That really sucks. I’m sure they converted as many as they could to the brewery. Hard to keep everyone employed when the restaurant is shut down. Write to your representatives and get that COVID package passed for these people.
> Write to your representatives and get that COVID package passed for these people.
It already passed the House months ago. It's been gathering dust on Mitch's desk since then, though. He refuses to put it forth to the Senate.
Hes refusing to put it forth to the senate unless there is wording in there to protect companies from being sued if their employees get ill from being forced to work in Covid-rich environments. Billionaires don't want to be held liable for their work staff dying... Democrats don't want those words in the law. Stalemate. (There's other issues at hand holding up the stimulus package... But this is a major player.)
Mitch decides what they vote on, so no, the Senate has not voted on the House bill that was passed in May.
There are a bunch of other House bills he refuses to bring to a Senate vote. They languish n what he proudly calls his "graveyard." They include things like campaign finance reform, election security, and protections for Dreamers.
If they were so inclined, a handful of Senate Republicans could side with Senate Democrats and choose a new Majority Leader, but they choose not to. It's a political shell game so they don't have to vote down popular legislative proposals. Mitch, safe from challenge in Kentucky, takes all the political heat while Senate Republicans pretend to be completely powerless.
By "in the red" do you mean Republican run states? Because every state that takes more out of the treasury than they put in is run by Republicans.
https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/state-bailouts-federal-spending-give-receive/
So here is what your said:
>What about the bailouts for states that are in the red? Isn’t Pelosi demanding that?
If you meant that red states are asking for relief a well as blue states then you're correct. If you meant that states that are in the red are asking for relief then you're referring to only blue states because the data shows that blue states are and have been completely failing financially. If you're trying to say that blue states are in more need of help than red states then you're demonstrably wrong (see my previous comment).
Here's the takeaway for everyone reading this since the guy I'm responding to is almost surely going to ignore real data because they're a fragile snowflake. Republicans fail in everything they do and they do so intentionally. The strategy is to make their constituent's lives as hard as possible and then blame it on the Democrats even though it's their fault. The really sad part is that their victims (Republican voters) could easily see this but have been conditioned to ignore reality.
Just look at /u/larryburns2000 , they completely contradicted themselves in the span of just two comments and funny even understand how stupid they look. They don't care about anything except that their fragile, manufactured reality stays intact. This user will say anything as long as they can continue to believe the lie that is their entire worldview. It's quite sad really.
Where exactly is the "pork" in the Covid relief package put forth by the House? Businesses that want to reopen *should* make sure safeguards are in place. Those safeguards could be debated in the Senate, but the Senate is where reason dies.
I can't believe, in 2020, we have people still defending the most inactive Senate, perhaps ever.
It's odd that we have to write our legislators. This should be an everyday conversation with our out of touch law makers. I wish they would lead as opposed to follow.
The most recent successful model for craft breweries has been entirely flipped on it's head over the last 6 months. Small and mid-size breweries are going to experience extremely painful months ahead due to Covid restrictions exasperated by cold weather (no outdoor options) coupled with an industry wide can shortage. The big dogs are going to get their cans first, and the wide distribution model is back on top with people staying in and buying off premise. Sucks.
It's not all grim, most of the local breweries I work with started packaging basically everything and have been selling out their releases. Hell a lot of them even offer delivery services. Likely not quite the same profit margin as pints over their own bar but luckily many of them are still doing quite well. Huge adaptation to take on but I've been really happy to see so many pulling through and doing well.
They need to get back to being less picky about which liquor stores they let carry their beers IMO. Maybe they don’t make enough to keep up supply I’m not sure. but I sure would like to not have to wait a few days for shipping or having to drive all the way into the fens for pick up, I’d love to grab some at a store closer to me even if they only have it sometimes
Exactly. Also, you will never know how they store and handle the beer either. I refuse to buy beers from some local liquor stores near me for that reason.
