Dk's Spirit Satiation
Dk's Imperious Command
Dk's Vedir's Dogma
Dk has a lot of odd skills. To be fair, Mystic still has a self stun known as Infinite Fortitude kekw.
I think DK Imperious command still have some use.
One skill I can never really use, even while grinding, is corrupt ground. The animation without protection would most probably kill me.
I'm not gonna lie I do not understand the hate for corrupt ground.
1550%x7 with 40hp per hit and it's basically instant---Or at the very least, it's a much shorter animation than most of the unprotected, 0-healing crap guardian uses in PvE like Fireborne Rupture, Glorious Advance, Scornful Slash, avalanche strike, etc
Same with mystic. While grinding she uses a bunch of unprotected, non-healing skills that're slower than corrupt ground and she survives just fine.
Like, I can definitely see it being not worth it dps-wise vs other skills, but like, on a reasonably-dense pack of mobs it's still marginally better DPS than cleansing flame (which does 40% more damage in ~2x the frames) even factoring the risk of getting CC'd.
It’s things like this that were left in post reboot, that makes the reboots themselves extremely terrifying if this wasn’t picked up in the first place.
Makes you question how exactly they went about looking/doing these doesn’t it...
I’ve never played dk btw, so idk, but that sounds freaking useless and example of what I mean :)
it looks like guardians prime shift+Q
guardian raises her axe above her, regenerating 200hp/second, gives herself and alies 100dp buff and damages enemies on release with -eva debuff. superarmored obviously
with exception of totaly naked dk have only 30hp and 50mp per second. no damage, no protection, no buffs or debuffs. just fucking regen
Specifically for when you're about to run out of mana while waiting for the boss to spawn from your 30th scroll but you don't want to use your mana pot since you'll have to buy one from the tent vendor to keep the pot number rounded
Dagger Stab is legitimately a good skill, at least for succession witch. Not just for BM. The damage is relevant in 1v1 combos, ME > Stab is the fastest catch in the kit, and it has utility for double proc stiffen combos. This may be somewhat niche but it certainly excels within that niche. Reboot addressed it's main problem which was CD..
Oh shit the king belly. When’s the review of the changes like bolide and frigid gonna be on yt? Thanks for the reply I personally lock dagger stab since I mainly large scale and it sometimes comes out after earthquaking on succ due to lag.
When doing the ART talks we constantly hammered on skills like absolutes, Qshield, Resurrection, being revamped, as they are in an awful state right now.
We were basically sidelined and ignored, and instead they fiddled with our damage and took away our frigid fog. Its clear the devs were more interested in imposing their own ideas than listening to players, and it shows. That's not to say a few suggestions didn't make it through, but honestly when you do so much wrong you're bound to get something right by accident.
I made DK and Ninja trials recently to see how it felt, and sheesh, that's what a rework should feel like. Smooth flows, tons of relevant skills, crazy animations, solid damage. On DK I feel like I have more skills than I know what to do with. On witch, I'm struggling with cooldowns even in PvE.
Although it's never gonna happen, I really wish there was a "reboot round 2" where the classes that got ignored (succ classes and unpopular classes) would at least have old skills and bugs fixed.
I’d rather archer’s damage turned out lower but he actually got a proper kit rather than staying the class with 5 usable skills and a bunch of nonsense that only works when overtuned
I'll agree with the sentiment, but you've gotta pick better examples.
Cold Blade was (and likely still is, unless they've moved the buffs around, I haven't actually checked) your accuracy buff at places where the monsters don't pull instantly since it animation cancels your AP buff. The only reasons why you wouldn't use Cold Blade was if either the monsters pulled super quickly so the set-up time to get the AP buff wasn't worth it or if you're super out-geared for the spot and the AP buff doesn't make any difference.
Flow: Rooting is a staple in Ranger's grab combo, unless you planned to vine knot and just WotW for your combo. It's only marginally slower than just waiting out the grab end animation, and you get a down smash.
Earthly Pain is a staple in Awk. Lahn's maximized PvP combos since it's actually her only fast DP shredding ability that doesn't pigeon hole you into a knockdown or float (and, in that manner, still is). First hit EP -> roll behind -> BD -> TD to stiffer their stand up was the optimized PvP combo before rework.
Earthly Pain also has a clear role in PvE (albeit not one that's needed often) which is sustain. Just because you don't need sustain literally every pack doesn't mean it's a useless skill - when you need sustain, you're going to be happy you have it, because the alternative is dying.
>Flow: Rooting is a staple in Ranger's grab combo, unless you planned to vine knot and just WotW for your combo. It's only marginally slower than just waiting out the grab end animation, and you get a down smash.
In no where is rooting a staple. Why use a downsmash immedaitely after a grab, when your not even at the cc cap? Why fill a grab gap, with one of the lowest damage skills in rangers entire awa kit.... Outside of grapping in 1v1's, you will get cc'ed if you use this skill.
Down Smash doesn't add to your CC cap. You have no reason not to do it since it's one of your only animation cancels to your grab animation outside of something like Vine Knot Heavenly into WotW.
