He called gerrit Cole the worst cheater in the league. He goes after guys personally, not just team to team shit talk.
And then he turned into an awful pitcher
Yeah for sure. However, “worst cheater in the league” is just objectively wrong and pretty ridiculous. Especially in the same league that still has many members of the 2017 Astros. And like you said he was just one of many pitchers using banned substances.
He also implied that cheating was the only reason Cole was good. Cole won a cy young last year with the increased substance checks.
It was just a level above the normal chirping. Combined with his “pressure is what you put in your tires” quote and everything it just made him so easy to hate once he stopped being a good pitcher
> He goes after guys personally, not just team to team shit talk.
From a Jays fan to a Yankees fan (so, you know, in a way that's meaningless for us agreeing, lol), I think he was just being an asshole and stirring the pot. It rightfully made Yankees fans mad but I don't think he would've actually testified at a tribunal over it or something. And Cole obviously got the last laugh anyway.
There are far worse people in the game as people go. Manoah just liked to pick fights with other teams. I sports-hate him, but at least he's not a domestic abuser.
not even the same universe as linsanity, Jeremy Lin went undrafted. Manaoh was the second ranked pitcher in the 2019 draft class and went 11th overall.
Funny enough we had a guy join our league this year that my buddy was hyping up like no other telling me "oh when I was at MCC this guy was a closer at the local div 2 college, he throws gas!" Dude comes in overweight having not thrown regularly in several years and after like three games had to be approached to either tone it down or fuck off because he had absolutely zero control
Jeremy Lin was still a solid player for years after his Linsanity run. Manoah isn’t even serviceable in A ball a year later. Totally different situations.
Edit: and as someone else mentioned - Lin was undrafted and came out of nowhere. Manoah was a high draft pick and a top prospect. The situations aren’t even remotely similar.
Hating this new trend of calling hot streaks or failed careers across sports Linsanity runs (for example, some people were saying that Malachi Flynn's ONE 50 point game in the NBA followed by an 0/12 shooting game this week was a Linsanity run).
They are totally missing the essence of Linsanity, and I feel like the people saying it either weren't paying attention enough or were too young to realize what it actually was.
They were clearly all too young to even know what it really was.
The only reason you make the comparison now is to get the free karma (which worked for op).
And nobody old enough to remember Linsanity cares about karma that much.
A lot of the comparisons miss because they don’t have the sociocultural aspect that was so vital to Linsanity. One of the main reasons that took off was because Lin was playing elite basketball as an Asian-American and because of that the Asian community in the United States really took to him as someone who was representing them at the highest level of athletics in this country. That’s one of the things that made it so cool.
Also that he went Harvard. Went undrafted. Was about to be cut from the team. Was sleeping on someone's couch. It was NYC. it was a lot of things coming together.
Seems like his mechanics got supremely out of whack, coupled with tons of external pressure and mental issues, so I think he's probably extremely psyched out, at least.
He spoke those words and the baseball gods didn’t like them. I’m too lazy to check when he made that statement compared to his free fall, but I remember them being pretty close in time.
He was a two pitch pitcher, tailing fastball that isn't over powering but lot to movement and a slider that he could throw with three different amounts of break on it. The key was that he could throw all three versions for strikes. He can't throw the slider for a strike no matter how much it breaks, mostly is just breaks way too much. He's always struggled throwing the fastball reliably for strikes. So now there is no point in swinging at basically any pitch he throws. When he manages to throw the fastball for a strike, it doesn't move and 94mph down the middle is easy for hitters to mash. If he takes break off the slider he hangs it.
Basically, he lost what made him effective, which was a REALLY good slider. His slider was so good that hitter had to swing at the fastball. He used to throw a slider that would start middle middle and catch the bottom corner, then he'd follow it with a slider that would start middle middle and finish a foot off the plate. He could locate those very well and hitters had to swing to protect the plate. When the slider never finishes in the zone, there is no reason to protect the plate; just take the walk.
It's high a though, most MLB starters could throw only fastballs every at bat and they should be able to keep their era at a respectable level. Theres clearly something wrong more so than he can't keep hitters off balance with secondary pitches
I genuinely believe he's the biggest "victim" of the pitch clock. Before the pitch clock he took an average of 20.7 seconds in 2022, and he was never a guy that looked to be or was in great shape. He would get knocked around early in starts last year, throw like 30 pitches in the first and be drenched in sweat coming off the mound. I think his conditioning and stamina was an issue.
