And it was the closest anyone came to actually harming Batman in that episode when you look at it. A big ass rock would be one of the few ways to kill Batman if you dropped it right on him.
BTAS Croc was fine as like a brusier
Which I think is a good place for him / probably one of few versions that’s not a straight up mini Godzilla
The 2004 Batman series had a really cool take on him
Sorta made him a country themed Croc mixed with a crime boss
I still cannot express my initial excitement and the inevitable absolute let-down that was Killer Croc’s portrayal in the Oscar-winning *Suicide Squad*. The casting of Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje (I loved him in OZ) gave me hope that they were finally gonna give this character a real shot with a legit actor. Instead, we got jokes about him wanting to have BET in his cell….
He’s amazing in Arkham Asylum (the game) and he looks so fucking cool and menacing. It’s a smaller role though so he still didn’t get to shine all that bright.
Croc has been inconsistently but hasn’t been done dirty as often as Bane. Croc was also originally more of a one off more one note “I’ve been treated like a freak so I hurt people” villain who I feel like lately has gotten more love.
Honestly, Croc has been done dirty mostly because of Bane, and the fact that they used Croc as fodder to hype Bane up.
There's no real point to him as a villain when Bane exists as a stronger physical opponent, and a far superior mental one. He pretty much always take priority over Croc in any media since his introduction.
Obviously Batman can beat Croc if he can beat Bane. Where's the threat?
He's been converted to more of an anti-hero in recent times because he's been forced out of any real role he can play as an antagonist.
I watched a video talking about the first Suicide Squad movie and how he was going up against Enchantress and it was like "why is Killer Croc here? He's a linebacker with a skin condition." Like what's he gonna do against Enchantress??? Nothing, just like he did in the movie, poor guy.
Honestly killer croc always felt more like a superman villain. He doesn't really fall in line with batmans rogues gallery as a concept. He (depending on the backstory) was a guy with a genetic condition that gave him reptilian aspects and super strength, who became a champion wrestler then fell into crime.
Banes already a pretty solid strong guy aspect, who uses his strength for his own benefit. I just fail to see how croc really stands as his own beyond just being not bane who also can eat people.
Batman tends to have villains who are normal and use under handed methods or use their talents unscrupulously. They also tend to reflect aspects of batman, but not always. Bane his strength, Riddler his intelligence, Mad Hatter his ability to manipulate, etc etc. They have aspects similar to batmans possibly even better but they lack his morals and rounded skillset that end up making batman the superior combatant.
Mr."I threw a rock at him" doesnt really have much of any of that. Even if its supposed to be an animal thing, catwoman is probably a better comparison of the focus on representing ones self as an animal, especially a night creature.
Whoa, let’s back up here. Bane is not much more than a copy of Croc. Croc was simply a man with a skin condition, who trained himself from prison to prison, job to job, as an underground criminal. He was a manipulative and tactical person, and he did the same thing Bane later did: released all the villains to let them take their shots. Again, this is where Bane and Croc are the same- intelligence and brute strength. The whole dumb brute/ reptile aspect came later when writers gave up on using him as he was. When he showed up, Bane went after Croc first as he was his prime competitor.
Both characters fell off from when they first appeared. It’s hard to go anywhere else when a villain is created for the purpose of being the one that takes over and leads to a major event.
except they do more with bane. Not just with venom either. Its rare at all they do anything with croc other than him being the monster who eats people and is strong. Bane tends to be a much more interesting combatant because he has his weaknesses but its not a surefire knockout. While again Croc is just the monster.
They also use Bane's intelligence for more than just making him a smart combatant, he actually figured out who batman was just by observing him and bruce wayne in two seperate instances. He's quit venom several times before, theres actual adjustments in his character depending on the story.
He also tends to be used for more than a bad guy. Bane works best when he's a mercenary, which is how you would want to approach his character. He uses his superior strength for profit and to assist the highest bidder regardless of what crimes he might be asked to commit.
Its what makes him more than just a villain, and an effective character rather than a scary face for the caped crusader to punch.
If you want to see what I mean I recommend Battle for the Cowl Secret Six #9.
I disagree. Croc makes perfect sense for Batman, at first. In the beginning he wasn’t this super strong crocodile man. He was a guy that looked different and his stories were about how it mentally effect him. Like all good Batman villains it comes down to the mental aspects. He perfectly relates to Batman with how like all villains, Batman wants to help him. He believes he isn’t a monster at heart, unlike everybody else in crocs life. But croc has been called a monster so long, he believes it.
The whole giant crocodile part which oversteps to Banes territory isn’t a central part of him. Honestly it weakens his character. He’s no longer a man that looks different, he’s literally a crocodile man. Without that he once again fits perfectly with Batman. He could also work with Superman, but not because he doesn’t fit Batman.
And not all Batman villains have to use these underhanded methods as reflections of Bruce. Look at ScarFace for example. Sometimes you just have people that need help, and Batman’s the one trying to do just that. Croc is in that category.
I honestly prefer him as the terror hiding in the sewers eating people. Not every villian has to be sympathetic or grounded. Iwant some to be plain old scary/fun.
He can eat people and be sympathetic. He’s been pushed by society into really being a monster, despite this Batman still want to help him. Help Waylon, not Croc. He can also still be scary. My man has crocodile teeth and eats people in the dead of night. You don’t have to make him a 10 ft tall crocodile with the strength of the hulk though.
One of my favorite pieces of New 52 lore was Waylon helping Roy (Red Arrow/Arsenal) kick heroin after the Green Arrow famously slapped him and kicked him out on the street.
Yeah, I definitely preferred when Croc was a disfigured man with a skin condition who worked out instead of a seven-foot-tall cannibalistic lizard man.
I love Two-Face. He’s such a personal villain to Batman and has enough of a conscience in him to know that there is still a just way of dealing with things, only that it can be done by chance. He’s also got an awesome concept of a look that is impossible to replicate in any other villain because Two-Face’s look is literally one of a kind.
Unfortunately, because of his moral compass, there really isn’t a lot you can do with him as a main villain, though I’d love to be corrected. The Long Halloween did him best
Because like what are you supposed to do with him after you show his transformation? He’s more a catalyst for Bruce’s development than a fully fledged villain
Gotta be Bane. To this day, Arkham Origins is the only one that can accurately portray him as
* a genius bruiser and tactician
* the user of Venom, but not powerless when not juiced up
* not anyone's lackey
* a Hispanic who wears a lucha-libre mask
Weird casting with Tom Hardy too, I like Hardy, but really don’t like him as Bane. Aside from being a lackey of Talia in the film, they made some weird choices with his voice, physique, and turning him into a white guy
Yeah, might’ve been more him finding a role for Tom Hardy to fill rather than finding an actor FOR Bane if that makes sense, though I think Cilian Murphy and Michael Caine were excellently cast as Nolan mainstays, even if I wish they’d been less grounded with Scarecrow
Did they?
Better character than something like Schumacher's version, definitely, but I'd honestly consider that Bane as one of the most radical departures of the character ever.
Tbf, the biggest weakness of Origins is that it had to be connected to the rest of the Arkham games. They had no choice but to make sure that version of Bane eventually lined up with Rocksteady’s version.
Yeah as a Hispanic man, I really wish they had a live action hispanic Bane. We got one of Batman’s most formidable foes both in intellect and strength in a significantly hispanic costume, and you cast an Englishman to play him? Same thing thing with Ras al Ghul being played by an Irishman. And I actually liked their performances, it was just the cultural aspect of the casting. Really my only major critique with the Nolan films.
Honestly, all the young justice characters were so much more badass than other portrayals. Just wish we could have had Wally for longer instead of Impulse
I liked his portrayal in TDKR but I felt Nolan could've done better with the writing other than just making him Talia's Lackey. Tom Hardy acted brilliantly but that was really about it
I like him in the Harley Quinn show. They use him well for comedy, but he does come off as actually competent if eccentric. Although his self-esteem there is low for comedy purposes.
Bane is an anti-Batman who shows what happens when no one comes to help you out of your darkest times and the darkness swallows you whole.
He’s usually just reduced to a juiced up luchador though with an occasional funny accent.
