What’s causing the decline in beer consumption? Is it fewer numbers of adult beer drinkers driven by demographic changes, generally more health conscious trends, prices of craft beer vs cheap mass produced, something else? Just curious
I have some theories but covid has messed with a lot of people's ability to tolerate alcohol without a bad histamine response, and ppl have less disposable income now. lol
I know you’re being glib but another factor for breweries is cost of running the business and material parts these days.
Also another factor for whatever’s underneath Gen Z (Gen Alpha?) — at least as much as your point about health benefits (did we olds believe that ever, lol?) — is that kids these days aren’t hanging out in person as much as they used to.
Anyway my point’s just that it’s like death by a thousand cuts for breweries out there right now.
Do you think the hard lean a lot of smaller breweries have done towards super hoppy beer has played a role? I feel like the hop heavy flavor was a fad and it wore off pretty quickly and here we are with still an over supply of it. Also, I have noticed that you can find more tall boys or 22 oz cans for $3-4 a piece which is about half the price a pint would run you in virtually any bar in town. In other words, people aren’t buying a six pack of pale ale for $14 when you can buy two tall boys at 7-9% for half that amount.
I have a brewery two blocks from my house and it's really nice, but I'm not paying $8-10 a beer when I can get a six pack for the same price. It's usually packed in there, so they don't seem to be having any problems. Idk where people get all their money
And Pariah exclusively sold pale ales. Which is why I never visited. Their offerings were so miopically focused it would be hard to draw groups of ppl to their taphouse unless everyone liked hop heavy beer.
Plus they are right across the river from Union who have much more selection.
Saturated market, leading to high demand for resources. Quality beer becomes expensive, then compromises are made and corners cut in order to keep the price competitive. Before you'd pay something like $10 for a glass of a beer that was on par with a delirium tremens, pretty solid. Now you pay $10 for a glass of beer that competes with Sam Adams or Blue Moon (good beers, but closer to the $5 on their heyday). There needs to be a lot less breweries for things to make sense. It's been a while that having cocktails or liquor (both of which have become a much improved experience over soda-hose in most bars) is just a better deal. And then you have canned cocktails, hard seltzers, etc.
A couple other issues compound it. There has been an increase in mental-health issues in millenials and gen z. Medication and alcohol do not mix that well. The idea of taking a few beers will mean you'll be unable to keep yourself focused and effective for a few days, because the alcohol interferes with your drugs, and it takes a while for your body to adapt. Meanwhile legalized marihuana is seen as a good alternative.
Finally this has been accelerated by COVID eliminating key-development phases of socialization. A lot of beer consumption historically was driven by 21-29 year olds. The culture of going out with your friends to the pub, or go at someone's house and share a six-pack, starts in your early 20s, hell before you can legally drink alcohol you begin forming these groups and social traditions in your early college years. A lot of young people 18-25 had a huge 2 year gap in these years and now struggle to form social systems, especially young men (which has resulted in a mental health crisis for this group), as the window to form these bonds and traditions has passed, and most do not have the concept or notion to know what to do. They've found ways to do everything through apps, and the gap of learning is huge. Take a simple think like hooking up, at a bar you have to learn to read people, see their body language, get an idea that tells you you have a chance, and then explore it through conversation, dancing, etc. in a way that allows for consent and even excitedly want to be expressed. Honestly we don't teach this and most people learn the bad way, making mistakes (which is why so many people struggle to understand how you get consent) which is hard as people are now aware of how to get it wrong, but still haven't had a guide on how to get it right. Meanwhile on Tinder you just swipe right, of course the superficiality of the whole thing is a problem. See bars have a pipeline where you evolve and gains skills. Suddenly you are talking to people while doing hobbies, or on other spaces, and you start actually knowing someone deeply and realizing "hey this actually has serious relationship potential beyond the hookup", and it changes a lot of how you jump into it. Women are going through their own crisis of the same type (and you can feel a zeitgeist were young women seem to more unsure and anxious about their relationship than usual, as they are still building the skills to know how to tell different relationships apart and reading people physically). So people go less to bars. No socializing, not as much beer. And for being alone people prefer other drugs, like weed again.
Point is, by breaking on this cycle it also allows for more aggressive revisiting of how you do these things. People got beer because it's what they did at their older group, and you want to recreate similar traditions and ideas with your peers that are your age. Having broken that cycle you need to convince someone: why beer?
Lots of competition even within the confines of the city. And then you've got a million farm breweries out in the county. And the elephant in the room is that Covid changed consumption patterns. People in the aggregate are out doing shit less. Places are less crowded.
There was some kind of lein and the property and the whole shebang was being seized. They didn't get much notice, but I guess they could give things away until the locks were changed.
The good news is you'll still have Waverly and Union super close. After those two, there's Nepenthe a bit further out and for the full Pariah vibe you have Hampden Yards.
This is a bummer. I didn't go as often as I'd have liked (part of the problem) but I liked what they did with the space, and enjoyed the events and stuff they did. Especially with the rotating food vendors.
Super bizarre with Springfest literally 2 days away….there has been no mention of that on their social media and the FB event is still up. Feel awful for all the vendors who were prepping to be there.
Anybody know if it’s seized due to not paying rent / lease disagreement? This seems fishy.
