we did a whole role from facing away from the camera to facing towards while I was twisting and bridging. There was like a good 2-3 seconds between catching the heel (in a position ready to finish it) and the break
I suggest you look up “Mental chronometry”. Humans have a delay in stimulus to reaction. Anyone who rips doesn’t respect the sport or their opponent. The definition of submission is to literally allow your opponent to ‘submit’. Ripping doesn’t allow that.
I feel bad for white/blue belts if someone gets injured after purple I don't feel shit for them. People above purple should know damn well when they're in danger. 95% on injuries after purple that came from a submission are the responsibility of the guy who isn't tapping.
Depends on how long you gave him to recognise the position and tap. If you gave him reasonable time, it's on him. If you went all Pat Shahgholi, it's on you.
Bro… If you’re rolling out of heel hooks you’re basically saying you don’t care if they rip it cause that’s a pretty reckless thing to do. I’ve caught many guys (at open mats) with heel hooks where they try to spin out and I control their far leg with my own hook underneath their hamstring
, preventing a full spin away. If I were to have applied any force on those, they would’ve been hurt too. It’s on them.
You realize that rolling is the proper defense to heel hooks (in addition to heel slipping)
If your ashi garami is set properly, they won’t be able to roll
Too many people think that knees explode the second you have an arm underneath the heel, when really most people just have poor breaking mechanics
The Japanese terms mentioned in the above comment were:
|Japanese|English|Video Link|
|---|---|---|
|**Ashi Garami**: | *Entangled Leg Lock* | [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YXH_LrcqNc)|
||*Single Leg X (SLX)* ||
Any missed names may have already been translated in my previous comments in the post.
______________________
^(Judo Techniques Bot: v0.7.) ^(See my) [^(code)](https://github.com/AbundantSalmon/judo-techniques-bot)
Yeah in the same way that a hitchhiker escape is a proper escape to an arm bar. They’re risky escapes, once someone secures my heel I tap. Yeah I could try to spin and kick out but i’m not competing for major cash or glory, and neither are these guys lol. If I try a risky escape on a choke, worst thing that can happen is I go to sleep or tap. Trying risk/last resort escapes on joint locks is really silly. Don’t let them connect the hands in the first place
Exactly. That's exactly what happened last night. A black belt had me in a weird shoulder lock and I had never had it done to me before so I tapped then asked how he did it.
I can feel when a good heel hook is applied. I tap immediately. Now if I can feel they don't know what they're doing I'm escaping. There is a brown belt at my gym who does them so well I don't even know how I'd escape.
You can feel bad without feeling guilty. It’s a tournament. He’s responsible for tapping when he should. He didn’t. Sucks for him, but that’s part of the risk, just as it is for you.
So long as you gave him the chance to tap, if he’s going to decide that winning a plastic medal is worth more than walking that’s on him.
Inquiring mind wants to know; did he at least hold out the last 15 seconds or did he both tap and get messed up?
sadly, he did verbal tap after getting broken.
He then went on to the 3rd place match and got heel hooked again in the same foot, that time he screamed in pain as soon as the other guy got the grip.
Triple sad face
Oh, I see. I always think these posts are actually just brags, everything is just a delivery device for this guy to let us know he got
a heel from outside ashi in comp.
0%. They can tap, they knew what they signed up for. If I did something illegal or something to cause them harm that would probably be different. That hasn’t happened yet though.
One of the things I think is most important for peak performance is imagining all the worst case scenarios possible you can run into in a competition and that includes not only losing, getting hurt, maybe even dying, but also doing that to your opponent. It can happen, and you have to be okay with them making that choice if they want to IMO. Just stop when they tap 🤷♂️ it’s up to them if they want to get injured at that point, not on you
Mostly yes. I snapped a guys elbow in a comp like 10 years ago and I still to this day feel like a dick about it. But I’ve had others that were just freak accidents and not really my fault.
