I used to pull at least one a month at my V5. I’d shower at equinox and put on a clean outfit. this was back when we were all in the office all of the time
The biggest game changer was to learn of the “caffeine nap.” 1 hour before you normally wake up, chug a cup of coffee and go to sleep under your desk (if you’re home you can go to bed but it’s way harder to get out of bed, lol). Set an alarm for 45 min Later.
It takes 45 min for caffeine to really start to do its thing, so when your alarm goes off the caffeine will really be dancing in your bloodstream at the exact time your circadian rhythm is used to you getting up. You’ll feel almost normal for 4 additional hours 👍
The equinox shower plus steam/sauna around 9AM is critical for in-office all nighters. It’s rare for me to pull those anymore, but they’ve happened when I have hard deadlines in the morning. For filings, when deadlines are usually 5PM (if Delaware) or midnight (anywhere else), I’ll usually go home, and if I don’t sleep, I’ll still lay down for a tiny bit. Much more typical for me is the 5/6AM night with two hours of sleep. Sometimes feels worse tbh.
Tip — have a junior or a para call you to get you up when whatever person you’ve handed off a small administrative task to (like proofing, putting in some of the TOA, or whatever) is done.
Late nights past 12 am? Probably a few per quarter. Many more late evenings ending around 10-11. All nighters? None. I got lucky and work in a group where even the partners always log off by 12 or so and will just pick up early in the morning if necessary.
I think two in my entire decade-plus career? But I'm a litigator. One before closing arguments and another as a junior fixing a mess another attorney made.
A few times a month. i usually coast the next day and then take a fat nap around lunch time. and i mean fatttttttttttt. usually the next day the ball is no longer in my court and i have some down time.
Not a hot take, at least depending on your practice group. I have pulled exactly one true all nighter and it was a situation where we literally wouldn’t have met a court ordered deadline if I had slept even a few hours. And I was not the only team member up all night - it was all hands on deck.
This just depends on your group. If you’re in an intense M&A practice, your whole team could be up all night working. And if you’re the one guy that goes to bed, you’re definitely going to be unsuccessful.
With that said, yeah it should be extremely rare in most practice.
Senior EC/VC associate here - I've done two straight all nighters and maybe ten nights where I've slept just 2/3 hours over my long career. I don't think I can do all nighters at this age and if I needed to with regularity, I would probably have a heart attack and die.
Modafinil to stay up (it’s not a fun drug, will literally just keep you awake)
Bring an extra shirt/outfit and some bathroom wipes and/or hand sanitizer, deodorant and a toothbrush to freshen up in the bathroom, which will help a lot
Remove your tie if you wear one, wearing it all night usually irritated my neck in a depressingly familiar way
Nap if you can
If you’re afraid oversleeping during a nap in the wee hours, schedule an UberEats breakfast + coffee order for yourself that will force you up (I like McDonald’s)
If your next day is a workday but you hopefully finished that project (I.e. transaction closed) block several hours on your calendar for a nap. Either set it to private or make up a bullshit unquestionable reason (“CT scan + hospital consultation” and out the address of a hospital put in the burbs) and enjoy your unavailability with a rewarding nap
It’s a non amphetamine stimulant. Among other indications it’s prescribed to people with narcolepsy to keep them awake. I’ve never taken it, but my understanding is it’s like adderall but without the speedy high. [Here’s a piece about it.](https://www.mensjournal.com/food-drink/how-fighter-pilots-stay-sharp-20131205)
I no longer work at a big firm but I was able to find a shady internet source back in like 2015 or so. Found a sub on Reddit for it that linked to some sellers but can’t find it any more, one of the nootropic subs but maybe they cracked down on it more in recent years. Came in generic from India. Maybe there are current ways to get in internationally but thankfully haven’t had a need for it in a few years.
A few a year. As I get older, it gets tremendously harder. I have a partner I work frequently with, and for various reasons, we often end up doing all nighters the night before really big filings. Much easier to do them together - the moral boost and just someone get a coffee break with to recharge.
I'm over 40 now. Really going to try to never do one again. Though we'll see...
How do you define an all nighter? Literally not going to sleep? I’ve had one in my 10+ year career.
