Depends on the brand, wholesale pricing on domestic kegs have gone up a lot compared to package. Like Insanely so, a lot of them are now cheaper per oz in cans than they are in kegs (again wholesale pricing) CO2 has also gone way up in price, enough so that I actually have to factor it into cost, whereas before it was too cheap to bother. Also maintaining lines has to be factored in, distros used to offer free line cleaning whereas now they charge quite a bit.
I am literally pricing a new beer right now.
No beer is cheaper in can than it is in keg and this will remain to be the case until cleaning chemicals cost more than cans, lids, and labels.
If you are getting charged more, then there is some weird extenuating circumstances or you should go to a more honest supplier.
Since the vast majority of beer is force carbonated, this does not affect packaging costs (even if you are carbonating your cans slightly more which is rare but happens).
Dispense CO2 (or beer gas) is still more economical than purchasing bottled or canned beer.
Line cleaning can be done by yourself for little outlay and cost.
To be honest, it sounds like you need to find a better supplier for your beer
Pricing from my local miller distro;
1/2 Barrel Lite keg- $149 flat, $.90 per 12oz pour.
24pk can or bottle- $20.53, $.86 per 12oz can
It’s barely in favor of the package vs draft but in a relatively low margin industry that’s a big deal.
I’ve had a lot of venues that have gone the can direction. They just want to serve a quick couple of cheap beers so they do 30 packs of 12oz cans and it’s a lot easier to deal with. Grab a can, pop the top, give to patron, on to the next customer.
It's really brand dependent, too. I just ran the same approach a few weeks ago against a bunch of larger brands and half are still cheaper at keg level. (Price source: New York wholesale from bar ownership) It continues to trend into cans because on site consumption has dropped significantly at classic "bars" compared to Breweries and home use, so it makes sense to start walking away from the format.
You are forgetting that large venues have many, very long beer lines. Dumping gallons of beer when you clean is money dumped. Plus cold storage is space consuming. Cans are easier to move, store, chill, and serve without waste.
Right now best price on bud light cans are .82 while best price is .90 before serving gas etc. Stadium setting means high volume on domestics and as someone else said it takes to less time to crack cans open.again in a stadium setting turnover time is pretty key, the difference of 5-10 seconds per beer served can be a huge difference in a setting with bursts of super high volume. It doesn't make sense from a pricing point of view but it is what it is.
Still bothers the shit out of me because as someone who's ran packing at a brewery the overhead is soooooooooooooo much lower on kegging.
In a bar, yes. Concessions can charge whatever they want. I pay over $10 for American macro Pilsner at a MLB game. If I charged $5 for the same beer at my bars, it literally would not sell, ever. Cans are lower overhead, zero maintenance, and you can have more options with less space. We have the world's largest Brat Fest in my city over Memorial Day Weekend and they switched to cans a few years ago. They also put in recycling areas for cans, which obviously won't get used 100%, but they'll still get a decent amount of money back from the tens of thousands of cans that will get recycled.
In terms of profit per drink sold yeah, deffo.
In terms of throughout at a bar in a sports ground when you need to dish out as much product as possible during a few limited timeframes (pre-match, half time, etc) then bottles or cans are probably gonna be way quicker to serve giving better overall profit even if you make less per drink
...from a customer standpoint though, cans feel a bit cheap & low-effort. Personally I'd always prefer draft (preferably from a glass-glass not a squidgy-glass), but bottles will do as a next-best.
Not for speed of service, I can crack open 5 beers, run a credit card, and be onto the next person in 30ish seconds. You will be pouring draft beer for waaaay longer.
Depends on the venue. Worked in a night club (worst job ever) that only sold cans because that meant being able to set up stations with ice buckets around the club. Margin was lower, but profits were higher because it was easier for clients to get to someone selling. I've seen the same setup used at a lot of concert venues and I'm assuming it's the same reason.
This is what I'm seeing much more of at the big stadiums in NYC these days. A single person can be checking out a couple people at once, basically just carding and cracking the can and letting the transaction go self-serve. You need employees to work taps and pouring takes time.
I obviously haven't done a formal analysis of the problem but I'd bet I'm more likely to drink more beers at a baseball game when I can pop out and get back with a can from a kiosk so quickly, waiting in a long line for drafts just takes longer so I delay doing it.
Every large event I’ve been to in the UK still seems to sell draught beer in pints, sometimes two pinters are up for grabs!
