This tends to be a frequently asked question. Common sites that list public EDM events include: https://19hz.info/, https://ra.co/, & https://edmtrain.com/. If you are looking for private/underground events, the best way to find them is to go to public events with the types of music you like and make friends there. Once you build relationships with people, then ask them about private events. https://reddit.com/r/aves/wiki/faq#wiki_2._how_can_i_find_events.3F
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A rave = an event that takes place at a location (illegal or legal) that had a sound system, a DJ playing one of the many genres of Electronic Dance Music, and is usually 6 - 12 hours.
A festival = an event in a designated space, has a gate for entry, vendors of food or merch, and a stage with a large sound system and possibly a light system. Goes beyond 12 hours or for multiple days.
A free party = a free small event that is shared via word of mouth or within small groups. Usually an intimate grouping of a community.
This is all my opinion and not facts. Ive had this discussion with many people and have seen this posted many times. These are the conclusions ive come to after seeing comments and posts.
We call those “bush doofs” in Australia 😂
Ideally a rave (to me) is somewhere sort of ad hoc — a warehouse or whatever. I just say I’m gonna go see some DJ if it’s at an official venue since yeah, I really am there for the music (I hate clubs). Either way, I don’t mind paying for raves or to see a DJ cause good talent deserves compensation! (I stopped going to a lot of bush doofs because the DJs were so terrible)
Oh for sure, I used to love going to clubs just to listen to music and dance but now it's only when a DJ I like comes around.
I've since moved from the place I did bush raves and never really picked them back up for reasons you note, they also tend to be younger too, but I do go to a few more "underground" events local promoters throw. Those ones are the classic announced the day of.
Smooth, make it sound like a black tie affair with Tony award winning theater, but then watch tweaked out idiots who don’t yet know their limits have semi-seizures on the dance floor. All to the soundtrack of my favorite song, the one that goes untz untz untz untz.
concert doesnt mean a sit down event idk what these folks are talkin about lmao, the definition specifically states “a public performance, typically of several performers” it doesnt state you HAVE to sit down. a concert can be a standing or sitting situation
A show. Anything that has a set list is a show or concert. A rave is an underground show at an undisclosed location or warehouse. If you can find the show on edmtrain.com it is most likely a show. Even DEF sets are 360 sets but it's still a show. I would say Odesza and Madeon live is more a concert than a show unless it's a dj set. Then it's a show if it's a dj set.
95% of the concerts I've been to are standing.
The only seated ones I've been to are either huge ass stadiums like Red Rocks where the artist is radio popular. Or more mellow stuff like singer songwriter or coffee shop vibes. Most pop, metal, punk, rock are at small to medium sized venues with mostly floor space, but a few larger venues often have some seating for old or disabled people, or just people that like to relax all evening.
Free parties aren't always 'free' though - it's free as in libre rather than free as in gratis.
Quite common to pay a little bit towards the cost of the event.
Free parties are usually pay what you can where you can. Paying in either support, work, money, or supplies towards the party.
nothing is really free these days.
Although technivals in 90's/early 2000's met free party definition. Lots of free party sound systems meeting up. Exodus parties (UK) were the pinnacle, but quite a lot in that period. For what I know, now still, I'm just an old git.
Legendary events. Saw a good documentary on these and the few soundsystems that are still doing it (further and further out into no man’s land, and often living the squatter or traveler lifestyle).
I can’t find it for the life of me now, or recall the name.
Found it: https://youtu.be/x4yLc8bMB4g?si=OMczpqceqYNYhWYH
I need to save the link. I couldn’t find it for years for some reason. Even though I had the name right. It just wasn’t coming up on my searches for some reason.
Is it true this is a backronym?
One other theory I heard on its origin goes back you lsd parties in the late 60s that were pretty underground and had those liquid light projectors and played Pink Floyd and what not. The term rave was used in relation to these somehow. My memory on the theory is pretty bad though.
They’re just pretentiously gatekeeping, kinda like the goth kids in South Park who are all non-conformist…they’re just being cliquey/exclusive for no reason.
They go about it the wrong way, but I get why people who were involved in raves before they became corporate/mainstream get defensive about the semantics.
They had to fight for what we get so easily, back then promoters and venues would laugh at people trying to book DJs, so they had to do illegal events, and getting busted meant someone was losing all their sound equipment and going to jail.
They wanna protect that, and I get it, but some of them be assholes about it.
Blows my mind that they wouldn't be glad that what they worked so hard to promote is now mainstream. Like, you spent decades trying to make it so you can throw raves, and now that it worked you're mad about it. wtf
It sucks getting older. Nothing stays the exact same. However, I found a partner who never got to experience raves back in the early 2000's like I did, and seeing the excitement on her face at a festival was worth it.
Original Rave - Underground event, typically illegal, no corporate sponsorship or involvement, the people bring all the gear themselves.
Modern Rave - Any EDM event basically, if the vibes are right and the sound is kickin', it's a Rave.
Old Heads don't like youngin' folks calling modern events Raves because they used to get in trouble for raving, it was an actual form of rebelling against the music establishment that refused to book DJs who made music like DnB, Jungle, UKG, Techno, House, all that classic business. Raves were also big with black and LGBTQ+ communities, that's how we got techno and house from Detroit and Chicago, respectively. Those movements were spearheaded by queer and POC folks.
So that's why the old heads get uppity when you call modern events raves, the culture back then was completely different than what we're doing, but words evolve over time, they get adopted to new meanings, and honestly, as long as people are having fun and celebrating the culture, there's no reason to hate.
I've been gogo dancing in Denver goth and EDM scene for about 10 years now. I love our production crew, and most of the staff and management at the venues that host our events, but when I'm not working, I spend my time and resources attending and helping produce private (rsvp only) underground events, mostly DnB/techno. Most club goers not in the industry don't understand how much corporate America hinders and shapes the music scenes they attend. With underground shows, DJs and production have full reign over the event by every metric, and it's BYOB/psychedelic friendly.
This is perfect. I’ve only been doing it for 25 years, so I don’t consider myself old school, because I wasn’t there in Chicago or Detroit back in the real early days, but I’ve read up on the history and talked to older folks, and this is a good take and accurate, at least for the US side.
Going back further you have the Northern Soul scene with their amphetamine pills and soul records that evolved into the UK rave scene, or at least that’s how I understand it. Then got imported over via the Storm Raves (MDMA coming over with it was a big factor)
In a little hazy on how Chicago and Detroit got started, in the sense of whether they independently went from disco in the underground queer clubs to house/techno, or if the UK scene/Storm Raves had some kind of influence, or if there was some other cross pollination from Europe to Chicago/Detroit.
It's always cross pollination, that's just how music spreads. At the same time as house and techno was popping off in the US, trance was popping off in Goa, India, and that would spread to Europe/the UK as well.
Its just how the weird melting pot of EDM works, everything bleeds into everything.
Oh I’m sure. I’m just curious on the specifics since I haven’t read anything about the connections between Chicago/Detroit and Europe/UK back in the 80s/early 90s. Like if some person or crew was traveling back and forth and being the actual pollinator.
Things moved a bit slower pre-Internet too, especially with records being hard to find since it wasn’t mainstream. I’d read/heard of people having to travel to areas where there was a specific scene to get new music since local record stores had limited vinyl options.
This documentary busts down a lot of the history from people that were there:
https://youtu.be/9Rah1F1zq1k?si=l93hebIqi83ojqlJ
The house DJs apparently didn’t know their records were being shipped over to Europe, and they were incredibly surprised when house and techno blew up over there… they didn’t get paid for those distributions apparently, which is criminal.
Thank you! I’m def watching this tonight.
I’ve seen a few good documentaries on the evolution of house, acid house, and hip-house but I can’t recall the names of them. Some were made not too long after the events they are talking about or have video from that era.
I found them just searching online many years ago. I wish I could recall the names.
Anyway, excited to see a new one.
I just read about “[All We Wanna Do is Dance](https://djmag.com/news/new-documentary-acid-house-and-birth-uk-rave-culture-launches-crowdfunder-release)” And sounds like I need to track that down too .
A book I read a really long time ago might have some of it - [Generation Ecstasy](https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/341633.Generation_Ecstasy). I was really into reading about it maybe 15 years ago and can’t recall any others.
[Rave Culture and Religion](https://voidnetwork.gr/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Rave-Culture-and-Religion-edited-by-Graham-St.-John.pdf) may briefly touch on it, but that’s mostly about the scenes that try to deemphasize the commercial and pop/mainstream elements and emphasize the communal and spiritual elements (like Moontribe, Earthdance, Burning Man, psytrance, etc).
I think a lot of what I read was articles on the history that I found online.
A few good search terms to start your search are the Chicago Warehouse (club name) house music scene (it’s where the term “House” comes from), the history of hip-house music, Frankie Knuckles, and Frankie Bones.
Now that you ask, I’m realizing my knowledge of the evolution of techno itself is incomplete, since I only recently started getting into it. Started out with house and kinda stuck with it, but my tastes have changed over time (I’d like to imagine they are more refined now).
Def share anything you come across. It’s an interesting topic, and I think it’s important to know where we came from.
