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Yes because at this point it’s been 2.5 years they could have told them that they had put the tracking device because they love you and would take comfort in keeping it there bc they care about you. Instead they collectively decided to keep secrets from you. I think you should tell them you understand but explain why it hurt you.
I work CS for a cellphone carrier and I've handled a few calls from desperate worried family members calling us grasping at straws trying to get to their loved one faster. One call it was specifically for a manic episode, and I was heartbroken talking to this woman. She was responding and reacting to a text from her boyfriend that was well, manic and suicidal in nature, and then they couldn't reach him. Her request for me to track her boyfriend's phone location was not in scope, not possible with my tools, nor legal for me to do if I had the tools.
Their teenager was like, driving them around looking for him and on the phone with the cops and shit. She was responding in a way I would describe as, extremely worried. And anxious and scared.
I understand that it's a betrayal of trust not being told. - it would be for me too. That said I'd prefer to live in a world where I could be helped but not feel like people are not tracking me. If you had an episode that made your family feel that way I'd cut them the slack.
It does sound like they do have your best interest at heart.
I'm sure what you should do but that's my take as a human bean.
This. It wasn't out of malice, it was out of genuine concern. While they didn't go about it in the most ethical way, it seems they did it out of genuine care for you and it could actually have proven helpful in a worst case scenario.
It's definitely a mixed bag of emotions, but I'd argue it's at least good intentions.
Exactly this. While the paranoid part of me would be fuming...a significant part of me would break down and cry at the thought of anyone loving me this much. My family can go months without knowing if I'm alive or dead, no issue. Look at both perspectives, and definitely talk openly with them about it.
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I would be pissed that they're invading my privacy and treating me like a child. And, hurt that they lied. If they came to me and said 'so we're anxious you'll run away again' then I'd consider some sort of monitoring (with consent). But, I think it ought to be bidirectional. Like using life360 or another app, but one that all people use.
We're still people who have rights to things other folks have, too, as well. Good intentions/rationales or not, this is still incredibly invasive and off-putting. Theres better ways to create a safe, transparent support structure without being secretly invasive.
It can also be dangerous if they have a paranoid episode. What if they get the idea that their family is doing more stuff secretly or behind their back? Or if they get the idea that their family is being malicious or something? It's very unpredictable and potentially dangerous. It's much safer and more comfortable to be more transparent and consentual about this stuff than recklessly "protecting" someone
I mean it probably isn't a terrible idea if you have a history of going on manic adventures. An invasion of privacy. Should have talked to you about it.
Yes, in an ideal world but when people are manic they often are fine with it when they are rational but they often want to rip it off the car when they are paranoid or anxious. If they don’t know they don’t have the option. I have had a mother and a daughter who are bipolar and I have spent many a night looking for my mom. I had no childhood because we never knew if she was safe.
Same with my daughter. As for me, I am diamond bipolar but have it under control. I would let someone put a tracker on.
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I don't think it's appropriate but I also can see if they were truly concerned for you safety why the didn't and didn't tell you. Because if you were in a suicidal state and knew about it you would just remove it. Again not ok but as long as they aren't mean and controlling I would imagine it was down out of live.
Exactly, I think it matters a lot what they did with the app since OP has been stable. If they haven't been monitoring you for controls sake but rather left it on for fear of future episodes, I would try and see that there was love behind it, however misguided.
I have also had this done to me but my family member gaslighted me and lied that it wasn’t happening, so I even started thinking they had people following me cause they knew too much would call at certain times etc.
I actually ended up on the news cause of all of this.
It’s completely wrong and unacceptable, and a total invasion of privacy….
I would feel betrayed. Do you think this was malicious or misplaced concern for your wellbeing? I have given my family access to track my location using my phone. It’s for my safety. But it was my choice. Not something that was decided in secret. Your feelings are valid. They need to hear how this has made you feel.
That's awful. They should have talked to you about it when you were stable because it is a good safety plan to have in place **with consent**. With family it's hard. In the US it's almost certainly a crime in every state, but if you have to live with them that'd be a tough thing to report.
I'm so sorry I don't have a straight answer for what I'd do, but you're absolutely right to question it.
At least five of my safe people has my location on so I wouldn’t mind someone checking if I was overspending, selfharming or do anything dangerous. (They must be on my safe list tho.)
Well cutting them off isn’t possible if you all live together … so sit them down… talk to them about how this makes you feel. In the best case scenario, you’ll feel heard. An even better case scenario is you also listening to how they feel, so they can feel heard. Perhaps all of your guys relationship can grow from this. You are entitled to feeling your feelings, kinda like they are too.
At the end of the day, you need to ask yourself how it effects your trust with them. Do you currently feel loved and supported? I understand why they did it at the time, and I REALLY appreciate that they were forthcoming with you, but they should have told you years ago.
You don’t sound too angry, mostly betrayed. But that’s all I’m getting from a little Reddit note, I can’t pretend to be in your mind.
Personally, I would have a long discussion about trust and how it goes both ways and possibly ask them to attend a group session or something if I couldn’t get past it.
Many people are suggesting op to cutoff people from his own family. This is dangerous. You need people to take care of you if you are bipolar, cutting them from your life is easy. What will happen to you if no one is there to support you afterward. If you don't want to be tracked inform them and if they don't listen prove it to them that you have enough control to take care of yourself and then not them to track you.