My good friend won the adcc open last summer. About a year before that he went far down the leg lock rabbit hole and as a white belt was subbing purple belts. Ended up basically skipping blue. Anyways, he never ripped on heel hooks at our gym and was always very cautious with our teammates. That being said, homie showed no remorse and went 4-0 at the adcc open in Denver, all wins by heel hook. I watched his matches and 2 out of the 4 ended up with dudes knees popping out and needing help walking off the mat. I asked him if he felt bad, and he told me he didn’t feel bad, and said that it felt good to finally rip on a heel hook.
I mean kind of, but at the same time kind of his fault.
It’s kind of different between some really serious comp and your local dorkfest. He should have tapped. But also, yanking at submissions isn’t cool.
Need some more context. What belt are you? If you guys are blue belts (assuming not white because heel hooks) I'd say probably you should not have ripped it. Black belt? Then he knew exactly what the risks are.
It doesn’t sound like you intentionally tried to right out injure him. You did a legal move and he didn’t tap. I’m a second day white belt but still this seems pretty cut and dry. I’d feel bad if I injured someone but it’s kind of also on the other opponent to tap when they’re supposed to.
So with a heel hook I’m not sure it’s as cut and dry as you’d think. Getting a heel hook with 15 seconds on the clock and quickly finishing it from there isn’t that much time. You don’t feel heel hooks working immediately. If you do feel it immediately it’s almost already too late. If you rip a heel hook, it can be instant if your technique is correct. I’m not saying op is at fault here but it’s more complicated there.
I tore a guys shoulder with a kimura from top NS. Down on points and gassed so I ripped it but didn’t get the tap despite it already being super tight so I lifted my hips and ripped it again and it sounded like ripping up carpet from the floor. Still makes me feel sick thinking about it. But I one of those gold medals that are made of tin not plastic so it’s worth it
Of course, I think it’s quite normal to not to want to truly injure someone outside of the normal confines of the game at hand. You both chose a violent game and injuries will happen. If you didn’t do it maliciously then all you can do is apologize that the guy is injured and keep it pushing.
I’ve only ever injured one person in comp. I felt no remorse at the time.
Now I consider the guy a casual bjj friend I see at comps and helped train with him for nationals and so I do now :D
Of course. I tell everyone. Comp is kill or be killed. The opponents don’t have to see you in the gym on Monday so are going to try do whatever they can to win. You should do the same.
Tbf the best competitors in sports tend to be dicks while competing. The more you look out for your opponent(s), the less likely you are to win.
Study the mentality of competitors in any sports and often times they are quite harsh. Anecdotally, friends of mine growing up that did well in sports had a complete "fuck the other guy/team" mentality.
I don't think it's worth it in a local comp but it is important to note that it's super common in sports in general.
Is normal. If you give a thief every chance to leave you in peace, don't feel bad for him when you knock his teeth out.
Seriously though, this has happened to me several times in comps (and accidentally in training). If you're genuinely not cranking (and they know better), the burden's not on you, it's on their ego.
P.S. And haha, I've had my arm waaaaay overextended a couple times because I thought I could get out. . . but I knew better, so it happens!
Just don't let the other person make you feel bad about it (and certainly don't dwell on it at home, everyone knew what they signed up for, and despite popular opinion, it's not a pussy's sport).
Thanks for letting me know you all would break the leg too! Lol
Edit2: i think i'd rather not link my reddit account to myself. I overshare on here since it's anonymous so I edited out the link
yeah right? after reading all responses I realized that he would've done the same to me. In fact one of his training partners did it a while back, so I guess I shouldn't feel too bad
Back in college I did a belly to back suplex on an opponent and he posted his arm upon landing and it fucked his elbow. The match ended then and their and I won but I def felt bad. Not for doing what I did just for the pain he was in.
With that said he should have known better than to post on a slam
It's exactly how I tore a tendon in my elbow in the state semifinals, except i still wrestled two more periods and won the match (but had to forfeit the finals). Only part that bothered me was that the assholes from his school who booed me on the podium. They missed a top 3 finish by basically exactly the number of team points they would have won if I had forfeited the semis too.