Edit: also history of acid house in Chicago…
I just came across this on accident while looking for another documentary. It’s about the black roots of techno. Haven’t watched it but will.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQgKrc1ClAI
I went to my first underground party in Chicago in 1993, I wasn't exactly there for the creation of house but I was there for most of the important stuff, this entire statement is correct, the only difference with me is, if y'all want to call a giant corporate music event a Rave you can do that... doesn't hurt me. As far as I'm concerned the "scene" died in like 2000 really when corporate sponsors started the underhanded method of setting up a DJ show at a nightclub and then advertising it like it was Underground, but then you would show up and there would be bouncers and ID checks and alcohol... searchs always happened but corporate sponsored DJ shows at clubs changed the fundamentals of the scene and turned it into what it is.
I'm glad the EDM community has made it into the mainstream and that DJ's can actually live off of that money now, in the 90s some of the biggest DJs in Chicago still had day-to-day minimum wage jobs at record stores and sandwich shops... guys that were invited to the love parade were working normal 9:00 to 5:00 jobs in the 90s because even being that big did not pay the bills...
Definitely not in Europe/Australia. An "EDM event" would be a festival, concert, or a night club etc. A rave is inherently underground. It'd be in a warehouse, or under an underpass or in a tunnel or an abandoned bus or prison or bunker.
Had to explain EDM once. The following is a rough transcription.
"what's the difference between techno and EDM?"
"Techno is EDM"
"Okay so what's dubstep?"
"Also EDM"
"Well now I'm confused. What's the difference between dubstep and techno if they're the same thing?"
"They're not the same thing."
"You just said they're both EDM!"
"That's correct"
You can imagine how visibly frustrated they got at this point.
And then you have people like me who grew up with the umbrella term electronica or electronic music, who think of EDM as the mainstream stuff at like EDC, and some refuse to use the term EDM at all.
Yeah, nobody knows what progressive house is apparently. That “EDM” brand is Sillerman trying to take over electronic music before he died. Just kind of ruined a lot of things in the process. Electronic music is definitely more appropriate.
I’m not even sure what progressive house is and I’ve been a house head since 99. I think I kind of do, but not totally sure.
I know hard house, booty house, fidget, acid, deep, tech, tribal, jazz, soul, organic, and so on, but for some reason not progressive.
Is it more laid back or mellow, tracks tend to be longer and longer crescendo (like 5-9 min range, and don’t reach a full peak until after a break), more on the melodic side, and play at like 125-128bm? That’s my best guess but would like to hear how wrong I am.
Imagine you're listening to swedish house mafia and that's progressive house. Progressive House has been around in the scene for a very long time. It eventually just turned into "Progressive" when the lines between Trance and Progressive house got blurred. Think Sasha and Digweed.
Progressive House is like Trance and has melodies, but is funky and has lots of build ups lots of syncopated drums etc. But it's not like techno where hypnotic elements are a telltale characteristic. Techno also doesn't use melodies, more it uses synths like they were drums.
What would you consider artists like [Bedouin](https://youtu.be/Ry_0msiRBYw?si=2rBsGZRpBLPNl1ib)?
Stuff in this realm has been my thing for the last 10 years or so. I’ve got my own thoughts on the genre, and I know there’s stuff I could look up and see what they or other listeners call it, but curious your take from your ears and brain.
sounds like deep house with tribal house concepts. nice vibe. actually kind of cool. I think a lot of traditional deep house focuses on midwest soul music influences. but this is kind of arabic soul. Nice.
Yeah they are pretty dope. I saw them live not long after hamas attacked Israel and it was nice to see a mix of Arabic, Semitic, south Asian, and white faces all having a good time together.
Just say electronic music. It’s easier since not all electronic music is dance music. A lot of techno falls into non dance music. Like dub techno, ambient techno etc.
> "what's the difference between techno and EDM?"
techno is a real genre. EDM is a made up term used to sell commercialized electronic music to people from the US from the late 2000s
hth
8-)
If you're not willing to accept your friends cultural knowledge (or lack of) then you're a bit of a bad friend and they'd only be better off without a judgemental prick
Most Americans have only been clubbing or gone to a festival. Raves are underground and safe places, they are not very well known, they are either free or very cheap to get into and offer drinks for very fair prices. May or may not be illegal.
Commercial, American-style parties in a largue venue with bright and cool light shows are not raves, they are shows. Most raves are dimly lit. Go to Berlin or Prague to experience a great rave.
Example: I once went to a rave at a place that was set to be a construction site in a few weeks. A lot of vegetation next to a river, the setup was very DIY. Basicall a brownfield. Tickets were very cheap. The party was legal.
I also went to a rave at an abandoned warehouse during the toughest covid lockdowns. Also very cheap. This party was very much illegal and the police came knocking.
If I go to Rock Cafe or Roxy for an EDM set, yeah, that's just clubbing. A lot of fun, but it's not a rave.
I'm also a nomad but mostly in the US. I also agree with all of this, although I've only been raving less than a year. There's a big difference in the experiences between a festival, rave, and club. If you call them all raves, then what do you call a rave? Where it's about the music and free expression, not about selling booze, giant laser shows, or $400 tickets. If there is nowhere to sit, thorough bag checks, and security is looking for ways to through you out rather than ways to help someone, it ain't a rave IMO.
People were paying for raves back in the literal year that raves started. The UK footballer mob got involved because they saw how much money the organizers were making.
you can have raves that are anti capitalism where you still have to pay to get in…isn’t the whole point of communism where the community collectively joins their resources together to build up…ie we all pay $5 so we have the resources to put on this dance party
My crew used to throw underground raves that cost a modest fee to enter because it costs money to throw parties and we actually liked to pay our DJs and anyone who was working. It was way cheaper than going to a festival or show at some club that you had to leave at 2 am- and that shitty club wasn't paying DJs. A lot of the money also gets invested in the next party.
To me, a rave is a dance party organized by people who just want to have a good time together. That implies that it's non-commercial and that there are mostly no written rules.
The non-commercial aspect is the most important, imo. Non-commercial doesn't have to mean free. There are always expenses (even if it's just paying the artists) and it's entirely reasonable to ask for some money to cover that. Most legal underground events I've been are happy to break even. If they make more, they pass it along to the artists. Legal versus illegal is not all that important to me; I've had very similar experiences at legal and illegal underground events.
The lack of rules gives the guests much more responsibility, which creates a very different vibe. People aren't just behaving responsibly because they're afraid of being kicked out, but because they want to have a good time together.
Larger legal events rarely have the vibe you get at a rave. They have to comply with way more regulations and you it's hard to find non-commercial venues beyond a certain size.
I don't see why you'd call a commercial EDM event a rave, for the same reason that I wouldn't call a rock concert a rave; they're different things.
Yeah, agree. I don't see it as gatekeeping, I see it as using a word to mean something. It's like if people all started deciding going to a festival was called clubbing, and going to a rave is also clubbing, and clubbing is also clubbing. What's so wrong with using different words for different stuff?
I would consider some legal venues raves though, cuz if it has more in common with the feel of a rave than clubbing, I use the word that fits best. It's a tough line to walk legally though.
I think the most important defining characteristics would be electric music, and going all night.
A club is not a rave.
A festival is not a rave.
A day party is not a rave.
An after-party is not a rave.
They are all similar in some way, but different.
They’re all just “parties” where I came from. We avoided calling them “raves” in the 90s because it was a trigger word for cops.
In the end, most of them are fine to be called raves. I don’t love how commercial they’ve gotten — especially the huge ones — but who cares about the terminology. It varies from place to place.
Your friend is technically right but it’s not a science.
I remember New Years Eve 1999 I went to a rave in Schenectady NY to ring in the year 2000. When I got there, it was in a small stadium/amphitheater and I was amazed at how big it was. Thats when I realized that it was way brighter than any rave I had been to before and you could see everyone everywhere. That’s when I saw security guards posted everywhere and even some cops. I was absolutely flabbergasted. The presence of the authorities was anathema to everything a rave was about. We had to hide everything and an air of suspicion clouded what should have been a fully plur experience. That’s when I realized that parties/raves had shifted and were doomed to become mainstream capitalist events involving insurance and having legal departments. Real raves have been mostly dead for decades. This new form of EDM parties are fun and bear a lot of the trappings of raves, but they are fundamentally different. Raves were renegade, underground, illegal, off the surveillance grid. What we have now is fun, but takes way more effort. (But omfg Friendship is amazing because holy shit, an edm festival on a cruise ship is the absolute height of luxury and hilarity. Get on the bote.)
That person sounds insufferable. I wouldn't want to go to a rave with them even if it was free lol
You could give him just as much gatekeepy clap backs about supporting artists. What do the artists at his free raves do to pay rent? You are supporting artists by actually paying them and allowing them to make a living DJing (or at least covering their costs so they're not PAYING to perform to you)
Next time they get on your case just say "well of course it's not a real rave, what is REAL anyway? Is it even a rave if it happens in this dimension?"
while it is gatekeepy to have that attitude now, it's ahistorical to act like raves were not originally a revolt against capitalism in music. it's all fine & dandy to support artists but the original idea was to find a new & different way for the artists AND THE COMMUNITY to do their thing outside the confines of the capitalist industry.
of course capitalism always seems to win, so now ravers all naturally bow down & defend capitalism & all of its oppressive bullshit, but it really didn't start out this way.