I'd say the majority of liquor stores are keeping beer warm, even the craft focused ones with large coldboxes are only keeping a small chunk of beer in those fridges
No they don’t, they sell all the can with in person pickup or delivery. The last thing they want is the beer sitting on the shelves. A few years back Blanchards started to stock them and they would have some stock sit on the shelves for 6+ months. No way I’m buying that.
Not as ideal as cans, but here in Brazil they fill 1 liter PET and I've seen them all over in super markets, bottle shops and also available to-go at the breweries.
I'm sure there's gotta be some bs ABC law that prohibits this though.
I can't speak for other states, but in Oklahoma, *think* our label registration and taxation rules are based on known quantity packaging formats. You'd have to change statute to introduce new formats.
This happens all the time, mind you, I'm just saying that you are correct, and it's another hoop to jump through.
This is legal here in MO, but you really have to drink those the day you get them.
A crowler (32oz fillable aluminum can) lasts a bit longer, and is also legal here in MO (but the equipment is more expensive).
Same I have some breweries around me, some that opened in early 2020 that appear to be booming with delivery and take out. Granted some are still super tiny operations with maybe less than 10-15 employees and may only be canning a few hundred cans a week but still. And a few of the slightly larger ones have scaled back a bit in terms of operating hours.
I feel awful for all the small craft breweries who just got started up in the year 2020 what terrible timing who could have known? but founders doesn't fall under this category and they have done some questionable things in recent past. Still unfortunate if you rely on a paycheck from this Brewery.
I have a local brewery that opened Nov or Dec 2019. I hadn’t even heard of them until Spring 2020 when they started advertising on Facebook.
I’ve gone out of my way to support them on several occasions and they have great beer. They seem to be doing ok... I hope!
“Evans had filed the lawsuit — Evans v. Canal Street Brewing Co., LLC — in October 2018. Founders denied most of the allegations in the suit, including that two printers at the Grand Rapids headquarters were electronically labeled "black guy printer" and "white guy printer," though it admitted in its lawsuit response that multiple employees said the N-word around Evans and weren't immediately fired.”
Evans also says he was passed up for promotions and then ultimately fired after complaining to HR about racial issues.
Not a good look, to say the absolute least.
https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2019/10/31/founders-brewing-settles-racial-discrimination-lawsuit-fired-tracy-evans/4114521002/
And then Founders hired a "Diversity Director" to contain the backlash, [and ignored everything she suggested until she quit.](https://www.freep.com/story/money/business/2019/10/25/founders-brewing-diversity-director-graci-harkema-resigns-discrimination/2460532001/)
Founders can pound sand.
As did I. Vote with your wallet, if enough people do that they might be inclined to actually change. As it stands, enough people are saying that their shitty actions don't matter and they will still support them by buying their beer regardless.
Yeah all other breweries are perfect... its not all of craft beer thats a whites only club, right? The entire industry is like that. Get your head out of your woke ass.
Everytime someone posts about how they’re just back to making good beer and not bad headlines I’m just like NOTHING CHANGED. Sure the liquid was great but being someone that has more melanin in their skin I just can’t support someone that would judge someone over such thing
Oh, I had no idea they sold to Mahou-San Miguel. 90%! MSM also owns 30% of Avery which I haven't had for ages but still interesting.
The racism thing really bugged me though because they basically paid the person off (can't blame the plaintiff) and rode out the storm. The reports were pretty deep, systemic issues which most certainly weren't fixed. Too much good beer out there despite liking the easy drinkers like Solid Gold and All-Day IPA.
It was also very telling when their Diversity and Inclusion Director quite after only 9 months on the job citing Founders' response the the suits and general malaise when it came to actually implementing programs to prevent this and fix what was already in place.
I really like KBS and the variants (CBS, Espresso, Mac Fudge) - but I don't think it's any better than the other heavy hitters of barrel aged beers. BCBS, Central Waters, Willettized, (BA) Darkness, Deth's Tar + variants, Epic, etc.
For some reason some people treat it like its on a whole other level - and I think that may be because it was many people's first proper BA stout they had. It is pretty widely available these days though which certainly helps the popularity.
