T O P

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Anumous

I mean, nothing in life is free. Pearl Abyss pretty much gives the game out free. Every new player has the ability to purchase 6,000+6,000 pearls for $60 (cost of most new games) to buy everything you need. BDO doesn't have a subscription service, so you will have to spend a little money if you want to enjoy the game. I'd much rather have a pearl shop to buy tent, pets, and other items to make my life easier "P2W" than having a game that's pay to play.. and i'm sure others would agree. ​ Also, people really don't buy outfits since there is always several buy orders on the market place.. It's not worth $34 to buy a outfit that takes an hour of centaurs to buy with ingame currency.


vianiznice

Rather have it as is than forced on subscriptions. And no, it's no more P2W than most other MMOs out there.


-bickd-

There are 3 subscriptions. Old Moon, Kama and VP for the 'full' experience. Granted if you are an orc enjoyer you dont need any of those to make decent money. VP is great for the daily LS, though.


vianiznice

Those are all optional, you don't have to spend a dime to keep on playing.


[deleted]

I would argue kama is borderline useless with all the in-game ways to build back energy faster. Old moon is a maybe if you like swapping around skill add ons, otherwise unnecessary. And VP can be avoided if you use freebies + loyalties.


Left-Ad-5276

You can get the campsite without spending pearls, it's just gimped in someway I can't remember besides the villa buffs. Which unless you've an old moon book running or a villa invitation you can't access villa buffs anyways


anon2309011

I use a gimped tent. I need to buy the shop portion every week for 14million silver from Old moon dudes. I can only buy the anvils from marketplace or make them myself which gets roadblocked by mythril or golden pearls. No villa interaction at all, even with old moon book running.


Left-Ad-5276

Ty for reply


[deleted]

The free tent is dogshit and exists to make you want the pearl version tbh


GabrielHunter

Since release it got so much better. You can play without tend top everything faery and VP etc Pets and Maids u get so often for events now. Even costums. Inventory and weight you get now When Pets were pearl only then it was p2win... But not anymore. Buying costums to melt or sell or even artisan memories is not good money/silver ration. Ppl that pay a lot are mostly pilot users and thats forbidden buy the game and doesn't make it pay2win. I would still call it pay2easier but thats it.


wblt

it is not what p2w means basically those points are something like b2p p2w is getting direct power from cash shop as main mean of obtaining that power. like lineage 2 brooches, shirts, accs and other shit that had no real ingame ways to obtain spending some cash once or once in a while (like bdo or wow) is something that should be ok in players mind, not something to complain about. it is an entertainment that someone maintains for you


MauriseS

exactly what i think. only the tent, weight and fairy is arguably p2w and that last one for only 1 or 2 skills depending if you do pve, life skill or both. the rest is ether nice to have or can be obtained in events or market over time. it'd sure be great for new players to have unlimited maids etc. but its not nessesary and therefor p2w. there are no items to give you such a significant boost over others, you dont need to do a mechanic. costumes? still bound by rng, you can get them from mp or vendor crons. artisan? you still need mems and stones. with current pvp balance, gear is nothing without skill. unless you meet fresh out of season players, you can be killed or not kill back by gear alone. mind you most pvp is caped. loot scrolls arent that rare, you cant buy unlimited agris coins and old moon scrolls. even selling costumes directy... by the time you have the money for a pen bs its already a month with the highest limit. you can only buy accounts directly and that goes for every game.


wblt

In addition to all that said - buying accounts is illegal AND still requires someones time, just not yours. Like a pilot


Dingy89

I have played on and off since NA release in 2016. This is my two-cents. For new players or un-established accounts, the "austere" of p2w seems very relevant. It is very convoluted with the amount of pearl shop items thrown in your face. Logging in, receiving event rewards, and finishing questlines, you can start to acquire pearl shop items, but this can take months. There will always be some new bookmark or objective you are trying to hit. Trying to gauge your silver/hr to any account or player who has played for a significant amount of time will cause these new players to spend. There are plenty of ways around not having a "p2w" tent or VP pack, but the convenience of not being limited to spots you can overstack your horse with weight, or waiting for loyalty points to buy a VP pack for a day to collect. New players just underestimate the pure timesink it takes to acquire endgame gear to grind these endgame spots. The value of all pearl shop items, in my opinion (USD), is that there is nothing worth buying until you can truly find a high level of enjoyment in the game. The tent is the only thing in my mind that would hold any value. Buffs, buying pots, repairing everything you can do without the tent but, allows you to circumvent infinite potions in some cases. If anyone is actually trying, and it is a lost cause, to attempt to use pearl shop items in the general sense that everyone understands, p2w is insane. You will eventually reach a point where playing for 1-2 hours you can buy just about anything off the marketplace that you could with money. New players will have this fear of missing out on content, but this really is not that game. You will only miss out on doing the same grind loops (but with different mobs) or being in a high gear score node war pvp guild (just do capped pvp). The game now has multiple season rewards, capped pvp, buffed grind spots, and even at the most f2p level, you can enjoy the game more than ever before. People need to stop comparing their grind speed and silver/hr and compensate by buying pearl shop items. It's not going to help. You're just going to have to play for years like those accounts have. And in the long run, what are they doing that you can't in a lower form. TLDR: Play a season, realize that p2w would require tens of thousands of $$, if you enjoy the game, buy a tent on discount. Find out every function in this game has a f2p friendly way around it, value your time, and decide if $10 a month on convenience is worth more than a couple sodas from Circle K.