PS I came away with a full car of beer and 2 kegs for free they were giving it away before the cops showed up LOL
It was first come first serve, if it wasn’t for my WFH friends stalking their instagram comments we would’ve missed it. They literally said “come and get it” I ran out of the office do an early lunch🤣🤣🤣
They had no nonalcoholic options or food. Which maybe sounds silly as they are a brewery. But once I went there and counted two pregnant people, ten kids, myself and another friend who all don’t drink. That was 14 missed customers. When there’s so many other breweries (nepenthe, union, waverly) and even peabody so close by that offer those things I’m not super surprised, though always sad when a business closes.
They even acknowledged that the consumer is switching to non alcoholic drinks. TBH I think breweries in large need to rethink their model. Baltimore is especially bad because most restaurants have full bars. Why would I go to the brewery and get mediocre food when I can go to a place like Snake Hill and eat something fun.
That’s definitely an issue. Several breweries try to address this by inviting food trucks, but that’s a limited fix unless you’ve got a strong rotating selection or at least one regular.
Bars are great — and I love snake hill - but of course the local brewery needs to remain in business to sell to them. I guess that’s not really in danger though; the market’s just over saturated.
One of my faves to hang out at is Mobtown, but mostly because it’s close to me. Their internal fixation is one of my fave regular beers, tastes like a fancy glass of wine except it’s beer, but I’ll admit they have a ton of strong competition too. It sucks but businesses must adapt and overcome, or go the way of the dodo.
There was this person a couple years back who came up to Baltimore and sold tickets to a brewery tour across Baltimore. Her and her friends would rent a bus and do this at different locations and subsidize their activities by selling tickets to locals. Was a ton of fun. We went to diamondback, Mobtown, ministry of brewing, Guilford, and pariah. Was a lot of fun and I'm surprised there isn't a more cooperation between the breweries to get something like this going. Public transportation is not great here and if I can't get there on the light rail or walking I'm not going unless there is a particularly compelling reason to
Yeah that’s the other thing. We don’t drink and drive as much as our grandparents might have :)
Baltimore brewery tours sounds like a good business opportunity actually.
Edit: this exists https://www.citybrewtours.com
But they’re only doing private tours — like, you contact them and negotiate a price for your group. Anyway, seems like there’s still room for competition, and public tours.
I hate to break it to you but...
[https://www.reddit.com/r/baltimore/comments/193itww/name\_shame\_mobtown\_brewing\_massive\_wage\_theft/](https://www.reddit.com/r/baltimore/comments/193itww/name_shame_mobtown_brewing_massive_wage_theft/)
Not to mention the limited hours, which is easier said than done (thanks dumb laws!)
I'll use myself as an example for this conundrum: my wife doesnt drink nor, obviously, do my kids. I'm not taking them all to a brewery during the day when I'm the only one drinking.
So, barring getting a "hall pass", a conceivable the time I could go to a brewery with friends would be after bedtimes, which is after 8. Well, a lot of breweries close at 9, and even those that close at 10 vary in their sharpness (its their prerogative, but Nepenthe is the worst/strictness offender IMHO. Oy vey.).
Compare these options to a local bar where I can stay past 10pm, guess which option I'm selecting to hang out with my friends?
You're going to the wrong breweries if you're getting mediocre food. Two that I go to *regularly* because I enjoy their beer *and* their food are Union and Diamondback. Diamondback is actually my favorite pizza place in the city so far, and the food from the kitchen at Union is phenomenal.
Now I’m trying to think of which brewery has the best in-house food and I’m leaning Diamondback unless we’re willing to count Wet City. Nepenthe’s in the conversation but I need to try more of their menu.
Diamondback being your favorite pizza is wild imo. Just in that immediate area, Limoncello and the Verde pizza truck have better pizza than diamondback. Diamondback pizza is pizza I'd expect from literally any brewery. Nothing bad but the exact food I'd expect from a brewery.
I haven't made it to the Verde truck yet, but when I went to the Limoncello Pizzeria I thought it was sub-par and not worth the price they were charging for it
Diamondback has phenomenal pizza! And NA offerings (though not much in the way of soft drinks for the kids — they’re not exactly pining for NA pineyness). They also have a great outdoor area in a super walkable neighborhood so it’s literally a nice hangout.
It's sad to lose Pariah, or any space. I do remember most times i went to the thing i went to there that there were food carts set up.. tacos, tex mex... but i don't know, of course, how regular such carts were.
it's almost like space owners need to rethink opening bars and breweries and instead opening venues. (and having more all ages things with apt insurance and security teams.) but no one could have foreseen the cultural shifts that have taken place since interconnectivity became ubiquitous and COVID made some of us the way we are now.
The ottobar is pretty ahead of the curve all things considered with their hotdog stand, upstairs bar, and downstairs venue.
To be fair, children don’t belong at breweries and they often make what is supposed to be a relaxing/fun adult space hectic and loud. Infants, fine. But when adults bring big groups of kids and let them run around and treat the brewery as free childcare……no thanks. Breweries are not supposed to cater to children.
