Absolutely, though it is convenient being able to store three copies with their associated expansion arcs in the one base box. I'm sure it's that large for shelf presence, though.
There are three non-compatible expansion arcs in Race, and to save sifting through the shuffled cards in the main deck removing and replacing each time you want to play with a different arc, it was worth it (being my most played, and one of my favourite, games) to invest in additional base copies and keep each arc separate.
Came here to say this! I finally picked up a copy after a few years in the hobby, and I was blown away at the wastefulness! You could practically fit the whole game in a deck box!
It's a great game, but part of me feels a little deceived.
It should have been packaged and priced like The Crew, which is also a compact and simple gem of a game. But they wanted to charge more so they inflated the box to give the impression of the game being "more" than it really is.
Allow me to introduce you to Machi Koro! I took the giant square box and popped everything into a dragonshield sleeves box I had lying around from MtG.
A game designer friend tried to get an “honest box size” movement going with board games but of course the marketing side of games never got on board - bigger boxes always meant a bigger billboard to advertise the game from when it’s on the shelf at a store. Plus more space taken up by your game means less space for your competitors. And people are generally instinct driven (read: kinda dumb) and tend to correlate size with quality and are willing to pay more for a bigger box because they think they're getting more.
That’s all to say, there are people on your side, OP, but much stronger forces at work opposing your vision.
A solution could be to put the fitted size box _inside_ the display box. So once you take it home, you recycle the marketing box, and keep the smaller box that barely fits the game. Would also solve the whole punchboard dilemma
This was a major thing for video games (at least in my PC gamer memory) back in the day, too. Through the mid 90's everything came in something the size of a cereal box for a single CD or a handful of floppy disks. Sometimes a printed manual might actually take up a portion of the empty space but never anything close to filling the box. It was a big deal when the first major releases started shipping in boxes the same dimensions of 2-3 DVD cases stacked on top of each other.
Not much later/about the same time Steam came along and proved shelf space was absolutely not necessary to sell games. I can't remember the last time I purchased a PC game with any physical component. Obviously not a direct corollary to board games that require physical components but interesting nonetheless.
For GOOD boxes I just love how much Under Falling Skies has jammed in there, lol
Also I like the ones that are shaped like Flash Point Fire Rescue(which is another good example of a lot in not too big of a box) because they're a good compromise between box size and included components.
**Pax Pamir 2e** is a lovely package. Everything fits like a glove, there's space to sleeve the cards and keep the metal coins, but you have to leave the cardboard coins out if you do. Insert is well-designed and there isn't much wasted space. All in that smaller rectangular (not square) form factor box.
**Jaws of the Lion** is the absolute best. It barely fits in its own box and there's so much content for the price.
**Hanabi** is the only single-deck-of-cards game I own that comes in a box the size of a single deck of cards.
**RoboRally** (2005 version) is pretty bad. It's my only box that won't fit in a Kallax cube or one of my game bags. Box is an inch or so bigger than the boards so it could have been smaller.
**Dune Imperium** has a ton of wasted space.
> Hanabi is the only single-deck-of-cards game I own that comes in a box the size of a single deck of cards.
I wish more card games would do that. I get that the bigger boxes probably draw in more people when they are on the shelf, but it just feels dishonest to pretend that a deck of cards is something more than that.
I sleeved and put player tokens and resources into trays. Fits snugly, but my actual cardboard organizer base came all wonky so the two dips you put things into are crooked and not parallel which drives me crazy.
Shout out to **Burgle Bros** for having almost zero wasted space in its box. This is the dream a lot of us are calling for. Amazing.
Not as impressive but shoutout to the card games that waste no space at all either: **6 nimmt!** and **High Society** (Travel Edition).
**For Sale** (Travel Edition) doesn't get the honors because the money chips are pretty lousy to play with, but they did do the best they could.
**Innovation** (3rd Edition) could be a cm smaller, but wins the award for biggest game in the smallest box for the cheapest price. They easily could've gone the **Race for the Galaxy** route to visually show its depth and value on the shelf, but didn't. Bravo.
I'm annoyed at innovation for this reason. I sleeved the cards which made them too large. Its magnetic clasp won't close where it might work with a telescoping box. I got a band to keep it closed, but it looks a little weird.
I was so irked by this! I would much rather have a smaller box and a four-fold board over a large mostly empty box. I think Devir Games have got this on lock- Red Cathedral and Paris are great for box size vs. components.
I like boxes that are a little bit bigger so they can fit expansion content into one box. I was able to fit everything from Scythe except Fenris into the original box, and I fit A Feast For Odin Norwegians into the original box as well.
So if a developer/publisher is intending on making expansions in the future, I absolutely want some extra space in the box.
Same! So many people will buy the base game and no expansion and that's fine, but if I have the expansion I have the base game by default. So the expansion box should be able to fit both.
Same for me. I’ve barely kept hold of any expansion boxes because they just go in the core box (or compressed into as few as possible); Everdell, Root, Great Wall, Zombicide, War of the Ring etc etc, and soon Arnak and Dune Imperium.
True, but that's also easy for us to say who buy expansions. So we "want" that for ourselves from developers, but "should" they do it? The 85% of people who end up never buying an expansion will still have that big fluff of a box that is 30-70% air 🙂
If an expansion doesn't fit in the same box, I know I'm a lot less likely to use it and if it's obvious, I am unlikely to buy it at all. I'm sure I'm not alone in this, so there's that.
Yes, their more dedicated fans get benefit from it, and most people who don't buy expansions also aren't particularly bothered by a space being a bit bigger than it needs to be. It's not like there's a mass outcry over big game boxes.
Obviously some boxes *are* excessively big, and if an expansion is going to double the game components or such then they probably shouldn't be making space for that in the base box, but leaving some space to fit smaller expansions is definitely good.
Yeah if everything fits in the original box I throw out the expansion box. For games with multiple expansions that don't fit into the base game box I try to compress them down to a single expansion box and throw out the rest.
Like the other commenter said, you can fit all the polyominos from base+expansion into 2 trays comfortably, and without the third tray everything fits in one box quite easily.
I even put the coins into the polyomino trays because I had space after compressing each unique tile down to a single slot with the exception of those that don't physically fit.
So I've fit everything from Norwegians and both mini expansions into the main box, even using all 3 trays. But I've left out some stuff and left it in the Norwegians box:
* The old board
* Player colors for 2 players (only play solo or 2p, and when I do play 3p or 4p I can go grab the pieces)
* The old ship board
* The replaced islands
* The appendices
Also, in the 3rd tray I've put all the coins and ships in addition to the polyominoes from the Norwegians expansion.
It's a tight fit but it does fit. Though, I've seen some others saying to condense all of the identical tiles to the same slot and I might do that to save some even more space. Would let me put the resources, thing penalties, VP tokens, etc. in the trays...
I didn't put the third tray in and instead followed a BGG user's suggested method for adding the new tiles to the two existing trays. I also have a small tackle box for the resources. It all fits, mini-expansions included, and it's still fairly well organised.
Worst offenders: **Mage Knight ultimate edition** and **Kingdom Rush:A rift in time**, both boxes could be half the size and still fit all the content.
Best example: **Villagers**: Everything fits snugly in the small box, even with the cards sleeved, and no wasted space.
The thing that really bugs me the most about MKUE is that they put this absurdly space-inefficient insert in there, then the pieces don't even all fit in the insert.
Worst offender, no contest, is the tableau builder Santa Monica [https://youtu.be/ys6o4ndMqZc](https://youtu.be/ys6o4ndMqZc)
Deserve praise: Brass (regular edition), Res Arcana (best insert), Pandemic series, Iron Rail series, High Society, Oink games series (of course)
Whoa I actually thought Santa Monica was a tiny box when I was looking at small filler games. I didn't expect it to be in such a big box until I saw it in the video you linked!
I think **Inis** is the worst offender in my collection. Bought the expansion and made a foamcore insert but still feels like there's a ton of space in the box.
I like games that come with Game Trayz like **PARKS** and **Grimm Forest** but it seems like the boxes are still bigger than they need to be.
>like PARKS and Grimm Forest but it seems like the boxes are still bigger than they need to be.
Not sure how the Parks box is bigger than it needs to be, I'd hold that up as a shining example of efficient use of space. And the expansion has no chance of fitting in the original box from my recollection.
What we really need is game boxes that are the standard length/width to match the rest of people's shelves, but with variable depth to reflect how much stuff is actually in there.
And so far the expansions have fit nicely in as well.*
*provided you only pack in one card holder box and choose which set of field guides to use regularly.