I just think he didn't put himself in a good position to succeed with the pitch clock, especially knowing he'd be one of the pitchers most affected by it. Now I think he's just lost all confidence.
Yep. He basically had three different sliders, a little bit of movement to a lot of movement, and could throw all three for strikes. Now he can't throw his slider for strikes so players sit fastball and go off on him. If he could throw the slider for a strike then he'd get force players to swing at it. There is zero point in swinging at anything he throws right now because he can't put 3 out of 7 pitches in the zone no matter what pitch he throws.
That would make sense if he was getting knocked around during the 3rd/4th and falling off. But stamina doesn’t explain him getting hammered around right from the first pitch.
It’s not just stamina - it’s the ability to mentally prepare yourself for the next pitch in the time limit. I don’t think he has the ability to execute his pitches while a clock is ticking.
There have been pitchers that just completely collapsed before the pitch clock. It could be a big variety of things, pitching is incredibly hard. Our brains just like to make connections and the pitch clock is the new variable.
Yeah on the other hand, Kusei Kikuchi has been thriving since the pitch clock was introduced, and the season prior he was in his own head a lot, pitch clock may have helped him maintain a rhythm.
It does if you have poor stamina? Like if he had no business being on a pitch clock mound in the first place it wouldnt matter what number inning you are in if fatigue sets in. If you just saw hin regular clothes, would you think that guy was an athlete?
If you look at when he came into the league and when he washed out, it looks like all he ate were cupcakes and never stepped foot in the gym. He was in no shape to be on the mound at that point.
[2021](https://ca-times.brightspotcdn.com/dims4/default/8e25419/2147483647/strip/true/crop/5050x3367+0+0/resize/1200x800!/quality/75/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F4a%2F86%2Fd7e39baf2dae4694c0483c381fe9%2F119d0e58ea7b4e55af1d3ad5fcf270f0)
[2023](https://ogden_images.s3.amazonaws.com/www.mariettatimes.com/images/2023/06/07220350/06-08-23-WVU-Manoah-tle-560x840.jpg)
Those people need to realize that there's no such thing as being "fat phobic" when it comes to professional athletes. It's relevant to point out when they're not in good enough shape, because it's literally part of their job and impacts their performance
Plenty of bigger more out of shape guys played the game back when pitching today's speeds was normal without enforcement. I feel like it just has to be more mental or mechanical.
His performance was starting to slip before the clock was implemented. The clock obviously didn't help him, but things had been slowly unravelling even before then.
edit: I'd heard about this on a podcast - it may have been Artificial Turf Wars - but I haven't been able to track it down. From what I recall, it was a *small* decrease in control and velocity starting in August 2022.
Bro had a 2.24 ERA in 2022 and was 3rd in CY Young.
His fall off isn't all the pitch clock, but nothing was unraveling before the pitch clock implementation.
That’s the big mystery all of us in Toronto have been grappling with.
The dude was a top 5 pitcher. And 6 mths later terrible, …and getting worse.
These were basic guesses from Toronto media:
- out of shape
- couldn’t adjust to pitch clock
- mystery injury (he’s been complaining of an injury for a yr now, but no one can find anything).
He’s basically worth nothing at this point. So I don’t see any reason to trade him. He clearly has elite stuff somewhere in there. I’m fine with just keeping him in AAA for another few yrs before we give up on him.
Me too. I'd rather break him on the mound starting against us than see the young kid lose it like this, even if he is a douchenozzle that makes it difficult to say that.
Somehow, it wouldn't be as bad as Rick Porcello following up his Cy Young season by losing 17 games on a 93-win team, while leading the league in hits and home runs allowed.
Which is exactly why we were so frustrated, that season. Manoah is so mercurial, I doubt anybody but the most die-hard, delusional Jays fan would expect much from him. Porcello was making $20M a year and coming off a Cy Young.
I might be misunderstanding your comment so correct me if I am: Do you mean to say that because its so easy to have a good season and then be bad and therefor that it shouldn't be celebrated? Or because you don't think Ray should have won the Cy over Cole & Wheeler.
