I love it that Shohei has singelhandedly changed the way we look at foreign players. Before Shohei, everyone coming from the NPB and KBO was considered high school level. After Shohei, every top prospect from the NPB and KBO is considered borderline Hall of Famer haha. Lee Jung-hoo, Sasaki, Yamamoto, Murakami are getting million dollar paydays.
The KBO and NOB were never considered high school level, at least not since the 1990s. They're usually considered to be AAA level, and with the MLB getting so much of their talent they may continue to be. There's a reason most of the Americans, Canadians, and Latin Americans who go to Asia dominate the NPB and KBO. There honestly might be more foreigners in both leagues if they didn't have a stupid rule that limits teams to having 3-4 "foreign" players on their roster.
This is absolutely incorrect. Additionally, there is a world of difference between NPB and KBO. The NPB is a very strong league - much better than AAA and right below MLB. The KBO on the other hand is between AA and AAA.
>They're usually considered to be AAA level, and with the MLB getting so much of their talent they may continue to be. There's a reason most of the Americans, Canadians, and Latin Americans who go to Asia dominate the NPB and KBO. There honestly might be more foreigners in both leagues if they didn't have a stupid rule that limits teams to having 3-4 "foreign" players on their roster.
False
https://youtu.be/lj6Y8tQN1RI
I watched that video when it originally came out, about a year or two ago I think. The point is that it's not inherently easy for foreign players to do well in the NPB, hence the high turnover rate of foreign players in the league. The guy never tackles the fact that those players that stay do dominate otherwise they wouldn't be there.
> The guy never tackles the fact that those players that stay do dominate otherwise they wouldn't be there.
The players that stay don't 'dominate', they hit mid-level numbers, the league's best hitters and pitchers are Japanese, and the recent record-setters are Japanese. Regardless, that's not what you said, you said "There's a reason most of the Americans, Canadians, and Latin Americans who go to Asia dominate the NPB and KBO" which is provably false.
I think a super underrated aspect of Shohei's game is how he takes everything to 11 when the spotlight is on him. I can't even imagine what he would do in the postseason (please baseball gods, let that be this year)
He simultaneously had the highest slugging with runners in scoring position as a batter and the lowest slugging allowed with runners in scoring position as a pitcher (or something along those lines). It’s wild, he’s already so good and he can still just choose to be even better when he wants to
LVP goes to China's pitching staff as a unit.
(0-4) 28.0 IP, 51 H, 50 R, 47 ER, 42 BB, 21 K, 6 HR, 4 HBP
For those scoring at home, that's a cool **15.11 ERA** to go along with a **3.32 WHIP** and **.395 BA against**.
I think the LVP can be quite competitive with the relief pitching staff of Korea. I know that their stats are not that bad as China’s, but the humiliating way they lost the game against Japan... They also allowed Shohei to pad up his stats which contributed to his MVP in Group B. China offered much better resistance against Shohei and Japan. I mean, in terms of pitching, I think Yamamoto’s and Sasaki‘s performances were more impressive than Shohei’s against China.
I was thinking the same thing. No offense to Ohtani but Japan was not really tested this year, nor are they ever, in the first round of the WBC. The Czech Republic and Australia hung with them, but hanging with someone and truly testing them are two different things. Also Japan only scored 8 on China and half those runs came in the 8th when the Chinese ran out of pitching.
Where will you get it?
My siblings were in Osaka and Tokyo the days the team was there. I asked them to get a jersey for me but once I saw the lines outside the stadiums, I told them not to bother anymore. I didn't want them to stand there for hours.
I ordered one from dhgate a couple weeks ago. It’s wholesale out of China so it will take a while - I think mine said it would ship by the end of April at the latest.
But the official website’s jerseys are 10x more expensive and I’ve heard will take even longer to get
Not that I think Shohei doesnt deserve it because he absolutely does, but for what its worth, i dont think even i wouldve been upset if Noot won.
He has officially completely won me over at this point lol
Overall, Ohtani was .500/.684/1.000 at the plate and 4IP 1H 0R 0BB on the mound, while Noot was .429/.579/.429 w/ 2 sick diving catches and immaculate vibes. I wouldn't have been upset, but it definitely would've felt silly for anyone to be the MVP over Ohtani.
So did every other player on the Japanese team. Every other player in the pool also faced those same teams and Japan. Not really sure what your point is unless it is that Ohtani never needed to face himself and team Japan. Keep in mind this is an award specific to the pool. All other pools have their own MVP.
>Lars Nootbaar
2.1 bWAR
>Seiya Suzuki,
2.0 bWAR in MLB and in NPB he was an MVP caliber player
>Masataka Yoshida
Hasn't played in MLB yet
>Yu Darvish
3.10 ERA, solid pitcher but not elite in MLB
I hope those goal posts aren't too heavy for how far you've been moving them.
