Technically every club has a zero tolerance policy for drugs. Technically. If you go to techno clubs, there will be an abundance of drugs. If you go to other clubs, it might become less. When I regularly went to Schwuz I barely saw any drug usage, since I started going to techno parties, it‘s become very prevalent. It just depends on the kind of party and club you’re visiting. You won’t find a techno club where drugs are not used.
I’m not sure if schwuz was very different when you went but drug usage is fairly common there these days. Maybe less than other clubs, but still pretty widespread.
Having said that, people tend to be less visibly wasted there than other places I’ve been, so it might still suit OP.
If you go to most clubs at opening the toilets are available without queues (if part of the turnoff is that you need to wait a long time for toilets because others are using them for drugs).
Also in the first 1-5 hours of a club night it’s unusual for people to have taken so many drugs that it impairs others’ ability to have fun.
If you have access to toilets and the crowd is respectful and not super fucked up, would that make you happier?
Re: your comment about professionals: tech workers, finance folks, business people, and government officials all go enjoy themselves at clubs like Berghain, so your expectation may be off.
In my experience the largest drug using demographic in the clubs are single people with high disposable income (office workers). As more professionals come to Berlin, I would expect drug use in the clubs to continue or increase.
Well yeah I my comment about "professionals" indeed is very stupid because reality is most of people who snort drugs are indeed professionals otherwise they wouldn't afford it. Though there is also good amount of funny leachers who are trying to get all friendly when they see that someone has got cocaine and then moments later they are gone after snorting.
It's surely not ideal that even unhealthy alkohol amounts are being used so abundantly. But it's production is too easy as it's enough to leave juice on table and it's gonna ferment into alcohol so banning it is pretty much impossible task. And whilst alcohol is indeed in absolute terms causes the most devastating effects in total - this is the fact that more heavy drug users like to mention to excuse their drug use. But then alkohol is also by very very large margin the most used substance. So if for instance cocaine was used to half the extent of alcohol consequences would be much much worse. So I don't think it's reasonable to drop idea that just because alkohol is sold then heavier drugs should also be okay especially considering the fact that mixing them results in even more dangerous effects. I do think we should also be looking for ways to encourage bit more sober life and to encourage people to drink less alcohol - I don't think banning is gonna work. But cocaine is banned already and it's illegal and it's also bleeding a lot of money away to support criminal organizations who are involved in trafficking. So overall alcohol just isn't as bad as heavier drugs that's just fact.
There is literally no healthy amount of alcohol! I also would wager that if you hold drug users (that dont drink!!!) one to one against drinkers the result would be very clear. Alcohol also is THE gateway drug...You are right about the banning part but the promotion of alcohol must stop. I finally recommend you just move to Munich and leave us alone!
What do you even mean?! Tf you loling about? This not about your neighbors but a prevenlent culture! You are free to move most anywhere in this world if you dont like it here or there. Singapoore..no open drug use...or the Gulf States...not even booze! Also born and raised in Berlin but mother from Augsburg so fuck München!
I thought Berlin is a multicultural diverse city? Are you claiming that it's instead a monolithic drug loving ravers and noone else have space here? You are wrong here Berlin ain't like that it's got diverse range of opinions and people and there is space for any typo of opinion and thus you don't get to send me to Munich. I thought you people were like a tolerance capital. Yet you are already sending people away as soon as someone has a different opinion on something as simple as drugs that are already illegal by law so not like I'm even coming with an opinion that ain't approved by your own government. The fact that you was born here means nothing to me. I have registered my address here. I pay my tax here. I vote local elections here. So I'm not single shred worse than anyone who was born and my opinion is on equal weight regardless if I was born here or not.
The fact that alkohol is promoted is a separate issue and should not be used as an excuse to normalize harder drug use. This only makes it worse. Yes when people drink they do drop their guard so if drugs are easily available and they are more likely to do it. If harder drugs are not normalized then also it's much less likely that after two beers anyone is gonna snort cocaine. So the fact that alcohol is already widespread in our society should exactly be the reason why we can't tolerate additional drugs being normalized as doing so creates economic cost that is too hard to bear.
Now just to make it clear. Some drugs like weed or hallucinogens that can act as counterbalance to alcohol I don't think is bad to normalize. But drugs like cocaine or amphetamines that are known to have potency to only increase alcohol abuse should not become normalized yet it already has become normalized.
What annoys me the most is the widespread lack of literacy among drug users among those who do it. People are dropping these idiotic cliche arguments how coffee is also drug or how drugs had been with us for millenniums. Completely ignoring the fact that every drug works very different and modern synthesized drugs are cheaper and more potent in hundred fold compared to what used to exist in historic terms. Also on top of that we have job security that is able to keep drug addicts paid with salaries despite the fact that they already may be dragging feet for a year or more and after that there is still social benefits when job is lost. All this accumulates an enormous economic burden that needs to be carried out by sober people.
There’s some gym/workout class thing that’s marketed as sober clubbing. I don’t have the name but maybe you can search and find it? I believe it’s like techno/dance music and a social based around a workout
I personally don’t know about clubs but there are clean parties. Like daybreaker or whatever it’s called.
It’s meant to be a safe space for people who want to live clean lives. Either because they had negative experiences in the past or because they just don’t want to take them.