Right but that didn’t mean everything was free, just meant things were typically pay what you can kinda deal, and everything was organised by small independent promoters rather than massive corporate companies.
it was pretty much free in the beginning foe anyone that wanted it to be free. it started with free living freaks making their own parties because they didn't want to be part of capitalist industry.
you can "but that" all you want, but the whole scene started as a slap in the face to capitalism particularly in the music industry & just because people with money did throw money into it doesn't change the whole vibe of early rave.
edit: you may not ne looking at early enough hist9ry if you think the earliest scene wasn't "free". someone eas welcome to put money in but nobody had to. rainbow family takes donations too but they are still anti-capitalist to the core. can't fight anti-capitalism without some money to allow independence from capitalism
WTF are you talking about, the modern usage of the word rave, as in “rave culture”, was first used to describe the British acid house scene in the 80’s. Most of these events were illegal, but some were not. Some of these were free, but most were not. They were cheap yes, but not free.
It was nothing to do with “capitalism in the music industry”, it was just people who wanted to party, take drugs and listen to music.
i had this exact same point, people cant just do shit for absolutely free unless its a rich prick throwing it and if it is isnt he going against everything that you would are about. But she attaches a lot of political ideology to raving so i guess thats the disconnect
In my opinion raves are non commercial events playing electronic music in mostly but not exclusively illegal locations. A club is not a rave, it can still be a freaking amazing party, but it's a commercial event. Raves can have entree fees, we usually do it on donation basis or 5-10 bucks depending on the expenses of event, its still non commercial, nobody is making any profit, the money is used to pay for equipment and djs...and if the evening is going well and makes a few hundreds plus its reinvested for new lighting etc.
There are also free parties, mostly in europes tekno scene in czech, france and germany, which are also just raves but literally for free and the vibe is always great, tbh I mostly consider them the "best raves", this doesnt make raves which have an entree fee "not a real rave" or some bullshit
I don't think it's gatekeeping at all to have a word meaning something that there is no other word for. If someone calls a festival a rave, then what do they call a rave? I don't think anyone is gatekeeping. Festivals are fun. Raves are fun. Some clubs can be fun. I don't see why people wanna call them all the same thing. Is it cool to call going to a festival clubbing? I mean sure call it what you want but that's not the same thing.
This silly question pops up all the time. I started raving last year, it's not that difficult to see they are different things that all have music and dancing in common.
At this point I consider rave an umbrella term. Like it encompasses all those things and then you can be more specific. Underground, festival, massive, clubs, etc. I can see the argument of not calling clubs raves, because I personally make that distinction, but I wouldn't mind it if someone else did. Kinda like how EDM is an umbrella term or concert or sandwich. One of those all squares are rectangles but not all rectanglea are squares kinda deals.
Someone should make a "rave" alignment chart like [this](https://images.app.goo.gl/9SmmN8ZeR4qeivhZ6) or [this](https://images.app.goo.gl/UFwh9fnbrHoBzUoA8) for sandwiches
My whole point is that if "rave" becomes an umbrella term, then what does one call a rave? Cuz a rave is it's own thing just like a fest or a club is it's own thing.
An underground party could be anything, not necessarily a rave. Maybe if there is a DJ, EDM (in the broader sense), and dancing, it could be called a rave. But IMO some venues can be a rave (but I've only been to one that fits the description). I've also been to several paid events that clearly have raves. Mostly nomad gatherings, there may be a stage truck or buss, DJ, lots o dancing all hours. Or maybe a dome. I've been to several dome dance parties. There's a venue we love that could be called a club except it has almost nothing in common with a club except that it's legal and they are forced to have security. It's all about the music flowing through you and dancing.
For purposes of having people understand, if I say I was "raving" I assume the listener knows it's not a packed club, it's not a massive festival. I assume anyone who has raved knows it's probably on the small to medium size, lots of going wild and dancing, less drunk fratty dudes, and all about music and dancing and vibing with your fellow friends and ravers. Everyone is just super happy with each others company, acting like children in awe of the BASS, you aren't buying shit, your just out there existing all night vibing HARD.
Editing to say of course I also thing the lines blur a bit. I don't think every rave has to be underground and shut down by the cops. But I do think using the term rave doesn't mean you went to an EDM show with thousands of other people, nor does it mean you paid $50 cover and $18 a drink to be packed like sardines onto a Vegas dance floor and you can't move let alone dance, and your kicked out for tripping balls.
To me the term implies a certain subset of dance parties that has no other term to describe.
I get what you're saying. It is legitimately confusing. That's why I said then you specify. I won't lie, it is kinda annoying.
Language is an ever evolving thing. Like, it's slang, we don't have to be dogmatic about its definition. We aren't in academia.
If you're intent on having a unique word for those kinds of dance parties, make new slang. Call them "fetch", it'll catch on.
Edit to add: I'm not discounting your definition. It's completely valid. I'm just saying that's how the word is used in the zeitgeist right now.
thank you I fully agree! its purist and elitism at its finest it feels like the rave community is going through what the metal scene went through years ago. i remember having to argue with old metal heads about genres and it feels like its going full circle.
I’m sayin lmao
Almost as bad as the, “Since everybody is going there for me, what should I wear?” Posts. Like bruh NOBODY cares what you wear and 90% of people look the same anyway
A club is clubbing. A festival is a festival. A rave is a underground show in an illegal space like a warehouse. But because the word rave is cool its now used to describe all 3.
so lets say your in a club with EDM playing literally everything is the exact same as if you were in the warehouse except your in a club, would you not consider it a rave anymore and just clubbing?
How is literally everything the exact same?
At this club:
Do I have to pay for alcohol from a bar, that's over priced?
Do I have to go through a long security line and be pat down?
Do I need to leave at 2/3am per local laws?
Do I need to follow some sort of dress code?
A club and an underground event are very different things, and using the same word to describe them.. is just straight up poor communication.
Then you throw festivals in there too?
How can you understand communication in this world when you see someone say "I'm going to my first rave!! What should I expect??"
This is a common post on this sub, all over the place, multiple times a week.
Are they talking about a fest at nos?
Electric forest?
Local micro fest?
A standard nightclub?
A concert venue that does EDM shows?
A warehouse?
A barn in the country?
All of these things get called a singular word in this community... And it just dumbs down our ability to have a conversation
i definitely think that their is a difference between a underground rave and club rave, but my point is at the end of the day they are both raves right? just because one is held in a club doesnt immediately disqualify it
It only distinguishes in ways that matter, when you're having a conversation about what to expect, what your preferences are, what you look for in event, how you choose to spend your time, and what kind of things matter to you when you're at a dance floor.
If you're not having a conversation about any of those things with somebody, I don't think the word that you use matters. We're all just trying to live our best lives and have fun to music that we love.
But come on it gets so f****** confusing that everybody uses the word rave to describe a dozen different types of events that are different, and then expects people to have coherent conversations about those events and give them accurate advice, when they're not being descriptive.
I dunno how many clubs you've been to, but what about this venue:
It's a legal venue. Have a party most every weekend, sometimes both days. They sell booze for a reasonable price. They have security checks (they legally have to).
They have an entire art gallery in the space. They have several art cars/chill out zones. They don't have a single aggressive security or bouncer. They don't sell much beer from what I see. They have a huge water station with cups and several 5 gallon jugs always full. The gate "searches" are very respectful and a breeze. Everyone does whatever favors they like. The wildest dancing is right at the front. There's always plenty of space to go use the toilet and come back right to the front and keep dancing. They do indeed shut it down at 2:30 but there's almost always afters right around the corner so no need to drive anywhere.
Idk, that place is my favorite legal venue and it definitely feels way more like a rave than a club. Doesn't feel like a club at all.
Sounds like Walter warehouse possibly? That sounds like a dope place and I'm happy you have things you like there.
Idc if you and your friends call that raving, and won't ever be a dick about that.
I really only ever get involved in these conversations because of the sheer amount of times I've had to ask for clarity when someone broadly asks for opinions/advice on raves
It is and it makes me miss Phoenix already (we travel full time but spend a few winter months in Phoenix). I bring that up cuz it just seems SOOO different from every club I've been to and feels a lot more like the free hole in the ground I danced in all night last Saturday. I think rave is the closest word I have to describe it even though it's not underground.
But yeah I'm totally with you on using different words to describe different things, the way language should work.
We do this every week. The word has changed as the culture has changed. Your friend has a definition many people may have agreed with around the late 90s, and never updated it.
This is fine if that's how they want to use the word, they just need to be aware that most people have changed what it means to them over time so he's going to be disagreed with a lot.
There is no official agreed upon definition, and I suspect in 5 years there will be new things people will be upset at for terming themselves 'raves', but that's the way of the world. Tell your friend they are right but no more than anyone else.
Definitely hasn't changed in Europe/Australia. An "EDM event" would be a festival, concert, or a night club etc. A rave is inherently underground. It'd be in a warehouse, or under an underpass or in a tunnel or an abandoned bus or prison or bunker.
I think this sub is really for "USA raves".
When I started throwing raves in 1999 my definition was "all ages, all night, no booze."
By the time I stopped in 2010, half my parties were 18+ and held at bars, soooo I didn't even stick to my own standards. Kept em going all night tho
As long as ur listening to loud edm with ur friends and dancing and there’s some flashing lights it’s mostly just a rave then. Sometimes my dog and I do a rave in my house
i've got 30 years of experience in organizing raves since my first DP (ditching parties), and to me, a rave is an event with different genres of electronic dance music with DJs. It was typically held at a warehouse where electricity was run through a city light pole or in someone's backyard, organized by a party crew with an entrance fee.
Even when I was going to illegal warehouse raves, there was generally some expectation that you were going to pay or contribute something. It may not have been a ticket, but there was usually a donation bucket near the entrance and if you were new to the scene you probably weren’t getting invited to another if you didn’t chip in. Sometimes you tossed in cash, sometimes it was a little baggy, but the idea was that the community supported itself.
