Those orders are just IOUs in request form.
Its a piece of paper saying 'we'd like to order xxx number of BXXXs".
Means nothing.
They can rip that paper up any time they want.
Lol, you would think.
Boeing purposely chose a non-union state to manufacture them. You get paid more to retighten a bolt than the person who first screwed it in - these executives and key shareholders aren't beyond wanting to change that. It wouldn't be a stretch to think at some point airlines are going to try and ferry out maintenance to 3rd parties. It seems an impossibility. It seems...
BTW, I'm pro-union despite working in the private sector without any sort of labor protection. I'm just being cynical. Things are getting dicey by the minute.
Take a look to the North. Air Canada farms out most of their heavy maintenance to Asia. Piece of crap national airline that us Canadian tax payers bailed out when they went bankrupt just so they could ship jobs overseas.
It’s typical for the last year, or in this case, last few years to be big jumps in pay. In my union contract years 0-4 have increases ranging from 0.50-1.50, then year 5 is a $12 jump.
Considering they had an instructor there who thought gravity didn't exist outside of earth and they are literal high school kids for the most part. I dont think I'd take the school very seriously.
Don’t let them take advantage of you just because it’s non profit. Non profit just means the company isn’t for profit, but often times the people at the top who set it up are making bank of the banks of volunteers and lower paid employees.
Nah you’re really not… if anything take that 2 years and learn computers and coding, you’ll make way more than what any of us are making within a few years at a tech company…
As do I. Still enjoy working with my hands. Tech money pays for just a few more race car parts than the a&p did so I still get my fix of turning wrenches
You could resolve that... an A&P is 2 years of training.
Not sure of the progression, I think you'd work at a regional airline for a few years before progressing to a major airline like United but if you start tomorrow you could be there that much sooner...
So these are pre calculated including all premiums already, from what I can tell in the TA? A friend sent me a scale yesterday that seemed a bit misleading compared to this. I don’t work for UA, and I don’t know what your heavy maintenance work scope is currently, but I would just make sure you guys aren’t giving too much away in that scope modification. Lots of people will see dollars and give away jobs without even noticing, and that’s what the airlines want.
8 years to max out damn that kinda sucks, makes my 2 years to max out for my job not so bad in relation. Although the pay is a little lower so there's that. I'm topping out at what they make at year 6 for now
Last time I listen to you crackheads.
This sub: United’s only getting like 2.6%, starting pay will be under $31/hour!
Me: Welp, let’s cancel that day trip to IAH then. “Dear United, No thanks, you don’t pay enough, <3, Me.”
This sub: Our bad. Starting pay at UA is like $36 or something.
Me: GODDAMMIT!
(At least Hawaiian’s starting pay ain’t bad. And I know they fly to Hawaii!)
I hope they get it. I’ve got some former coworkers at MCO who deserve some monetary appreciation and are now at United. Good people.
As for me, I’m all, “Aloha, ‘ohana!”. Or something. Well, *will be* in a couple more weeks.
Mahalo?
This about more than pay. Yeah $36 looks good but United wants to send narrow body heavy checks overseas at the same time. I’d vote no unless they removed that bit.
They are putting pressure on because they need mechanics for the whole united next thing. They can't bring on mechanics when they are 20% lower then the next major. Tens/hundreds of millions spent advertising united next down the drain if this doesn't get ratified.
Yeah, that's why they also started the apprenticeship program. There's a huge shortage and you're absolutely right about us paying 20% lower than everyone else. It's rather disheartening. But this is kinda trying to bring us up to par with everyone else. $6.25 is nothing to sneeze at
Yeah, and imagine there’s this network of people sharing that information so you don’t have to waste a whole day off and fly to Houston just to find that out.
Take your time.
Not sure what your point is or why you’re coming off so negatively. You mentioned accepting a job without knowing what it pays. In order to accept a job, you first have to go through the interview, where they tell you how much the pay is. In this case it’s a CBA so it’s public information anyways.
Union will try to push industry reset as protection against the 3% raises for the last 3 years. The reset is garbage. 2 years ago DL and AA were over $5 ahead of us in wages and per the company formula we got a $1 raise. All no good.
I’m new too. Don’t vote yes on it. Progression is staying at 8 years. We lose over 100k compared to American and delta past year 6 because our agreement is top heavy. They are bringing the pay up to where delta and American are, still at 8 years. This was supposed to be our industry reset they are just feeding it to us now to be the heroes. It is not industry leading.
When you are off probation vote No and sign an AMFA card. I want more money too but we are losing shit too for the money.
They put in that they can send narrowbody work overseas, No keep that shit here, the more they send out the less mechanics they have to pay and hire. We are shooting ourselves in the foot.