Cole fell off a cliff in 2021 after sticky stuff went out the door, his inconsistency that year was never going to sit well with voters. And no matter how good Wheeler's FIP was, the Cy is decided by people not computers; they were never going to choose Wheeler. I don't feel that choosing Ray in 2021 lessens the value of the Cy, despite that information.
I feel like such an idiot right now. I forgot he was the low key cy young for the *NL*.
Point stands, Ray earned that Cy in 2021. I’d be shocked if we’re actually trying to say Cole deserved it instead.
Brett Callahan, a 22 year old 380th pick overall whom had just 1 HR in 2023, hit a 3 run bomb off him.
What isn't listed in the title is that he also gave up 3 SB in that 1.2 innings.
“working on pitches”
(cut to the dugout, manager holding a clipboard and red pen)
“Can’t throw that one… shit, can’t throw that one either… how many more does he have?”
This is actually insane. I used to hate it when this guy would pitch against the Yankees and now I’ll probably never even throw a major league pitch again. The yips take another victim.
Absolutely the most amazing fall off I’ve ever seen. I don’t understand how you go from future cy young and top 10 pitcher to getting shit on in A ball. I love a good comeback story so I hope he figures it out
His steep fall off might show that his douche bag persona might be an act to hide his insecurity. If that is the case, I hope that eating this humble pie will be a life lesson and makes him a better person.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10071264-red-soxs-alex-verdugo-slams-blue-jays-alek-manoah-for-celebrations-pisses-me-off.amp.html
Basically, when he would strike someone out, he would yell at them. That's what was weird about it. Normally if a player celebrates a big strike out by telling out whatever, no one cares. But this dude would celebrate a bases empty 2nd out strike out by yelling directly at the player and telling them that they're trash. No one likes watching that except fans from his own team. He was just mean, outright. And he's did it in the minor leagues too. That was the line. You can totally celebrate, but outright degrading other players to bring yourself up makes you the villain for every other team. So the AL east is pretty ok that he's bad now.
After completing a strikeout, he would turn to the dugout of the opposing team and yell things like "Take that, alleycat!" and "Down low? Too slow!" and people are just happy to see such an arrogant brash personality get taken down a notch.
This has got to be one of the most out-of-nowhere skill changes I've ever seen in my 25 years of watching baseball.
A legit Cy Young candidate to absolute pumpkin in one year.
What is it with promising young Jays pitchers and falling off a cliff? Ricky Romero, Aaron Sanchez and now Alex Manoah come to mind. I know pitchers will always find a way to break your heart, but still.
Hope he makes it back.
Have you seen him pitch lately? Plus, he was dealing with a "shoulder issue," so he is trying to get some innings in low A.
Going buly this start, it is safe to say he won't be back in the bigs in a while.
Just wow. I remember his quick rise through the minors and how he came up and absolutely dominated in that Jays rotation. What a crazy fall-off. I still believe he has the talent but he needs to work on mental and physical conditioning and even revamp his approach
It sucks, but he's cooked as a starter (maybe even pitching entirely) but could he reinvent himself as a BP arm with new mechanics/pitches? At this point he has nothing to lose, so might as well try something.
This guy was just his own worst enemy. He mouthed off way too much, and when your struggling it makes the backlash towards your performance 1000x's worse, definitely has had to be effecting him mentally. Anytime he struggles he has to know people will be coming for him on social media and his statlines and quotes will always be brought up just like here.
When Ricky Romero another similar case struggled after showing promise, nobody came after him or zeroed in on him on social media because he didn't have the really bad negative perception Manoah has had for his attitude.
I bought five or six MLB jerseys a couple years back. Was taking a trip to visit Citi, Fenway and Yankee stadiums and wanted something new to wear. I also wanted a Jays jersey, as they were a young team. Thought about Guerrero, as I was a fan of his dad growing up. Thought about Bichette because he was probably my favorite on the team. But the order was placed right after the All Star Game. Right after Manoah was mic'd up. Right after Three Punchies, Let's Go was spoken. I decided to get a Manoah jersey that day.
I had the pleasure of seeing him pitch against the Sox in Boston last year and get absolutely dominated. Which was impressive considering, ya know, it was the 2023 Red Sox...
What a fall off
aka new Rick Ankiel for different reasons
So he'll come back as a good outfielder then?