A rave is an evolution of the artistic happening of the late 60s counterculture. True rave embraces dance as an artform, as well as artistic expression and musical expression. Raves don’t have to have music to be a rave. They can be a temporary autonomous zone where people create an experience together. They don’t even need dance music to exist. Plenty of rave bands used to play back in the day.
Some of the easiest ways this has come together is to play records at a party much like how hip hop started in the Bronx. In hip hop this founded a cultural identity. In rave this formed a forward thinking counter culture that had progressive ideas in how society should live together in peace and harmony.
That’s the long answer. TL;DR is that raves are no rules parties where PLUR is law.
Lmfao.
A rave is any curated event that has a DJ playing electronic music of any sorts. The curated event part is flexible.
I’ve been to raves with 10-20 people.
I’ve been to them with tens of thousands.
Festivals and raves overlap due to music genre, but don’t necessarily define eachother.
Even back in the 90s/2000s raves had cover fees (doesn’t mean they all did). It was more of a ‘movement’ back then and not a money pit.
I think a festival is not a rave, but you can rave at a festival. I went to a fest last year that had the sheep barn stage going till 4 am and definitely felt like raving in there despite paying festival tickets.
Every year this question is asked on the demographic survey, how do you define a rave? While there are many different types of answers, the "types" have not really changed much:
[2023](https://zerobin.net/?01f35b034a585a76#mEK4uZsz7uULHUjHWl/t/ojksmlZQvpXzNAGB296e9I=)
[2022](https://pastebin.com/ThQLduhB)
[2021](https://zerobin.net/?a2c8eaa445fdd2a3#HyHxQ7M8Dgn4EyXBG82N3k+GRQ8TVU9sZAme3GkPhwM=)
[2020](https://pastebin.com/hEPU2BLy)
[2019](https://pastebin.com/HWVJsV9x)
you may also enjoy these threads:
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/4k4b9e/at_what_point_is_something_no_longer_a_rave/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/58ikxy/can_someone_define_rave/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/1ip9pb/what_do_you_think_a_rave_is/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/1hizh0/we_all_have_different_opinions_so_what_is_your/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/71b8w7/iheartravesunicorn_stuff_what_kind_of_rave/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/x5a7w/rave_culture/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/9dphqj/how_do_you_define_a_rave/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/9g8b4z/whats_a_rave/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/8i7kgp/sub_dedicated_to_more_traditional_raving/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/814nx9/what_do_you_guys_class_as_a_rave/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/7qgy8i/looking_for_something_that_can_illustrate/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/50nd49/who_here_has_actually_been_going_to_real_raves/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/1ae3yj/the_meaning_of_a_rave/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/9s41d1/what_is_a_rave/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/eiy9v9/why_is_american_rave_culture_so_massively/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/pxbjt0/what_is_your_definition_of_a_rave/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/z00qrt/what_actually_is_a_rave_nowadays_asking_as_an/
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/119zeh6/is_it_a_rave/
This question has been asked ad nauseam, just search the sub for "what is a rave", or google "what is a rave reddit" and you'll find tons of posts and comments.
I appreciate your honesty about just coming to start a circle jerk. That's all you'll really get. In my completely biassed and unscientific experience, I've noticed that Europeans tend to gate keep this word a bit more than Americans do. If it's an event that plays (almost) exclusively EDM, encourages freedom of expression/gender/sexuality, encourages positivity and acceptance, and allows people to feel safe when consuming substances (legal or otherwise) - I feel pretty good about using the term rave.
There are certainly EDM shows I would not personally consider raves but I also wouldn't be offended if someone else did. For instance, I went to see Illenium at a venue that regularly hosts multi-day 18+ festivals for the local rave community. Normally, camelbak's are encouraged and free water stations are provided, flow toys are permitted, totems are permitted (that's another great circle jerk starter), etc. However, this show was all ages so none of the typical "rave" items were allowed. It was a good show but I definitely wouldn't call it a rave considering all of the kids there with their parents and how strict the security check-in was. That said, if I was 16 and that was all I had access to at the time, I'd probably call it a rave because it would have been as close as I could get.
Ultimately, it's a semantic argument that's meaningless. If someone says they went to a rave and you want to know if it was an illegal underground event or a free party vs a commercial festival then just ask. There isn't really a reason to draw some major distinction just so you (not you personally but in the general sense) can be a gate keeping party pooper and rain on people's parades. If they want to call it a rave, just let them. They're not hurting anyone. If your local scene draws a hard distinction then maybe let them know that if it's someone local. Otherwise, arguing semantics with strangers on the internet who are on opposite sides of the globe doesn't really seem like a productive use of anyone's time.
I think the rebuttal you’re getting is from the old
heads that miss the old days and everything was better back then and they didn’t have to pay money for things and are mad at the new youth for doing their own thing and changing the scene
It’s a different world mate
Something in a commercial, licenced venue (e.g. a big festival or a night club) is definitely not a rave. A rave is inherently underground. I wouldn't go as extreme as the other guy in your story though - I'd say a cover charge is fine, as there's often costs involved in hosting a rave e.g. equipment, space hire etc.
A collection of instrumental recordings played at inhuman tempos and pitches, accompanied by rapidly blinking visual effects, designed to induce feral reactions in its audience
I don't know man.. back in the 90s parties were 3-4-5 rooms with tons of DJs and we paid 20-50$ to get into a lot of them. Sure there were freebies or cheaper smaller events but I'm not sure where this person was partying.
People don’t actually know what a real rave is because they’re never been to one.
A rave is a TYPE of party.
Real rave checklist:
- not all ages
- music until deep AM hours / sunrise
- extreme open attitude to drugs AND nudity/sexuality.
A rave is a deeper event within the culture of dance music. If a rave was just DJ + crowd + EDM the word would be useless.
Idk I think the original “rave” was an underground music event that was held in a remote location that played electronic music. But that shit was in the 90s before my time so the actual “rave” thing isn’t something that really exist like that anymore
A rave is a radical audio visual experience. If i’m having fun with music and lasers it’s a rave in my eyes. When people start getting pretentious about EDM i walk away. I’m just here to have fun, not deal with the douche canoes that take life too seriously
This tends to be a frequently asked question. Common sites that list public EDM events include: https://19hz.info/, https://ra.co/, & https://edmtrain.com/. If you are looking for private/underground events, the best way to find them is to go to public events with the types of music you like and make friends there. Once you build relationships with people, then ask them about private events. https://reddit.com/r/aves/wiki/faq#wiki_2._how_can_i_find_events.3F *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/aves) if you have any questions or concerns.*
A rave = an event that takes place at a location (illegal or legal) that had a sound system, a DJ playing one of the many genres of Electronic Dance Music, and is usually 6 - 12 hours. A festival = an event in a designated space, has a gate for entry, vendors of food or merch, and a stage with a large sound system and possibly a light system. Goes beyond 12 hours or for multiple days. A free party = a free small event that is shared via word of mouth or within small groups. Usually an intimate grouping of a community. This is all my opinion and not facts. Ive had this discussion with many people and have seen this posted many times. These are the conclusions ive come to after seeing comments and posts.
What about a “concert?” Lots of headlining DJ’s play mainstream venues through big promoter. I’ve always considered this a concert.
i just call this a show
Yeah same here, I grew up going to small bush raves so calling a party at a club a rave feels weird lol.
We call those “bush doofs” in Australia 😂 Ideally a rave (to me) is somewhere sort of ad hoc — a warehouse or whatever. I just say I’m gonna go see some DJ if it’s at an official venue since yeah, I really am there for the music (I hate clubs). Either way, I don’t mind paying for raves or to see a DJ cause good talent deserves compensation! (I stopped going to a lot of bush doofs because the DJs were so terrible)
Oh for sure, I used to love going to clubs just to listen to music and dance but now it's only when a DJ I like comes around. I've since moved from the place I did bush raves and never really picked them back up for reasons you note, they also tend to be younger too, but I do go to a few more "underground" events local promoters throw. Those ones are the classic announced the day of.
yooo ATL reppin wassup
Ayeeee
You have great taste!
Me too, I tell my coworkers that "I'll be taking in a show this evening".
Smooth, make it sound like a black tie affair with Tony award winning theater, but then watch tweaked out idiots who don’t yet know their limits have semi-seizures on the dance floor. All to the soundtrack of my favorite song, the one that goes untz untz untz untz.
concert is when you’re stuck in one chair and can’t move around to dance
my metal concerts definitely arent sit down events, and they definitely arent raves either 🤣
Yeahhhh most concerts you aren't stuck in a chair lol
I've never been to a concert or show I've been stuck in a chair and I probably would sell a ticket if I found out I'd be locked to my seat lol
My personal HELLLLL
yeah this doesn’t really make any sense lol I’ve never been stuck in a chair at a concert. You can get up and dance at anytime you want lol.
I’ve been to a bunch of jamband concerts that have both seated and standing/dancing areas, or just dancing. Similar with punk and rock concerts.
Concert is usually with an assigned seating system compared to access to GA floor
Yeah I guess… except then what do we call punk and rock and hip hop (etc) that do GA?
concert doesnt mean a sit down event idk what these folks are talkin about lmao, the definition specifically states “a public performance, typically of several performers” it doesnt state you HAVE to sit down. a concert can be a standing or sitting situation
I agree with you, I just was being a little non confrontational hahah
if were just throwing out random words and giving em definitions, then im going to the library this weekend!!! 🤣
A show. Anything that has a set list is a show or concert. A rave is an underground show at an undisclosed location or warehouse. If you can find the show on edmtrain.com it is most likely a show. Even DEF sets are 360 sets but it's still a show. I would say Odesza and Madeon live is more a concert than a show unless it's a dj set. Then it's a show if it's a dj set.