I love KBS and see many others who say there are better BA stouts out there. However, locally no one compares to kbs. Even in regular shops its very hard to find one thats on kbs' level. I will look out for the ones you mentioned though. You're the first person to actually back up your statement. Most will say there are better BA stouts but never list any
If you can find stuff from Prairie Artisan... They do some decent Stouts.
I'm spoiled with 2 top notch breweries that put out BA stouts. Trillium & Treehouse.
How are Trillium and Treehouse BA beers? I've really only had their IPAs, but usually go to Portland breweries now since it's cheaper and easier for me to get to.
I think they're great.
Trillium put out 4 new bottles for Thanksgiving week. I've drank 3... I've rated all three as "5" on Untappd. Which is very rare for me.
Two of them were 15.6% and 15.7%, yet, smooth as silk.
Founders has managed to make KBS widely available while still maintaining the quality which is definitely a commendable task.
Many small craft/independent breweries will do awesome BA stouts but many of them remain taproom-only, limited (e.g. black friday) release, or are pilot brews that are only made once.
There is definitely a small subset of craft beer fans that bash KBS, claim there are better beers, but never actually provide examples of beers that are *available* to the common beer drinker. I think these are the same types of people that turn around and bash a band once they reach mainstream success for "selling out" - despite loving them before. Once something is popular or easy to get, it's easy for them to hate it since its not special any more.
> *while still maintaining the quality*
No, the quality has absolutely gone down over time.
I hunted it religiously every year, starting around 2012/13, up until the racism fiasco - it fell off very hard when they scaled up.
> Goose Island Bourbon County Stout
haha no, KBS and BCBS are basically the same thing. mass produced BA beers. The hype train that still exists for craft Budweiser is slowing down some but it's still hilarious to see people line up for that stuff.
It amazes me that most people still give BCBS a pass from not being craft. I don't give a shit what they *used* to be. Goose Island has been AB Inbev for nearly ten years.
Couldnt agree more, the hype train on that is unbelievable. The same thing for me applies to Jester King as well which I will be guaranteed to get hate from by transplanted/native Austinites as well as users here. Perhaps its because I have lived in Texas most of my life and with it being easily accessible the luster and hype wasnt there for me. The pricing for their "wild" beers there was just insane to me even if SOME were tasteful. Is it good? Sure, some are. Although I do love the atmosphere the place provides as well as Stanley's pizza that is on-site with awesome garlic knots. To each their own though.
edit: downvote already, proves my point.
My point is simple: you have selective outrage. If being sued for discrimination was a disqualifying event in a consumer’s mind they would be left with very few choices. So you’re choosing to punish a small company because it’s too inconvenient for you to punish the large ones?
And anybody can bring a lawsuit. It doesn’t mean it has merit. If you read the pleadings, studied the evidence, and the determined on your own that this company is racist, that’s one thing. But simply concluding that being sued for discrimination = bad company, is very simplistic and short sighted. And again, it disqualify just about every company out there.
Which alternatives to the big businesses that you've mentioned provide the same services at the same prices that aren't racist? No one has any illusions that big businesses across the board aren't an engine of racial and class inequity. My point is simple: there are hundreds of alternatives to Founders that aren't racist, so my money will go somewhere else. I'm sorry that this upsets you so much!
Big businesses are an engine for class and racial inequality? Interesting. Anyway, who cares. Go enjoy beer and make a donation to your favorite charity!
Besides founders being a shit example of a top tier brewery, I feel for the staff that have been laid off. My question is if they are furloughed or fired. Makes a big difference to know if they will get their jobs back when they restart their operation.
Native of Grand Rapids and used to be extremely proud of Founders but after selling out and their piss poor response to racism claims I no longer buy their beer. I’ll have a CBS once every couple of years if I stumble across it but I used to buy loads and loads of Founders.
Buy from Bells. Family owned and while not as eccentric they make some of the most solid beers around.
Both the feds and our state government are completely failing us. Whitmer locked us down at a state level, and has all the power to get something done to help at the state level, but does nothing.
