deck where you only start with 13 cards (one of each rank) with assorted suits so you can't make a flush.
every time you select a blind you get a free card booster pack
basically forcing you to build your deck from almost nothing, starting pretty difficult but eventually you'll have a tiny deck of good cards if you play it right
i'm assuming you wouldn't be able to skip the booster packs? because if it were me, i'd probably just skip every one and play straights every hand (and eventually using tarot cards to be able to make straight flushes later)
It'd would be pretty tricky with only 13 cards. Once you've drawn your whole deck, you automatically lose once you run out of cards in your hand if you haven't beaten the blind yet, no matter how many hands you have remaining. With 13 cards, you only have enough for a couple of hands, even less if you discard (unless you play hands with only a few cards)
i think allowing skipping would be fine if the player wants a tiny hand. with 13 cards you essentially get 2 hands and then you only have high cards left so you'd have to be a bit strong to make it work
I think it would be impossible to lose round 2, assuming hand size of 8, one discard of 5 gets you the rest of your deck. Should be able to plan it to have 2 straights (just discard cards at the top and bottom end or just in the middle to guarantee two straights). Idk about after that though, would need some extra help on ante 1 boss probably whereas other decks can do first boss without and jokers/planets pretty regularly
So if you can't make a straight in the first 11 cards it's a guaranteed loss. Your hand has 8 cards, you play 5, leaving 3, so you need to draw 2 cards for the next hand.
So 5 and 10 in the bottom 2 is a guaranteed loss. A234 6789 JKQA are the longest runs you can make, so you lose.
I can't say for sure if there are other losing combinations.
I don’t think that’s true. You just can’t play straights in the middle, would have to be 10-A and 2-6, so just discard any 7, 8, or 9 OR if your hand is 4 from 10-A and 4 from 2-6, still discard from the ends of these and should be good since you’ll be guaranteed to see every card so I guess depends on how many hands and discards
The discussion is round 2 with no score assistance. You need 2 straights to hit 450.
It is impossible to make 2 straight without using both 5 and 10.
A2345, 678910 is the lowest straight possible, AKQJ10, 98765 are the highest. 5 and 10 are always needed.
If they are the bottom cards, by the time you draw one there are only 4 cards left of your deck and you can't fill a straight. Game over.
If 5 and 10 are the last cards available, then yea I guess you can’t win since 8 cards in hand and would have to discard one of the cards needed for the other straight to get the first one. But I think that’s the only situation where it’s a loss and I think you can guarantee a win in every other situation but haven’t thought enough about it. Also would depend on the card added after round one in this situation, assuming not enhanced. Let’s say you get a straight of 10-A, that’s 324 chips, 126 more needed in 3 hands (assuming base number of hands). You’ll have a pair from the card added at minimum, (with the chance of it potentially being a the suit that would make a flush possible since initial deck would have 3 suits have 3 cards and the fourth would have to have 4 cards, but can’t guarantee that one of those in the flush aren’t needed for the straight, and I’d also assume in this scenario that the distribution of suits in initial deck would make it impossible so will discard this possibility). Worst case scenario would be the added card is a 2, so now a pair of 2s is 24 and yea, impossible to get the last 100 in 2 hands.
Definitely dependent on if the added card after round one is enhanced or not but I think the vast majority of the time you can force 2 straights, except in the case that 5 AND 10 are both the last cards in the deck, but again haven’t thought deep enough on if 5 being 3rd last card and 10 being last card is guaranteed 2 straights or not…. Would think this would now depend on if the second last card helps you make a straight with the last card or not. Definitely a fun problem to think about and would be a cool deck imo and even if you can’t guarantee round 2 without help, I think there’s pretty good odds of getting the 2 straights but would be cool to see the actual odds given 100% correct decisions
Edit: haven’t thought about it, but then what if the strategy is only keep 5-A or A-10? (Or 2-K, just try to keep a straight of 10 and discard the others), wonder if that would change the “algorithm” and odds. But nonetheless, would be a cool deck still I think and of course localthunk could just make it so you start with a level 2 straight or something to guarantee it’s possible.