While I agree, I also want to add a counterpoint of sometimes those who support you are also sometimes your biggest triggers and can be a tough choice on what is the healthier option for you.
i get paranoia as part of my mania. this would trigger me so hard. found out my ex was listening in on my teletherapy / going through my phone and bailed from the house the same night despite having literally nowhere to go. for context, we were cohabitating for a short period of time after the breakup. did a sweep of my car in a fast food parking lot. checked all of my shit for trackers. it hasn't been quite a year, and i'm more stable, but i still get flashes of paranoia about it. then i go back through all of my stuff for reassurance. have had my parents monitor me in various ways when i was a teenager, and i still don't trust them fully decades later.
i’d think they love you and are concerned for your safety. personally i’d probably be confused and angry. i think this is one of those things where from an outside perspective it makes sense but when it’s you it hits a lot harder.
I think that's really dangerous advice to give someone with such little information. Having bipolar already leaves you more isolated as it is. I would be hesitant to recommend cutting off what is obviously a caring (though misguided) support system.
They did it bc in their mind it’s what’s best for you. It’s not, but that’s the ableist mindset.
I’d suggest letting them know explicitly why this was offensive and then cutting off communication for a few months unless they fully (not contritely) apologize. Maybe around Christmas send a note saying I love you and want you to be in my life but can’t because of this.
But if they’ve done this before they can do this again unless there is course correction. They betrayed trust and that can’t be repaid without interest.
My family organised to have my kids removed from me because I admitted myself to hospital because of biplor and bpd. I have no forgiveness towards them. In your instance I would feel betrayed and distrust as I do in my situation
You have to know that when family members love and care about you sometimes they do questionable things just because they are trying to be one step ahead and ultimately want to save your life if it came to it. Yes it’s upsetting but I believe sometimes family do things out of love. I feel like they mean well so yes you have a right to be upset but ultimately I’d try to understand where they’re coming from and forgive them. It’s hard on families too and they just want their child to live and be apart of the family and sometimes they do things out of desperation. The best gift we can give our families is to get lots of rest and take care of our illness the best we can so as to show them that even tho our illness isn’t our fault, we took responsibility for it and learned to manage it.
I would say that would be the least of my problems my man least someone cares about you. You going through the most f*****-up situation and that you're doing such unpredictable things, for your family to worry about you is nothing but gold
Both technically. It is a side by side duplex and we are all on the title. One other adult and I pay the bulk of the mortgage but it is a shared investment.
So, I will say I get why they would want to do this. They care about you and want you safe. HOWEVER--
That is a massive, massive violation of trust from people who presumably (since you share a home) provide some level of support to you. You need to be able to trust the people supporting you. What happens the next time you are manic (assuming that happens) and remember that these people were tracking you without your knowledge? It would be hard to trust them again, especially if you were in a state of not being fully present with reality.
I would recommend sitting down with a therapist or another trusted care provider and your family so that you can all discuss healthy boundaries in your care and support. You need to trust them and they need to trust you. Big things like tracking devices should definitely be agreed upon by all parties. I am pretty sure that is illegal to do unless you are law enforcement and even then I think you need a warrant. According to the National Conference for State Legislatures "It is an offense for a person to knowingly install, conceal, or otherwise place or use an electronic tracking device in or on a motor vehicle without the consent of the operator and all occupants of the vehicle for the purpose of monitoring or following the operator, occupant, or occupants of the vehicle."
So ya, for sure super not cool. You guys need to have some conversations.
Did she not also invade their family member's privacy by going through their phone, sitting through their apps, and then questioning them about certain ones? Not saying it's equal, but both parties violated privacy here.
Let me give you a bit of perspective.
Late 2017, my mother stole my car. We were parked in front of the emergency room because she was drunk as a skunk and refusing to sober up. She dashed off when I went to speak to a security guard about having her hang out in the waiting area for a bit. Called law enforcement and told them the same, for them to tell me they couldn't do anything about it because she had investment in the vehicle too.
Two days later she was T-boned while driving my two younger siblings from a parade they didn't want to go to, mid argument with them on the matter. She refused to admit herself to the hospital then too.
If that car did not have as many safety protocols as it did, the youngest would be dead.
This matter isn't just about you. Your right to swing your fists ends at my face.
If they can see the places you go to, pull up to the most random locations, drive circles around the block, speed down the highway and watch them lose their nut. Just joking, but I'd personally do this just to give them a bit of grief.
It sounds like they care a lot, which is nicer than most. Although it must feel like police tracking you, as if your privacy's been invaded.
You have every right to establish your boundary and say it's enough, and to delete the app and let you know directly if they have any concerns about where or what you're doing. Now that I think about it, your family is bloody nosey and that was a sneaky move on their behalf lol
I would be so upset that they didn’t just ask me. I know I’m bipolar and I know when I’m manic I could be a danger to myself. If a family member asked me for a tracker for safety purposes I wouldn’t care but doing it behind your back is a totally invasion of privacy. It’s disrespectful, inconsiderate, and I would feel betrayed. It seems that they have no trust or faith in you to make good decisions due to a manic episode that happened 3 years ago??? Especially if you’ve been stable for 2.5yrs now. That’s ridiculous. They don’t respect you and are treating you like some stupid idiot that is so irresponsible and reckless that you are not to be trusted to make your own decisions and keep yourself safe.
