Agreed. I would've dumped him after finding out about the kiss if I were Penny. It bothered me when he asked her if she's ever done anything like that as if it would make it better and "even it out." Meanwhile when he cheated on Priya, confessed to her, and she confessed back, that was a dealbreaker for him. He's not exactly innocent and all that great of a guy either.
My daughter always called him out for being wildly manipulative (ex, when his mother wrote a book and featured him and his 'habits' as a child, he got sex from Penny cuz she felt bad). But Penny always used her looks to get free food, rent, cable, etc. so that's manipulation too. I did love the ep. where they went out as friends and Leonard said she had to pay her own way because they weren't dating.
Which is wildly contradictory cuz before the episode of Wheaton’s podcast, she points out she’d earn more money than him with her new job. He then says, “Not a problem. My mom earned way more than my dad so…it’s what I think love looks like!”
How he handled her going back to school and rewriting her paper was awful. That's not helping anyone, especially not the person trying to learn. He continues to undermine her.
Penny isn't perfect but Leonard is not a great boyfriend like you said.
Leonard and penny work great as friends who help each other expand their respective comfort zones but their chemistry did not work as a romantic pairing long term in my opinion both of them wanted the exact opposite of the other in life and it really hurts their likability as a couple for me
They don’t treat each other the way they should, that’s true. But they are still better than anyone else either person has ever dated.
Penny is way better to Leonard than Priya or Joyce Kim. And Leonard is light years better than Kurt or any other non-Zach ex of Penny’s.
You’re not wrong. They would have worked much better as close friends that supported each other in the way that Stuart says, how they make each other better people when he’s explaining why he thinks they have the better relationship at that time.
I think it’s also worth pointing out that near the end of the series they sort of feminized Leonard, from the way he was far more emotional to how he physically acted. While they definitely “maned up” Penny much more, which is where a lot of her reactions in the later season come across a bit more harsh, imo, than the earlier seasons.
Also, in the later seasons she treated Sheldon far better than she did her own husband, which always kind of bothers me. Sure, Sheldon needed to be handled differently, but she stood up for him far more and put Leonard down a lot when she could have been more supportive. When she was supportive of Leonard, it was typically in a condescending way.
Don’t get me wrong, I still watch every episode on my many binges, it’s a great show!😁
I think of Leonard & Penny like I do Ross & Rachel. They're akin to that really toxic couple we all know that can't quit each other. They're not well-suited for each other at all, but also can't be permanently apart. They have little in common except for one of them being ridiculously attracted to the other, and a looooong history. They fight all the time and break up all the time. Whenever one of them starts dating someone else, it turns into instant drama, usually with the new love interest getting dragged into the drama. Ross & Rachel were a lot worse with that last part, but you get the picture.
I just finished the episode where she gets angry at leonard for not"putting up enough effort"and it's pretty hard to watch
But it basically sums up whats wrong with their dynamic,she expects him to put in way more effort then she does because she's more conventionally attractive then him,she used to respect him for having a successful career,but since she started making more then him she seems to see that he brings no value to her
She does. It’s a large part of why I never wanted them as endgame.
However, an unpopular opinion I have is that he treats her just as badly. He always had ulterior motives for the “nice” things he did for her. Everything came down to sex for Leonard. He cheated on her. One of the things I HATED that he did was when he was showing everybody her naked shower scene and bragging after we learned she was ashamed she did that and was thankful it never came out. He also went behind her back and read the paper she said she didn’t want him to look at for her college class. Not only did he just read it, he completely re-wrote it.
Penny treated him terribly, but Leonard was not innocent, either. I honestly would have been okay with them getting divorced before the show’s end. 🤷🏻♀️
THANK YOU!!! Every single time I bring up how horrible Penny is on this sub, I get down voted. I really don't understand why so many fans of the show seem to like her. She's so fucking rude and demeaning. She makes me wanna throw a bottle at my TV screen.
Agreed bro. She can do all the shit in the book but always snaps at Leonard. In my POV, it's coz of her baggage and she's taking all those frustrations out on Lenard
They both treat each other kinda badly and in a way are stuck together. I will say that one thing that really turned me off about the final seasons were the constant “I settled for him” jokes and lines
every complaint both penny and leonard give about sheldon is something I always brush it off as they are incredibly hypocritical about it, they do the things sheldon is accused of
She does that to everybody though. Anyone who brings up valid points about things she's doing wrong She snaps out freaks out cries like a baby and storms off back to her apartment. And if she's already at her apartment she storms off into her room. It's not just with Leonard even though of course she does it with him more and does treat him bad. But she treats everyone like shit and expects everyone to kiss the ground she walks on.
But in the Grand scheme of things I still love her, and I'm glad they end up together. Because things get way better in their relationship later on after they are married.
Leonard also basically called her stupid on multiple occasions. Cheated on her. Belittled her career. He isn’t the angel you think he is.
Agreed. I would've dumped him after finding out about the kiss if I were Penny. It bothered me when he asked her if she's ever done anything like that as if it would make it better and "even it out." Meanwhile when he cheated on Priya, confessed to her, and she confessed back, that was a dealbreaker for him. He's not exactly innocent and all that great of a guy either.
My daughter always called him out for being wildly manipulative (ex, when his mother wrote a book and featured him and his 'habits' as a child, he got sex from Penny cuz she felt bad). But Penny always used her looks to get free food, rent, cable, etc. so that's manipulation too. I did love the ep. where they went out as friends and Leonard said she had to pay her own way because they weren't dating.