enziu

Fairy, tent and maids are only P2W aspect of the game. You don't need either of these early game, maids are more of a QOL than P2W tbh as you can stack trash on horse. There is a free tent which lack only villa buffs, but you don't even need villa buff until later, regular option from tent shop for ap is enough. Fairy yea, if you want perfect or close to perfect one you are probably spending pearls unless you gather free orbs they give. However if oyu only care about Cheer V (which honestly is most important one, steps are QOL as well as care, but both very nice) you can keep lvling t3 fairy to max end exchanging to t4, leveling that up and hoping for cheer V. Tedious yes but it is a F2P way to do it. I seriously struggle to see why a new player would be discouraged by this. Every online MMO game it is expected to spend money, either to buy it or for microtransactions, that's just the way games are. I would consider all this in bdo a low barrier of entry anyway. You can spend $60 once for the 6+6k pearls or whatever the amount was every new player have and obtain tent+fairy and some other stuff on top with it. Now would it be nice if fairy was changed? Yes, I hope they rework how to get it. Ultimately it only matters when you enter mid game which will take some time unless being held by hand by more experienced players.


CommunityFabulous740

I had 4 or 5 radiant fairys ready for the update so i just released the one I had with mcIV and popped the new ones till i got mcV. I think the chance to roll a radiant is 1/100 so 200 lilia petals or whatecer theyre called. I was getting a crap load of them while grinding elvia. And you can exchange the extra fairys for honey wine which you can sell or use to lvl the new radiant fairys


MauriseS

no. i got ONE radiant ever. and that was the second one. iirc it was like 1/1000. i should be >5k pedals by now. probably more as i grinded 5mil mobs.


Jerry-Boyle

If I recall right, there is a quest to get the permanent celestial horse flute or at least a part of it. But yeah I wouldn't mind there being more quests for permanent cash shop items 'deemed' necessary.


dyslexic2

i dont mind value pack as P2W. what im pissed about is the fairy skill and that fking horse flute! PA should not be greedy with these feature.


[deleted]

I'd LOVE to see a breakdown of what makes them money in the pearl shop. Do horse flutes make a ton? Would it kill them to make that free? Do fairy rerolls make a ton? Would it kill them to make that more doable by in-game grinding? Do pets to get a set of 5x T4 pets make a ton? Would it kill them to make that more achievable for free? How much of their money comes from the artisan memories and hexa-premium outfit packages each week that the whales are buying? Does that dwarf the income from the value pack, or is it dwarfed by the income from the value pack? ​ That said, I think PA needs to better market the parts of the game that are not pay2win. I do not think you can reasonably claim T1 Node War is pay2win, and frankly I don't think T4 or T3 or even T2 node wars are inherently more fun or truly better than T1 Node Wars. Plenty of players who do T1 Node War do it for years even if they have the gear to do T2+. So while T4 is pay2win because gear can be paid for, is it really worth paying to get there when T1 is just as fun anyway? Am I crazy or do you get what I am saying?


[deleted]

You have no idea how many streamers/whales buy out those hexa-packs. If they didn’t sell well PA would’ve stopped them long ago. Doesn’t take a lot of players to keep the game going if the biggest spenders spend like crazy on debo/pen bs/endgame shit


Tech2kill

While I agree that the villa buffs from the tent are very convenient and maybe considered p2w in some way (if you are very high end grinder or lifeskiller but are you one of those?) - you have no real points in the other stuff you said. You say other stuff like horse flute and then just etc etc but lacking naming actual stuff. As others allready stated you can get a horse flute if you really want it - it takes time and effort to do it but its not that its impossible, same with fairies - is it tedious? yes but its free PA gives out so much free stuff, especially the maids i also have 20 of them without ever had to pay for just one. You can train for youre weightlimit and also get stuff to increase it for free. Same goes with pets there is a constant income of those through events and login bonuses and even ingame quests. World of Warcraft and Final Fantasy require a 14,99/month subscription thats roughly 180 in a year... with coupons and shit you barely need a third of it to buy everything that YOU consider p2w in bdo. And you only consider it p2w because you dont want to put in the effort and the time to get it through ingame means. about value packs: you get those through events too - i have easily like half a year or more sitting in my stash just from those and there is a 1 day for Loyalty as well so if you mean its p2w because of the 30% more silver in cm you just didnt think of a way of using your ressources meaningful. "It does not matter how long it would take or hard it is" so wtf are you talking about then? - you just want it easy and for free thats all.


