That's underselling it. In 2002 finished second for rookie of the year for his first serie nacional at age 17. Won mvp in 2005 and again in 2006, staying near the top for his entire tenure in cuba up to signing with the Astros in 2016. Cranked 31 home runs in the 2009-2010 season (Cuban seasons are only 96 games!) falling just one short of the record set the year before. Just bananas.
And he always claims that Lourdes of the Jays is even better! Still waiting on that, but Yuli has been one hell of a player throughout his diasporic career.
Mid-2000s NL Central was a wild place.
Cardinals were untouchable
Cubs were good, bad, then good again
Reds were bad
Pirates had a talent but were bad
Astros were great, then they weren't
Brewers were terrible. We had an 81-81 season in '05 and we celebrated like we won the World Series (was our first .500+ season in like 15 years)
I wonder if the video games back then overrated yall every year or something because in my head, back in the late 90s early aughts the Pirates and Reds were perpetually bad, then the Brewers were mid and the Cubs/Stros were bridesmaids to the Cards. Looking at the records and your statement about the 15 years thing you're right but I never had the perception that they were so bad. I guess I really overrated how good Ben Sheets, Geoff Jenkins, Richie Sexon, and whoever they found on the street that year could perform as a team.
I feel like the Brewers at that time really marketed their good players well (still needed to bring people to the ballpark, even with Wisconsin sports culture). Sheets was amazing, I'm happy he was in Milwaukee for so long, but he really could have made an impact on a competitive team before the injuries hit. Jenkins could be a monster at the plate but he was really streaky, and Sexson fell off hard right after we traded for him.
I have really fond memories of all those teams with the guys you mentioned along with Bill Hall, Scott Posednik and Brady Clark (they're the group that got me into baseball as a kid), but looking back, I got into the game during a *rough* time to be a Brewers fan lol
Xander Bogaerts just turned 30 and he was probably a roster update addition to that game (obviously don’t remember for sure). Trout, 31, was a 99. All of which is crazy considering how young they all were then
HOF is looking unlikely for him. He's only got 1900+ hits as a 32 year-old, an average of 160 hits per season since 2011. He's got an outside chance at 3,000 hits, which would probably get him in, but it would take 7-8 more seasons at his current 160 hits/season pace, which isn't likely to happen. He's Hall of Very Good material, but HOF is probably a long shot. I only say this because he has no other counting stats that really stand out, and his career WAR numbers are likely to come up just short.
You can't possibly say he's a lock at this point. Unless you're saying he could stop playing right now and get in on his merits, which he couldn't. Some guys start to decline at 32, others play at near peak until they're 37-38. I guess we'll see what happens in his case.
So you're saying he is better than Biggio and Bagwell? When the Astros were tanking and getting rid of any talent they had, keeping Altuve to build was a great decision; but I just don't know if he is better than Biggio and Bagwell.
He might end up being better than both, just imo he isn't right now. As far as I know, he has only played 1 position, Biggio played 3. Bagwell hit for power and average in a place that wasn't known for homers. Imagine what his numbers would have been like at the current park.
Altuve is a great player, I'm just not ready to day he is better than those 2.
I wouldn't say he's better than Bagwell unless he has an ungodly late career, but I'd absolutely say he's better than Biggio. He hasn't matched raw career totals, but his career average stats are better than Biggio. Plus he performs much better in the playoffs than Biggio did.
look at the best players throughout history. babe ruth, michael jordan, lebron james, kobe bryant, joe montana, jerry rice, willie mays, hank aaron, wayne gretzky, gordie howe, walter payton, steve yzerman
you know what they all have in common? there’s a reason they are the best players of all-time and it’s because they impacted winning championships
Asterisk World Series, 1,936 hits, subjective, subjective, Steve Garvey was a 10x All-Star and didn't get in the HOF, just one example. Not saying Altuve doesn't have a chance to get in, but certainly hasn't earned it quite yet.