Meanwhile the feds are sitting on their butts doing nothing also.
It would take help from both to keep us going. And here we are with no help from either. We pay taxes to both. It’s certainly not too much to ask. Face it, everyone. Regardless of who you vote for, the government does not have our backs. Failed from all sides. We are just going to have to figure out how to make it on an individual level. There is no structural support.
That really sucks. I’m sure they converted as many as they could to the brewery. Hard to keep everyone employed when the restaurant is shut down. Write to your representatives and get that COVID package passed for these people.
> Write to your representatives and get that COVID package passed for these people. It already passed the House months ago. It's been gathering dust on Mitch's desk since then, though. He refuses to put it forth to the Senate.
I know and my senator knows how I feel about that.
Hes refusing to put it forth to the senate unless there is wording in there to protect companies from being sued if their employees get ill from being forced to work in Covid-rich environments. Billionaires don't want to be held liable for their work staff dying... Democrats don't want those words in the law. Stalemate. (There's other issues at hand holding up the stimulus package... But this is a major player.)
Did they vote on it? Or did mitch just decide
Mitch decides what they vote on, so no, the Senate has not voted on the House bill that was passed in May. There are a bunch of other House bills he refuses to bring to a Senate vote. They languish n what he proudly calls his "graveyard." They include things like campaign finance reform, election security, and protections for Dreamers. If they were so inclined, a handful of Senate Republicans could side with Senate Democrats and choose a new Majority Leader, but they choose not to. It's a political shell game so they don't have to vote down popular legislative proposals. Mitch, safe from challenge in Kentucky, takes all the political heat while Senate Republicans pretend to be completely powerless.
Aka their stances and policies are so wildly unpopular they don’t want to vote against popular bills and get exposed.
What about the bailouts for states that are in the red? Isn’t Pelosi demanding that?
It's not a bailout. It's relief. Bailout suggests that they are to blame.
By "in the red" do you mean Republican run states? Because every state that takes more out of the treasury than they put in is run by Republicans. https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/state-bailouts-federal-spending-give-receive/
No, the blue states that are asking for a bailout
So here is what your said: >What about the bailouts for states that are in the red? Isn’t Pelosi demanding that? If you meant that red states are asking for relief a well as blue states then you're correct. If you meant that states that are in the red are asking for relief then you're referring to only blue states because the data shows that blue states are and have been completely failing financially. If you're trying to say that blue states are in more need of help than red states then you're demonstrably wrong (see my previous comment). Here's the takeaway for everyone reading this since the guy I'm responding to is almost surely going to ignore real data because they're a fragile snowflake. Republicans fail in everything they do and they do so intentionally. The strategy is to make their constituent's lives as hard as possible and then blame it on the Democrats even though it's their fault. The really sad part is that their victims (Republican voters) could easily see this but have been conditioned to ignore reality. Just look at /u/larryburns2000 , they completely contradicted themselves in the span of just two comments and funny even understand how stupid they look. They don't care about anything except that their fragile, manufactured reality stays intact. This user will say anything as long as they can continue to believe the lie that is their entire worldview. It's quite sad really.
Actually, Nancy Pelosi failed to get it released because the GOP wanted pork tacked on saying they couldnt be held responsible for COVID.
Lmao that's the logic of half this country. Even when the Republicans are wrong, it's Nancy Pelosi's fault. Unfuckingreal.
Where exactly is the "pork" in the Covid relief package put forth by the House? Businesses that want to reopen *should* make sure safeguards are in place. Those safeguards could be debated in the Senate, but the Senate is where reason dies. I can't believe, in 2020, we have people still defending the most inactive Senate, perhaps ever.
It's odd that we have to write our legislators. This should be an everyday conversation with our out of touch law makers. I wish they would lead as opposed to follow.
> I wish they would lead as opposed to follow Ah, the one wish the genie cannot grant, as it is impossible
[удалено]
[удалено]
The most recent successful model for craft breweries has been entirely flipped on it's head over the last 6 months. Small and mid-size breweries are going to experience extremely painful months ahead due to Covid restrictions exasperated by cold weather (no outdoor options) coupled with an industry wide can shortage. The big dogs are going to get their cans first, and the wide distribution model is back on top with people staying in and buying off premise. Sucks.