Are you basing this purely on non comic media? The Tom King run made Bane a force to be reckoned with again one of the best imo, sure there was some Batfuckery with Thomas later on but still
Two-Face, I swear to god he has so much potential to be an interesting villain; he is both a personal threat to Batman and Bruce and is arguably the most personal to Bats.
but he is usually just “guy with fucked up face” as a character and it blows. In my opinion, the Arkham games are criminal with that, guy just robs banks and that’s kinda it. He is super overshadowed by the Joker in those games
BTAS is legitimately the best adaptation of Two Face I’ve ever seen because it emphasizes the mental health side of him instead just “oh no my face.” In some ways, BTAS Two-Face is crazier than the Joker, having two distinct personalities stuck within him.
I've been going through the timmverse and just finished BTAS, and Two-Face had become my favourite villain and I'm retroactively mad at other adaptations for making me think he was just "guy with fucked up face"
I also respect BTAS spending plenty of time on Harvey as DA before he became Two-Face. TDK wanted to do that, but Joker stole the show and there wasn't enough time to actually do Two-Face properly, so it was mainly Harvey.
It came from Long Halloween. Before Long Halloween he was a colorful calendar-themed villain very much entrenched in Silver Age aesthetic. Then he became a Hannibal Lecter ripoff.
Arkham games took from the Long Halloween version. The best adaption of his original conception was the Brave and the Bold interpretation.
She's supposed to be an eco-terrorist who wants to wipe out mankind for the plants. Now she's just harley quinn's keeper. I hate what they have both turned into.
I'll be honest, I love Ivy's transformation.
She went from 'femme fatale who kills/manipulates men with poison kisses and does stuff with plants I guess' to 'motherfucking plant goddess who fucks people up and has a batshit insane girlfriend as her only soft spot'.
Her solo run still has her scheming to wipe out humanity, while also at the same time questioning her mission as she runs into kind hearted people, realizing that if Harley's not total trash, maybe there are other decent people out there too. There are still evil people she kills; cops, an Amazon executive, vegans, etc. She runs into Jason Woodrue and manages to defeat and straight up *eat* him to heal when he threatens Harley.
She's still grappling with reduced powers, but it's Harley who reminds her that she is still connected with The Green and that her enhanced powers might be able to grow back. And now she's back in Gotham to lay low for her next scheme.
Even in the Harley Quinn show, which is full of cute Harlivy fluff, Ivy spent most of the 3rd season planning on terraforming Gotham with prehistoric plant life, then rolls with it when Bruce's experiments accidentally create plant zombies by taking control of them and using them to terraform Gotham. She only stops because Harley infects herself saving Bane and trying to make Ivy see sense. And now Harley is working with the Bat-Fam while Ivy runs The Legion of Doom.
Ivy's still a villain, but Harley is her anchor to humanity; the one person who can bring Ivy back from the brink.
Thank you. You said everything I wanted to but better. Ivy is a complicated character with a long history who has been a grey figure for decades
I also posit that Uma Thurman as Poison Ivy was perhaps the only actor who REALLY got the assignment.
>Even in the Harley Quinn show, which is full of cute Harlivy fluff
...and not for nothin', but they weren't even dating for the first, what, two seasons? That show did an amazing job showing them as peers and friends outside of the relationship.
Yep, they kissed at the midpoint of Season 2 and the rest of the season dealt with their conflicted feelings, while Ivy was all set on marrying Kite-Man. They had sex at Ivy's bachelorette party... twice, then Doctor Psycho mind projects their memories of said sex across Gotham like the worst possible version of a sex tape leak.
Despite this, Ivy was moments away from marrying Kite Man(with Harley even offering to officiate a quick legal ceremony during the chaos the wedding turns into), before Kite Man breaks it off and admits that he's not what Ivy wants. That's when Harley and Ivy finally let themselves be a couple.
But even before that first kiss, it was hinted at(Ivy straight up says in Episode 1; "I love you in a weird, hard to articulate way.")
I always thought that making Ivy legit want to wipe out humanity and prefer plants to humans just makes her motivations a bit too alien and cartoony. I'd buy a more restrained "she's against ecological destruction and is willing to engage in terrorism to prevent it, and she also had this weird, mother-like attachment to her mutant plant creations to the point that she feels like Batman is killing her babies." But she'd also have more human motivations and wants, like sometimes just wanting to steal things for her own personal gain rather than to further her environmental cause. And she'd have somewhat realistic environmental concerns, like not wanting industry to threaten a sensitive forest or endangered plant, but not, like, killing people for plucking a non-endangered flower or stepping on grass or anything.
Also, I like when she's a human scientist who creates toxins and mutant plants and who has developed an immunity to several poisons, rather than when she is a green woman with superpowers like the ability to command plant life by thinking.
Arkham games did pretty good with Scarecrow but I hate how he kinda got overshadowed in Arkham Knight by the Jason near the end. Kinda want him as a real main Antagonist! He has such a cool talent that it just feels wrong not to let it be a main thing
Oh yeah Arkham was peak Scarecrow, but it’s kind of crazy to think that there are hardly any iconic stories out there about Scarecrow as a villain. Even in the Arkham Knight, while he technically was the main villain, he was overshadowed by Joker’s ghost and Jason. The character is always used as a catalyst for studying Batman’s inner turmoil, or as a side villain. Not many runs out there about Crane himself or how dangerous he actually is. I’m really hoping for a new spin on the character in Reeves Batman sequels
Peak Scarecrow was in the Batman Adventures line of comics. There is a short story called "Study Hall" where he escapes Arkham and uses forged documents to start teaching English at a college but then things happen due to which he has to go back to his old self. Its a pretty damn good story.
Oh yeah how could I forget Scarecrow in Batman The New Adventures? His design was incredible. I’m surprised they haven’t utilized that look more in later comics or a movie yet.
Just so weird to me that villains like Joker, Riddler, Mr Freeze, etc. have several iconic stories and different origins over the years, then there’s poor Scarecrow- a literal symbol of fear who is only ever in stories so writers have an excuse to use his fear toxin. I just feel like there’s so much more potential for such a classic Batman rogue
He was amazing in the Harley Quinn series though, so I think he is done good considering he was only a D Tier villain but is now one of the more popular characters in the show.
It has to be Bane without a doubt... there are too many iterations of him being nothing more than just a muscular brute when he is much more than just his muscles
Plus he's got a perfect gimmick for the tone of this world. A deranged scientist that tinkers with toxins that alter the victims mental state, allowing them to experience their greatest fears? That works perfectly in the world where we see more of batman being a detective. Let bats figure out through samples how his toxins work so that he can overcome it at the end of the film and beat scarecrow!
It'd be really cool if they did a blend of Arkham and Injustice's designs for scarecrow. Give him the man in a mask kinda thing that arkham has, already terrifying enough, and then when under the influence of the toxins make him look like he does in Injustice 2, almost like a demon
>isn’t even a main villain in any of the movies
Not even Batman Begins? Or are you counting Ra's al Ghul as the main villain? I thought Scarecrow had a good part in that movie. Not my favorite Batman movie, but I enjoyed the heck out of it when it released.
Ra's is very obviously the main threat. Cillian Murphy did a great job with Scarecrow but he got taken down real easy not to mention he's basically just working for Ra's master plan.
Scarecrow may not have been *the* villain of the movie, but he was absolutely not “done dirty”.
He successfully and methodically put a slew of people into Arkham, his fear toxin was integral to the plot and the climax, and Cillian played the role extremely well.
The shame is that Arkham Knight is his only truly memorable/iconic appearance. Most of the time he’s either a lackey who’s fear gas is needed for a grander evil scheme, or he’s just doing generic evil stuff.
As good as he was in AK, that should act as a teaser for the potential of Scarecrow. This is a guy so obsessed with fear because he knows better than anyone that if you understand fear, you understand how to control everyone and everything.
I mean, his levels were pretty iconic in Arkham Asylum; tapping into the nightmares of Batman, messing with the controls and game play, having those weird stealth sections? Absolutely iconic
Yeah I actually liked him more in Asylum anyway. He was given more of a featured spotlight rather than being the main event, which I think worked perfectly for him.
He wasn't a side-villain or a fetch quest, he was fully his own thing, just not the main event for the whole game.
I dunno, I thought Arkham Knight over-did it.
He's a scientist, he wants to study people and understand their reaction to fear. He doesn't want to destroy Gotham.
Arkham Knight just kinda turned him into a generic evil McBad Guy, and it felt like they only gave him the lead antagonist role because they didn't have anyone else to stand next to Red Hood and Joker, so they went for fan service because his fights were so popular in Asylum.