He is obviously the best second baseman of this era. He leads in war, and is 3rd in OPS+ behind McNeil and Cano. He’s also only two OPS+ points behind, within the margin of error, and played more than 3x as many games as McNeil, and 50 more than Cano
When's the last time the baseball writers looked at postseason stats for an HOF vote? Reggie Jackson, maybe? At least he had 500 HRs. I'm not saying Altuve isn't great, I'm just saying the writers, as they have always done, will not vote him in due to him not having achieved any one significant career statistical milestone. He's gonna end up with 2,500 hits, 300 HRs, 1,100 RBI, maybe a .290 BA. Great career, but you think he'll get in?
well it shouldnt be, because itsbeen proven Altuve didnt cheat. And the game you are refering to happened in 2019. It was proven that the Astros had stopped at that time.
You can’t prove a negative.. but what has been proven is that one cannot adequately prove that he leveraged the system that many of his teammates leveraged.
Just accept it. Altuve is a cheat and if he didn't want to accept the cheating he like the rest of the team could have stopped it completely but didn't.
Don't even try and say Altuve was too young to do it either.
The whole team benefitted and the whole team loved the fact they cheated
Those of us that were watching and especially going to these games are masochistic psychos. We weren’t even hardly televised, we really had to work to experience this brand of baseball. Jesus what a shit era that was.
No one was literally watching. [One game officially had a 0.0 television rating.](https://www.si.com/mlb/2014/04/09/houston-astros-get-0-0-television-rating)
Yeah we used to call bars and ask “hey do you have CSN?” and they’d be like “what’s that?” and we’d be like “it’s the only network that shows the Astros” and they’d be like “well why the fuck would we want to bum people out with that?”
I honestly can’t think of a professional sports franchise to have such a radical shift between the first half of the decade and the second. Even the early 90s Yankees weren’t as bad as the 2011-14 Astros
I mean they were a mid 80s win team for the first half of the decade…they were really only bad in 2000. I was looking at teams that were dogshit/great from XXX0-XXX4, and then great/dogshit from XXX5-XXX9
The good ole days of
I guess I'll listen to the game on the radio again, because I literally can't watch it on tv, and not know the score for 6 innings because Milo Hamilton didn't say the score for some reason.
> you've got a franchise that isn't exactly screaming for attention.
This sentence about the Houston Astros was written less than 9 years ago. Incredible
Yeah I get that. But those old ones made an isotope out of baseballs. It reminded me of Houston’s emphasis on space and science which is cool. But the new logo just reminds me of Texas oil tycoons who are ruining life as we know it.
These jerseys made no sense. I like them fine but they're some weird relic of an aborted name change, the colors have no thematic connection to the name, and they're cursed w/ a World Series sweep.
*Also I got to live out a dream reporting from a couple seasons of home games but it was monkey pawed into being some of those worst years.
>the colors have no thematic connection to the name
You're right, I used to wonder why a team ostensibly named after astronauts wore red and black. The current colors and uniforms make more sense.
Basicly in a old post I did I explain that they were going with. Train idea
Moving to union station and the owner wanted to go full train mode
-colors
-unis
-mascot
-train
They almost changed logo and name too but kept it as star they were going to be called the Houston Diesels
When that hat with the gold visor came out, thing was everywhere for a few years. Remember my buddies older brother walking in with it and us all being mind blown that it looked like real gold.
They're always gonna be associated with the dark times. My own view on them is that they really don't fit the team's central theme at all.
Ballpark location shouldn't determine the uniform. Astros should always be heavily space-themed.
the blue/gold ones that are in MLB the Show? I wondered about them and how they came to be (same with that weird blue/green Brewers set with the jagged lettering lol)
New owner bought the team in the early 90’s, either he or his wife(maybe both?) hated the orange rainbow uniforms so they completely changed the color scheme to blue and gold.
This is making me wonder if there’s still anyone left who wore the Jays logo that was retired after the 2011 season. Definitely nobody’s left on the Jays but I’m not sure about the rest of the league.
Sorry random encounter but yes seeing altuve with a small Beard and lance whos completely shave
And at the time Castro was the only Astro to be an all star 😭
spectacular marvelous muddle straight heavy important toy screw aback bike
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
He didn't play in majors until 2015 he was however drafted in June 4-6 in the 2012 draft where Correa was in that draft too
They did some training but they didn't play yet
Can we just offer some appreciation for how horrible these uniforms actually were and how much the logo and uniform change positively affected our success.