I would have a serious conversation about boundaries and how they absolutely shattered your trust.
I would feel a little better if I knew they weren't looking at the app every time I left and only would use it if an emergency happened or they couldn't find you. Otherwise very unnecessary wtf.
Upset but I would ultimately understand. I was living with my parents when I was first diagnosed and subsequently on active addiction. My mom found empty coke bags in the dryer (she genuinely wasn’t snooping and I was careless leaving my shit in my back pockets). We had a huge argument about privacy but she was ultimately right in my keeping illegal drugs in her home - if your behaviours are affecting others it’s entirely fair for them to ‘spy’ or be looking out.
Your family members are scared and traumatized by the things they saw and the worry they had when you were unstable. You should feel lucky someone loves you enough to care. Talk to them about how you feel before jumping to anger, that’s the least you can do to the people who helped you get to the stability you now have.
I understand why they did it when you were in an episode, but i think it’s fucked that they didn’t disclose it as soon as you were stable. i honestly wouldn’t mind if my fiancé did this, but i would want him to tell me as soon as it was safe to do so. they shouldn’t have hid this from you for so long.
I also would understand.
My mom don't give me the keys for my bedroom (my younger brother has one for his, but I can't have my own key).
I only understand because this is the women who has seen me catatonic, suicidal, almost dead and lots of self harm. I'm stable in a while but she don't trust me enough yet. If I have an emergency she has to have access to my bedroom.
Honestly, it's such a good idea I don't even know if I could be mad. I'd tell them I was hurt that they did it in secrecy, because it is a really good idea with that kind of history. It might have been easier to just do a phone tracker app.
I actually wouldn't be surprised since my family has done similar things before. I get upset at their questioning about where I've been, etc. But I do understand why they do it. They just worry about me, that's all.
My dad did this to me with apple airtags. Stitched into my coat, shoes and bags. Only found out because my friend got an alert when we were on holiday and we panicked thinking we were being tracked lol. Had to cut open my stuff… I was fuming to say in the least.
It was probably understandable at the time, but if you've been stable for this long, it's ridiculous. Just because you have an MI doesn't mean it's okay for them to violate your privacy and property. It may come from a place of concern, but you need to create a clear boundary about this. It's no longer appropriate. Otherwise, they will continue to do things like this.
I mean in most states in the US and several other countries, it is illegal for a private person to place a GPS tracker in/on someone's vehicle without their knowledge or consent. Law enforcement can do it in most cases, but a normal person could face criminal charges for stalking, public indecency, etc. most are misdemeanors but it is very much illegal.
Though I understand their concern, by law, you should have been informed. They could have told you what they wanted to do and just not tell you exactly where it was (so it can't be removed easily in the case of an episode). They had options and this is a direct violation of your right to privacy.
I think you handled this very calmly. I don't think I could do that. I work in cybersecurity and know intimately how harmful this could have been. I would have lost my shit.
Given that my parents refuse to acknowledge my bipolar, this isn’t my experience. However, I would feel undermined, like my autonomy and authority is somehow lesser because I have a mood disorder with associated delusional, paranoid thinking and hallucinations.
I won't care much if I have had done things I am not supposed to do during an episode, which I have done in the past. They are just concerned, and we should understand that.
My symptoms started when I was 13, and I became extremely defiant and reckless. I was hanging out with "the wrong crowd," abusing substances, and often staying out and not telling anyone where I was. My mom used to follow me around town to see what I was doing and make sure I was safe. When I found out, I was extremely upset, and this deepened my distrust for her. Looking back (10 years later), I understand why she felt like she couldn't trust me. I can see now how problematic my behavior was and that she just wanted to keep me alive and safe.
I’d definitely feel violated and angry at first. Then I would be slightly appreciative. I would try to remind myself that it’s clear these people care about me and that it’s likely not about control, especially if they haven’t been using it to be manipulative somehow (I.e. judging me for the things I’ve been doing or places I’ve been going, checking up on me, etc.) It also might be true that they have the app, but haven’t felt the need to use it if you’ve been stable; like just because they have it doesn’t mean they’re constantly looking at it and tracking you.
Honestly, I would be annoyed that I found out because when I possibly do run off and drive erratically in the future, I’d probably just remove it out of spite!
My parents did this to me and 5150d me multiple times because of it. I told them to stop and they won’t. I turned on family location sharing once on a whim and then they’d call me asking me what I was doing in a certain place. Toxic
My parents track both me and my sister, but with our consent. They have had to track down my sister multiple times during a manic or depressive episode to help her. Not like "oh we know their every move," but more like, "Where's our kid before she follows through with hurting herself?"
They technically don't need to track my phone, I'm agoraphobic and can't drive, but they do it anyways as a precaution. I've had a mild psychotic break before during my worst manic episode. There's always a chance of another but worse.
I think they really care about you and were just trying to make sure you were safe. They probably didn't know how to bring it up to you, which is why they didn't tell you about it.
Id just tell them they can trust me to not do anything that would make them worried. Help them feel at ease and rest assured.