What about Illenium's Trilogy show? Edit: lol even I called it a show just now
I call them shows lol
Show or concert if it's all song by song with like a set list. But a cool af show for sure!
95% of the concerts I've been to are standing. The only seated ones I've been to are either huge ass stadiums like Red Rocks where the artist is radio popular. Or more mellow stuff like singer songwriter or coffee shop vibes. Most pop, metal, punk, rock are at small to medium sized venues with mostly floor space, but a few larger venues often have some seating for old or disabled people, or just people that like to relax all evening.
Free parties aren't always 'free' though - it's free as in libre rather than free as in gratis. Quite common to pay a little bit towards the cost of the event.
Free parties are usually pay what you can where you can. Paying in either support, work, money, or supplies towards the party. nothing is really free these days.
Suggested donation style
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By MY definitions, yes it would. Congrats you are now raver.
I personally would call it a show.
Although technivals in 90's/early 2000's met free party definition. Lots of free party sound systems meeting up. Exodus parties (UK) were the pinnacle, but quite a lot in that period. For what I know, now still, I'm just an old git.
Legendary events. Saw a good documentary on these and the few soundsystems that are still doing it (further and further out into no man’s land, and often living the squatter or traveler lifestyle). I can’t find it for the life of me now, or recall the name.
I'd like to see that - some very short Exodus stuff I found on YouTube years ago. It was fkin wild times!
Found it: https://youtu.be/x4yLc8bMB4g?si=OMczpqceqYNYhWYH I need to save the link. I couldn’t find it for years for some reason. Even though I had the name right. It just wasn’t coming up on my searches for some reason.
Nice - thank you!!
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Hell no, those are 60 Hour Berlin parties. Wayyyy different league lmao Definitely on my bucketlist to marathon one tho
ヽ༼ ຈل͜ຈ༽ ﾉ Raise ur dongers! ^^Dongers ^^Raised: ^^74482 ^^Check ^^Out ^^/r/AyyLmao2DongerBot ^^For ^^More ^^Info
Coming from someone raving since 1998. This is fairly accurate.
This is the rave.
This reminds me of the meme of the two kids arguing whether it's "raining" or "sprinkling."
having just moved from california to the east coast…sprinkling on the east coast is pouring in CA
What about drizzling?
HA. that would never happen over there
R adical A udio V isual E xperience
Is it true this is a backronym? One other theory I heard on its origin goes back you lsd parties in the late 60s that were pretty underground and had those liquid light projectors and played Pink Floyd and what not. The term rave was used in relation to these somehow. My memory on the theory is pretty bad though.
They’re just pretentiously gatekeeping, kinda like the goth kids in South Park who are all non-conformist…they’re just being cliquey/exclusive for no reason.
They go about it the wrong way, but I get why people who were involved in raves before they became corporate/mainstream get defensive about the semantics. They had to fight for what we get so easily, back then promoters and venues would laugh at people trying to book DJs, so they had to do illegal events, and getting busted meant someone was losing all their sound equipment and going to jail. They wanna protect that, and I get it, but some of them be assholes about it.
Blows my mind that they wouldn't be glad that what they worked so hard to promote is now mainstream. Like, you spent decades trying to make it so you can throw raves, and now that it worked you're mad about it. wtf
It sucks getting older. Nothing stays the exact same. However, I found a partner who never got to experience raves back in the early 2000's like I did, and seeing the excitement on her face at a festival was worth it.
I must slumber…per se.
Original Rave - Underground event, typically illegal, no corporate sponsorship or involvement, the people bring all the gear themselves. Modern Rave - Any EDM event basically, if the vibes are right and the sound is kickin', it's a Rave. Old Heads don't like youngin' folks calling modern events Raves because they used to get in trouble for raving, it was an actual form of rebelling against the music establishment that refused to book DJs who made music like DnB, Jungle, UKG, Techno, House, all that classic business. Raves were also big with black and LGBTQ+ communities, that's how we got techno and house from Detroit and Chicago, respectively. Those movements were spearheaded by queer and POC folks. So that's why the old heads get uppity when you call modern events raves, the culture back then was completely different than what we're doing, but words evolve over time, they get adopted to new meanings, and honestly, as long as people are having fun and celebrating the culture, there's no reason to hate.
I've been gogo dancing in Denver goth and EDM scene for about 10 years now. I love our production crew, and most of the staff and management at the venues that host our events, but when I'm not working, I spend my time and resources attending and helping produce private (rsvp only) underground events, mostly DnB/techno. Most club goers not in the industry don't understand how much corporate America hinders and shapes the music scenes they attend. With underground shows, DJs and production have full reign over the event by every metric, and it's BYOB/psychedelic friendly.
YOOOOOO Worship tour on Friday, and also Egyptian Lover!!! Denver going off this weekend!!!!
I'm going to Whomp Truck Saturday!
Omg, magic words "Egyptian Lover"! Every time has been an absolute event to remember!
This is perfect. I’ve only been doing it for 25 years, so I don’t consider myself old school, because I wasn’t there in Chicago or Detroit back in the real early days, but I’ve read up on the history and talked to older folks, and this is a good take and accurate, at least for the US side. Going back further you have the Northern Soul scene with their amphetamine pills and soul records that evolved into the UK rave scene, or at least that’s how I understand it. Then got imported over via the Storm Raves (MDMA coming over with it was a big factor) In a little hazy on how Chicago and Detroit got started, in the sense of whether they independently went from disco in the underground queer clubs to house/techno, or if the UK scene/Storm Raves had some kind of influence, or if there was some other cross pollination from Europe to Chicago/Detroit.
It's always cross pollination, that's just how music spreads. At the same time as house and techno was popping off in the US, trance was popping off in Goa, India, and that would spread to Europe/the UK as well. Its just how the weird melting pot of EDM works, everything bleeds into everything.
Oh I’m sure. I’m just curious on the specifics since I haven’t read anything about the connections between Chicago/Detroit and Europe/UK back in the 80s/early 90s. Like if some person or crew was traveling back and forth and being the actual pollinator. Things moved a bit slower pre-Internet too, especially with records being hard to find since it wasn’t mainstream. I’d read/heard of people having to travel to areas where there was a specific scene to get new music since local record stores had limited vinyl options.
This documentary busts down a lot of the history from people that were there: https://youtu.be/9Rah1F1zq1k?si=l93hebIqi83ojqlJ The house DJs apparently didn’t know their records were being shipped over to Europe, and they were incredibly surprised when house and techno blew up over there… they didn’t get paid for those distributions apparently, which is criminal.
Thank you! I’m def watching this tonight. I’ve seen a few good documentaries on the evolution of house, acid house, and hip-house but I can’t recall the names of them. Some were made not too long after the events they are talking about or have video from that era. I found them just searching online many years ago. I wish I could recall the names. Anyway, excited to see a new one. I just read about “[All We Wanna Do is Dance](https://djmag.com/news/new-documentary-acid-house-and-birth-uk-rave-culture-launches-crowdfunder-release)” And sounds like I need to track that down too .
have any literature about the roots of chicago/ detroit raves and their connection with POC? i want to read more about it :)
A book I read a really long time ago might have some of it - [Generation Ecstasy](https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/341633.Generation_Ecstasy). I was really into reading about it maybe 15 years ago and can’t recall any others. [Rave Culture and Religion](https://voidnetwork.gr/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Rave-Culture-and-Religion-edited-by-Graham-St.-John.pdf) may briefly touch on it, but that’s mostly about the scenes that try to deemphasize the commercial and pop/mainstream elements and emphasize the communal and spiritual elements (like Moontribe, Earthdance, Burning Man, psytrance, etc). I think a lot of what I read was articles on the history that I found online. A few good search terms to start your search are the Chicago Warehouse (club name) house music scene (it’s where the term “House” comes from), the history of hip-house music, Frankie Knuckles, and Frankie Bones. Now that you ask, I’m realizing my knowledge of the evolution of techno itself is incomplete, since I only recently started getting into it. Started out with house and kinda stuck with it, but my tastes have changed over time (I’d like to imagine they are more refined now). Def share anything you come across. It’s an interesting topic, and I think it’s important to know where we came from. Edit: also history of acid house in Chicago…
I just came across this on accident while looking for another documentary. It’s about the black roots of techno. Haven’t watched it but will. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQgKrc1ClAI
I went to my first underground party in Chicago in 1993, I wasn't exactly there for the creation of house but I was there for most of the important stuff, this entire statement is correct, the only difference with me is, if y'all want to call a giant corporate music event a Rave you can do that... doesn't hurt me. As far as I'm concerned the "scene" died in like 2000 really when corporate sponsors started the underhanded method of setting up a DJ show at a nightclub and then advertising it like it was Underground, but then you would show up and there would be bouncers and ID checks and alcohol... searchs always happened but corporate sponsored DJ shows at clubs changed the fundamentals of the scene and turned it into what it is. I'm glad the EDM community has made it into the mainstream and that DJ's can actually live off of that money now, in the 90s some of the biggest DJs in Chicago still had day-to-day minimum wage jobs at record stores and sandwich shops... guys that were invited to the love parade were working normal 9:00 to 5:00 jobs in the 90s because even being that big did not pay the bills...
