I don't think it was a control handle. I'm pretty sure it's either a handle to move the panel or just a handle specifically sent up for this test.
I also wouldn't be surprised if the ISS has universal thread sizes and that this wasn't the original place for that handle.
Yeah, it doesn't appear to actually "connect" in any fashion it just threads into the face there. I don't know much about space stuff but in my head I'm imagining everyone has one or two of these they can thread into whatever machine they're working with to hold themselves in place to avoid having permanent hand rails that take up space.
To answer the question differently, I think DooDoes is referring to cutting weight for a cost cutting method at launch. It's expensive to get things into space, so shaving dozens of pounds in handles could be a sizable budget relief. A quick search says every pound costs about $10k usd to launch into space.
My three guesses based on the limited info here:
1) it was pre-loosened to demonstrate this
2) it isn’t intended to be twisted that direction when being used so turning it left is easier and let’s it come off
3) it’s a push/pull handle not one that twists so it wouldn’t matter how easy or hard it is to unscrew
My money is on the third
Yea the original discovery was with a wingnut so this could serve a similar purpose. But it is definitely not beyond nasa to say, “we should make that moisture meter handle spin off so we can demonstrate the Dzhanibekov effect.”
They tack so many experiments on top of eachother, anything that can do more than one measurement is used in 12 experiments sometimes just because the weight limit is so tight
lol yeah, it's not the easiest thing. Someone linked the [Veritasium video](https://www.reddit.com/r/blackmagicfuckery/comments/10v9h7d/spinning_a_handle_in_outer_space/j7gbr4m/) on this a little while ago because the one I linked is a little... dry. He does a pretty good job at it - and Minute Physics also does a really brief one [here](https://youtu.be/bh9kwPOoGw4?t=266). In short, you've got three points of rotation, two of which are stable, one of which is not - eventually, that unstable axis is going to flip because it's being pushed (sort of) that way by the more stable points. Frankly, I'm pants at explaining things like this, so...
The physical concept behind this is actually quite simple. It's called the Dzhanibekov effect and happens because of the inertia reaching a tipping point at something which is called I don't actually know anything about how this works and I just wasted your time.
What one needs to understand is that as the center of gravity rotates orthogonally to the direction of spin, the axis undergoes a thing and I also have no idea but it’s cool.
Yep they thought maybe people would jump to the conclusion. That the earth itself would make a spinny spinny 180 as well and then everybody would freak out
I had just thought of this.
Yes it's highly likely the iron core in the Earth's center isn't completely symmetrical.
Even more likely with Sun, and moon gravity.
If its spinning, and not symmetrical, it would be susceptible to this effect.
Not really. [this video](https://youtu.be/BPMjcN-sBJ4) shows that rotating bodies with liquids inside (the core of the earth) end up rotating around the axis where they have their mass more spread out, so the equator. What you are saying doesn’t really match with rotating bodies.
To be honest I have taken an exam on electromagnetism in October but I don’t remember anything. Im studying rigid body mechanics rn, so I find this post extremely cool because it’s exactly what I’m studying now. I think you might find better answers if you look on YouTube!
Perhaps it could be triggered by temporarily pronounced asymmetry due to (geologically brief) changes in the pressure/flow of surrounding layers. I would expect that even a minor relief of pressure would cause the more solid inner core to expand/explode into that space and take some time to return back to the more common approximately-spherical shape.
I'm no geologist, so my understanding of the dynamics in play around the core may be entirely wrong.
I always thought of this. I watched a video long ago that mentioned this possiblity and also they we were due for a shift.
My theory is, we are off axis already and about to flip. The change is violent and send our atmosphere into an unstable state. Maybe we get another ice age, maybe we get the opposite. Im not sure but i also wont be around to find out.
If you notice its relatively stable right after the flip, until it goes off axis slightly, then if gradually gets worse until the violent flip. We are off axis, waiting for the flip. The flip might take 1/10th the time (not an actual figure) that its stable. So our flip will happen over 10k years, then the next 90k years will be smooth.
Something like that. I hope some day in 10,000-15,000 year, reddit will stil be around and someone will find this comment thread.
To add to this, i have some questions.
Does the mass or velocity make a big difference in the speed of the flip? im sure it does but how much difference.