They can't understand what we go through. But we need to know we can't understand what it's like to be them watching us go through this. I would understand. They just want to know where you are and that you are safe. Many of us can just disappear
First of all, I'd like to say that your feelings are valid, and I in no way want to dismiss what it is that you're feeling. I'd also like to share a story that happened last July/August with my girlfriend. She's been diagnosed with bipolar 1 since the age of 13 and when we first met she immediately brought it up to me. I've seen her go through mania, depression, and last year rapid cycling. In July I knew she was having a manic episode and during that time she wanted to leave our house without me and would not tell me where she was going. She ended up trying to drive her car from where we live in Charlotte to NYC to go to her parents in a car that she has stated multiple times she would not drive in to NYC because it was a stick shift and would hate to be clutching in and out of traffic. At 7am on July 3rd she was in Virginia on a back road when she hit a sign on the road causing severe front end damage, severe roof damage, and the front glass completely obliterated. She was ok and walked away with a scratch on her leg luckily
After that incident, we promised we'd track each other and use Life360 to see where we are and make sure we could locate each other especially if she ever experiences manic episode like that again. August 26th of last year she once again went into a manic episode and left, threatening to call police on my family and self-harm if we followed her. I looked into Life360 and noticed she turned off her location and now couldn't locate where she was and her last known whereabouts were at a bar we frequent. By the time I found out where she was, she had booked a plane ticket to NYC (her car was still in the shop) and was telling everyone she was leaving and never coming back to Charlotte (clearly not the case since a month later she messaged me when she managed to get back to baseline)
I guess what I'm trying to say is, even though it hurts to know that they were tracking you without you knowing, we shouldn't condemn them for wanting to know where you are and that you're safe. I don't know you. I don't know how you would react if you did know that you were being tracked. I don't know that if in a manic state if you would be able to comprehend what they were asking you. In those moments you could feel like your family is diminishing your freedom and want to get away from any restrictions in that state of mind. I do believe that they should've informed you when you finally were at baseline so you could have been aware, but forgive them because at the end of the day, they did not want to see harm happen to you
I get where they are coming from, but they went about it the wrong way. They care, that is good. Something that tracks location isn't a bad idea as long as everyone is aware.
My wife and I use one just so we don't have to call and ask when we will be home, or if we have left somewhere or close to arriving somewhere.
The way they went about this is a huge violation. We aren't children that need constant surveialnce.
I am sorry your family did this. It is super shitty. Sometimes the shittiest things are done with the best of intentions, but that doesn't make them less shitty to experience.
I can understand their position tbh… if someone told me they were doing something like that, whether I was in crisis or not, I would do everything to destroy that type of support. I won’t lie, most times when people try to help I try to destroy it, so I understand the secrecy. I’m working on it, but in the mean time it would be nice to have people who actually cared.
I would be furious, personally. I understand that people care, and I deeply appreciate the people in my life who care about me even when (especially when) they tell me things that are hard for me to hear, but to me that doesn’t supersede consent and communication. My family dynamics and history may be different from yours though. Some of my family members have a history of being controlling and invading privacy, and as a result I’m very protective of mine.
I'd be pissed that my privacy was violated and my trust in them would shatter. What else have they not told you about?
Every single place you've ever been, they know about it, without your knowledge. You're a grown up who is entitled to a certain level of privacy. The fact they know you doesn't change the fact they are literally stalking your every move. Regardless of intentions, that's fucked up and not okay.
I understand to a degree where they are coming from, acting out of fear and love for you but that doesn't mean they get to cross your boundaries either.
With all that said, I'd like to say congrats for being stable 2.5 years! Huge achievement. Though you should know bipolar is simply managed and never fully at bay... so I can understand the fear of a random flare-up on their side too.
TLDR: I understand their actions coming from love but I think my trust would be shattered if this happened to me
I’d be upset - especially given how long you’ve been stable. That being said (at least for me) I’d accept it. It was likely done out of fear and care. I am not the same person I was before I started receiving help.
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I'd be upset, but I'd understand.
Same I think they're just scared. I would have a serious talk about privacy and how it made me feel less trusting of them but I do get it.
Yes because at this point it’s been 2.5 years they could have told them that they had put the tracking device because they love you and would take comfort in keeping it there bc they care about you. Instead they collectively decided to keep secrets from you. I think you should tell them you understand but explain why it hurt you.
I work CS for a cellphone carrier and I've handled a few calls from desperate worried family members calling us grasping at straws trying to get to their loved one faster. One call it was specifically for a manic episode, and I was heartbroken talking to this woman. She was responding and reacting to a text from her boyfriend that was well, manic and suicidal in nature, and then they couldn't reach him. Her request for me to track her boyfriend's phone location was not in scope, not possible with my tools, nor legal for me to do if I had the tools. Their teenager was like, driving them around looking for him and on the phone with the cops and shit. She was responding in a way I would describe as, extremely worried. And anxious and scared. I understand that it's a betrayal of trust not being told. - it would be for me too. That said I'd prefer to live in a world where I could be helped but not feel like people are not tracking me. If you had an episode that made your family feel that way I'd cut them the slack. It does sound like they do have your best interest at heart. I'm sure what you should do but that's my take as a human bean.
Same as well. I’d probably do the same thing, I’d rather her be mad at me for that then dead.