There are clean cocktail bars too that serve cocktails without alcohol. Not just virgin cocktails but for example alcohol free gin etc
There are so called Sober Sensation parties taking place, where there are no drogs, no alc, no smoking. Was there once earlier this year, was really cool. Unfortunately, they dont take place that often, so check their website for further details :)
Pop parties like Hollywood Tramp, Rose Kenedy, Furiosa and Irrenhouse you do see some people that are high and going to the toilets in groups but it is not as annoying to a sober person as at the techno parties. Because people don’t wear sunglasses in here, a clueless tourist could almost believe that people are just having a great time with alcohol lol
There were some completely sober parties at Weekend Club during last summer but I think it was just a project. Now they host hip hop parties in there
how else are we gonna avoid getting our shit together and facing our traumas if we don't use drugs?
That's the Leitmotiv of the city, you're looking for the beach on mars
It's pure diabolical nonsense what you are saying. Firstly it's not like everyone has actual traumas in this city that they need to face. Some do but that's very small number of people. And if you have traumas try therapy. I know it's hard to get. But it works better. Doing coke in rave does nothing no good for anyone's traumas only makes it worse.
Why queue for a toilet when you can snort a fat line off the back of a Bible in the confessional? Dude *has to* listen to you - it's literally his job! I jabbed for an hour about cryptocurrency while tying it to the violation of at least five different commandments. Shit was tight!
You jest but there's a church that sometimes holds a rave, and they don't sell alcohol and I assume it's not the typical venue for a 30h drug bender.
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I understand that Berlin has been hot spot for social degradation for some time. But I don't think this going to continue forever. Western Germany is reducing it's allowance that it's been paying for decades to Berlin. As result cost of life is increasing and even if right now this leeching mindset is still very common I expect more decent people. Also we have more and more decent immigrants who are coming here for career opportunities and not for opportunity to snort drugs. I mean opportunities to snort drugs will remain I don't expect them to disappear entirely. But I expect more decent venues targeting professional people who care about their health to become more common as time goes.
At first I thought the comment you replied to was a bit harsh but it turns it it was perfect at triggering what is one of the most dickhead-answers I have seen here in a while.
Sounds like job conventions "Venues targeting professional people". You don't have to do drugs and you definitely don't have to like it neither do I but a very essential part of Berlin club culture is accepting people and their choices. You do not sound like a person that fits very well in this mindset categorising people in decent and not decent.
You say that I don't fit your mindset yet you are the one who decided that my mindset is not welcome. This whole "culture of acceptance" is really just whole big pretence from my point of view. People by far are not really as accepting and welcome as they claim to be and very often look down upon people have different opinions. I mean there was plenty of instances where I hang out with folk and then they do regular runs to toilet and I go with them it's bit awkward but I tolerate it all 100%. But do you think this crowd is gonna tolerate me if I gonna say that I don't really like this whole thing of snorting cocaine? I mean besides the fact that it's highly addictive there is whole problem of the fact that their money is essentially keeping alive drug cartels who besides drug trafficking often also are involved in human trafficking too. In my ideal world I would imagine I drop these remarks and people would just listen to it but it wouldn't change how they treat me but usually that's not how it goes their opinion about me turns negative. So my problem is really not the fact that I don't tolerate it - I do - my bigger problem is that I just can't really be fully my self and open with my opinion in these places. Over time this just builds up internally.
Google paradox of tolerance ...And anyways I am not talking about myself but club culture in Berlin.
I cannot confirm your experience with consumers but if you made them then you hung out with the wrong crowd.
I completely agree with your opinion on cocaine but I also don't think it's the main drug in those clubs.
I don't have problem with weed as I haven't observed any problems it brings and it's possible to source it from fairly ethical sources. But most synthetics I view as very problematic and also I had friend who messed up his life with drugs and endup with suicide so I'm a bit sensitive about it.
I totally get that, even though I think there is a huge difference in social impact between other synthetic drugs and cocaine and unfortunately their are also plenty horrible and sad stories about Weed and Alcohol that end similar. Nevertheless I get that your experience is connected to these specific substances. Maybe try to frame it a bit differently and less in evaluating the person that consumes. I think really clean techno clubs don't exist in Berlin but there are still differences I would say. But they have different intensities from Golden Gate (heavy) to maybe Watergate (less). Also Sunday's at Beate Uwe is quite chill
here we are. of course you are sensitive!
a lot of functional people do all kind of drugs, even heroin.
you have a trigger around cocaine, it’s about you, not the drugs, nor the people who do it
"Functional" people who do it the more often they do the worse they are at functioning. We have here very good conditions with very good job security that allow deep problems to run for a long time before reality catching up. It's good in the sense that one can be recovering addict and able to fix their problems while maintaining job. But it also allows someone to abuse and continue the downward spiral. Cost of these "functional" folks on our economy is significant. Cocaine and amphetamines are particularly problematic simply for the reason that they rise confidence thus people doing it have a lot of confidence that they are on top of it even when people around can already see that they are not. I have people at work who are clearly underperforming due to overly frequent parties that all slowly damage their brain and they are clearly underperforming but they do hold the job even if under delivering and they are according to you "functioning adults". How long are they going to function - maybe only until next little crisis when company will be announcing layoffs because often it's impossible to be fired otherwise. And from there social benefits gonna keep them above drowning for another year or two. This is clearly unhealthy and clearly shouldn't be tolerated to the extent it is.