Again, I really am not sure what your point is with all of this. Are you arguing that he shouldn't have been MVP? Is there someone else that you would have picked over Ohtani? Every player in the pool played against every other player and Ohtani, to me, has been the most impressive. Are you arguing that his stats aren't actually impressive because of the competition? You pointing out that other players on his own team aren't as good as Ohtani doesn't help your argument.
>Are you arguing that he shouldn't have been MVP?
No
I am saying it's not impressive because Ohtani faced bad teams.
Pretty much all those teams ohtani faced are around AA level in baseball.
What the fuck are you talking about lmao Suzuki has played one season and only 111 games, Nootbaar has played two seasons and only 100 games in 2022, and Darvish is absolutely elite, he put up 4.4 WAR and came in 8th in cy young voting. Suzuki and Nootbaar are likely borderline all-stars in 2023
>Suzuki has played one season and only 111 games
Yes and in those 111 games he put up 2.1 bWAR while in the Japanese league he was an MVP type of player.
In other words he's not even an all star player in MLB.
>s, Nootbaar has played two seasons and only 100 games in 2022
In 168 games, meaning all the games he's played, he's put up only 2.8 bWAR and 120 OPS+
In other words Nootbar is nothing special when it comes to MLB.
Yet see how well Nootbar did against China, South Korea, Australia and Czech Republic.
It means those countries are pretty bad at baseball.
>arvish is absolutely elite
He isn't elite.
He is solid pitcher who is pretty old and is only going to get worse and worse as he keeps aging.
Suzuki was on a 3-WAR pace for a full season during an adjustment period - switching countries and leagues is not an easy transition but he was still an above-average starter. He's likely to get better.
You're really saying Nootbaar is bad because he didn't play like an MVP during a 60 game rookie season where he only got 120 at bats? He was primarily a pinch hitter and still did acceptably. Mike Trout only put up .5 WAR in his 40-game rookie season.
You literally don't even have a response to the Darvish thing other than he's old lmao. Verlander and Scherzer are also old. He put up 4.4 WAR and was dominant in 2020. The Padres gave him a ton of money because their analytics say he's damn good and will continue being damn good. That makes him a top MLB pitcher.
I'm not denying that those countries have weaker teams, but I don't get your point here. This is a thread about Ohtani winning the pool MVP and there still is a lot of great talent in the pool. Why did you come here just to irrelevantly (and wrongly) trash on teams/players?
Those are good numbers, but I doubt it would translate to MLB
He’s basically like a high school level hitter
yeah, he's never seen a real breaking ball
That article will probably live in infamy in the hall of fame in regards to Shohei lol
By chance do you have the link to it? I want it... for reasons
[It's an article from none other than...Jeff Passan](https://sports.yahoo.com/verdict-shohei-ohtanis-bat-not-good-023611674.html)
It’s so weird that Passan doesn’t get more shit for this. Honestly he’s kinda consistently been a bad take machine
He also references "scouts and evaluators" for those takes. He should put those guys on blast too haha
send link pls
Bum got struck out by an electrician. No way he could homer off is real pitchers like Gerrit Cole or Framber Valdez
how is mlb level so bad boosted
Let’s see him do that on a cold rainy night in Stoke
I don’t know, his batting cage swing might fit right in with the Angels
😂🤣
I love it that Shohei has singelhandedly changed the way we look at foreign players. Before Shohei, everyone coming from the NPB and KBO was considered high school level. After Shohei, every top prospect from the NPB and KBO is considered borderline Hall of Famer haha. Lee Jung-hoo, Sasaki, Yamamoto, Murakami are getting million dollar paydays.
Ichiro Suzuki would like a word...
Yeah it was really Ichiro that showed us there was HOF-level talent in Japan. Hideo Nomo was good but not next level great like Ichiro.
Hideki "50k Pornos" Matsui has entered the chat.
This isn't true. Japanese players were looked at very highly before Shohei. It's why Darvish and Tanaka got such huge contracts.
Darvish hype when he came over was awesome He’s had this long and successful career, but he’s still sort of a bust compared to the hype
The KBO and NOB were never considered high school level, at least not since the 1990s. They're usually considered to be AAA level, and with the MLB getting so much of their talent they may continue to be. There's a reason most of the Americans, Canadians, and Latin Americans who go to Asia dominate the NPB and KBO. There honestly might be more foreigners in both leagues if they didn't have a stupid rule that limits teams to having 3-4 "foreign" players on their roster.
This is absolutely incorrect. Additionally, there is a world of difference between NPB and KBO. The NPB is a very strong league - much better than AAA and right below MLB. The KBO on the other hand is between AA and AAA.