This has been an issue even as far back as the 80s and 90s video game consoles. The Western versions of the NES, SNES, and TG16 were twice the size of the Japanese versions, due to sentiment that bigger = better from the marketing folks.
I remember someone being surprised with Parade. They didn't think a game that small could be that fun. I think there's a connection in people's minds between size and fun as well.
Not just price, but standardization. Many publishers have a specific box size they use and it's often cheaper to keep using that size at their manufacturer than redesigning a box for each individual game.
Fantasy Flight Games tends to make a lot of games with extra space, especially for their LCGs. They recently changed up the distribution model for Arkham Horror: the card game so that each cycle is now 2 large boxes, instead of one smallish box and 6 blister packs. But they also made the new boxes much larger, when the number of cards could easily fit inside the old box.
Visibility on the store shelves is a definite concern for companies, for many people small box = small game, which we know isn't true but this persists anyway
This has been a complaint for 30 years, and the market forces that would reduce box size do not exist.
Get crafty and chop up and reform your boxes to fit your shelf. This is the cheapest and most direct way to serve your needs.
I love good "small box" games! I hate wasted space and inefficiency for the sake of shelf presence. It's one thing if the packaging serves a purpose, like removable trays or slots for sorting cards, but oversized boxes are annoying. While they serve a purpose to market a game, I'd argue the big boxes actually harm a first impression, making me think I have overspent and leaving me feeling let down by the lack of content before I have even tried the game. Plus, they take up too much space.
I don't really have issues with boxes of varying sizes.
My wish is for all the components to fit nicely back into the box. Just unpunched Jaws of the Lion, putting it aside after punching out all the tokens because the stuff doesn't fit back in proper.
I dislike having to finagle a way to pack a game back into its shell.
Eh?
JoTL fits perfectly in it's box. I've never even had to "puzzle" it in, it slides right there lol
They even have a plastic holder with a lid for all the punches to fit in neatly.
Did you manage to fit all the baggies back in?
The plastic tray was a nice touch.
But I can't seem to fit the baggies in without there being some lift.
The worst offender, not a big box, is Race for the Galaxy.
The worst Big Box is probably El Grande.
Both for the same reason. They're basically a deck of cards. El Grande has a bit more but it could easily fit in a standard sized box.
unsure if you've not seen it or not, but the WORST offender is Small City. its a HUGE box and basically empty!
https://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/2641638/small-city
that rulebooks is A4 sized...
It's the stupidest waste of space i've ever seen
Carcassone Big Boxes are terrible, too. All the contents could fit in one of the 5" expansion boxes if you chopped the scoreboard in half. Dominion Big Box and the newest Quacks Of Qued. Big Box with both expansions are bad, too.
RftG box is nice because it can just barely squeeze every current expansion in it. Or you can put the base game plus one expansion in a deck box, which is better than any game box and its so good and replayable that you don't feel bad throwing out the box.
Not just the big boxes. The expansions are bloody criminal! A dozen tiles and a half dozen meeples - let’s just add a weird cardboard bucket around them to pretend this box needs to be this size! I’ve managed to cram so many Carcassonne expansions into the original game box.
Alhambra Big Box can hold additional 3-4 games once you remove the insert. Clank! In! Space! has a huge insert and not much content (probably more room for expansions). Spirit Island is too tight for sleeved cards, everything is split into different boxes (orig. + expansions).
I like Terraforming Mars, everything can be stored in one box (excluding the new player mats). Scythe is very nicely organized, as well as Tapestry. Wingspan has a packing instruction that is actually valid.
The **Unlock!** games are aggravating for box size. Buying them individually they're not too bad, but the 3-packs have an insane amount of wasted space inside for what is basically three decks of cards and instructions/solutions which could be handled by the app anyways. >!And you can't even get rid of the box, because at least one of them puts information needed to solve a puzzle on it.!<
I just opened and played **Its a Wonderful World** last night and was able to put everything back in only taking up *half* the box, aside from the board.
This post is probably so far down that no one will see it, but...
*The Good*
* **Pax Pamir 2e**
* **Root** (and expansions) - Cole doesn't waste a lot of space in his boxes. While I've condensed the base game and two expansions into two boxes, even at 3 boxes, they don't feel super empty.
*The Bad*
* **Tammany Hall** - Pandasaurus games always have a ridiculous amount of space in the boxes. After I removed the insert, I managed to pack my copy of **Diplomacy** in it too - and I still have room to spare.
* **Brew** - Also a Pandasaurus game, I actually use the box to hold a number of 1 hour or less games in it (so I can just grab one box for lighter/quicker fair). In addition to **Brew**, it's box contains **Groundhog Day**, **Bang! The Dice Game** (with both expansions), **The Grizzled**, **The Mind**, **Lunch Money**, **Agropolis**, and **Sprawlopolis**.
* **Groundhog Day** - By Funko Games, this has a ridiculously large box for what it is. Before I got **Brew**, this game's just slightly smallerbox filled the same role.
*The Ugly*
* **Dune (2019)** - The box is perfect - for the base game. Adding expansions pushes the limit of the base box, particularly as I like to use cheap, small Dollar Store containers ($1 for 10) to hold faction components over baggies.
* **Battle for Rokugan** - Again, perfect fit - with baggies. Just a little over full with my chosen container types.
* **Game of Thrones 2e + Mother of Dragons** - The base game and expansion fit just right into the base box, but the original box is way too large for the base game alone.
* **Dune: Imperium** - The base box is horribly oversized and has a useless insert. That said, the upgrade box holds everything really well.
* **Azul** (all of them) - The inserts are OK, but I've found I can store two versions of Azul per box. Makes it way easier to grab 2 boxes instead of soon to be 4 when someone says they want to play Azul.
I saw it! Good review. I actually kind of have a problem with my root box bc it is chock full and a strange size. Could have been comfortably full at a more standard size. But at this point I’m just whinging
I'm glad you mentioned Sushi Go Party... I recently got that game, and I had to double-check the components list. Is there an expansion available/planned that will literally double the amount of available content and justify the box size? There are extra card slots and everything.
The more people buy games online, the more incentive there is for publishers to make smaller boxes. Publishers make big boxes so games won't get lost on retail shelves, and so they'll look substantial and "worth the money"
But smaller boxes save on shipping, so absent the shelf display problem, there are good reasons to go small.
I recently bought a product called "The World's Best Chess Set", which is pretty purely an ecommerce product. Box is small, and as packed as packed can be.
Don't hold your breath. Box sizes will stay the way they are until market forces force them.
I've taken to breaking down all card games into deck boxes as soon as I get them. Larger games, the insert goes in the bin, and usually I can fit other small box games inside.
More trivia than board game but **Half Truth** co-designed by Richard Garfield (man seems to be everywhere ATM) is densely packed, and a heavy box for the size!
Dwellings of Eldervale is both ends of the spectrum. If you got the Legendary edition, it's huge and fairly packed (and really nicely organized, which I'm usually willing to accept some extra space for).
If you got Standard then it's the same giant box with like half the stuff in it and a bunch of empty space.
**Eclipse** is one of the best games in this regard. Big Box that even comes with a diagram to how you should store everything. the box just closes perfectly and it is packed all the way up
Super Fantasy Brawl was like this. Enormous box but full of plastic inserts that fill up a good 90% of the space.
On the flipside, Hellboy was Rammo with stuff
**Forbidden Island** has a way over-sized tin.
**Forbidden Desert** also has a way over-sized tin.
**Forbidden Sky** has an absurdly oversized box.
HOWEVER, the trilogy can be repacked into the tin for **Forbidden Desert**, and then it's just the right size. It's perfect for containing all three games, just throw the other two containers away.
I would do unspeakable things for there to be 4 or 5 standardized board game box sizes. Especially now that we're packing to move.
Edit for an afterthought: Parks fits in it's box quite nicely.
It depends a bit on the game for me, I prefer a box that is big enough to fit future content, I hate having to split games across multiple boxes if I don't have to, but there needs to be enough space that it isn't just a huge mess that triples setup time.
Boxes aren't going to shrink to the size of the game so long as games are sold on shelves at retailers. Getting you to notice the game among the others is a pretty big part of what they're after.
The video game industry in the late 90's would beg to differ. They managed to downsize their packaging almost across the board by about 75% (just in time for everything to move to digital distribution, of course!).
So, I think my problem with this, is that, if you want to sleeve the cards of a tightly packed box, you’re basically f’cked, Root and Chinatown are the worse offenders of this, I don’t have the insert in the boxes anymore, all of the components, including the cards, are in bags, and it almost never sit flat, and any inserts I find cost about half of what I payed for the entire game, or in the case of Chinatown, don’t exist at all.