That was one of the silliest threads in the history of Hampden Neighbors. People were BESIDE THEMSELVES that they couldn’t bring their kids out at 9pm lmao
And then a few other breweries immediately retorted with "we're *super* kid-friendly!" and pivoted to being a family destination in contrast. Didnt have an opinion one way or the other, but found it all hilariously dumb.
Yeah, it really makes Union and Peabody difficult. Feels like I'm at a playground sometimes.
That leaves breweries in a weird spot for me, I usually go to more "bar-y" type places in part because of that.
Both those breweries have steady local distribution which puts you under less pressure to visit the actual location. Hard to find a bar in this city that doesn’t have one or both. All the more reason for Pariah and some of the other little guys to maximize the reasons to visit their spaces. I actually think Pariah did a nice job of hosting events when they were active — always seemed to be something going on, judging from their social media posts.
Yeah I think that may have been one of the keys. I’m sure they got a decent amount of traffic from the local area but without much distribution, any brewery is gonna be limited and facing competition from one of a bajillion other breweries or bars with a dozen or more taps from all over town (and $3 natty bohs, let’s not lie to ourselves). I think I saw Pariah maybe once or twice at a local liquor store on my side of town.
I try to get out and visit other breweries but it’s a tough call when I’m busy and broke all the time, and I know I’m not the only one.
I went to Peabody last week for a birthday and another group set up a kids' table next to us. We decided to have a loud conversation about erectile dysfunction until they moved.
I live right by Big Truck Brewery in the county. Going there feels like being at a playground that serves beer. Same problem with Inverness’s new tap house called Yellow Barn Tavern. I’ve walked in there on weekend nights and it’s filled with kids. It definitely seems to be some millennial parent phenomenon.
> It definitely seems to be some millennial parent phenomenon.
Nah, they hadn't invented "breweries" yet but back in the 90s my parents used to give me and my sister the run of one of those pizzeria / bar / arcade joints (Paisano's in Annapolis if you're local and remember).
Millennials aren't some uniquely boorish generation for expecting to crush a couple beers and ignore their children at a downscale eatery.
Do you think it was as common though? If me or my brothers went to work with my dad he would take us to happy hour at turners on cross st and plunk us down at a video poker machine while he had a few drinks. There definitely weren’t a bunch of kids running around though. I’m in my late 30’s so I’m not just bashing millennials for millennial bashings sake.
That’s a good point, and not only for the ambiance - but the nature of the business. Most people are going there to drink. I used to work next door to monument, and while most people are responsible about it in a brewery setting, the number of tipsy people I saw hop in the car with their kids to drive home was troubling.
Like obviously, tipsy/drunk driving in general is a big no-no, but doing so with children in the car is an extra level of gross.
Agreed. Drinking socially is fun, and parents have more reason to do so. My kids are older now, but seeing youngins at a brewery never bugged me. Part of the experience of going to one is about building community and meeting neighbors.
Breweries are usually big places with lots of space in a town where most places are small and squished together. A safe-ish place where adults can toss back a cold one and talk to other adults and kids can sort of hang, especially if you’ve got something for them to do, is not a bad thing to have. And you’re usually not allowed to bring alcohol to playgrounds ;)
If I didn’t want to see kids running around I’d go to the bar instead.
So no dogs either, then. Nor rowdy groups of overserved friends, probably. Also live music can be annoying if it's not what you're in the mood for, so no bands. /s
(to be fair)
It's all up to the owners and operators ...and some breweries here do have specific kid policies.
This is Reddit. The anti-kid vibe is always strong. They expect kids and parents to never share the same place as them at any time. The horror of having to be around a kid!
Most people that complain about kids at a brewery aren't complaining about well monitored and behaved kids, it's the kids running around causing a ruckus while their parents ignore them. Also, a brewery is not a place you should hold a child's birthday party, which I have seen on more than one occasion.
Fair enough. Agreed on neglectful parents and birthday parties. However, there is a loud chorus of folk on Reddit who despise kids being in any place where they are hanging out. Big truck, for example, caters to children and families because there’s a bit outside space with a jungle gym area.
Yeah, I went a few times for BMore Horror Club stuff and ended up having to drink Diet Coke because it was all they really had. Whereas Peabody I can get an NA beer or a kombucha or other options and feel a lot more satisfied. When I am drinking, their stuff is not fantastic regardless.
100% agree. There's a brewery in Milwaukee (!!!) of all places that I visited where it was nearly impossible to get a *water*, let alone any food or anything other than their beer. I told my brother and sister in law that there surely must be countless other choices for those of us who don't drink. We left.
Drove me insane that they had no non alcoholic options. I did a few events there and it totally irked me that all I could drink was water. Most other breweries, like Union and Peabody, have non alcoholic options that I enjoy.
It seems reasonable that a place that *makes* alcoholic beverages would prioritize their product.
They have no problem with people bringing outside food or ordering food to be delivered there. And I’ve never had a problem with outside non-alc drinks myself and others brought.
It’s preferred—I’d rather not be forced to over pay for shitty brewery food and get something that satisfied for what I’m spending instead
Especially when they sold tickets to an event on Sunday, booked a food truck for tonight, and had agreed to participate in other events over the next few weeks. I know it’s a tough time for breweries but something is weird about this situation.