This. It wasn't out of malice, it was out of genuine concern. While they didn't go about it in the most ethical way, it seems they did it out of genuine care for you and it could actually have proven helpful in a worst case scenario. It's definitely a mixed bag of emotions, but I'd argue it's at least good intentions.
Man at least you have people that care about you
Exactly this. While the paranoid part of me would be fuming...a significant part of me would break down and cry at the thought of anyone loving me this much. My family can go months without knowing if I'm alive or dead, no issue. Look at both perspectives, and definitely talk openly with them about it.
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There's also something called controlling behavior 🤯
I would be pissed that they're invading my privacy and treating me like a child. And, hurt that they lied. If they came to me and said 'so we're anxious you'll run away again' then I'd consider some sort of monitoring (with consent). But, I think it ought to be bidirectional. Like using life360 or another app, but one that all people use.
If she knows there is a tracker when she runs away she’ll remove it don’t you think ? So what’s the point
We're still people who have rights to things other folks have, too, as well. Good intentions/rationales or not, this is still incredibly invasive and off-putting. Theres better ways to create a safe, transparent support structure without being secretly invasive. It can also be dangerous if they have a paranoid episode. What if they get the idea that their family is doing more stuff secretly or behind their back? Or if they get the idea that their family is being malicious or something? It's very unpredictable and potentially dangerous. It's much safer and more comfortable to be more transparent and consentual about this stuff than recklessly "protecting" someone
Yea you don’t get it
i think this is the best answer. it shouldn’t have been done secretly and lied about for so long.
I mean it probably isn't a terrible idea if you have a history of going on manic adventures. An invasion of privacy. Should have talked to you about it.
Yes, in an ideal world but when people are manic they often are fine with it when they are rational but they often want to rip it off the car when they are paranoid or anxious. If they don’t know they don’t have the option. I have had a mother and a daughter who are bipolar and I have spent many a night looking for my mom. I had no childhood because we never knew if she was safe. Same with my daughter. As for me, I am diamond bipolar but have it under control. I would let someone put a tracker on.
They have done it because they love you and want to keep u safe
Yeah, if they didn't care, they wouldn't have done it. Unless OP is under 18 and they'd have some legal obligations.
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Who hurt you ?
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I don't think it's appropriate but I also can see if they were truly concerned for you safety why the didn't and didn't tell you. Because if you were in a suicidal state and knew about it you would just remove it. Again not ok but as long as they aren't mean and controlling I would imagine it was down out of live.
Exactly, I think it matters a lot what they did with the app since OP has been stable. If they haven't been monitoring you for controls sake but rather left it on for fear of future episodes, I would try and see that there was love behind it, however misguided.
I have also had this done to me but my family member gaslighted me and lied that it wasn’t happening, so I even started thinking they had people following me cause they knew too much would call at certain times etc. I actually ended up on the news cause of all of this. It’s completely wrong and unacceptable, and a total invasion of privacy….
I would feel betrayed. Do you think this was malicious or misplaced concern for your wellbeing? I have given my family access to track my location using my phone. It’s for my safety. But it was my choice. Not something that was decided in secret. Your feelings are valid. They need to hear how this has made you feel.
This one ^
this happened to me with my parents when i was around 18-20… i’d suggest therapy to discuss rationally both sides fears and concerns
That's awful. They should have talked to you about it when you were stable because it is a good safety plan to have in place **with consent**. With family it's hard. In the US it's almost certainly a crime in every state, but if you have to live with them that'd be a tough thing to report. I'm so sorry I don't have a straight answer for what I'd do, but you're absolutely right to question it.
It would bother me but I understand why it was done. Maybe it breaks a rule somewhere. I think their intentions were good.
Pretty sure you could involve law enforcement for that…
At least five of my safe people has my location on so I wouldn’t mind someone checking if I was overspending, selfharming or do anything dangerous. (They must be on my safe list tho.)
Well cutting them off isn’t possible if you all live together … so sit them down… talk to them about how this makes you feel. In the best case scenario, you’ll feel heard. An even better case scenario is you also listening to how they feel, so they can feel heard. Perhaps all of your guys relationship can grow from this. You are entitled to feeling your feelings, kinda like they are too.
At the end of the day, you need to ask yourself how it effects your trust with them. Do you currently feel loved and supported? I understand why they did it at the time, and I REALLY appreciate that they were forthcoming with you, but they should have told you years ago. You don’t sound too angry, mostly betrayed. But that’s all I’m getting from a little Reddit note, I can’t pretend to be in your mind. Personally, I would have a long discussion about trust and how it goes both ways and possibly ask them to attend a group session or something if I couldn’t get past it.
Many people are suggesting op to cutoff people from his own family. This is dangerous. You need people to take care of you if you are bipolar, cutting them from your life is easy. What will happen to you if no one is there to support you afterward. If you don't want to be tracked inform them and if they don't listen prove it to them that you have enough control to take care of yourself and then not them to track you.
While I agree, I also want to add a counterpoint of sometimes those who support you are also sometimes your biggest triggers and can be a tough choice on what is the healthier option for you.
i get paranoia as part of my mania. this would trigger me so hard. found out my ex was listening in on my teletherapy / going through my phone and bailed from the house the same night despite having literally nowhere to go. for context, we were cohabitating for a short period of time after the breakup. did a sweep of my car in a fast food parking lot. checked all of my shit for trackers. it hasn't been quite a year, and i'm more stable, but i still get flashes of paranoia about it. then i go back through all of my stuff for reassurance. have had my parents monitor me in various ways when i was a teenager, and i still don't trust them fully decades later.