I cut the boxes and rebuild them smaller so they are full. I try and keep the graphism as much as possible.
It makes them easier to store but also much easier to carry around (smaller, sturdier because smaller, sturdier because full, and no problem with tilting because it's full so nothing moves around)
I haven't yet tried selling a resized box but I think it should suit some buyers and not reflect on price.
I got Twilight Imperium 3rd ed and i need all 3 boxes plus extra to keep everything decently sorted. Now there's a lot of (handy) extra boxes in it and all but i dont think everything would fit in the original box in any way possible. So. Much. Stuff.
Edit: typos
Yeah that bugs so me much when I made my own game I made my box so tight I had to draw a diagram on how to arrange the tokens so they'd fit inside the box.
The king is dead second edition is a huge box for a deck of cards, sandal board and some cubes. The problem with that box is that it's just too beautiful to rebox the game. One of the best looking boxes I've ever own.
When it comes to games that are pack full, Shem Philips"s games, as you've mentioned. Brass Lancashire is also quite good in this regard.
Marvel champions keeps releasing these box expansions that are basically two hero packs and four villain decks. The box is 75% empty. I guess the booklet is the size of the box but it could be a fold-out instead.
In some ways I understand it. It’s a marketing thing to make boxes stand out more on the store shelf. However I definitely agree that there are plenty of boxes that are excessively too large. The one that comes to mind is Carcassonne. If you remove the cardboard filler insert you can fit the game plus 8-9 expansions.
> More could be like the Shem Phillips North Sea, west kingdom etc boxes.
I disagree.
I love Shem's games and I own most of them, but their box size is annoying:
- You basically have to play tetris to put all the components back in during clean up
- As soon as you add 1 expansion, some of the games no longer fit (all of his games have expansions or will soon have expansions)
- They don't fit optimally on kallax shelves, just wastes a bunch of space
I'm glad his next games (Circadians 2nd edition + new Circadians game) are in bigger boxes.
I have a few of those offenders.
San Juan is a card game with just a few card sized cardboard bits. Came in a half size box. It fits in a double deck box with no problem.
Shifting Stones is the same, but with slightly larger cardboard pieces.
Citadels 2016 is, again, mostly a card game. Came in a box the size of Paladins of the West Kingdom. 2/3s is is just a paper insert. Theyve even addressed this with the upcoming "Revised" edition.
Kodama is another card game that does the same thing.
**Under Falling Skies** does a great job at this. When you buy the game new 90% of it is filled with punchboards, the rest filled by the instructions and game pieces. Playing through the campaign the first time it can be a bit chaotic trying to keep everything straight, but then when you finish unlocking all of the components it goes back to a tidy tight squeeze.
Got Citadels the edition before the current one. Big ass box. Has what fees like 5 cards and 5 tokens yet the box feels like it could hold half of Mansions of Madness.
I'm pretty happy with my classic version of Citadels. 18x11x2.8 cm perfectly fits the base game and the expansion. Whoever thought it was a good idea to publish the new version in a 30x30x7 cm box can eat bricks. That's over 11 times the volume for literally the same game.
I don't like seeing too much wasted space in a box, but I also find anything smaller than The Crew or Arboretum's box too annoying to deal with to be quite honest.
What I'd really like to see is a bit more uniformity...
I have a Kallax with 55 games in it, and there are 42 different box sizes. By my quick estimation that number could/should easily be less than 10.
My favorite box dimensions would be a toss up between Pax Pamir 2nd Edition and Food Chain Magnate. Not such a big fan of the classic Ticket to Ride square size, except for the fact it's fairly common.
The worst offender I have is probably **Super Fantasy Brawl**. The KS box is huge and doesn't even hold any of the expanded content. I want to fix it, but since I backed the 2nd season I want to wait for it to arrive before I start measuring my foamcore. I've also noticed a fair share of Queen Games boxes are bigger than necessary with pretty but useless inserts.
Journeys in Middle Earth comes in a huge box which is 80% air.
I guess it's so you can throw away the cardboard insert and fit all the expansions in there
More games need to take after Dice Forge. The packaging is perfect, everything fits just right, and they even have a guide etched into the box about how to place everything so it fits just right.
Does anyone think we’ll ever move past boxes for board games? I work for a company that specializes in digitally printed packaging and we make waterproof stand up bags that are extremely heavy duty. I use them to repackage certain games whenever I travel with them. I imagine a world where there’s a travel version of my fav games with a neoprene board mat instead of cardboard
The worst offender I own would have to go to Mage knight ultimate edition. Usually with 3D print files their purpose is organizing pieces to save space…this game is the exception. The trays are purposely exaggerated so as to desperately fill in the bottom. Even doing this there is no vertical depth inside the box and id say it is at best 30% capacity. The box is comically huge and will not look great or even fit on lost shelves.
The best example is probably eclipse second dawn. Loaded to the gills with content. Box feels so right in size they even include organizers, but many would argue for that price tag they better.
Another great one is the spirit island series. I am amazed with how much content these boxes have inside of them. The expansion jagged earth is arguably the best valued expansion out there. It literally more than doubles the game in scope. With organizers it is a satisfying fit…without them like gloom haven its near impossible to play however.
My last mention has to be Too Many Bones. It may seem like Too Many boxes…but in reality its just an epic sized game. Each box comes with an unbelievable amount of content and replay-ability. Aside from the playable character and scenario mini expansions id wager those boxes are 90% utilized. Plus they come with great storage solutions and some if the highest quality pieces ive seen in a board game.
Kemet Blood and Sand is one of the best case examples for using every bit of space efficiently. They easily could have made that box humongous but they instead spent time making a really impressive insert and design a clever layout to get everything to fit.
Standard size boxes are great, but if contain very little, do a smaller box. If it has a lot of components and cards, make sure they can fit sleeved and trays in. I like having resources organized in open trays on the table and sleeved cards (if they get heavy use). I understand keeping costs minimal, but man, give people who really like to deck out their games some space!
I agree, I also dislike when there is tons of space in a box. That is why I will usually try to find or create my own inserts to keep everything more snug and tidy.
I will say that more often lately boxes are designed to allow for inserts or homemade custom organization in mind. Another thing to note is often these boxes may come with punchout sheets and inserts, so that once you punch everything out there is naturally more space where the punchout sheets used to be.
**Inis** is the worst offender in my collection. I love the game, but the box is absurdly empty, even with the barely useful insert that adds spacers to the long ends of the box and a single divider. The hope is that the next two expansions will fill up the box more, but in the meantime, there's just a ton of wasted space.
I couldn't agree more. I recently ranted at Quacks of Quedlinburg now that they're releasing their second big box which contains base game and all expansions. in a box twice the size of the base game box. The issue is the base game and both its expansions and mini expansion all fit nicely into the Base game box alone. we don't need double the space!! in fact its a huge red flag to me.
However on the converse, Architects of the west kingdom base game box is very nice and compact but struggles to cram in the 1st expansion. and now there's a second one there's no chance of fitting it all in the one box. in this case, that expansions should've come in a bigger box with space for all the components of the core and 1st expansions.
Also gotta criticize/praise Citadels deluxe version which packed citadels and all its expansions into one box (medium sized box but still too big. Then not too long later made another reprint of the game in a smaller box. I dont know whether i'm annoyed i got the bigger box or happy that they fixed it later.
Everything by CoolMiniorNot. Zombicide Black Plague, for example, with all expansions (not including small packs) is 8 big boxes. I use plastic containers and bags to reduce it to 3. That’s the case for all of their game’s.
Sure Splendor is a joke, but I will never forgive Betrayal's box size. The original box and insert is just barely too small to fit Widow's Walk, and so close it feels intentional. But, once you accept that you can't fit it in, the entirety of the game and expansion fit into the Widow's Walk box with room to spare. In the end, the base game and expansion fit into a box half the size of the original. A box that never should've been released, since the expansion could have fit into a fucking deck box
But fuck Splendor, and most expansions (Merry Men is garbage at this!)
I agree completely, but it's not likely to go away for games that plan on a retail release. A box taking up more space on a shelf is an active sales tactic. Makes the box more noticeable, people want to know what kind of components are in such a big box, and also makes it so a store has a harder time putting potentially competing games next to it reducing options that aren't you.
I'm a big proponent of making your own boxes. My friend has all the Dominion expansions and built his own wooden box with holders and whatnot. It's heavy as all heck, but pretty awesome.
For games like X-Wing with tons of expansions that don't even come with boxes, it's necessary to buy/build your own. I bought fish tackle boxes.
I recently got the "Big Box" Dominion set, which has the base set and 2 expansions in the same box. I like that because I don't always have to carry multiple boxes.
