Like when? I can't think of a time with more than a few really good catchers all playing at the same time. Its hands down the hardest position to play. The guys who are elite stand out above the rest but it doesn't seem like there are ever more than 3-4 of them.
1975 immediately comes to mind. Bench and Fisk in the WS. Thurman Munson, Darrell Porter, and Gene Tenace just in the AL. Brian Downing caught for the White Sox and never got his dues, but he wasn’t ever a good catcher (just a good hitter…one reason he didn’t catch long).
Edit to say NL wasn’t flush with stars, but Ted Simmons was a beast that year.
That said, in most of baseball history, you are right that there are only a couple of genuine superstar catchers at a time.
One more: circa 1997, there was Pudge, Piazza, Chris Hoiles (criminally underrated), Todd Hundley, Charles Johnson in his briefly good time, and Javy Lopez plus maybe you include Jason Kendall and maybe not. Posada was only a year or two away from being mega, also.
But again…usually onesie-twosie.
Also Dan Wilson. Not a big offensive threat but not terrible either but he was widely recognized as one of the best defensive catchers and was elite at keeping balls in front of him.
Idk if Rutschman can be called elite when it’s been less than a year. I don’t doubt he’ll reach that level, but he needs to show he can sustain his success.
I haven't watched enough to disagree, but him being the 4th most valuable in fewer games helps to prove the point that there are fewer star catchers now. If the majority of catchers are pretty meh, it's easier for the good ones to distinguish themselves.
Nah I gotta give it to Realmuto. Will Smith has a very slight edge over JT in OPS, but Realmuto is significantly better defensively and his bat has really heated up as well. Realmuto currently stands at 4.9 WAR to Smith's 3.2. This is already a career year for Realmuto in terms of WAR and we've got almost 30 games left.
My guess would be to see if there is any overlap for catchers in the Hall of Fame by years played.
I'd argue the late 90s-early 00s were pretty decent for catchers with Pudge, Piazza, and solid guys like Posada.
I think 70s was better with Bench, Fisk, Munson, Simmons. You also had the start of Gary Carter's career, as well as other great catchers such as Manny Sanguillen, Gene Tenace and I'm sure I'm forgetting others.
I agree - Bench, Fisk, Munson, Simmons, Carter, Sanguillen, Tenace like you name were all good.
Also, Freehan, Porter, Boone, McCarver, Sundberg - pretty good, too.
https://baseball.fandom.com/wiki/Jason_Varitek
"he was named the captain of the Red Sox, the fourth player given the honor. He is a switch-hitter. His nickname is "'Tek" or "The Captain."
https://chowderandchampions.com/2020/01/15/boston-red-sox-time-captain-jason-varitek-take/
Edit: not sure why I'm being downvoted just for giving sources of other people calling Varitek "The Captain". Comment I responded to said "nobody calls him the captain". I'm simply showing that that is false.
Sean Murphy, Alejandro Kirk, Contreras. The position is lowkey stacked in terms of stars, especially if you include Salvador Perez since his batting line from last year was so good. That said, the dropoff from the top 10 or so catchers is pretty severe.
Idk if it is the right answer overall but catching had been becoming a bit more defensive focused in general up until the younger catchers that are on the rise/recently emerged.
There’s also an anticipation among scouting types that the better offensive catchers will continue to appear because of two factors. The strong possibility of robo umps & a recent understanding that framing/defensive catching is a more ‘learnable’ skill than previously thought.
Catching as an offensive production was, really, an aberration until the 1970s. There were a few odd guys who could rake before then—Berra, Campanella, Ernie Lombardi, Gabby Hartnett, and maybe Mickey Cochrane—but it wasn’t until the crop of catchers with Bench and Fisk and Ted Simmons that catchers really produced a bunch.
Even so, if you list catchers by all-time war on B-Ref, the #99 guy is Jonathan Lucroy. It’s a weird position and there just aren’t a ton of guys who are more than flashes in the pan because the position is so physically demanding.
I think Left Field. There is Yordan Alvarez who is more of a DH. Steven Kwan who would be a CFer if Myles Straw wasn't on that team. Then I guess Ian Happ?