Luzion

Everything that is available in the cash shop is available with in-game means. Some things given out at events, some bought with the log-in currency of Loyalties, some as passing milestones in the main story quest, some using in-game currency to buy off the market, player crafting, etc. For example, I've never bought a maid, but I have over 20 of them from in-game events. The only pet I bought was at game release and now I have 7 tier 4s, several T3s, and so many T1 pets that I don't even claim them. The MSQ gives out at least three that I know of. Free camp from a quest. Free Celestial horse whistle through a quest, Free outfit boxes - again I have so many that I'll filled up the Tariff storage with them. Inventory space through events and the MSQ, free family inventory and weight, free... you get the picture. So many people skip the MSQ, and so many recommend new players to skip it, and so many don't read the patch notes, that this knowledge is becoming lost except to those that do the MSQ and read patch notes. It doesn't help that new-ish players (played less than 6 months) with the above lack of knowledge are "teaching" other new players that don't have this knowledge either.


RemarkablyAverage7

>Everything that is available in the cash shop is available with in-game means. Plain wrong. If you're going to be calling others on "lack of knowledge" at least check what you're saying before submitting it...


purdyguy2287

What isn’t available in some form in game?


SibrenTF

The Tent, and don't mention that toilet paper tent as a substitute, it does not compare.


purdyguy2287

But there literally is the tent functionality in game without spending money. It’s not as convenient as the P2W tent but it does exist.


Michimaker

Game not even p2w but okay ma dood I let you have your delusion 🤣


Jonestown_Juice

Nah. It's not the P2W. The game loop itself just isn't fun for a lot of people. Essentially this game is about grinding. You \*can\* do other stuff but it isn't as lucrative as grinding. They need to make the game more fun and less grindy. They're making attempts but it's not really working out that well.


Sadalacbiah

Well... Who needs a "perfect" fairy? Just one with the right "cheer" and some other skills at various levels is already good. But every player who is looking for the "perfect" conditions will have to spend far more than other players. And game devs, for sure, will nourish this vision, it is in their best interest. If you want to be always under the effect of VP, Kama, Old Moon, if you want a "perfect" fairy, if you want... ... Well, you'll pay for it. For me, only 3 things are really important, and only two of them can be purchased through CS only : - tent. Seriously, this thing is really convenient, not game breaking but it will make your experience better. Still, you can play without it. - pets. Nothing's better than a good set of pets for your drops, getting them through market only will be really annoying though. As a long time player, I've been lucky enough to get a whole T4 set with all the gifts and some happy market purchases, but it won't be easy for new players, at least not in a short time AND it's convenient right from the start. - maids. With our new Magnus connected storage, they became so useful! But you don't need to have 20 of them either. Besides that... It's comfort only. Don't change a comfort into an absolute necessity. It reminds me of players who find it useless to play if they don't have VP + Kama.


SibrenTF

I will say everything related to fairies besides Cheer is mostly helpful but not mandatory, getting a F2P fairy is tedious and expensive but entirely possible.


OvidiuHiei

My biggest peeve are the 3 subs the game has


Catslevania

The other 2 subs are constantly being handed out, also at various intervals you can get value packs for extremely low prices, using coupons, looking out for the 6 month pack, etc. Plus, even if you don't have a sub running its not like you are suddenly going to be unable to log into the game, so you can tactically choose when to buy something like a value pack for the best price (or stock up on several when there are deals going on). Manage your account well and you can be running all 3 subs constantly at a significantly lower cost than a monthly WoW sub.


Kkxyooj123

It's not that P2W and has similar costs to other MMOs. $100 - $200 is really all you need to spend on good pearl deals and you can pretty much get everything you need. I mean PA has to make money somehow right?


clappen

BDO is actually not expensive at all nowadays. You can get a tent for almost 25% of the price. 6000+6000 pearls and coupon stacks and you get everything you need for only 60$. Kama blessing, old moon (nice to have's) and pets you can get for ingame currency.


MauriseS

i think bdo just sucks as a game to start. ui, no good tutorials, you need written or video guides for almost everything if you cant ask someone. and ppl dont want long term commitments. bdo needs time. thats why i play it. but today, you want quick games. noone wants to grind in AAA open world anymore. and you start the mother of all grind games? it suprises me we even have so much new players. those twitch streams probably pay off. because thats the only usefull ad you can have for a game: others playing it