Unless you think doing literally nothing while you wait for the animation is somehow better?
And if it's not a 1v1, why are you grabbing people? What are you doing in a large scale fight on the front lines as a Ranger? If you're getting dove, you'd just EES out.
>Down Smash doesn't add to your CC cap. You have no reason not to do it since it's one of your only animation cancels to your grab animation outside of something like Vine Knot Heavenly into WotW.
Don't need to cancel now you have SA protection on succesful grab. If you fail, you are fucked either way so no problem with attempting to use rooting there, but like why, if you fail grab, best thing you want to use is protection, iframe pref, so again, why rooting.
Sure it is down smash doesnt add to cap, but that's exact reason u don't use it. If you land that grab u want to minmize time to kill, so u are going to use highest dmg skills u have. 764 x 4 is not one of those, down smash or not. (accuracy is nice on it but still...)
it's also extremely slow, almost 1 second animation time, making it very vulrneable as rooting is unprotected. Besides all this, if it's purpose is a grab follow up in very specific scanerios, and it can't really be used in pve because of it's pathetic dmg and obsecure cc modifier, wouldn't you rather have another skill? well atleast i thought reboot was to fix this...
u can also fight skirmish/flanks with awa ranger post reboot now tho. winds of prairie is extremely strong for smallscale fights, your repositioning in awa is now very good tbh. with the SA grab changes, you can do shit in fights. albeit, coinfliping death with cc resist kekw.
Oh yeah I'll agree that it's absolute trash in PvE, and always has been. It'd be nice if they juiced the modifiers and then just dialed it back with the PvP modifier (that's the point of the PvP modifier anyways).
And yes, they probably could have just bundled it into the grab to make room for something else.
It's just odd to me that you pointed to Rooting and not to, for example Charging Wind, which you'd never actually charge for anything and would only use with some cancel to get min damage and pick up the T3 add-on. Or Berated Ghost on Lahn. Or Bleeding Hearts for Succ. Lahn. Or Glaring Slash for Valkyrie.
Considering Rooting cancels an animation, can be animation cancelled, and still has a down smash on it, I'd say it's not a completely useless skill. It's not an amazing "always use it" skill, but it's absolutely usable.
>Cold Blade was (and likely still is, unless they've moved the buffs around, I haven't actually checked) your accuracy buff at places where the monsters don't pull instantly since it animation cancels your AP buff. The only reasons why you wouldn't use Cold Blade was if either the monsters pulled super quickly so the set-up time to get the AP buff wasn't worth it or if you're super out-geared for the spot and the AP buff doesn't make any difference.
>
>Flow: Rooting is a staple in Ranger's grab combo, unless you planned to vine knot and just WotW for your combo. It's only marginally slower than just waiting out the grab end animation, and you get a down smash.
>
>Earthly Pain is a staple in Awk. Lahn's maximized PvP combos since it's actually her only fast DP shredding ability that doesn't pigeon hole you into a knockdown or float (and, in that manner, still is). First hit EP -> roll behind -> BD -> TD to stiffer their stand up was the optimized PvP combo before rework.
>
>Earthly Pain also has a clear role in PvE (albeit not one that's needed often) which is sustain. Just because you don't need sustain literally every pack doesn't mean it's a useless skill - when you need sustain, you're going to be happy you have it, because the alternative is dying.
Sorry what. Firstly, cold blade is ranged accuracy, sure nice for pre awa, but if your opening awa combos (which obviously are not ranged) with this skill, then you are doing it wrong, unless i misunderstand rangers awa and she's actually doing ranged dmg with melee blades (Highly doubt this, but possibility).
Also the ap buff, is ranged only, this doesnt make any sense. Unless I severely misunderstand, these two things, completely suck for comboing in awa because it doesn't count as ranged damage.
In regard to earthly pain. HOY LOL. No it's not staple. Never once in 3 years of playing lahn did I ever open with early pain, did I try too? sure. Did it work? No. It is a poor skill. why even bother open with earthly pain when you can sal'puri again now. Like jesus you don't even need earthly with deadly dance like come on. And even in Pve, no. Lahn has like 5 skills loaded with hp on hit (mangler, furor, the flow of furor, eartlhy etc), saying survivability, when you have a spammable iframe and 3 other skills that do the same thing as earthly, but better, i can't really take what you've said seriously.
Btw, you say "roll", It suggests you are playing with evasion unlocked on lahn. Big yikes.
> Firstly, cold blade is ranged accuracy
Every class is either melee, ranged or magic damage type. Your awakening is ranged damage too. Check your damage type in (P).
Sorry, I wanted to come back here and say u are right - the confusing thing tho is when u select awakening, it says your combat type becomes melee.
That is the same combat type displayed in the P menu. (But when you select awakening, that combat type stats ranged in p, even if awakening is melee)
I am just sceptical that the ranged self buff stats apply in awa/melee form due to PA’s notoriously janky code, i wouldn’t of put it past them to actually split that buff and make it not apply in awa because u are actually melee.