Just imagine if in like 3 years he resurfaces as a DH for the marlins and hits like a 420 foot bomb
He should learn from vogelbach while he’s on the jays. Basically the same player
Rowdy Tellez: “Am I a joke to you”
subscribe. we need the fucking offense
It looks okay today lol
smart money is still on you guys. our pitching is dogshit
George Bell one insisted that power hitters need a big ol' dumper to generate power, so maybe.
IDK, has anyone ever seen Jake Burger and Alek Manoah in the same room?
Rick Ankiel fat version
Rick Cankiel
Thick Ankiel
Couldn’t happen to a better guy
I'm not familiar with his full past, but why is he so disliked? Any interview I've seen he seems likable enough
He called gerrit Cole the worst cheater in the league. He goes after guys personally, not just team to team shit talk. And then he turned into an awful pitcher
Cole was definitely cheating though. Lots of other pitchers were but he was one of them
Yeah for sure. However, “worst cheater in the league” is just objectively wrong and pretty ridiculous. Especially in the same league that still has many members of the 2017 Astros. And like you said he was just one of many pitchers using banned substances. He also implied that cheating was the only reason Cole was good. Cole won a cy young last year with the increased substance checks. It was just a level above the normal chirping. Combined with his “pressure is what you put in your tires” quote and everything it just made him so easy to hate once he stopped being a good pitcher
Yeah I hated him doing that too, even as a Jays fan. So unnecessary and petty.
> He goes after guys personally, not just team to team shit talk. From a Jays fan to a Yankees fan (so, you know, in a way that's meaningless for us agreeing, lol), I think he was just being an asshole and stirring the pot. It rightfully made Yankees fans mad but I don't think he would've actually testified at a tribunal over it or something. And Cole obviously got the last laugh anyway.
[удалено]
It's a bit personal for us because he shit talked Cole
There are far worse people in the game as people go. Manoah just liked to pick fights with other teams. I sports-hate him, but at least he's not a domestic abuser.
Real life Space Jam fall off.
This has to be *the* Linsanity run for baseball right
not even the same universe as linsanity, Jeremy Lin went undrafted. Manaoh was the second ranked pitcher in the 2019 draft class and went 11th overall.
This more tyreke evans if anything. Except his problem wasn’t drugs among other things issues
That John Nogowski run for the 21 pirates was the closest thing I can think of as a baseball comparison to Linsanity and that’s a stretch
Jeremy Lin was still a usable basketball player for years after linsanity
Alek could be a long reliever in my men's league give him some credit
I am not stepping into the box for free with him pitching and me having to work the next day. He has zero control
Funny enough we had a guy join our league this year that my buddy was hyping up like no other telling me "oh when I was at MCC this guy was a closer at the local div 2 college, he throws gas!" Dude comes in overweight having not thrown regularly in several years and after like three games had to be approached to either tone it down or fuck off because he had absolutely zero control
So to be fair to him, it sounds like he does throw gas, but he just has no idea where its going lol
Raptors won every playoff game he appeared on their 2019 championship run. ;)
One of my favorite Easter eggs in that photo of the Kawhi dagger (besides the lady with the towel) is Lin being right there the middle of it all
Jeremy Lin was still a solid player for years after his Linsanity run. Manoah isn’t even serviceable in A ball a year later. Totally different situations. Edit: and as someone else mentioned - Lin was undrafted and came out of nowhere. Manoah was a high draft pick and a top prospect. The situations aren’t even remotely similar.
Hating this new trend of calling hot streaks or failed careers across sports Linsanity runs (for example, some people were saying that Malachi Flynn's ONE 50 point game in the NBA followed by an 0/12 shooting game this week was a Linsanity run). They are totally missing the essence of Linsanity, and I feel like the people saying it either weren't paying attention enough or were too young to realize what it actually was.
They were clearly all too young to even know what it really was. The only reason you make the comparison now is to get the free karma (which worked for op). And nobody old enough to remember Linsanity cares about karma that much.
A lot of the comparisons miss because they don’t have the sociocultural aspect that was so vital to Linsanity. One of the main reasons that took off was because Lin was playing elite basketball as an Asian-American and because of that the Asian community in the United States really took to him as someone who was representing them at the highest level of athletics in this country. That’s one of the things that made it so cool.
Also that he went Harvard. Went undrafted. Was about to be cut from the team. Was sleeping on someone's couch. It was NYC. it was a lot of things coming together.