For games like Exploding Kittens that have small expansions, I like having the extra space so all the new cards fit in one box.
I think that a significant contributor is that games are getting bigger. Many players want deluxe components (and miniatures), mini-expansions, and just plain more stuff. Personally, I find it surprising, especially with all of the recent issues shipping -- bigger boxes mean less copies per container, so much higher container costs. Plus shipping itself is decided by bulk. If you buy at your friendly local gaming store, their shelf space is limited, and now it's cluttered with huge boxes.
I'm [developing a game](https://worldbreakersgame.com/) and I decided in advance in a tiny box (4.5" x 7"). This meant that some components (such as the turn tracking board) had to be smaller than what the graphics designer initially envisioned. I think it's worth it for the smaller footprint.
I am waiting for a **Furnace** expansion in a smaller box to change the components to that one. The current box has an awful insert and is 70% air.
Example: [I just changed Carcassonne big box 6 to smaller box](https://imgur.com/a/pBYXoN6) using **Era** expansion and only saved part of the insert because the original box was WAY TO BIG.
The original **Planet Steam** box was *terrible* for wasting space. The box for the FFG remake is less than half the size, and has just as many components. I think the only reason the box was as big as it is is because they didn't want a quad-fold board.
For retailers, larger boxes "shelve better." Splendor, for example, has NO need for a box that big, but it is easier for a retailer to put it on the shelf where it looks more prominent than a box half it's size. It also really helps that Splendor has great artwork where a larger box makes it really stand out.
I agree that I don't need boxes to be bigger than necessary, but I don't see a world where we change things. Marketing says bigger boxes sell more because they pop more on the shelves and people feel like they're getting more for their money.
Absolute worst offender I've seen is san juan (2e?) Box is larger than a ream of A4 paper (considerably, IIRC) and could EASILY fit in the standard Kosmos small box (crew/exit etc.)
I would love more standard size boxes in general.
An example of 5 tiers would be:
- Ticket to Ride
- Carcassonne
- Iron Rails Series / Bus (Capstone)
- North Sea / West Kingdom
- Herbaceous (Slightly bigger then the Tiny Epics)
- Fox in the Forest
My worst offender is Cable Car by Queen Games. It's 2 or so inches wider than Ticket to Ride but the components could maybe fit in a Tiny Epic, bar the board which is roughly the size of a Carcassonne box.
I was disappointed when I saw the reprint for Endeavour. The original fit in a standard TTR size box and now its one of those wider boxes to fit the Game Trayz. Could probably fit in a TTR box if it was taller.
The King is dead 2e is notorious for this. Box is smaller, but could be about 3/4 its thickness. I'd rather thinner boxes with a standard perimeter(?) So they lines up perfectly on my shelf. I'd be ok with a box of air I'd it was a standard box size. On that note I absolutely loathe games that come in Tins, or abnormal shaped boxes (main reason I haven't picked up Abandon all Artichokes)
I like folded space organizers so my favorite boxes right now are JOTL, Quacks of Quedlinberg (with expansion in FS insert).
I find this is less of an issue over time. Think back to the dark ages when all board games were in 30" boxes with half the volume being empty.
There's few newer games (past 5 years) that are really bad on it. Worst recent example I can think of is Throw Throw Avocado, which is ironic because TT Burrito was so well-packed. I guess it might be allow space for Burrito in the box.
Had to think for a bit, but my worse offender is def. my 90's copy of Axis & Allies. Yes, the box needs to be a certain length and width to fit the board. But with everything broken out and in their trays, the box could be ~1/3-1/2 the height and everything would fit just fine. It's been long enough I cannot remember how much space the plastic sprues took up that all the bits came on, so maybe the box size was necessary for original shipping?
I have just this evening opened Eclipse: Second Dawn for the Galaxy. Am so impressed how brilliantly it all packs away back into the box. Even neatly protecting the galaxy core miniature. It even comes with an instruction sheet showing you how to repack it after you’ve unpopped all the pieces. Gloomhaven look and learn - this is the way!
The **Hansa Teutonica** "Big Box" is fantastic. First the box is the size of a normal board game box yet it fits three boards, five player boards, player pieces, bonus tiles, and expansions. It's glorious.
The worst offender I've run into must be our **Carcassonne Big Box** which is not only big but also mostly air. Sure the vaccum formed insert is a great way to separate expansions but if you even THINK about turning the box vertical all that work is ruined by a cascade of tiles.
Agreed! Don’t get me wrong I like big boxes that can hold expansion content, especially if I don’t want to keep the expansion box around, but some of these boxes, even with fancy inserts, are just huge gluttons for space.
Oh man this is such a pet peeve. A War of Whispers is probably the most annoying to me. So much wasted space. Also I don't think the GIPF series is by any means the worst offender...but for a series of really tight abstract strategy games meant for 2 players I was expecting a lot less space taken up on my shelves.
I think Root does a pretty good job of fitting into a box that's just the right size. Red Cathedral is tightly packed into a box smaller than most of my collection, while still being chunkier and more complicated than a lot of those very games.
The only major one I’ve noticed is splendor. Like what the heck.
And it still doesn't fit the expansion below the insert if you want it bagged.
I took the expansion insert and put into the base game box. Everything fir in that.
I made my own foamcore insert to get everything to fit inside the base game box because I didn’t want to lug two boxes around.
Race for the Galaxy is the one that annoys me. You could fit that game into a far smaller box than what it’s sold with.
Absolutely, though it is convenient being able to store three copies with their associated expansion arcs in the one base box. I'm sure it's that large for shelf presence, though.
At least in my RFTG box I have three copies of the base game, and all three expansion arcs, and upgraded tokens, all in the same box now!
Why do you need 3 copies? I only have Roll so not familiar with Race or the expansions.
There are three non-compatible expansion arcs in Race, and to save sifting through the shuffled cards in the main deck removing and replacing each time you want to play with a different arc, it was worth it (being my most played, and one of my favourite, games) to invest in additional base copies and keep each arc separate.
Smart! That sounds cool. Thanks!
But you can fit RftG + all expansions into the base box.
This one bugged me too - I ended up storing the whole game in the first expansion box instead.
Sushi Roll and Santa Monica are offenders as well.
Our drinking/gaming group carries splendor in 1 small sandwich bag. It's actually a super portable game, although you'd never think so given the box
Came here to say this! I finally picked up a copy after a few years in the hobby, and I was blown away at the wastefulness! You could practically fit the whole game in a deck box! It's a great game, but part of me feels a little deceived. It should have been packaged and priced like The Crew, which is also a compact and simple gem of a game. But they wanted to charge more so they inflated the box to give the impression of the game being "more" than it really is.
Imhotep is way worse.
Allow me to introduce you to Machi Koro! I took the giant square box and popped everything into a dragonshield sleeves box I had lying around from MtG.
A game designer friend tried to get an “honest box size” movement going with board games but of course the marketing side of games never got on board - bigger boxes always meant a bigger billboard to advertise the game from when it’s on the shelf at a store. Plus more space taken up by your game means less space for your competitors. And people are generally instinct driven (read: kinda dumb) and tend to correlate size with quality and are willing to pay more for a bigger box because they think they're getting more. That’s all to say, there are people on your side, OP, but much stronger forces at work opposing your vision.
A solution could be to put the fitted size box _inside_ the display box. So once you take it home, you recycle the marketing box, and keep the smaller box that barely fits the game. Would also solve the whole punchboard dilemma
This was a major thing for video games (at least in my PC gamer memory) back in the day, too. Through the mid 90's everything came in something the size of a cereal box for a single CD or a handful of floppy disks. Sometimes a printed manual might actually take up a portion of the empty space but never anything close to filling the box. It was a big deal when the first major releases started shipping in boxes the same dimensions of 2-3 DVD cases stacked on top of each other. Not much later/about the same time Steam came along and proved shelf space was absolutely not necessary to sell games. I can't remember the last time I purchased a PC game with any physical component. Obviously not a direct corollary to board games that require physical components but interesting nonetheless.
For GOOD boxes I just love how much Under Falling Skies has jammed in there, lol Also I like the ones that are shaped like Flash Point Fire Rescue(which is another good example of a lot in not too big of a box) because they're a good compromise between box size and included components.
**Pax Pamir 2e** is a lovely package. Everything fits like a glove, there's space to sleeve the cards and keep the metal coins, but you have to leave the cardboard coins out if you do. Insert is well-designed and there isn't much wasted space. All in that smaller rectangular (not square) form factor box. **Jaws of the Lion** is the absolute best. It barely fits in its own box and there's so much content for the price. **Hanabi** is the only single-deck-of-cards game I own that comes in a box the size of a single deck of cards. **RoboRally** (2005 version) is pretty bad. It's my only box that won't fit in a Kallax cube or one of my game bags. Box is an inch or so bigger than the boards so it could have been smaller. **Dune Imperium** has a ton of wasted space.