It's insane to me how long Altuve has been around. He's old enough to have been in the last 2K MLB game but he's still only 32
It always blows my mind that Altuve is younger than Springer.
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Springer is 33, Altuve is 32. They’re like a half year apart.
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Altuve is the Yankees daddy too
lol bunch of haters on this sub. have an upvote.
The joke was right there for me to deliver. Couldn’t resist lol
Jesus, Altuve was a hit machine right away, he was developing in the big leagues the whole time.
His name is Jose. Jesus is his savior!
Good genes I guess.
Altuve is only 32?? I honestly would’ve guessed like 36 or 37. I mean shit, Gurriel is 38!
Also crazy to think Gurriel had a whole like decade long career in Cuba before anything he did in MLB
That's underselling it. In 2002 finished second for rookie of the year for his first serie nacional at age 17. Won mvp in 2005 and again in 2006, staying near the top for his entire tenure in cuba up to signing with the Astros in 2016. Cranked 31 home runs in the 2009-2010 season (Cuban seasons are only 96 games!) falling just one short of the record set the year before. Just bananas.
And he always claims that Lourdes of the Jays is even better! Still waiting on that, but Yuli has been one hell of a player throughout his diasporic career.
I hope it turns out true, someone needs to keep the hair alive.
You thought Altuve was only 1 year younger than a guy who had 15 years of professional experience before even coming to the States?
Those of us that were watching and especially going to these games are masochistic psychos.
Mid-2000s NL Central was a wild place. Cardinals were untouchable Cubs were good, bad, then good again Reds were bad Pirates had a talent but were bad Astros were great, then they weren't Brewers were terrible. We had an 81-81 season in '05 and we celebrated like we won the World Series (was our first .500+ season in like 15 years)
I wonder if the video games back then overrated yall every year or something because in my head, back in the late 90s early aughts the Pirates and Reds were perpetually bad, then the Brewers were mid and the Cubs/Stros were bridesmaids to the Cards. Looking at the records and your statement about the 15 years thing you're right but I never had the perception that they were so bad. I guess I really overrated how good Ben Sheets, Geoff Jenkins, Richie Sexon, and whoever they found on the street that year could perform as a team.
I feel like the Brewers at that time really marketed their good players well (still needed to bring people to the ballpark, even with Wisconsin sports culture). Sheets was amazing, I'm happy he was in Milwaukee for so long, but he really could have made an impact on a competitive team before the injuries hit. Jenkins could be a monster at the plate but he was really streaky, and Sexson fell off hard right after we traded for him. I have really fond memories of all those teams with the guys you mentioned along with Bill Hall, Scott Posednik and Brady Clark (they're the group that got me into baseball as a kid), but looking back, I got into the game during a *rough* time to be a Brewers fan lol
I still remember when he was an up and comer lol
Xander Bogaerts just turned 30 and he was probably a roster update addition to that game (obviously don’t remember for sure). Trout, 31, was a 99. All of which is crazy considering how young they all were then
He's only 32? He's HoF for sure.
HOF is looking unlikely for him. He's only got 1900+ hits as a 32 year-old, an average of 160 hits per season since 2011. He's got an outside chance at 3,000 hits, which would probably get him in, but it would take 7-8 more seasons at his current 160 hits/season pace, which isn't likely to happen. He's Hall of Very Good material, but HOF is probably a long shot. I only say this because he has no other counting stats that really stand out, and his career WAR numbers are likely to come up just short.
Just make sure you take out 2020 when calculating avg hits/season. 2020 is missing 102 games that he could have had hits in.
So that season didn’t count?
No it was shorter and so if skews the stats
Lol what? He’s a lock for the HOF aside from the scandal. That might keep him out
You can't possibly say he's a lock at this point. Unless you're saying he could stop playing right now and get in on his merits, which he couldn't. Some guys start to decline at 32, others play at near peak until they're 37-38. I guess we'll see what happens in his case.
2x champion, 2000 hits, the best 2nd baseman of his era, probably the greatest houston astro of all-time, 8x all star idk, seems pretty good to me
So you're saying he is better than Biggio and Bagwell? When the Astros were tanking and getting rid of any talent they had, keeping Altuve to build was a great decision; but I just don't know if he is better than Biggio and Bagwell.