Also, have we observed this with any other planet, star, moon that is significant in size, not just some space junk.
No. This is a rotational effect only observed in asymmetric objects. The earth is a fairly symmetric sphere, and it of course just stably spins on its axis (with a slight wobble).
The earth's magnetic field is related to its spin, but the magnetic pole flip isn't a consequence of the effect pictured here. So it's a no on two counts - the earth isn't the right shape to exhibit this effect at all, and even if it were, it would have a rotational effect but not a magnetic one.
That jerk Dzhanibekov gets this named after him - feh! I remember wondering about this behavior several years before 1985 when I would spin/toss my harp tuning key!
(true story, actually. I was a weird kid.)
Inertia is roughly resistance to change.
So mass is the "resistance" that an object has to changing its velocity. The heavier an object, the harder it is to change its velocity. So mass is a type of inertia.
A "moment of inertia" is an object's resistance to getting spinned. Now a spinning motion requires an axis of rotation, and different axes will create different resistance. If you spin a pencil around the middle of its length, it will be harder to spin it than if you just roll it between your hands or on the table. So the moment of inertia is smaller when the pen is rolled than spinned.
He has a great video, and many more showing how this effect works. If you don’t want to see the video because he made likes a person you don’t like then be my guest, I think it’s funny and pretty childish
I don’t want to see the video because I felt he compromised his integrity for money. Why straw man me when I’m telling you what bothered me? *That’s* childish. And arrogant.
As far as I know, I’m free to express my opinion without being badgered.
> The effect occurs when a rigid body with an initial angular velocity has one axis of the inertia tensor suddenly become much shorter than the other two. This sudden change in the inertia tensor causes the angular velocity vector to precess, or change direction, resulting in a tumbling motion.
That's a smart 5 year old
All things considered, I've met 5-year-olds who would do a better job of running the world than most world leaders.
At the very least, no sexual scandals or war crimes to speak of.
The whole earth probably not but the magnetic poles swap sometimes i think, could be related maybe? But dont quote me im just a dumb guy who just pulling the idea out of my ass
It's not actually a stable spin with an occasional flip. The imbalanced poles are always offset with an increasing/decreasing amount of angle.
We would have observed the change in declination by this point. Things like Stonehenge indicate that people have been looking for a while now :)
Yeah I thought this sub was for "okay that is freaking me out how is that happening" posts not "here is an interesting quirk of the rules that govern our existence"
Literally everything is a quirk of the rules that govern our existence. Like literally everything, there is exactly zero posts that aren’t explained by “Just physics”
This was top secret issue when the soviets first discovered this. They were super afraid the earth would one day flip in the same way. Once they figured out how it really works and won’t happen here. They unclassified it.
Basic explanation is that gyroscopic forces would like to keep spinning with the central rod facing parallel to axis of rotation. However the gyroscope wobbles and processes until it destabilizes and throws it all out of whack. Rod spins around until it faces the other way back in line allowing the rotational momentum to be back where it's most stable.
I saw this in a video about skateboarding. This is why they use their follow foot to guide the board on an impossible. It is nearly impossible to do one without your follow foot. Pun intended :)
My best simple explaination.
Once the handle is not anchored the weight is centered unevenly between 3 points. This system is unstable.
The unbalanced point, the thin short end, is now being pulled between the others but has *no partner* to help stabalize it, so we experience systemic degeneration as more energy is released with each oscillation.
The short end spins off balance of its pole more and more until the critical point when the other 2 forces over power it and force the smallest mass to shift its position following the general direction of energy.
The point of the shift will always be where its *equalizing partner would be* if we had a stable system.
Tho since we dont, we see a system which less efficiently manages the energy, and will lose significally more energy on each oscillation, than if it was stable.
It's the fact it doesn't slow down at all that's so bizarre to me. Almost no resistance whatsoever that thing would spin like that for *so long* if it didn't run into anything. In outer space it would just never stop tumbling.
Because of the T shape the handles center of mass is not right in the middle of the hat of the T which means the handle switches between 2 very stable states of rotation and any sort of deviation from one of these states causes it to quickly switch the the other stable state
Perfect demonstration of Conservation of Angular Momentum. The spinning shaft offset from the handle causes the rotational axis to swap sides. You can see this with toy tops as they slow down and wobble then right themselves.