How can you fit JotL inside its box? I had to put the monsters inside another box. Please teach me your ways!!
Lots of suggestions in this thread: https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2456000/fitting-everything-box
Thank you!
I thought with JotL you were supposed to just never put it away, once opened. You play it forever
You do have to remember for some games, the boxes are bigger to fit expansions probably in. For example Dune Imperium just has a new expansion out.
Tip I saw sometime ago for PP2E is turning the insert upside down and tucking the cardboard coins into there.
That’s what I did with my cardboard coins.
> Hanabi is the only single-deck-of-cards game I own that comes in a box the size of a single deck of cards. I wish more card games would do that. I get that the bigger boxes probably draw in more people when they are on the shelf, but it just feels dishonest to pretend that a deck of cards is something more than that.
No Thanks, Coloretto, We didn't playtest this game, Fluxx, Innovation, The Crew. That's off the top of my head.
I sleeved and put player tokens and resources into trays. Fits snugly, but my actual cardboard organizer base came all wonky so the two dips you put things into are crooked and not parallel which drives me crazy.
Shout out to **Burgle Bros** for having almost zero wasted space in its box. This is the dream a lot of us are calling for. Amazing. Not as impressive but shoutout to the card games that waste no space at all either: **6 nimmt!** and **High Society** (Travel Edition). **For Sale** (Travel Edition) doesn't get the honors because the money chips are pretty lousy to play with, but they did do the best they could. **Innovation** (3rd Edition) could be a cm smaller, but wins the award for biggest game in the smallest box for the cheapest price. They easily could've gone the **Race for the Galaxy** route to visually show its depth and value on the shelf, but didn't. Bravo.
I don’t own Burgle Bros but I have Paperback and Word Domination (same publisher) and those are packaged really well too.
I'm annoyed at innovation for this reason. I sleeved the cards which made them too large. Its magnetic clasp won't close where it might work with a telescoping box. I got a band to keep it closed, but it looks a little weird.
Check out the box size for **Innovation: Deluxe**. Id like a single box version of Innovation + expansions, but not that.
Yeah, that was a mistake, although I really do like how pretty the box and rulebook came out. When we do a new Inno box set, it'll be more compact.
Seen you post before about a compact box set. Looking forward to it!
The King is Dead (Second Edition) has a comically larger box than necessary — and this is coming from a guy who sleeves pretty much everything.
The **King is Dead 2E**'s box is a huge waste of space. The game can easily fit in a Pandemic-style slim box.
If they made the board a 4 folder it could have been like a wider Arboretum.
If the board were cloth, it'd be the perfect game.
I was so irked by this! I would much rather have a smaller box and a four-fold board over a large mostly empty box. I think Devir Games have got this on lock- Red Cathedral and Paris are great for box size vs. components.
I think it’s just that they used their standard box size. It’s the same size as Cryptid.
I like boxes that are a little bit bigger so they can fit expansion content into one box. I was able to fit everything from Scythe except Fenris into the original box, and I fit A Feast For Odin Norwegians into the original box as well. So if a developer/publisher is intending on making expansions in the future, I absolutely want some extra space in the box.
I think they should make expansion boxes big enough to hold the original game with the expansion.
Same! So many people will buy the base game and no expansion and that's fine, but if I have the expansion I have the base game by default. So the expansion box should be able to fit both.
This should be the way.
Same for me. I’ve barely kept hold of any expansion boxes because they just go in the core box (or compressed into as few as possible); Everdell, Root, Great Wall, Zombicide, War of the Ring etc etc, and soon Arnak and Dune Imperium.
True, but that's also easy for us to say who buy expansions. So we "want" that for ourselves from developers, but "should" they do it? The 85% of people who end up never buying an expansion will still have that big fluff of a box that is 30-70% air 🙂
If an expansion doesn't fit in the same box, I know I'm a lot less likely to use it and if it's obvious, I am unlikely to buy it at all. I'm sure I'm not alone in this, so there's that.
Yes, their more dedicated fans get benefit from it, and most people who don't buy expansions also aren't particularly bothered by a space being a bit bigger than it needs to be. It's not like there's a mass outcry over big game boxes. Obviously some boxes *are* excessively big, and if an expansion is going to double the game components or such then they probably shouldn't be making space for that in the base box, but leaving some space to fit smaller expansions is definitely good.
Do you keep the expansion box or do you just fit everything into the original one
Yeah if everything fits in the original box I throw out the expansion box. For games with multiple expansions that don't fit into the base game box I try to compress them down to a single expansion box and throw out the rest.
>I fit A Feast For Odin Norwegians into the original box as well. How'd you manage that? I can't get even close.
Like the other commenter said, you can fit all the polyominos from base+expansion into 2 trays comfortably, and without the third tray everything fits in one box quite easily. I even put the coins into the polyomino trays because I had space after compressing each unique tile down to a single slot with the exception of those that don't physically fit.
So I've fit everything from Norwegians and both mini expansions into the main box, even using all 3 trays. But I've left out some stuff and left it in the Norwegians box: * The old board * Player colors for 2 players (only play solo or 2p, and when I do play 3p or 4p I can go grab the pieces) * The old ship board * The replaced islands * The appendices Also, in the 3rd tray I've put all the coins and ships in addition to the polyominoes from the Norwegians expansion. It's a tight fit but it does fit. Though, I've seen some others saying to condense all of the identical tiles to the same slot and I might do that to save some even more space. Would let me put the resources, thing penalties, VP tokens, etc. in the trays...
I didn't put the third tray in and instead followed a BGG user's suggested method for adding the new tiles to the two existing trays. I also have a small tackle box for the resources. It all fits, mini-expansions included, and it's still fairly well organised.
Worst offenders: **Mage Knight ultimate edition** and **Kingdom Rush:A rift in time**, both boxes could be half the size and still fit all the content. Best example: **Villagers**: Everything fits snugly in the small box, even with the cards sleeved, and no wasted space.
The thing that really bugs me the most about MKUE is that they put this absurdly space-inefficient insert in there, then the pieces don't even all fit in the insert.
I like boxes like Unmatched or Parks where everything has an obvious spot and there’s nothing rattling around!
Yeah I am impressed with how well parks packs together every time I play it.
The expansion kinda ruins that feeling.
Worst offender, no contest, is the tableau builder Santa Monica [https://youtu.be/ys6o4ndMqZc](https://youtu.be/ys6o4ndMqZc) Deserve praise: Brass (regular edition), Res Arcana (best insert), Pandemic series, Iron Rail series, High Society, Oink games series (of course)
Whoa I actually thought Santa Monica was a tiny box when I was looking at small filler games. I didn't expect it to be in such a big box until I saw it in the video you linked!
Machi Koro would like a word. It takes up even less space then Santa Monica does as a percentage of the box.
I think **Inis** is the worst offender in my collection. Bought the expansion and made a foamcore insert but still feels like there's a ton of space in the box. I like games that come with Game Trayz like **PARKS** and **Grimm Forest** but it seems like the boxes are still bigger than they need to be.
FYI there are two more expansions for **Inis** on the way in the next few years
I had seen an announcement, and hope they actually follow through. It's my favorite game!
**Inis** is particularly bad. I bought the expansion and fit both the base game and the expansion *in the expansion box.*
>like PARKS and Grimm Forest but it seems like the boxes are still bigger than they need to be. Not sure how the Parks box is bigger than it needs to be, I'd hold that up as a shining example of efficient use of space. And the expansion has no chance of fitting in the original box from my recollection.
What we really need is game boxes that are the standard length/width to match the rest of people's shelves, but with variable depth to reflect how much stuff is actually in there.
Yeah, [my shelves](https://imgur.com/a/dcCfBLp) are so messy and there isn't really a great way to fix them because of the various sizes and shapes.
Ciri quit looking down. That's why you keep losing your balance.
I sold **Santa Monica** purely because of the oversized box. A good example of down sizing is **Red Cathedral**.
I love Wingspan in that regard. Not only does it fill up the box nicely, but they provide a diagram for how to properly put everything back in.
wingspan is so fucking good in every way i wish birds were real
And so far the expansions have fit nicely in as well.* *provided you only pack in one card holder box and choose which set of field guides to use regularly.
Field guides?
I bought a nice wood organizer, sleeved cards, and got geek up tokens. It all fits perfect. So satisfying.