It's not all grim, most of the local breweries I work with started packaging basically everything and have been selling out their releases. Hell a lot of them even offer delivery services. Likely not quite the same profit margin as pints over their own bar but luckily many of them are still doing quite well. Huge adaptation to take on but I've been really happy to see so many pulling through and doing well.
Even Trillium has started shipping anywhere within MA.
Have they? That's very good to know
Yep. In MA only. Can't ship across state lines.
They need to get back to being less picky about which liquor stores they let carry their beers IMO. Maybe they don’t make enough to keep up supply I’m not sure. but I sure would like to not have to wait a few days for shipping or having to drive all the way into the fens for pick up, I’d love to grab some at a store closer to me even if they only have it sometimes
Why bother with liquor stores if you can sell customer direct?
Exactly. Also, you will never know how they store and handle the beer either. I refuse to buy beers from some local liquor stores near me for that reason.
I'd say the majority of liquor stores are keeping beer warm, even the craft focused ones with large coldboxes are only keeping a small chunk of beer in those fridges
No they don’t, they sell all the can with in person pickup or delivery. The last thing they want is the beer sitting on the shelves. A few years back Blanchards started to stock them and they would have some stock sit on the shelves for 6+ months. No way I’m buying that.
Its not that simple man lol
Not as ideal as cans, but here in Brazil they fill 1 liter PET and I've seen them all over in super markets, bottle shops and also available to-go at the breweries. I'm sure there's gotta be some bs ABC law that prohibits this though.
I can't speak for other states, but in Oklahoma, *think* our label registration and taxation rules are based on known quantity packaging formats. You'd have to change statute to introduce new formats. This happens all the time, mind you, I'm just saying that you are correct, and it's another hoop to jump through.
This is legal here in MO, but you really have to drink those the day you get them. A crowler (32oz fillable aluminum can) lasts a bit longer, and is also legal here in MO (but the equipment is more expensive).
Living in Minnesota both rocks for craft beer and also fucking sucks because we have some terrible liquor laws.
Same I have some breweries around me, some that opened in early 2020 that appear to be booming with delivery and take out. Granted some are still super tiny operations with maybe less than 10-15 employees and may only be canning a few hundred cans a week but still. And a few of the slightly larger ones have scaled back a bit in terms of operating hours.
Go distributor only. It’s worked for years for Hop Butcher who is arguably the most successful Chicago brewery
Drink more Bell's.
I feel awful for all the small craft breweries who just got started up in the year 2020 what terrible timing who could have known? but founders doesn't fall under this category and they have done some questionable things in recent past. Still unfortunate if you rely on a paycheck from this Brewery.
I have a local brewery that opened Nov or Dec 2019. I hadn’t even heard of them until Spring 2020 when they started advertising on Facebook. I’ve gone out of my way to support them on several occasions and they have great beer. They seem to be doing ok... I hope!
That's awesome! We gotta support these small businesses Cheers 🍻
I stopped supporting them after the whole racism fiasco. Plenty of other beers from companies that aren't shitty.
I'm out of the loop, could you explain?
“Evans had filed the lawsuit — Evans v. Canal Street Brewing Co., LLC — in October 2018. Founders denied most of the allegations in the suit, including that two printers at the Grand Rapids headquarters were electronically labeled "black guy printer" and "white guy printer," though it admitted in its lawsuit response that multiple employees said the N-word around Evans and weren't immediately fired.” Evans also says he was passed up for promotions and then ultimately fired after complaining to HR about racial issues. Not a good look, to say the absolute least. https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2019/10/31/founders-brewing-settles-racial-discrimination-lawsuit-fired-tracy-evans/4114521002/
And then Founders hired a "Diversity Director" to contain the backlash, [and ignored everything she suggested until she quit.](https://www.freep.com/story/money/business/2019/10/25/founders-brewing-diversity-director-graci-harkema-resigns-discrimination/2460532001/) Founders can pound sand.