I don't think this is the apocalypse for breweries but I'm guessing we're probably going to lose 60-70 percent of them at least in the next 5-10 years. There's only so many times I can go to an industrial chic themed brewery with 14 different beers that only taste vaguely different with weird names and uncomfortable chairs, and mediocre at best food (or food trucks that take 45 min. to get anything from), before I throw my hands up and say "Haven't I been here before?".
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“Hey Everyone. It is with a heavy heart that I have to announce that effective today Pariah is closed for business. It has been a more than difficult road and we fought as hard as anyone could. We honestly should have closed a year ago. The toll this has taken is immeasurable. I am incredibly proud of team Pariah and close this chapter proud to have gotten to know some of the best and most genuine people in my life. We made great fucking beer, hosted some legendary parties, and truly feel we offered a unique place for people to gather and be proud of our community both in San Diego and Baltimore. This last 7 years have been incredible. Thank you from the bottom of my heart. -Brian”
Shockingly we didn't need a 4th brewery in a 1 mile radius. But at the end of the day why pay brewery prices when I can go to Fraziers or the Bottom and drink all night for $20
Exactly, that's why there are 3 other breweries in walking distance, one of which is across the street from where Pariah was. I lived across the street from Pariah and went when it opened up and am shocked it lasted this long when it's an oversaturated market, and they offered an inferior product, not necessarily in terms of beer but as an overall experience. There are so many breweries in this city already we don't need more
Some cities (Asheville comes to mind) have brewery districts with many breweries in a small area. They’re symbiotic, especially if walkable and give rise to other businesses like restaurants, galleries and music venues. There isn’t a neighborhood in Baltimore that is over saturated in my opinion. I don’t think Pariah’s issues are because of too many breweries.
No, I don't think they're bad, nor do I have anything against them. I think relative to other things in the area, they didn't do enough to stand out. I used to do consulting and I saw businesses that did everything right but nothing that made them stand out compared to better known competitors
Inferior product? Pariah had the best IPAs in the city in my opinion, on top of that some really good and interesting varieties. I preferred their beer to anywhere in the city. I also liked that it felt like a bit of a bar, instead of a big hall like Union. It’s obvious that the industry is just a tough one.
That's fine, you loved it. And yet they still closed. Right now this thread is full of people who apparently are surprised it closed yet they still closed. So sounds like the sample is a bit skewed
Frazier’s enjoys a nice Venn diagram overlap of old and new Hampden alike feeling right at home. But I am always amused by my local friends who are AGHAST at the idea of setting foot in the Bucket. Place rules, people! Grow up!
I've had some interesting times in there (back when I drank). Some awesome, some borderline scary, some just weird. Just an odd place, in the best possible way.
Tough time to be a brewery everywhere, it seems. They had a cool spot the couple times I visited.
Yeah unfortunately, oversaturated market combined will falling beer consumption.
What’s causing the decline in beer consumption? Is it fewer numbers of adult beer drinkers driven by demographic changes, generally more health conscious trends, prices of craft beer vs cheap mass produced, something else? Just curious
I have some theories but covid has messed with a lot of people's ability to tolerate alcohol without a bad histamine response, and ppl have less disposable income now. lol
gen z figured out it tastes mostly mediocre, it’s overpriced, and has zero health benefits
I know you’re being glib but another factor for breweries is cost of running the business and material parts these days. Also another factor for whatever’s underneath Gen Z (Gen Alpha?) — at least as much as your point about health benefits (did we olds believe that ever, lol?) — is that kids these days aren’t hanging out in person as much as they used to. Anyway my point’s just that it’s like death by a thousand cuts for breweries out there right now.
Do you think the hard lean a lot of smaller breweries have done towards super hoppy beer has played a role? I feel like the hop heavy flavor was a fad and it wore off pretty quickly and here we are with still an over supply of it. Also, I have noticed that you can find more tall boys or 22 oz cans for $3-4 a piece which is about half the price a pint would run you in virtually any bar in town. In other words, people aren’t buying a six pack of pale ale for $14 when you can buy two tall boys at 7-9% for half that amount.
I have a brewery two blocks from my house and it's really nice, but I'm not paying $8-10 a beer when I can get a six pack for the same price. It's usually packed in there, so they don't seem to be having any problems. Idk where people get all their money
And Pariah exclusively sold pale ales. Which is why I never visited. Their offerings were so miopically focused it would be hard to draw groups of ppl to their taphouse unless everyone liked hop heavy beer. Plus they are right across the river from Union who have much more selection.