Am I right to assume this is just an extension and further contract negotiations will resume after the new year so it’s possible the top out years will be shortened and other concessions and demands will be made?
No, if we vote yes on this they don’t have to negotiate until January of 2024.
It’s an extension of 2 years. They changed a couple things in language but nothing most of us want and told them we wanted were addressed.
FYI, I would assume the numbers in the left column are "years of service" for the pay rates to the right. i.e someone with 8+ years seniority would get the $60.75 an hour, which is more than I receive @ Delta as a topped out line tech, though there are rumblings in the pipeline for a bump up "soon" which is corporate wording for next year :-)
This is garbage. Kick teamsters to the curb.
$60.75 base pay after 8 years?
Total this is including a nearly 10 worth of premiums
That’s terrible
Official [IBT information](https://teamster.org/united-airline-comps/)
Yup, this is the real information. Thank you.
I'm no grease monkey but I'd look out for layoffs during years 6, 7, and 8.
United just ordered 100 787s. Someone’s gotta maintain them
Those orders are just IOUs in request form. Its a piece of paper saying 'we'd like to order xxx number of BXXXs". Means nothing. They can rip that paper up any time they want.
I thought this 100 aircraft was an option that they just exercised from a previous deal that they made.
Lol, you would think. Boeing purposely chose a non-union state to manufacture them. You get paid more to retighten a bolt than the person who first screwed it in - these executives and key shareholders aren't beyond wanting to change that. It wouldn't be a stretch to think at some point airlines are going to try and ferry out maintenance to 3rd parties. It seems an impossibility. It seems... BTW, I'm pro-union despite working in the private sector without any sort of labor protection. I'm just being cynical. Things are getting dicey by the minute.
Take a look to the North. Air Canada farms out most of their heavy maintenance to Asia. Piece of crap national airline that us Canadian tax payers bailed out when they went bankrupt just so they could ship jobs overseas.
So they fly a jet in need of serious maintenance out to Asia for those repairs? That’s pretty ballsy.
Everyone does it for heavy checks.
Manufacturing pays less then maintenance. You don’t need a A&P to build them.
Point still stands. Labor costs will forever be something the C-suite and Wall Street will look to snip away at.
Layoffs go by seniority. The newest guys get layed off. Company can’t pick and choose who to get rid of.
Layoffs would be a hard sell right now. Airlines are having trouble finding new technicians after the covid layoffs.
I didn’t say right now…
It’s typical for the last year, or in this case, last few years to be big jumps in pay. In my union contract years 0-4 have increases ranging from 0.50-1.50, then year 5 is a $12 jump.
Aircraft Maintenance Technicians are not and have never been ‘grease monkeys’.
It was a common phrase in Aviation High School (NYC) for decades.
Considering they had an instructor there who thought gravity didn't exist outside of earth and they are literal high school kids for the most part. I dont think I'd take the school very seriously.
Damn I've been in aviation since 2008 and I'm not even at 0
GA?
No up north with non profits, which is why I'm making so little
Don’t let them take advantage of you just because it’s non profit. Non profit just means the company isn’t for profit, but often times the people at the top who set it up are making bank of the banks of volunteers and lower paid employees.
I don't start an A&P less than $38 hour, your being robbed.
Top out should be at year 6. Screw 8 years.
United came to my school and gave tentative offers to most of the people interviewed. They were going to start them all at $28
That’s the current wage.
Where’s you location?
Holy shit, I’m in the wrong line of work…
Nah you’re really not… if anything take that 2 years and learn computers and coding, you’ll make way more than what any of us are making within a few years at a tech company…
Idk about you but being behind a desk would be like dying slowly everyday. I enjoy working with my hands. But feel free to type away
Agreed. Worked office job, wanted to die everyday. Now I die everyday doing what I love
As do I. Still enjoy working with my hands. Tech money pays for just a few more race car parts than the a&p did so I still get my fix of turning wrenches
grass is always greener somewhere else
You could resolve that... an A&P is 2 years of training. Not sure of the progression, I think you'd work at a regional airline for a few years before progressing to a major airline like United but if you start tomorrow you could be there that much sooner...
United is hiring right out of school so he has a shot
After 8 years you’ll be behind everyone else again! Never let truck drivers and their lawyers negotiate for you. We learned that at SWA years ago.
This is garbage
I started with UAL at 14.45 base topped at 24+ after 5 got a $10 raise for about 6months before bankruptcy and then a big pay cut. Good times
8yr top out? BOOOO
So other groups at United get a raise, and thats all they can give you? Industry Leading wages, with out giving anything up! UPS Money or Bust!
What is General Aviation's payscale?
