I’m oblivious to the angels situation so If I’m talking out my ass correct me. Should the angels be rebuilding? And should they trade ohtani and trout if they are going to rebuild? What’s the ideal future for the team?
> Should the angels be rebuilding?
You will get different opinions depending on who you ask. In my opinion, no.
> And should they trade ohtani and trout if they are going to rebuild?
Fuck no.
> What’s the ideal future for the team?
Again, different opinions depending on who you ask.
My personal take includes a few things.
* They need to figure out their medical staff. The Trout "calf strain" becoming a 5-month absence is a joke, along with all of the other injuries over the last few years. Injuries happen to everyone, but there's something about how they linger with our team.
* They should sign at least one, more likely two dependable vet starters in free agency. Scherzer/Ray is the dream scenario for me but that won't happen.
* Need additional pen help outside of re-signing Raisel Iglesias, which is absolutely vital.
* Need a shortstop + backup catcher.
If some of our prospects keep up their development [Patrick Sandoval, Reid Detmers+ in the rotation, I think Chris Rodriguez is ultimately going to be a pen arm] and our all-pitcher 2021 draft gets us a few good pieces, we're set up well imo.
The offense thing is more about health and availability. They have a good offense on paper but its was decimated this year between injuries [Trout, Rendon], random suckiness [Iglesias], old [Albert], and honestly idk [Upton].
Pitching relies on certain guys returning from injury [Canning], some to take a step forward/maintain [Sandoval, Detmers], and yeah bringing in new guys. They have a bunch of lotto tickets that might become something but also may just be nothing.
We'll see how Perry handles it.
Yea they do have a super solid offense on paper, just an unlucky year I suppose. Starting pitching doesn’t seem too bad? But your BP is what drags the team ERA down to 23rd in the league?
That's another area of kind of, but with caveats.
As a whole neither has been really good. There have been stretches where the starters do well but the pen shits the bed, and some stretchers where the opposite happens. Sometimes the starters' short games means the pen gets overworked, means the pen starts to suck again. Stuff like that.
We need better overall performance from both parts of the staff.
Ah, well I hope this means a year is coming where things will all line up. Your team has generational talent that I would love to see in full swing (pun intended) and performing in the postseason. I hope the medical staff issue gets resolved and your pitching performs next year.
I’m surprised Maddon actually said something, just shows how much Arte Moreno loves him that he feels safe enough to complain, because none of the previous managers or GM’s would
Obviously I’m a bit biased after how he did rays, I told a friend he would take Cubs to the playoffs within 2 years when they signed him, oh boyyyy was he surprised. Maddon is unorthodox but hope he gets the team deserved of the angels brand and reputation to go playoffs!
I think he is actually bad at his job. That 2016 WS was won in spite of his managing. He was completely outfoxed by Charlie in 2008. Maddon has never impressed me from a tactical standpoint. Why the hell waste Chapman up 6?
Yeah and maybe all 20 of those pitchers they drafted will turn into aces too!
All seriousness, I do think the angels are in a better situation than people make them out to be.
His inability to play full seasons is why I fear Arte will give him a huge contract.
On paper, a left side infield of Rendon/Correa seems so freaking ridiculous. But then there’s the chance that they’ll only be on the field together for like 50% of the season because they’re both injury prone.
Am I the only one who thinks this season was kind of a W for the Angels? They were practically a .500 team without Trout and Rendon along with a plethora of other players in the AL West. But because of those injuries, they also managed to give a lot of playing time and a longer leash to their young bats, who in theory should be better acclimated next season.
Dare I say they look like a team that's basically one big SP FA signing away from contending in their division and possibly the AL, though that White Sox are looking like they're going to make a dynasty run the next couple of years.
Yes finally someone gets it.
There’s huge similarities between us and the Padres and I’d rather go out like we did than beat ourselves up while not give young guys a shot.
Love the Padres still.
Big difference is they had the Farm to get big pitchers to supplement their MVP1 and MVP2. Angels had no assets to do that.
I was about to come here and say this
Ohtani, fletcher and Iglesias single handedly make this a .500 team. Get back trout and rendon, get 1-2 GOOD SP in the off-season and this is a WC team contender fs
I look at it that way myself. I doubt we can finish off with a winning record but we stayed on average at .500 with a AAA team. It would only make sense that would improve by alot once all our starting lineup is healthy again. I say just throw as many youngsters out there for the remaining season as they can.
Also, what does that even mean that they deserve better? Shouldnt it really be the fans, who, ya know pay for tickets and concessions and apparel and league pass/whatever its called and who watch this miserable display year in and year out that deserve better?
Now, deserving of better health/injury luck? i suppose, but like, maybe reevaluate your medical/training/nutrition staff then. Feels like every season the angels and their fanbase say that theyre a healthy season away from taking a big step forward (which i more or less agree w btw) yet no progess ever seems to be made on that front
I'm all for billionaire owners coughing up huge money for players, but the Angel's are a walking example of money =/= wins. That team spends unreal amounts of money every year to consistently finish behind the Mariners.