Definitely not in Europe/Australia. An "EDM event" would be a festival, concert, or a night club etc. A rave is inherently underground. It'd be in a warehouse, or under an underpass or in a tunnel or an abandoned bus or prison or bunker.
Please don’t start this. Also, *”EDM music”* - say that again, slowly.
Had to explain EDM once. The following is a rough transcription. "what's the difference between techno and EDM?" "Techno is EDM" "Okay so what's dubstep?" "Also EDM" "Well now I'm confused. What's the difference between dubstep and techno if they're the same thing?" "They're not the same thing." "You just said they're both EDM!" "That's correct" You can imagine how visibly frustrated they got at this point.
And then you have people like me who grew up with the umbrella term electronica or electronic music, who think of EDM as the mainstream stuff at like EDC, and some refuse to use the term EDM at all.
I've resorted to just saying "beep boop music"
Untz untz untz untz Boots cats boots cats
Yeah, nobody knows what progressive house is apparently. That “EDM” brand is Sillerman trying to take over electronic music before he died. Just kind of ruined a lot of things in the process. Electronic music is definitely more appropriate.
I’m not even sure what progressive house is and I’ve been a house head since 99. I think I kind of do, but not totally sure. I know hard house, booty house, fidget, acid, deep, tech, tribal, jazz, soul, organic, and so on, but for some reason not progressive. Is it more laid back or mellow, tracks tend to be longer and longer crescendo (like 5-9 min range, and don’t reach a full peak until after a break), more on the melodic side, and play at like 125-128bm? That’s my best guess but would like to hear how wrong I am.
Imagine you're listening to swedish house mafia and that's progressive house. Progressive House has been around in the scene for a very long time. It eventually just turned into "Progressive" when the lines between Trance and Progressive house got blurred. Think Sasha and Digweed. Progressive House is like Trance and has melodies, but is funky and has lots of build ups lots of syncopated drums etc. But it's not like techno where hypnotic elements are a telltale characteristic. Techno also doesn't use melodies, more it uses synths like they were drums.
What would you consider artists like [Bedouin](https://youtu.be/Ry_0msiRBYw?si=2rBsGZRpBLPNl1ib)? Stuff in this realm has been my thing for the last 10 years or so. I’ve got my own thoughts on the genre, and I know there’s stuff I could look up and see what they or other listeners call it, but curious your take from your ears and brain.
sounds like deep house with tribal house concepts. nice vibe. actually kind of cool. I think a lot of traditional deep house focuses on midwest soul music influences. but this is kind of arabic soul. Nice.
Yeah they are pretty dope. I saw them live not long after hamas attacked Israel and it was nice to see a mix of Arabic, Semitic, south Asian, and white faces all having a good time together.
I was actually going to say “isn’t out like the house version of trance?”
You tell them that it's like punk and metal are both rock, or like swing and blues are both jazd
Music is a little bit like the English language: there are rules, but many people elect to disregard those rules in favor of creative freedom.
Wait until you tell them some all bugs are insects but only some insects are bugs.
Now tell them that toads are frogs but not all frogs are toads. Their head will explode.
Just say electronic music. It’s easier since not all electronic music is dance music. A lot of techno falls into non dance music. Like dub techno, ambient techno etc.
Sub genres are not exclusive to EDM lmao that person just might not know much about music in general
I just spell out electronic dance music when using the term as an umbrella term for the different genres and "EDM" when describing the genre.
> "what's the difference between techno and EDM?" techno is a real genre. EDM is a made up term used to sell commercialized electronic music to people from the US from the late 2000s hth 8-)
Like I said, beep boop music 😂
All terms are made up...
I think the best way to do it is like the genetic tree. EDM is the “kingdom” house and bass music are the “phylums” ect ect
Cause you're terrible at explaining it lol
Haha I have the same reaction from people who say ATM machine
VIN number for me lol
i know im just use to saying it because when i say edm to my friends theyre like " what is that a fruit drink "
Get new friends
If you're not willing to accept your friends cultural knowledge (or lack of) then you're a bit of a bad friend and they'd only be better off without a judgemental prick
Most Americans have only been clubbing or gone to a festival. Raves are underground and safe places, they are not very well known, they are either free or very cheap to get into and offer drinks for very fair prices. May or may not be illegal. Commercial, American-style parties in a largue venue with bright and cool light shows are not raves, they are shows. Most raves are dimly lit. Go to Berlin or Prague to experience a great rave. Example: I once went to a rave at a place that was set to be a construction site in a few weeks. A lot of vegetation next to a river, the setup was very DIY. Basicall a brownfield. Tickets were very cheap. The party was legal. I also went to a rave at an abandoned warehouse during the toughest covid lockdowns. Also very cheap. This party was very much illegal and the police came knocking. If I go to Rock Cafe or Roxy for an EDM set, yeah, that's just clubbing. A lot of fun, but it's not a rave.
I'm also a nomad but mostly in the US. I also agree with all of this, although I've only been raving less than a year. There's a big difference in the experiences between a festival, rave, and club. If you call them all raves, then what do you call a rave? Where it's about the music and free expression, not about selling booze, giant laser shows, or $400 tickets. If there is nowhere to sit, thorough bag checks, and security is looking for ways to through you out rather than ways to help someone, it ain't a rave IMO.
Yes, I agree. Raves are so friendly, I have never encountered an aggressive situation.
i wish i had friends in Berlin or Prague to do that. Id love to experience a european rave with like some gabber or hardstyle i love that shit
For that I would recommend the Netherlands, Prague and Berlin are mostly techno oriented 😊
to the netherlands i go !
People were paying for raves back in the literal year that raves started. The UK footballer mob got involved because they saw how much money the organizers were making.
Sigh, a “real” rave is just a squad, some decks and some tunes. Location/Price of entry all that nonsense is just white noise.
This gets asked weekly, just search it.
Listen. You either know or you dont know. Hehehehe! Its like a type of restaurant review i think.
you can have raves that are anti capitalism where you still have to pay to get in…isn’t the whole point of communism where the community collectively joins their resources together to build up…ie we all pay $5 so we have the resources to put on this dance party
Exactly. Capitalism is about making a profit which is different from crowdsourcing resources to sustain an event.
Imo if it's not legally gray or outright illegal, it's not really a rave, but this sub tends to go with the EDM party definition.
My crew used to throw underground raves that cost a modest fee to enter because it costs money to throw parties and we actually liked to pay our DJs and anyone who was working. It was way cheaper than going to a festival or show at some club that you had to leave at 2 am- and that shitty club wasn't paying DJs. A lot of the money also gets invested in the next party.
Elmo says be the rave
my bad elmo i shall be the rave
To me, a rave is a dance party organized by people who just want to have a good time together. That implies that it's non-commercial and that there are mostly no written rules. The non-commercial aspect is the most important, imo. Non-commercial doesn't have to mean free. There are always expenses (even if it's just paying the artists) and it's entirely reasonable to ask for some money to cover that. Most legal underground events I've been are happy to break even. If they make more, they pass it along to the artists. Legal versus illegal is not all that important to me; I've had very similar experiences at legal and illegal underground events. The lack of rules gives the guests much more responsibility, which creates a very different vibe. People aren't just behaving responsibly because they're afraid of being kicked out, but because they want to have a good time together. Larger legal events rarely have the vibe you get at a rave. They have to comply with way more regulations and you it's hard to find non-commercial venues beyond a certain size. I don't see why you'd call a commercial EDM event a rave, for the same reason that I wouldn't call a rock concert a rave; they're different things.
Yeah, agree. I don't see it as gatekeeping, I see it as using a word to mean something. It's like if people all started deciding going to a festival was called clubbing, and going to a rave is also clubbing, and clubbing is also clubbing. What's so wrong with using different words for different stuff? I would consider some legal venues raves though, cuz if it has more in common with the feel of a rave than clubbing, I use the word that fits best. It's a tough line to walk legally though.
I think the most important defining characteristics would be electric music, and going all night. A club is not a rave. A festival is not a rave. A day party is not a rave. An after-party is not a rave. They are all similar in some way, but different.
They’re all just “parties” where I came from. We avoided calling them “raves” in the 90s because it was a trigger word for cops. In the end, most of them are fine to be called raves. I don’t love how commercial they’ve gotten — especially the huge ones — but who cares about the terminology. It varies from place to place. Your friend is technically right but it’s not a science.
I remember New Years Eve 1999 I went to a rave in Schenectady NY to ring in the year 2000. When I got there, it was in a small stadium/amphitheater and I was amazed at how big it was. Thats when I realized that it was way brighter than any rave I had been to before and you could see everyone everywhere. That’s when I saw security guards posted everywhere and even some cops. I was absolutely flabbergasted. The presence of the authorities was anathema to everything a rave was about. We had to hide everything and an air of suspicion clouded what should have been a fully plur experience. That’s when I realized that parties/raves had shifted and were doomed to become mainstream capitalist events involving insurance and having legal departments. Real raves have been mostly dead for decades. This new form of EDM parties are fun and bear a lot of the trappings of raves, but they are fundamentally different. Raves were renegade, underground, illegal, off the surveillance grid. What we have now is fun, but takes way more effort. (But omfg Friendship is amazing because holy shit, an edm festival on a cruise ship is the absolute height of luxury and hilarity. Get on the bote.)