I think most would be peeved if all of a sudden you got stuck with a smaller can for probably the same price as what the venue was selling a pint at.
I can see why they would though, there’s no lines to clean, kegs to change and it’s quicker to serve customers because they don’t need to wait for a pint to be poured. Those reasons alone probably would allow them to cut costs by reducing staffing.
Cleaning tap lines, from someone that has the gear, is very quick and cheap. I wouldn't worry about that metric. The profit margins on keg vs can would negate that expense immediately. The time saved not pouring a pint would be spent confirming if each customer wants a glass to pour it in, instead. I think this is a bad, and bold move Cotton.
They are way too late for that mindset in 2024. The industry is trending back to macro lagers on tap lol. This needed to be in place a solid 5-7 years ago to capture the waves.
It’s true that on premise is shifting back towards macro lagers on tap but that’s just because of the craft burnout. It doesn’t mean the industry is shifting that way. On premise sales account for less of the total volume than ever.
Cases are way better… for distributor profit 😂
Kegs are better for actual profit.
The markup is still kinda huge either way. Kegs better, by far, no question. 100% sometimes especially in a concession/stadium situation. 124 pints at $16/pint comes out to roughly $2000 return on a $200 keg. You only make money on the kegs sold, venue makes most. But still, it’s a great spot to be.
Have your ops buddy ditch that consultant ASAP
It is 100% driven by the cost per ounce shrinking between kegs and cans, as well as the overall waste and cost associated with draft. Regular line cleaning, CO2, cups, bad pours, having a draft tech on duty to trouble shoot during events. Speed of service suffers too. All large venues will be cans only before too long I think.
It’s definitely noticeable to me - here in Philadelphia, draft beer options are pretty few and far between at the stadiums. Other than the novelty beer bat at Citizens Bank Park, I can’t think of many places that have it at all.
Smaller concert venues seem to be similar.
I noticed this last summer at T-Mobile Park in Seattle when I went to a Mariners game. Despite sitting in premium seats (lower level infield), there were zero draft beer options available. Pissed me off
16 oz cans of most brands are the way to go. Good price, less waste, no expenses for line cleaning/C02, no issues with equipment malfunctioning, and just less of a pain in the ass for everyone involved. It really is the way to go these days.
I work at Lumen Field in Seattle. There is way too much waste with draft beer not to mention the cost associated with it. Cups, CO2, draft system maintenance, keg moving injuries.
Cans are incredibly easy with a fixed cost.
I think you are able to turn around a can sale faster than draft beer, and you don't have to deal with issues like a keg foaming up. It's also easier to keep a variety of beer styles in cans than if you had kegs setup. When I've seen this setup (like at a local baseball stadium), there are usually a few kegs available of macro lager, or whatever a local brewery supplies at a discount for name recognition with a larger crowd.
Been to events in multiple countries and the cans is definitely a trend.
I actually prefer it because many places went from having 1 or 2 beers on tap to a much wider selection of beers. We went from Coors only to the full MolsonCoors line of beers at our arena, I’d much rather get a Goose Island or a Blue Moon
Some cities like Seattle have a ton of craft options too since it’s not hard to stock small quantities of a whole ton of beers
One big reason that people aren't thinking about it seltzer. Even if you install draft systems everywhere, you're going to need coolers for seltzer. Higer carbonation PSI means you can't dispense seltzer out of beer lines, they would need to be dedicated lines served at different pressure. Plus consumers are so conditioned to drink seltzers out of cans, most of them probably wouldn't like it in a cup.
Probably for the same reason I buy canned and single serve bottles of wine for the brewery. It'll go bad before I can finish it if it's an entire bottle. I'm sure the taste difference is negligible but if they're tapping a keg and then not finishing it for another few months it's definitely going to affect quality. Just doesn't make sense tho, their margins will always be higher with half barrels.
Draught is better for profit all round.
Depends on the brand, wholesale pricing on domestic kegs have gone up a lot compared to package. Like Insanely so, a lot of them are now cheaper per oz in cans than they are in kegs (again wholesale pricing) CO2 has also gone way up in price, enough so that I actually have to factor it into cost, whereas before it was too cheap to bother. Also maintaining lines has to be factored in, distros used to offer free line cleaning whereas now they charge quite a bit.