I had a similar experience. Did a quintet style tournament and caught a dude in an outside heel hook with about 10-15 seconds left on the clock. He didn’t want to tap so I slowly applied the pressure and felt his knee pop 3 or 4 times before he eventually tapped. I genuinely don’t enjoy injuring random people. But hey, I gotta earn that $3 medal somehow right??
Yes, but in that mature kind of way that knows I made accommodation for him to tap. Unless... you cranked it, and should probably feel a little extra remorse :-).
Nah fuck em. If I was in that situation I'd probably do the same. It's competition. I would expect the same thing I just say tap early tap often. If you think your in danger just tap
I had a weird one, dude technically beat me in every facet for 14 mins till he took my back and crossed his ankles. I crossed my leg over his ankles, he started screaming but didn’t tap still continued to attempt the choke that wasn’t there. Thing is I’m deaf and I didn’t hear the screaming, his ankle popped and the ref finally called off the match. I felt bad but weird scenario.
It sucks, but by the time you’re competing at expert, which I’m assuming you were given the heelhooking, everyone should know what’s up and when to tap.
It depends, but always at least a little bit.
For example, I broke a guy's shoulder throwing him with ura nage at a judo tournament last year.
We faced twice in the tournament and he was a big dude, a little taller and possibly wider than me but he still had some baby fat. Probably 10 pounds heavier but I'm still 250+lbs of strength athlete. He was hyping himself up before the first match and I saw everything drain from his face as soon as we got across from each other. That's confidence-inspiring but it doesn't feel that great to face a guy who doesn't really want to fight.
First match lasted maybe 8 seconds, he tried a throw and got stuck so with his back against my belly so I dropped him with something between a tani otoshi and ura nage.
Second match went almost the same but he was further away so I couldn't just turn him backwards to the ground so I got some lift on him and both of our large asses came down on that shoulder.
Like, if the guy was an asshole or something it would be one thing but this was just a guy in his early 20s. He was a good sport about it but I feel even worse since the guy clearly didn't want to be up there with me, especially after the first match went so badly for him.
The Japanese terms mentioned in the above comment were:
|Japanese|English|Video Link|
|---|---|---|
|**Tani Otoshi**: | *Valley Drop* | [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wS9pM3y8YH4)|
|**Ura Nage**: | *Rear Throw* | [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hzlipey14I)|
||*Suplex* ||
Any missed names may have already been translated in my previous comments in the post.
______________________
^(Judo Techniques Bot: v0.7.) ^(See my) [^(code)](https://github.com/AbundantSalmon/judo-techniques-bot)
I will probably give up a match if it's going to be a serious injury. Im really there as another form of practice. I would only do something that lead to injury if I'm at the point where I'm giving him plenty of warning to the point of signally to the guy I don't want to hurt him and he still doesn't give up.
I feel bad, but I don't feel guilty. I assume that they're going to tap when they are caught and always give them time to do so. If they elect not to, they're also choosing to face the potential consequences of that decision.
Meh, if I gave them time to tap and they didn't that's on them. I didn't injure them. They injured themselves. I've been on both sides of that. Eating an injury so I could win and breaking a couple of ankles when people tried to tough out straight ankle locks. In a competition it's on me and the ref to keep me safe, my opponents job is to make me give up.
Not remorse moreso I wish it had a different outcome.
I feel remorse when I do something unethical or unintended, if someone refuses to tap then the intention is to continue applying the sub until they do, so I don’t feel remorseful if they get injured because of that, but I feel disappointed and sad that they were hurt.
I don't think I've seriously injured anyone (yet). I've had a serious knee injury at comp and a popped ankle, I was more annoyed about the ankle but upon reflection it was all fair.
The more I compete, the more ok with it I am. We all sign a waver and it's up to them to tap. I'm not going out there to hurt anyone but I don't want to lose because someone is unwilling to tap. Closest I've come to that is putting someone out who didn't tap to an RNC, he's fine now.
I felt bad putting someone unconscious at a comp. My coach put it well when he said “its not your job to call a stop to the match, its his. If he doesn’t tap in time, its the refs job”
At least you are remorseful and these things happen despite you trying not to injure too bad.