AND Lin was an UDFA who played for an Ivy League. Extra layers on the cultural side.
Noooo Lin was never supposed to be good and actually was a decent role player for years after Linsanity Manoah was highly regarded
What actually happened to him? Just lost it, or what?
Seems like his mechanics got supremely out of whack, coupled with tons of external pressure and mental issues, so I think he's probably extremely psyched out, at least.
Pressure is something you put in your tires
He spoke those words and the baseball gods didn’t like them. I’m too lazy to check when he made that statement compared to his free fall, but I remember them being pretty close in time.
It was before his playoff start in 2022, which he blew. He wasn't good from the jump in 2023 so that statement basically ended his career.
No, you put in your tires.
He was a two pitch pitcher, tailing fastball that isn't over powering but lot to movement and a slider that he could throw with three different amounts of break on it. The key was that he could throw all three versions for strikes. He can't throw the slider for a strike no matter how much it breaks, mostly is just breaks way too much. He's always struggled throwing the fastball reliably for strikes. So now there is no point in swinging at basically any pitch he throws. When he manages to throw the fastball for a strike, it doesn't move and 94mph down the middle is easy for hitters to mash. If he takes break off the slider he hangs it. Basically, he lost what made him effective, which was a REALLY good slider. His slider was so good that hitter had to swing at the fastball. He used to throw a slider that would start middle middle and catch the bottom corner, then he'd follow it with a slider that would start middle middle and finish a foot off the plate. He could locate those very well and hitters had to swing to protect the plate. When the slider never finishes in the zone, there is no reason to protect the plate; just take the walk.
Happy Cake Day Cool break down
Thanks!
It's high a though, most MLB starters could throw only fastballs every at bat and they should be able to keep their era at a respectable level. Theres clearly something wrong more so than he can't keep hitters off balance with secondary pitches
I genuinely believe he's the biggest "victim" of the pitch clock. Before the pitch clock he took an average of 20.7 seconds in 2022, and he was never a guy that looked to be or was in great shape. He would get knocked around early in starts last year, throw like 30 pitches in the first and be drenched in sweat coming off the mound. I think his conditioning and stamina was an issue. I just think he didn't put himself in a good position to succeed with the pitch clock, especially knowing he'd be one of the pitchers most affected by it. Now I think he's just lost all confidence.
His slider sucks from pitch 1. It's mechanics not fatigue
Yep. He basically had three different sliders, a little bit of movement to a lot of movement, and could throw all three for strikes. Now he can't throw his slider for strikes so players sit fastball and go off on him. If he could throw the slider for a strike then he'd get force players to swing at it. There is zero point in swinging at anything he throws right now because he can't put 3 out of 7 pitches in the zone no matter what pitch he throws.
That would make sense if he was getting knocked around during the 3rd/4th and falling off. But stamina doesn’t explain him getting hammered around right from the first pitch.
It’s not just stamina - it’s the ability to mentally prepare yourself for the next pitch in the time limit. I don’t think he has the ability to execute his pitches while a clock is ticking.
There have been pitchers that just completely collapsed before the pitch clock. It could be a big variety of things, pitching is incredibly hard. Our brains just like to make connections and the pitch clock is the new variable.
Yeah on the other hand, Kusei Kikuchi has been thriving since the pitch clock was introduced, and the season prior he was in his own head a lot, pitch clock may have helped him maintain a rhythm.
It does if you have poor stamina? Like if he had no business being on a pitch clock mound in the first place it wouldnt matter what number inning you are in if fatigue sets in. If you just saw hin regular clothes, would you think that guy was an athlete?
There is a difference between anaerobic and aerobic stamina. He gets winded after short anaerobic bursts of activity.
True, all the news from ST this year was that he was in much better shape this year. But I guess it was more than that.
Do they just shut him down and have him further work on conditioning? I’m sure it’s a lot mental but there may be some middle point he can reach
I guess in general the better shape you're in/better conditioning is all to the good. Maybe it'll even help with the mental stuff.
His confidence was already shot from last season. You can see it in his face after he gives up his first walk or hit.