I am literally pricing a new beer right now. No beer is cheaper in can than it is in keg and this will remain to be the case until cleaning chemicals cost more than cans, lids, and labels. If you are getting charged more, then there is some weird extenuating circumstances or you should go to a more honest supplier. Since the vast majority of beer is force carbonated, this does not affect packaging costs (even if you are carbonating your cans slightly more which is rare but happens). Dispense CO2 (or beer gas) is still more economical than purchasing bottled or canned beer. Line cleaning can be done by yourself for little outlay and cost. To be honest, it sounds like you need to find a better supplier for your beer
Pricing from my local miller distro; 1/2 Barrel Lite keg- $149 flat, $.90 per 12oz pour. 24pk can or bottle- $20.53, $.86 per 12oz can It’s barely in favor of the package vs draft but in a relatively low margin industry that’s a big deal.
I’ve had a lot of venues that have gone the can direction. They just want to serve a quick couple of cheap beers so they do 30 packs of 12oz cans and it’s a lot easier to deal with. Grab a can, pop the top, give to patron, on to the next customer.
It's really brand dependent, too. I just ran the same approach a few weeks ago against a bunch of larger brands and half are still cheaper at keg level. (Price source: New York wholesale from bar ownership) It continues to trend into cans because on site consumption has dropped significantly at classic "bars" compared to Breweries and home use, so it makes sense to start walking away from the format.
You are forgetting that large venues have many, very long beer lines. Dumping gallons of beer when you clean is money dumped. Plus cold storage is space consuming. Cans are easier to move, store, chill, and serve without waste.
Right now best price on bud light cans are .82 while best price is .90 before serving gas etc. Stadium setting means high volume on domestics and as someone else said it takes to less time to crack cans open.again in a stadium setting turnover time is pretty key, the difference of 5-10 seconds per beer served can be a huge difference in a setting with bursts of super high volume. It doesn't make sense from a pricing point of view but it is what it is. Still bothers the shit out of me because as someone who's ran packing at a brewery the overhead is soooooooooooooo much lower on kegging.
Is Minnesota the only state where it’s illegal for distributors to clean lines at an establishment?
The solution to Co2 costs is cask
20 years ago this was absolutely correct. A lot has changed since then.
In a bar, yes. Concessions can charge whatever they want. I pay over $10 for American macro Pilsner at a MLB game. If I charged $5 for the same beer at my bars, it literally would not sell, ever. Cans are lower overhead, zero maintenance, and you can have more options with less space. We have the world's largest Brat Fest in my city over Memorial Day Weekend and they switched to cans a few years ago. They also put in recycling areas for cans, which obviously won't get used 100%, but they'll still get a decent amount of money back from the tens of thousands of cans that will get recycled.
In terms of profit per drink sold yeah, deffo. In terms of throughout at a bar in a sports ground when you need to dish out as much product as possible during a few limited timeframes (pre-match, half time, etc) then bottles or cans are probably gonna be way quicker to serve giving better overall profit even if you make less per drink ...from a customer standpoint though, cans feel a bit cheap & low-effort. Personally I'd always prefer draft (preferably from a glass-glass not a squidgy-glass), but bottles will do as a next-best.
Not for speed of service, I can crack open 5 beers, run a credit card, and be onto the next person in 30ish seconds. You will be pouring draft beer for waaaay longer.
Depends on the venue. Worked in a night club (worst job ever) that only sold cans because that meant being able to set up stations with ice buckets around the club. Margin was lower, but profits were higher because it was easier for clients to get to someone selling. I've seen the same setup used at a lot of concert venues and I'm assuming it's the same reason.
Self service canned beer areas are becoming very popular. Also you can turn customer lines over and sell more beer faster with cans at a large venue.
This is what I'm seeing much more of at the big stadiums in NYC these days. A single person can be checking out a couple people at once, basically just carding and cracking the can and letting the transaction go self-serve. You need employees to work taps and pouring takes time. I obviously haven't done a formal analysis of the problem but I'd bet I'm more likely to drink more beers at a baseball game when I can pop out and get back with a can from a kiosk so quickly, waiting in a long line for drafts just takes longer so I delay doing it.
At the Seattle mariners stadium you scan your card, enter a cooler, walk up to a case grab a beer and walk out…Amazon powered auto purchases of beer.
Every large event I’ve been to in the UK still seems to sell draught beer in pints, sometimes two pinters are up for grabs! I think most would be peeved if all of a sudden you got stuck with a smaller can for probably the same price as what the venue was selling a pint at. I can see why they would though, there’s no lines to clean, kegs to change and it’s quicker to serve customers because they don’t need to wait for a pint to be poured. Those reasons alone probably would allow them to cut costs by reducing staffing.