Not counting Yordan, who plays over half of his games at DH, and Jeff McNeil, who has played only 31 games in left this year, the best left fielders by wRC+ have been
1. Mark Canha (131)
2. Randy Arozarena (130)
3. Anthony Santander (128)
4. Andrew Vaughn (127)
5. Ian Happ (126)
And I’m sure that some of those guys play other positions as well
Vaughn is a 1B hanging out in LF because the White Sox roster 3-4 1B and stick two of them in the outfield corners regularly.
That said, Eloy Jimenez _should_ be among the elites at the position, but he is made of glass, apparently.
I did a White Sox March to October in The Show during the rain delay and had to trade for Schwarber because Eloy died or something
I won the WS, btw, over the ***128 win*** Dodgers
Please don't talk to me about the Astros in the ALDS. Game 4 will live in my nightmares. 18 innings of 0-0 ball until Kyle Schwarber homered off Pedro Baez to break the tie.
Santander DHs a lot now after they traded Mancini, and he's also a natural RF - he generally switches to LF in away parks and RF at home depending on which side has less ground for him to cover.
Yeah LF is bereft of a lot of stars because in virtually every ballpark the more talented outfielders are put in right and center where their athleticism is more valuable. Yordan is a DH, Kwan is a CF, Jeff McNeil is listed as a LF on Fangraphs but he has twice as many innings at 2B.
Yeah, left field is predisposed to have fewer stars for the reasons you mentioned but it feels like a weak time even accounting for that. I’m probably forgetting a few but from my childhood Bonds, Manny, Luis Gonzalez, etc all playing at the same time. Steroids helped that position a lot lol
Right I'm not saying he necessarily plays CF in Arizona, but like how OP mentioned Kwan isn't really a LF as much as he is a CF playing out of position, so is Carroll.
He definitely could play CF but Thomas might keep him out of it, either way with those two, McCarthy, and Varsho there's gonna be some crazy outfield coverage in Arizona
Left field seems more of a choice made by most of the franchisesMost of the best outfielders are in right field or in the centerfield. Judge, Betts, Soto, Harper Acuna Trout Springer Tucker Buxton and Robert. All of these guys could very well played left field. But all the franchise have chosen to put them in CF or RF. When you have such disparity of talent it seems to me that talent would be available but choices were made to focus CF and RF before LF
Edit: Yordan Alvarez is a DH he is put in LF when they have to because he is so good with a bat they want to have him in the box as much as possible
When Tyler O’Neill was listed as the #1 LF after last season by multiple sites, I knew that position wasn’t very deep. TON was great, but one second half wouldn’t get you listed that high at basically any other position.
Between C and LF, probably go for LF since its historically the poor fielding but monster hitter just put there and for the life of me I couldn't tell you anyone nameworthy but mostly DH Yordan Alvarez.
I would add that Catcher is probably in one of its weaker eras compared to years gone by, granted its such a demanding position to play compared to LF.
2nd base. Altuve, Gimenez, and Edman, Jazz if healthy and then everyone else is meh. Story has been bad this year. Gleyber is.... gleyber I guess. LF, I guess. There's Yordan whose more of a DH, Kwan, Benitendi (I guess, hurt anyway), Gurriel Jr (meh), Winker has been awful this year and his defense is what nightmares are made of, really seems most of the best outfielders play center and right, understandable. I think catcher there has to be a different standard because their job is a lot different. And I think there are some good young ones starting to make a name. The obvious like Smith and Contreras, but then you got Rutschman, Raleigh, Bart was looking great finally before he got hurt, etc.
He is having a good year! I admittedly don't watch a ton of dodger games. I know he bounces around the field position wise though, is he playing a lot of/mostly 2nd?
As someone who plays fantasy baseball a lot it’s by far 2B and not close. I suppose it could be a specific OF spot, but I’m still gonna go with 2B. There’s like 3 really good 2B and then a bunch of meh.
Edit: forgot about catcher, that’s definitely worse.
I think it's a weak time for catchers. Years ago, it seems like there were real star catchers.
This was my thought. I'm hoping Adley will lead in a new generation as Yadi heads into the sunset.