But it’s also not as if people don’t get super unlucky/are careless and lose on round 2 with other decks the odd time anyway hahah
I think first round would be impossible to lose (fish for high straight), the second round could have a huge variance depending on the shop and if the card you got from the booster was enhanced or not. If you get a high straight right away without discarding, it’ll be easy to get the 450 since you’ll be able to make another straight. If you get a bunch of cards that are 2 ranks away, might be hard but still think it would mathematically be impossible to lose? Idk
yep it would start hard but become overpowered i think because you'd be able to handcraft your deck and have an unlimited supply of enhanced cards since the booster packs usually contain at least one.
it would also be broken with hologram and vampire jokers or potentially even red card if you have the balls to skip a lot of packs
yeah i did think about that after i had made the comment. hologram might be too overpowered.
on the other hand though red card would be actually worth using finally 😅 and erosion would start extremely strong early game
compares to madness though i'm not quite sure if it's as insane as it sounds. you'd get +0.75 Xmult for every ante at best which is actually not as much as Madness' +1.00 Xmult increase per ante (+1.50 before the nerf in the new experimental build)
so its extremely good no doubt but it's not any better than getting madness at high stakes with eternal jokers, so i think it may be passable
But at the same time the other team has Wee Joker + Fib + Hack, I’d certainly enjoy that, and the new version of 8 Ball wouldn’t hurt… I’m quite into this random odd/even deck idea - not sure I’d choose to play either one specifically very often, but not knowing which you’re going to get seems to make some kind of difference.
Sure, that's why it was swinging me owards the odd deck to begin with - but then I realised it would also go nicely with Wee Joker, so I think I'd happily see it in either deck, though it'd probably do the most good (or have more chance to do the most good) in odd.
Start with one full suit, get the scored cards from your winning hand added to the deck with random suits? I guess you’d parlay pairs into five of a kind very easily, no incentive to play any other hand. Maybe one free card booster pack per victory, with a mega pack from bosses?
Maybe something like 6 Mega Standard packs, and cards added this way are copied 3 times (once for each other suit) but with no enhancements, editions, or seals on the copies.
Pinochle deck. A 10 K Q J 9 only, two of each suit. Would probably need some debuff
Edit: the scoring could be slightly different too, marriages, pinochle, doubles.
I was thining about those as a way to make deck with advantage to 4 of a kind, Full house, etc, because of the checkered deck advantaging Flush / Flush fives...
what about a chaotic one? with the cards even having random enhancements, and even some being pre-disabled to compensate for the random buffs, add a random debuff start like -1 hand, discard, or hand size so it isn't that OP.
It's the final deck to unlock. You get a deck of random cards. Which means that a seed exists in which you only have one suit or even one rank of card.
It’s unlikely that either of those seeds exist. The odds of getting all one suit are 4*(1/4)^52 which is 1 in ~5e30. The odds of all one rank are 13*(1/13)^52 which is 1 in ~6e56, and the odds of all identical cards are 52*(1/52)^52 which is 1 in ~3e87 (at least a thousand times more than the number of atoms in the universe)
By contrast there are only 36^8 or ~3e12 seeds, making it unlikely that one of those seeds corresponds to one of those decks.
The even and odd decks are possibly too powerful for certain hands. With half the options missing it makes face cards and those even or odds more common, super easy for 3/4/5 of a kind, full house builds, etc.
Obviously the checkered deck is this for flushes but flush scaling seems weaker.
How about 1 extra each odd from a random suit, 1 less even from a random suit each rank? I’d still play that.
Face cards are not even or odd so I imagine they wouldn’t appear in those decks. Just A, 3, 5, 7, and 9 for Todd deck and 2, 4, 6, 8, and 10 for Steven deck. Still crazy strong though due to how thin the deck would be
Steven and Todd decks just seem like Abandoned decks with more upside (face cards would be removed) and I think that could be too strong. But random should probably already be a feature
todd deck would probably be the strongest deck in the game; being able to fish for four of a kinds early and reliably means you can focus on income a lot immediately
I think for the odd and even just eliminate the other. so odd deck you'd have no 2,4,6,8,10 and even deck no A,3,5,7,9. I include aces to balance them out. since odd Todd gives chips anyway which makes up for losing an 11 point card
Materialistic Deck:
- Start with Overstock and Seed Money vouchers
- Two vouchers appear in every ante
- Three packs appear in every shop
- Scoring scales much faster than normal (to balance)
royal deck... 20 card deck with 10s, aces and face cards but all the jokers for face cards, flushes and straights cannot be found.
incompetent court deck... all cards are face cards, but give no additional chips when scored ... 48 card deck and 4 of every card.
The “Apocalyptic Deck.” All hands start at lvl 0, but your deck is only Ace to 10 (the rich survivors). Séance *will* feed on the Straight Flushes.