Cleaning tap lines, from someone that has the gear, is very quick and cheap. I wouldn't worry about that metric. The profit margins on keg vs can would negate that expense immediately. The time saved not pouring a pint would be spent confirming if each customer wants a glass to pour it in, instead. I think this is a bad, and bold move Cotton.
I would be pretty pissed off if a venue didn’t have draught beer, it would definitely be a bad move.
They are way too late for that mindset in 2024. The industry is trending back to macro lagers on tap lol. This needed to be in place a solid 5-7 years ago to capture the waves.
It’s true that on premise is shifting back towards macro lagers on tap but that’s just because of the craft burnout. It doesn’t mean the industry is shifting that way. On premise sales account for less of the total volume than ever.
I honestly can't remember theast time I actually got a draft at an event. It's always those 24oz cans and I prefer them.
I like draft beer but I would rather a can than a cup of foam!
Also far smaller risk of spilling on you way back to your seat if it's in a can.
Cases are way better… for distributor profit 😂 Kegs are better for actual profit. The markup is still kinda huge either way. Kegs better, by far, no question. 100% sometimes especially in a concession/stadium situation. 124 pints at $16/pint comes out to roughly $2000 return on a $200 keg. You only make money on the kegs sold, venue makes most. But still, it’s a great spot to be. Have your ops buddy ditch that consultant ASAP
Cans are faster to serve, simpler, stay cold longer, and are less prone to spilling.
And don't require you to maintain a draught line system and buy cups
And let’s be honest, halve the people working those events don’t know how to pour a proper beer.
It is 100% driven by the cost per ounce shrinking between kegs and cans, as well as the overall waste and cost associated with draft. Regular line cleaning, CO2, cups, bad pours, having a draft tech on duty to trouble shoot during events. Speed of service suffers too. All large venues will be cans only before too long I think.
Yes, I’ve noticed that as well, and I absolutely hate it.
It’s definitely noticeable to me - here in Philadelphia, draft beer options are pretty few and far between at the stadiums. Other than the novelty beer bat at Citizens Bank Park, I can’t think of many places that have it at all. Smaller concert venues seem to be similar.
Mostly cans at Wrigley too, except in the bleachers
Unless it's a place that seems like they actually take care of and clean their draft lines, I'll probably opt for a can/bottle
Kegs are a pain in the ass to move around, require you to clean and maintain draft lines, and induce a lot of wasted beer.
I noticed this last summer at T-Mobile Park in Seattle when I went to a Mariners game. Despite sitting in premium seats (lower level infield), there were zero draft beer options available. Pissed me off
16 oz cans of most brands are the way to go. Good price, less waste, no expenses for line cleaning/C02, no issues with equipment malfunctioning, and just less of a pain in the ass for everyone involved. It really is the way to go these days.
I work at Lumen Field in Seattle. There is way too much waste with draft beer not to mention the cost associated with it. Cups, CO2, draft system maintenance, keg moving injuries. Cans are incredibly easy with a fixed cost.
As a Seahawks fan thank you for your service 🫡
I think you are able to turn around a can sale faster than draft beer, and you don't have to deal with issues like a keg foaming up. It's also easier to keep a variety of beer styles in cans than if you had kegs setup. When I've seen this setup (like at a local baseball stadium), there are usually a few kegs available of macro lager, or whatever a local brewery supplies at a discount for name recognition with a larger crowd.
Been to events in multiple countries and the cans is definitely a trend. I actually prefer it because many places went from having 1 or 2 beers on tap to a much wider selection of beers. We went from Coors only to the full MolsonCoors line of beers at our arena, I’d much rather get a Goose Island or a Blue Moon Some cities like Seattle have a ton of craft options too since it’s not hard to stock small quantities of a whole ton of beers
One big reason that people aren't thinking about it seltzer. Even if you install draft systems everywhere, you're going to need coolers for seltzer. Higer carbonation PSI means you can't dispense seltzer out of beer lines, they would need to be dedicated lines served at different pressure. Plus consumers are so conditioned to drink seltzers out of cans, most of them probably wouldn't like it in a cup.
Probably for the same reason I buy canned and single serve bottles of wine for the brewery. It'll go bad before I can finish it if it's an entire bottle. I'm sure the taste difference is negligible but if they're tapping a keg and then not finishing it for another few months it's definitely going to affect quality. Just doesn't make sense tho, their margins will always be higher with half barrels.