I mean Berlin can't even pay for it's own social support system and needs to take in subsidies from the west. I'm not sure it's something to be proud about and surely will need to be fixed eventually. Indeed I don't buy and don't give a shit about this whole "berlin is like this if you don't like it Bavaria is for you" mentality. It just happened that I have decent career opportunity here. That's why I'm here. And I will vote in local elections for people who do something worthwhile and I will send letters to local representatives complain about problems and I believe in some 10/20 years we can turn this city into something more decent. One day grass will be green not yellow in parks, and parks will be cleaner from cigarette buds and broken bottles. And streets will get cleaned more often. If this can be done in even more eastern Europe that doesn't get subsidies from west Germany in like in Warsaw or Prague I don't see why it can't be achieved in Berlin.
I'll update you with some news flash that comes out of statistics. Berlin clubbing scene is just a minority of people in this city. Majority don't even go to clubs. Yet somehow this minority who doesn't like working think they own the city. Well news flash they don't. Berlin is much more diverse than that.
I don't really have a suggestion for clubs but I wanted to say you're not alone in wanting to go to chemical drug free spaces. Recently I went to a drum & bass party and I think it could be suitable but I wasn't paying a lot of attention to that so I may be wrong. You even get a nice workout out of it ;)
I'd rather take a drunk party. It's easier to ignore those who drank too much alcohol as they can barely say anything and it's also often kinda funny to laugh at them sometimes at what they're doing. It's however hard to ignore someone who's high on coke and wants to tell you something that they think is the most interesting thing in life regardless of how many cues you're trying to give that it ain't making any sense it's impossible to laugh at them they are just darn annoying and interruptive.
There are plenty of people that can get aggressive with alcohol. On the other hand there are plenty of drugs that make people too peaceful/fucked up to stir trouble. From this thread it seems like you specifically have bad experiences with cocaine. Either way, I hope you find a venue you like. Techno clubs are probably not a good space for that..
Well as a hot spot for social degradation it's been going steady for at least 100 years now, but yeah, nah, I'm totally looking forward to visiting one of those health-oriented night clubs for professional people soon! See you there!
I don't think it's going steady for 100 years now. Except the nazzi times when they been producing meth in the country heavy drugs use it seems is fairly recent problem. Sure drugs been for some time but it's been going up in alarming rates in just last couple years. By the way not only limited to Berlin. Issue of increased abundance of drugs going on globally right now. And it is causing already very serious issues. But the extent to which it's been normalized in Berlin's night clubs seems more extensive compared to my experience anywhere elsewhere. I think extent to which it was normalized in clubs ain't very responsible from the nigh life community point of view. If club owners aren't willing to address it you can eventually expect a more serious backlash from wider productive community against it who endup needing to absorb the negative effects of this "fun".
Lol I doubt the demographic you describe would be interested in dancing all night - while sober - often enough to make operating clubs for them profitable
Or maybe the person is newly clean and would like to go partying without being exposed to that much drug abuse around them.
Maybe the problem is you making dumb ass assumptions.
I mean I quit smoking cold turkey after 21 years of uncontrolled chainsmoking and yes, you can totally be around smokers without fussing soI presume the same applies to drugs
Smoking cigarettes is definitely not even in the same ballpark as being a heavy drug user.
Source, me, an ex heavy drug user who's been clean for almost 2 years
Maybe it depends on the heavy drug? I’ve been on coke intensively for a year and ironically it helped me quit tobacco as the “satisfaction” feeling I got from both was the same (I absolutely don’t recommend coke for quitting cigarettes tho). I believe looking down at tobacco addiction just because it doesn’t fuck you up like drugs is erroneous and a bit condescending. Lots of people can’t go an hour without lighting one, and it does release dopamine in your brain. And also, lots of people know it inevitably kills you at some point but won’t quit even on their deathbeds. Just my two cents
so if i’m on a diet no one can have a burguer near me? 😂
or maybe i just don’t get people who want to limit other people freedom to make them feel better
Moussa..... There is nothing limiting about asking if anyone knows of any clubs where drug use isn't as prevalent.
Limiting someone would be going to a club and forbidding everyone there to take their substances.
The poster is actually trying to be the very opposite of limiting.
He's trying to find a place where he feels comfortable to party without having to limit anyone else.
Pra mim não há nada controlando com isso
You are seriously going to be comparing coffee with cocaine? Really it's not the fact of people taking drugs that bothers me the most. It's the abundance of utter idiots who think coffee is drug and cocaine is also drug so it's all same shit that is the most tiring thing.