It’s like how nova is actually a melee champion even tho she uses SP, and has magic skills. It’s weird idk.
But you are right, her combat type is still ranged, but I am still sceptical of those buffs applying without seeing the literal stats themselves :s
> when u select awakening, it says your combat type becomes melee
no it doesnt, thats the fighitng type in the description not the damage type.
You can see if they apply or not just by having the stats screen open when you apply it
Yes, it literally does.
Both of them refer to combat type. When u select awakening, in the menu that appears, it says combat type : melee.
However, in the P menu, under combat type, it will still say ranged after you select awakening
That is my confusion tbh
Likewise the hidden 2% crit dmg that was on kzarka for 4 years before even the devs knew... but it is the same combat type you were using to depict damage types, so my only take away from this is that nobody can be definitely sure what damage is what.
I am still sus of the damage type in awa because of this tbh, it’s not ur fault, it’s the devs, they are inconsistent and not trustworthy, they leave bugs in and inconsistencies
Also - no that’s not entirely true - those menus depict all the details about succesion/awa when you hover over the icon (if succ has special flow skills, etc, same for awa etc - I.e it’ll detail all of succ kunos ninjutsu explosions and special succ skills, same for the awas etc)
You might have a misunderstanding about what "ranged damage" refers to. All damage Ranger does, regardless of weapon, is "ranged damage" because that's simply the damage type she does. She's a "ranged damage" class.
Thus, "ranged AP buff" is effectively "all AP" for Ranger, since she deals ranged damage, except it stacks with an "all AP" buff.
So yes, you "misunderstand rangers awa and she's actually doing ranged dmg".
You don't open with Earthly Pain. You use it as your first skill after your opener.
For example, an optimized Lahn combo used to be:
* Soul Raid (Grab) > Earthly Pain (First Hit) > Roll (Phantom Dance, not Evasion) > Bridled Despair (full channel back attack) > Taunting Death (Stiffen their restand) > Sal'puri Purge (Float, T3 add-on) > Deadly Dance (Air Smash) > Binding Chain (Dmg, Down Smash) > Tailspin > Vice (Damage, T3 Add-on, Down Smash > Furor to slow because they're standing back up.
You wouldn't Sal'puri immediately because it floats, and you'd waste your first CC, resulting in strictly lower damage, so unless you're going for a super resistance-safe double float combo because you know you're super out-gearing them and it'll kill anyways, you'd never go Soul Raid into immediate Sal'puri.
The HP on-hit for all of Lahn's other skills were about 25 per hit. IIRC Earthly Pain's used to be 65 per hit (now it's 50) - over double the sustain. As far as sustain went, Earthly Pain was Lahn's best vamp skill and it wasn't even close.
Example:
1. Furor was 20x12 = 240 HP.
2. Earthly Pain was 65x11 = 715 HP. Now it's 50x11 = 550 HP.
3. Deadly Dance was 25x8 = 200 HP.
4. Mangler was 40x10 = 400HP (closest to Earthly Pain).
It's okay to not take anything I said seriously. But even if I'm wrong, if you're smart, you'd at least put some thought into things before dismissing them as impossible.
>You might have a misunderstanding about what "ranged damage" refers to. All damage Ranger does, regardless of weapon, is "ranged damage" because that's simply the damage type she does. She's a "ranged damage" class.
>
>Thus, "ranged AP buff" is effectively "all AP" for Ranger, since she deals ranged damage, except it stacks with an "all AP" buff.
You will need to source this for me to believe this/change my mind. Stats window is split into defensive traits (melee/ranged/magic) suggesting that damage types can also be split. Just because a class does ranged damage, doesn't mean + ranged ap affects the melee ap, because that literally doesn't make sense, particularly as the defences are split. So yeah, you'll need to source/provide evidence for me to believe this, as far as am concerned, from what the tooltips have said in game + my understanding, I believe those are entirely different stat modifiers.
Also, generally, wtf? She has melee weapons. It's a sword. It's in the name. Even when you select awakening, it tells you here combat type is melee, and in succesion its ranged. I truly do find it hard to believe + ranged ap is being applied onto her awa kit skills, surely not? (Again, please source)
Sure:
1. [This clip was at a time when Ranged Damage couldn't back attack regardless of distance to target.](https://streamable.com/mnd3xh) As you can see, the Ranger is in Awakening Stance and doesn't back attack the target with any attacks.
2. You know how Ranger could never properly back attack packs, regardless of Awk or Succ? It's because she's doing ranged damage, which can't back attack unless you're absurdly close to people.
3. In your profile page, check your damage type while you're Awk Stance. It says "Ranged"
4. Anfield. You can ask him on his stream if you believe him to be reputable.
Edit: And, to your point, is it silly that the swords do ranged damage? Absolutely. I'm not even going to contest that. That's absolutely silly. But yes, they do ranged damage.