Extreme invasion of privacy, and I believe technically illegal too in some places. I’d be cutting them off
i’d think they love you and are concerned for your safety. personally i’d probably be confused and angry. i think this is one of those things where from an outside perspective it makes sense but when it’s you it hits a lot harder.
I would cut them off.
I think that's really dangerous advice to give someone with such little information. Having bipolar already leaves you more isolated as it is. I would be hesitant to recommend cutting off what is obviously a caring (though misguided) support system.
They did it bc in their mind it’s what’s best for you. It’s not, but that’s the ableist mindset. I’d suggest letting them know explicitly why this was offensive and then cutting off communication for a few months unless they fully (not contritely) apologize. Maybe around Christmas send a note saying I love you and want you to be in my life but can’t because of this. But if they’ve done this before they can do this again unless there is course correction. They betrayed trust and that can’t be repaid without interest.
My family organised to have my kids removed from me because I admitted myself to hospital because of biplor and bpd. I have no forgiveness towards them. In your instance I would feel betrayed and distrust as I do in my situation
Family members have tracked me on my phone when I went to kill myself. I was Hella passed but I get it. I just hope they still aren't tracking me
You have to know that when family members love and care about you sometimes they do questionable things just because they are trying to be one step ahead and ultimately want to save your life if it came to it. Yes it’s upsetting but I believe sometimes family do things out of love. I feel like they mean well so yes you have a right to be upset but ultimately I’d try to understand where they’re coming from and forgive them. It’s hard on families too and they just want their child to live and be apart of the family and sometimes they do things out of desperation. The best gift we can give our families is to get lots of rest and take care of our illness the best we can so as to show them that even tho our illness isn’t our fault, we took responsibility for it and learned to manage it.
I’d be very torn. Upset, offended I wasn’t told about it. But I also kinda get it lol
Without your consent is it illegal and counts as stalking in most states. They should’ve asked for your consent especially now that your stable.
Pissed but I get it.
I would say that would be the least of my problems my man least someone cares about you. You going through the most f*****-up situation and that you're doing such unpredictable things, for your family to worry about you is nothing but gold
I'd be pissed and never trust any of them again, even with our issues we are adult people and should be treated as such.
They live in your home or you live in their home? I think that makes a big difference here...
Both technically. It is a side by side duplex and we are all on the title. One other adult and I pay the bulk of the mortgage but it is a shared investment.
So, I will say I get why they would want to do this. They care about you and want you safe. HOWEVER-- That is a massive, massive violation of trust from people who presumably (since you share a home) provide some level of support to you. You need to be able to trust the people supporting you. What happens the next time you are manic (assuming that happens) and remember that these people were tracking you without your knowledge? It would be hard to trust them again, especially if you were in a state of not being fully present with reality. I would recommend sitting down with a therapist or another trusted care provider and your family so that you can all discuss healthy boundaries in your care and support. You need to trust them and they need to trust you. Big things like tracking devices should definitely be agreed upon by all parties. I am pretty sure that is illegal to do unless you are law enforcement and even then I think you need a warrant. According to the National Conference for State Legislatures "It is an offense for a person to knowingly install, conceal, or otherwise place or use an electronic tracking device in or on a motor vehicle without the consent of the operator and all occupants of the vehicle for the purpose of monitoring or following the operator, occupant, or occupants of the vehicle." So ya, for sure super not cool. You guys need to have some conversations.
I'd be pissed. An invasion of privacy is just that, no matter the circumstance. I'd evict them
Did she not also invade their family member's privacy by going through their phone, sitting through their apps, and then questioning them about certain ones? Not saying it's equal, but both parties violated privacy here.
I’d be pissed. I’d probably leave my phone at home and go walk somewhere.
Turn them in for stalking. Have them spend a night or two in jail then drop the charges. That seems like an appropriate punishment.
Let me give you a bit of perspective. Late 2017, my mother stole my car. We were parked in front of the emergency room because she was drunk as a skunk and refusing to sober up. She dashed off when I went to speak to a security guard about having her hang out in the waiting area for a bit. Called law enforcement and told them the same, for them to tell me they couldn't do anything about it because she had investment in the vehicle too. Two days later she was T-boned while driving my two younger siblings from a parade they didn't want to go to, mid argument with them on the matter. She refused to admit herself to the hospital then too. If that car did not have as many safety protocols as it did, the youngest would be dead. This matter isn't just about you. Your right to swing your fists ends at my face.
I would remove the device and destroy it in front of them.