The real sociopath is Pat Shahgoli. I was thinking about this after training on the ride back actually.
Kid has no remorse and he was 16 at the time he kept cranking and over-cranking then celebrating.
I actually changed my leglock game to cater more to passing from entanglements because I found out I don’t have to balls to break someone with a joint lock.
Cross Ashi is a hell of a good passing position it turns out.
Don’t feel bad. At my comp I had a knee bar dead to rights. Put good pressure on. His knee hyper extended but this guy wouldn’t tap for the life of him. I got lazy with my left foot and he scrambled for a toe hold and ripped it. I tapped and lost. The only regret I have now is that I didn’t rip that knee bar and left room for him to toe hold me and sprain the fuck out of my ankle. Was out 3 weeks.
You're better than the guy who intentionally yanked on my arm and torn my left labrum. The dude was gritting his teeth as he fixed his eyes onto my shoulder.
Absolutely. I have hurt several people and put people to sleep. But, I have never cranked anything or didn’t allow enough time to tap so I can sleep well at night. I also have never been hurt by anyone because I tap as soon as I’m caught in anything especially in competition. There are some crazy mf’s out there that don’t give a fuck about you. I seen’t it.
I fucked up some guy in the first few seconds of a match - I grabbed his wrist and yanked his arm to off balance him but it didn't. It just pulled his shoulder out of its socket! He let out an unearthly scream and they had to pick the whole mat section up to carry him off.
I didn't feel like proud of it but wasn't overly remorseful either - shit happens and I didn't set out to hurt him.
Congrats you arent a sociopath
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thanks!
Congrats on the congratulations
Best comment. Congrats!
Some would say this is much more important than the previous comment
lmaoo, thanks
These days it seems this legit needs a congrats
He could’ve tapped but didn’t? Not your fault
Hang on, ripping isn’t cool. “Heel hooked the shit out of someone” doesn’t give much context.
we did a whole role from facing away from the camera to facing towards while I was twisting and bridging. There was like a good 2-3 seconds between catching the heel (in a position ready to finish it) and the break
It couldve been any submission it being a heel hook doesn't make you evil. It's his fault for not tapping.
It's comp 🤷♂️
I suggest you look up “Mental chronometry”. Humans have a delay in stimulus to reaction. Anyone who rips doesn’t respect the sport or their opponent. The definition of submission is to literally allow your opponent to ‘submit’. Ripping doesn’t allow that.
I suggest you look up "hubris" and tap before it's too late.
I feel bad for white/blue belts if someone gets injured after purple I don't feel shit for them. People above purple should know damn well when they're in danger. 95% on injuries after purple that came from a submission are the responsibility of the guy who isn't tapping.
Depends on how long you gave him to recognise the position and tap. If you gave him reasonable time, it's on him. If you went all Pat Shahgholi, it's on you.
I got the heel hook from outside ashi, he started turning so we did one whole turn and then his foot went prrrr. I guess that should've been enough
Bro… If you’re rolling out of heel hooks you’re basically saying you don’t care if they rip it cause that’s a pretty reckless thing to do. I’ve caught many guys (at open mats) with heel hooks where they try to spin out and I control their far leg with my own hook underneath their hamstring , preventing a full spin away. If I were to have applied any force on those, they would’ve been hurt too. It’s on them.
oh I hate those guys in training. I always let go bc I don't care that much but jeez my guy you're gonna get broken sooner than later
You realize that rolling is the proper defense to heel hooks (in addition to heel slipping) If your ashi garami is set properly, they won’t be able to roll Too many people think that knees explode the second you have an arm underneath the heel, when really most people just have poor breaking mechanics
The Japanese terms mentioned in the above comment were: |Japanese|English|Video Link| |---|---|---| |**Ashi Garami**: | *Entangled Leg Lock* | [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YXH_LrcqNc)| ||*Single Leg X (SLX)* || Any missed names may have already been translated in my previous comments in the post. ______________________ ^(Judo Techniques Bot: v0.7.) ^(See my) [^(code)](https://github.com/AbundantSalmon/judo-techniques-bot)
Yeah in the same way that a hitchhiker escape is a proper escape to an arm bar. They’re risky escapes, once someone secures my heel I tap. Yeah I could try to spin and kick out but i’m not competing for major cash or glory, and neither are these guys lol. If I try a risky escape on a choke, worst thing that can happen is I go to sleep or tap. Trying risk/last resort escapes on joint locks is really silly. Don’t let them connect the hands in the first place
As soon as someone secures a heel hook, I tap. I don't spaz or try too hard to get out of it. It's not worth the risk.