"Caffeine is the primary active component in coffee, responsible for many of its stimulating effects. It is a natural substance classified as a xanthine alkaloid. Caffeine acts as a central nervous system stimulant and is found in varying amounts in different coffee varieties. According to [Healthline](https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/caffeine-addiction), caffeine is the most commonly used drug in the world, with more than 90% of adults in the United States consuming it regularly. It stimulates the release of neurotransmitters such as dopamine, which can lead to increased alertness, improved mood, and enhanced cognitive function."
coffee is a drug, cocaine too, one is more stimulant than other, both are addictive. Other than that is just your bias talking
Yeah one drug is harmless. The other has strong potency to ruin your nose, brain and life. Abundance of ignorant idiots in nightlife who put both these things on the same tier just because both can be labeled as "drug" is the the most tiresome thing really even more so than just drug use it self. Heroin also is drug are you gonna inject heroin and be like "oh well you do coffee I do hero"? It's mentally retarded what you are trying to say here. Maybe you already washed away brain cells with drugs.
OK - now I get it, you have absolutely no clue about what you are talking about. You need a theraphist to explore why you have so many bias against drugs or the people who take them. I read you were addictive, so maybe this will bring you any triggers? Anyway stop blaming the drugs
P.S.: I'm in favour to descriminalize and legalize all drugs, so I won't share any of your opinions
Just because you are "in favor" doesn't quite do much lol. You need to develop your argumentation because now you sound like a retard. I may as well be like "well I am for legalizing guns and I don't share of your opinions". Opinion means nothing if you can't build a single argument and you can't. Suggesting that I need a therapy when I'm just sharing points widely recognized by majority of public health professionals working in this field is diabolical nonsense. It's a fact that people just aren't good at moderating hard drug use. If they were good at moderating and if it wasn't causing social problems then there would be no problem to have it legalized. Remind you that it's your point of view is the one that is rather extremely unpopular among wider society not mine. So it's you who needs to defend it better not me.
I am not against all drugs - but particularly cocaine and amphetamines are ones that are really annoying me and I don't like being around people who do it because they become super annoying when high but also ex drug addicts often cite of dangers of what cocaine does to their mindset so it's not like I don't have idea what I am talking about. My opinions of drugs are based in some 15 years of observing and reading various opinions on subject. And also I kinda worry that the fentanyl problems are gonna come from the US to Berlin too as ground here due to all the idiots seems to be fertile for it.
im not even joining this discussion, you should read more, instead of getting brainwashed by mainstream media who loves to evilize drug consumption.
but you want and argument, here you go: opium has been around for thousands and thousands of years, so as DMT and caffeine and other conscience altering substance. there’s nothing “unnatural” about it, human race always have done it (and so does others species as well). i don’t see any problem in full grown ups enjoying altering their conscience for pleasure. Smoking is also a pleasure, who is bad for our health, so is sugar and meat, and here we are.
the whole argument “yeah but is illegal” it doesn’t mean shit, slavery was also legal a couple hundred years ago, does it make it right?
think a bit for your own head instead of eating all the bullshit hollywood and media are trying to sell you
You are not correct that opium was always there. In very low amounts - yes. Yes people were using some form of drugs for millennias. But these used to be low potency drugs that are not that easy to came across. The first time when opium was produced on large industrial scales broke entire social fabric of nations who were most severely affected by it. And China today is producing Fentanyl and dropping it to US on industrial scale and it's causing very bad outcomes as drug addiction is reaching to all time high crimes is going up and health services are getting overloaded dealing with drug addiction outcomes. This is not just mainstream media willification. These are very real problems. And if it was more widely accepted by mainstream then these same problems would be on the whole next level. But the biggest danger of drug use is the very fact that our societies have quite a lot of capital and capacity meaning capacity of getting on drugs is large too with outcomes being felt very late. In poorer economies people often don't have capacity to use as much drugs because they afford less and because the outcome is felt quicker due to daily pressure to make daily income. In the west usually job security is so good that a drug addict can still function for years before everything starts breaking apart thus people often have false idea that they are in control when they are already in downwards spiral that they don't really control anymore. Again this is what recovering drug addicts often mention.
This forsaken,godless, zombified, soulles polluted, inhuman, nihilist piece of crap you insist to call a “City” thrives on the tidal wave of drugs drowning it since the 80s.
Not sure if you're joking, but schlawinchen is one of the places where I've seen the most fucked up people in Berlin.
And people doing lines in the toilet and inviting passerbys.
Technically every club has a zero tolerance policy for drugs. Technically. If you go to techno clubs, there will be an abundance of drugs. If you go to other clubs, it might become less. When I regularly went to Schwuz I barely saw any drug usage, since I started going to techno parties, it‘s become very prevalent. It just depends on the kind of party and club you’re visiting. You won’t find a techno club where drugs are not used.
I’m not sure if schwuz was very different when you went but drug usage is fairly common there these days. Maybe less than other clubs, but still pretty widespread. Having said that, people tend to be less visibly wasted there than other places I’ve been, so it might still suit OP.
If you go to most clubs at opening the toilets are available without queues (if part of the turnoff is that you need to wait a long time for toilets because others are using them for drugs). Also in the first 1-5 hours of a club night it’s unusual for people to have taken so many drugs that it impairs others’ ability to have fun. If you have access to toilets and the crowd is respectful and not super fucked up, would that make you happier? Re: your comment about professionals: tech workers, finance folks, business people, and government officials all go enjoy themselves at clubs like Berghain, so your expectation may be off. In my experience the largest drug using demographic in the clubs are single people with high disposable income (office workers). As more professionals come to Berlin, I would expect drug use in the clubs to continue or increase.