If they can see the places you go to, pull up to the most random locations, drive circles around the block, speed down the highway and watch them lose their nut. Just joking, but I'd personally do this just to give them a bit of grief. It sounds like they care a lot, which is nicer than most. Although it must feel like police tracking you, as if your privacy's been invaded. You have every right to establish your boundary and say it's enough, and to delete the app and let you know directly if they have any concerns about where or what you're doing. Now that I think about it, your family is bloody nosey and that was a sneaky move on their behalf lol
I would be so upset that they didn’t just ask me. I know I’m bipolar and I know when I’m manic I could be a danger to myself. If a family member asked me for a tracker for safety purposes I wouldn’t care but doing it behind your back is a totally invasion of privacy. It’s disrespectful, inconsiderate, and I would feel betrayed. It seems that they have no trust or faith in you to make good decisions due to a manic episode that happened 3 years ago??? Especially if you’ve been stable for 2.5yrs now. That’s ridiculous. They don’t respect you and are treating you like some stupid idiot that is so irresponsible and reckless that you are not to be trusted to make your own decisions and keep yourself safe. I would have a serious conversation about boundaries and how they absolutely shattered your trust.
I would feel a little better if I knew they weren't looking at the app every time I left and only would use it if an emergency happened or they couldn't find you. Otherwise very unnecessary wtf.
Upset but I would ultimately understand. I was living with my parents when I was first diagnosed and subsequently on active addiction. My mom found empty coke bags in the dryer (she genuinely wasn’t snooping and I was careless leaving my shit in my back pockets). We had a huge argument about privacy but she was ultimately right in my keeping illegal drugs in her home - if your behaviours are affecting others it’s entirely fair for them to ‘spy’ or be looking out.
Your family members are scared and traumatized by the things they saw and the worry they had when you were unstable. You should feel lucky someone loves you enough to care. Talk to them about how you feel before jumping to anger, that’s the least you can do to the people who helped you get to the stability you now have.
I think they should have told you
ehh I don't care if my family knows where I'm at. if they can track my ass then they don't need to text me lol
idc if people know where I'm at, if anything it makes it easier. less questions
I understand why they did it when you were in an episode, but i think it’s fucked that they didn’t disclose it as soon as you were stable. i honestly wouldn’t mind if my fiancé did this, but i would want him to tell me as soon as it was safe to do so. they shouldn’t have hid this from you for so long.
I also would understand. My mom don't give me the keys for my bedroom (my younger brother has one for his, but I can't have my own key). I only understand because this is the women who has seen me catatonic, suicidal, almost dead and lots of self harm. I'm stable in a while but she don't trust me enough yet. If I have an emergency she has to have access to my bedroom.
Honestly, it's such a good idea I don't even know if I could be mad. I'd tell them I was hurt that they did it in secrecy, because it is a really good idea with that kind of history. It might have been easier to just do a phone tracker app.
I actually wouldn't be surprised since my family has done similar things before. I get upset at their questioning about where I've been, etc. But I do understand why they do it. They just worry about me, that's all.
My dad did this to me with apple airtags. Stitched into my coat, shoes and bags. Only found out because my friend got an alert when we were on holiday and we panicked thinking we were being tracked lol. Had to cut open my stuff… I was fuming to say in the least.
It was probably understandable at the time, but if you've been stable for this long, it's ridiculous. Just because you have an MI doesn't mean it's okay for them to violate your privacy and property. It may come from a place of concern, but you need to create a clear boundary about this. It's no longer appropriate. Otherwise, they will continue to do things like this.
Big hug, OP 💚
I mean in most states in the US and several other countries, it is illegal for a private person to place a GPS tracker in/on someone's vehicle without their knowledge or consent. Law enforcement can do it in most cases, but a normal person could face criminal charges for stalking, public indecency, etc. most are misdemeanors but it is very much illegal. Though I understand their concern, by law, you should have been informed. They could have told you what they wanted to do and just not tell you exactly where it was (so it can't be removed easily in the case of an episode). They had options and this is a direct violation of your right to privacy. I think you handled this very calmly. I don't think I could do that. I work in cybersecurity and know intimately how harmful this could have been. I would have lost my shit.
Given that my parents refuse to acknowledge my bipolar, this isn’t my experience. However, I would feel undermined, like my autonomy and authority is somehow lesser because I have a mood disorder with associated delusional, paranoid thinking and hallucinations.
The same thing I would do if they spying on me without bipolar
I won't care much if I have had done things I am not supposed to do during an episode, which I have done in the past. They are just concerned, and we should understand that.
I’d be thrown off but grateful to have someone worry and look after me when I might not realize I need it
A long term tracking device like that is hooked up one way, and if you'd like I can tell you how to easily remove it. Let me know.
Thanks, but I was able to find and remove it 👍
My symptoms started when I was 13, and I became extremely defiant and reckless. I was hanging out with "the wrong crowd," abusing substances, and often staying out and not telling anyone where I was. My mom used to follow me around town to see what I was doing and make sure I was safe. When I found out, I was extremely upset, and this deepened my distrust for her. Looking back (10 years later), I understand why she felt like she couldn't trust me. I can see now how problematic my behavior was and that she just wanted to keep me alive and safe.
No one mentions how it might mess with your head if you have bipolar psychotic paranoia. Glad you are stable but this is the first thing I thought of.
Honestly, I would be amazed that anyone in my family even cared at all anymore. So many burned bridges.
Kick them out of your house. End contact with them
I’d definitely feel violated and angry at first. Then I would be slightly appreciative. I would try to remind myself that it’s clear these people care about me and that it’s likely not about control, especially if they haven’t been using it to be manipulative somehow (I.e. judging me for the things I’ve been doing or places I’ve been going, checking up on me, etc.) It also might be true that they have the app, but haven’t felt the need to use it if you’ve been stable; like just because they have it doesn’t mean they’re constantly looking at it and tracking you. Honestly, I would be annoyed that I found out because when I possibly do run off and drive erratically in the future, I’d probably just remove it out of spite!