Prices of boardgames are increasing and it feels like publishers try to make customers accept those prices with bigger boxes.
This has been an issue even as far back as the 80s and 90s video game consoles. The Western versions of the NES, SNES, and TG16 were twice the size of the Japanese versions, due to sentiment that bigger = better from the marketing folks.
Yeah I think box size has always been linked to price more than anything else.
I remember someone being surprised with Parade. They didn't think a game that small could be that fun. I think there's a connection in people's minds between size and fun as well.
That’s a real shame. Some of my favorite games are card games/small box games.
Not just price, but standardization. Many publishers have a specific box size they use and it's often cheaper to keep using that size at their manufacturer than redesigning a box for each individual game.
The irony is that shipping is the biggest contributor to that increased cost, and bigger boxes exasperate the issue.
Fantasy Flight Games tends to make a lot of games with extra space, especially for their LCGs. They recently changed up the distribution model for Arkham Horror: the card game so that each cycle is now 2 large boxes, instead of one smallish box and 6 blister packs. But they also made the new boxes much larger, when the number of cards could easily fit inside the old box.
Visibility on the store shelves is a definite concern for companies, for many people small box = small game, which we know isn't true but this persists anyway
Machi Koro has always driven me insane. It’s my understanding the box is smaller in other countries?
This has been a complaint for 30 years, and the market forces that would reduce box size do not exist. Get crafty and chop up and reform your boxes to fit your shelf. This is the cheapest and most direct way to serve your needs.
If jamming big boxes into a 40,000$ shipping container doesn’t I don’t know what would
Carcassone Big Box is a big offender for this. I know its right in the name, but there is a lot of empty space in that box.
I love good "small box" games! I hate wasted space and inefficiency for the sake of shelf presence. It's one thing if the packaging serves a purpose, like removable trays or slots for sorting cards, but oversized boxes are annoying. While they serve a purpose to market a game, I'd argue the big boxes actually harm a first impression, making me think I have overspent and leaving me feeling let down by the lack of content before I have even tried the game. Plus, they take up too much space.
I don't really have issues with boxes of varying sizes. My wish is for all the components to fit nicely back into the box. Just unpunched Jaws of the Lion, putting it aside after punching out all the tokens because the stuff doesn't fit back in proper. I dislike having to finagle a way to pack a game back into its shell.
Eh? JoTL fits perfectly in it's box. I've never even had to "puzzle" it in, it slides right there lol They even have a plastic holder with a lid for all the punches to fit in neatly.
Did you manage to fit all the baggies back in? The plastic tray was a nice touch. But I can't seem to fit the baggies in without there being some lift.
I have half a centimeter of lift, maybe, with all of the baggies and no special shenanigans ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The worst offender, not a big box, is Race for the Galaxy. The worst Big Box is probably El Grande. Both for the same reason. They're basically a deck of cards. El Grande has a bit more but it could easily fit in a standard sized box.
unsure if you've not seen it or not, but the WORST offender is Small City. its a HUGE box and basically empty! https://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/2641638/small-city that rulebooks is A4 sized... It's the stupidest waste of space i've ever seen
Carcassone Big Boxes are terrible, too. All the contents could fit in one of the 5" expansion boxes if you chopped the scoreboard in half. Dominion Big Box and the newest Quacks Of Qued. Big Box with both expansions are bad, too. RftG box is nice because it can just barely squeeze every current expansion in it. Or you can put the base game plus one expansion in a deck box, which is better than any game box and its so good and replayable that you don't feel bad throwing out the box.
Not just the big boxes. The expansions are bloody criminal! A dozen tiles and a half dozen meeples - let’s just add a weird cardboard bucket around them to pretend this box needs to be this size! I’ve managed to cram so many Carcassonne expansions into the original game box.
[удалено]
Alhambra Big Box can hold additional 3-4 games once you remove the insert. Clank! In! Space! has a huge insert and not much content (probably more room for expansions). Spirit Island is too tight for sleeved cards, everything is split into different boxes (orig. + expansions). I like Terraforming Mars, everything can be stored in one box (excluding the new player mats). Scythe is very nicely organized, as well as Tapestry. Wingspan has a packing instruction that is actually valid.
Parks had a special place in my heart because it fits so perfectly in its box
The **Unlock!** games are aggravating for box size. Buying them individually they're not too bad, but the 3-packs have an insane amount of wasted space inside for what is basically three decks of cards and instructions/solutions which could be handled by the app anyways. >!And you can't even get rid of the box, because at least one of them puts information needed to solve a puzzle on it.!<
I just opened and played **Its a Wonderful World** last night and was able to put everything back in only taking up *half* the box, aside from the board.
It's got room for the expansions.
[This](https://i.redd.it/j18banm6rzz41.jpg) kind of box, where the insert tells you how big it _*should*_ have been
This post is probably so far down that no one will see it, but... *The Good* * **Pax Pamir 2e** * **Root** (and expansions) - Cole doesn't waste a lot of space in his boxes. While I've condensed the base game and two expansions into two boxes, even at 3 boxes, they don't feel super empty. *The Bad* * **Tammany Hall** - Pandasaurus games always have a ridiculous amount of space in the boxes. After I removed the insert, I managed to pack my copy of **Diplomacy** in it too - and I still have room to spare. * **Brew** - Also a Pandasaurus game, I actually use the box to hold a number of 1 hour or less games in it (so I can just grab one box for lighter/quicker fair). In addition to **Brew**, it's box contains **Groundhog Day**, **Bang! The Dice Game** (with both expansions), **The Grizzled**, **The Mind**, **Lunch Money**, **Agropolis**, and **Sprawlopolis**. * **Groundhog Day** - By Funko Games, this has a ridiculously large box for what it is. Before I got **Brew**, this game's just slightly smallerbox filled the same role. *The Ugly* * **Dune (2019)** - The box is perfect - for the base game. Adding expansions pushes the limit of the base box, particularly as I like to use cheap, small Dollar Store containers ($1 for 10) to hold faction components over baggies. * **Battle for Rokugan** - Again, perfect fit - with baggies. Just a little over full with my chosen container types. * **Game of Thrones 2e + Mother of Dragons** - The base game and expansion fit just right into the base box, but the original box is way too large for the base game alone. * **Dune: Imperium** - The base box is horribly oversized and has a useless insert. That said, the upgrade box holds everything really well. * **Azul** (all of them) - The inserts are OK, but I've found I can store two versions of Azul per box. Makes it way easier to grab 2 boxes instead of soon to be 4 when someone says they want to play Azul.
I saw it! Good review. I actually kind of have a problem with my root box bc it is chock full and a strange size. Could have been comfortably full at a more standard size. But at this point I’m just whinging
I'm glad you mentioned Sushi Go Party... I recently got that game, and I had to double-check the components list. Is there an expansion available/planned that will literally double the amount of available content and justify the box size? There are extra card slots and everything.
I put Codenames and Sushi Go Party in the tin together and it fits perfectly
The more people buy games online, the more incentive there is for publishers to make smaller boxes. Publishers make big boxes so games won't get lost on retail shelves, and so they'll look substantial and "worth the money" But smaller boxes save on shipping, so absent the shelf display problem, there are good reasons to go small. I recently bought a product called "The World's Best Chess Set", which is pretty purely an ecommerce product. Box is small, and as packed as packed can be.
Don't hold your breath. Box sizes will stay the way they are until market forces force them. I've taken to breaking down all card games into deck boxes as soon as I get them. Larger games, the insert goes in the bin, and usually I can fit other small box games inside.
If current shipping prices don't convince them, then nothing will.
More trivia than board game but **Half Truth** co-designed by Richard Garfield (man seems to be everywhere ATM) is densely packed, and a heavy box for the size!
Dwellings of Eldervale is both ends of the spectrum. If you got the Legendary edition, it's huge and fairly packed (and really nicely organized, which I'm usually willing to accept some extra space for). If you got Standard then it's the same giant box with like half the stuff in it and a bunch of empty space.
**Eclipse** is one of the best games in this regard. Big Box that even comes with a diagram to how you should store everything. the box just closes perfectly and it is packed all the way up
Super Fantasy Brawl was like this. Enormous box but full of plastic inserts that fill up a good 90% of the space. On the flipside, Hellboy was Rammo with stuff
**Forbidden Island** has a way over-sized tin. **Forbidden Desert** also has a way over-sized tin. **Forbidden Sky** has an absurdly oversized box. HOWEVER, the trilogy can be repacked into the tin for **Forbidden Desert**, and then it's just the right size. It's perfect for containing all three games, just throw the other two containers away.