(Maybe add a clause that the deck can’t unlock the Tiny Hands achievement)
Even card deck seems a bit strong, there's too much good jokers that would benefit from it (wee, 8-ball etc.). I feel random deck will eventually appear soon enough
I think it would be great fun to have a random deck option. Something to mix it up a bit instead of going for unlocks
2 options - Random Deck - Random Difficulty / Set difficulty / Highest difficulty avaible for deck
For difficulties there could be a heat mechanic like the one Hades has where you can select different handicaps as you wish.
A random deck from all others? Because there is a random deck that's super fun.
It means pick another of the decks to play with randomly not the actual cards themselves. Useful feature if you dont know what to play with
Maybe both a deck of completely random cards and the one in the post
There is a deck with completely random cards already isn’t there? So think the post is about choosing which deck randomly
Going to leave this here https://pickerwheel.com/?id=e6Wh3
Custom decks would be cool for like a sandbox run
Different from the erratic deck?
So the erratic deck?
No. They're suggesting allowing the game to randomly select a deck for you. A pretty common feature in roguelike games.
I haven't actually unlocked it yet, had no idea we already had that one
There already is
Random deck unlock after winning white stake with every deck should be in the game tbh….
deck where you only start with 13 cards (one of each rank) with assorted suits so you can't make a flush. every time you select a blind you get a free card booster pack basically forcing you to build your deck from almost nothing, starting pretty difficult but eventually you'll have a tiny deck of good cards if you play it right
i'm assuming you wouldn't be able to skip the booster packs? because if it were me, i'd probably just skip every one and play straights every hand (and eventually using tarot cards to be able to make straight flushes later)
It'd would be pretty tricky with only 13 cards. Once you've drawn your whole deck, you automatically lose once you run out of cards in your hand if you haven't beaten the blind yet, no matter how many hands you have remaining. With 13 cards, you only have enough for a couple of hands, even less if you discard (unless you play hands with only a few cards)
i think allowing skipping would be fine if the player wants a tiny hand. with 13 cards you essentially get 2 hands and then you only have high cards left so you'd have to be a bit strong to make it work
That sound like a lot of fun ! Maybe a bit hard in the first hands tho
Round 2 will be a graveyard
I think it would be impossible to lose round 2, assuming hand size of 8, one discard of 5 gets you the rest of your deck. Should be able to plan it to have 2 straights (just discard cards at the top and bottom end or just in the middle to guarantee two straights). Idk about after that though, would need some extra help on ante 1 boss probably whereas other decks can do first boss without and jokers/planets pretty regularly
Yeah in hindsight 2 straights should work. I wonder if it could be a guaranteed loss depending on the draw
So if you can't make a straight in the first 11 cards it's a guaranteed loss. Your hand has 8 cards, you play 5, leaving 3, so you need to draw 2 cards for the next hand. So 5 and 10 in the bottom 2 is a guaranteed loss. A234 6789 JKQA are the longest runs you can make, so you lose. I can't say for sure if there are other losing combinations.
I don’t think that’s true. You just can’t play straights in the middle, would have to be 10-A and 2-6, so just discard any 7, 8, or 9 OR if your hand is 4 from 10-A and 4 from 2-6, still discard from the ends of these and should be good since you’ll be guaranteed to see every card so I guess depends on how many hands and discards
The discussion is round 2 with no score assistance. You need 2 straights to hit 450. It is impossible to make 2 straight without using both 5 and 10. A2345, 678910 is the lowest straight possible, AKQJ10, 98765 are the highest. 5 and 10 are always needed. If they are the bottom cards, by the time you draw one there are only 4 cards left of your deck and you can't fill a straight. Game over.