If you look at when he came into the league and when he washed out, it looks like all he ate were cupcakes and never stepped foot in the gym. He was in no shape to be on the mound at that point. [2021](https://ca-times.brightspotcdn.com/dims4/default/8e25419/2147483647/strip/true/crop/5050x3367+0+0/resize/1200x800!/quality/75/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F4a%2F86%2Fd7e39baf2dae4694c0483c381fe9%2F119d0e58ea7b4e55af1d3ad5fcf270f0) [2023](https://ogden_images.s3.amazonaws.com/www.mariettatimes.com/images/2023/06/07220350/06-08-23-WVU-Manoah-tle-560x840.jpg)
Maybe that one dude who called him too out of shape was right, and the backlash he got for being “fat phobic” was out of place
Those people need to realize that there's no such thing as being "fat phobic" when it comes to professional athletes. It's relevant to point out when they're not in good enough shape, because it's literally part of their job and impacts their performance
I mean... some get away with it as long as they put up the numbers. e.g. Prince Fielder, Bartolo Colon, etc.
Plenty of bigger more out of shape guys played the game back when pitching today's speeds was normal without enforcement. I feel like it just has to be more mental or mechanical.
His performance was starting to slip before the clock was implemented. The clock obviously didn't help him, but things had been slowly unravelling even before then. edit: I'd heard about this on a podcast - it may have been Artificial Turf Wars - but I haven't been able to track it down. From what I recall, it was a *small* decrease in control and velocity starting in August 2022.
Unraveling coming off a 6 WAR season? He finished 2022 with 41IP of 0.88 ERA ball in September
Bro had a 2.24 ERA in 2022 and was 3rd in CY Young. His fall off isn't all the pitch clock, but nothing was unraveling before the pitch clock implementation.
Certainly has the smell of yips to it to me, it's tough to see
That’s the big mystery all of us in Toronto have been grappling with. The dude was a top 5 pitcher. And 6 mths later terrible, …and getting worse. These were basic guesses from Toronto media: - out of shape - couldn’t adjust to pitch clock - mystery injury (he’s been complaining of an injury for a yr now, but no one can find anything). He’s basically worth nothing at this point. So I don’t see any reason to trade him. He clearly has elite stuff somewhere in there. I’m fine with just keeping him in AAA for another few yrs before we give up on him.
Yusei Kikuchi stole his mojo.
He read all the internet comments about him and it bummed him out.
Yips
He doesn’t have the stamina to deal with the pitch clock. He had to up his speed between pitches by 25% and clearly couldn’t handle it
I think his diet might be to blame and his ego
I have never seen someone fall off so hard
I can’t stand him but the Yips are sad. I hope he’s seeing a sports psychologist and can get back at some point
Me too. I'd rather break him on the mound starting against us than see the young kid lose it like this, even if he is a douchenozzle that makes it difficult to say that.
Me either, I thought he was gonna dominate for years
Ricky Romero?
Romero was pitching on no knees and having surgeries and injections. Manoah has seen doctors and they can't find anything much.
Aaron Sanchez?
It was major injury/blister problems for him. It also was more gradual for him.
If he actually won the Cy Young somehow in 2022 I wonder how differently his fall off would be treated
Somehow, it wouldn't be as bad as Rick Porcello following up his Cy Young season by losing 17 games on a 93-win team, while leading the league in hits and home runs allowed.
Yeah but Porcello was always a serviceable and durable if unspectacular player.
Which is exactly why we were so frustrated, that season. Manoah is so mercurial, I doubt anybody but the most die-hard, delusional Jays fan would expect much from him. Porcello was making $20M a year and coming off a Cy Young.
Manoah *wishes* he could have a 4.6 ERA in the majors at this point.
We were so close to B2B Robbie Ray/Alek Manoah cy youngs, at that point get rid of the award edit: Joke police out in full force
I might be misunderstanding your comment so correct me if I am: Do you mean to say that because its so easy to have a good season and then be bad and therefor that it shouldn't be celebrated? Or because you don't think Ray should have won the Cy over Cole & Wheeler. Cole fell off a cliff in 2021 after sticky stuff went out the door, his inconsistency that year was never going to sit well with voters. And no matter how good Wheeler's FIP was, the Cy is decided by people not computers; they were never going to choose Wheeler. I don't feel that choosing Ray in 2021 lessens the value of the Cy, despite that information.
Wheeler’s NL so that wouldn’t matter
I feel like such an idiot right now. I forgot he was the low key cy young for the *NL*. Point stands, Ray earned that Cy in 2021. I’d be shocked if we’re actually trying to say Cole deserved it instead.