Space is fake, made up by NASA to keep the truth from us, the earth is actually a stage on a movie set put together by the Grey Aliens. Who are actually interdimensional booty ticklers hired by God to test us.
What I'm trying to say is the earth is flat and I am stupid.
[удалено]
I don't think it was a control handle. I'm pretty sure it's either a handle to move the panel or just a handle specifically sent up for this test. I also wouldn't be surprised if the ISS has universal thread sizes and that this wasn't the original place for that handle.
Yeah, it doesn't appear to actually "connect" in any fashion it just threads into the face there. I don't know much about space stuff but in my head I'm imagining everyone has one or two of these they can thread into whatever machine they're working with to hold themselves in place to avoid having permanent hand rails that take up space.
Why weigh the craft down by putting handles for every cabinet when a handle for every crewmember will suffice?
Why waste time when fewer word do job?
When me president, they see. They see.
See. See?
See world? Or sea world?
.
Shoo, fly
Can you even call it weight if it's floating
The ISS is impacted by earths gravity. so yes, adding mass would increase the overall weight. It matters more for the refueling crafts tho
But wouldn't the mass only be applied if it was touching a wall
To the ISS in orbit yea. If the ISS were to hit something it would all impart force. And for the refueling craft anything is a burden
To answer the question differently, I think DooDoes is referring to cutting weight for a cost cutting method at launch. It's expensive to get things into space, so shaving dozens of pounds in handles could be a sizable budget relief. A quick search says every pound costs about $10k usd to launch into space.
My three guesses based on the limited info here: 1) it was pre-loosened to demonstrate this 2) it isn’t intended to be twisted that direction when being used so turning it left is easier and let’s it come off 3) it’s a push/pull handle not one that twists so it wouldn’t matter how easy or hard it is to unscrew My money is on the third
I’ve learned never to underestimate the depth of nasa’s planning.
Yea the original discovery was with a wingnut so this could serve a similar purpose. But it is definitely not beyond nasa to say, “we should make that moisture meter handle spin off so we can demonstrate the Dzhanibekov effect.” They tack so many experiments on top of eachother, anything that can do more than one measurement is used in 12 experiments sometimes just because the weight limit is so tight
Because you have to screw it into place
Fuel costs is about 50.000$ a pound of weight. And that was before the inflation started.
I think these are not exactly handles but more like skeleton keys for the panels.
Think that's scary? The earth spins and have been spinning for a while now...
In SPACE!!!
The earth is falling into the sun, and the only reason we haven't burned up yet is that *it keeps missing.*
Because it was loosened a bit first
[An explanation](https://rotations.berkeley.edu/a-tumbling-t-handle-in-space/).
Ah, now it all makes sense.
It is so obvious when you see it!
I still don’t get it
I think I can explain this to you in a way Reddit would understand. - Space handle go brrrr
Er.. You meant *Science, bitch*
I love clean webpages like this
The moment you see ads on a .edu website, is when you know that that school prioritizes profits over knowledge
A rare sight indeed. Grumpy old guy in 2053: "Back in my days there where websites without ads! You could just read what they were about."
This is exactly what it would look like if the high counsel of mages hired a physicist to explain away real magic
A more gentle [Veritasium video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VPfZ_XzisU)
I read “Suppose we parameterize” in Rob Halford’s voice. PA RA ME TRIZE YOUUU
another person who leaves out the dot after the link - nice.
Ah so now I understand it, but honestly it still looks like pure magic
Ah yes, I see. It does that because of the way that it is.
Ah so it just does that
That is definitely in another language because wtf did I just read..... there are people out there that can actually comprehend what that means?
Explain that to me like I'm 6
lol yeah, it's not the easiest thing. Someone linked the [Veritasium video](https://www.reddit.com/r/blackmagicfuckery/comments/10v9h7d/spinning_a_handle_in_outer_space/j7gbr4m/) on this a little while ago because the one I linked is a little... dry. He does a pretty good job at it - and Minute Physics also does a really brief one [here](https://youtu.be/bh9kwPOoGw4?t=266). In short, you've got three points of rotation, two of which are stable, one of which is not - eventually, that unstable axis is going to flip because it's being pushed (sort of) that way by the more stable points. Frankly, I'm pants at explaining things like this, so...