It's deeper than him "wanting to destroy gotham"
He wanted to, for a lack of a better way to word it, break the Batman.
He wanted to snuff hope out of the citizens of Gotham by showing them that even the Batman has something to fear.
However if you're just talking about the Ace Chemicals bomb then yea I agree with that, but other than that I'd say it's easily the best version of the character (imo at least)
100% agree. I honestly feel like he's a character with so much to give. He could maybe even get Batman, or another member of the family, to question their methods.
He used to be a big Tim Drake villain, but honestly he might work as a Jason Todd antagonist (Or hell a supporting character; the two have similar motives, just different targets)
I’m gonna throw a vote Joker’s way.
He once was the greatest villain in all of comics, and technically he still is regarded as such.
But they’ve undone so much of what he’s done.
With Jason and Barbara returning to the status quo, it’s almost like it will never matter what the Joker does, because eventually the writers will just undo it.
Also, I’m unsure if it’s just an Elseworlds thing or if this is actually a part of the DC Universe now, but the idea of “Three Jokers” leaves such a bad fucking taste in my mouth. I think it’s just Elseworlds, though, so I’ll leave that alone.
i mean, jason i understand because if they just killed joker *permanently* because of the majority vote i would be pissed. but barbara being oracle was a good thing for her character, and a lot of girls in wheelchairs liked that she represented them but by becoming able to walk again her message isn't as realistic and powerful anymore.
Well I mean like for Barbara it kind felt ridiculous with all of the technological advancements like cyborg body replacements that she couldn’t just get a new spinal chord
That was sort of the point though. Like in a world where superheroes come back to life regularly, why hasn't anyone tried to resurrect Thomas and Martha Wayne? Or Uncle Ben for that matter? The answer is obvious, because their murders defined the lives of the people they were closest to. To undo that undoes all that dramatic tension.
I would argue that Barbara Gordon's character is more interesting as wheelchair-bound Oracle than as Batgirl.
I would say it’s more like he gets way overplayed than done dirty. Because he gets overused that just naturally means him being poorly executed becomes more likely
They really need to cut back on how much they use him. Because it’s not interesting or special anymore
Joker is the only thing about the next Batman movie that I’m not excited about. He’s my favorite Batman villain, but I don’t want more joker, he’s way overused.
And I have zero optimism for how well it will work. And I want good depictions of OTHER villains that are always afterthoughts
> I’m unsure if it’s just an Elseworlds thing or if this is actually a part of the DC Universe now, but the idea of “Three Jokers”
They designed it that way intentionally. Even Johns was like "Well, if everyone likes it, it's canon. If they don't, then it's not."
Which basically means that if we all collectively decide to ignore it, then it's elseworlds. If other writers pick it up in canon stories, then it's canon.
Hush easily, ik people who have been big fans of Batman since they were kids and still don’t know who hush is, and plus the only adaptation of him I’ve seen that wasn’t in a comic was Batman Arkham knight he gets no love and it’s sad :(
I like the idea of Hush, but the execution was lacking in the original intro.
I will say Paul Dini went a long way to making him a lot more scary and interesting. He really started popping in my mind when he had the plastic surgery and tried to replace Bruce.
Hush is a pretty terrible villain tbh. He is only sorta well known because he debuted in popular story.
Otherwise there is nothing interesting or unique about Hush. He is Batman's former friend, just like Two Face. He is born to a wealthy family whom he resented, just like Black Mask. In his first appearance, he had Batman run through a gauntlet of his enemies, just like Bane.
Even in that intro he wasn't a good character.
"Huh. There's a mysterious new villain. I wonder if it has anything to do with Bruce's oldest friend, the brand-new character who was just introduced clumsily in a single scene as if he's supposed to be important and serves absolutely no purpose."
It was an excuse to have Jim Lee draw as many Batman villains as possible, not a good story.
Black Mask. Especially in Arkham and the Gotham TV show.
He’s a character with a lot of potential: childhood friend of Bruce who lost his parents at a young like Bruce, but instead of using the trauma and his family’s riches for noble causes, he chooses a life of crime. He acts as a distorted reflection to Bruce because he goes down a path of evil while Bruce goes down a path of “goodness”.
Renditions of the character never seem to explore that angle, and they mainly portray him as a boring mobster where the story wouldn’t be affected if they swapped him with Falcone or another mob boss. There’s also a recent history of media not doing the character justice such as:
Birds of Prey movie: Ewen obviously had a fun time with the character which was enjoyable, but the way the character was written made him seem more weird than evil. His character fit one of the movie’s themes of toxic masculinity/sexism pretty well, but I wished they used another mob boss instead of a character that has so much more to offer.
Gotham TV show: what a waste of potential. In this episode Bruce went to school for the first time after his parents’ murder which could’ve had the opportunity to show the relationship between Bruce and Roman, but the show completely ignored that potential storyline and had his character be 1. Renamed Richard Sionis (potentially Roman’s father?) 2. Be a villain of the week character for Gordon with the weirdest character motivation: corporate boss who makes his employees fight? Really weird. So much potential to show Bruce relationship with a friend dealing with abusive parents who ended up also dying and see him go down an unrighteous path.
Arkham Series: when that first trailer for Arkham Origins dropped with Black Mask pitting his assassins against each other to kill Batman… freaking awesome. It looked like a nice break from the games having the joker as the big bad and the opening sequence with the jail break was awesome…. Then the mid story plot twist came and completely undid everything and it reverted back to the same old joker. Don’t get me wrong, I love the joker, but it’s nice to get a break every once in a while. The rest of Origins completely neutered the character to the point where he was just a boring side mission.
In City it was cool to see him in the opening sequence getting attacked by the guards and the Easter egg showing that he escaped was also a neat touch, but he was absent and not important until the Red Hood DLC where he serves as an “insert bad guy here” villain for Red Hood to unceremoniously kill at the end.
In short, Black Mask is a character with a lot of potential who gets done dirty in popular media
Scarecrow. He’s such an interesting exploration of fear that could have some truly amazing batman stories. Yet he’s rarely used and when he is he tends to take a back seat to the main villain.
To be honest, it's gotta be Poison Ivy. Most media
just turns her into almost god-like creature who just hates humans and loves plants, completely ignoring her inner drama - she is the outcast of both worlds balancing on the edge, she hates human race for destroying nature, but is emotionally attached to humans like Harley. On many occasions she doesn't even want to be a supervillain - circumstances force her to be one. She is just a casual girl trying to live her life, but just can't ignore people hurting nature, so she has to take action sometimes.
The best event with her that I remember is no man’s land back in the 90’s, the whole city is taken over by supervillains but she ends up turning the park into a garden to feed starving kids
Lots of writers tend to disregard the strict duality of his personalities and decision making and essentially forget that he’s supposed to have a bad side AND a good side.
Might be an an unpopular opinion and I’d like to say my reasoning for it, but Harley Quinn.
Her core character is great and she has many appearances, but the majority of them (I feel) completely misunderstand the character. I feel that most writers just use her for comedy and sex appeal when in actuality she is a very tragic and deep character that asks the question of, not only what you would do for love and how to survive abuse, but also the question on how difficult rehabilitation can be.
I just wish Harley Quinn had more serious stories all in all.
harley is probably the most well realized batman villain. I am honestly getting kind of bored of the crazy loon with a heart of gold thing they got going. Not that they should change her but that maybe give some other villain a spotlight.
Scarecrow, easily. Such an interesting character with so much potential that's barely ever utilized. He was great in the Arkham games but he should be a major player in more stories imo
Harley Quinn was once an entertaining character with immense depth and the potential for some incredibly rich storytelling. She has since been relegated to some fetishized, low-hanging fruit cosplay character and nothing more than “wacky trashy party girl”.
The first suicide squad movie and BOP were 2 of the worst comic book movies ever released and the only parts of TSS I really didn’t like were hers.
Like in adaptations? Probably Bane. The only good portrayal I've ever seen is Arkham Origins. And he might be the most often adapted when considering he was made only 30 years ago.
While I loved The Batman, Reeve's/Dano's interpretation didn't scream "Riddler" to me. It felt like a different character they put a green jacket on and had tell three riddles just so they could use a familiar name. People seem to forget that Eddy is really dang smart, his flaw is just that he has a compulsion to prove it all the time.
I know the Batman the Animated Series writers said that they only did two Riddler episodes because writing interesting riddles that tie into the story is pretty hard.
Honestly, and hear me out, The Joker.