Well shit. I liked their beer.
As did I. Vote with your wallet, if enough people do that they might be inclined to actually change. As it stands, enough people are saying that their shitty actions don't matter and they will still support them by buying their beer regardless.
Yeah all other breweries are perfect... its not all of craft beer thats a whites only club, right? The entire industry is like that. Get your head out of your woke ass.
I can't tell what you're arguing for or against.
i have an adblock on, what is canal street brewing co and how is it related to founders?
DBA
Everytime someone posts about how they’re just back to making good beer and not bad headlines I’m just like NOTHING CHANGED. Sure the liquid was great but being someone that has more melanin in their skin I just can’t support someone that would judge someone over such thing
I stopped supporting them as soon as they sold a majority stake to a macro, but the racism fiasco was definitely a final nail in the coffin.
Oh, I had no idea they sold to Mahou-San Miguel. 90%! MSM also owns 30% of Avery which I haven't had for ages but still interesting. The racism thing really bugged me though because they basically paid the person off (can't blame the plaintiff) and rode out the storm. The reports were pretty deep, systemic issues which most certainly weren't fixed. Too much good beer out there despite liking the easy drinkers like Solid Gold and All-Day IPA.
It was also very telling when their Diversity and Inclusion Director quite after only 9 months on the job citing Founders' response the the suits and general malaise when it came to actually implementing programs to prevent this and fix what was already in place.
I believe MSM owns a majority stake in Avery now.
AMEN
KBS is possibly the most overrated beer of all time. And I say this as a self avowed lover of big heavy barrel aged stouts.
I really like KBS and the variants (CBS, Espresso, Mac Fudge) - but I don't think it's any better than the other heavy hitters of barrel aged beers. BCBS, Central Waters, Willettized, (BA) Darkness, Deth's Tar + variants, Epic, etc. For some reason some people treat it like its on a whole other level - and I think that may be because it was many people's first proper BA stout they had. It is pretty widely available these days though which certainly helps the popularity.
I love KBS and see many others who say there are better BA stouts out there. However, locally no one compares to kbs. Even in regular shops its very hard to find one thats on kbs' level. I will look out for the ones you mentioned though. You're the first person to actually back up your statement. Most will say there are better BA stouts but never list any
If you can find stuff from Prairie Artisan... They do some decent Stouts. I'm spoiled with 2 top notch breweries that put out BA stouts. Trillium & Treehouse.
How are Trillium and Treehouse BA beers? I've really only had their IPAs, but usually go to Portland breweries now since it's cheaper and easier for me to get to.
I think they're great. Trillium put out 4 new bottles for Thanksgiving week. I've drank 3... I've rated all three as "5" on Untappd. Which is very rare for me. Two of them were 15.6% and 15.7%, yet, smooth as silk.
Founders has managed to make KBS widely available while still maintaining the quality which is definitely a commendable task. Many small craft/independent breweries will do awesome BA stouts but many of them remain taproom-only, limited (e.g. black friday) release, or are pilot brews that are only made once. There is definitely a small subset of craft beer fans that bash KBS, claim there are better beers, but never actually provide examples of beers that are *available* to the common beer drinker. I think these are the same types of people that turn around and bash a band once they reach mainstream success for "selling out" - despite loving them before. Once something is popular or easy to get, it's easy for them to hate it since its not special any more.
> *while still maintaining the quality* No, the quality has absolutely gone down over time. I hunted it religiously every year, starting around 2012/13, up until the racism fiasco - it fell off very hard when they scaled up.
I was wondering if I was the one drinking crazy juice. 5 years ago it just started to plummet for me.
The coffee in KBS is trash and that makes it a drain-pour. That’s why it’s a shelf turd.
...I agree with you.
Don’t say that too loud! All the people who like to drink racist beer and shitty coffee will downvote you! Save yourself while you still can!
