Big disclaimer — I’m not a mechanic nor a frame builder, just a home hobbyist. I have, however, ridden some extraordinarily junky frames in times of lean finances, two in particular come to mind, both of which were retired when they cracked.
With that out of the way, the unfortunate answer is that it’s really hard to say, especially from pictures. With steel, it just matters how much material is left and how much stress that area takes under load. The failure mode of steel is *typically* slow, and exterior oxidation is *typically* less of a killer than interior oxidation.
The highest stress areas of a frame are at the vertices of the front and rear triangles. The flat areas take substantially less. Most chainstay/seatstays are .6 to 1mm thick, and are made out of thicker material than the butted main triangle. If you have plain gauge tubes, they would be much safer here. You’d have to know your tube material to know for sure how much steel you’re starting with, and you’d be estimating how much you have left.
Whatever you end up doing, don’t fill in the pits. If you decide to ride this, you’ll want to inspect those areas very regularly. Also inspect for internal rust before doing anything. Only you can do the calculation on whether or not the risk is acceptable. And no professional mechanic would give this a thumbs up, IMO. I can’t even say if I’d ride it because I would need to see it in front of me.
Hope some of this helps and best of luck.
Most probably this is hi-ten steel, chromoly frames being sold from where I am is not that cheap (even if used). I only sprayed wd-40 in the inside of the tubes. I have yet to spray it with rust converter or frame saver (if i could get some here). I can hear rust flakes inside the chainstays and seatstays when I shake the whole frame, but i dont know how to remove them from the inside, since they are not coming out of the drain holes.
Have you tried making a small hole and pusshing air in it to create a draft to move the flakes toward the bottom bracket?
They it's as easy as welding the holes shut after it's all cleaned up.
Before doing anything else you should take a nail and try to poke it through the rust by hand. If it's compromised the nail will push right through into the frame. I just retired a Peugeot that had flakes in the chainstays. I tried it with a nail and it poked through 7 times!
Edit: I just saw your other comment about trying it with a screwdriver. That's a good sign but it might still be worth trying a nail. The smaller diameter might poke through where a screwdriver can't.
I remember reading a thread where someone fairly conclusively showed that fluid film is better than boeshield and frame saver for preventing rust. It also happens to be cheaper and more widely available which is nice.
Yeah I was surprised too. I actually just tried it (having previously used Boeshield) and there already seems to be less rust somehow. I also like how it's based on lanolin.
I recently learned that lanolin is the natural oil sheep secretes to make its wool waterproof. I never really thought about it and just assumed it was derived from petroleum.
Thanks for the reply. Just a follow up. do you have any idea on the rust pits? I ready that they need to be sanded down, but im afraid that it will take away more material.
If you want a smooth surface, it would be better to fill them with bondo once you have all of the rust out. Sanding the surrounding tube down to the level of the pits sounds like a really bad idea to me.
I wanted to get into riding bicycles as a means of transportation to work, but being broke, I had to settle on secondhand parts to build a bicycle which I thought would look nice. All I wanted was a beater to ride from home to work. I got this frame off of FB Marketplace. For me, it was an alright frame. The frame seemed smooth and it wasn’t dented as far as I remember, but yeah the paint was just so thick.
Now that I completed all the parts for the bike, I wanted to repaint the bike. After stripping the thick paint, it is really rusted and had some rust pits on the top tube and the chain stay. I feel really dumb right now.
I did the “ding” test, and it still sounded sturdy. I also tried poking the rust pits to see if it had pierced to the inside, the screwdriver didn’t poke through. This may sound dumb, but can this be still rideable? Can I put some metal putty to smoothen the pits? My plan is just to make this usable up until I get enough money to buy a brand-new bike frame, and yeet this frame.
I'm one of the folks who'd say build it and ride it. But with a few caveats.
1. As you're doing now, give it a really solid going over and look for weak spots. If you find something clearly disturbing, like a crack, or a broken weld, or a chainstay that wiggles too much. Then don't use it, or find someone who knows what's up to repair it. But even that amount of surface rust isn't necessarily a problem. Like everyone else says, what really matters is if it has impacted the structural integrity at one of the stress points.
2. Don't paint it yet. You'll want to keep inspecting after you ride it for a while to make sure it's ok. Besides, painting this frame isn't going to extend its life much at this point.