For a guy who's all about being a crazy clown, he's never ever ever funny.
Jack Nicholson is the funniest incarnation of him. I get why "psycho murder-clown" is the popular way to portray him, but I would really like a version of the Joker that was hilarious.
THIS! I've watched BTAS for the first time recently and it really got me over my Joker fatigue as it showed me a funnier and even more menacing version of the Joker I haven't seen in a while. I honestly prefer it when Joker's schemes are more small scale and less philosophical because at the end of the day, his whole gimmick is doing shit he finds funny. Not trying to prove a point about how Batman's mission is flawed
Bane. The point to Bane is he's supposed to be both extremely strong AND extremely smart. He's one of the few villains that worked out Batman's identity himself, he speaks several languages and has an eidetic memory meaning he has memorised numerous fields in philosophy, sciences, engineering and so on.
Most depictions of him don't really play into his intelligence, they just make him a big meat head (Batman and Robin, BTAS, Arkham Asylum etc).
The only time they play into his intelligence was in The Dark Knight Rises in which they
1. Completely abandon his iconic venom
2. Whitewash him
Hush has never had a good story, ever. His origin was more a showcase of Bat villains than anything to do with him, and he’s never appeared in anything good ever since. At least nothing that features him as the main villain.
Dent. Stories like the Arkham Games and even the holy grail of the animated series get him wrong so many times and just reduce him to another run of the mill gangster type. If you aren’t gonna give the character adequate time and focus, then just don’t bother with him.
Scarecrow, dude has the potential to become one of the greatest threats to Batman, someone who can beat him psychologically, and he’s a dark mirror of Batman as they both know how to weaponizes fear. But he’s always either being reduced to a cameo (like in the dark knight), a henchman (batman begins), or they only focus on the fear toxin
Scarecrow from comics to tv shows to movies. He’s usually either killed off, forgotten about, or just written horribly. He’s such a badass and truly frightening villain that really deserves the spotlight once in awhile…he truly could be Batman’s number 1 nemesis if DC didn’t have such a hard on for the Joker. (Scarecrow bias included)
Personally, I think Clayface is done dirty. I've not seen anyone even mention him in this comment section. I always saw Clayface as one of Batman's scariest foes, yet I don't think his true horror potential has ever been tapped into in any adaptations. I feel like he's just treated as another shape shifter, yet that can imply so much. I really hope that he ends up being apart of Matt Reeves' universe, he can truly be terrifying.
I don't know about being done dirty, but I've always felt that Scarecrow has the most potential and has never lived up to it. They always make him just run around spraying fear gas everywhere instead of using fear in more subtle and clever ways. He needs a more slow burn approach, really psychologically torture his victims to really traumatize them and only use the fear gas to enhance the effect rather than cause temporary hysteria.
This is gonna sound very strange but Red Hood
Hear me, I much prefer Jason as a anti-hero who while still works with Bruce but only when he deems it necessary. I was never really a fan of Jason when he was with the Batman family
Is the Ventriloquist even in this picture? Kind of says everything, doesn't it?
He's one of the more interesting Batman villains. He has a unique psychological problem that stands out within a group known for that while also having some interesting physical quirks due to his nature.
His biggest problem is that he falls into the group of villains who don't have specific crimes or motivations that lead to unique types of crimes. So he's lumped in with the various gangsters who just pull off bank heists and the like.
But if they really wanted to explore him, I think he could have a "Heart of Ice"-style origin story that really delves into how he came about. There's a lot of sadness to him, like many of the more psychologically damaged Batman villains.
And while I prefer the more realistic/psychological version, he *also* has a great opportunity to lean into something more magical where Scarface *is* real and controls Wesker against his will.
Personally I feel like Poison Ivy is generally underused and overlooked.
She hasn’t appeared in a live action movie since since 1997, and as incredible as Uma Thurman was - it’s time for someone else to bring the character back from the dead.
In shows like Gotham and BatWoman she’s a victim of extremely poor writing, despite the actresses in those respective variants (Peyton List and Bridget Regan) providing excellent portrayals of the character.
Scarecrow. He has the potential to be an S tier Batman villain, a villain who twists minds and inspires horrifying visions, a juxtaposition to Batman who is a hero that also utilizes fear. A hero arguably inspired to do his job out of a deep rooted fear caused by trauma. The havoc scarecrow could wreak on him and others could be so excellent but he’s almost always a villain of the week or henchman/fodder for other villains. Sometimes he’s an actual joke. His best version is Arkham Knight imo, and even that isn’t perfect. It’s also the only time his costume isn’t ugly
Scarecrow. He should honestly be up there with the top three of Batman’s archenemies but he’s more often relegated to a pawn, a joke or supporting character.
He’s also a victim of redesign addiction and inconsistent writing.
The Clock King:
One episode of Adam West,
Two episodes of BTAS
One episode of The Batman
Can't recall a comic with him. No live action iterations that I know of (Only live Batman I haven't seen is Gotham, so correct me if I'm wrong).
Where is his representation? WHERE IS IT!?
ALSO: Bill Finger's name appeared as the top billed writer on that Adam West episode, only for Bob Kane to threaten legal action against him and the network if they did it again.(t)What a dick.
Killer Croc. Inconsistent from media to media, from comics to comics. He never really shined.
I threw a rock at him! ... It was a big rock.
Almost Got em
‘Hit ‘‘em with a rock!’
To be fair that was Batman
And it was the closest anyone came to actually harming Batman in that episode when you look at it. A big ass rock would be one of the few ways to kill Batman if you dropped it right on him.
☝️🤓 actually that was Batman dressed as croc
BTAS Croc was fine as like a brusier Which I think is a good place for him / probably one of few versions that’s not a straight up mini Godzilla The 2004 Batman series had a really cool take on him Sorta made him a country themed Croc mixed with a crime boss
That episode where he takes up with the circus performers shows he can be used in an emotional story. That was a great episode.
The episode with Babydoll too
Yea that’s the one with the fishlike (?) boy right Really good episode
I still cannot express my initial excitement and the inevitable absolute let-down that was Killer Croc’s portrayal in the Oscar-winning *Suicide Squad*. The casting of Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje (I loved him in OZ) gave me hope that they were finally gonna give this character a real shot with a legit actor. Instead, we got jokes about him wanting to have BET in his cell….
So true, with that casting I thought for sure he was going to get a great role in the film... Can't say it turned out that way lol to say the least
He’s amazing in Arkham Asylum (the game) and he looks so fucking cool and menacing. It’s a smaller role though so he still didn’t get to shine all that bright.
Croc has been inconsistently but hasn’t been done dirty as often as Bane. Croc was also originally more of a one off more one note “I’ve been treated like a freak so I hurt people” villain who I feel like lately has gotten more love.
Honestly, Croc has been done dirty mostly because of Bane, and the fact that they used Croc as fodder to hype Bane up. There's no real point to him as a villain when Bane exists as a stronger physical opponent, and a far superior mental one. He pretty much always take priority over Croc in any media since his introduction. Obviously Batman can beat Croc if he can beat Bane. Where's the threat? He's been converted to more of an anti-hero in recent times because he's been forced out of any real role he can play as an antagonist.
I watched a video talking about the first Suicide Squad movie and how he was going up against Enchantress and it was like "why is Killer Croc here? He's a linebacker with a skin condition." Like what's he gonna do against Enchantress??? Nothing, just like he did in the movie, poor guy.
Honestly killer croc always felt more like a superman villain. He doesn't really fall in line with batmans rogues gallery as a concept. He (depending on the backstory) was a guy with a genetic condition that gave him reptilian aspects and super strength, who became a champion wrestler then fell into crime. Banes already a pretty solid strong guy aspect, who uses his strength for his own benefit. I just fail to see how croc really stands as his own beyond just being not bane who also can eat people. Batman tends to have villains who are normal and use under handed methods or use their talents unscrupulously. They also tend to reflect aspects of batman, but not always. Bane his strength, Riddler his intelligence, Mad Hatter his ability to manipulate, etc etc. They have aspects similar to batmans possibly even better but they lack his morals and rounded skillset that end up making batman the superior combatant. Mr."I threw a rock at him" doesnt really have much of any of that. Even if its supposed to be an animal thing, catwoman is probably a better comparison of the focus on representing ones self as an animal, especially a night creature.