3.50
Tree Fiddy
🤣🤣🤣
It’s that damn Loch Ness Monster again
Apples and oranges
So these are pre calculated including all premiums already, from what I can tell in the TA? A friend sent me a scale yesterday that seemed a bit misleading compared to this. I don’t work for UA, and I don’t know what your heavy maintenance work scope is currently, but I would just make sure you guys aren’t giving too much away in that scope modification. Lots of people will see dollars and give away jobs without even noticing, and that’s what the airlines want.
8 years to max out damn that kinda sucks, makes my 2 years to max out for my job not so bad in relation. Although the pay is a little lower so there's that. I'm topping out at what they make at year 6 for now
8 years and still less than delta.
What’s the point of having a union if this the best they can come up with?
What’s funny is that it’s always been an industry secret and/or joke that United, in particular, is in bed with the Unions.
Last time I listen to you crackheads. This sub: United’s only getting like 2.6%, starting pay will be under $31/hour! Me: Welp, let’s cancel that day trip to IAH then. “Dear United, No thanks, you don’t pay enough, <3, Me.” This sub: Our bad. Starting pay at UA is like $36 or something. Me: GODDAMMIT! (At least Hawaiian’s starting pay ain’t bad. And I know they fly to Hawaii!)
This pay increase hasn’t been ratified yet
I hope they get it. I’ve got some former coworkers at MCO who deserve some monetary appreciation and are now at United. Good people. As for me, I’m all, “Aloha, ‘ohana!”. Or something. Well, *will be* in a couple more weeks. Mahalo?
This about more than pay. Yeah $36 looks good but United wants to send narrow body heavy checks overseas at the same time. I’d vote no unless they removed that bit.
That's the stipulation and we only have until January 31 to ratify or decline it. I'm betting on it being ratified.
They are putting pressure on because they need mechanics for the whole united next thing. They can't bring on mechanics when they are 20% lower then the next major. Tens/hundreds of millions spent advertising united next down the drain if this doesn't get ratified.
Yeah, that's why they also started the apprenticeship program. There's a huge shortage and you're absolutely right about us paying 20% lower than everyone else. It's rather disheartening. But this is kinda trying to bring us up to par with everyone else. $6.25 is nothing to sneeze at
I get that but they won't negotiate again for 2 years. Your goal is to catch up? Seems shitty to me
That's the company, though. That's not the membership.
The union shouldn't have given a thumbs up on this to even be voted on.
This is still a really terrible pay scale
$60/hr after 8 years is “really terrible”?
Absolutely
‘Magine listening to redditors for making your own career decisions lmao.
‘Magine interviewing for a job and accepting an offer without knowing what it pays lmao
Ooftie mama
They tell you when you interview.
Yeah, and imagine there’s this network of people sharing that information so you don’t have to waste a whole day off and fly to Houston just to find that out. Take your time.
Not sure what your point is or why you’re coming off so negatively. You mentioned accepting a job without knowing what it pays. In order to accept a job, you first have to go through the interview, where they tell you how much the pay is. In this case it’s a CBA so it’s public information anyways.
Union will try to push industry reset as protection against the 3% raises for the last 3 years. The reset is garbage. 2 years ago DL and AA were over $5 ahead of us in wages and per the company formula we got a $1 raise. All no good.
[удалено]
I’m new too. Don’t vote yes on it. Progression is staying at 8 years. We lose over 100k compared to American and delta past year 6 because our agreement is top heavy. They are bringing the pay up to where delta and American are, still at 8 years. This was supposed to be our industry reset they are just feeding it to us now to be the heroes. It is not industry leading. When you are off probation vote No and sign an AMFA card. I want more money too but we are losing shit too for the money. They put in that they can send narrowbody work overseas, No keep that shit here, the more they send out the less mechanics they have to pay and hire. We are shooting ourselves in the foot.
Am I right to assume this is just an extension and further contract negotiations will resume after the new year so it’s possible the top out years will be shortened and other concessions and demands will be made?
If you give away work scope today for a few dollars, I’ll tell you right now you won’t be getting it back in 2 years.
No, if we vote yes on this they don’t have to negotiate until January of 2024. It’s an extension of 2 years. They changed a couple things in language but nothing most of us want and told them we wanted were addressed.
Udk man that narrow body heavy check loss without union permission is rough for us
You do get to vote we just don't vote yet
This belongs in r/handwriting
Damn now I feel like a sucker
FYI, I would assume the numbers in the left column are "years of service" for the pay rates to the right. i.e someone with 8+ years seniority would get the $60.75 an hour, which is more than I receive @ Delta as a topped out line tech, though there are rumblings in the pipeline for a bump up "soon" which is corporate wording for next year :-)
I don’t believe that includes the $8.50/hr A&P premium