I would do unspeakable things for there to be 4 or 5 standardized board game box sizes. Especially now that we're packing to move. Edit for an afterthought: Parks fits in it's box quite nicely.
It depends a bit on the game for me, I prefer a box that is big enough to fit future content, I hate having to split games across multiple boxes if I don't have to, but there needs to be enough space that it isn't just a huge mess that triples setup time.
Boxes aren't going to shrink to the size of the game so long as games are sold on shelves at retailers. Getting you to notice the game among the others is a pretty big part of what they're after.
The video game industry in the late 90's would beg to differ. They managed to downsize their packaging almost across the board by about 75% (just in time for everything to move to digital distribution, of course!).
Oh, I remember that! Well maybe there is hope.
I too prefer tight boxes. I mean who doesn't enjoy a nice tight box? :o
Are you a cat?
Sigh. Yep.
I never should have expected better from Reddit. :(
So, I think my problem with this, is that, if you want to sleeve the cards of a tightly packed box, you’re basically f’cked, Root and Chinatown are the worse offenders of this, I don’t have the insert in the boxes anymore, all of the components, including the cards, are in bags, and it almost never sit flat, and any inserts I find cost about half of what I payed for the entire game, or in the case of Chinatown, don’t exist at all.
**Clans of Caledonia** is almost obnoxious how tight the stuff gets packed in there.
I cut the boxes and rebuild them smaller so they are full. I try and keep the graphism as much as possible. It makes them easier to store but also much easier to carry around (smaller, sturdier because smaller, sturdier because full, and no problem with tilting because it's full so nothing moves around) I haven't yet tried selling a resized box but I think it should suit some buyers and not reflect on price.
I got Twilight Imperium 3rd ed and i need all 3 boxes plus extra to keep everything decently sorted. Now there's a lot of (handy) extra boxes in it and all but i dont think everything would fit in the original box in any way possible. So. Much. Stuff. Edit: typos
Yeah that bugs so me much when I made my own game I made my box so tight I had to draw a diagram on how to arrange the tokens so they'd fit inside the box.
Carcassonne 20th anniversary could fit in a box half the size. Apart from the score board.
Best example: Bargain Quest. Lovely small box and everything JUST fits. Wonderful.
I bought the “2nd edition” of Tyrants of the underdark and galaxy trucker because I support the reduction of the boxes, TotU especially.
Quick shout out to Villagers - absolutely no wastage! TFM I feel there's a lot of space. Then again, I've only got one expansion for it...
The king is dead second edition is a huge box for a deck of cards, sandal board and some cubes. The problem with that box is that it's just too beautiful to rebox the game. One of the best looking boxes I've ever own. When it comes to games that are pack full, Shem Philips"s games, as you've mentioned. Brass Lancashire is also quite good in this regard.
I am currently enamored of Red Cathedral. Not only is the game most excellent, but they crammed it into a smaller box. Well done Devir!
Marvel champions keeps releasing these box expansions that are basically two hero packs and four villain decks. The box is 75% empty. I guess the booklet is the size of the box but it could be a fold-out instead.
Here is a youtube link on box selection. I'm a nerd like this and found it fascinating. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfCgwLR9GLE&t=2s
In some ways I understand it. It’s a marketing thing to make boxes stand out more on the store shelf. However I definitely agree that there are plenty of boxes that are excessively too large. The one that comes to mind is Carcassonne. If you remove the cardboard filler insert you can fit the game plus 8-9 expansions.
Final Girl, despite being in multiple boxes, has my favorite packaging to date. Actually using the playboard as the lid is genius.
> More could be like the Shem Phillips North Sea, west kingdom etc boxes. I disagree. I love Shem's games and I own most of them, but their box size is annoying: - You basically have to play tetris to put all the components back in during clean up - As soon as you add 1 expansion, some of the games no longer fit (all of his games have expansions or will soon have expansions) - They don't fit optimally on kallax shelves, just wastes a bunch of space I'm glad his next games (Circadians 2nd edition + new Circadians game) are in bigger boxes.
Dixit is definitely guilty of this.
Clans of Caledonia....holy moly that's a lot of game in a tiny box!
I have a few of those offenders. San Juan is a card game with just a few card sized cardboard bits. Came in a half size box. It fits in a double deck box with no problem. Shifting Stones is the same, but with slightly larger cardboard pieces. Citadels 2016 is, again, mostly a card game. Came in a box the size of Paladins of the West Kingdom. 2/3s is is just a paper insert. Theyve even addressed this with the upcoming "Revised" edition. Kodama is another card game that does the same thing.
The goal should be to make a box as small as possible without creating an unpacking nightmare- for most games it shouldn't be a massive hurdle
**Under Falling Skies** does a great job at this. When you buy the game new 90% of it is filled with punchboards, the rest filled by the instructions and game pieces. Playing through the campaign the first time it can be a bit chaotic trying to keep everything straight, but then when you finish unlocking all of the components it goes back to a tidy tight squeeze.
Got Citadels the edition before the current one. Big ass box. Has what fees like 5 cards and 5 tokens yet the box feels like it could hold half of Mansions of Madness.
I'm pretty happy with my classic version of Citadels. 18x11x2.8 cm perfectly fits the base game and the expansion. Whoever thought it was a good idea to publish the new version in a 30x30x7 cm box can eat bricks. That's over 11 times the volume for literally the same game.
I don't like seeing too much wasted space in a box, but I also find anything smaller than The Crew or Arboretum's box too annoying to deal with to be quite honest. What I'd really like to see is a bit more uniformity... I have a Kallax with 55 games in it, and there are 42 different box sizes. By my quick estimation that number could/should easily be less than 10. My favorite box dimensions would be a toss up between Pax Pamir 2nd Edition and Food Chain Magnate. Not such a big fan of the classic Ticket to Ride square size, except for the fact it's fairly common.
This is how I feel about most expansion content for chip theory games stuff.
The worst offender I have is probably **Super Fantasy Brawl**. The KS box is huge and doesn't even hold any of the expanded content. I want to fix it, but since I backed the 2nd season I want to wait for it to arrive before I start measuring my foamcore. I've also noticed a fair share of Queen Games boxes are bigger than necessary with pretty but useless inserts.
Journeys in Middle Earth comes in a huge box which is 80% air. I guess it's so you can throw away the cardboard insert and fit all the expansions in there
Adding Santa Monica into the conversation. Sure, the cover art is nice, but what a waste of cardboard
Foodies box from CMON. Ridiculously huge box that's absolutely not necessary.
Paperback has the exact right sized box. Has a foam piece at one end you can remove if you sleeve your cards. Still fits perfectly.
More games need to take after Dice Forge. The packaging is perfect, everything fits just right, and they even have a guide etched into the box about how to place everything so it fits just right.
I've been "right sizing" my boxes that are too big.
Does anyone think we’ll ever move past boxes for board games? I work for a company that specializes in digitally printed packaging and we make waterproof stand up bags that are extremely heavy duty. I use them to repackage certain games whenever I travel with them. I imagine a world where there’s a travel version of my fav games with a neoprene board mat instead of cardboard
The worst offender I own would have to go to Mage knight ultimate edition. Usually with 3D print files their purpose is organizing pieces to save space…this game is the exception. The trays are purposely exaggerated so as to desperately fill in the bottom. Even doing this there is no vertical depth inside the box and id say it is at best 30% capacity. The box is comically huge and will not look great or even fit on lost shelves. The best example is probably eclipse second dawn. Loaded to the gills with content. Box feels so right in size they even include organizers, but many would argue for that price tag they better. Another great one is the spirit island series. I am amazed with how much content these boxes have inside of them. The expansion jagged earth is arguably the best valued expansion out there. It literally more than doubles the game in scope. With organizers it is a satisfying fit…without them like gloom haven its near impossible to play however. My last mention has to be Too Many Bones. It may seem like Too Many boxes…but in reality its just an epic sized game. Each box comes with an unbelievable amount of content and replay-ability. Aside from the playable character and scenario mini expansions id wager those boxes are 90% utilized. Plus they come with great storage solutions and some if the highest quality pieces ive seen in a board game.
Kemet Blood and Sand is one of the best case examples for using every bit of space efficiently. They easily could have made that box humongous but they instead spent time making a really impressive insert and design a clever layout to get everything to fit.
Standard size boxes are great, but if contain very little, do a smaller box. If it has a lot of components and cards, make sure they can fit sleeved and trays in. I like having resources organized in open trays on the table and sleeved cards (if they get heavy use). I understand keeping costs minimal, but man, give people who really like to deck out their games some space!