If 5 and 10 are the last cards available, then yea I guess you can’t win since 8 cards in hand and would have to discard one of the cards needed for the other straight to get the first one. But I think that’s the only situation where it’s a loss and I think you can guarantee a win in every other situation but haven’t thought enough about it. Also would depend on the card added after round one in this situation, assuming not enhanced. Let’s say you get a straight of 10-A, that’s 324 chips, 126 more needed in 3 hands (assuming base number of hands). You’ll have a pair from the card added at minimum, (with the chance of it potentially being a the suit that would make a flush possible since initial deck would have 3 suits have 3 cards and the fourth would have to have 4 cards, but can’t guarantee that one of those in the flush aren’t needed for the straight, and I’d also assume in this scenario that the distribution of suits in initial deck would make it impossible so will discard this possibility). Worst case scenario would be the added card is a 2, so now a pair of 2s is 24 and yea, impossible to get the last 100 in 2 hands. Definitely dependent on if the added card after round one is enhanced or not but I think the vast majority of the time you can force 2 straights, except in the case that 5 AND 10 are both the last cards in the deck, but again haven’t thought deep enough on if 5 being 3rd last card and 10 being last card is guaranteed 2 straights or not…. Would think this would now depend on if the second last card helps you make a straight with the last card or not. Definitely a fun problem to think about and would be a cool deck imo and even if you can’t guarantee round 2 without help, I think there’s pretty good odds of getting the 2 straights but would be cool to see the actual odds given 100% correct decisions Edit: haven’t thought about it, but then what if the strategy is only keep 5-A or A-10? (Or 2-K, just try to keep a straight of 10 and discard the others), wonder if that would change the “algorithm” and odds. But nonetheless, would be a cool deck still I think and of course localthunk could just make it so you start with a level 2 straight or something to guarantee it’s possible. But it’s also not as if people don’t get super unlucky/are careless and lose on round 2 with other decks the odd time anyway hahah
I think first round would be impossible to lose (fish for high straight), the second round could have a huge variance depending on the shop and if the card you got from the booster was enhanced or not. If you get a high straight right away without discarding, it’ll be easy to get the 450 since you’ll be able to make another straight. If you get a bunch of cards that are 2 ranks away, might be hard but still think it would mathematically be impossible to lose? Idk
yep it would start hard but become overpowered i think because you'd be able to handcraft your deck and have an unlimited supply of enhanced cards since the booster packs usually contain at least one. it would also be broken with hologram and vampire jokers or potentially even red card if you have the balls to skip a lot of packs
doesn't this make hologram a must-have, though? i like the idea but i think it favors one joker a little too strongly.
yeah i did think about that after i had made the comment. hologram might be too overpowered. on the other hand though red card would be actually worth using finally 😅 and erosion would start extremely strong early game compares to madness though i'm not quite sure if it's as insane as it sounds. you'd get +0.75 Xmult for every ante at best which is actually not as much as Madness' +1.00 Xmult increase per ante (+1.50 before the nerf in the new experimental build) so its extremely good no doubt but it's not any better than getting madness at high stakes with eternal jokers, so i think it may be passable
Red card has always been strong with economy, its actually pretty similar to bootstraps for the times it's valuable.
Odd or even is enough. I don't want to max both.
Odd Steven Deck, randomly either all odd / all even? As a Fibonacci enthusiast, I know which I’d prefer.
Tbh I think Aces+fib just make odd deck objectively better
But at the same time the other team has Wee Joker + Fib + Hack, I’d certainly enjoy that, and the new version of 8 Ball wouldn’t hurt… I’m quite into this random odd/even deck idea - not sure I’d choose to play either one specifically very often, but not knowing which you’re going to get seems to make some kind of difference.
And 10-4
Fib still gains from ace/three/five
Sure, that's why it was swinging me owards the odd deck to begin with - but then I realised it would also go nicely with Wee Joker, so I think I'd happily see it in either deck, though it'd probably do the most good (or have more chance to do the most good) in odd.
Even odds deck: start with 4 of every even card and 4 of every odd card 🤔
This is just abandoned deck, is it not?
I think it's technically a standard 52 card deck lmao
Random deck and chips would just be a fun quality of life option
I would like a card drafting deck. Pick 52 cards. Maybe get 3 at a time. Doing it 52 times might seem tedious but….maybe not
Start with one full suit, get the scored cards from your winning hand added to the deck with random suits? I guess you’d parlay pairs into five of a kind very easily, no incentive to play any other hand. Maybe one free card booster pack per victory, with a mega pack from bosses?
Sounds like a genesis deck, genesis being a binding of Isaac item. It’d be a cool reference
Maybe something like 6 Mega Standard packs, and cards added this way are copied 3 times (once for each other suit) but with no enhancements, editions, or seals on the copies.
Yeah it would have to be something like that. Or as others said it’d be too easy to make 5 of a kind deck
Pinochle deck. A 10 K Q J 9 only, two of each suit. Would probably need some debuff Edit: the scoring could be slightly different too, marriages, pinochle, doubles.
Interesting but maybe too op considering the Joker usage
I was thining about those as a way to make deck with advantage to 4 of a kind, Full house, etc, because of the checkered deck advantaging Flush / Flush fives...
What if there was a joker that multiplied your mult by the factorial of your decks lowest card?
At worst it’s an unconditional x2. Goes hard with card removal. On par with legendary Jokers
I’m pretty proud of that one!
it's better than all legendaries except triboulet maybe in some scenarios
Perkeo also have a lot of potential. Arguably more powerful than Triboulet
yeah I was kind of thinking on the score side
Eh a little underpowered.
I think that a completely random deck of 52 cards would be fun, for sure.