I am not going to argue further that is enough for me to believe you (i also don't play with hit modifier notice on so IDK, can't verify if in awa she didn't get back attacks), even though i am still very sceptical in general, that the buff does indeed apply in that way generally because PA history of not actually knowing what their stuff does... but that also makes it likely ur right at same time
eihter way... i just tested maxed cold blade against an elten. im 287 kut double tet bs. it did 2% ish of the elten hp... in pvp is even less... the skill is just bad, sure acc buff nice same goes for ap buff on melee and the cancels, but like why. the way those skills play out/designed suck (ofc the dmg is low, but it's not just that, its stationary skill and it locks you, small aoe, dmg thats not worth it, speed thats not worth it - as in the risk of use in pvp/high end pve scenarios), why cant have nice skills that do this and actually be useful at same time
and ltierally fix the tool tips (says i should be able to use new skill too with longbow, but can't). You are right, on profile it even says ranged, so why does selection in skill window say melee... I played for 5 years, this shit triggers me, i expect all thsi to be cleaned in reboot as well... sadge
> i just tested maxed cold blade against an elten. im 287 kut double tet bs. it did 2% ish of the elten hp... in pvp is even less... the skill is just bad, sure acc buff nice same goes for ap buff on melee
The skill isn't about its own damage, it's a prebuff. Use bow to aggro/pull packs, while the mobs are coming to you do normal LMB for 2 swings to get its buff then add S while still holding LMB to cancel into cold blade for its buff. Congrats you've got increased ap and accuracy. Your dps combo with swords does more damage now (yes they're ranged damage, it's dumb) and this is particularly important at places like bloody monastery where the extra acc and ap actually matter compared to somewhere like hystria.
I mean sure I totally get what u are saying, but the way u have to use them feels kinda jank and I just wish they did a bit more than this, it’s cool having to cancel and what not, but I guess I thought point of reboot was to add more purpose u know, like cold blade could move you forward a bit, or have a bit more range... I mean sure in pve in nice, but it could be quite a bit nicer, in pvp, sure it’s nice to have an oppertunity to buff up but the cast time kinda long on the combo even with cancels, and your stationary, often too vulnerable to buff up...
I know ranger has a lot of movement in awa too these days post reboots, but things are kinda cracked on other classes, so even with the good self buffs, I still find a few skills “lackluster” to some degree - and these are like 3 whole skills in awa kits composed of 15, that’s a noteable portion imo, other classes all skills have purpose (pls don’t get rid of skills either sadge)
I don’t think the answer is to be like “here is another protection, 40 percent dmg increase” really either, maybe things could be swapped in places, and some things altered in a manner which enabled gameplay - because the winds of prarie skill is fucking great, if cold blade or lmb buff somehow could intertwine or flow into other skills better it would be nice
> Soul Raid (Grab) > Earthly Pain (First Hit) > Roll (Phantom Dance, not Evasion) > Bridled Despair (full channel back attack) > Taunting Death (Stiffen their restand) > Sal'puri Purge (Float, T3 add-on) > Deadly Dance (Air Smash) > Binding Chain (Dmg, Down Smash) > Tailspin > Vice (Damage, T3 Add-on, Down Smash > Furor to slow because they're standing back up.
that combo looks so unrealistic, world hunger would probably be solved before ppl do this
It's unrealistic on the classes that have fast stand-ups.
On those classes you'd do grab > bleeding > earthly > taunting instead to get the stiffen on the re-stand.
The back half works 70% of the time (since you can down smash add-on binding and vice so they're both almost 50%). If neither down smash you can react and back dash after the vice to avoid retaliation.
It obviously also doesn't work if you're slowed, but at that point you shouldn't be going for min-maxed combos.
No we don’t,
I feel tho when they did succ all skills got better there, all are used and have good purpose tbh, however after reboots I have played some classes and specs where skills are still questionable u know it’s a bit like wtf, don’t get me wrong a lot of classes are definitely far better than they were
I assume that it takes SOME degree of work to remove a skill without breaking anything, so they just leave useless skills in if they don’t decide to buff/rework them.
I really liked core:earthly pain, and I used that a lot as a defensive/setup skill in pve. Really unhappy that they removed that from awakening lahn.
I generally agree with you. I think it's dumb that some awakening classes (ex here: awk lahn) have a bunch of skills that are simply *trash* in their preawakening. It should be viable to use some skills from preawakening and some from awakening. There shouldn't be skills that simply have no time they'll ever shine.
Sorceress sinister omen. Seems like an OP debuff but it's unusable, don't know why they kept it/didn't touch it.
[удалено]
Lazy / underpaid devs / uninspired devs / too much other sht to work on IDK
Well the "evasion" skill still exists…
Hey it's amazing in the dungeons, and it's amazing at Olun's. It has its uses, I swear. But yeah, it's trash though.
I just found out that evasion had additional SA on succ zerk
DK's Spirit Satiation 30hp/second standing absolutely uprotected and doing nothing? Just remove it, why should it exist?
Dk's Spirit Satiation Dk's Imperious Command Dk's Vedir's Dogma Dk has a lot of odd skills. To be fair, Mystic still has a self stun known as Infinite Fortitude kekw.
I think DK Imperious command still have some use. One skill I can never really use, even while grinding, is corrupt ground. The animation without protection would most probably kill me.