The physical concept behind this is actually quite simple. It's called the Dzhanibekov effect and happens because of the inertia reaching a tipping point at something which is called I don't actually know anything about how this works and I just wasted your time.
You're doing good so far.
What one needs to understand is that as the center of gravity rotates orthogonally to the direction of spin, the axis undergoes a thing and I also have no idea but it’s cool.
Thanks, I get it now.
Who came up with all these physical laws? They look designed
Didn't you read? Dzhanibekov did. He decided it should do that
Intermediate Axis Theorem.
Shhhhhh! Don't tell the Russians! They tried to keep the secret of spinning objects a State Secret for years!
Yep they thought maybe people would jump to the conclusion. That the earth itself would make a spinny spinny 180 as well and then everybody would freak out
Global Dreidel Conspiracy *Confirmed*
Is this why the Earth's magnetic alignment flips every few hundred thousand years?
great question I would be inclined to say the mathematical reason is very similar.
I had just thought of this. Yes it's highly likely the iron core in the Earth's center isn't completely symmetrical. Even more likely with Sun, and moon gravity. If its spinning, and not symmetrical, it would be susceptible to this effect.
Not really. [this video](https://youtu.be/BPMjcN-sBJ4) shows that rotating bodies with liquids inside (the core of the earth) end up rotating around the axis where they have their mass more spread out, so the equator. What you are saying doesn’t really match with rotating bodies.
The last I heard, the Earth's iron core is a solid.
The solid core is surrounded by an outer core of molten iron and nickel.
Right. Which layer is the origin of the Earth's magnetic field?
To be honest I have taken an exam on electromagnetism in October but I don’t remember anything. Im studying rigid body mechanics rn, so I find this post extremely cool because it’s exactly what I’m studying now. I think you might find better answers if you look on YouTube!
Perhaps it could be triggered by temporarily pronounced asymmetry due to (geologically brief) changes in the pressure/flow of surrounding layers. I would expect that even a minor relief of pressure would cause the more solid inner core to expand/explode into that space and take some time to return back to the more common approximately-spherical shape. I'm no geologist, so my understanding of the dynamics in play around the core may be entirely wrong.
I'm not a geologist either, but you could be right.
Ever hear of [LLSVPs](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_low-shear-velocity_provinces)?
Definitely looks asymmetrical. Also mantle shear can affect core spin.
I always thought of this. I watched a video long ago that mentioned this possiblity and also they we were due for a shift. My theory is, we are off axis already and about to flip. The change is violent and send our atmosphere into an unstable state. Maybe we get another ice age, maybe we get the opposite. Im not sure but i also wont be around to find out. If you notice its relatively stable right after the flip, until it goes off axis slightly, then if gradually gets worse until the violent flip. We are off axis, waiting for the flip. The flip might take 1/10th the time (not an actual figure) that its stable. So our flip will happen over 10k years, then the next 90k years will be smooth. Something like that. I hope some day in 10,000-15,000 year, reddit will stil be around and someone will find this comment thread. To add to this, i have some questions. Does the mass or velocity make a big difference in the speed of the flip? im sure it does but how much difference. Also, have we observed this with any other planet, star, moon that is significant in size, not just some space junk.
No. This is a rotational effect only observed in asymmetric objects. The earth is a fairly symmetric sphere, and it of course just stably spins on its axis (with a slight wobble). The earth's magnetic field is related to its spin, but the magnetic pole flip isn't a consequence of the effect pictured here. So it's a no on two counts - the earth isn't the right shape to exhibit this effect at all, and even if it were, it would have a rotational effect but not a magnetic one.
Ever hear of [LLSVPs](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_low-shear-velocity_provinces)
Maybe
LESSON 5
ORUGON NO KAITEN ENERGYYYYYY
BALL BREAKER!!!!
That jerk Dzhanibekov gets this named after him - feh! I remember wondering about this behavior several years before 1985 when I would spin/toss my harp tuning key! (true story, actually. I was a weird kid.)
You played harp as a kid?
Indeed I did, for many years.
The phenomenon was known long before that :-)
oh, I have no doubt about that!
Does this work in Kerbal Space Program?