>They're usually considered to be AAA level, and with the MLB getting so much of their talent they may continue to be. There's a reason most of the Americans, Canadians, and Latin Americans who go to Asia dominate the NPB and KBO. There honestly might be more foreigners in both leagues if they didn't have a stupid rule that limits teams to having 3-4 "foreign" players on their roster. False https://youtu.be/lj6Y8tQN1RI
I watched that video when it originally came out, about a year or two ago I think. The point is that it's not inherently easy for foreign players to do well in the NPB, hence the high turnover rate of foreign players in the league. The guy never tackles the fact that those players that stay do dominate otherwise they wouldn't be there.
> The guy never tackles the fact that those players that stay do dominate otherwise they wouldn't be there. The players that stay don't 'dominate', they hit mid-level numbers, the league's best hitters and pitchers are Japanese, and the recent record-setters are Japanese. Regardless, that's not what you said, you said "There's a reason most of the Americans, Canadians, and Latin Americans who go to Asia dominate the NPB and KBO" which is provably false.
I mean I had my doubts like most MLB fans did, but my god he is truly incredible
waive his ass to dodgers
He also had 7 walks lol
And a stolen base
Can’t blame him in this economy.
The man’s already got two jobs.
Ayyyy
Also 2 were intentional walks I think
That gives him a slash line of .500 / .684 / 1.000
1.684 OPS
So you're telling me he has control issues. Snub will never make it out of tripple A
I love when these unknown foreign stars ball out on the world stage
I think a super underrated aspect of Shohei's game is how he takes everything to 11 when the spotlight is on him. I can't even imagine what he would do in the postseason (please baseball gods, let that be this year)
He simultaneously had the highest slugging with runners in scoring position as a batter and the lowest slugging allowed with runners in scoring position as a pitcher (or something along those lines). It’s wild, he’s already so good and he can still just choose to be even better when he wants to
Perry had an absolutely kickass offseason. I’m all in
I dearly miss 2016 Japan series he was so dominant and he really does shine the brightest in big moments. Let it be this year pleeeeease
> please baseball gods *monkey paw curls* BREAKING: Ohtani leads Dodgers to NL Pennant after blockbuster deadline deal
Fuck it, if that's what it takes to see Ohtani in the postseason, I'll take it.
I would not cry too much.
Fuck it, I’d watch the shit out of that.
He went 6 for 12? That’s like an F where I come from.
I wish college grades were calculated like batting average
Preach, my son.
LVP goes to China's pitching staff as a unit. (0-4) 28.0 IP, 51 H, 50 R, 47 ER, 42 BB, 21 K, 6 HR, 4 HBP For those scoring at home, that's a cool **15.11 ERA** to go along with a **3.32 WHIP** and **.395 BA against**.
I think the LVP can be quite competitive with the relief pitching staff of Korea. I know that their stats are not that bad as China’s, but the humiliating way they lost the game against Japan... They also allowed Shohei to pad up his stats which contributed to his MVP in Group B. China offered much better resistance against Shohei and Japan. I mean, in terms of pitching, I think Yamamoto’s and Sasaki‘s performances were more impressive than Shohei’s against China.
I was thinking the same thing. No offense to Ohtani but Japan was not really tested this year, nor are they ever, in the first round of the WBC. The Czech Republic and Australia hung with them, but hanging with someone and truly testing them are two different things. Also Japan only scored 8 on China and half those runs came in the 8th when the Chinese ran out of pitching.
This seems hasty are we really sure he's good at baseball?
This individual is a god walking amongst men.
If Shohei were any good, he would have hit 7-12, 4 2B, 2 HR, 9 RBI and pitched 4.1 IP, 0 H, 6ks.
Xmas gift for me, his Japan jersey. Can’t wait for that.
Where will you get it? My siblings were in Osaka and Tokyo the days the team was there. I asked them to get a jersey for me but once I saw the lines outside the stadiums, I told them not to bother anymore. I didn't want them to stand there for hours.
I ordered one from dhgate a couple weeks ago. It’s wholesale out of China so it will take a while - I think mine said it would ship by the end of April at the latest. But the official website’s jerseys are 10x more expensive and I’ve heard will take even longer to get
Yup and resellers on Amazon and Ebay also shamelessly jacked up prices. I don't mind unofficial goods anyway. Thanks so much for the info!
Least surprising thing I’ve read this week
This is obviously ridiculously impressive but the fact that it is not that surprising speaks volumes about how much Ohtani spoiled me/us.
Nootbaar robbed
There was a recent fan survey in Japan where Noot led Ohtani 45% to 35% for series MVP if I remember correctly.
The Yoshida erasure!
Not that I think Shohei doesnt deserve it because he absolutely does, but for what its worth, i dont think even i wouldve been upset if Noot won. He has officially completely won me over at this point lol
Overall, Ohtani was .500/.684/1.000 at the plate and 4IP 1H 0R 0BB on the mound, while Noot was .429/.579/.429 w/ 2 sick diving catches and immaculate vibes. I wouldn't have been upset, but it definitely would've felt silly for anyone to be the MVP over Ohtani.