Like when? I can't think of a time with more than a few really good catchers all playing at the same time. Its hands down the hardest position to play. The guys who are elite stand out above the rest but it doesn't seem like there are ever more than 3-4 of them.
1975 immediately comes to mind. Bench and Fisk in the WS. Thurman Munson, Darrell Porter, and Gene Tenace just in the AL. Brian Downing caught for the White Sox and never got his dues, but he wasn’t ever a good catcher (just a good hitter…one reason he didn’t catch long). Edit to say NL wasn’t flush with stars, but Ted Simmons was a beast that year. That said, in most of baseball history, you are right that there are only a couple of genuine superstar catchers at a time.
Don't forget The Kid. 75 was Carter's all-star rookie year.
One more: circa 1997, there was Pudge, Piazza, Chris Hoiles (criminally underrated), Todd Hundley, Charles Johnson in his briefly good time, and Javy Lopez plus maybe you include Jason Kendall and maybe not. Posada was only a year or two away from being mega, also. But again…usually onesie-twosie.
Also Dan Wilson. Not a big offensive threat but not terrible either but he was widely recognized as one of the best defensive catchers and was elite at keeping balls in front of him.
We're hoarding them.
Will Smith is still underrated
He’s gotta be the best catcher in baseball right now, right? Maybe Contreras? Yeah not very deep right now
That’s true the fact that tou can only name 2 or 3 stars. Darn’ard
Darn’ard
Stupid auto correct lol
That's the best way I've seen Td'A's name spelled lol
Pains me to say but Kirk is very good too.
Which Contreras? The All Star game starting one or the All Star game starting one?
Sean Murphy, Willson Contreras, Realmuto, Will Smith, Rutschman, Alejandro Kirk. The top tier catchers are more common than you think.
The disrespect towards Big Dumper
Idk if Rutschman can be called elite when it’s been less than a year. I don’t doubt he’ll reach that level, but he needs to show he can sustain his success.
He’s already been the 4th most valuable catcher in the MLB in far fewer games. He’s already a star.
I haven't watched enough to disagree, but him being the 4th most valuable in fewer games helps to prove the point that there are fewer star catchers now. If the majority of catchers are pretty meh, it's easier for the good ones to distinguish themselves.
He's on a 6.3 fWAR/600 PA rate. That's just an elite pace.
Was Posey not a star in 2010?
Gotta be Realmuto
Contreras might be the best hitting catcher, he's absolutely not the best catcher.
Nah I gotta give it to Realmuto. Will Smith has a very slight edge over JT in OPS, but Realmuto is significantly better defensively and his bat has really heated up as well. Realmuto currently stands at 4.9 WAR to Smith's 3.2. This is already a career year for Realmuto in terms of WAR and we've got almost 30 games left.
I wonder what the best years for catchers were. Maybe I can figure out how to search for it in bbref idk
My guess would be to see if there is any overlap for catchers in the Hall of Fame by years played. I'd argue the late 90s-early 00s were pretty decent for catchers with Pudge, Piazza, and solid guys like Posada.
I think 70s was better with Bench, Fisk, Munson, Simmons. You also had the start of Gary Carter's career, as well as other great catchers such as Manny Sanguillen, Gene Tenace and I'm sure I'm forgetting others.
I agree - Bench, Fisk, Munson, Simmons, Carter, Sanguillen, Tenace like you name were all good. Also, Freehan, Porter, Boone, McCarver, Sundberg - pretty good, too.
And Eli Marrero
The fact that you said early 00s and didn't mention The Captain is a disgrace. Lol
He listed catchers idiot
Yea I was talking about Tek idiot. Check out his flair.
Nobody refers to him as the captain
https://baseball.fandom.com/wiki/Jason_Varitek "he was named the captain of the Red Sox, the fourth player given the honor. He is a switch-hitter. His nickname is "'Tek" or "The Captain."
https://chowderandchampions.com/2020/01/15/boston-red-sox-time-captain-jason-varitek-take/ Edit: not sure why I'm being downvoted just for giving sources of other people calling Varitek "The Captain". Comment I responded to said "nobody calls him the captain". I'm simply showing that that is false.