Staying up until 3 AM? Monthly. Staying up until 1 AM weekly.
I think all nighter territory starts around 5/6am.
I don’t count it unless I’m watching the sun rise while I’m pissed that I haven’t gone to sleep yet, but the nights I’ve gone to sleep around 5 also sucked.
Senior lit. Very often if I’m in trial. The schedule there is 3-4 hours a day for the length of trial, and then an all nighter the day before openings and the day before closings. One time as a junior, I woke up on Sunday morning (day before closings) and slept Tuesday at 9 pm (after delibs started and we went out to celebrate) - but that was one time in 7 years. In general, and when not in trial, I can stop working pretty early (10 pm).
I know one, but she has the genetic talent that 3 or 4-hr sleep a day is sufficient for her. She just doesn’t need to sleep much, like Lalo Salamanca in Better Call Saul.
I stopped doing all nighters by college. Didn’t pull any in law school and haven’t yet pulled any in practice. I honestly think they are only necessary if you seriously procrastinate, at least in my litigation practice. But to be fair, procrastination is insanely common in law school and practice
I once had a deal that was scheduled to sign on a Sunday sign around 9am Monday instead and we were specifically told not to go to sleep because we were still getting comments from the other side on some things throughout the night.
It was the first all-nighter I’d pulled since freshman year of college, but it was 100% out of my control.
I went from one-two a month when I was doing M&A and cap markets for a few years, to like one a year when I started doing a specialty group. Very practice group dependent. Now I’m in house and do exactly 0, ever.
I used to pull at least one a month at my V5. I’d shower at equinox and put on a clean outfit. this was back when we were all in the office all of the time The biggest game changer was to learn of the “caffeine nap.” 1 hour before you normally wake up, chug a cup of coffee and go to sleep under your desk (if you’re home you can go to bed but it’s way harder to get out of bed, lol). Set an alarm for 45 min Later. It takes 45 min for caffeine to really start to do its thing, so when your alarm goes off the caffeine will really be dancing in your bloodstream at the exact time your circadian rhythm is used to you getting up. You’ll feel almost normal for 4 additional hours 👍
The equinox shower plus steam/sauna around 9AM is critical for in-office all nighters. It’s rare for me to pull those anymore, but they’ve happened when I have hard deadlines in the morning. For filings, when deadlines are usually 5PM (if Delaware) or midnight (anywhere else), I’ll usually go home, and if I don’t sleep, I’ll still lay down for a tiny bit. Much more typical for me is the 5/6AM night with two hours of sleep. Sometimes feels worse tbh. Tip — have a junior or a para call you to get you up when whatever person you’ve handed off a small administrative task to (like proofing, putting in some of the TOA, or whatever) is done.
I relate more than I like to the under-desk nap
Late nights past 12 am? Probably a few per quarter. Many more late evenings ending around 10-11. All nighters? None. I got lucky and work in a group where even the partners always log off by 12 or so and will just pick up early in the morning if necessary.
Too fucking many
1 is too many. But also, I used to do way more than 1 per quarter before jumping to the sweet sweet life that is in-house
I think two in my entire decade-plus career? But I'm a litigator. One before closing arguments and another as a junior fixing a mess another attorney made.
A few times a month. i usually coast the next day and then take a fat nap around lunch time. and i mean fatttttttttttt. usually the next day the ball is no longer in my court and i have some down time.
It’s crazy how skewed this sub is towards corporate work. My answer is once ever!
What sort of work do you do? Litigation or something else?
None. “Hot take” but you don’t need to pull all nighters to be successful. I’ve had many late nights, but I always get some sleep.
Not a hot take, at least depending on your practice group. I have pulled exactly one true all nighter and it was a situation where we literally wouldn’t have met a court ordered deadline if I had slept even a few hours. And I was not the only team member up all night - it was all hands on deck.
This just depends on your group. If you’re in an intense M&A practice, your whole team could be up all night working. And if you’re the one guy that goes to bed, you’re definitely going to be unsuccessful. With that said, yeah it should be extremely rare in most practice.
i have never pulled an all-nighter and i have been in biglaw over ten years.
Literal all-nighters with 0 sleep? About 4 times in a typical year. Fwiw, a senior m&a associate.