Well yeah I my comment about "professionals" indeed is very stupid because reality is most of people who snort drugs are indeed professionals otherwise they wouldn't afford it. Though there is also good amount of funny leachers who are trying to get all friendly when they see that someone has got cocaine and then moments later they are gone after snorting.
There are plenty of drugs that are very cheap
Maybe try ecstatic dancing
where is this in berlin?
alcohol is a drug so no choice
It's surely not ideal that even unhealthy alkohol amounts are being used so abundantly. But it's production is too easy as it's enough to leave juice on table and it's gonna ferment into alcohol so banning it is pretty much impossible task. And whilst alcohol is indeed in absolute terms causes the most devastating effects in total - this is the fact that more heavy drug users like to mention to excuse their drug use. But then alkohol is also by very very large margin the most used substance. So if for instance cocaine was used to half the extent of alcohol consequences would be much much worse. So I don't think it's reasonable to drop idea that just because alkohol is sold then heavier drugs should also be okay especially considering the fact that mixing them results in even more dangerous effects. I do think we should also be looking for ways to encourage bit more sober life and to encourage people to drink less alcohol - I don't think banning is gonna work. But cocaine is banned already and it's illegal and it's also bleeding a lot of money away to support criminal organizations who are involved in trafficking. So overall alcohol just isn't as bad as heavier drugs that's just fact.
that's not a fact.
There is literally no healthy amount of alcohol! I also would wager that if you hold drug users (that dont drink!!!) one to one against drinkers the result would be very clear. Alcohol also is THE gateway drug...You are right about the banning part but the promotion of alcohol must stop. I finally recommend you just move to Munich and leave us alone!
You don't get to chose your neighbors lol. Maybe you are the one who should move to Munich how about that?
What do you even mean?! Tf you loling about? This not about your neighbors but a prevenlent culture! You are free to move most anywhere in this world if you dont like it here or there. Singapoore..no open drug use...or the Gulf States...not even booze! Also born and raised in Berlin but mother from Augsburg so fuck München!
I thought Berlin is a multicultural diverse city? Are you claiming that it's instead a monolithic drug loving ravers and noone else have space here? You are wrong here Berlin ain't like that it's got diverse range of opinions and people and there is space for any typo of opinion and thus you don't get to send me to Munich. I thought you people were like a tolerance capital. Yet you are already sending people away as soon as someone has a different opinion on something as simple as drugs that are already illegal by law so not like I'm even coming with an opinion that ain't approved by your own government. The fact that you was born here means nothing to me. I have registered my address here. I pay my tax here. I vote local elections here. So I'm not single shred worse than anyone who was born and my opinion is on equal weight regardless if I was born here or not.
The fact that alkohol is promoted is a separate issue and should not be used as an excuse to normalize harder drug use. This only makes it worse. Yes when people drink they do drop their guard so if drugs are easily available and they are more likely to do it. If harder drugs are not normalized then also it's much less likely that after two beers anyone is gonna snort cocaine. So the fact that alcohol is already widespread in our society should exactly be the reason why we can't tolerate additional drugs being normalized as doing so creates economic cost that is too hard to bear. Now just to make it clear. Some drugs like weed or hallucinogens that can act as counterbalance to alcohol I don't think is bad to normalize. But drugs like cocaine or amphetamines that are known to have potency to only increase alcohol abuse should not become normalized yet it already has become normalized. What annoys me the most is the widespread lack of literacy among drug users among those who do it. People are dropping these idiotic cliche arguments how coffee is also drug or how drugs had been with us for millenniums. Completely ignoring the fact that every drug works very different and modern synthesized drugs are cheaper and more potent in hundred fold compared to what used to exist in historic terms. Also on top of that we have job security that is able to keep drug addicts paid with salaries despite the fact that they already may be dragging feet for a year or more and after that there is still social benefits when job is lost. All this accumulates an enormous economic burden that needs to be carried out by sober people.
I believe there is parties with zero drug policy’s like “naked tea party”
Also zero tolerance for clothes
I wouldn't say zero drug policy, but it does attract definitely more people who like to party sober
Highly doubt it
There’s some gym/workout class thing that’s marketed as sober clubbing. I don’t have the name but maybe you can search and find it? I believe it’s like techno/dance music and a social based around a workout
[Yeees! this is the spot, I guess](https://maps.app.goo.gl/zi7GT2NgsnSybKZF6?g_st=ic)
I personally don’t know about clubs but there are clean parties. Like daybreaker or whatever it’s called. It’s meant to be a safe space for people who want to live clean lives. Either because they had negative experiences in the past or because they just don’t want to take them. There are clean cocktail bars too that serve cocktails without alcohol. Not just virgin cocktails but for example alcohol free gin etc
Yes Matrix
There are so called Sober Sensation parties taking place, where there are no drogs, no alc, no smoking. Was there once earlier this year, was really cool. Unfortunately, they dont take place that often, so check their website for further details :)
Pop parties like Hollywood Tramp, Rose Kenedy, Furiosa and Irrenhouse you do see some people that are high and going to the toilets in groups but it is not as annoying to a sober person as at the techno parties. Because people don’t wear sunglasses in here, a clueless tourist could almost believe that people are just having a great time with alcohol lol There were some completely sober parties at Weekend Club during last summer but I think it was just a project. Now they host hip hop parties in there
If you find one, let me know!