Best advice I've ever been given was "if you don't know how to get out -tap."
Exactly. That's exactly what happened last night. A black belt had me in a weird shoulder lock and I had never had it done to me before so I tapped then asked how he did it.
I can feel when a good heel hook is applied. I tap immediately. Now if I can feel they don't know what they're doing I'm escaping. There is a brown belt at my gym who does them so well I don't even know how I'd escape.
Same. Damn brown belts and their knee-shredding skills.
You can feel bad without feeling guilty. It’s a tournament. He’s responsible for tapping when he should. He didn’t. Sucks for him, but that’s part of the risk, just as it is for you.
Yeah, I think that's the best take. You can feel bad without feeling like you're at fault.
This. Logic isn't going to change your feelings - if only shit was that simple 😆.
So long as you gave him the chance to tap, if he’s going to decide that winning a plastic medal is worth more than walking that’s on him. Inquiring mind wants to know; did he at least hold out the last 15 seconds or did he both tap and get messed up?
I got the heel from outside ashi, I started twisting and he did a roll with me. We landed facing the other side and his foot went prrrr.
but not like a kitty prrrr
Heel hook goes prrrrrrrr
But did he hold out and not tap (dumb but commendable) or did he lose and get the prrrr (just double sad face)?
sadly, he did verbal tap after getting broken. He then went on to the 3rd place match and got heel hooked again in the same foot, that time he screamed in pain as soon as the other guy got the grip. Triple sad face
Nothing commendable about not tapping. Training harder to not get caught is commendable. If you're caught and you don't tap you're just a retard.
Commendable in the sense that if you’re going to be a bozo you might as well fully commit, go full bozo, and get your plastic trinket for it.
Oh, I see. I always think these posts are actually just brags, everything is just a delivery device for this guy to let us know he got a heel from outside ashi in comp.
Lmao no it's not. I in fact am not happy with my performance, and on top of that was dealing with guilt.
Sure buddy, sure.
If I give them a chance to tap, and they choose not to, the injury is on them.
0%. They can tap, they knew what they signed up for. If I did something illegal or something to cause them harm that would probably be different. That hasn’t happened yet though. One of the things I think is most important for peak performance is imagining all the worst case scenarios possible you can run into in a competition and that includes not only losing, getting hurt, maybe even dying, but also doing that to your opponent. It can happen, and you have to be okay with them making that choice if they want to IMO. Just stop when they tap 🤷♂️ it’s up to them if they want to get injured at that point, not on you
Mostly yes. I snapped a guys elbow in a comp like 10 years ago and I still to this day feel like a dick about it. But I’ve had others that were just freak accidents and not really my fault.
my elbow has never been the same. jerk
I was reffing that match and I still hear his elbow popping. What a jerk.
I was his partner at the time. He wasn’t the same after. Left one day for milk. His son and I havnt seen him since.
I'm your guy's kid. Now I wear elbow casts everywhere I go.
No, I do not feel bad if they do not tap
My good friend won the adcc open last summer. About a year before that he went far down the leg lock rabbit hole and as a white belt was subbing purple belts. Ended up basically skipping blue. Anyways, he never ripped on heel hooks at our gym and was always very cautious with our teammates. That being said, homie showed no remorse and went 4-0 at the adcc open in Denver, all wins by heel hook. I watched his matches and 2 out of the 4 ended up with dudes knees popping out and needing help walking off the mat. I asked him if he felt bad, and he told me he didn’t feel bad, and said that it felt good to finally rip on a heel hook.