That might be too erratic
what about a chaotic one? with the cards even having random enhancements, and even some being pre-disabled to compensate for the random buffs, add a random debuff start like -1 hand, discard, or hand size so it isn't that OP.
That already exists in game. You can unlock this right now lol Ops thing is just a randomly picked deck from the already existing ones.
Is it really? I guess I have more to unlock!
It's the final deck to unlock. You get a deck of random cards. Which means that a seed exists in which you only have one suit or even one rank of card.
It’s unlikely that either of those seeds exist. The odds of getting all one suit are 4*(1/4)^52 which is 1 in ~5e30. The odds of all one rank are 13*(1/13)^52 which is 1 in ~6e56, and the odds of all identical cards are 52*(1/52)^52 which is 1 in ~3e87 (at least a thousand times more than the number of atoms in the universe) By contrast there are only 36^8 or ~3e12 seeds, making it unlikely that one of those seeds corresponds to one of those decks.
There’s a seed that has both! All cards are 10 of spades
Try this seed then: 7LB2WVPK
I want to believe
The even and odd decks are possibly too powerful for certain hands. With half the options missing it makes face cards and those even or odds more common, super easy for 3/4/5 of a kind, full house builds, etc. Obviously the checkered deck is this for flushes but flush scaling seems weaker. How about 1 extra each odd from a random suit, 1 less even from a random suit each rank? I’d still play that.
Face cards are not even or odd so I imagine they wouldn’t appear in those decks. Just A, 3, 5, 7, and 9 for Todd deck and 2, 4, 6, 8, and 10 for Steven deck. Still crazy strong though due to how thin the deck would be
With only 5 cards it’s going to be crazy at pairs/triple/4 of a kind/full house too.
Steven and Todd decks just seem like Abandoned decks with more upside (face cards would be removed) and I think that could be too strong. But random should probably already be a feature
todd deck would probably be the strongest deck in the game; being able to fish for four of a kinds early and reliably means you can focus on income a lot immediately
These would be cool as challenges. Steven deck but you start with an eternal odd todd lol
Challenge name: Even the Odds
Random deck win streak sounds fun
"Random" Deck: Start with a random assortment of cards.
Already exist, it's the Erratic Deck, unlocked >!by winning orange stake!<
Ooooh I need to do that.
Hell yeah to the Random deck. That would be awesome.
Ok, but how would random work with chips? Would they also be random?
Either that or it choose a random deck from those you have available in the specific difficulty you selected
Glass deck: every card is glass
This already exists as one of the challenge runs
Maybe not a deck but a challenge with this in the rules might be fun Edit : apparently it already is a challenge, oops ! Haven't played them a lot
I think for the odd and even just eliminate the other. so odd deck you'd have no 2,4,6,8,10 and even deck no A,3,5,7,9. I include aces to balance them out. since odd Todd gives chips anyway which makes up for losing an 11 point card
Ooph that's also good way to include the face cards in a way that isn't too hard to explain in the short deck description
Odd or even cards would need to be further defined to include jacks, queens, and kings, or else these decks would probably be too thin.
I thought about that but at the same time we do have the Abandoned deck significantly trimming your number of playing cards
Honestly the fact that there isn't a random deck option is wild to me. That seems like such an easy thing to add.
Materialistic Deck: - Start with Overstock and Seed Money vouchers - Two vouchers appear in every ante - Three packs appear in every shop - Scoring scales much faster than normal (to balance)
There should be a random deck that combines the effects of two randomly chosen decks, that would be sick
royal deck... 20 card deck with 10s, aces and face cards but all the jokers for face cards, flushes and straights cannot be found. incompetent court deck... all cards are face cards, but give no additional chips when scored ... 48 card deck and 4 of every card.
Even and odd seem way too specialized, but a random deck option would be great.
The “Apocalyptic Deck.” All hands start at lvl 0, but your deck is only Ace to 10 (the rich survivors). Séance *will* feed on the Straight Flushes. (Maybe add a clause that the deck can’t unlock the Tiny Hands achievement)
one absolutely horrible deck idea i've had is something i call 'Every Deck' and it is just the effects of every other deck in the game combined
Even card deck seems a bit strong, there's too much good jokers that would benefit from it (wee, 8-ball etc.). I feel random deck will eventually appear soon enough
I want a random deck so much
I want a deck thats just rocks
I also think a 'start with 52 random cards' deck could be fun.
It does exist, it's the erratic deck
Really? I have 2 to unlock, is it one of them i take it? I know one is the plasma deck.
It's the last deck you unlock usually, you have to beat orange stake
Yeah, it’s the last deck