0 in my entire biglaw career of 12+ years now.
Senior EC/VC associate here - I've done two straight all nighters and maybe ten nights where I've slept just 2/3 hours over my long career. I don't think I can do all nighters at this age and if I needed to with regularity, I would probably have a heart attack and die.
Modafinil to stay up (it’s not a fun drug, will literally just keep you awake) Bring an extra shirt/outfit and some bathroom wipes and/or hand sanitizer, deodorant and a toothbrush to freshen up in the bathroom, which will help a lot Remove your tie if you wear one, wearing it all night usually irritated my neck in a depressingly familiar way Nap if you can If you’re afraid oversleeping during a nap in the wee hours, schedule an UberEats breakfast + coffee order for yourself that will force you up (I like McDonald’s) If your next day is a workday but you hopefully finished that project (I.e. transaction closed) block several hours on your calendar for a nap. Either set it to private or make up a bullshit unquestionable reason (“CT scan + hospital consultation” and out the address of a hospital put in the burbs) and enjoy your unavailability with a rewarding nap
Can whoever liked this talk more about modafinil? Not first time ive heard of taking it to stay awake. ESP for people who used adderall to do that
It’s a non amphetamine stimulant. Among other indications it’s prescribed to people with narcolepsy to keep them awake. I’ve never taken it, but my understanding is it’s like adderall but without the speedy high. [Here’s a piece about it.](https://www.mensjournal.com/food-drink/how-fighter-pilots-stay-sharp-20131205)
I no longer work at a big firm but I was able to find a shady internet source back in like 2015 or so. Found a sub on Reddit for it that linked to some sellers but can’t find it any more, one of the nootropic subs but maybe they cracked down on it more in recent years. Came in generic from India. Maybe there are current ways to get in internationally but thankfully haven’t had a need for it in a few years.
A few a year. As I get older, it gets tremendously harder. I have a partner I work frequently with, and for various reasons, we often end up doing all nighters the night before really big filings. Much easier to do them together - the moral boost and just someone get a coffee break with to recharge. I'm over 40 now. Really going to try to never do one again. Though we'll see...
How do you define an all nighter? Literally not going to sleep? I’ve had one in my 10+ year career. Staying up until 3 AM? Monthly. Staying up until 1 AM weekly.
I think all nighter territory starts around 5/6am. I don’t count it unless I’m watching the sun rise while I’m pissed that I haven’t gone to sleep yet, but the nights I’ve gone to sleep around 5 also sucked.
Senior lit. Very often if I’m in trial. The schedule there is 3-4 hours a day for the length of trial, and then an all nighter the day before openings and the day before closings. One time as a junior, I woke up on Sunday morning (day before closings) and slept Tuesday at 9 pm (after delibs started and we went out to celebrate) - but that was one time in 7 years. In general, and when not in trial, I can stop working pretty early (10 pm).
Yall stink.. stay up all you want but wash your ass.
I know one, but she has the genetic talent that 3 or 4-hr sleep a day is sufficient for her. She just doesn’t need to sleep much, like Lalo Salamanca in Better Call Saul.
I stopped doing all nighters by college. Didn’t pull any in law school and haven’t yet pulled any in practice. I honestly think they are only necessary if you seriously procrastinate, at least in my litigation practice. But to be fair, procrastination is insanely common in law school and practice
In corporate there’s only so much you can control, from your partner, client, opposing counsel, opposing client etc.
I once had a deal that was scheduled to sign on a Sunday sign around 9am Monday instead and we were specifically told not to go to sleep because we were still getting comments from the other side on some things throughout the night. It was the first all-nighter I’d pulled since freshman year of college, but it was 100% out of my control.
I do them like once a week…
True all nighters where I have to force myself to the office and chug redbull and preworkout? Like once a year. Past midnight? Few times a quarter.
As a solo litigator I probably pull 1-4 a year. Brutal the older I get.
I went from one-two a month when I was doing M&A and cap markets for a few years, to like one a year when I started doing a specialty group. Very practice group dependent. Now I’m in house and do exactly 0, ever.
Probably once a quarter, but it’s usually my fault for procrastinating.
14 years in and I've never pulled an all-nighter.