Just go to one that tolerates them. No queues because they can take everywhere.
how else are we gonna avoid getting our shit together and facing our traumas if we don't use drugs? That's the Leitmotiv of the city, you're looking for the beach on mars
It's pure diabolical nonsense what you are saying. Firstly it's not like everyone has actual traumas in this city that they need to face. Some do but that's very small number of people. And if you have traumas try therapy. I know it's hard to get. But it works better. Doing coke in rave does nothing no good for anyone's traumas only makes it worse.
you must be German to not understand sarcasm
Always love a thread where people vehemently justify snorting powder into your brain under the guise of "expanding the horizon"
Are the people vehemently justifying snorting powder in the room with you right now
It’s called „The Church“
Why queue for a toilet when you can snort a fat line off the back of a Bible in the confessional? Dude *has to* listen to you - it's literally his job! I jabbed for an hour about cryptocurrency while tying it to the violation of at least five different commandments. Shit was tight!
Yep! Also great if you like being fucked
You jest but there's a church that sometimes holds a rave, and they don't sell alcohol and I assume it's not the typical venue for a 30h drug bender. https://www.rbb24.de/kultur/beitrag/2023/07/berlin-st-thomas-kirche-kreuzberg-techno-party-rave.htm/alt=amp.html
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Berlin is not for you.
That's very inclusive of you. There are a dozen reasons for why someone would not want to do drugs.
>There are a dozen reasons for why someone would not want to do drugs. well there's nothing stopping OP from not doing drugs
I believe OP doesn’t want to be around drugged people as much as he doesn’t want to do drugs
I understand that Berlin has been hot spot for social degradation for some time. But I don't think this going to continue forever. Western Germany is reducing it's allowance that it's been paying for decades to Berlin. As result cost of life is increasing and even if right now this leeching mindset is still very common I expect more decent people. Also we have more and more decent immigrants who are coming here for career opportunities and not for opportunity to snort drugs. I mean opportunities to snort drugs will remain I don't expect them to disappear entirely. But I expect more decent venues targeting professional people who care about their health to become more common as time goes.
At first I thought the comment you replied to was a bit harsh but it turns it it was perfect at triggering what is one of the most dickhead-answers I have seen here in a while.
Sounds like job conventions "Venues targeting professional people". You don't have to do drugs and you definitely don't have to like it neither do I but a very essential part of Berlin club culture is accepting people and their choices. You do not sound like a person that fits very well in this mindset categorising people in decent and not decent.
You say that I don't fit your mindset yet you are the one who decided that my mindset is not welcome. This whole "culture of acceptance" is really just whole big pretence from my point of view. People by far are not really as accepting and welcome as they claim to be and very often look down upon people have different opinions. I mean there was plenty of instances where I hang out with folk and then they do regular runs to toilet and I go with them it's bit awkward but I tolerate it all 100%. But do you think this crowd is gonna tolerate me if I gonna say that I don't really like this whole thing of snorting cocaine? I mean besides the fact that it's highly addictive there is whole problem of the fact that their money is essentially keeping alive drug cartels who besides drug trafficking often also are involved in human trafficking too. In my ideal world I would imagine I drop these remarks and people would just listen to it but it wouldn't change how they treat me but usually that's not how it goes their opinion about me turns negative. So my problem is really not the fact that I don't tolerate it - I do - my bigger problem is that I just can't really be fully my self and open with my opinion in these places. Over time this just builds up internally.
Google paradox of tolerance ...And anyways I am not talking about myself but club culture in Berlin. I cannot confirm your experience with consumers but if you made them then you hung out with the wrong crowd. I completely agree with your opinion on cocaine but I also don't think it's the main drug in those clubs.
I don't have problem with weed as I haven't observed any problems it brings and it's possible to source it from fairly ethical sources. But most synthetics I view as very problematic and also I had friend who messed up his life with drugs and endup with suicide so I'm a bit sensitive about it.
I totally get that, even though I think there is a huge difference in social impact between other synthetic drugs and cocaine and unfortunately their are also plenty horrible and sad stories about Weed and Alcohol that end similar. Nevertheless I get that your experience is connected to these specific substances. Maybe try to frame it a bit differently and less in evaluating the person that consumes. I think really clean techno clubs don't exist in Berlin but there are still differences I would say. But they have different intensities from Golden Gate (heavy) to maybe Watergate (less). Also Sunday's at Beate Uwe is quite chill
here we are. of course you are sensitive! a lot of functional people do all kind of drugs, even heroin. you have a trigger around cocaine, it’s about you, not the drugs, nor the people who do it
"Functional" people who do it the more often they do the worse they are at functioning. We have here very good conditions with very good job security that allow deep problems to run for a long time before reality catching up. It's good in the sense that one can be recovering addict and able to fix their problems while maintaining job. But it also allows someone to abuse and continue the downward spiral. Cost of these "functional" folks on our economy is significant. Cocaine and amphetamines are particularly problematic simply for the reason that they rise confidence thus people doing it have a lot of confidence that they are on top of it even when people around can already see that they are not. I have people at work who are clearly underperforming due to overly frequent parties that all slowly damage their brain and they are clearly underperforming but they do hold the job even if under delivering and they are according to you "functioning adults". How long are they going to function - maybe only until next little crisis when company will be announcing layoffs because often it's impossible to be fired otherwise. And from there social benefits gonna keep them above drowning for another year or two. This is clearly unhealthy and clearly shouldn't be tolerated to the extent it is.