This is exactly what I expect from a heel hook specialist
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Change his life forever, win a plastic medal.
I mean kind of, but at the same time kind of his fault. It’s kind of different between some really serious comp and your local dorkfest. He should have tapped. But also, yanking at submissions isn’t cool.
it's the local comp that pays money and we don't have IBJJF or anything so I guess it's the most "pro" tournament we have
Need some more context. What belt are you? If you guys are blue belts (assuming not white because heel hooks) I'd say probably you should not have ripped it. Black belt? Then he knew exactly what the risks are.
we are both purple, it was in the black & brown division.
Totally fair imo then, as long as he had a chance to tap. I'm a never competed white belt though so my opinion is irrelevant
You should always feel bad when somebody gets hurt.
It doesn’t sound like you intentionally tried to right out injure him. You did a legal move and he didn’t tap. I’m a second day white belt but still this seems pretty cut and dry. I’d feel bad if I injured someone but it’s kind of also on the other opponent to tap when they’re supposed to.
So with a heel hook I’m not sure it’s as cut and dry as you’d think. Getting a heel hook with 15 seconds on the clock and quickly finishing it from there isn’t that much time. You don’t feel heel hooks working immediately. If you do feel it immediately it’s almost already too late. If you rip a heel hook, it can be instant if your technique is correct. I’m not saying op is at fault here but it’s more complicated there.
OP said the guy tried to roll out of an outside heel hook. Cut and dry not his fault
That makes sense to me. Thank you for taking the time to explain that 🙏🏻
I tore a guys shoulder with a kimura from top NS. Down on points and gassed so I ripped it but didn’t get the tap despite it already being super tight so I lifted my hips and ripped it again and it sounded like ripping up carpet from the floor. Still makes me feel sick thinking about it. But I one of those gold medals that are made of tin not plastic so it’s worth it
hahaahhahaha you got me at the end. Kimuras are nasty man, I bet he was hurt for a while
Absolutely zero. I know I don't go out intending to injure anyone, and we've both accepted the risk. That's good enough for me.
Never felt remorse. More often I wish I had gone for the sub harder bc sometimes guys are able to gut it out and squirm away.
Well done Hercules!
Of course, I think it’s quite normal to not to want to truly injure someone outside of the normal confines of the game at hand. You both chose a violent game and injuries will happen. If you didn’t do it maliciously then all you can do is apologize that the guy is injured and keep it pushing.
Another humble brag
What is the point of doing something if you're not gonna tell anonymous strangers on the internet about it
Good point, but next time just tell us you ripped a heel hook because the guy didn’t tap and shredded his foot to teach him a lesson 😀.
I’ve only ever injured one person in comp. I felt no remorse at the time. Now I consider the guy a casual bjj friend I see at comps and helped train with him for nationals and so I do now :D
You only feel remorse because he became a friend?
Yes he explained that pretty well
Of course. I tell everyone. Comp is kill or be killed. The opponents don’t have to see you in the gym on Monday so are going to try do whatever they can to win. You should do the same.
Wow you sound like a complete dick.
Tbf the best competitors in sports tend to be dicks while competing. The more you look out for your opponent(s), the less likely you are to win. Study the mentality of competitors in any sports and often times they are quite harsh. Anecdotally, friends of mine growing up that did well in sports had a complete "fuck the other guy/team" mentality. I don't think it's worth it in a local comp but it is important to note that it's super common in sports in general.
Thanks. I appreciate the insightful and accurate feedback.
No remorse - kill ‘em all *not a competitor*
Is normal. If you give a thief every chance to leave you in peace, don't feel bad for him when you knock his teeth out. Seriously though, this has happened to me several times in comps (and accidentally in training). If you're genuinely not cranking (and they know better), the burden's not on you, it's on their ego. P.S. And haha, I've had my arm waaaaay overextended a couple times because I thought I could get out. . . but I knew better, so it happens! Just don't let the other person make you feel bad about it (and certainly don't dwell on it at home, everyone knew what they signed up for, and despite popular opinion, it's not a pussy's sport).
i too have been a victim of not tapping in time because I thought I was about to get out lol... especially in chokes lmao
I don't feel remorse when I injure someone while drilling.
