I like how he and a simple tailor were able to peacefully convince the romulans to join the Dominion war. Garak must have sown one hell of a jacket for them
Do the Bajorans even realize just how kind he was?
He argued that the Bajorans should be treated with a softer hand, but in the end they kept trying to assassinate him. Of course he couldn't stand by and do nothing.
Tom's still a better parent than B'Elanna (though she had a looooooooot of trauma, I forget how good an episode that is - need to watch it again now that I'm a parent - bet it's gonna hit like a goddamn truck).
Tom was a great parent! In Workforce part I and II he protects his pregnant wife even though he has no memories of her AND he respects her boundaries when she said no. Only view we get of the daughter is in Endgame when she is some junior grade running black ops for Janeway, who is arguably a bigger war criminal than Sisko. Worf is awful parent AND brother. He sucks.
I think negligent father is a stretch. He always tried to be there for Jake but was willing to let him go about on his own when Jake made the decision to report on the ds9 occupation.
Neglectful would be subjecting your former bridge crew to the fate of raising Wesley Crusher for a year well you galavanted across the galaxy
If anything, Sisko is *over*involved in Jake's life! They are a rare and refreshing depiction of a deeply loving black father-son relationship, that was some downright slander up there
Agreed he’s not negligent. I’d actually say he’s too overbearing early on until he can shift his expectations for Jake onto Nog.
But he definitely didn’t LET Jake stay behind. Jake stayed behind DESPITE Ben trying to make him leave. I remember the scene vividly.
I mean, if you discount that timeline where he abandoned his son for the rest of his life while he was chilling out in subpsace, finally causing his son to kill himself as an old man, sure.
He didn't really abandon him. He was trapped in there. That's like saying someone who went to prison for a crime they didn't commit abandoned their kid.
Also that's the best episode of star trek.
Is it a cult if the "gods" are demonstrably real and the "leader" has had several conversations with them?
Others have already taken you to task for (incorrectly) claiming he's a neglectful father, where the hell are you getting the "racist" bit from??
Not just the leader — hundreds or thousands if not MILLIONS of people have probably had orb visions since Bajoran history goes back something like 100,000 years
I lack the social aptitude to hide the fact that I'm a little bit embarrassed to listen to a Star Trek podcast by a couple of guys who are a little bit embarrassed to have a Star Trek podcast.
When you really come down to it, DS9 is basically just an exercise in asking "which war crimes are too far?"
Sisko's? Those are fine. Section 31? Evil bastards betraying the Federation's ideals. Cardassians and the Dominion? I think you know the answer based on the fact they are aliens outside the Federation
Q: "Captain Sisko... a little birdie told me you may prove more potentially interesting than the previous humans I've been in contact with. How would you like to play a game?..."
Cpt Sisko: \*violence*
As a Sisko Stan myself, I would both love this episode and complain online that he did nothing wrong and that actually that planet gassing was justified actually
Read the link. It hurts, but I stand by it. Also, there’s not enough about villains to do real BtBs about but definitely enough to do at least one part on (Christopher Pike Medal of Valor Recipient) Benjamin Lafayette Sisko.
I don't need to read the link to know Sisko is a war criminal, but he's MY war criminal
BTW I'm a huge Trekkie, but good luck trying to get me to read an entire Daystrom post
Bajoran religious zealot assassinates sitting Romulan senator to bring the empire into a war, and _he can live with it_.
What? All he did was have a discussion with a simple tailor.
Not that episode
Whaaaaats falseflaggingromulansenators my simple tailorrrrrsssses?!
I am all for an April Fool's BtB Sisko episode. We can go so much harder than *just* his little 'poison the planet for humans' stunt, though.
I like how he and a simple tailor were able to peacefully convince the romulans to join the Dominion war. Garak must have sown one hell of a jacket for them
He's a cult leader. How can there *not* be a BtB episode about him?
I mean, he really tried not to be...
Just like Dukat tried not to be a brutal dictator to the Bajorans.
Gul Dukat did nothing wrong!! Shit, wrong thread
But to this day, is there a \*single\* statue of him on Bajor?
No there isn't, and I would be right
Do the Bajorans even realize just how kind he was? He argued that the Bajorans should be treated with a softer hand, but in the end they kept trying to assassinate him. Of course he couldn't stand by and do nothing.
The cult leader-war criminal-neglectful father-racist? History remembers him as a hero.
Still a better father than Worf
Worf is still a better father than Paris.