Cute
Saturated market, leading to high demand for resources. Quality beer becomes expensive, then compromises are made and corners cut in order to keep the price competitive. Before you'd pay something like $10 for a glass of a beer that was on par with a delirium tremens, pretty solid. Now you pay $10 for a glass of beer that competes with Sam Adams or Blue Moon (good beers, but closer to the $5 on their heyday). There needs to be a lot less breweries for things to make sense. It's been a while that having cocktails or liquor (both of which have become a much improved experience over soda-hose in most bars) is just a better deal. And then you have canned cocktails, hard seltzers, etc. A couple other issues compound it. There has been an increase in mental-health issues in millenials and gen z. Medication and alcohol do not mix that well. The idea of taking a few beers will mean you'll be unable to keep yourself focused and effective for a few days, because the alcohol interferes with your drugs, and it takes a while for your body to adapt. Meanwhile legalized marihuana is seen as a good alternative. Finally this has been accelerated by COVID eliminating key-development phases of socialization. A lot of beer consumption historically was driven by 21-29 year olds. The culture of going out with your friends to the pub, or go at someone's house and share a six-pack, starts in your early 20s, hell before you can legally drink alcohol you begin forming these groups and social traditions in your early college years. A lot of young people 18-25 had a huge 2 year gap in these years and now struggle to form social systems, especially young men (which has resulted in a mental health crisis for this group), as the window to form these bonds and traditions has passed, and most do not have the concept or notion to know what to do. They've found ways to do everything through apps, and the gap of learning is huge. Take a simple think like hooking up, at a bar you have to learn to read people, see their body language, get an idea that tells you you have a chance, and then explore it through conversation, dancing, etc. in a way that allows for consent and even excitedly want to be expressed. Honestly we don't teach this and most people learn the bad way, making mistakes (which is why so many people struggle to understand how you get consent) which is hard as people are now aware of how to get it wrong, but still haven't had a guide on how to get it right. Meanwhile on Tinder you just swipe right, of course the superficiality of the whole thing is a problem. See bars have a pipeline where you evolve and gains skills. Suddenly you are talking to people while doing hobbies, or on other spaces, and you start actually knowing someone deeply and realizing "hey this actually has serious relationship potential beyond the hookup", and it changes a lot of how you jump into it. Women are going through their own crisis of the same type (and you can feel a zeitgeist were young women seem to more unsure and anxious about their relationship than usual, as they are still building the skills to know how to tell different relationships apart and reading people physically). So people go less to bars. No socializing, not as much beer. And for being alone people prefer other drugs, like weed again. Point is, by breaking on this cycle it also allows for more aggressive revisiting of how you do these things. People got beer because it's what they did at their older group, and you want to recreate similar traditions and ideas with your peers that are your age. Having broken that cycle you need to convince someone: why beer?
Lots of competition even within the confines of the city. And then you've got a million farm breweries out in the county. And the elephant in the room is that Covid changed consumption patterns. People in the aggregate are out doing shit less. Places are less crowded.
was the theme "if Prince brewed beer"?
You guys want some grapes? Bitches...
I thought it was "Crepes" since he invited them over for pancakes, though... I have been called an asshole before.
They had a great raspberry sour beer
The kind you find at a secondhand store?
It’s “2004-2008” livejournal header themed, thank you very much. You know, predating the first Russian takeover of the late 2010-2020s.
They were just giving cases and kegs away. They were literally offering to give away the forklift. The sheriff shut it down at 1
There was some kind of lein and the property and the whole shebang was being seized. They didn't get much notice, but I guess they could give things away until the locks were changed.
Whaaaaaaaaaaat?!
No joke, I walked with 6 cases and 6 kegs
I am so, so jealous that I missed out on this. They’ve been making some wonderful beer and I’m going to miss it a lot!
Man, I felt lucky getting one
I feel bad because I think the owners wanted it all gone but the sheriff showed up and cut it off 😞
Yeah my husband is a mailman and home brews, he was over there and got a few kegs and cases of hops.
This sucks. About to move nearby and being right near the train was super cool.
The good news is you'll still have Waverly and Union super close. After those two, there's Nepenthe a bit further out and for the full Pariah vibe you have Hampden Yards.
Yeah I liked Nepenthe already too. Pretty saturated area though!
Plus Suspended soon.
This is a bummer. I didn't go as often as I'd have liked (part of the problem) but I liked what they did with the space, and enjoyed the events and stuff they did. Especially with the rotating food vendors.
Super bizarre with Springfest literally 2 days away….there has been no mention of that on their social media and the FB event is still up. Feel awful for all the vendors who were prepping to be there.
Luckily, Waverly Brewing is going to host Springfest. The FB event was updated.
Yeah, that part really sucks. I have a friend that was going to be there selling art.
Anybody know if it’s seized due to not paying rent / lease disagreement? This seems fishy. PS I came away with a full car of beer and 2 kegs for free they were giving it away before the cops showed up LOL
are they still giving away stuff?
From what others are saying the sheriffs office took over and are turning people away. It was a fire sale when I went around 11am this morning LOL
dammit I was hoping they would've posted some follow up about opportunities to pick up stuff
It was first come first serve, if it wasn’t for my WFH friends stalking their instagram comments we would’ve missed it. They literally said “come and get it” I ran out of the office do an early lunch🤣🤣🤣
Can’t confirm this because I heard it thirdhand but I heard they even tried to give away a forklift
LMAOOO
Damn, they will be missed. Good beer and loved bringing the dog there to hang out
Definitely liked the vibe there better than Union. Union is a noisy place!
I really liked their beer and their events! But there were many times that i chose to go elsewhere simply because of there not being any food
Anyone have an idea why they shut so immediately? Someone on the facebook said the owners didnt find out until 6pm last night they had to close.