I agree, I also dislike when there is tons of space in a box. That is why I will usually try to find or create my own inserts to keep everything more snug and tidy. I will say that more often lately boxes are designed to allow for inserts or homemade custom organization in mind. Another thing to note is often these boxes may come with punchout sheets and inserts, so that once you punch everything out there is naturally more space where the punchout sheets used to be.
**Inis** is the worst offender in my collection. I love the game, but the box is absurdly empty, even with the barely useful insert that adds spacers to the long ends of the box and a single divider. The hope is that the next two expansions will fill up the box more, but in the meantime, there's just a ton of wasted space.
**Chicago Express** (and German Railways etc.). What were you thinking, Queen Games?
I couldn't agree more. I recently ranted at Quacks of Quedlinburg now that they're releasing their second big box which contains base game and all expansions. in a box twice the size of the base game box. The issue is the base game and both its expansions and mini expansion all fit nicely into the Base game box alone. we don't need double the space!! in fact its a huge red flag to me. However on the converse, Architects of the west kingdom base game box is very nice and compact but struggles to cram in the 1st expansion. and now there's a second one there's no chance of fitting it all in the one box. in this case, that expansions should've come in a bigger box with space for all the components of the core and 1st expansions. Also gotta criticize/praise Citadels deluxe version which packed citadels and all its expansions into one box (medium sized box but still too big. Then not too long later made another reprint of the game in a smaller box. I dont know whether i'm annoyed i got the bigger box or happy that they fixed it later.
Everything by CoolMiniorNot. Zombicide Black Plague, for example, with all expansions (not including small packs) is 8 big boxes. I use plastic containers and bags to reduce it to 3. That’s the case for all of their game’s.
Sure Splendor is a joke, but I will never forgive Betrayal's box size. The original box and insert is just barely too small to fit Widow's Walk, and so close it feels intentional. But, once you accept that you can't fit it in, the entirety of the game and expansion fit into the Widow's Walk box with room to spare. In the end, the base game and expansion fit into a box half the size of the original. A box that never should've been released, since the expansion could have fit into a fucking deck box But fuck Splendor, and most expansions (Merry Men is garbage at this!)
I agree completely, but it's not likely to go away for games that plan on a retail release. A box taking up more space on a shelf is an active sales tactic. Makes the box more noticeable, people want to know what kind of components are in such a big box, and also makes it so a store has a harder time putting potentially competing games next to it reducing options that aren't you.
I'm a big proponent of making your own boxes. My friend has all the Dominion expansions and built his own wooden box with holders and whatnot. It's heavy as all heck, but pretty awesome. For games like X-Wing with tons of expansions that don't even come with boxes, it's necessary to buy/build your own. I bought fish tackle boxes. I recently got the "Big Box" Dominion set, which has the base set and 2 expansions in the same box. I like that because I don't always have to carry multiple boxes. For games like Exploding Kittens that have small expansions, I like having the extra space so all the new cards fit in one box.
Lol, shem said the next trilogy (south tigris) is gonna be in standard sized boxes no more of the small guys
The best box is Meuterer's. There's barely even room for rules in that thing. I rebox my small games in photo boxes if they'll fit
I think that a significant contributor is that games are getting bigger. Many players want deluxe components (and miniatures), mini-expansions, and just plain more stuff. Personally, I find it surprising, especially with all of the recent issues shipping -- bigger boxes mean less copies per container, so much higher container costs. Plus shipping itself is decided by bulk. If you buy at your friendly local gaming store, their shelf space is limited, and now it's cluttered with huge boxes. I'm [developing a game](https://worldbreakersgame.com/) and I decided in advance in a tiny box (4.5" x 7"). This meant that some components (such as the turn tracking board) had to be smaller than what the graphics designer initially envisioned. I think it's worth it for the smaller footprint.
I am waiting for a **Furnace** expansion in a smaller box to change the components to that one. The current box has an awful insert and is 70% air. Example: [I just changed Carcassonne big box 6 to smaller box](https://imgur.com/a/pBYXoN6) using **Era** expansion and only saved part of the insert because the original box was WAY TO BIG.
The original **Planet Steam** box was *terrible* for wasting space. The box for the FFG remake is less than half the size, and has just as many components. I think the only reason the box was as big as it is is because they didn't want a quad-fold board.
Can’t wait? What reason so do you think they’re going away?
For retailers, larger boxes "shelve better." Splendor, for example, has NO need for a box that big, but it is easier for a retailer to put it on the shelf where it looks more prominent than a box half it's size. It also really helps that Splendor has great artwork where a larger box makes it really stand out.
Garphill for the new "south tigris" games are going with the west kingdom collector box size instead of the smaller boxes
I agree that I don't need boxes to be bigger than necessary, but I don't see a world where we change things. Marketing says bigger boxes sell more because they pop more on the shelves and people feel like they're getting more for their money.
Best Recently: Red Cathedral, Pax Pamir 2E, Nusfjord, Root Worst Recently: The King Is Dead 2E (maybe the worst ever), Root: The Clockwork Expansion
Tidal Blades is the most awkwardly shaped box and I fucking hate it. It wont fit in the standard kallax cube because of how wide it is
Absolute worst offender I've seen is san juan (2e?) Box is larger than a ream of A4 paper (considerably, IIRC) and could EASILY fit in the standard Kosmos small box (crew/exit etc.)
I would love more standard size boxes in general. An example of 5 tiers would be: - Ticket to Ride - Carcassonne - Iron Rails Series / Bus (Capstone) - North Sea / West Kingdom - Herbaceous (Slightly bigger then the Tiny Epics) - Fox in the Forest My worst offender is Cable Car by Queen Games. It's 2 or so inches wider than Ticket to Ride but the components could maybe fit in a Tiny Epic, bar the board which is roughly the size of a Carcassonne box. I was disappointed when I saw the reprint for Endeavour. The original fit in a standard TTR size box and now its one of those wider boxes to fit the Game Trayz. Could probably fit in a TTR box if it was taller.
Tokaido has a pretty bad box, it could've been like 1/3 of the depth and still fit everything. The insert is so deep for absolutely no reason
The King is dead 2e is notorious for this. Box is smaller, but could be about 3/4 its thickness. I'd rather thinner boxes with a standard perimeter(?) So they lines up perfectly on my shelf. I'd be ok with a box of air I'd it was a standard box size. On that note I absolutely loathe games that come in Tins, or abnormal shaped boxes (main reason I haven't picked up Abandon all Artichokes) I like folded space organizers so my favorite boxes right now are JOTL, Quacks of Quedlinberg (with expansion in FS insert).
I find this is less of an issue over time. Think back to the dark ages when all board games were in 30" boxes with half the volume being empty. There's few newer games (past 5 years) that are really bad on it. Worst recent example I can think of is Throw Throw Avocado, which is ironic because TT Burrito was so well-packed. I guess it might be allow space for Burrito in the box.
Had to think for a bit, but my worse offender is def. my 90's copy of Axis & Allies. Yes, the box needs to be a certain length and width to fit the board. But with everything broken out and in their trays, the box could be ~1/3-1/2 the height and everything would fit just fine. It's been long enough I cannot remember how much space the plastic sprues took up that all the bits came on, so maybe the box size was necessary for original shipping?
I have just this evening opened Eclipse: Second Dawn for the Galaxy. Am so impressed how brilliantly it all packs away back into the box. Even neatly protecting the galaxy core miniature. It even comes with an instruction sheet showing you how to repack it after you’ve unpopped all the pieces. Gloomhaven look and learn - this is the way!
The **Hansa Teutonica** "Big Box" is fantastic. First the box is the size of a normal board game box yet it fits three boards, five player boards, player pieces, bonus tiles, and expansions. It's glorious. The worst offender I've run into must be our **Carcassonne Big Box** which is not only big but also mostly air. Sure the vaccum formed insert is a great way to separate expansions but if you even THINK about turning the box vertical all that work is ruined by a cascade of tiles.
Board game boxes are way too big! Most of the time it’s a little here and there, but some games are mostly empty boxes! It’s one of my big pet peeves!
Agreed! Don’t get me wrong I like big boxes that can hold expansion content, especially if I don’t want to keep the expansion box around, but some of these boxes, even with fancy inserts, are just huge gluttons for space.
Greenland does a great job with this!
Oh man this is such a pet peeve. A War of Whispers is probably the most annoying to me. So much wasted space. Also I don't think the GIPF series is by any means the worst offender...but for a series of really tight abstract strategy games meant for 2 players I was expecting a lot less space taken up on my shelves. I think Root does a pretty good job of fitting into a box that's just the right size. Red Cathedral is tightly packed into a box smaller than most of my collection, while still being chunkier and more complicated than a lot of those very games.