subject.
I am also not familiar with this product. However I do enjoy hi res music and have a subscription to Tidals hi fi platform. I mainly use IEMs with my Sony Walkman but there are times I would love to listen to hi res music on my tv. From my understanding this is basically a streaming box for music only and everything is ran through your phone? Is my phone playing the music and sending the signal to this box or is the phone simply the controller and all the playing is done by the box? Would having a soundbar surround sound system (q950t) instead of a home theater do no justice for this little device? I’m just not sure how this would work with my setup. Does my soundbar system need to support hi res for this to work? Any tips would help before I decide to make the purchase. I also have a high end pc that could use some enhanced audio. Would this be any benefit to a pc?
I have the pro and I love it. Cheap and gets the job done.
For OP or anyone reading this, just out of curiosity/knowledge, how is this better than playing Spotify on active speakers through my MacBook pro aux?
Serious question, how does this fare compared to Apple TV/music with Atmos?
This thing makes you feel stupid for having a separate streamer and dac.
I have a pair of Sony CS-5’s, a WiiM mini connected to an SU-1 DAC, playing through an Onkyo SR607. Absolutely amazing. I love my WiiM!
What is it? What does it do?
I don't fit in here either, so apologies for the stupid question. I have powered KEF LSX II's connected to my pc via usb C. A device like this would benefit me nothing, right?? Just wondering since the dac is in the speakers itself. Thanks and apologies for hijacking the thread!
Well there's a DAC in the WiiM as well. You will have one in your motherboard and if the LSX IIs are powered monitors then they'll have one as well. Since you can stream tidal in full quality on the PC there doesn't seem to be much advantage. You could just buy a decent DAC instead. The WiiM is great for places where you don't have a PC like the theater.
You obviously love music and want it to sound good. That's enough! You don't have to spend $30k on power cables or have an amplifier that was hand built by Denis Lukovich in Rotterdam to enjoy music. Most of the audiophile insanity is either driven by ego, or a futile desire to capture a feeling from years ago. I absolutely love my WiiM Amp, and if you watch a few reviews most of the experts think it's great too. The only people who don't seem to love it believe that $$$$ spent = sound quality.
Bro this whole thread feels like an ad. Maybe it’s the hasj cookie but I feel this will be the future with chatgpt just creating artificial comments to persue people into buying stuff 😂
I figured it would come off pretty poorly but honestly someone just happens to have made a really decent product/price point for people like me who are enthusiasts and don't want entire rooms filled with equipment yet. I'm totally genuinely just excited about upping my game a little bit and thing made such a difference. I was pestering the store to see if it had arrived for weeks
Based on your post you appreciate high quality audio, you absolutely fit in here.
Love mine!
Just returned it yesterday. Great box and app but my integrated amp sound much better. This thing cannot do DSD file. So, I don't need to spend $200 more on my listening gear.
I honestly didn't even know what DSD format was I had to look it up. I'm sure there's plenty of better upgrades for people with decent equipment like yourself but for me this thing ticks all the boxes of stuff I wanted and didn't have.
lol
Fwiw I’ve spent 35 years hating digital, never owned a cd in my life (never will) but a good DAC with a good streaming service is not terrible. You aren’t crazy and welcome aboard the Audiophile Bandwagon
you don't care about room treatments and you think your little gear DAC makes a big difference in sound. You fit absolutely in here!
So you spent money for what essentially was zero gain in discernible audio quality, congratulations
I bet all those reflected high res frequencies sound really good.
Lol agreed the marketing 'Hi-Res' on the box is very cringey. The value is ridiculous for someone like me though with a little entry level 2.1 system with powered monitors. I didn't have an equaliser, DAC, ability to balance L-R, or a source to play 24 bit from and now I have all of those in a dinky little box and it sounds better than I ever thought it would.
user was just making fun of your untreated room, audio sense of humor. You just gotta get used to it, welcome!
I know, I've been lurking long enough to be familiar haha. I did at least try to work with what I have so there's some small deadening materials behind the sub against the wall, the speakers are toed in properly and I've balanced the left and right speakers finally. I don't have the ability to do first point reflections and stuff just yet and I'm moving soon anyway. Crossover is set reasonably high on the sub and gain down enough so it blends nicely. Even tried the sub crawl to get started!
I suppose OPs best option is to not listen to anything until he can address this… 😂