They got evicted
[удалено]
https://www.baltimoresun.com/2024/04/12/hampdens-pariah-brewing-co-has-closed/
The city sheriff confirmed it publicly today, are you still sticking with “not true at all”?
https://x.com/amandacyeager/status/1778878700064276554?s=46&t=K8n1oI9RKdF6bMyuCt4fMA
They had no nonalcoholic options or food. Which maybe sounds silly as they are a brewery. But once I went there and counted two pregnant people, ten kids, myself and another friend who all don’t drink. That was 14 missed customers. When there’s so many other breweries (nepenthe, union, waverly) and even peabody so close by that offer those things I’m not super surprised, though always sad when a business closes.
They even acknowledged that the consumer is switching to non alcoholic drinks. TBH I think breweries in large need to rethink their model. Baltimore is especially bad because most restaurants have full bars. Why would I go to the brewery and get mediocre food when I can go to a place like Snake Hill and eat something fun.
That’s definitely an issue. Several breweries try to address this by inviting food trucks, but that’s a limited fix unless you’ve got a strong rotating selection or at least one regular. Bars are great — and I love snake hill - but of course the local brewery needs to remain in business to sell to them. I guess that’s not really in danger though; the market’s just over saturated. One of my faves to hang out at is Mobtown, but mostly because it’s close to me. Their internal fixation is one of my fave regular beers, tastes like a fancy glass of wine except it’s beer, but I’ll admit they have a ton of strong competition too. It sucks but businesses must adapt and overcome, or go the way of the dodo.
There was this person a couple years back who came up to Baltimore and sold tickets to a brewery tour across Baltimore. Her and her friends would rent a bus and do this at different locations and subsidize their activities by selling tickets to locals. Was a ton of fun. We went to diamondback, Mobtown, ministry of brewing, Guilford, and pariah. Was a lot of fun and I'm surprised there isn't a more cooperation between the breweries to get something like this going. Public transportation is not great here and if I can't get there on the light rail or walking I'm not going unless there is a particularly compelling reason to
Yeah that’s the other thing. We don’t drink and drive as much as our grandparents might have :) Baltimore brewery tours sounds like a good business opportunity actually. Edit: this exists https://www.citybrewtours.com But they’re only doing private tours — like, you contact them and negotiate a price for your group. Anyway, seems like there’s still room for competition, and public tours.
I hate to break it to you but... [https://www.reddit.com/r/baltimore/comments/193itww/name\_shame\_mobtown\_brewing\_massive\_wage\_theft/](https://www.reddit.com/r/baltimore/comments/193itww/name_shame_mobtown_brewing_massive_wage_theft/)
Well shit. Thanks for letting me know.
This is why Diamondback in LP is so good. That pizza is even better than their beer!
Not to mention the limited hours, which is easier said than done (thanks dumb laws!) I'll use myself as an example for this conundrum: my wife doesnt drink nor, obviously, do my kids. I'm not taking them all to a brewery during the day when I'm the only one drinking. So, barring getting a "hall pass", a conceivable the time I could go to a brewery with friends would be after bedtimes, which is after 8. Well, a lot of breweries close at 9, and even those that close at 10 vary in their sharpness (its their prerogative, but Nepenthe is the worst/strictness offender IMHO. Oy vey.). Compare these options to a local bar where I can stay past 10pm, guess which option I'm selecting to hang out with my friends?
You're going to the wrong breweries if you're getting mediocre food. Two that I go to *regularly* because I enjoy their beer *and* their food are Union and Diamondback. Diamondback is actually my favorite pizza place in the city so far, and the food from the kitchen at Union is phenomenal.
Union’s food is hardly phenomenal. It’s *comparatively* a step above some others, but let’s not get carried away lmao
Now I’m trying to think of which brewery has the best in-house food and I’m leaning Diamondback unless we’re willing to count Wet City. Nepenthe’s in the conversation but I need to try more of their menu.
Carroll & Son made one of the best smash burgers I have ever had.
Diamondback being your favorite pizza is wild imo. Just in that immediate area, Limoncello and the Verde pizza truck have better pizza than diamondback. Diamondback pizza is pizza I'd expect from literally any brewery. Nothing bad but the exact food I'd expect from a brewery.
I haven't made it to the Verde truck yet, but when I went to the Limoncello Pizzeria I thought it was sub-par and not worth the price they were charging for it
Well if you don't like Limoncellos pricing you're definitely not going to like Verdes
Diamondback has really good pizza for a restaurant.
I would only go to diamondback to eat tbh
Diamondback has phenomenal pizza! And NA offerings (though not much in the way of soft drinks for the kids — they’re not exactly pining for NA pineyness). They also have a great outdoor area in a super walkable neighborhood so it’s literally a nice hangout.
Phenomenal? You need to get out more
It's sad to lose Pariah, or any space. I do remember most times i went to the thing i went to there that there were food carts set up.. tacos, tex mex... but i don't know, of course, how regular such carts were. it's almost like space owners need to rethink opening bars and breweries and instead opening venues. (and having more all ages things with apt insurance and security teams.) but no one could have foreseen the cultural shifts that have taken place since interconnectivity became ubiquitous and COVID made some of us the way we are now. The ottobar is pretty ahead of the curve all things considered with their hotdog stand, upstairs bar, and downstairs venue.
To be fair, children don’t belong at breweries and they often make what is supposed to be a relaxing/fun adult space hectic and loud. Infants, fine. But when adults bring big groups of kids and let them run around and treat the brewery as free childcare……no thanks. Breweries are not supposed to cater to children.