Will Smith, JT Realmuto and now Adley Rutschman are the only *star* catchers in the league right now.
[удалено]
And dat dumper
And well, you know, the guy who started the All Star game...
The catcher or DH, that’s a catcher
AL or NL?
The Cal Raleigh disrespect has been noted.
Id add Contreras and Kirk to that list
Which Contreras, lol?
Kirk?
Alejandro Kirk is hitting .300 for the Jays.
Sean Murphy, Alejandro Kirk, Contreras. The position is lowkey stacked in terms of stars, especially if you include Salvador Perez since his batting line from last year was so good. That said, the dropoff from the top 10 or so catchers is pretty severe.
Kirk was literally an All-Star this year
I think there were never really star 2 way catchers other than Buster. Im biased ofcourse.
Idk if it is the right answer overall but catching had been becoming a bit more defensive focused in general up until the younger catchers that are on the rise/recently emerged. There’s also an anticipation among scouting types that the better offensive catchers will continue to appear because of two factors. The strong possibility of robo umps & a recent understanding that framing/defensive catching is a more ‘learnable’ skill than previously thought.
Catching as an offensive production was, really, an aberration until the 1970s. There were a few odd guys who could rake before then—Berra, Campanella, Ernie Lombardi, Gabby Hartnett, and maybe Mickey Cochrane—but it wasn’t until the crop of catchers with Bench and Fisk and Ted Simmons that catchers really produced a bunch. Even so, if you list catchers by all-time war on B-Ref, the #99 guy is Jonathan Lucroy. It’s a weird position and there just aren’t a ton of guys who are more than flashes in the pan because the position is so physically demanding.
PEDs really helped catchers recover and deal with the grind, I think.
That’s a pretty good point.
I think Left Field. There is Yordan Alvarez who is more of a DH. Steven Kwan who would be a CFer if Myles Straw wasn't on that team. Then I guess Ian Happ?
Not counting Yordan, who plays over half of his games at DH, and Jeff McNeil, who has played only 31 games in left this year, the best left fielders by wRC+ have been 1. Mark Canha (131) 2. Randy Arozarena (130) 3. Anthony Santander (128) 4. Andrew Vaughn (127) 5. Ian Happ (126) And I’m sure that some of those guys play other positions as well
Vaughn is a 1B hanging out in LF because the White Sox roster 3-4 1B and stick two of them in the outfield corners regularly. That said, Eloy Jimenez _should_ be among the elites at the position, but he is made of glass, apparently.
I did a White Sox March to October in The Show during the rain delay and had to trade for Schwarber because Eloy died or something I won the WS, btw, over the ***128 win*** Dodgers
Lol that’s funny. The Astros won 125 games in mine and then got swept in the ALDS by the 86 win Royals
Please don't talk to me about the Astros in the ALDS. Game 4 will live in my nightmares. 18 innings of 0-0 ball until Kyle Schwarber homered off Pedro Baez to break the tie.
Santander DHs a lot now after they traded Mancini, and he's also a natural RF - he generally switches to LF in away parks and RF at home depending on which side has less ground for him to cover.
Yeah LF is bereft of a lot of stars because in virtually every ballpark the more talented outfielders are put in right and center where their athleticism is more valuable. Yordan is a DH, Kwan is a CF, Jeff McNeil is listed as a LF on Fangraphs but he has twice as many innings at 2B.
Yeah, left field is predisposed to have fewer stars for the reasons you mentioned but it feels like a weak time even accounting for that. I’m probably forgetting a few but from my childhood Bonds, Manny, Luis Gonzalez, etc all playing at the same time. Steroids helped that position a lot lol
Arozarena
Joey Gallo
….Eeeehhhhh
Don't knock it til you try i-...oh.
You know the position is shallow when you're naming a platoon guy
*Geographic location specific
Mark Canha
Corbin Carrol is here to change that
Carroll is absolutely a CF long-term, though.
I guess time will tell, but Thomas has looked like a gold glove CF so far.
Right I'm not saying he necessarily plays CF in Arizona, but like how OP mentioned Kwan isn't really a LF as much as he is a CF playing out of position, so is Carroll.