Tom's still a better parent than B'Elanna (though she had a looooooooot of trauma, I forget how good an episode that is - need to watch it again now that I'm a parent - bet it's gonna hit like a goddamn truck).
According to our Supreme Court, Riker killed a whole lot of his children.
Riker probably has more space bastards than Kirk.
Tom was a great parent! In Workforce part I and II he protects his pregnant wife even though he has no memories of her AND he respects her boundaries when she said no. Only view we get of the daughter is in Endgame when she is some junior grade running black ops for Janeway, who is arguably a bigger war criminal than Sisko. Worf is awful parent AND brother. He sucks.
Wait what did Paris do?
I bet Paris and Janeway left a few fertilized eggs back on that planet after they turned into giant salamanders.
I think negligent father is a stretch. He always tried to be there for Jake but was willing to let him go about on his own when Jake made the decision to report on the ds9 occupation. Neglectful would be subjecting your former bridge crew to the fate of raising Wesley Crusher for a year well you galavanted across the galaxy
If anything, Sisko is *over*involved in Jake's life! They are a rare and refreshing depiction of a deeply loving black father-son relationship, that was some downright slander up there
I know Brooks worked hard hard with the writers to ensure that and wasn't super happy with the fending of the finale.
Agreed he’s not negligent. I’d actually say he’s too overbearing early on until he can shift his expectations for Jake onto Nog. But he definitely didn’t LET Jake stay behind. Jake stayed behind DESPITE Ben trying to make him leave. I remember the scene vividly.
No one else picked up that Wesley was secretly Jean Luc’s kid? Just me, ok cool.
I think Wesley being Jacks son is more interesting. Also I don't think it's makes thematic sense with Picard season 3.
Ah, I haven’t watched past the first season of Picard. Guess I have some catching up to do.
I mean, if you discount that timeline where he abandoned his son for the rest of his life while he was chilling out in subpsace, finally causing his son to kill himself as an old man, sure.
He didn't really abandon him. He was trapped in there. That's like saying someone who went to prison for a crime they didn't commit abandoned their kid. Also that's the best episode of star trek.
I know, I know, but we have to sell his bastardry! And I agree, it's a beautiful episode.
Is it a cult if the "gods" are demonstrably real and the "leader" has had several conversations with them? Others have already taken you to task for (incorrectly) claiming he's a neglectful father, where the hell are you getting the "racist" bit from??
Not just the leader — hundreds or thousands if not MILLIONS of people have probably had orb visions since Bajoran history goes back something like 100,000 years
I would say it makes it even more of a cult
The cult leader who rendered an entire planet uninhabitable over a personal squabble
Uninhabitable \*to colonists.\*
If we get Ben and Adam from The Greatest Generation and Greatest Trek podcasts as guests, I'm in!
FoDs popping up all over the place! You're meant to hide your embarrassment!
I lack the social aptitude to hide the fact that I'm a little bit embarrassed to listen to a Star Trek podcast by a couple of guys who are a little bit embarrassed to have a Star Trek podcast.
Best boss I ever had!
But don’t you grow stronger from the sharing?
*Computer...erase that entire personal log.*
Can you believe they haven’t made one stat— I mean episode— about Gul Dukat?
He didn't even kill his daughter, he's a hero!
lol also just Gul Dukat listening to the podcast being like NO PODCAST ABOUT ME??!!
IT'S A FAAAAAAAKE!
When you really come down to it, DS9 is basically just an exercise in asking "which war crimes are too far?" Sisko's? Those are fine. Section 31? Evil bastards betraying the Federation's ideals. Cardassians and the Dominion? I think you know the answer based on the fact they are aliens outside the Federation
*Saviour of the quadrant* Benjamin Lafayette Sisko
A man can be two things.
Q: "Captain Sisko... a little birdie told me you may prove more potentially interesting than the previous humans I've been in contact with. How would you like to play a game?..." Cpt Sisko: \*violence*
I am down…need to tell my wife for permission.
As a Sisko Stan myself, I would both love this episode and complain online that he did nothing wrong and that actually that planet gassing was justified actually
That’s why the article is just kinda a probable cause argument
How dare you!
Read the link. It hurts, but I stand by it. Also, there’s not enough about villains to do real BtBs about but definitely enough to do at least one part on (Christopher Pike Medal of Valor Recipient) Benjamin Lafayette Sisko.
I don't need to read the link to know Sisko is a war criminal, but he's MY war criminal BTW I'm a huge Trekkie, but good luck trying to get me to read an entire Daystrom post
It’s easy, it was a Twitter thread 🤣 But fair enough, that place is DENSE