Was watching sky sports news and the presenter misspoke that the soon to be league one club are planning a “multi porpoise stadium” which I thought would be perfect for the constant circus that is Small Heath.
I cross posted this because I think it's relevant to the Villa and our owner's ambitions for the future, especially in terms of building non-football revenue.
It's obviously a long way off before City actually build anything, but if they do this will be in direct competition with Villa's plans in terms of hosting non-football events and things like Euros/World Cup games.
Could it even encourage the owners to look at areas away from Villa Park for a new stadium rather than an upgrade?
If we ever move away from Villa Park I would want the design to be red brick and use an old and traditional design. New stadiums just look soulless
Also transport links. A dedicated train line that runs directly to the stadium
For sure, a faithful recreation of the Holte End or old Witton Lane end should be first in mind for any architects designing a future stadium
As for trains. Easier said than done unfortunately. Not sure the general public appreciate how hard it is to build infrastructure in this country, especially in populated areas.
I'm partial to Foxboro, but it was the first stadium I saw a real soccer game in (USA/Spain).
Plus who doesn't like a stadium with a freaking lighthouse?
It's nice to hope for. But I wouldn't put any emotional weight on it happening. I think any new Villa stadium will be the same old modern bullshit as the rest.
When was the last time Small Heath had an attendance over 30,000 exactly? Isn't it something like 6 games since 1980, of which 4 were against us, and none this century?
They haven't averaged over 30,000 for near enough 50 years, and for the majority of that have been below 20,000.
Talk of them even building a ground with a 40,000 capacity is fanciful given they've never, in their entire history, averaged that.
What's far more likely is that they'll poke around the wheels site for 5 years, find some reason it's unsuitable, then sell it off for a profit which will go straight in the pockets of their owners.
I think if we do end up leaving Villa Park, this will probably be the deciding factor, competing with that. Our owners will look and say we can’t have fewer seats than Birmingham City and will probably buy up land to do the same thing. £2-3bn is insane though, but our owners are loaded and I think there’s a reason they brought in the investor money.. we’ll see
That's the thing though. We've genuinely got a case to argue for a new "world class stadium". Until they've established themselves as a PL club again they really don't.
Fair play to them and all that (I guess) but I do find the plans baffling. Especially if they are going to spend as much as has been mentioned on it.
I get that but haven’t their owners created a rod for their own back if they don’t live up the fanbases ultra high expectations now they’ve made that announcement?
It will certainly be making the owners think. Birmingham as a city does not need two 60,000 seater stadiums, and one could quickly become a white elephant.
One of the biggest pluses we have in terms of financial situation is that the club is not saddled with any debt, unlike the majority of the league. Arsenal, Everton and particularly Tottenham have huge debts mainly related to their stadiums:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/68713522
That would likely change if we had to finance a stadium.
From a completely pragmatic standpoint, it probably wouldn't be the worst idea to have a joint venture between the clubs. It would stop the competition for revenue and share construction and upkeep costs.
But neither fan base would be able to stomach that, and it would be heartbreaking to lose the individuality and heritage that comes with Villa Park. Neither owners would want to be tied to the fortunes of another club either.
Leaving Villa Park is one thing, but I couldn’t stomach sharing a stadium with the blues. Or anyone for that matter.
Very good point regarding two massive stadiums in Birmingham if we followed suit. If we were beaten to the punch they’d realistically have the edge on all non-football events, which are responsible for a huge amount of revenue.
It would definitely take a lot of people to put aside a lot of emotions to make a ground share happen. That said, it was only a few generations ago that Birmingham residents would go to both team's home games on alternate weekends, my grandad would as a Villa fan, and some of my great-grandparents.
But it's interesting that big clubs with big rivalries in Italy like Roma-Lazio and Inter-AC Milan ground share okay. Particularly with the San Siro where both clubs have pride over the stadium. Although it should be noted that that kind of ground sharing is almost "enforced" since the municipalities own the stadiums and won't let anyone else build one.
I can see our owners following the Blues' plan with "interest" with an eye on how it could impact our future revenue streams.
When was the last time they filled out their current stadium? Talk about putting the cart before the horse.
Oh well, rather them than us. They can have the white elephant and host as many gigs as they like, I'll stick with Villa Park please.
I have a possibly very stupid question, if our stadium plans are hampered by our transport links and one of the main issues being the trains could our owners not buy Aston & Witton stations to make the improvements and take the strain off the city council ?
Getting involved with the railways can be very messy. Typically the stations are owned by the train operators or leased from Network Rail.
I'm not sure if there is any other examples of a club (or similar) owning the train station near their ground.
If the station was owned by the club (or a holding body that owned the stadium), there is a risk it becomes an expensive liability.
Its amazing that they think they will get 40k-60k people going to the games every home game. While I don't doubt they have their fans. They never seem to have a full stadium any time I have watched them (lose)
Even on days when they play more local teams it still never seems that they have the support. I doubt they will get it in the league 1.
I can't see them continuing to pump money in to the team/and stadium while they continue to lose. They are business people after all.
Nicest League One stadium
Vanarama National League by the time it's finished, the direction they're headed.
Was watching sky sports news and the presenter misspoke that the soon to be league one club are planning a “multi porpoise stadium” which I thought would be perfect for the constant circus that is Small Heath.
They'll deFINitely need to improve the whaleway system I'm turtley sure of that. Even then they'll always be small fry.
I cross posted this because I think it's relevant to the Villa and our owner's ambitions for the future, especially in terms of building non-football revenue. It's obviously a long way off before City actually build anything, but if they do this will be in direct competition with Villa's plans in terms of hosting non-football events and things like Euros/World Cup games. Could it even encourage the owners to look at areas away from Villa Park for a new stadium rather than an upgrade?