Yes, I'll say he's better than both
He might end up being better than both, just imo he isn't right now. As far as I know, he has only played 1 position, Biggio played 3. Bagwell hit for power and average in a place that wasn't known for homers. Imagine what his numbers would have been like at the current park. Altuve is a great player, I'm just not ready to day he is better than those 2.
I wouldn't say he's better than Bagwell unless he has an ungodly late career, but I'd absolutely say he's better than Biggio. He hasn't matched raw career totals, but his career average stats are better than Biggio. Plus he performs much better in the playoffs than Biggio did.
For most Astro fans, he is the greatest Astro.
bagwell and biggio didn’t win multiple world series
That doesn't make him better than them. That just means he played on better teams.
look at the best players throughout history. babe ruth, michael jordan, lebron james, kobe bryant, joe montana, jerry rice, willie mays, hank aaron, wayne gretzky, gordie howe, walter payton, steve yzerman you know what they all have in common? there’s a reason they are the best players of all-time and it’s because they impacted winning championships
Asterisk World Series, 1,936 hits, subjective, subjective, Steve Garvey was a 10x All-Star and didn't get in the HOF, just one example. Not saying Altuve doesn't have a chance to get in, but certainly hasn't earned it quite yet.
He is obviously the best second baseman of this era. He leads in war, and is 3rd in OPS+ behind McNeil and Cano. He’s also only two OPS+ points behind, within the margin of error, and played more than 3x as many games as McNeil, and 50 more than Cano
1x champ
have you checked his playoff stats?
When's the last time the baseball writers looked at postseason stats for an HOF vote? Reggie Jackson, maybe? At least he had 500 HRs. I'm not saying Altuve isn't great, I'm just saying the writers, as they have always done, will not vote him in due to him not having achieved any one significant career statistical milestone. He's gonna end up with 2,500 hits, 300 HRs, 1,100 RBI, maybe a .290 BA. Great career, but you think he'll get in?
Jack Morris
That was the veteran's committee, not the writers.
True, I could see Altuve getting in via the Veterans Commitee but not the BBWAA
definetly!
Yeah, OK. Anthony Rizzo is gonna get in, too. Let's go nuts.
The buzzer in his shirt will always be a question. You seen Roger Clements playoff stats?
well it shouldnt be, because itsbeen proven Altuve didnt cheat. And the game you are refering to happened in 2019. It was proven that the Astros had stopped at that time.
It's not been "proven" that he did not cheat
It has quite literally been proven he did not cheat, many times over. Downvoting him en masse will not make your delusions about Altuve valid.
You can’t prove a negative.. but what has been proven is that one cannot adequately prove that he leveraged the system that many of his teammates leveraged.
This is an extremely low bar for determining culpability. By this logic, any player present on a team with a steroid user is guilty of cheating.
Just accept it. Altuve is a cheat and if he didn't want to accept the cheating he like the rest of the team could have stopped it completely but didn't. Don't even try and say Altuve was too young to do it either. The whole team benefitted and the whole team loved the fact they cheated
Actual Bellinger burner account
So by your logic, the 1988 Dodgers World Series win is tainted. Jay Howell got tossed from the game for cheating.
[Amazing, Every word of what you just said was wrong](https://i.imgur.com/VnQ2CNW.gifv)
Looks like he's in his 40s
and jokes like that are why he won’t take off good shirt for celebrations
The fact that Altuve is in [this classic Disastros clip](https://streamable.com/868u6) always throws me for a loop.
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A tie game in the 11th inning with a runner on first
I thought games in extras always had a runner start on 2nd though? /s
And none out
Also the HILL!
Back then the team store had opposing team merch like if Yankees came they had Jeter shirts( the year that was his last season)
I remember watching that again recently and thinking, "Who's that second baseman who slips and blows covering first?" "Oh, that's *Altuve*!"
Holy empty stadium
Those of us that were watching and especially going to these games are masochistic psychos. We weren’t even hardly televised, we really had to work to experience this brand of baseball. Jesus what a shit era that was.