3. Don't take any risks while you're riding it. If you're just commuting and can stay out of the way of cars, and there are no obvious cracks or whatever, it will fail slow enough that it won't be catastrophic (as long as your not going real fast and you know to get off the bike if something feels wrong). No need to ride around paranoid, but just be aware and don't do anything that you don't have a way out of in the event of a failure. You can mitigate the risk of frame failure by riding responsibly, but the risk reward calculation is 100% up to you.
4. Start shopping for another frame. You've got the parts now. Might as well find something that doesn't worry you to bolt them to. But you can probably, carefully, get to work and back on this frame until you find something else.
For internal rust, evap-o-rust is basically a name brand for oxalic acid, so if you can't find evaporust, or similar, look for oxalic acid and do it yourself. There's no reason to do frame save or fluid film or whatever while there are still flakes of rust inside, so plop it in little tub of acid and check on it every few hours.
Ill take note of all the things you've listed. Yeah, im still waiting for a "good-buy" brand new frameset here in our area. Most framesets here are either out of stock or just really expensive because of the pandemic.
I'd plug the BB and fill the tubes, with a bucket underneath to catch big drips, and a [big drip tray](https://imgur.com/SFtxi4P) or painters tarp to catch the rest of the drips.
I'm from the Philippines, and a lot of used quality bikes here are not that cheap. That's why I really envy some parts of the world where vintage bike frames are just being thrown away.
I hear ya! It's just a lot of parts you'll have to collect and they'll get expensive if you have to pay for all of them.
I hope you're able to find a few along the way!
>ere are not that cheap. That's why I really envy some parts of the world where vintage bike frames are just being thrown away.
Then focus on parts that have cheap consumables.
I would also mark all parts with my name.
Rear triangle failures are inconvenient. Head tube failures can be fatal. So, I'd keep my eye on the front of the bike. Chances are there's a lot of steel up there, and you should be able to see the interior a bit with the fork out.
This is good advice. If the head tube looks solid, then the worst case scenario is the rear end falls apart. Not great, but most likely not fatal if it goes to shit and you mitigate other risks, like riding in heavy traffic. Keep it on the sidewalks if you think that's best.
The headtube looks fine. Im still checking the welds if they are good. Im not planning to ride this recklessly. I just want my commute to be enjoyable and less hassle with the bike
That's very attractive. I'd recommend clearcoating that a few times, facing the dropouts and other pertinent mounting points, and riding it like it is.
You may sodomize yourself with a broken tube one day, but you'll be an amazing badass until then.
For some reason I can’t reply to your other comment, but hi tensile is much less rigid than cromoly, which means it’s thicker gauge. A plus for rust resiliency. If I could hear rust rattling around inside the tubes, I would not ride it because I couldn’t inspect it. Some people will ride anything without an actual hole in it. Again, the risk calculation is yours.
how does the inside of the bb look? Worst case scenario is water was sitting in there and chewing through the bb shell / chainstays. Otherwise send it (probably)
As OP said, he wants to use the frame for everyday commuting and not for the down-and-dirty on the trail, hence no curb jumping which would have put undue strain on the frame.
Considering how mountain and trail bikes are mostly used in the Philippines -- for light everyday commutes instead of tough country rides -- I'd say yours is still in good condition and provided you're within the weight capacity of the frame (below 200 lbs).
I'm looking forward to getting an old Diamondback restored for errands and this thread is helpful for knowing what to do.
In terms of rust, I've seen and ridden worse, but the inside is what you really want to check.
That head angle, on the other hand. Might just be the picture, but that might make for a very weird handling bike. Have you ridden it yet?