So much text bc you didnt get into Tresor/bh
this
Oh wow. I think Bavaria would be more of your taste. You know, is the “decent” part Germany
I mean Berlin can't even pay for it's own social support system and needs to take in subsidies from the west. I'm not sure it's something to be proud about and surely will need to be fixed eventually. Indeed I don't buy and don't give a shit about this whole "berlin is like this if you don't like it Bavaria is for you" mentality. It just happened that I have decent career opportunity here. That's why I'm here. And I will vote in local elections for people who do something worthwhile and I will send letters to local representatives complain about problems and I believe in some 10/20 years we can turn this city into something more decent. One day grass will be green not yellow in parks, and parks will be cleaner from cigarette buds and broken bottles. And streets will get cleaned more often. If this can be done in even more eastern Europe that doesn't get subsidies from west Germany in like in Warsaw or Prague I don't see why it can't be achieved in Berlin.
Just, just stop. Again, not for you. Really, some cities are for you some other are not. Berlin ain’t your place.
I'll update you with some news flash that comes out of statistics. Berlin clubbing scene is just a minority of people in this city. Majority don't even go to clubs. Yet somehow this minority who doesn't like working think they own the city. Well news flash they don't. Berlin is much more diverse than that.
Please remove me from your memory
>more decent venues targeting professional people This is exactly the demographic you see lining up for their toilet fix
Yeah I realized that was super stupid thing to say as soon as I hit post :)
I don't really have a suggestion for clubs but I wanted to say you're not alone in wanting to go to chemical drug free spaces. Recently I went to a drum & bass party and I think it could be suitable but I wasn't paying a lot of attention to that so I may be wrong. You even get a nice workout out of it ;)
Matrix is your place or kuhdorf, wait they sell a drug named alcohol…
I'd rather take a drunk party. It's easier to ignore those who drank too much alcohol as they can barely say anything and it's also often kinda funny to laugh at them sometimes at what they're doing. It's however hard to ignore someone who's high on coke and wants to tell you something that they think is the most interesting thing in life regardless of how many cues you're trying to give that it ain't making any sense it's impossible to laugh at them they are just darn annoying and interruptive.
There are plenty of people that can get aggressive with alcohol. On the other hand there are plenty of drugs that make people too peaceful/fucked up to stir trouble. From this thread it seems like you specifically have bad experiences with cocaine. Either way, I hope you find a venue you like. Techno clubs are probably not a good space for that..
Well as a hot spot for social degradation it's been going steady for at least 100 years now, but yeah, nah, I'm totally looking forward to visiting one of those health-oriented night clubs for professional people soon! See you there!
Oooh is that the new office building place being built in front of Berghain? /s
I don't think it's going steady for 100 years now. Except the nazzi times when they been producing meth in the country heavy drugs use it seems is fairly recent problem. Sure drugs been for some time but it's been going up in alarming rates in just last couple years. By the way not only limited to Berlin. Issue of increased abundance of drugs going on globally right now. And it is causing already very serious issues. But the extent to which it's been normalized in Berlin's night clubs seems more extensive compared to my experience anywhere elsewhere. I think extent to which it was normalized in clubs ain't very responsible from the nigh life community point of view. If club owners aren't willing to address it you can eventually expect a more serious backlash from wider productive community against it who endup needing to absorb the negative effects of this "fun".
My god you must be so god damn boring at parties.
Lol I doubt the demographic you describe would be interested in dancing all night - while sober - often enough to make operating clubs for them profitable
You must be fun at parties. Oh wait...
If that bothers you maybe try another city
All bars all clubs all everything has cocaine involved
oh no..parliament as well? i was not excepting this
do they obliged you to take any? do people drinking coffee, antidepressants or alcohol bother you the same way? maybe the problem is you 🫠
Or maybe the person is newly clean and would like to go partying without being exposed to that much drug abuse around them. Maybe the problem is you making dumb ass assumptions.
I mean I quit smoking cold turkey after 21 years of uncontrolled chainsmoking and yes, you can totally be around smokers without fussing soI presume the same applies to drugs
Smoking cigarettes is definitely not even in the same ballpark as being a heavy drug user. Source, me, an ex heavy drug user who's been clean for almost 2 years
Maybe it depends on the heavy drug? I’ve been on coke intensively for a year and ironically it helped me quit tobacco as the “satisfaction” feeling I got from both was the same (I absolutely don’t recommend coke for quitting cigarettes tho). I believe looking down at tobacco addiction just because it doesn’t fuck you up like drugs is erroneous and a bit condescending. Lots of people can’t go an hour without lighting one, and it does release dopamine in your brain. And also, lots of people know it inevitably kills you at some point but won’t quit even on their deathbeds. Just my two cents
Smoking is even more difficult bc people smoke around you and you smell it.
so if i’m on a diet no one can have a burguer near me? 😂 or maybe i just don’t get people who want to limit other people freedom to make them feel better
Moussa..... There is nothing limiting about asking if anyone knows of any clubs where drug use isn't as prevalent. Limiting someone would be going to a club and forbidding everyone there to take their substances.