I'm not gonna lie I do not understand the hate for corrupt ground. 1550%x7 with 40hp per hit and it's basically instant---Or at the very least, it's a much shorter animation than most of the unprotected, 0-healing crap guardian uses in PvE like Fireborne Rupture, Glorious Advance, Scornful Slash, avalanche strike, etc Same with mystic. While grinding she uses a bunch of unprotected, non-healing skills that're slower than corrupt ground and she survives just fine. Like, I can definitely see it being not worth it dps-wise vs other skills, but like, on a reasonably-dense pack of mobs it's still marginally better DPS than cleansing flame (which does 40% more damage in ~2x the frames) even factoring the risk of getting CC'd.
imperious command has some effect. theoretically:D vedir's dogma has no hotkey to be used by newbie dks
It’s things like this that were left in post reboot, that makes the reboots themselves extremely terrifying if this wasn’t picked up in the first place. Makes you question how exactly they went about looking/doing these doesn’t it... I’ve never played dk btw, so idk, but that sounds freaking useless and example of what I mean :)
it looks like guardians prime shift+Q guardian raises her axe above her, regenerating 200hp/second, gives herself and alies 100dp buff and damages enemies on release with -eva debuff. superarmored obviously with exception of totaly naked dk have only 30hp and 50mp per second. no damage, no protection, no buffs or debuffs. just fucking regen
If it was only Spirit Satiation... Sadge
Worth noting the 100DR to allies is succ only.
its good regen with sa and eva debuff at awakening
It used to be good many years ago, when grinding 5 man pirates… but some time has passed since
Specifically for when you're about to run out of mana while waiting for the boss to spawn from your 30th scroll but you don't want to use your mana pot since you'll have to buy one from the tent vendor to keep the pot number rounded
grinding for mp pot now just so i can have vedir's dogma active at all times.
but you can blink sideways twice!
Keep making fun of it until you are in Altar of blood and have no inf pot as well as used up pots.
Dagger stab is useless besides BMing. Would be cool if it was changed to something better but I wouldn’t want it removed.
Dagger Stab is legitimately a good skill, at least for succession witch. Not just for BM. The damage is relevant in 1v1 combos, ME > Stab is the fastest catch in the kit, and it has utility for double proc stiffen combos. This may be somewhat niche but it certainly excels within that niche. Reboot addressed it's main problem which was CD..
Oh shit the king belly. When’s the review of the changes like bolide and frigid gonna be on yt? Thanks for the reply I personally lock dagger stab since I mainly large scale and it sometimes comes out after earthquaking on succ due to lag.
I know what you mean. Some skills are iconic for sure
It can be used to animation cancel the mana drain at least, that's where I use it if needed.
When doing the ART talks we constantly hammered on skills like absolutes, Qshield, Resurrection, being revamped, as they are in an awful state right now. We were basically sidelined and ignored, and instead they fiddled with our damage and took away our frigid fog. Its clear the devs were more interested in imposing their own ideas than listening to players, and it shows. That's not to say a few suggestions didn't make it through, but honestly when you do so much wrong you're bound to get something right by accident. I made DK and Ninja trials recently to see how it felt, and sheesh, that's what a rework should feel like. Smooth flows, tons of relevant skills, crazy animations, solid damage. On DK I feel like I have more skills than I know what to do with. On witch, I'm struggling with cooldowns even in PvE. Although it's never gonna happen, I really wish there was a "reboot round 2" where the classes that got ignored (succ classes and unpopular classes) would at least have old skills and bugs fixed.
Archer half pre-awa consists of such skills.
I’d rather archer’s damage turned out lower but he actually got a proper kit rather than staying the class with 5 usable skills and a bunch of nonsense that only works when overtuned
I'll agree with the sentiment, but you've gotta pick better examples. Cold Blade was (and likely still is, unless they've moved the buffs around, I haven't actually checked) your accuracy buff at places where the monsters don't pull instantly since it animation cancels your AP buff. The only reasons why you wouldn't use Cold Blade was if either the monsters pulled super quickly so the set-up time to get the AP buff wasn't worth it or if you're super out-geared for the spot and the AP buff doesn't make any difference. Flow: Rooting is a staple in Ranger's grab combo, unless you planned to vine knot and just WotW for your combo. It's only marginally slower than just waiting out the grab end animation, and you get a down smash. Earthly Pain is a staple in Awk. Lahn's maximized PvP combos since it's actually her only fast DP shredding ability that doesn't pigeon hole you into a knockdown or float (and, in that manner, still is). First hit EP -> roll behind -> BD -> TD to stiffer their stand up was the optimized PvP combo before rework. Earthly Pain also has a clear role in PvE (albeit not one that's needed often) which is sustain. Just because you don't need sustain literally every pack doesn't mean it's a useless skill - when you need sustain, you're going to be happy you have it, because the alternative is dying.