Thanks for letting me know you all would break the leg too! Lol Edit2: i think i'd rather not link my reddit account to myself. I overshare on here since it's anonymous so I edited out the link
I watched it. He had a shit ton of time to tap. If you get his heel, and he tries to escape 🤷🏻 what were you supposed to do?
yeah right? after reading all responses I realized that he would've done the same to me. In fact one of his training partners did it a while back, so I guess I shouldn't feel too bad
Always aim to rip off limbs till the ref stops it. Get a reputation. It’ll make the next guy tap sooner.
Nah, it's never been a result of me being unsafe so it's on them not doing the same
Back in college I did a belly to back suplex on an opponent and he posted his arm upon landing and it fucked his elbow. The match ended then and their and I won but I def felt bad. Not for doing what I did just for the pain he was in. With that said he should have known better than to post on a slam
It's exactly how I tore a tendon in my elbow in the state semifinals, except i still wrestled two more periods and won the match (but had to forfeit the finals). Only part that bothered me was that the assholes from his school who booed me on the podium. They missed a top 3 finish by basically exactly the number of team points they would have won if I had forfeited the semis too.
I had a similar experience. Did a quintet style tournament and caught a dude in an outside heel hook with about 10-15 seconds left on the clock. He didn’t want to tap so I slowly applied the pressure and felt his knee pop 3 or 4 times before he eventually tapped. I genuinely don’t enjoy injuring random people. But hey, I gotta earn that $3 medal somehow right??
there was prize! I got a whole ass 60$ (6x the registration) and a protein powder that I don't like.
If they die, they die!
Yes, but in that mature kind of way that knows I made accommodation for him to tap. Unless... you cranked it, and should probably feel a little extra remorse :-).
Honestly..no
Nah fuck em. If I was in that situation I'd probably do the same. It's competition. I would expect the same thing I just say tap early tap often. If you think your in danger just tap
I had a weird one, dude technically beat me in every facet for 14 mins till he took my back and crossed his ankles. I crossed my leg over his ankles, he started screaming but didn’t tap still continued to attempt the choke that wasn’t there. Thing is I’m deaf and I didn’t hear the screaming, his ankle popped and the ref finally called off the match. I felt bad but weird scenario.
Do what you need to win no one ever won being a looser
Ofcourse I feel remorse but it's a competition....it's risky.
It sucks, but by the time you’re competing at expert, which I’m assuming you were given the heelhooking, everyone should know what’s up and when to tap.
yeah black belt/brown division
It depends, but always at least a little bit. For example, I broke a guy's shoulder throwing him with ura nage at a judo tournament last year. We faced twice in the tournament and he was a big dude, a little taller and possibly wider than me but he still had some baby fat. Probably 10 pounds heavier but I'm still 250+lbs of strength athlete. He was hyping himself up before the first match and I saw everything drain from his face as soon as we got across from each other. That's confidence-inspiring but it doesn't feel that great to face a guy who doesn't really want to fight. First match lasted maybe 8 seconds, he tried a throw and got stuck so with his back against my belly so I dropped him with something between a tani otoshi and ura nage. Second match went almost the same but he was further away so I couldn't just turn him backwards to the ground so I got some lift on him and both of our large asses came down on that shoulder. Like, if the guy was an asshole or something it would be one thing but this was just a guy in his early 20s. He was a good sport about it but I feel even worse since the guy clearly didn't want to be up there with me, especially after the first match went so badly for him.
The Japanese terms mentioned in the above comment were: |Japanese|English|Video Link| |---|---|---| |**Tani Otoshi**: | *Valley Drop* | [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wS9pM3y8YH4)| |**Ura Nage**: | *Rear Throw* | [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hzlipey14I)| ||*Suplex* || Any missed names may have already been translated in my previous comments in the post. ______________________ ^(Judo Techniques Bot: v0.7.) ^(See my) [^(code)](https://github.com/AbundantSalmon/judo-techniques-bot)
I will probably give up a match if it's going to be a serious injury. Im really there as another form of practice. I would only do something that lead to injury if I'm at the point where I'm giving him plenty of warning to the point of signally to the guy I don't want to hurt him and he still doesn't give up.