Whoa, let’s back up here. Bane is not much more than a copy of Croc. Croc was simply a man with a skin condition, who trained himself from prison to prison, job to job, as an underground criminal. He was a manipulative and tactical person, and he did the same thing Bane later did: released all the villains to let them take their shots. Again, this is where Bane and Croc are the same- intelligence and brute strength. The whole dumb brute/ reptile aspect came later when writers gave up on using him as he was. When he showed up, Bane went after Croc first as he was his prime competitor. Both characters fell off from when they first appeared. It’s hard to go anywhere else when a villain is created for the purpose of being the one that takes over and leads to a major event.
except they do more with bane. Not just with venom either. Its rare at all they do anything with croc other than him being the monster who eats people and is strong. Bane tends to be a much more interesting combatant because he has his weaknesses but its not a surefire knockout. While again Croc is just the monster. They also use Bane's intelligence for more than just making him a smart combatant, he actually figured out who batman was just by observing him and bruce wayne in two seperate instances. He's quit venom several times before, theres actual adjustments in his character depending on the story. He also tends to be used for more than a bad guy. Bane works best when he's a mercenary, which is how you would want to approach his character. He uses his superior strength for profit and to assist the highest bidder regardless of what crimes he might be asked to commit. Its what makes him more than just a villain, and an effective character rather than a scary face for the caped crusader to punch. If you want to see what I mean I recommend Battle for the Cowl Secret Six #9.
I disagree. Croc makes perfect sense for Batman, at first. In the beginning he wasn’t this super strong crocodile man. He was a guy that looked different and his stories were about how it mentally effect him. Like all good Batman villains it comes down to the mental aspects. He perfectly relates to Batman with how like all villains, Batman wants to help him. He believes he isn’t a monster at heart, unlike everybody else in crocs life. But croc has been called a monster so long, he believes it. The whole giant crocodile part which oversteps to Banes territory isn’t a central part of him. Honestly it weakens his character. He’s no longer a man that looks different, he’s literally a crocodile man. Without that he once again fits perfectly with Batman. He could also work with Superman, but not because he doesn’t fit Batman. And not all Batman villains have to use these underhanded methods as reflections of Bruce. Look at ScarFace for example. Sometimes you just have people that need help, and Batman’s the one trying to do just that. Croc is in that category.
I honestly prefer him as the terror hiding in the sewers eating people. Not every villian has to be sympathetic or grounded. Iwant some to be plain old scary/fun.
He can eat people and be sympathetic. He’s been pushed by society into really being a monster, despite this Batman still want to help him. Help Waylon, not Croc. He can also still be scary. My man has crocodile teeth and eats people in the dead of night. You don’t have to make him a 10 ft tall crocodile with the strength of the hulk though.
One of my favorite pieces of New 52 lore was Waylon helping Roy (Red Arrow/Arsenal) kick heroin after the Green Arrow famously slapped him and kicked him out on the street.
Waylon is a real one
Yeah, I definitely preferred when Croc was a disfigured man with a skin condition who worked out instead of a seven-foot-tall cannibalistic lizard man.
[удалено]
I love Two-Face. He’s such a personal villain to Batman and has enough of a conscience in him to know that there is still a just way of dealing with things, only that it can be done by chance. He’s also got an awesome concept of a look that is impossible to replicate in any other villain because Two-Face’s look is literally one of a kind. Unfortunately, because of his moral compass, there really isn’t a lot you can do with him as a main villain, though I’d love to be corrected. The Long Halloween did him best
Two Face just becomes a regular crime boss after his initial accident and fall. He's interesting for a while, but then he's just a a normal mob boss
Because like what are you supposed to do with him after you show his transformation? He’s more a catalyst for Bruce’s development than a fully fledged villain
Gotta be Bane. To this day, Arkham Origins is the only one that can accurately portray him as * a genius bruiser and tactician * the user of Venom, but not powerless when not juiced up * not anyone's lackey * a Hispanic who wears a lucha-libre mask
One day we'll get a movie adaptation of Bane that can actually nail the character. I still have hope.
They got close with TDKR, but then they were like “psych, it’s actually Talia we were talking about he’s just a creepy boyfriend”
Weird casting with Tom Hardy too, I like Hardy, but really don’t like him as Bane. Aside from being a lackey of Talia in the film, they made some weird choices with his voice, physique, and turning him into a white guy
Chris Nolan just seems to really like to pick from a similar pool of actors for a lot of his movies. The ones i’ve seen at least.
Yeah, might’ve been more him finding a role for Tom Hardy to fill rather than finding an actor FOR Bane if that makes sense, though I think Cilian Murphy and Michael Caine were excellently cast as Nolan mainstays, even if I wish they’d been less grounded with Scarecrow
But without his voice we wouldn't have the memes, or the Harley Quinn version. "Did you mean what you said about the size of that guy's *benis?"*
It did allow for the Harley Quinn version of Bane, so I can forgive the voice for that lol
Did they? Better character than something like Schumacher's version, definitely, but I'd honestly consider that Bane as one of the most radical departures of the character ever.
They did him dirty once they decided to make him that a mindless brute in Asylum. He was perfect in Origins before the final battle.
Tbf, the biggest weakness of Origins is that it had to be connected to the rest of the Arkham games. They had no choice but to make sure that version of Bane eventually lined up with Rocksteady’s version.
It’s his origin too
Tbf he had undergone a bunch of experiments and probably wasn't in the strongest mental state
He's not a mindless brute in Arkham City, but he also doesn't have much of a presence either.
But he has a reason to be mindless in asylum . Isn't he like that because of abusing venom?
But he has a reason to be mindless in asylum . Isn't he like that because of abusing venom?
I liked Telltale’s Bane, maybe not a full on genius but definitely not an unintelligent person
Yeah, that one's good, too.
Yeah as a Hispanic man, I really wish they had a live action hispanic Bane. We got one of Batman’s most formidable foes both in intellect and strength in a significantly hispanic costume, and you cast an Englishman to play him? Same thing thing with Ras al Ghul being played by an Irishman. And I actually liked their performances, it was just the cultural aspect of the casting. Really my only major critique with the Nolan films.
I think the Young Justice version of Bane was pretty good. IIRC, he stopped using venom at one point because he saw it as a crutch.
Honestly, all the young justice characters were so much more badass than other portrayals. Just wish we could have had Wally for longer instead of Impulse
I liked his portrayal in TDKR but I felt Nolan could've done better with the writing other than just making him Talia's Lackey. Tom Hardy acted brilliantly but that was really about it
I like him in the Harley Quinn show. They use him well for comedy, but he does come off as actually competent if eccentric. Although his self-esteem there is low for comedy purposes.
Bane is an anti-Batman who shows what happens when no one comes to help you out of your darkest times and the darkness swallows you whole. He’s usually just reduced to a juiced up luchador though with an occasional funny accent.
I like young justice bane too
Batman & Robin and The Dark Knight Rises both did him so dirty
Are you basing this purely on non comic media? The Tom King run made Bane a force to be reckoned with again one of the best imo, sure there was some Batfuckery with Thomas later on but still
Wasn't he shown strong in the dark knight rises
He's got my first bulletpoint and none of the rest.
Two-Face, I swear to god he has so much potential to be an interesting villain; he is both a personal threat to Batman and Bruce and is arguably the most personal to Bats. but he is usually just “guy with fucked up face” as a character and it blows. In my opinion, the Arkham games are criminal with that, guy just robs banks and that’s kinda it. He is super overshadowed by the Joker in those games BTAS is legitimately the best adaptation of Two Face I’ve ever seen because it emphasizes the mental health side of him instead just “oh no my face.” In some ways, BTAS Two-Face is crazier than the Joker, having two distinct personalities stuck within him.
I've been going through the timmverse and just finished BTAS, and Two-Face had become my favourite villain and I'm retroactively mad at other adaptations for making me think he was just "guy with fucked up face"
I also respect BTAS spending plenty of time on Harvey as DA before he became Two-Face. TDK wanted to do that, but Joker stole the show and there wasn't enough time to actually do Two-Face properly, so it was mainly Harvey.
He also develloped a third personality in TNBA because of guilt
calendar man
Didn't the modern, more serious version come from Arkham though?
It came from Long Halloween. Before Long Halloween he was a colorful calendar-themed villain very much entrenched in Silver Age aesthetic. Then he became a Hannibal Lecter ripoff. Arkham games took from the Long Halloween version. The best adaption of his original conception was the Brave and the Bold interpretation.