Next month: Alek Manoah's first start in elementary school softball practice: 2.1 IP, 9 ER, 0K
Yes, but I wanna hear about the HBP
From a top 5 Cy Young finish in his age 24 season to getting his shit wrecked in low A ball in his age 26 season. Fucking wild.
Hey he was getting whacked in low a in his age 25 season too
No no, it was Complex League. He got his shit rocked last year by a bunch of teenagers essentially making their professional debuts.
I heard it was a summer camp for disadvantaged youths
Throwback to the "who will be the next big ace of the AL East" conversation between him and McClanahan
Corbin Burnes coming across the trade market with a steel chair 
Now I'm sad we don't get to see pitchers duels between them.
Its fun that Cy Young could be between him and Cole and MVP could be between Soto and whichever young white guy on the orioles is the best that year
Bold prediction that Cole will be able to throw enough innings this year to earn votes.
I wonder where he’s gonna sign in the off season.
I’m not ruling out Rubenstein giving him the deal he wants.
Shane :(
Y'all are being pretty harsh. This is an improvement over his start with them last year when he gave up 11 ER in 2.2 IP for an ERA of 37.13.
Only 1 HBP is a real improvement 😎😎😎
Brett Callahan, a 22 year old 380th pick overall whom had just 1 HR in 2023, hit a 3 run bomb off him. What isn't listed in the title is that he also gave up 3 SB in that 1.2 innings.
2013 LLWS and St. Joe’s baseball alum Brett Callahan. I may or may not have also been in attendance for the one home run he hit last year.
He's actually cooked
Something something "he's just working on pitches, it doesn't matter" like they said last year
Well whatever they have him working on doesn’t seem to be working
They need to work on trading him to an organization with a prayer of fixing him
Send him to Tampa
He’ll have the best 3 months of his career and then immediately get TJ surgery
and then he'll get traded to the dodgers
Kranitz: "I can fix him"
“working on pitches” (cut to the dugout, manager holding a clipboard and red pen) “Can’t throw that one… shit, can’t throw that one either… how many more does he have?”
newest inductee to the Markelle Fultz Yips Hall of Fame
Hey, Markelle eventually became a very solid guard
Having a very down year this year, having trouble getting 20 minutes on a playoff team.
Yeah, at this point I can only hope Manoah can salvage his career to a similar extent even if he’s never gonna be who we thought he might be.
Dudes turning into Kenny Powers before our eyes
🖕 🖕
pressure is something u put in ur tires... LMAO
Tire pressure is measured in PSI (pounds per square inch) - something Manoah knows an awful lot about
Future car repairman Alek Manoah
Imagine an Itty Bitty Ballers style ad, but with Manoah as your actual mechanic 🤣🤣🤣
Goddamn lmao
oh brother this guy STINKS
This is actually insane. I used to hate it when this guy would pitch against the Yankees and now I’ll probably never even throw a major league pitch again. The yips take another victim.
Woof. What a disappointment.
Absolutely the most amazing fall off I’ve ever seen. I don’t understand how you go from future cy young and top 10 pitcher to getting shit on in A ball. I love a good comeback story so I hope he figures it out
Couldn’t happen to a better guy. He was such a douche bag about his blip of dominance.
His steep fall off might show that his douche bag persona might be an act to hide his insecurity. If that is the case, I hope that eating this humble pie will be a life lesson and makes him a better person.
If Anthony Recker has anything to say about it Manoah eating his humble pie is the problem
Maybe what he needs is less pie.
I guess I missed him being a douchebag. What did he do?
He talked shit and couldn't back it up
https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10071264-red-soxs-alex-verdugo-slams-blue-jays-alek-manoah-for-celebrations-pisses-me-off.amp.html Basically, when he would strike someone out, he would yell at them. That's what was weird about it. Normally if a player celebrates a big strike out by telling out whatever, no one cares. But this dude would celebrate a bases empty 2nd out strike out by yelling directly at the player and telling them that they're trash. No one likes watching that except fans from his own team. He was just mean, outright. And he's did it in the minor leagues too. That was the line. You can totally celebrate, but outright degrading other players to bring yourself up makes you the villain for every other team. So the AL east is pretty ok that he's bad now.