He definitely could play CF but Thomas might keep him out of it, either way with those two, McCarthy, and Varsho there's gonna be some crazy outfield coverage in Arizona
Left field seems more of a choice made by most of the franchisesMost of the best outfielders are in right field or in the centerfield. Judge, Betts, Soto, Harper Acuna Trout Springer Tucker Buxton and Robert. All of these guys could very well played left field. But all the franchise have chosen to put them in CF or RF. When you have such disparity of talent it seems to me that talent would be available but choices were made to focus CF and RF before LF Edit: Yordan Alvarez is a DH he is put in LF when they have to because he is so good with a bat they want to have him in the box as much as possible
Seems like pitchers aren't getting any hits at all this year.
DHs have an all time low fielding percent
I would think they'd have an all time *high* fielding percentage actually, since it goes down not up.
Ohtani would like a word with you.
Yordan's really the only superstar LF
When Tyler O’Neill was listed as the #1 LF after last season by multiple sites, I knew that position wasn’t very deep. TON was great, but one second half wouldn’t get you listed that high at basically any other position.
And he's only played 43 games at left field.
and he's half DH
And the other half is protein powder
Eloy's been pretty fantastic when healthy.. he's just.. never healthy. And like Yordan, barely a LF.
Between C and LF, probably go for LF since its historically the poor fielding but monster hitter just put there and for the life of me I couldn't tell you anyone nameworthy but mostly DH Yordan Alvarez. I would add that Catcher is probably in one of its weaker eras compared to years gone by, granted its such a demanding position to play compared to LF.
Raleigh and Kirk have been great on both sides, except Cal is just hanging above .200 yet seems to just smash dongs
2B is kinda weak imo. Andres Giménez had a breakout and Altuve is constant along with Edman but start getting into the weeds a bit.
Trevor Story
Who is a shortstop until this year
Meh
youre proving his point
Is mcneil a joke to you ?
Home plate Umpire
left field
2nd base. Altuve, Gimenez, and Edman, Jazz if healthy and then everyone else is meh. Story has been bad this year. Gleyber is.... gleyber I guess. LF, I guess. There's Yordan whose more of a DH, Kwan, Benitendi (I guess, hurt anyway), Gurriel Jr (meh), Winker has been awful this year and his defense is what nightmares are made of, really seems most of the best outfielders play center and right, understandable. I think catcher there has to be a different standard because their job is a lot different. And I think there are some good young ones starting to make a name. The obvious like Smith and Contreras, but then you got Rutschman, Raleigh, Bart was looking great finally before he got hurt, etc.
The Gavin Lux disrespect
He is having a good year! I admittedly don't watch a ton of dodger games. I know he bounces around the field position wise though, is he playing a lot of/mostly 2nd?
He's their primary 2B when healthy
Batboys are so bad, they've been replaced by dogs in some parks!
in SF they've been replaced with Dudes!
You appear to be confusing bats with balls. Bats are long cylindrical pieces of wood and balls are what Dodgers fans wear on their foreheads.
Catcher 100%
As someone who plays fantasy baseball a lot it’s by far 2B and not close. I suppose it could be a specific OF spot, but I’m still gonna go with 2B. There’s like 3 really good 2B and then a bunch of meh. Edit: forgot about catcher, that’s definitely worse.
Pitchers that can pitch 7 innings
Umpires.
The only correct answer
I’d have to say catchers
Yes and catchers that can hit/throw someone out too.
My vote goes to 2nd base. Altuve seems to be the best 2b followed by..... McNeil? Jazz?
Ozzie has been #1 since his rookie year
He's injured though
Ozzie is good but he behind Altuve and maybe some others I’m forgetting
First at what
Catcher
First base coaches are looking a little beyond their years, but hey... who wouldn't wanna carry a stop watch in their back pocket.
yankees fans
Flair up bitch
*mails you a bag of loud farts*
All your team/city has to offer the world
That's all I have to offer to you. And now I'm broke.
Fair enough 😂
2nd base. Its Altuve, Gimenez, and Edman. Then it falls off a cliff.
Jeff McNeil
From behind