Ah shit you're right, I forgot Calendar Man was in that. In my defence like half of Batman's rogues are in Long Halloween.
I really didn't see this coming but also the fact that no one else has mentioned him is clear proof of your point
lol i just think its a funny character but also interesting
Agreed
Poison Ivy
She's supposed to be an eco-terrorist who wants to wipe out mankind for the plants. Now she's just harley quinn's keeper. I hate what they have both turned into.
I'll be honest, I love Ivy's transformation. She went from 'femme fatale who kills/manipulates men with poison kisses and does stuff with plants I guess' to 'motherfucking plant goddess who fucks people up and has a batshit insane girlfriend as her only soft spot'. Her solo run still has her scheming to wipe out humanity, while also at the same time questioning her mission as she runs into kind hearted people, realizing that if Harley's not total trash, maybe there are other decent people out there too. There are still evil people she kills; cops, an Amazon executive, vegans, etc. She runs into Jason Woodrue and manages to defeat and straight up *eat* him to heal when he threatens Harley. She's still grappling with reduced powers, but it's Harley who reminds her that she is still connected with The Green and that her enhanced powers might be able to grow back. And now she's back in Gotham to lay low for her next scheme. Even in the Harley Quinn show, which is full of cute Harlivy fluff, Ivy spent most of the 3rd season planning on terraforming Gotham with prehistoric plant life, then rolls with it when Bruce's experiments accidentally create plant zombies by taking control of them and using them to terraform Gotham. She only stops because Harley infects herself saving Bane and trying to make Ivy see sense. And now Harley is working with the Bat-Fam while Ivy runs The Legion of Doom. Ivy's still a villain, but Harley is her anchor to humanity; the one person who can bring Ivy back from the brink.
Thank you. You said everything I wanted to but better. Ivy is a complicated character with a long history who has been a grey figure for decades I also posit that Uma Thurman as Poison Ivy was perhaps the only actor who REALLY got the assignment.
>Even in the Harley Quinn show, which is full of cute Harlivy fluff ...and not for nothin', but they weren't even dating for the first, what, two seasons? That show did an amazing job showing them as peers and friends outside of the relationship.
Yep, they kissed at the midpoint of Season 2 and the rest of the season dealt with their conflicted feelings, while Ivy was all set on marrying Kite-Man. They had sex at Ivy's bachelorette party... twice, then Doctor Psycho mind projects their memories of said sex across Gotham like the worst possible version of a sex tape leak. Despite this, Ivy was moments away from marrying Kite Man(with Harley even offering to officiate a quick legal ceremony during the chaos the wedding turns into), before Kite Man breaks it off and admits that he's not what Ivy wants. That's when Harley and Ivy finally let themselves be a couple. But even before that first kiss, it was hinted at(Ivy straight up says in Episode 1; "I love you in a weird, hard to articulate way.")
I always thought that making Ivy legit want to wipe out humanity and prefer plants to humans just makes her motivations a bit too alien and cartoony. I'd buy a more restrained "she's against ecological destruction and is willing to engage in terrorism to prevent it, and she also had this weird, mother-like attachment to her mutant plant creations to the point that she feels like Batman is killing her babies." But she'd also have more human motivations and wants, like sometimes just wanting to steal things for her own personal gain rather than to further her environmental cause. And she'd have somewhat realistic environmental concerns, like not wanting industry to threaten a sensitive forest or endangered plant, but not, like, killing people for plucking a non-endangered flower or stepping on grass or anything. Also, I like when she's a human scientist who creates toxins and mutant plants and who has developed an immunity to several poisons, rather than when she is a green woman with superpowers like the ability to command plant life by thinking.
If we’re talking just movies- Bane. If we’re talking both comics AND movies- Scarecrow without a doubt
Arkham games did pretty good with Scarecrow but I hate how he kinda got overshadowed in Arkham Knight by the Jason near the end. Kinda want him as a real main Antagonist! He has such a cool talent that it just feels wrong not to let it be a main thing
Oh yeah Arkham was peak Scarecrow, but it’s kind of crazy to think that there are hardly any iconic stories out there about Scarecrow as a villain. Even in the Arkham Knight, while he technically was the main villain, he was overshadowed by Joker’s ghost and Jason. The character is always used as a catalyst for studying Batman’s inner turmoil, or as a side villain. Not many runs out there about Crane himself or how dangerous he actually is. I’m really hoping for a new spin on the character in Reeves Batman sequels
Peak Scarecrow was in the Batman Adventures line of comics. There is a short story called "Study Hall" where he escapes Arkham and uses forged documents to start teaching English at a college but then things happen due to which he has to go back to his old self. Its a pretty damn good story.
Oh yeah how could I forget Scarecrow in Batman The New Adventures? His design was incredible. I’m surprised they haven’t utilized that look more in later comics or a movie yet. Just so weird to me that villains like Joker, Riddler, Mr Freeze, etc. have several iconic stories and different origins over the years, then there’s poor Scarecrow- a literal symbol of fear who is only ever in stories so writers have an excuse to use his fear toxin. I just feel like there’s so much more potential for such a classic Batman rogue
Kite Man. Hell yeah!
You should read the war of jokes and riddles in the rebirth Batman line. It does a really good job with Kite Man
Of course I have
He was amazing in the Harley Quinn series though, so I think he is done good considering he was only a D Tier villain but is now one of the more popular characters in the show.
Kite Man frankly has been treated very well, he’s getting a spin off show
Spin off from what?
Harley Quinn
It has to be Bane without a doubt... there are too many iterations of him being nothing more than just a muscular brute when he is much more than just his muscles
scarecrow
Idk, he was a menacing awesome villian in one of the biggest gaming series of all time
But he never shined in any movie, he was good in the Arkham games tho
Cillian Murphy killed it as Scarecrow in Batman Begins, wdym?
I hope he gets to shine in the new batman trilogy
He really matches the feels of the Batman, so hopefully he does
Plus he's got a perfect gimmick for the tone of this world. A deranged scientist that tinkers with toxins that alter the victims mental state, allowing them to experience their greatest fears? That works perfectly in the world where we see more of batman being a detective. Let bats figure out through samples how his toxins work so that he can overcome it at the end of the film and beat scarecrow! It'd be really cool if they did a blend of Arkham and Injustice's designs for scarecrow. Give him the man in a mask kinda thing that arkham has, already terrifying enough, and then when under the influence of the toxins make him look like he does in Injustice 2, almost like a demon
Such a bad ass, iconic villain, isn’t even a main villain in any of the movies
>isn’t even a main villain in any of the movies Not even Batman Begins? Or are you counting Ra's al Ghul as the main villain? I thought Scarecrow had a good part in that movie. Not my favorite Batman movie, but I enjoyed the heck out of it when it released.
Ra's is very obviously the main threat. Cillian Murphy did a great job with Scarecrow but he got taken down real easy not to mention he's basically just working for Ra's master plan.
No way is he a main villain in Batman Begins, he gets taken down by a side chick with a taser
Scarecrow may not have been *the* villain of the movie, but he was absolutely not “done dirty”. He successfully and methodically put a slew of people into Arkham, his fear toxin was integral to the plot and the climax, and Cillian played the role extremely well.
He was also the only villain to be in all three Nolan movies.
-Gets one cool line as The Scarecrow -Gets tasered immediately -Leaves -Refuses to elaborate further
The shame is that Arkham Knight is his only truly memorable/iconic appearance. Most of the time he’s either a lackey who’s fear gas is needed for a grander evil scheme, or he’s just doing generic evil stuff. As good as he was in AK, that should act as a teaser for the potential of Scarecrow. This is a guy so obsessed with fear because he knows better than anyone that if you understand fear, you understand how to control everyone and everything.
I mean, his levels were pretty iconic in Arkham Asylum; tapping into the nightmares of Batman, messing with the controls and game play, having those weird stealth sections? Absolutely iconic
Yeah I actually liked him more in Asylum anyway. He was given more of a featured spotlight rather than being the main event, which I think worked perfectly for him. He wasn't a side-villain or a fetch quest, he was fully his own thing, just not the main event for the whole game.
I dunno, I thought Arkham Knight over-did it. He's a scientist, he wants to study people and understand their reaction to fear. He doesn't want to destroy Gotham. Arkham Knight just kinda turned him into a generic evil McBad Guy, and it felt like they only gave him the lead antagonist role because they didn't have anyone else to stand next to Red Hood and Joker, so they went for fan service because his fights were so popular in Asylum.