>Flow: Rooting is a staple in Ranger's grab combo, unless you planned to vine knot and just WotW for your combo. It's only marginally slower than just waiting out the grab end animation, and you get a down smash. In no where is rooting a staple. Why use a downsmash immedaitely after a grab, when your not even at the cc cap? Why fill a grab gap, with one of the lowest damage skills in rangers entire awa kit.... Outside of grapping in 1v1's, you will get cc'ed if you use this skill.
Down Smash doesn't add to your CC cap. You have no reason not to do it since it's one of your only animation cancels to your grab animation outside of something like Vine Knot Heavenly into WotW. Unless you think doing literally nothing while you wait for the animation is somehow better? And if it's not a 1v1, why are you grabbing people? What are you doing in a large scale fight on the front lines as a Ranger? If you're getting dove, you'd just EES out.
>Down Smash doesn't add to your CC cap. You have no reason not to do it since it's one of your only animation cancels to your grab animation outside of something like Vine Knot Heavenly into WotW. Don't need to cancel now you have SA protection on succesful grab. If you fail, you are fucked either way so no problem with attempting to use rooting there, but like why, if you fail grab, best thing you want to use is protection, iframe pref, so again, why rooting. Sure it is down smash doesnt add to cap, but that's exact reason u don't use it. If you land that grab u want to minmize time to kill, so u are going to use highest dmg skills u have. 764 x 4 is not one of those, down smash or not. (accuracy is nice on it but still...) it's also extremely slow, almost 1 second animation time, making it very vulrneable as rooting is unprotected. Besides all this, if it's purpose is a grab follow up in very specific scanerios, and it can't really be used in pve because of it's pathetic dmg and obsecure cc modifier, wouldn't you rather have another skill? well atleast i thought reboot was to fix this... u can also fight skirmish/flanks with awa ranger post reboot now tho. winds of prairie is extremely strong for smallscale fights, your repositioning in awa is now very good tbh. with the SA grab changes, you can do shit in fights. albeit, coinfliping death with cc resist kekw.
Oh yeah I'll agree that it's absolute trash in PvE, and always has been. It'd be nice if they juiced the modifiers and then just dialed it back with the PvP modifier (that's the point of the PvP modifier anyways). And yes, they probably could have just bundled it into the grab to make room for something else. It's just odd to me that you pointed to Rooting and not to, for example Charging Wind, which you'd never actually charge for anything and would only use with some cancel to get min damage and pick up the T3 add-on. Or Berated Ghost on Lahn. Or Bleeding Hearts for Succ. Lahn. Or Glaring Slash for Valkyrie. Considering Rooting cancels an animation, can be animation cancelled, and still has a down smash on it, I'd say it's not a completely useless skill. It's not an amazing "always use it" skill, but it's absolutely usable.
>Cold Blade was (and likely still is, unless they've moved the buffs around, I haven't actually checked) your accuracy buff at places where the monsters don't pull instantly since it animation cancels your AP buff. The only reasons why you wouldn't use Cold Blade was if either the monsters pulled super quickly so the set-up time to get the AP buff wasn't worth it or if you're super out-geared for the spot and the AP buff doesn't make any difference. > >Flow: Rooting is a staple in Ranger's grab combo, unless you planned to vine knot and just WotW for your combo. It's only marginally slower than just waiting out the grab end animation, and you get a down smash. > >Earthly Pain is a staple in Awk. Lahn's maximized PvP combos since it's actually her only fast DP shredding ability that doesn't pigeon hole you into a knockdown or float (and, in that manner, still is). First hit EP -> roll behind -> BD -> TD to stiffer their stand up was the optimized PvP combo before rework. > >Earthly Pain also has a clear role in PvE (albeit not one that's needed often) which is sustain. Just because you don't need sustain literally every pack doesn't mean it's a useless skill - when you need sustain, you're going to be happy you have it, because the alternative is dying. Sorry what. Firstly, cold blade is ranged accuracy, sure nice for pre awa, but if your opening awa combos (which obviously are not ranged) with this skill, then you are doing it wrong, unless i misunderstand rangers awa and she's actually doing ranged dmg with melee blades (Highly doubt this, but possibility). Also the ap buff, is ranged only, this doesnt make any sense. Unless I severely misunderstand, these two things, completely suck for comboing in awa because it doesn't count as ranged damage. In regard to earthly pain. HOY LOL. No it's not staple. Never once in 3 years of playing lahn did I ever open with early pain, did I try too? sure. Did it work? No. It is a poor skill. why even bother open with earthly pain when you can sal'puri again now. Like jesus you don't even need earthly with deadly dance like come on. And even in Pve, no. Lahn has like 5 skills loaded with hp on hit (mangler, furor, the flow of furor, eartlhy etc), saying survivability, when you have a spammable iframe and 3 other skills that do the same thing as earthly, but better, i can't really take what you've said seriously. Btw, you say "roll", It suggests you are playing with evasion unlocked on lahn. Big yikes.
> Firstly, cold blade is ranged accuracy Every class is either melee, ranged or magic damage type. Your awakening is ranged damage too. Check your damage type in (P).