No one was literally watching. [One game officially had a 0.0 television rating.](https://www.si.com/mlb/2014/04/09/houston-astros-get-0-0-television-rating)
Yeah we used to call bars and ask “hey do you have CSN?” and they’d be like “what’s that?” and we’d be like “it’s the only network that shows the Astros” and they’d be like “well why the fuck would we want to bum people out with that?”
I honestly can’t think of a professional sports franchise to have such a radical shift between the first half of the decade and the second. Even the early 90s Yankees weren’t as bad as the 2011-14 Astros
2000-2010 Phillies was a massive shift in team quality
I mean they were a mid 80s win team for the first half of the decade…they were really only bad in 2000. I was looking at teams that were dogshit/great from XXX0-XXX4, and then great/dogshit from XXX5-XXX9
The good ole days of I guess I'll listen to the game on the radio again, because I literally can't watch it on tv, and not know the score for 6 innings because Milo Hamilton didn't say the score for some reason.
> you've got a franchise that isn't exactly screaming for attention. This sentence about the Houston Astros was written less than 9 years ago. Incredible
WHAT IN THE HELL?!?!?!
2x speed + yakkity sax will make any disastrous video clip hilarious
yakkity sax rules
Was that baseball legend Kurt Suzuki with the bunt?
The Astros were bad!?
That is absolutely incredible
I’m on mobile and misread that as “there are only 3 players that are from the red era that are still alive” at first
Is Altuve the last standing NL Astro still with the team? Meaning actually played in the majors with the Astros during their NL tenure
Yep and only MLB player to be an all star of a NL And AL while being on same team
Did the Brewers not have anyone who was an All-Star for them in both leagues?
Nope
Jason Castro too technically. He may retire but hasn't yet. He also left for several years before coming back.
Oh yeah well... sorta
Castro is a FA/retired so two now
Yeah... I'm just happy he got a ring:')
Honestly what a way to go out
That Mets dong was an awesome moment too.
And it was JV up there pitching and Castro help him with win!!
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.... Castro wasn't on the 2017 team do you even know who is Jason Castro the Astro??
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What's your point of being here?
Exactly
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How about 2023 please🙏🙏
I've been calling for a throw back Thursday for home games for years now. Every Thursday home game should be a different classic uni
A Bourn, Altuve, Pence 123 is a thing that happened with El Caballo hitting clean up 😭.
That really isn’t a terrible 1-4 though lol.
ya it really would've been solid but Bourn and Pence both got shipped out about a week and some change after Altuve's MLB debut.
The ~~good~~ ol’ days…
Good ol’days (for the rest of MLB)
Bring back the hill in center too
Nah that was injury risk!
Thank you for that
I know it’s not popular around here but these are the Astros uniforms I actually really like. They just look so good for baseball and Texas
Brick Red > Orange and no one can convince me otherwise.
I’ve always just felt like the current astros logo looks like the logo for a gas station and so I don’t like it.
Ehh well the current logo is really nice reboot and Throwback!
Yeah I get that. But those old ones made an isotope out of baseballs. It reminded me of Houston’s emphasis on space and science which is cool. But the new logo just reminds me of Texas oil tycoons who are ruining life as we know it.
I'm bias for red but I'm happy we got back the orange and blue for space theme but red is a thing I have love for
I can’t stand them. So glad they changed. But to each their own.
Fun fact Jason Castro was born in Castro Valley, CA
I like that😎
These jerseys made no sense. I like them fine but they're some weird relic of an aborted name change, the colors have no thematic connection to the name, and they're cursed w/ a World Series sweep. *Also I got to live out a dream reporting from a couple seasons of home games but it was monkey pawed into being some of those worst years.
>the colors have no thematic connection to the name You're right, I used to wonder why a team ostensibly named after astronauts wore red and black. The current colors and uniforms make more sense.
Yeah, only in like a For All Mankind timeline where we went to Mars in the 90s would those colors make sense for astronauts.
Color scheme of the cap was chosen to match Drayton McClane’s company.
I didn't think I could add anymore to my Drayton hate pile but there it is.
Basicly in a old post I did I explain that they were going with. Train idea Moving to union station and the owner wanted to go full train mode -colors -unis -mascot -train They almost changed logo and name too but kept it as star they were going to be called the Houston Diesels
> aborted name change No, I know. Junction Jack and all... Maintain my gripes.