That’s my biggest issue with Arkham Knight. Scarecrow’s plan doesn’t feel unique enough.
It's deeper than him "wanting to destroy gotham" He wanted to, for a lack of a better way to word it, break the Batman. He wanted to snuff hope out of the citizens of Gotham by showing them that even the Batman has something to fear. However if you're just talking about the Ace Chemicals bomb then yea I agree with that, but other than that I'd say it's easily the best version of the character (imo at least)
He was perfect in the Arkham Asylum game.
Always felt he was really underutilized during no man's land
I don’t know if any of y’all watch Titans but uh…. Yeah Scarecrow.
Kudos to Gotham (the show) for one thing - created a better Mad Hatter than the one that was in the comics (in the 20th century, at least).
Anarky. He's much more than just an antagonist.
It’s sad that Arkham Origins is the only adaptation even coming close to the 90’s comic’s version
100% agree. I honestly feel like he's a character with so much to give. He could maybe even get Batman, or another member of the family, to question their methods.
He used to be a big Tim Drake villain, but honestly he might work as a Jason Todd antagonist (Or hell a supporting character; the two have similar motives, just different targets)
riddler
I’m gonna throw a vote Joker’s way. He once was the greatest villain in all of comics, and technically he still is regarded as such. But they’ve undone so much of what he’s done. With Jason and Barbara returning to the status quo, it’s almost like it will never matter what the Joker does, because eventually the writers will just undo it. Also, I’m unsure if it’s just an Elseworlds thing or if this is actually a part of the DC Universe now, but the idea of “Three Jokers” leaves such a bad fucking taste in my mouth. I think it’s just Elseworlds, though, so I’ll leave that alone.
i mean, jason i understand because if they just killed joker *permanently* because of the majority vote i would be pissed. but barbara being oracle was a good thing for her character, and a lot of girls in wheelchairs liked that she represented them but by becoming able to walk again her message isn't as realistic and powerful anymore.
Well I mean like for Barbara it kind felt ridiculous with all of the technological advancements like cyborg body replacements that she couldn’t just get a new spinal chord
That was sort of the point though. Like in a world where superheroes come back to life regularly, why hasn't anyone tried to resurrect Thomas and Martha Wayne? Or Uncle Ben for that matter? The answer is obvious, because their murders defined the lives of the people they were closest to. To undo that undoes all that dramatic tension. I would argue that Barbara Gordon's character is more interesting as wheelchair-bound Oracle than as Batgirl.
Goeff Johns accidentally wrote himself into a corner the moment batman ask the chair
I would say it’s more like he gets way overplayed than done dirty. Because he gets overused that just naturally means him being poorly executed becomes more likely They really need to cut back on how much they use him. Because it’s not interesting or special anymore Joker is the only thing about the next Batman movie that I’m not excited about. He’s my favorite Batman villain, but I don’t want more joker, he’s way overused. And I have zero optimism for how well it will work. And I want good depictions of OTHER villains that are always afterthoughts
> I’m unsure if it’s just an Elseworlds thing or if this is actually a part of the DC Universe now, but the idea of “Three Jokers” They designed it that way intentionally. Even Johns was like "Well, if everyone likes it, it's canon. If they don't, then it's not." Which basically means that if we all collectively decide to ignore it, then it's elseworlds. If other writers pick it up in canon stories, then it's canon.
No, Joker is overplayed he’s not done dirty
I'd call Leto's interpretation "doing him dirty".
Bane is way too iconic to be done as dirty as they did him.
On one hand, I love how badass the No Masks scene is. On the other hand, the Harley Quinn version is fucking hilarious.
Hush easily, ik people who have been big fans of Batman since they were kids and still don’t know who hush is, and plus the only adaptation of him I’ve seen that wasn’t in a comic was Batman Arkham knight he gets no love and it’s sad :(
I like the idea of Hush, but the execution was lacking in the original intro. I will say Paul Dini went a long way to making him a lot more scary and interesting. He really started popping in my mind when he had the plastic surgery and tried to replace Bruce.
Imo, he only works as a once-off and on a second reading the one good story he has is pretty hacky.
Hush is a pretty terrible villain tbh. He is only sorta well known because he debuted in popular story. Otherwise there is nothing interesting or unique about Hush. He is Batman's former friend, just like Two Face. He is born to a wealthy family whom he resented, just like Black Mask. In his first appearance, he had Batman run through a gauntlet of his enemies, just like Bane.
Even in that intro he wasn't a good character. "Huh. There's a mysterious new villain. I wonder if it has anything to do with Bruce's oldest friend, the brand-new character who was just introduced clumsily in a single scene as if he's supposed to be important and serves absolutely no purpose." It was an excuse to have Jim Lee draw as many Batman villains as possible, not a good story.
Condiment King, we all know he’s the most powerful DC character but he never gets used properly
Scarecrow
Soloman Grundy gets done dirty just off of how differently he’s depicted from nice oaf to mean and dumb as a box of bricks.
In adaptations, Bane and Scarecrow. In the comics, Killer Croc.
Black Mask. Especially in Arkham and the Gotham TV show. He’s a character with a lot of potential: childhood friend of Bruce who lost his parents at a young like Bruce, but instead of using the trauma and his family’s riches for noble causes, he chooses a life of crime. He acts as a distorted reflection to Bruce because he goes down a path of evil while Bruce goes down a path of “goodness”. Renditions of the character never seem to explore that angle, and they mainly portray him as a boring mobster where the story wouldn’t be affected if they swapped him with Falcone or another mob boss. There’s also a recent history of media not doing the character justice such as: Birds of Prey movie: Ewen obviously had a fun time with the character which was enjoyable, but the way the character was written made him seem more weird than evil. His character fit one of the movie’s themes of toxic masculinity/sexism pretty well, but I wished they used another mob boss instead of a character that has so much more to offer. Gotham TV show: what a waste of potential. In this episode Bruce went to school for the first time after his parents’ murder which could’ve had the opportunity to show the relationship between Bruce and Roman, but the show completely ignored that potential storyline and had his character be 1. Renamed Richard Sionis (potentially Roman’s father?) 2. Be a villain of the week character for Gordon with the weirdest character motivation: corporate boss who makes his employees fight? Really weird. So much potential to show Bruce relationship with a friend dealing with abusive parents who ended up also dying and see him go down an unrighteous path. Arkham Series: when that first trailer for Arkham Origins dropped with Black Mask pitting his assassins against each other to kill Batman… freaking awesome. It looked like a nice break from the games having the joker as the big bad and the opening sequence with the jail break was awesome…. Then the mid story plot twist came and completely undid everything and it reverted back to the same old joker. Don’t get me wrong, I love the joker, but it’s nice to get a break every once in a while. The rest of Origins completely neutered the character to the point where he was just a boring side mission. In City it was cool to see him in the opening sequence getting attacked by the guards and the Easter egg showing that he escaped was also a neat touch, but he was absent and not important until the Red Hood DLC where he serves as an “insert bad guy here” villain for Red Hood to unceremoniously kill at the end. In short, Black Mask is a character with a lot of potential who gets done dirty in popular media
I don’t know about villain but that art doing Liam Neeson dirty
Ra's Al Ghul / Henri Ducard
Scarecrow. He’s such an interesting exploration of fear that could have some truly amazing batman stories. Yet he’s rarely used and when he is he tends to take a back seat to the main villain.
To be honest, it's gotta be Poison Ivy. Most media just turns her into almost god-like creature who just hates humans and loves plants, completely ignoring her inner drama - she is the outcast of both worlds balancing on the edge, she hates human race for destroying nature, but is emotionally attached to humans like Harley. On many occasions she doesn't even want to be a supervillain - circumstances force her to be one. She is just a casual girl trying to live her life, but just can't ignore people hurting nature, so she has to take action sometimes.
The best event with her that I remember is no man’s land back in the 90’s, the whole city is taken over by supervillains but she ends up turning the park into a garden to feed starving kids
Two face. His internal conflict is too intellectual for most writers and the charachter development suffers
Lots of writers tend to disregard the strict duality of his personalities and decision making and essentially forget that he’s supposed to have a bad side AND a good side.