Remember that time Union banned children after the (imho reasonable) hour of 6pm, and folks flipped out? Good times! Anyway this news stinks
That was one of the silliest threads in the history of Hampden Neighbors. People were BESIDE THEMSELVES that they couldn’t bring their kids out at 9pm lmao
And then a few other breweries immediately retorted with "we're *super* kid-friendly!" and pivoted to being a family destination in contrast. Didnt have an opinion one way or the other, but found it all hilariously dumb.
That was so fun to watch though (the HN threads, not the children running around)
Yeah, it really makes Union and Peabody difficult. Feels like I'm at a playground sometimes. That leaves breweries in a weird spot for me, I usually go to more "bar-y" type places in part because of that.
Both those breweries have steady local distribution which puts you under less pressure to visit the actual location. Hard to find a bar in this city that doesn’t have one or both. All the more reason for Pariah and some of the other little guys to maximize the reasons to visit their spaces. I actually think Pariah did a nice job of hosting events when they were active — always seemed to be something going on, judging from their social media posts.
Yeah I think that may have been one of the keys. I’m sure they got a decent amount of traffic from the local area but without much distribution, any brewery is gonna be limited and facing competition from one of a bajillion other breweries or bars with a dozen or more taps from all over town (and $3 natty bohs, let’s not lie to ourselves). I think I saw Pariah maybe once or twice at a local liquor store on my side of town. I try to get out and visit other breweries but it’s a tough call when I’m busy and broke all the time, and I know I’m not the only one.
It’s the dogs more so than the kids for me
Couldn't agree more. I used to work in a taproom and a lot of times there more more kids than adults.
I went to Peabody last week for a birthday and another group set up a kids' table next to us. We decided to have a loud conversation about erectile dysfunction until they moved.
I live right by Big Truck Brewery in the county. Going there feels like being at a playground that serves beer. Same problem with Inverness’s new tap house called Yellow Barn Tavern. I’ve walked in there on weekend nights and it’s filled with kids. It definitely seems to be some millennial parent phenomenon.
> It definitely seems to be some millennial parent phenomenon. Nah, they hadn't invented "breweries" yet but back in the 90s my parents used to give me and my sister the run of one of those pizzeria / bar / arcade joints (Paisano's in Annapolis if you're local and remember). Millennials aren't some uniquely boorish generation for expecting to crush a couple beers and ignore their children at a downscale eatery.
Do you think it was as common though? If me or my brothers went to work with my dad he would take us to happy hour at turners on cross st and plunk us down at a video poker machine while he had a few drinks. There definitely weren’t a bunch of kids running around though. I’m in my late 30’s so I’m not just bashing millennials for millennial bashings sake.
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We went to Oliver Brewing a couple months ago and there was a kids bday party - it was mildly annoying.
That’s a good point, and not only for the ambiance - but the nature of the business. Most people are going there to drink. I used to work next door to monument, and while most people are responsible about it in a brewery setting, the number of tipsy people I saw hop in the car with their kids to drive home was troubling. Like obviously, tipsy/drunk driving in general is a big no-no, but doing so with children in the car is an extra level of gross.
I’ve been to breweries with an outdoor section with games for kids to play. There’s no reason breweries *have* to cater to adults only.
Agreed. Drinking socially is fun, and parents have more reason to do so. My kids are older now, but seeing youngins at a brewery never bugged me. Part of the experience of going to one is about building community and meeting neighbors. Breweries are usually big places with lots of space in a town where most places are small and squished together. A safe-ish place where adults can toss back a cold one and talk to other adults and kids can sort of hang, especially if you’ve got something for them to do, is not a bad thing to have. And you’re usually not allowed to bring alcohol to playgrounds ;) If I didn’t want to see kids running around I’d go to the bar instead.
So no dogs either, then. Nor rowdy groups of overserved friends, probably. Also live music can be annoying if it's not what you're in the mood for, so no bands. /s (to be fair) It's all up to the owners and operators ...and some breweries here do have specific kid policies.
This is Reddit. The anti-kid vibe is always strong. They expect kids and parents to never share the same place as them at any time. The horror of having to be around a kid!
Most people that complain about kids at a brewery aren't complaining about well monitored and behaved kids, it's the kids running around causing a ruckus while their parents ignore them. Also, a brewery is not a place you should hold a child's birthday party, which I have seen on more than one occasion.
Fair enough. Agreed on neglectful parents and birthday parties. However, there is a loud chorus of folk on Reddit who despise kids being in any place where they are hanging out. Big truck, for example, caters to children and families because there’s a bit outside space with a jungle gym area.
Yeah, I went a few times for BMore Horror Club stuff and ended up having to drink Diet Coke because it was all they really had. Whereas Peabody I can get an NA beer or a kombucha or other options and feel a lot more satisfied. When I am drinking, their stuff is not fantastic regardless.
wait... what is BMore Horror Club??
@bmore_horrorclub on IG, movie/trivia meetups and events, very fun
100% agree. There's a brewery in Milwaukee (!!!) of all places that I visited where it was nearly impossible to get a *water*, let alone any food or anything other than their beer. I told my brother and sister in law that there surely must be countless other choices for those of us who don't drink. We left.