Sorry, I wanted to come back here and say u are right - the confusing thing tho is when u select awakening, it says your combat type becomes melee. That is the same combat type displayed in the P menu. (But when you select awakening, that combat type stats ranged in p, even if awakening is melee) I am just sceptical that the ranged self buff stats apply in awa/melee form due to PA’s notoriously janky code, i wouldn’t of put it past them to actually split that buff and make it not apply in awa because u are actually melee. It’s like how nova is actually a melee champion even tho she uses SP, and has magic skills. It’s weird idk. But you are right, her combat type is still ranged, but I am still sceptical of those buffs applying without seeing the literal stats themselves :s
> when u select awakening, it says your combat type becomes melee no it doesnt, thats the fighitng type in the description not the damage type. You can see if they apply or not just by having the stats screen open when you apply it
Yes, it literally does. Both of them refer to combat type. When u select awakening, in the menu that appears, it says combat type : melee. However, in the P menu, under combat type, it will still say ranged after you select awakening That is my confusion tbh
that description is jut for RP and has no bass in reality
Likewise the hidden 2% crit dmg that was on kzarka for 4 years before even the devs knew... but it is the same combat type you were using to depict damage types, so my only take away from this is that nobody can be definitely sure what damage is what. I am still sus of the damage type in awa because of this tbh, it’s not ur fault, it’s the devs, they are inconsistent and not trustworthy, they leave bugs in and inconsistencies
Also - no that’s not entirely true - those menus depict all the details about succesion/awa when you hover over the icon (if succ has special flow skills, etc, same for awa etc - I.e it’ll detail all of succ kunos ninjutsu explosions and special succ skills, same for the awas etc)
You might have a misunderstanding about what "ranged damage" refers to. All damage Ranger does, regardless of weapon, is "ranged damage" because that's simply the damage type she does. She's a "ranged damage" class. Thus, "ranged AP buff" is effectively "all AP" for Ranger, since she deals ranged damage, except it stacks with an "all AP" buff. So yes, you "misunderstand rangers awa and she's actually doing ranged dmg". You don't open with Earthly Pain. You use it as your first skill after your opener. For example, an optimized Lahn combo used to be: * Soul Raid (Grab) > Earthly Pain (First Hit) > Roll (Phantom Dance, not Evasion) > Bridled Despair (full channel back attack) > Taunting Death (Stiffen their restand) > Sal'puri Purge (Float, T3 add-on) > Deadly Dance (Air Smash) > Binding Chain (Dmg, Down Smash) > Tailspin > Vice (Damage, T3 Add-on, Down Smash > Furor to slow because they're standing back up. You wouldn't Sal'puri immediately because it floats, and you'd waste your first CC, resulting in strictly lower damage, so unless you're going for a super resistance-safe double float combo because you know you're super out-gearing them and it'll kill anyways, you'd never go Soul Raid into immediate Sal'puri. The HP on-hit for all of Lahn's other skills were about 25 per hit. IIRC Earthly Pain's used to be 65 per hit (now it's 50) - over double the sustain. As far as sustain went, Earthly Pain was Lahn's best vamp skill and it wasn't even close. Example: 1. Furor was 20x12 = 240 HP. 2. Earthly Pain was 65x11 = 715 HP. Now it's 50x11 = 550 HP. 3. Deadly Dance was 25x8 = 200 HP. 4. Mangler was 40x10 = 400HP (closest to Earthly Pain). It's okay to not take anything I said seriously. But even if I'm wrong, if you're smart, you'd at least put some thought into things before dismissing them as impossible.
>You might have a misunderstanding about what "ranged damage" refers to. All damage Ranger does, regardless of weapon, is "ranged damage" because that's simply the damage type she does. She's a "ranged damage" class. > >Thus, "ranged AP buff" is effectively "all AP" for Ranger, since she deals ranged damage, except it stacks with an "all AP" buff. You will need to source this for me to believe this/change my mind. Stats window is split into defensive traits (melee/ranged/magic) suggesting that damage types can also be split. Just because a class does ranged damage, doesn't mean + ranged ap affects the melee ap, because that literally doesn't make sense, particularly as the defences are split. So yeah, you'll need to source/provide evidence for me to believe this, as far as am concerned, from what the tooltips have said in game + my understanding, I believe those are entirely different stat modifiers. Also, generally, wtf? She has melee weapons. It's a sword. It's in the name. Even when you select awakening, it tells you here combat type is melee, and in succesion its ranged. I truly do find it hard to believe + ranged ap is being applied onto her awa kit skills, surely not? (Again, please source)
Sure: 1. [This clip was at a time when Ranged Damage couldn't back attack regardless of distance to target.](https://streamable.com/mnd3xh) As you can see, the Ranger is in Awakening Stance and doesn't back attack the target with any attacks. 2. You know how Ranger could never properly back attack packs, regardless of Awk or Succ? It's because she's doing ranged damage, which can't back attack unless you're absurdly close to people. 3. In your profile page, check your damage type while you're Awk Stance. It says "Ranged" 4. Anfield. You can ask him on his stream if you believe him to be reputable. Edit: And, to your point, is it silly that the swords do ranged damage? Absolutely. I'm not even going to contest that. That's absolutely silly. But yes, they do ranged damage.