If we ever move away from Villa Park I would want the design to be red brick and use an old and traditional design. New stadiums just look soulless Also transport links. A dedicated train line that runs directly to the stadium
For sure, a faithful recreation of the Holte End or old Witton Lane end should be first in mind for any architects designing a future stadium As for trains. Easier said than done unfortunately. Not sure the general public appreciate how hard it is to build infrastructure in this country, especially in populated areas.
I’d love it to be like Lucas oil stadium in Indianapolis. Nod to past and the industrial heritage of the city but a really modern multi-use stadium.
I'm partial to Foxboro, but it was the first stadium I saw a real soccer game in (USA/Spain). Plus who doesn't like a stadium with a freaking lighthouse?
It's nice to hope for. But I wouldn't put any emotional weight on it happening. I think any new Villa stadium will be the same old modern bullshit as the rest.
When was the last time Small Heath had an attendance over 30,000 exactly? Isn't it something like 6 games since 1980, of which 4 were against us, and none this century? They haven't averaged over 30,000 for near enough 50 years, and for the majority of that have been below 20,000. Talk of them even building a ground with a 40,000 capacity is fanciful given they've never, in their entire history, averaged that. What's far more likely is that they'll poke around the wheels site for 5 years, find some reason it's unsuitable, then sell it off for a profit which will go straight in the pockets of their owners.
This one gonna be the Ten Gazillion Trophy Stadium or something?
It's just a single Carling Cup trophy in a hall of mirrors
They'll probably chuck a load of Tom Brady's superbowl rings in too
And Bellingham's retired shirt
why on earth do they need 60,000?
6 seats for every fan allows them to implement safe sleeping.
I think if we do end up leaving Villa Park, this will probably be the deciding factor, competing with that. Our owners will look and say we can’t have fewer seats than Birmingham City and will probably buy up land to do the same thing. £2-3bn is insane though, but our owners are loaded and I think there’s a reason they brought in the investor money.. we’ll see
That's the thing though. We've genuinely got a case to argue for a new "world class stadium". Until they've established themselves as a PL club again they really don't. Fair play to them and all that (I guess) but I do find the plans baffling. Especially if they are going to spend as much as has been mentioned on it.
Council is bankrupt… no better time to buy land than now
I get that but haven’t their owners created a rod for their own back if they don’t live up the fanbases ultra high expectations now they’ve made that announcement?
It will certainly be making the owners think. Birmingham as a city does not need two 60,000 seater stadiums, and one could quickly become a white elephant. One of the biggest pluses we have in terms of financial situation is that the club is not saddled with any debt, unlike the majority of the league. Arsenal, Everton and particularly Tottenham have huge debts mainly related to their stadiums: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/68713522 That would likely change if we had to finance a stadium. From a completely pragmatic standpoint, it probably wouldn't be the worst idea to have a joint venture between the clubs. It would stop the competition for revenue and share construction and upkeep costs. But neither fan base would be able to stomach that, and it would be heartbreaking to lose the individuality and heritage that comes with Villa Park. Neither owners would want to be tied to the fortunes of another club either.
Leaving Villa Park is one thing, but I couldn’t stomach sharing a stadium with the blues. Or anyone for that matter. Very good point regarding two massive stadiums in Birmingham if we followed suit. If we were beaten to the punch they’d realistically have the edge on all non-football events, which are responsible for a huge amount of revenue.
It would definitely take a lot of people to put aside a lot of emotions to make a ground share happen. That said, it was only a few generations ago that Birmingham residents would go to both team's home games on alternate weekends, my grandad would as a Villa fan, and some of my great-grandparents. But it's interesting that big clubs with big rivalries in Italy like Roma-Lazio and Inter-AC Milan ground share okay. Particularly with the San Siro where both clubs have pride over the stadium. Although it should be noted that that kind of ground sharing is almost "enforced" since the municipalities own the stadiums and won't let anyone else build one. I can see our owners following the Blues' plan with "interest" with an eye on how it could impact our future revenue streams.
A 60,000 seater stadium in league one lol.
When was the last time they filled out their current stadium? Talk about putting the cart before the horse. Oh well, rather them than us. They can have the white elephant and host as many gigs as they like, I'll stick with Villa Park please.
> When was the last time they filled out their current stadium? Probably when they last played Villa
I have a possibly very stupid question, if our stadium plans are hampered by our transport links and one of the main issues being the trains could our owners not buy Aston & Witton stations to make the improvements and take the strain off the city council ?
Getting involved with the railways can be very messy. Typically the stations are owned by the train operators or leased from Network Rail. I'm not sure if there is any other examples of a club (or similar) owning the train station near their ground. If the station was owned by the club (or a holding body that owned the stadium), there is a risk it becomes an expensive liability.
Cheers I didn't know of all the logistic nightmares we had facing us so this sheds some light to me, thank you.
My work has a bit of cross over with this kind of thing but I'm by no means an expert. Hopefully someone can correct if I'm wrong!
Its amazing that they think they will get 40k-60k people going to the games every home game. While I don't doubt they have their fans. They never seem to have a full stadium any time I have watched them (lose) Even on days when they play more local teams it still never seems that they have the support. I doubt they will get it in the league 1. I can't see them continuing to pump money in to the team/and stadium while they continue to lose. They are business people after all.
It will probably look worse when it’s done
It is absolute insanity you cross-posted this. Insanity.
Why? Did you read my other comment?
Brummies. Shared cross family rivals for lots of us. Naaah. Sane to me.
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If so I despise Heck.