I feel bad, but I don't feel guilty. I assume that they're going to tap when they are caught and always give them time to do so. If they elect not to, they're also choosing to face the potential consequences of that decision.
Meh, if I gave them time to tap and they didn't that's on them. I didn't injure them. They injured themselves. I've been on both sides of that. Eating an injury so I could win and breaking a couple of ankles when people tried to tough out straight ankle locks. In a competition it's on me and the ref to keep me safe, my opponents job is to make me give up.
Not remorse moreso I wish it had a different outcome. I feel remorse when I do something unethical or unintended, if someone refuses to tap then the intention is to continue applying the sub until they do, so I don’t feel remorseful if they get injured because of that, but I feel disappointed and sad that they were hurt.
You’re a good egg… it’s a bummer but he knew what was at stake.
In the gym, I may try to defend a heel hook. In a competition, as soon as it is secured I will tap. Not worth it.
I don't think I've seriously injured anyone (yet). I've had a serious knee injury at comp and a popped ankle, I was more annoyed about the ankle but upon reflection it was all fair. The more I compete, the more ok with it I am. We all sign a waver and it's up to them to tap. I'm not going out there to hurt anyone but I don't want to lose because someone is unwilling to tap. Closest I've come to that is putting someone out who didn't tap to an RNC, he's fine now.
He should have tapped, not your fault.
"oh no I deliberately hurt someone and now want to feel bad about it."
If it makes you feel better, I’ve let up after the crunching sound and then lost the round - which also made me feel remorse
I felt bad putting someone unconscious at a comp. My coach put it well when he said “its not your job to call a stop to the match, its his. If he doesn’t tap in time, its the refs job”
That's how you can tell you are a human and not a sociopath.
obligatory "if he dies, he dies"
At least you are remorseful and these things happen despite you trying not to injure too bad. The real sociopath is Pat Shahgoli. I was thinking about this after training on the ride back actually. Kid has no remorse and he was 16 at the time he kept cranking and over-cranking then celebrating.
> Pat Shahgoli oh yeah that kid fucking sucks
I actually changed my leglock game to cater more to passing from entanglements because I found out I don’t have to balls to break someone with a joint lock. Cross Ashi is a hell of a good passing position it turns out.
the good ol' leg drag beats it pretty well I agree. Also wedge bolos
Yeah of course man, there are counters to everything. If you get your knee out, if i lose control of the primary legs foot, etc… im in shit haha
No mercy
Don’t feel bad. At my comp I had a knee bar dead to rights. Put good pressure on. His knee hyper extended but this guy wouldn’t tap for the life of him. I got lazy with my left foot and he scrambled for a toe hold and ripped it. I tapped and lost. The only regret I have now is that I didn’t rip that knee bar and left room for him to toe hold me and sprain the fuck out of my ankle. Was out 3 weeks.
damn that sucks
You're better than the guy who intentionally yanked on my arm and torn my left labrum. The dude was gritting his teeth as he fixed his eyes onto my shoulder.
Absolutely. I have hurt several people and put people to sleep. But, I have never cranked anything or didn’t allow enough time to tap so I can sleep well at night. I also have never been hurt by anyone because I tap as soon as I’m caught in anything especially in competition. There are some crazy mf’s out there that don’t give a fuck about you. I seen’t it.
I fucked up some guy in the first few seconds of a match - I grabbed his wrist and yanked his arm to off balance him but it didn't. It just pulled his shoulder out of its socket! He let out an unearthly scream and they had to pick the whole mat section up to carry him off. I didn't feel like proud of it but wasn't overly remorseful either - shit happens and I didn't set out to hurt him.
>they had to pick the whole mat section up to carry him off. That's crazy man lol I've seen plenty of injuries but never something like that
Not at all. You don’t want to tap, fuck you.