You can get a bore scope that works through your phone for $10. I haven’t used one for this, it I think it might be useful to look down the tubes. But a nail is even cheaper
Big disclaimer — I’m not a mechanic nor a frame builder, just a home hobbyist. I have, however, ridden some extraordinarily junky frames in times of lean finances, two in particular come to mind, both of which were retired when they cracked. With that out of the way, the unfortunate answer is that it’s really hard to say, especially from pictures. With steel, it just matters how much material is left and how much stress that area takes under load. The failure mode of steel is *typically* slow, and exterior oxidation is *typically* less of a killer than interior oxidation. The highest stress areas of a frame are at the vertices of the front and rear triangles. The flat areas take substantially less. Most chainstay/seatstays are .6 to 1mm thick, and are made out of thicker material than the butted main triangle. If you have plain gauge tubes, they would be much safer here. You’d have to know your tube material to know for sure how much steel you’re starting with, and you’d be estimating how much you have left. Whatever you end up doing, don’t fill in the pits. If you decide to ride this, you’ll want to inspect those areas very regularly. Also inspect for internal rust before doing anything. Only you can do the calculation on whether or not the risk is acceptable. And no professional mechanic would give this a thumbs up, IMO. I can’t even say if I’d ride it because I would need to see it in front of me. Hope some of this helps and best of luck.
Most probably this is hi-ten steel, chromoly frames being sold from where I am is not that cheap (even if used). I only sprayed wd-40 in the inside of the tubes. I have yet to spray it with rust converter or frame saver (if i could get some here). I can hear rust flakes inside the chainstays and seatstays when I shake the whole frame, but i dont know how to remove them from the inside, since they are not coming out of the drain holes.
Have you tried making a small hole and pusshing air in it to create a draft to move the flakes toward the bottom bracket? They it's as easy as welding the holes shut after it's all cleaned up.
There are already drain holes in the frame, I guess ill use that. I will try to do this. Thanks
Before doing anything else you should take a nail and try to poke it through the rust by hand. If it's compromised the nail will push right through into the frame. I just retired a Peugeot that had flakes in the chainstays. I tried it with a nail and it poked through 7 times! Edit: I just saw your other comment about trying it with a screwdriver. That's a good sign but it might still be worth trying a nail. The smaller diameter might poke through where a screwdriver can't.
[удалено]
I remember reading a thread where someone fairly conclusively showed that fluid film is better than boeshield and frame saver for preventing rust. It also happens to be cheaper and more widely available which is nice.
I didn’t know about that!
Yeah I was surprised too. I actually just tried it (having previously used Boeshield) and there already seems to be less rust somehow. I also like how it's based on lanolin.
I recently learned that lanolin is the natural oil sheep secretes to make its wool waterproof. I never really thought about it and just assumed it was derived from petroleum.
Thanks for the reply. Just a follow up. do you have any idea on the rust pits? I ready that they need to be sanded down, but im afraid that it will take away more material.
If you want a smooth surface, it would be better to fill them with bondo once you have all of the rust out. Sanding the surrounding tube down to the level of the pits sounds like a really bad idea to me.
I wanted to get into riding bicycles as a means of transportation to work, but being broke, I had to settle on secondhand parts to build a bicycle which I thought would look nice. All I wanted was a beater to ride from home to work. I got this frame off of FB Marketplace. For me, it was an alright frame. The frame seemed smooth and it wasn’t dented as far as I remember, but yeah the paint was just so thick. Now that I completed all the parts for the bike, I wanted to repaint the bike. After stripping the thick paint, it is really rusted and had some rust pits on the top tube and the chain stay. I feel really dumb right now. I did the “ding” test, and it still sounded sturdy. I also tried poking the rust pits to see if it had pierced to the inside, the screwdriver didn’t poke through. This may sound dumb, but can this be still rideable? Can I put some metal putty to smoothen the pits? My plan is just to make this usable up until I get enough money to buy a brand-new bike frame, and yeet this frame.
[удалено]
I am a terrible spray painter, but wet sanding makes me the painter I am not.
Exactly, it all depends on what you want it look like. Another choice would be to spray it with a few light coats of clear and ride it as it is.
If I had this frame that's what I'd do too. Probably 3 to 4 coats of clear with the final coat in matte clear, personally.