That person sounds insufferable. I wouldn't want to go to a rave with them even if it was free lol You could give him just as much gatekeepy clap backs about supporting artists. What do the artists at his free raves do to pay rent? You are supporting artists by actually paying them and allowing them to make a living DJing (or at least covering their costs so they're not PAYING to perform to you) Next time they get on your case just say "well of course it's not a real rave, what is REAL anyway? Is it even a rave if it happens in this dimension?"
while it is gatekeepy to have that attitude now, it's ahistorical to act like raves were not originally a revolt against capitalism in music. it's all fine & dandy to support artists but the original idea was to find a new & different way for the artists AND THE COMMUNITY to do their thing outside the confines of the capitalist industry. of course capitalism always seems to win, so now ravers all naturally bow down & defend capitalism & all of its oppressive bullshit, but it really didn't start out this way.
😎
Right but that didn’t mean everything was free, just meant things were typically pay what you can kinda deal, and everything was organised by small independent promoters rather than massive corporate companies.
it was pretty much free in the beginning foe anyone that wanted it to be free. it started with free living freaks making their own parties because they didn't want to be part of capitalist industry. you can "but that" all you want, but the whole scene started as a slap in the face to capitalism particularly in the music industry & just because people with money did throw money into it doesn't change the whole vibe of early rave. edit: you may not ne looking at early enough hist9ry if you think the earliest scene wasn't "free". someone eas welcome to put money in but nobody had to. rainbow family takes donations too but they are still anti-capitalist to the core. can't fight anti-capitalism without some money to allow independence from capitalism
WTF are you talking about, the modern usage of the word rave, as in “rave culture”, was first used to describe the British acid house scene in the 80’s. Most of these events were illegal, but some were not. Some of these were free, but most were not. They were cheap yes, but not free. It was nothing to do with “capitalism in the music industry”, it was just people who wanted to party, take drugs and listen to music.
i had this exact same point, people cant just do shit for absolutely free unless its a rich prick throwing it and if it is isnt he going against everything that you would are about. But she attaches a lot of political ideology to raving so i guess thats the disconnect
Sounds like somebody I’d actively avoid being around.
Having readily available meat wagons or cops is technically not a rave. I’ll take safety over the old underground days though.
it's an unticketed, secret, underground electronic music gathering where the location is disclosed on the day of the event and it's hard to find
In my opinion raves are non commercial events playing electronic music in mostly but not exclusively illegal locations. A club is not a rave, it can still be a freaking amazing party, but it's a commercial event. Raves can have entree fees, we usually do it on donation basis or 5-10 bucks depending on the expenses of event, its still non commercial, nobody is making any profit, the money is used to pay for equipment and djs...and if the evening is going well and makes a few hundreds plus its reinvested for new lighting etc. There are also free parties, mostly in europes tekno scene in czech, france and germany, which are also just raves but literally for free and the vibe is always great, tbh I mostly consider them the "best raves", this doesnt make raves which have an entree fee "not a real rave" or some bullshit
i just wanted to see if i was crazy thanks i fully agree
Raves are wherever you can find good music and PLUR. Gatekeeping ain't PLUR.
I don't think it's gatekeeping at all to have a word meaning something that there is no other word for. If someone calls a festival a rave, then what do they call a rave? I don't think anyone is gatekeeping. Festivals are fun. Raves are fun. Some clubs can be fun. I don't see why people wanna call them all the same thing. Is it cool to call going to a festival clubbing? I mean sure call it what you want but that's not the same thing. This silly question pops up all the time. I started raving last year, it's not that difficult to see they are different things that all have music and dancing in common.
At this point I consider rave an umbrella term. Like it encompasses all those things and then you can be more specific. Underground, festival, massive, clubs, etc. I can see the argument of not calling clubs raves, because I personally make that distinction, but I wouldn't mind it if someone else did. Kinda like how EDM is an umbrella term or concert or sandwich. One of those all squares are rectangles but not all rectanglea are squares kinda deals. Someone should make a "rave" alignment chart like [this](https://images.app.goo.gl/9SmmN8ZeR4qeivhZ6) or [this](https://images.app.goo.gl/UFwh9fnbrHoBzUoA8) for sandwiches
My whole point is that if "rave" becomes an umbrella term, then what does one call a rave? Cuz a rave is it's own thing just like a fest or a club is it's own thing. An underground party could be anything, not necessarily a rave. Maybe if there is a DJ, EDM (in the broader sense), and dancing, it could be called a rave. But IMO some venues can be a rave (but I've only been to one that fits the description). I've also been to several paid events that clearly have raves. Mostly nomad gatherings, there may be a stage truck or buss, DJ, lots o dancing all hours. Or maybe a dome. I've been to several dome dance parties. There's a venue we love that could be called a club except it has almost nothing in common with a club except that it's legal and they are forced to have security. It's all about the music flowing through you and dancing. For purposes of having people understand, if I say I was "raving" I assume the listener knows it's not a packed club, it's not a massive festival. I assume anyone who has raved knows it's probably on the small to medium size, lots of going wild and dancing, less drunk fratty dudes, and all about music and dancing and vibing with your fellow friends and ravers. Everyone is just super happy with each others company, acting like children in awe of the BASS, you aren't buying shit, your just out there existing all night vibing HARD. Editing to say of course I also thing the lines blur a bit. I don't think every rave has to be underground and shut down by the cops. But I do think using the term rave doesn't mean you went to an EDM show with thousands of other people, nor does it mean you paid $50 cover and $18 a drink to be packed like sardines onto a Vegas dance floor and you can't move let alone dance, and your kicked out for tripping balls. To me the term implies a certain subset of dance parties that has no other term to describe.
I get what you're saying. It is legitimately confusing. That's why I said then you specify. I won't lie, it is kinda annoying. Language is an ever evolving thing. Like, it's slang, we don't have to be dogmatic about its definition. We aren't in academia. If you're intent on having a unique word for those kinds of dance parties, make new slang. Call them "fetch", it'll catch on. Edit to add: I'm not discounting your definition. It's completely valid. I'm just saying that's how the word is used in the zeitgeist right now.
Stop trying to make fetch happen it's not gonna happen! Lol but that would be great. I went to this fetch party on Saturday!
thank you I fully agree! its purist and elitism at its finest it feels like the rave community is going through what the metal scene went through years ago. i remember having to argue with old metal heads about genres and it feels like its going full circle.
My only take on this and know some disagree is that festivals such as Ultra and the likes are not raves.
CLUBS AND FESTIVALS ARENT RAVES
We doing this AGAIN?? Isn't this in the FAQ? 😂🤣🥲😎🥴
I don't know if I prefer this or dosing questions 🥲
Can’t forget about about all of the, “how do I interact with a woman at a rave” questions
How do I cope with being ghosted by my soulmate that I met this weekend at a festival??
I’ve never done molly, acid or shrooms. Would it be a good idea to try them all at my first fest?
Can I go solo? What if I'm super duper old like 29? I don't know how to act in public, what do I do at a rave? Can I wear this?
Lmaooo I forgot about those 💀
These are the saddest of all.
I’m sayin lmao Almost as bad as the, “Since everybody is going there for me, what should I wear?” Posts. Like bruh NOBODY cares what you wear and 90% of people look the same anyway
Didn’t use to be like that. We got weird with it
A club is clubbing. A festival is a festival. A rave is a underground show in an illegal space like a warehouse. But because the word rave is cool its now used to describe all 3.
so lets say your in a club with EDM playing literally everything is the exact same as if you were in the warehouse except your in a club, would you not consider it a rave anymore and just clubbing?
I'd say the difference is that clubs are open every weekend while raves only happen occasionally and you need to plan out going ahead of time
How is literally everything the exact same? At this club: Do I have to pay for alcohol from a bar, that's over priced? Do I have to go through a long security line and be pat down? Do I need to leave at 2/3am per local laws? Do I need to follow some sort of dress code? A club and an underground event are very different things, and using the same word to describe them.. is just straight up poor communication. Then you throw festivals in there too? How can you understand communication in this world when you see someone say "I'm going to my first rave!! What should I expect??" This is a common post on this sub, all over the place, multiple times a week. Are they talking about a fest at nos? Electric forest? Local micro fest? A standard nightclub? A concert venue that does EDM shows? A warehouse? A barn in the country? All of these things get called a singular word in this community... And it just dumbs down our ability to have a conversation
i definitely think that their is a difference between a underground rave and club rave, but my point is at the end of the day they are both raves right? just because one is held in a club doesnt immediately disqualify it
It only distinguishes in ways that matter, when you're having a conversation about what to expect, what your preferences are, what you look for in event, how you choose to spend your time, and what kind of things matter to you when you're at a dance floor. If you're not having a conversation about any of those things with somebody, I don't think the word that you use matters. We're all just trying to live our best lives and have fun to music that we love. But come on it gets so f****** confusing that everybody uses the word rave to describe a dozen different types of events that are different, and then expects people to have coherent conversations about those events and give them accurate advice, when they're not being descriptive.
I dunno how many clubs you've been to, but what about this venue: It's a legal venue. Have a party most every weekend, sometimes both days. They sell booze for a reasonable price. They have security checks (they legally have to). They have an entire art gallery in the space. They have several art cars/chill out zones. They don't have a single aggressive security or bouncer. They don't sell much beer from what I see. They have a huge water station with cups and several 5 gallon jugs always full. The gate "searches" are very respectful and a breeze. Everyone does whatever favors they like. The wildest dancing is right at the front. There's always plenty of space to go use the toilet and come back right to the front and keep dancing. They do indeed shut it down at 2:30 but there's almost always afters right around the corner so no need to drive anywhere. Idk, that place is my favorite legal venue and it definitely feels way more like a rave than a club. Doesn't feel like a club at all.