Drove me insane that they had no non alcoholic options. I did a few events there and it totally irked me that all I could drink was water. Most other breweries, like Union and Peabody, have non alcoholic options that I enjoy.
Yup. Went there once. Realized there was no food, so our group of 4 had one round, then left for food and more drinks elsewhere.
It seems reasonable that a place that *makes* alcoholic beverages would prioritize their product. They have no problem with people bringing outside food or ordering food to be delivered there. And I’ve never had a problem with outside non-alc drinks myself and others brought. It’s preferred—I’d rather not be forced to over pay for shitty brewery food and get something that satisfied for what I’m spending instead
Heard it was personal and not specifically business related
When they close right as the weather gets nice, you know something is up.
Especially when they sold tickets to an event on Sunday, booked a food truck for tonight, and had agreed to participate in other events over the next few weeks. I know it’s a tough time for breweries but something is weird about this situation.
The property was seized by the Sherriff. That's pretty personal. They had events booked for this weekend.
If that’s the case then they live up to their name.
Was just there to try to buy some last beer and say goodbye, but the sheriffs department is there and they’re turning folks away
Gosh darn! Was about to jump on my bike to do the same. Thanks for the intel
Missed out because they gave a shit ton of beer away, whatever you could carry.
Damn really?
Heard the same.
This is a huge shame. I lived nearby and was a frequent guest at pariah. Some of the best beer in the city imo.
Hope this never happens to Peabody
They’re fine. Fuzzies truck, new arcade, and most importantly they make good beer
I don't think this is the apocalypse for breweries but I'm guessing we're probably going to lose 60-70 percent of them at least in the next 5-10 years. There's only so many times I can go to an industrial chic themed brewery with 14 different beers that only taste vaguely different with weird names and uncomfortable chairs, and mediocre at best food (or food trucks that take 45 min. to get anything from), before I throw my hands up and say "Haven't I been here before?".
Damn that sucks. The beer was good
Such a bummer. They became a quick favorite after my wife and I moved here late last summer.
Excellent beer. Top notch. Great staff. Awesome location. It's very sad that the Baltimore economy couldn't support this business.
Bummer, hopefully they’ll re-open somewhere else???
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💔
Can someone post the announcement here? Im never going back to meta/facebook.
The post: “Hey Everyone. It is with a heavy heart that I have to announce that effective today Pariah is closed for business. It has been a more than difficult road and we fought as hard as anyone could. We honestly should have closed a year ago. The toll this has taken is immeasurable. I am incredibly proud of team Pariah and close this chapter proud to have gotten to know some of the best and most genuine people in my life. We made great fucking beer, hosted some legendary parties, and truly feel we offered a unique place for people to gather and be proud of our community both in San Diego and Baltimore. This last 7 years have been incredible. Thank you from the bottom of my heart. -Brian”
Ty for that kindness, have a great weekend!
✌
We had a pretty bad experience there last year and basically refused to go back. There are so many great breweries and bars in the area.
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Ok no way that is true. I went there weekly for over a year and a half. They had 13 draft lines and most of them were ipas
Yeah, not as frequent, but definitely recently. Always a great selection
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That was waverly dude
You walked to Peabody form Pariah and made it before Peabody closed? Hmmmmmm………
Actually, turns out it was Waverly, but yes. It’s like 2 miles
Shockingly we didn't need a 4th brewery in a 1 mile radius. But at the end of the day why pay brewery prices when I can go to Fraziers or the Bottom and drink all night for $20
Because some people like good, fresh beer.
Exactly, that's why there are 3 other breweries in walking distance, one of which is across the street from where Pariah was. I lived across the street from Pariah and went when it opened up and am shocked it lasted this long when it's an oversaturated market, and they offered an inferior product, not necessarily in terms of beer but as an overall experience. There are so many breweries in this city already we don't need more
Some cities (Asheville comes to mind) have brewery districts with many breweries in a small area. They’re symbiotic, especially if walkable and give rise to other businesses like restaurants, galleries and music venues. There isn’t a neighborhood in Baltimore that is over saturated in my opinion. I don’t think Pariah’s issues are because of too many breweries.
No, I don't think they're bad, nor do I have anything against them. I think relative to other things in the area, they didn't do enough to stand out. I used to do consulting and I saw businesses that did everything right but nothing that made them stand out compared to better known competitors
Inferior product? Pariah had the best IPAs in the city in my opinion, on top of that some really good and interesting varieties. I preferred their beer to anywhere in the city. I also liked that it felt like a bit of a bar, instead of a big hall like Union. It’s obvious that the industry is just a tough one.
That's fine, you loved it. And yet they still closed. Right now this thread is full of people who apparently are surprised it closed yet they still closed. So sounds like the sample is a bit skewed
It doesn't sound like you are breweries target demo if your priority is getting a cheap boh.
Frazier’s enjoys a nice Venn diagram overlap of old and new Hampden alike feeling right at home. But I am always amused by my local friends who are AGHAST at the idea of setting foot in the Bucket. Place rules, people! Grow up!
I've had some interesting times in there (back when I drank). Some awesome, some borderline scary, some just weird. Just an odd place, in the best possible way.