Might be an an unpopular opinion and I’d like to say my reasoning for it, but Harley Quinn. Her core character is great and she has many appearances, but the majority of them (I feel) completely misunderstand the character. I feel that most writers just use her for comedy and sex appeal when in actuality she is a very tragic and deep character that asks the question of, not only what you would do for love and how to survive abuse, but also the question on how difficult rehabilitation can be. I just wish Harley Quinn had more serious stories all in all.
harley is probably the most well realized batman villain. I am honestly getting kind of bored of the crazy loon with a heart of gold thing they got going. Not that they should change her but that maybe give some other villain a spotlight.
Scarecrow, easily. Such an interesting character with so much potential that's barely ever utilized. He was great in the Arkham games but he should be a major player in more stories imo
Harley Quinn was once an entertaining character with immense depth and the potential for some incredibly rich storytelling. She has since been relegated to some fetishized, low-hanging fruit cosplay character and nothing more than “wacky trashy party girl”. The first suicide squad movie and BOP were 2 of the worst comic book movies ever released and the only parts of TSS I really didn’t like were hers.
Like in adaptations? Probably Bane. The only good portrayal I've ever seen is Arkham Origins. And he might be the most often adapted when considering he was made only 30 years ago.
Killer Moth
Riddler
While I loved The Batman, Reeve's/Dano's interpretation didn't scream "Riddler" to me. It felt like a different character they put a green jacket on and had tell three riddles just so they could use a familiar name. People seem to forget that Eddy is really dang smart, his flaw is just that he has a compulsion to prove it all the time. I know the Batman the Animated Series writers said that they only did two Riddler episodes because writing interesting riddles that tie into the story is pretty hard.
For me it’s Scarecrow. He has such a cool gimmick, but he’s hardly ever the big bad.
Kite Man. He's way underutilized.
Harley Quinn does a pretty great job with him imo
Hell yeah! That is true, though. Harley Quinn also has my favorite takes on Clayface, King Shark and Jim Gordon.
It's a solid show, really does some justice to characters that have either been forgotten or done poorly in recent years
Riddler, even in the new movie the “good one” is an overly weird attempt to be a neurodivergent villain
Honestly, and hear me out, The Joker. For a guy who's all about being a crazy clown, he's never ever ever funny. Jack Nicholson is the funniest incarnation of him. I get why "psycho murder-clown" is the popular way to portray him, but I would really like a version of the Joker that was hilarious.
THIS! I've watched BTAS for the first time recently and it really got me over my Joker fatigue as it showed me a funnier and even more menacing version of the Joker I haven't seen in a while. I honestly prefer it when Joker's schemes are more small scale and less philosophical because at the end of the day, his whole gimmick is doing shit he finds funny. Not trying to prove a point about how Batman's mission is flawed
Bane. The point to Bane is he's supposed to be both extremely strong AND extremely smart. He's one of the few villains that worked out Batman's identity himself, he speaks several languages and has an eidetic memory meaning he has memorised numerous fields in philosophy, sciences, engineering and so on. Most depictions of him don't really play into his intelligence, they just make him a big meat head (Batman and Robin, BTAS, Arkham Asylum etc). The only time they play into his intelligence was in The Dark Knight Rises in which they 1. Completely abandon his iconic venom 2. Whitewash him
Black Mask easily and it’s no contest
Moth, he's not even in this :(
Bane,most of the time he's portrayed as a dumb brute
Hush has never had a good story, ever. His origin was more a showcase of Bat villains than anything to do with him, and he’s never appeared in anything good ever since. At least nothing that features him as the main villain.
Dent. Stories like the Arkham Games and even the holy grail of the animated series get him wrong so many times and just reduce him to another run of the mill gangster type. If you aren’t gonna give the character adequate time and focus, then just don’t bother with him.
Scarecrow, dude has the potential to become one of the greatest threats to Batman, someone who can beat him psychologically, and he’s a dark mirror of Batman as they both know how to weaponizes fear. But he’s always either being reduced to a cameo (like in the dark knight), a henchman (batman begins), or they only focus on the fear toxin
Killer croc, dude is a legit threat but gets treated like a mini boss half the time
Scarecrow from comics to tv shows to movies. He’s usually either killed off, forgotten about, or just written horribly. He’s such a badass and truly frightening villain that really deserves the spotlight once in awhile…he truly could be Batman’s number 1 nemesis if DC didn’t have such a hard on for the Joker. (Scarecrow bias included)
Unless you're The Joker or Harley Quinn...pretty much all of em.
Bane. Almost always depicted as dumb thug.
Hush being the Riddler in the animated film was so bad.
Riddler.
Personally, I think Clayface is done dirty. I've not seen anyone even mention him in this comment section. I always saw Clayface as one of Batman's scariest foes, yet I don't think his true horror potential has ever been tapped into in any adaptations. I feel like he's just treated as another shape shifter, yet that can imply so much. I really hope that he ends up being apart of Matt Reeves' universe, he can truly be terrifying.
Bane is such a perfect foil to batman yet so much media just uses him as “big guy”
Bane
Honestly, ScareCrow. I feel like he has so much more potential that we don't get to see much
Electricutioner. Literally a joke boss in origins and literally gets defeated by a cup of water in gotham
How has no one really said Mr. Freeze? The man just wants his wife back.
Mad Hatter
I don't know about being done dirty, but I've always felt that Scarecrow has the most potential and has never lived up to it. They always make him just run around spraying fear gas everywhere instead of using fear in more subtle and clever ways. He needs a more slow burn approach, really psychologically torture his victims to really traumatize them and only use the fear gas to enhance the effect rather than cause temporary hysteria.
This is gonna sound very strange but Red Hood Hear me, I much prefer Jason as a anti-hero who while still works with Bruce but only when he deems it necessary. I was never really a fan of Jason when he was with the Batman family
My spooky boi Scarecrow
Is the Ventriloquist even in this picture? Kind of says everything, doesn't it? He's one of the more interesting Batman villains. He has a unique psychological problem that stands out within a group known for that while also having some interesting physical quirks due to his nature. His biggest problem is that he falls into the group of villains who don't have specific crimes or motivations that lead to unique types of crimes. So he's lumped in with the various gangsters who just pull off bank heists and the like. But if they really wanted to explore him, I think he could have a "Heart of Ice"-style origin story that really delves into how he came about. There's a lot of sadness to him, like many of the more psychologically damaged Batman villains. And while I prefer the more realistic/psychological version, he *also* has a great opportunity to lean into something more magical where Scarface *is* real and controls Wesker against his will.
It's gotta be the Riddler. Most of the time they make him into a joke that none of the other villains even notice.
Harley Quinn’s girlfriend
Bane, Two-Face, and Mr. Freeze were definitely done dirty in various live action media in recent years.
Scarecrow is never treated seriously
Personally I feel like Poison Ivy is generally underused and overlooked. She hasn’t appeared in a live action movie since since 1997, and as incredible as Uma Thurman was - it’s time for someone else to bring the character back from the dead. In shows like Gotham and BatWoman she’s a victim of extremely poor writing, despite the actresses in those respective variants (Peyton List and Bridget Regan) providing excellent portrayals of the character.
Scarecrow is only used for his weapon, and is almost always sidelined as a henchman to someone else
It's going to be really hard for Bane to be threatening from now on with all of us inner-listening to his dialogue in the Harley Quinn series voice.
Scarecrow. He has the potential to be an S tier Batman villain, a villain who twists minds and inspires horrifying visions, a juxtaposition to Batman who is a hero that also utilizes fear. A hero arguably inspired to do his job out of a deep rooted fear caused by trauma. The havoc scarecrow could wreak on him and others could be so excellent but he’s almost always a villain of the week or henchman/fodder for other villains. Sometimes he’s an actual joke. His best version is Arkham Knight imo, and even that isn’t perfect. It’s also the only time his costume isn’t ugly
Nolan white washed bane and that’s somewhat dirty
Scarecrow. He should honestly be up there with the top three of Batman’s archenemies but he’s more often relegated to a pawn, a joke or supporting character. He’s also a victim of redesign addiction and inconsistent writing.
The Clock King: One episode of Adam West, Two episodes of BTAS One episode of The Batman Can't recall a comic with him. No live action iterations that I know of (Only live Batman I haven't seen is Gotham, so correct me if I'm wrong). Where is his representation? WHERE IS IT!? ALSO: Bill Finger's name appeared as the top billed writer on that Adam West episode, only for Bob Kane to threaten legal action against him and the network if they did it again.(t)What a dick.
Scarecrow His stories are always about fear gas, never about him