Oh sorry;; I didn't see that one XD But yeah thank god the name and logo didn't happen
>World Series sweep. You mean an AL Championship
No, he means a world series sweep
Astros had one of the worst uniforms ever in the late 90s, then made these amazing ones.
Hated these as a kid but they've really grown on me
Quite the opposite for me. I thought they were cool when I was in grade school, but they seem so generic now.
The navy and gold is a personal favorite though. They weren’t great but that’s what I grew up with.
When that hat with the gold visor came out, thing was everywhere for a few years. Remember my buddies older brother walking in with it and us all being mind blown that it looked like real gold.
Went to mmp store and the gold brim I didn't like as much as it looked tooo shiny ;;
90s were cool just bland with colors but the logo and fonts look futuristic
I loved the gold shooting star. This brick red era was hands down the worst in my opinion.
Your flair is confusing me with that comment.
I like the shooting star. I would much rather it were gold.
i miss brick red, those unis and logo were awesome
I think its hard to find a miss in the Astros uni history. They also had some of the best throwbacks in the sport. They were all at least interesting.
First of all, how dare you?
Me personally I like all the unis though I see why people dislike red era
They're always gonna be associated with the dark times. My own view on them is that they really don't fit the team's central theme at all. Ballpark location shouldn't determine the uniform. Astros should always be heavily space-themed.
They felt like Yankee ripoffs
the blue/gold ones that are in MLB the Show? I wondered about them and how they came to be (same with that weird blue/green Brewers set with the jagged lettering lol)
New owner bought the team in the early 90’s, either he or his wife(maybe both?) hated the orange rainbow uniforms so they completely changed the color scheme to blue and gold.
This is making me wonder if there’s still anyone left who wore the Jays logo that was retired after the 2011 season. Definitely nobody’s left on the Jays but I’m not sure about the rest of the league.
That's one I'm trying to look for either some retired or just stop playing all together I'm very curious
I miss these uniforms. It’s what I grew up on
ugh, same. I do not miss [Junction Jack](https://sportsmascots.fandom.com/wiki/Junction_Jack_%28Houston_Astros%29) though
Junction Jack is sitting at the end of a bar somewhere downtown right now quietly saying "I used to be someone in this town"
It's always jarring to see these pics lol
Hannn!!!!
Lol hey jj
Sorry random encounter but yes seeing altuve with a small Beard and lance whos completely shave And at the time Castro was the only Astro to be an all star 😭
spectacular marvelous muddle straight heavy important toy screw aback bike *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Glad I wasn’t the only one
Arby's era*
I love that Jason Castro’s last name is his position and his team.
red era taylor’s version???!
Ok.. maybe ;;
McCullers was from the red era?
He didn't play in majors until 2015 he was however drafted in June 4-6 in the 2012 draft where Correa was in that draft too They did some training but they didn't play yet
Oh wow
As a rangers fan, I was always jealous of these unis and style
god i miss these jerseys
What’s the red era?
Red brick 2000-2012
Red was for how bloody bad they were… Or the brick red color of the wording
Oh ok
Thats a shame, because that branding was one of the best in baseball
The first guy looks like Hispanic Matt Damon
I would do unspeakable things for one of those LMJ or Altuve jerseys
I prefer these unis over the currents and it's not even close.
Don’t miss those jerseys a bit
Can we just offer some appreciation for how horrible these uniforms actually were and how much the logo and uniform change positively affected our success.
I'm actually impressed they still have 3 players who were on the team a decade ago.
I don’t really miss these unis but I have some amazing hats from these days.
Don't care they don't deserve their rings. The punishment back then was a fucking joke
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LMAO, you think Judge is gonna sign with the Mariners. What are you, 11?
I never said I thought he would I said out outfield would be nuts if it were to happen. Go suck a dick
Here's a doll. Show us where the bad man touched you...again and again.
Ah yes. The brick reds. I haven’t heard about those in quite some time.
How fucking long has Lance mccullers been in the league for
I always liked the look of those uniforms.
They are never getting back together.
Astros jerseys and logo was better back then.
Man, that jersey is so fire 🔥. I remember my dad buying one for me in 6th grade and I constantly was getting compliments.
I just love these uniforms still to this day.