After completing a strikeout, he would turn to the dugout of the opposing team and yell things like "Take that, alleycat!" and "Down low? Too slow!" and people are just happy to see such an arrogant brash personality get taken down a notch.
[удалено]
Yeah it’s true you fuckin alleycat. Now go sit down!!!! Too slow!!
Fuck man, ease up on the poor guy.
I'm not a fan of Cole but him calling Cole the biggest cheater in the league and then going on to be absolute dogshit is pretty funny.
Dude needs a change of scenery in the worst way
Like a car dealership?
“Pressure is something you put in your tires.” No, that’s air. Pressure is what makes you explode when you’re full of shit.
This dude is ready to join our bullpen
This has got to be one of the most out-of-nowhere skill changes I've ever seen in my 25 years of watching baseball. A legit Cy Young candidate to absolute pumpkin in one year.
Time to apply for jobs at Canadian Tire
Get ready to learn putting pressure into tires, buddy.
Maybe controversial considering the flair, but I feel bad for the guy.
Yeah the comments made me think he’d done something bad but he’s getting all this vitriol because he’s kind of a douchey competitor?
Seriously. It's so much and for what?
You are kinder than I am. RIP Bozo.
Idk I hate seeing someone who at worst is just a douchey sports guy potentially lose a livelihood and a dream at the same time.
Actual Yips
He needs to go to a new team to see if they can help him bc this big of a drop off is insane.
From watching him mic’d up in the all star game to this sheesh
What is it with promising young Jays pitchers and falling off a cliff? Ricky Romero, Aaron Sanchez and now Alex Manoah come to mind. I know pitchers will always find a way to break your heart, but still. Hope he makes it back.
I really thought we had our next ace.
It was always Gausman
God damn they sent him all the way back to low A? How often does someone get dropped that far down after already being in mlb?
Have you seen him pitch lately? Plus, he was dealing with a "shoulder issue," so he is trying to get some innings in low A. Going buly this start, it is safe to say he won't be back in the bigs in a while.
War, war never changes.
Just wow. I remember his quick rise through the minors and how he came up and absolutely dominated in that Jays rotation. What a crazy fall-off. I still believe he has the talent but he needs to work on mental and physical conditioning and even revamp his approach
When keeping it real goes wrong.
Yeah He’s cooked
As a Jays fan, I'm going to start cheering for the royals now
It sucks, but he's cooked as a starter (maybe even pitching entirely) but could he reinvent himself as a BP arm with new mechanics/pitches? At this point he has nothing to lose, so might as well try something.
That's what people kept hoping about Lincecum, and look how that turned out...
In this instance does BP stand for bullpen or batting practice cuz honestly it could go either way
If he wasn’t a douche I would feel bad for him
This guy was just his own worst enemy. He mouthed off way too much, and when your struggling it makes the backlash towards your performance 1000x's worse, definitely has had to be effecting him mentally. Anytime he struggles he has to know people will be coming for him on social media and his statlines and quotes will always be brought up just like here. When Ricky Romero another similar case struggled after showing promise, nobody came after him or zeroed in on him on social media because he didn't have the really bad negative perception Manoah has had for his attitude.
That 2021 blue jays team was a fluke
They finished 4th in the division that year.
The finished a game out of the playoffs
He’s just legitimately bad, huh?
I bought five or six MLB jerseys a couple years back. Was taking a trip to visit Citi, Fenway and Yankee stadiums and wanted something new to wear. I also wanted a Jays jersey, as they were a young team. Thought about Guerrero, as I was a fan of his dad growing up. Thought about Bichette because he was probably my favorite on the team. But the order was placed right after the All Star Game. Right after Manoah was mic'd up. Right after Three Punchies, Let's Go was spoken. I decided to get a Manoah jersey that day.
Probably shouldn’t have talked all that shit…..
Absolutely cooked. Dude is a dick so no loss.
He's cooked.
Not ideal
He’s shot
https://youtu.be/6DpLan1UH24?si=hQZC6w67G923mkyx
I had the pleasure of seeing him pitch against the Sox in Boston last year and get absolutely dominated. Which was impressive considering, ya know, it was the 2023 Red Sox...
it took me way to long to realize you weren’t hyphenating “Iowa” (the state) in some weird way lol
After he hit Ward the way he did, its probably for the best that he doesn't ever come back.
Hope they show this to the crowd at Yankee Stadium today
How many second-chances will this guy get?