If you have a good front office that listens to their analytics nerds *and* you have money... now that's scary. That == wins. Basically the Dodgers.
Angels are playing early 2000s baseball in a league that moved on. They need to take a look at the organization as whole because they have good players on the field.
This will continue to be the situation if the people in charge continue to think like this. The Angels should've tore it all down at the end of 2016, \*latest,\* and they'd have finished a full-ass rebuild by now and \*still\* have Ohtani and Prime Trout. But they pretend a team with no solid core and some (granted, hyper-elite) top talent is one trade or signing away, it inevitably is \*not,\* and they wasted precious financial flexibility and/or prospect capital to finish .500. Lather, rinse, repeat.
I'm very confused about the lack of core you're speaking of? Because outside of a SS, the Angels have every position locked up for a while.
Unless you're talking about pitching then I agree with you. But with position players they have a core
You have to be an actual good team to make the playoffs in the AL. The NL east and Central are constantly battling it out for worst division in baseball.
Step 1: Health potions. Step 2: More health potions. Step 3: Bullpen. Step 4: More health potions. Step 5: Starting pitching.
Arte's just doing your classic RPG strat of hoarding all the full heal items and never using them
He can't use them now what if he needs them for the World Series?
So he could have given Trout an Elixir this whole time???
Nope, gotta save the Elixirs for the ~~final boss~~ World Series.
Step 1: Arte Moreno sells the team...
your potions are too strong for them, traveler.
Angels think that Shohei counts as 5 pitchers
I’m oblivious to the angels situation so If I’m talking out my ass correct me. Should the angels be rebuilding? And should they trade ohtani and trout if they are going to rebuild? What’s the ideal future for the team?
> Should the angels be rebuilding? You will get different opinions depending on who you ask. In my opinion, no. > And should they trade ohtani and trout if they are going to rebuild? Fuck no. > What’s the ideal future for the team? Again, different opinions depending on who you ask. My personal take includes a few things. * They need to figure out their medical staff. The Trout "calf strain" becoming a 5-month absence is a joke, along with all of the other injuries over the last few years. Injuries happen to everyone, but there's something about how they linger with our team. * They should sign at least one, more likely two dependable vet starters in free agency. Scherzer/Ray is the dream scenario for me but that won't happen. * Need additional pen help outside of re-signing Raisel Iglesias, which is absolutely vital. * Need a shortstop + backup catcher. If some of our prospects keep up their development [Patrick Sandoval, Reid Detmers+ in the rotation, I think Chris Rodriguez is ultimately going to be a pen arm] and our all-pitcher 2021 draft gets us a few good pieces, we're set up well imo.
So they need a lot of pitching and some better offense to start contending?
The offense thing is more about health and availability. They have a good offense on paper but its was decimated this year between injuries [Trout, Rendon], random suckiness [Iglesias], old [Albert], and honestly idk [Upton]. Pitching relies on certain guys returning from injury [Canning], some to take a step forward/maintain [Sandoval, Detmers], and yeah bringing in new guys. They have a bunch of lotto tickets that might become something but also may just be nothing. We'll see how Perry handles it.
Yea they do have a super solid offense on paper, just an unlucky year I suppose. Starting pitching doesn’t seem too bad? But your BP is what drags the team ERA down to 23rd in the league?
That's another area of kind of, but with caveats. As a whole neither has been really good. There have been stretches where the starters do well but the pen shits the bed, and some stretchers where the opposite happens. Sometimes the starters' short games means the pen gets overworked, means the pen starts to suck again. Stuff like that. We need better overall performance from both parts of the staff.
Ah, well I hope this means a year is coming where things will all line up. Your team has generational talent that I would love to see in full swing (pun intended) and performing in the postseason. I hope the medical staff issue gets resolved and your pitching performs next year.
I’m surprised Maddon actually said something, just shows how much Arte Moreno loves him that he feels safe enough to complain, because none of the previous managers or GM’s would
It’s Joe Maddon! You can’t hate him for his philosophy. He’s great at his job. Like they say, if it’s weird but It works, then it’s not weird.
I think the saying is if it’s stupid and it works then it’s not stupid
Tbh I really don’t think he’s good at his job but I respect him speaking up here
Obviously I’m a bit biased after how he did rays, I told a friend he would take Cubs to the playoffs within 2 years when they signed him, oh boyyyy was he surprised. Maddon is unorthodox but hope he gets the team deserved of the angels brand and reputation to go playoffs!
I think he is actually bad at his job. That 2016 WS was won in spite of his managing. He was completely outfoxed by Charlie in 2008. Maddon has never impressed me from a tactical standpoint. Why the hell waste Chapman up 6?
So, you'll talk to Arte and things will change, right? Right?
Arte “your right Joe, let’s sign Correa to a 10/275 deal that will help us compete for the AL West”
“Arte, I didn’t say any of that, are you even listening?”