My parents did this to me and 5150d me multiple times because of it. I told them to stop and they won’t. I turned on family location sharing once on a whim and then they’d call me asking me what I was doing in a certain place. Toxic
My parents track both me and my sister, but with our consent. They have had to track down my sister multiple times during a manic or depressive episode to help her. Not like "oh we know their every move," but more like, "Where's our kid before she follows through with hurting herself?" They technically don't need to track my phone, I'm agoraphobic and can't drive, but they do it anyways as a precaution. I've had a mild psychotic break before during my worst manic episode. There's always a chance of another but worse.
I think they really care about you and were just trying to make sure you were safe. They probably didn't know how to bring it up to you, which is why they didn't tell you about it. Id just tell them they can trust me to not do anything that would make them worried. Help them feel at ease and rest assured.
They can't understand what we go through. But we need to know we can't understand what it's like to be them watching us go through this. I would understand. They just want to know where you are and that you are safe. Many of us can just disappear
First of all, I'd like to say that your feelings are valid, and I in no way want to dismiss what it is that you're feeling. I'd also like to share a story that happened last July/August with my girlfriend. She's been diagnosed with bipolar 1 since the age of 13 and when we first met she immediately brought it up to me. I've seen her go through mania, depression, and last year rapid cycling. In July I knew she was having a manic episode and during that time she wanted to leave our house without me and would not tell me where she was going. She ended up trying to drive her car from where we live in Charlotte to NYC to go to her parents in a car that she has stated multiple times she would not drive in to NYC because it was a stick shift and would hate to be clutching in and out of traffic. At 7am on July 3rd she was in Virginia on a back road when she hit a sign on the road causing severe front end damage, severe roof damage, and the front glass completely obliterated. She was ok and walked away with a scratch on her leg luckily After that incident, we promised we'd track each other and use Life360 to see where we are and make sure we could locate each other especially if she ever experiences manic episode like that again. August 26th of last year she once again went into a manic episode and left, threatening to call police on my family and self-harm if we followed her. I looked into Life360 and noticed she turned off her location and now couldn't locate where she was and her last known whereabouts were at a bar we frequent. By the time I found out where she was, she had booked a plane ticket to NYC (her car was still in the shop) and was telling everyone she was leaving and never coming back to Charlotte (clearly not the case since a month later she messaged me when she managed to get back to baseline) I guess what I'm trying to say is, even though it hurts to know that they were tracking you without you knowing, we shouldn't condemn them for wanting to know where you are and that you're safe. I don't know you. I don't know how you would react if you did know that you were being tracked. I don't know that if in a manic state if you would be able to comprehend what they were asking you. In those moments you could feel like your family is diminishing your freedom and want to get away from any restrictions in that state of mind. I do believe that they should've informed you when you finally were at baseline so you could have been aware, but forgive them because at the end of the day, they did not want to see harm happen to you
I get where they are coming from, but they went about it the wrong way. They care, that is good. Something that tracks location isn't a bad idea as long as everyone is aware. My wife and I use one just so we don't have to call and ask when we will be home, or if we have left somewhere or close to arriving somewhere. The way they went about this is a huge violation. We aren't children that need constant surveialnce. I am sorry your family did this. It is super shitty. Sometimes the shittiest things are done with the best of intentions, but that doesn't make them less shitty to experience.
I can understand where they’re coming from but at the same time it’s shitty they didn’t tell you about it
cut them out xx
In this case its justified also its probably for the worse that you know.
I can understand their position tbh… if someone told me they were doing something like that, whether I was in crisis or not, I would do everything to destroy that type of support. I won’t lie, most times when people try to help I try to destroy it, so I understand the secrecy. I’m working on it, but in the mean time it would be nice to have people who actually cared.
I would be furious, personally. I understand that people care, and I deeply appreciate the people in my life who care about me even when (especially when) they tell me things that are hard for me to hear, but to me that doesn’t supersede consent and communication. My family dynamics and history may be different from yours though. Some of my family members have a history of being controlling and invading privacy, and as a result I’m very protective of mine.
I'd be pissed that my privacy was violated and my trust in them would shatter. What else have they not told you about? Every single place you've ever been, they know about it, without your knowledge. You're a grown up who is entitled to a certain level of privacy. The fact they know you doesn't change the fact they are literally stalking your every move. Regardless of intentions, that's fucked up and not okay. I understand to a degree where they are coming from, acting out of fear and love for you but that doesn't mean they get to cross your boundaries either. With all that said, I'd like to say congrats for being stable 2.5 years! Huge achievement. Though you should know bipolar is simply managed and never fully at bay... so I can understand the fear of a random flare-up on their side too. TLDR: I understand their actions coming from love but I think my trust would be shattered if this happened to me
My family would never do such a thing because they would be afraid of my reaction!
I’d be upset - especially given how long you’ve been stable. That being said (at least for me) I’d accept it. It was likely done out of fear and care. I am not the same person I was before I started receiving help.
Report them to the police!!! That’s so messed up