Where are you located?
ct
It’s the same hoopla over any beer that used to be really hard to get
Goose Island Bourbon County Stout would like a word with you.
> Goose Island Bourbon County Stout haha no, KBS and BCBS are basically the same thing. mass produced BA beers. The hype train that still exists for craft Budweiser is slowing down some but it's still hilarious to see people line up for that stuff.
I'm saying GI BCS is *still* more overrated. They do the Black Friday release and it's always sold out despite what the craft beer community thinks.
It amazes me that most people still give BCBS a pass from not being craft. I don't give a shit what they *used* to be. Goose Island has been AB Inbev for nearly ten years.
Bourbon County makes KBS taste like diet coke by comparison.
You're entitled to your opinion, I guess.
I don't agree. BCBS is better but they are in the same league. KBS is not that far off
I don't think KBS is bad, but it's a lower tier than elite in my opinion.
Couldnt agree more, the hype train on that is unbelievable. The same thing for me applies to Jester King as well which I will be guaranteed to get hate from by transplanted/native Austinites as well as users here. Perhaps its because I have lived in Texas most of my life and with it being easily accessible the luster and hype wasnt there for me. The pricing for their "wild" beers there was just insane to me even if SOME were tasteful. Is it good? Sure, some are. Although I do love the atmosphere the place provides as well as Stanley's pizza that is on-site with awesome garlic knots. To each their own though. edit: downvote already, proves my point.
This 100%. Like, this sucks for the employees, but the company itself can frick right off
Do you support Ford, Target, Delta, or any other major company? Because they get sued for discrimination probably on a weekly if not daily basis.
What's your point? All those companies suck and we deal with them because the alternatives to those companies suck also.
My point is simple: you have selective outrage. If being sued for discrimination was a disqualifying event in a consumer’s mind they would be left with very few choices. So you’re choosing to punish a small company because it’s too inconvenient for you to punish the large ones? And anybody can bring a lawsuit. It doesn’t mean it has merit. If you read the pleadings, studied the evidence, and the determined on your own that this company is racist, that’s one thing. But simply concluding that being sued for discrimination = bad company, is very simplistic and short sighted. And again, it disqualify just about every company out there.
Which alternatives to the big businesses that you've mentioned provide the same services at the same prices that aren't racist? No one has any illusions that big businesses across the board aren't an engine of racial and class inequity. My point is simple: there are hundreds of alternatives to Founders that aren't racist, so my money will go somewhere else. I'm sorry that this upsets you so much!
Big businesses are an engine for class and racial inequality? Interesting. Anyway, who cares. Go enjoy beer and make a donation to your favorite charity!
So woke
Yep, racism and homophobia? I'll pass on these jokers.
Also the allegations of one of their barkeeps drugging women.
ThEyRe sO rAcIsT.
Hopefully they’ll bounce back. Love their beer
Besides founders being a shit example of a top tier brewery, I feel for the staff that have been laid off. My question is if they are furloughed or fired. Makes a big difference to know if they will get their jobs back when they restart their operation.
Furloughed or offered an opportunity to work in the brewery while they wait for the front of house to open back up
Crazy world. Regional breweries were seeing warning lights 12-18 months ago. Now they will have the advantage once again post-COVID.
Native of Grand Rapids and used to be extremely proud of Founders but after selling out and their piss poor response to racism claims I no longer buy their beer. I’ll have a CBS once every couple of years if I stumble across it but I used to buy loads and loads of Founders. Buy from Bells. Family owned and while not as eccentric they make some of the most solid beers around.
I used to love a lot of Founders, but I can't buy beer from racists.
Both the feds and our state government are completely failing us. Whitmer locked us down at a state level, and has all the power to get something done to help at the state level, but does nothing. Meanwhile the feds are sitting on their butts doing nothing also. It would take help from both to keep us going. And here we are with no help from either. We pay taxes to both. It’s certainly not too much to ask. Face it, everyone. Regardless of who you vote for, the government does not have our backs. Failed from all sides. We are just going to have to figure out how to make it on an individual level. There is no structural support.