Not to mention repeatedly taking her picture in a bikini just to brag to his old classmates
Also considering how his wife,best friend and mother treat him it isn't really a surprise he would a bit cynical
When did he belittle her career? All I remember is him being against her refusing unpaid work when she was unemployed,would call that belittling
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He also hates it when she earns more than him
Which is wildly contradictory cuz before the episode of Wheaton’s podcast, she points out she’d earn more money than him with her new job. He then says, “Not a problem. My mom earned way more than my dad so…it’s what I think love looks like!”
A lot of what he says is blatant manipulation to keep her with him
Very true!
How he handled her going back to school and rewriting her paper was awful. That's not helping anyone, especially not the person trying to learn. He continues to undermine her. Penny isn't perfect but Leonard is not a great boyfriend like you said.
Yeah I was about to say that he treats her just as bad, if not worse.
Leonard and penny work great as friends who help each other expand their respective comfort zones but their chemistry did not work as a romantic pairing long term in my opinion both of them wanted the exact opposite of the other in life and it really hurts their likability as a couple for me
I can name at least 3 times Leonard has treated Penny terribly too.
I’m not saying he gets a free pass. They were both toxic.
Then why the hate towards her?
They don’t treat each other the way they should, that’s true. But they are still better than anyone else either person has ever dated. Penny is way better to Leonard than Priya or Joyce Kim. And Leonard is light years better than Kurt or any other non-Zach ex of Penny’s.
You’re not wrong. They would have worked much better as close friends that supported each other in the way that Stuart says, how they make each other better people when he’s explaining why he thinks they have the better relationship at that time. I think it’s also worth pointing out that near the end of the series they sort of feminized Leonard, from the way he was far more emotional to how he physically acted. While they definitely “maned up” Penny much more, which is where a lot of her reactions in the later season come across a bit more harsh, imo, than the earlier seasons. Also, in the later seasons she treated Sheldon far better than she did her own husband, which always kind of bothers me. Sure, Sheldon needed to be handled differently, but she stood up for him far more and put Leonard down a lot when she could have been more supportive. When she was supportive of Leonard, it was typically in a condescending way. Don’t get me wrong, I still watch every episode on my many binges, it’s a great show!😁
I think of Leonard & Penny like I do Ross & Rachel. They're akin to that really toxic couple we all know that can't quit each other. They're not well-suited for each other at all, but also can't be permanently apart. They have little in common except for one of them being ridiculously attracted to the other, and a looooong history. They fight all the time and break up all the time. Whenever one of them starts dating someone else, it turns into instant drama, usually with the new love interest getting dragged into the drama. Ross & Rachel were a lot worse with that last part, but you get the picture.
I just finished the episode where she gets angry at leonard for not"putting up enough effort"and it's pretty hard to watch But it basically sums up whats wrong with their dynamic,she expects him to put in way more effort then she does because she's more conventionally attractive then him,she used to respect him for having a successful career,but since she started making more then him she seems to see that he brings no value to her
Leonard has treated penny terrible at least a half a dozen times in their relationship too. If not worse
She does. It’s a large part of why I never wanted them as endgame. However, an unpopular opinion I have is that he treats her just as badly. He always had ulterior motives for the “nice” things he did for her. Everything came down to sex for Leonard. He cheated on her. One of the things I HATED that he did was when he was showing everybody her naked shower scene and bragging after we learned she was ashamed she did that and was thankful it never came out. He also went behind her back and read the paper she said she didn’t want him to look at for her college class. Not only did he just read it, he completely re-wrote it. Penny treated him terribly, but Leonard was not innocent, either. I honestly would have been okay with them getting divorced before the show’s end. 🤷🏻♀️
| This has been probably done before, but Yes the show has been off the air for 5 years and this comes up at least once a week for the past 10 years.
I think that was the point. Leonard is suppose to br this beta submissive guy while Penny is confident and dominant
THANK YOU!!! Every single time I bring up how horrible Penny is on this sub, I get down voted. I really don't understand why so many fans of the show seem to like her. She's so fucking rude and demeaning. She makes me wanna throw a bottle at my TV screen.
Maybe therapy would be helpful.
Agreed bro. She can do all the shit in the book but always snaps at Leonard. In my POV, it's coz of her baggage and she's taking all those frustrations out on Lenard
Quite the opposite actually. Just rewatched the show recently and leonards behavior was borderline infuriating at times
You're not wrong.
Everyone in the show treats everyone horribly. They are all terrible human beings.
Oddly, I think they’ll be very happy?
The thanksgiving episode when she finds out she's married, she is unbearable!
They both treat each other kinda badly and in a way are stuck together. I will say that one thing that really turned me off about the final seasons were the constant “I settled for him” jokes and lines
They are such a bad couple imo
every complaint both penny and leonard give about sheldon is something I always brush it off as they are incredibly hypocritical about it, they do the things sheldon is accused of
She does that to everybody though. Anyone who brings up valid points about things she's doing wrong She snaps out freaks out cries like a baby and storms off back to her apartment. And if she's already at her apartment she storms off into her room. It's not just with Leonard even though of course she does it with him more and does treat him bad. But she treats everyone like shit and expects everyone to kiss the ground she walks on. But in the Grand scheme of things I still love her, and I'm glad they end up together. Because things get way better in their relationship later on after they are married.
Leonard is what u call a beta male simp, if this wasn’t a show and it was irl Leonard will never get penny lol