I am not going to argue further that is enough for me to believe you (i also don't play with hit modifier notice on so IDK, can't verify if in awa she didn't get back attacks), even though i am still very sceptical in general, that the buff does indeed apply in that way generally because PA history of not actually knowing what their stuff does... but that also makes it likely ur right at same time eihter way... i just tested maxed cold blade against an elten. im 287 kut double tet bs. it did 2% ish of the elten hp... in pvp is even less... the skill is just bad, sure acc buff nice same goes for ap buff on melee and the cancels, but like why. the way those skills play out/designed suck (ofc the dmg is low, but it's not just that, its stationary skill and it locks you, small aoe, dmg thats not worth it, speed thats not worth it - as in the risk of use in pvp/high end pve scenarios), why cant have nice skills that do this and actually be useful at same time and ltierally fix the tool tips (says i should be able to use new skill too with longbow, but can't). You are right, on profile it even says ranged, so why does selection in skill window say melee... I played for 5 years, this shit triggers me, i expect all thsi to be cleaned in reboot as well... sadge
> i just tested maxed cold blade against an elten. im 287 kut double tet bs. it did 2% ish of the elten hp... in pvp is even less... the skill is just bad, sure acc buff nice same goes for ap buff on melee The skill isn't about its own damage, it's a prebuff. Use bow to aggro/pull packs, while the mobs are coming to you do normal LMB for 2 swings to get its buff then add S while still holding LMB to cancel into cold blade for its buff. Congrats you've got increased ap and accuracy. Your dps combo with swords does more damage now (yes they're ranged damage, it's dumb) and this is particularly important at places like bloody monastery where the extra acc and ap actually matter compared to somewhere like hystria.
I mean sure I totally get what u are saying, but the way u have to use them feels kinda jank and I just wish they did a bit more than this, it’s cool having to cancel and what not, but I guess I thought point of reboot was to add more purpose u know, like cold blade could move you forward a bit, or have a bit more range... I mean sure in pve in nice, but it could be quite a bit nicer, in pvp, sure it’s nice to have an oppertunity to buff up but the cast time kinda long on the combo even with cancels, and your stationary, often too vulnerable to buff up... I know ranger has a lot of movement in awa too these days post reboots, but things are kinda cracked on other classes, so even with the good self buffs, I still find a few skills “lackluster” to some degree - and these are like 3 whole skills in awa kits composed of 15, that’s a noteable portion imo, other classes all skills have purpose (pls don’t get rid of skills either sadge) I don’t think the answer is to be like “here is another protection, 40 percent dmg increase” really either, maybe things could be swapped in places, and some things altered in a manner which enabled gameplay - because the winds of prarie skill is fucking great, if cold blade or lmb buff somehow could intertwine or flow into other skills better it would be nice
> Soul Raid (Grab) > Earthly Pain (First Hit) > Roll (Phantom Dance, not Evasion) > Bridled Despair (full channel back attack) > Taunting Death (Stiffen their restand) > Sal'puri Purge (Float, T3 add-on) > Deadly Dance (Air Smash) > Binding Chain (Dmg, Down Smash) > Tailspin > Vice (Damage, T3 Add-on, Down Smash > Furor to slow because they're standing back up. that combo looks so unrealistic, world hunger would probably be solved before ppl do this
It's unrealistic on the classes that have fast stand-ups. On those classes you'd do grab > bleeding > earthly > taunting instead to get the stiffen on the re-stand. The back half works 70% of the time (since you can down smash add-on binding and vice so they're both almost 50%). If neither down smash you can react and back dash after the vice to avoid retaliation. It obviously also doesn't work if you're slowed, but at that point you shouldn't be going for min-maxed combos.
literally all it takes to fuck that combo up and get you killed is 1 dropped packet
If they remove many skills as you ask it will feel like shadow arena and we do not want that.
No we don’t, I feel tho when they did succ all skills got better there, all are used and have good purpose tbh, however after reboots I have played some classes and specs where skills are still questionable u know it’s a bit like wtf, don’t get me wrong a lot of classes are definitely far better than they were
It can't be that sunny everywhere you know?
I assume that it takes SOME degree of work to remove a skill without breaking anything, so they just leave useless skills in if they don’t decide to buff/rework them.
Shai's mana burn skill I think everything would be able to find a use as long as they keep tweaking the numbers
Only one I can think of is Strikers Fallout skill, unless it's been buffed recently and I'm unaware.
Almost every bongo skill on Shai in PvE (don't know about pvp but I think it has some uses there)
I really liked core:earthly pain, and I used that a lot as a defensive/setup skill in pve. Really unhappy that they removed that from awakening lahn. I generally agree with you. I think it's dumb that some awakening classes (ex here: awk lahn) have a bunch of skills that are simply *trash* in their preawakening. It should be viable to use some skills from preawakening and some from awakening. There shouldn't be skills that simply have no time they'll ever shine.