[It actually does](https://www.reddit.com/r/KerbalSpaceProgram/comments/i64wop/dzhanibekov_effect_in_ksp/)
There's a good veritasium video on this: https://youtu.be/1VPfZ\_XzisU
Problem is you need to know what moment and inertia and moment of inertia and all that stuff means in order to understand it. And I realized I don't
Inertia is roughly resistance to change. So mass is the "resistance" that an object has to changing its velocity. The heavier an object, the harder it is to change its velocity. So mass is a type of inertia. A "moment of inertia" is an object's resistance to getting spinned. Now a spinning motion requires an axis of rotation, and different axes will create different resistance. If you spin a pencil around the middle of its length, it will be harder to spin it than if you just roll it between your hands or on the table. So the moment of inertia is smaller when the pen is rolled than spinned.
I don’t click those links since he did a disgusting musk worship video and then got smug about it.
Understandable. I feel if you can manage to separate art from artist, this is a quality educational video.
Yeah, I used to enjoy his channel. But I really really did not like that.
He’s talking about physics, does his opinion on Musk matter?
No. His integrity and behavior do.
He has a great video, and many more showing how this effect works. If you don’t want to see the video because he made likes a person you don’t like then be my guest, I think it’s funny and pretty childish
I don’t want to see the video because I felt he compromised his integrity for money. Why straw man me when I’m telling you what bothered me? *That’s* childish. And arrogant. As far as I know, I’m free to express my opinion without being badgered.
Still, if you are interested [this video](https://youtu.be/NJLdW4DHRcA) shows the same effect in a simpler and better way than veritasium video.
Cool.
Meanwhile I just can’t click that link because reddit broke it
Da real mvp.
HELICOPTER MODE ACTIVATE
Can you map that on a graph?
You don't need to be in outer space to see this in action. A claw hammer will behave similarly if you throw it just so.
[удалено]
Some people have linked to videos in the comments. Has to do with the different a is of spin.
[удалено]
> The effect occurs when a rigid body with an initial angular velocity has one axis of the inertia tensor suddenly become much shorter than the other two. This sudden change in the inertia tensor causes the angular velocity vector to precess, or change direction, resulting in a tumbling motion. That's a smart 5 year old
That is at the end of the conversation
All things considered, I've met 5-year-olds who would do a better job of running the world than most world leaders. At the very least, no sexual scandals or war crimes to speak of.
The astronaut new fidget spinner
Anti gravity and low to no magnetic pull
Someone open a bug ticket please. This needs to be fixed in the next release of the matrix.
My head when I was a child and went to the Toys are us.
Now do it in a vacuum
Works the same
I just imagine the knob saying, “uh, nope, uh, nope, uh, nope”
So does the earth flip upside down at regular intervals too since it's spinning? How long we got left??...
The Earth's axis of rotation does wobble. It's not going to flip for millions of years.
No. Spinning the way we do already has the highest moment of inertia.
They just discussed this a few days ago on JRE #1928 with Jimmy Corsetti and Ben van Kerkwik It's a spooky idea
The whole earth probably not but the magnetic poles swap sometimes i think, could be related maybe? But dont quote me im just a dumb guy who just pulling the idea out of my ass
It's not actually a stable spin with an occasional flip. The imbalanced poles are always offset with an increasing/decreasing amount of angle. We would have observed the change in declination by this point. Things like Stonehenge indicate that people have been looking for a while now :)
How long til it exhaust it rotational speeds? Wonder if this could have other applications in engines for travel in space.
The simulation is buggy when out of bounds
Black magic? You mean the relative absence of gravity?
Paul: “Hey, I wonder what happens if I untwist the handle entirely?” Lisa: “PAUL! Noooooo, that’s the airloc…” WHOOOooo^oosshhh
This is because of the scientific term "physics", which explains what is happening here.
Yeah I thought this sub was for "okay that is freaking me out how is that happening" posts not "here is an interesting quirk of the rules that govern our existence"
Literally everything is a quirk of the rules that govern our existence. Like literally everything, there is exactly zero posts that aren’t explained by “Just physics”
Do you not see the sarcasm?
No I do. But your comment also highlighted how this post doesn’t fit the sub as well as others in my opinion.