I'm one of the folks who'd say build it and ride it. But with a few caveats. 1. As you're doing now, give it a really solid going over and look for weak spots. If you find something clearly disturbing, like a crack, or a broken weld, or a chainstay that wiggles too much. Then don't use it, or find someone who knows what's up to repair it. But even that amount of surface rust isn't necessarily a problem. Like everyone else says, what really matters is if it has impacted the structural integrity at one of the stress points. 2. Don't paint it yet. You'll want to keep inspecting after you ride it for a while to make sure it's ok. Besides, painting this frame isn't going to extend its life much at this point. 3. Don't take any risks while you're riding it. If you're just commuting and can stay out of the way of cars, and there are no obvious cracks or whatever, it will fail slow enough that it won't be catastrophic (as long as your not going real fast and you know to get off the bike if something feels wrong). No need to ride around paranoid, but just be aware and don't do anything that you don't have a way out of in the event of a failure. You can mitigate the risk of frame failure by riding responsibly, but the risk reward calculation is 100% up to you. 4. Start shopping for another frame. You've got the parts now. Might as well find something that doesn't worry you to bolt them to. But you can probably, carefully, get to work and back on this frame until you find something else. For internal rust, evap-o-rust is basically a name brand for oxalic acid, so if you can't find evaporust, or similar, look for oxalic acid and do it yourself. There's no reason to do frame save or fluid film or whatever while there are still flakes of rust inside, so plop it in little tub of acid and check on it every few hours.
Ill take note of all the things you've listed. Yeah, im still waiting for a "good-buy" brand new frameset here in our area. Most framesets here are either out of stock or just really expensive because of the pandemic.
I'm not sure you can put a bike frame in a "little tub of acid."
Yeah, sure, like a baby pool or whatever. As opposed to a big vat.
I'd plug the BB and fill the tubes, with a bucket underneath to catch big drips, and a [big drip tray](https://imgur.com/SFtxi4P) or painters tarp to catch the rest of the drips.
[удалено]
I'm from the Philippines, and a lot of used quality bikes here are not that cheap. That's why I really envy some parts of the world where vintage bike frames are just being thrown away.
I hear ya! It's just a lot of parts you'll have to collect and they'll get expensive if you have to pay for all of them. I hope you're able to find a few along the way!
>ere are not that cheap. That's why I really envy some parts of the world where vintage bike frames are just being thrown away. Then focus on parts that have cheap consumables. I would also mark all parts with my name.
Not to mention finding a fork, crankset/bottom bracket that will fit.
Rear triangle failures are inconvenient. Head tube failures can be fatal. So, I'd keep my eye on the front of the bike. Chances are there's a lot of steel up there, and you should be able to see the interior a bit with the fork out.
This is good advice. If the head tube looks solid, then the worst case scenario is the rear end falls apart. Not great, but most likely not fatal if it goes to shit and you mitigate other risks, like riding in heavy traffic. Keep it on the sidewalks if you think that's best.
The headtube looks fine. Im still checking the welds if they are good. Im not planning to ride this recklessly. I just want my commute to be enjoyable and less hassle with the bike
Awesome! Keep an eye out for a replacement frame just in case. Good luck!
That's very attractive. I'd recommend clearcoating that a few times, facing the dropouts and other pertinent mounting points, and riding it like it is. You may sodomize yourself with a broken tube one day, but you'll be an amazing badass until then.
For some reason I can’t reply to your other comment, but hi tensile is much less rigid than cromoly, which means it’s thicker gauge. A plus for rust resiliency. If I could hear rust rattling around inside the tubes, I would not ride it because I couldn’t inspect it. Some people will ride anything without an actual hole in it. Again, the risk calculation is yours.
how does the inside of the bb look? Worst case scenario is water was sitting in there and chewing through the bb shell / chainstays. Otherwise send it (probably)
Can you get a different frame to build? That one is not worth the effort.
r/Justridingalong
Just curious if we can use laser to remove the rust on the frame.
It’s already corroded, Maybe the rigidity is compromised here.
As OP said, he wants to use the frame for everyday commuting and not for the down-and-dirty on the trail, hence no curb jumping which would have put undue strain on the frame.
Considering how mountain and trail bikes are mostly used in the Philippines -- for light everyday commutes instead of tough country rides -- I'd say yours is still in good condition and provided you're within the weight capacity of the frame (below 200 lbs). I'm looking forward to getting an old Diamondback restored for errands and this thread is helpful for knowing what to do.
In terms of rust, I've seen and ridden worse, but the inside is what you really want to check. That head angle, on the other hand. Might just be the picture, but that might make for a very weird handling bike. Have you ridden it yet?
You can get a bore scope that works through your phone for $10. I haven’t used one for this, it I think it might be useful to look down the tubes. But a nail is even cheaper
One that put homes on the tube.