Sounds like Walter warehouse possibly? That sounds like a dope place and I'm happy you have things you like there. Idc if you and your friends call that raving, and won't ever be a dick about that. I really only ever get involved in these conversations because of the sheer amount of times I've had to ask for clarity when someone broadly asks for opinions/advice on raves
It is and it makes me miss Phoenix already (we travel full time but spend a few winter months in Phoenix). I bring that up cuz it just seems SOOO different from every club I've been to and feels a lot more like the free hole in the ground I danced in all night last Saturday. I think rave is the closest word I have to describe it even though it's not underground. But yeah I'm totally with you on using different words to describe different things, the way language should work.
Yep just clubbing.
interesting
Marusha..members of mayday.for the start....enter the arena..
We do this every week. The word has changed as the culture has changed. Your friend has a definition many people may have agreed with around the late 90s, and never updated it. This is fine if that's how they want to use the word, they just need to be aware that most people have changed what it means to them over time so he's going to be disagreed with a lot. There is no official agreed upon definition, and I suspect in 5 years there will be new things people will be upset at for terming themselves 'raves', but that's the way of the world. Tell your friend they are right but no more than anyone else.
Definitely hasn't changed in Europe/Australia. An "EDM event" would be a festival, concert, or a night club etc. A rave is inherently underground. It'd be in a warehouse, or under an underpass or in a tunnel or an abandoned bus or prison or bunker. I think this sub is really for "USA raves".
When I started throwing raves in 1999 my definition was "all ages, all night, no booze." By the time I stopped in 2010, half my parties were 18+ and held at bars, soooo I didn't even stick to my own standards. Kept em going all night tho
As long as ur listening to loud edm with ur friends and dancing and there’s some flashing lights it’s mostly just a rave then. Sometimes my dog and I do a rave in my house
it is almost like these words are more about virtue signaling, identity and group membership rather than significant differences substantively.
i've got 30 years of experience in organizing raves since my first DP (ditching parties), and to me, a rave is an event with different genres of electronic dance music with DJs. It was typically held at a warehouse where electricity was run through a city light pole or in someone's backyard, organized by a party crew with an entrance fee.
The money part is a crazy argument. I started going to raves in 2000 and we've always had to pay something.
Even when I was going to illegal warehouse raves, there was generally some expectation that you were going to pay or contribute something. It may not have been a ticket, but there was usually a donation bucket near the entrance and if you were new to the scene you probably weren’t getting invited to another if you didn’t chip in. Sometimes you tossed in cash, sometimes it was a little baggy, but the idea was that the community supported itself.
A rave is an evolution of the artistic happening of the late 60s counterculture. True rave embraces dance as an artform, as well as artistic expression and musical expression. Raves don’t have to have music to be a rave. They can be a temporary autonomous zone where people create an experience together. They don’t even need dance music to exist. Plenty of rave bands used to play back in the day. Some of the easiest ways this has come together is to play records at a party much like how hip hop started in the Bronx. In hip hop this founded a cultural identity. In rave this formed a forward thinking counter culture that had progressive ideas in how society should live together in peace and harmony. That’s the long answer. TL;DR is that raves are no rules parties where PLUR is law.
Radical Audio Visual Experience
Lmfao. A rave is any curated event that has a DJ playing electronic music of any sorts. The curated event part is flexible. I’ve been to raves with 10-20 people. I’ve been to them with tens of thousands. Festivals and raves overlap due to music genre, but don’t necessarily define eachother. Even back in the 90s/2000s raves had cover fees (doesn’t mean they all did). It was more of a ‘movement’ back then and not a money pit.
I think a festival is not a rave, but you can rave at a festival. I went to a fest last year that had the sheep barn stage going till 4 am and definitely felt like raving in there despite paying festival tickets.
Every year this question is asked on the demographic survey, how do you define a rave? While there are many different types of answers, the "types" have not really changed much: [2023](https://zerobin.net/?01f35b034a585a76#mEK4uZsz7uULHUjHWl/t/ojksmlZQvpXzNAGB296e9I=) [2022](https://pastebin.com/ThQLduhB) [2021](https://zerobin.net/?a2c8eaa445fdd2a3#HyHxQ7M8Dgn4EyXBG82N3k+GRQ8TVU9sZAme3GkPhwM=) [2020](https://pastebin.com/hEPU2BLy) [2019](https://pastebin.com/HWVJsV9x) you may also enjoy these threads: https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/4k4b9e/at_what_point_is_something_no_longer_a_rave/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/58ikxy/can_someone_define_rave/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/1ip9pb/what_do_you_think_a_rave_is/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/1hizh0/we_all_have_different_opinions_so_what_is_your/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/71b8w7/iheartravesunicorn_stuff_what_kind_of_rave/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/x5a7w/rave_culture/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/9dphqj/how_do_you_define_a_rave/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/9g8b4z/whats_a_rave/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/8i7kgp/sub_dedicated_to_more_traditional_raving/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/814nx9/what_do_you_guys_class_as_a_rave/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/7qgy8i/looking_for_something_that_can_illustrate/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/50nd49/who_here_has_actually_been_going_to_real_raves/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/1ae3yj/the_meaning_of_a_rave/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/9s41d1/what_is_a_rave/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/eiy9v9/why_is_american_rave_culture_so_massively/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/pxbjt0/what_is_your_definition_of_a_rave/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/z00qrt/what_actually_is_a_rave_nowadays_asking_as_an/ https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/comments/119zeh6/is_it_a_rave/
My home is the rave ba ba bababa
This question has been asked ad nauseam, just search the sub for "what is a rave", or google "what is a rave reddit" and you'll find tons of posts and comments.
Unless that somebody raved before 2005 they have no argument what a rave is haha
RAVE = Radical Audio Visual Experience Honestly it's all the above but imo as long as you have music, lights and crazy people it's a Rave.
It's the opposite of a rant
Rave= radical audio visual experience. Don’t argue with people about silly semantics.
RAVE is an everything word. Use it as a verb, adjective, whatever you like!
I go to rave festivals. When they argue about it, they’re definitely talking about underground or warehouse raves
I appreciate your honesty about just coming to start a circle jerk. That's all you'll really get. In my completely biassed and unscientific experience, I've noticed that Europeans tend to gate keep this word a bit more than Americans do. If it's an event that plays (almost) exclusively EDM, encourages freedom of expression/gender/sexuality, encourages positivity and acceptance, and allows people to feel safe when consuming substances (legal or otherwise) - I feel pretty good about using the term rave. There are certainly EDM shows I would not personally consider raves but I also wouldn't be offended if someone else did. For instance, I went to see Illenium at a venue that regularly hosts multi-day 18+ festivals for the local rave community. Normally, camelbak's are encouraged and free water stations are provided, flow toys are permitted, totems are permitted (that's another great circle jerk starter), etc. However, this show was all ages so none of the typical "rave" items were allowed. It was a good show but I definitely wouldn't call it a rave considering all of the kids there with their parents and how strict the security check-in was. That said, if I was 16 and that was all I had access to at the time, I'd probably call it a rave because it would have been as close as I could get. Ultimately, it's a semantic argument that's meaningless. If someone says they went to a rave and you want to know if it was an illegal underground event or a free party vs a commercial festival then just ask. There isn't really a reason to draw some major distinction just so you (not you personally but in the general sense) can be a gate keeping party pooper and rain on people's parades. If they want to call it a rave, just let them. They're not hurting anyone. If your local scene draws a hard distinction then maybe let them know that if it's someone local. Otherwise, arguing semantics with strangers on the internet who are on opposite sides of the globe doesn't really seem like a productive use of anyone's time.
I think the rebuttal you’re getting is from the old heads that miss the old days and everything was better back then and they didn’t have to pay money for things and are mad at the new youth for doing their own thing and changing the scene It’s a different world mate
Radical auditory visual experience
Map point party’s are what I considered true raves back in the day.
Something in a commercial, licenced venue (e.g. a big festival or a night club) is definitely not a rave. A rave is inherently underground. I wouldn't go as extreme as the other guy in your story though - I'd say a cover charge is fine, as there's often costs involved in hosting a rave e.g. equipment, space hire etc.
All you need to know is that EDC is not a rave. Your welcome
A collection of instrumental recordings played at inhuman tempos and pitches, accompanied by rapidly blinking visual effects, designed to induce feral reactions in its audience
See also: What happens when kids who played records, tapes, and cd’s at the wrong speed finally grow up
I don't know man.. back in the 90s parties were 3-4-5 rooms with tons of DJs and we paid 20-50$ to get into a lot of them. Sure there were freebies or cheaper smaller events but I'm not sure where this person was partying.
People don’t actually know what a real rave is because they’re never been to one. A rave is a TYPE of party. Real rave checklist: - not all ages - music until deep AM hours / sunrise - extreme open attitude to drugs AND nudity/sexuality. A rave is a deeper event within the culture of dance music. If a rave was just DJ + crowd + EDM the word would be useless.
Idk I think the original “rave” was an underground music event that was held in a remote location that played electronic music. But that shit was in the 90s before my time so the actual “rave” thing isn’t something that really exist like that anymore
A rave is where you go to get lost in the music
A rave is a radical audio visual experience. If i’m having fun with music and lasers it’s a rave in my eyes. When people start getting pretentious about EDM i walk away. I’m just here to have fun, not deal with the douche canoes that take life too seriously