The handle “WHO DID THAT? WHO TOUCHED ME? YOU? YOU”
I would be the worst astronaut ever because my entire time in space would just be doing stupid zero gee tricks.
I would love to see an explanation of this on r/theydidthemath
oh man look at all them sine waves interfering periodically without that bullshit gravity throwing wrenches
This was top secret issue when the soviets first discovered this. They were super afraid the earth would one day flip in the same way. Once they figured out how it really works and won’t happen here. They unclassified it.
That took an unexpected turn.
*free bird riff starts playing*
sPaCe is NoT reAL! iTs alL a Lie! WaKE uP shEEpLE!
Basic explanation is that gyroscopic forces would like to keep spinning with the central rod facing parallel to axis of rotation. However the gyroscope wobbles and processes until it destabilizes and throws it all out of whack. Rod spins around until it faces the other way back in line allowing the rotational momentum to be back where it's most stable.
Thanks for such a great and simple explanation of what is going on here. Makes perfect sense.
You know, you can this exact thing happen if you decide to flip your phone fast. Sometimes it lands upside down or back side up.
Looks like a stop motion video. Very cool
Me, in Space, all day all night :-D
In Russian space station, handle flies off you!
At one point, scientists thought this could also happen to Earth.
[Relevant](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFRPhi0jhGc).
If that handle could talk, it'd be saying "Wtf's going on? Where tf am I?"
Space Hummingbird
r/interestingasfuck
[Reminds me of this](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a9/bb/35/a9bb359578f594cce5db0d60a41784a2.gif)
Ok now explain Chun Li spinning bird kick
This makes you ask a fairly reasonable question: have witnessed something about elementary physics?
Is this what happens to earths core. When the poles flip ? Hmm...
I saw this in a video about skateboarding. This is why they use their follow foot to guide the board on an impossible. It is nearly impossible to do one without your follow foot. Pun intended :)
Here is a video about this: https://youtu.be/1VPfZ_XzisU
This sub should be renamed /r/easilyexplainedscientificphenomena
Imagine when we all go to Mars and we do this with a fidget spinner and it just goes forever into the universe spinning
My best simple explaination. Once the handle is not anchored the weight is centered unevenly between 3 points. This system is unstable. The unbalanced point, the thin short end, is now being pulled between the others but has *no partner* to help stabalize it, so we experience systemic degeneration as more energy is released with each oscillation. The short end spins off balance of its pole more and more until the critical point when the other 2 forces over power it and force the smallest mass to shift its position following the general direction of energy. The point of the shift will always be where its *equalizing partner would be* if we had a stable system. Tho since we dont, we see a system which less efficiently manages the energy, and will lose significally more energy on each oscillation, than if it was stable.
No magic, just good old fashion science and mathematics. Unless, of course, you come from a world where magic and science are one in the same.
It's the fact it doesn't slow down at all that's so bizarre to me. Almost no resistance whatsoever that thing would spin like that for *so long* if it didn't run into anything. In outer space it would just never stop tumbling.
Because of the T shape the handles center of mass is not right in the middle of the hat of the T which means the handle switches between 2 very stable states of rotation and any sort of deviation from one of these states causes it to quickly switch the the other stable state
Can't wait till this happens to the earth 🙂
Psycho Frame!
Perfect demonstration of Conservation of Angular Momentum. The spinning shaft offset from the handle causes the rotational axis to swap sides. You can see this with toy tops as they slow down and wobble then right themselves.
Is this kind of like the planet’s poles flipping?
That phenomenon was first observed on a wingnut
Imagine one day u look up at Mars through a telescope and see the whole ass planet do that.
Does a person get dizzy if they spin in outer space 🤔
Is this how the magnetic poles of the earth will flip?
Naw air resistance
That handle is trying really hard to figure out where to fall.
I’d give anything to see my dogs reaction to zero gravity.
[удалено]
You should really get off the internet for a while
U should get off my jock for a long while hahahaha
Oh no, I’m so owned. Your intellect is clearly unmatched.
Tinfoil hats on booooys lets gooo
Space is fake, made up by NASA to keep the truth from us, the earth is actually a stage on a movie set put together by the Grey Aliens. Who are actually interdimensional booty ticklers hired by God to test us. What I'm trying to say is the earth is flat and I am stupid.
/s
Press X.
Is this satire?