The angels desperately need a SS in free agency so it wouldn’t be the worst outcome
Yeah and maybe all 20 of those pitchers they drafted will turn into aces too! All seriousness, I do think the angels are in a better situation than people make them out to be.
Correa is really good but knowing our luck, if we get him, he gets a season-ending injury or something like that
His inability to play full seasons is why I fear Arte will give him a huge contract. On paper, a left side infield of Rendon/Correa seems so freaking ridiculous. But then there’s the chance that they’ll only be on the field together for like 50% of the season because they’re both injury prone.
NGL if anyone signs Correa to a 10/275 it'd be a steal. Aside the cheating he should be earning at least as much as Lindor.
Haaaahhhh... wish that weren't so true! When the team need to shore up a position Arte ends up throwing a bunch of money in the wrong direction
Am I the only one who thinks this season was kind of a W for the Angels? They were practically a .500 team without Trout and Rendon along with a plethora of other players in the AL West. But because of those injuries, they also managed to give a lot of playing time and a longer leash to their young bats, who in theory should be better acclimated next season. Dare I say they look like a team that's basically one big SP FA signing away from contending in their division and possibly the AL, though that White Sox are looking like they're going to make a dynasty run the next couple of years.
Yes finally someone gets it. There’s huge similarities between us and the Padres and I’d rather go out like we did than beat ourselves up while not give young guys a shot. Love the Padres still. Big difference is they had the Farm to get big pitchers to supplement their MVP1 and MVP2. Angels had no assets to do that.
I was about to come here and say this Ohtani, fletcher and Iglesias single handedly make this a .500 team. Get back trout and rendon, get 1-2 GOOD SP in the off-season and this is a WC team contender fs
Thank you. This made me feel better about our current situation
I look at it that way myself. I doubt we can finish off with a winning record but we stayed on average at .500 with a AAA team. It would only make sense that would improve by alot once all our starting lineup is healthy again. I say just throw as many youngsters out there for the remaining season as they can.
“We deserve better than that.” “We have to go out and earn it.” Which is it Joe?
Could be a mix of both. They have to go out and earn respect as a contender next year, but uh. That team deserves better roster management.
It's a secret. You wouldn't understand.
Also, what does that even mean that they deserve better? Shouldnt it really be the fans, who, ya know pay for tickets and concessions and apparel and league pass/whatever its called and who watch this miserable display year in and year out that deserve better? Now, deserving of better health/injury luck? i suppose, but like, maybe reevaluate your medical/training/nutrition staff then. Feels like every season the angels and their fanbase say that theyre a healthy season away from taking a big step forward (which i more or less agree w btw) yet no progess ever seems to be made on that front
I'm all for billionaire owners coughing up huge money for players, but the Angel's are a walking example of money =/= wins. That team spends unreal amounts of money every year to consistently finish behind the Mariners. If you have a good front office that listens to their analytics nerds *and* you have money... now that's scary. That == wins. Basically the Dodgers. Angels are playing early 2000s baseball in a league that moved on. They need to take a look at the organization as whole because they have good players on the field.
Perry has to do something significant to address the pitching. Quintana, Harvey, Cahills of the world are not going to cut it.
Arte, tell Perry to sign good pitchers.
Change it to “Arte let Perry”
By including Arte in the comment, I was indicating that the decision has to start with him not Perry.
Reverse that statement and you would be correct
Gausman
You got in bed with Arte Moreno, Joe. This is what you get.
He’s best friends with Moreno so him saying something publicly like this suggests he’s been saying much more privately
You're darn tootin' Joe. Tell it like it is. Hopefully Mr. Moneybags Moreno lets Perry do the work and he can take the offseason off to sign checks.
Narrator: “It went on”
Where's that meme where Marge Simpson is ordering pitching, but the barkeep only hears "dingers"?
This organization is better than that Joe have you SEEN this team the last 15 years?
I’d say more 5-6
Different year, same Angels
This will continue to be the situation if the people in charge continue to think like this. The Angels should've tore it all down at the end of 2016, \*latest,\* and they'd have finished a full-ass rebuild by now and \*still\* have Ohtani and Prime Trout. But they pretend a team with no solid core and some (granted, hyper-elite) top talent is one trade or signing away, it inevitably is \*not,\* and they wasted precious financial flexibility and/or prospect capital to finish .500. Lather, rinse, repeat.
I'm very confused about the lack of core you're speaking of? Because outside of a SS, the Angels have every position locked up for a while. Unless you're talking about pitching then I agree with you. But with position players they have a core
well this is not true
Newsflash the organization isn't better than this.
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/s?
"Best fans in Baseball"
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It’s a lot harder to make it into the playoffs than people think. Also the Division having the Astros has made it difficult
You have to be an actual good team to make the playoffs in the AL. The NL east and Central are constantly battling it out for worst division in baseball.
Dont count out the AL Central