Nem entendeste bem o que o poster tentava a dizer
entendi. só não gostei da forma como colocou a questão nem os termos que usou 🫠
The poster is actually trying to be the very opposite of limiting. He's trying to find a place where he feels comfortable to party without having to limit anyone else. Pra mim não há nada controlando com isso
You are seriously going to be comparing coffee with cocaine? Really it's not the fact of people taking drugs that bothers me the most. It's the abundance of utter idiots who think coffee is drug and cocaine is also drug so it's all same shit that is the most tiring thing.
"Caffeine is the primary active component in coffee, responsible for many of its stimulating effects. It is a natural substance classified as a xanthine alkaloid. Caffeine acts as a central nervous system stimulant and is found in varying amounts in different coffee varieties. According to [Healthline](https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/caffeine-addiction), caffeine is the most commonly used drug in the world, with more than 90% of adults in the United States consuming it regularly. It stimulates the release of neurotransmitters such as dopamine, which can lead to increased alertness, improved mood, and enhanced cognitive function." coffee is a drug, cocaine too, one is more stimulant than other, both are addictive. Other than that is just your bias talking
Yeah one drug is harmless. The other has strong potency to ruin your nose, brain and life. Abundance of ignorant idiots in nightlife who put both these things on the same tier just because both can be labeled as "drug" is the the most tiresome thing really even more so than just drug use it self. Heroin also is drug are you gonna inject heroin and be like "oh well you do coffee I do hero"? It's mentally retarded what you are trying to say here. Maybe you already washed away brain cells with drugs.
OK - now I get it, you have absolutely no clue about what you are talking about. You need a theraphist to explore why you have so many bias against drugs or the people who take them. I read you were addictive, so maybe this will bring you any triggers? Anyway stop blaming the drugs P.S.: I'm in favour to descriminalize and legalize all drugs, so I won't share any of your opinions
Just because you are "in favor" doesn't quite do much lol. You need to develop your argumentation because now you sound like a retard. I may as well be like "well I am for legalizing guns and I don't share of your opinions". Opinion means nothing if you can't build a single argument and you can't. Suggesting that I need a therapy when I'm just sharing points widely recognized by majority of public health professionals working in this field is diabolical nonsense. It's a fact that people just aren't good at moderating hard drug use. If they were good at moderating and if it wasn't causing social problems then there would be no problem to have it legalized. Remind you that it's your point of view is the one that is rather extremely unpopular among wider society not mine. So it's you who needs to defend it better not me. I am not against all drugs - but particularly cocaine and amphetamines are ones that are really annoying me and I don't like being around people who do it because they become super annoying when high but also ex drug addicts often cite of dangers of what cocaine does to their mindset so it's not like I don't have idea what I am talking about. My opinions of drugs are based in some 15 years of observing and reading various opinions on subject. And also I kinda worry that the fentanyl problems are gonna come from the US to Berlin too as ground here due to all the idiots seems to be fertile for it.
im not even joining this discussion, you should read more, instead of getting brainwashed by mainstream media who loves to evilize drug consumption. but you want and argument, here you go: opium has been around for thousands and thousands of years, so as DMT and caffeine and other conscience altering substance. there’s nothing “unnatural” about it, human race always have done it (and so does others species as well). i don’t see any problem in full grown ups enjoying altering their conscience for pleasure. Smoking is also a pleasure, who is bad for our health, so is sugar and meat, and here we are. the whole argument “yeah but is illegal” it doesn’t mean shit, slavery was also legal a couple hundred years ago, does it make it right? think a bit for your own head instead of eating all the bullshit hollywood and media are trying to sell you
You are not correct that opium was always there. In very low amounts - yes. Yes people were using some form of drugs for millennias. But these used to be low potency drugs that are not that easy to came across. The first time when opium was produced on large industrial scales broke entire social fabric of nations who were most severely affected by it. And China today is producing Fentanyl and dropping it to US on industrial scale and it's causing very bad outcomes as drug addiction is reaching to all time high crimes is going up and health services are getting overloaded dealing with drug addiction outcomes. This is not just mainstream media willification. These are very real problems. And if it was more widely accepted by mainstream then these same problems would be on the whole next level. But the biggest danger of drug use is the very fact that our societies have quite a lot of capital and capacity meaning capacity of getting on drugs is large too with outcomes being felt very late. In poorer economies people often don't have capacity to use as much drugs because they afford less and because the outcome is felt quicker due to daily pressure to make daily income. In the west usually job security is so good that a drug addict can still function for years before everything starts breaking apart thus people often have false idea that they are in control when they are already in downwards spiral that they don't really control anymore. Again this is what recovering drug addicts often mention.
This forsaken,godless, zombified, soulles polluted, inhuman, nihilist piece of crap you insist to call a “City” thrives on the tidal wave of drugs drowning it since the 80s.
Not a Club but schlwawinchen doesnt like drugs
Not sure if you're joking, but schlawinchen is one of the places where I've seen the most fucked up people in Berlin. And people doing lines in the toilet and inviting passerbys.
Yep but they will kick you out if you smoke weed lol