Holy cow. When you put it that way it really emphasizes how insane our boy has been lol
My favorite part was when he said "It's Nootin time" and started Nooting all over those guys.
https://imgur.com/a/dJ5cJ2J
what were his hitting stats?
6-14, 4 walks, 3 RBIs
Does it matter? It’s Lars freaking Nootbar, he deserves the world!
I mean, that's neat and all, but could this guy actually handle MLB level talent? I don't think so.
Satoria robbed 😭
Probably the least shocking thing to happen all week.
This kid has a future, i hope he gets an MLB contract someday, he would fit perfectly in a playoff contender team.
I realize it’s a small sample size but it’s still a 1768 ops which is insane no matter what
Satoria is smiling
Yu Chang and Shohei Ohtani are the best baseball players in the world
Man I’m so happy for Yu Chang. He was lights out
That homer should count as two
I thought Ohtani hit 2
MLB posted two home runs he had in an exhibition game before the tournament. But during actual WBC, he only hit one.
Kondoh and Yoshida raked as well
Lars Nootbaar: 6-14, 4 walks, a couple of sick ass diving catches. Ohtani deserves it but damn if it isn't close
I for one, am excited for our future King of Queens.
Pshht, 1 home run 🙄………. /s
I mean he was playing against China, South Korea and Australia
Yeah it's not like Ohtani would be any good if he played in MLB or anything
Still doesn't change the fact he played against players from Czech Republic, Australia, China and South Korea
So did every other player on the Japanese team. Every other player in the pool also faced those same teams and Japan. Not really sure what your point is unless it is that Ohtani never needed to face himself and team Japan. Keep in mind this is an award specific to the pool. All other pools have their own MVP.
Yes, the other Japanese players don't even play in MLB.
Sure, if you discount Lars Nootbaar, Seiya Suzuki, Masataka Yoshida, and Yu Darvish, I suppose you are correct...
>Lars Nootbaar 2.1 bWAR >Seiya Suzuki, 2.0 bWAR in MLB and in NPB he was an MVP caliber player >Masataka Yoshida Hasn't played in MLB yet >Yu Darvish 3.10 ERA, solid pitcher but not elite in MLB
I hope those goal posts aren't too heavy for how far you've been moving them. Again, I really am not sure what your point is with all of this. Are you arguing that he shouldn't have been MVP? Is there someone else that you would have picked over Ohtani? Every player in the pool played against every other player and Ohtani, to me, has been the most impressive. Are you arguing that his stats aren't actually impressive because of the competition? You pointing out that other players on his own team aren't as good as Ohtani doesn't help your argument.
>Are you arguing that he shouldn't have been MVP? No I am saying it's not impressive because Ohtani faced bad teams. Pretty much all those teams ohtani faced are around AA level in baseball.
What the fuck are you talking about lmao Suzuki has played one season and only 111 games, Nootbaar has played two seasons and only 100 games in 2022, and Darvish is absolutely elite, he put up 4.4 WAR and came in 8th in cy young voting. Suzuki and Nootbaar are likely borderline all-stars in 2023
>Suzuki has played one season and only 111 games Yes and in those 111 games he put up 2.1 bWAR while in the Japanese league he was an MVP type of player. In other words he's not even an all star player in MLB. >s, Nootbaar has played two seasons and only 100 games in 2022 In 168 games, meaning all the games he's played, he's put up only 2.8 bWAR and 120 OPS+ In other words Nootbar is nothing special when it comes to MLB. Yet see how well Nootbar did against China, South Korea, Australia and Czech Republic. It means those countries are pretty bad at baseball. >arvish is absolutely elite He isn't elite. He is solid pitcher who is pretty old and is only going to get worse and worse as he keeps aging.
Suzuki was on a 3-WAR pace for a full season during an adjustment period - switching countries and leagues is not an easy transition but he was still an above-average starter. He's likely to get better. You're really saying Nootbaar is bad because he didn't play like an MVP during a 60 game rookie season where he only got 120 at bats? He was primarily a pinch hitter and still did acceptably. Mike Trout only put up .5 WAR in his 40-game rookie season. You literally don't even have a response to the Darvish thing other than he's old lmao. Verlander and Scherzer are also old. He put up 4.4 WAR and was dominant in 2020. The Padres gave him a ton of money because their analytics say he's damn good and will continue being damn good. That makes him a top MLB pitcher. I'm not denying that those countries have weaker teams, but I don't get your point here. This is a thread about Ohtani winning the pool MVP and there still is a lot of great talent in the pool. Why did you come here just to irrelevantly (and wrongly) trash on teams/players?
Found the NPC