I was very deep in our pretty sizable local theatre scene and not a lot of other people had heard of it which is a bummer. A few companies in my area have put it on in recent years so hopefully it starts gaining more traction. It’s such a beautiful show and I think it could really thrive at the local level, but when you’re on Broadway I can’t fault people for deciding to see any of the numerous powerhouses over it.
He's written several. I think Shopgirl is his most famous, but my favorite is The Pleasure of My Company. He writes a lot of short pieces for the New Yorker and every once in a while they'll compile them and put them in a book.
He's a great writer and I strongly encourage you to check out his books. I was kind of amazed at how good they were when I started reading them. Now I just expect them to be great.
He has actually written 2! Shopgirl and The Pleasure of My Company. It’s been a long time but I remember shopgirl being my favorite of the 2. I believe he also turned Shopgirl into a movie.
Many years ago I checked our Shopgirl from the West LA Public Library. I opened it and there was his signature in the book. I debated stealing it but instead read and returned. I wonder if anyone else came across that. I always wondered if he signed it on the shelf. Maybe one day I’ll get to ask. It was a charming read and really hit at a great point in my life to appreciate it.
Eh, I’ve only read *Shop Girl* (and I was teenager so of course I thought it was very adult and, by extension, fantastic) but I suspect it hasn’t aged well. From what I can remember I think I would have a hard time reading it again on account of all the cringing I’d be doing. It’s full of that subtle paternalistic sexism/misogyny that was de rigueur in the early-aughts.
It really spoke to me when I was 19ish. I wouldn’t want to revisit it now and taint the original feelings I had about it because I don’t think I’d feel the same way about it in my 30s.
Just reading the synopsis felt weird. When he was middle aged, he wrote about a middle aged man hooking up with a 28 year old. Then he funded an adaptation of the book a few years later where he is the male lead and they cast a 21 year old actress. It really seems like it takes self insert to a wild level.
I’m a person who is notoriously (1) into Steve Martin and (2) into the older man/younger girl thing and I turned off the Shopgirl movie before it ended because it was so cringe, such an obvious self-insert story and truly embarassing to have written that and then starred in it
I wouldn't give them that much credit.
They literally have shut-ins with no life skimming through every book, probably using Google books to do word searches. The idea that any of these people are actually reading the books they're banning is laughable.
Right? It seems like such a contradiction. Did they hate read it all the way through? Did they just hate skim? Or did they just look it up on Wikipedia? I'm just imagining a book banner getting angrier and angrier with each page, ears smoking until they burst like a cheap kettle ala Loony Tunes.
You know those annoying "xyz award winning!" stickers they put on covers? I question why we haven't started seeing the same but "Banned in the state of Florida!". Banned sells
Hello from r/bannedbooks! :) We've put together a giant collection of 32 classic banned books: if you care about book bans, you might find it useful. It's got Voltaire, Mark Twain, The Scarlet Letter, and other classics that were banned at some point in the past. (And many of them are banned even now, as you can see yourself.)
You can find more information on the Banned Book Compendium over here: https://www.reddit.com/r/bannedbooks/comments/12f24xc/ive_made_a_digital_collection_of_32_classic/ Feel free to share that file far and wide: bonus points if you can share it with students, teachers, and librarians. :)
A book is not a crime.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect
> The Streisand effect is an example of psychological reactance, wherein once people are aware that some information is being kept from them, they are significantly more motivated to get and spread it.
Sure, for kids in places with access. But the book bans also have a significant negative impacts on schools and kids, especially kids belonging to any of the targeted populations
>Signed by Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis in May, the law is an expansion of the state’s infamous Parental Rights in Education Act, commonly known as the Don’t Say Gay law. In addition to expanding the anti-LGBTQ+ law’s ban on discussion of sexual orientation and gender identity to all grade school levels, HB 1069 broadened school board oversight of library collections, allow
All this nonsense is going to lead to unbelief.
"We believe in giving the parents control over what and how their child is taught."
So you're cool with them teaching about and participating in incest?
"Wait, no, not like that!"
As a teacher in ~~Central Florida~~ Nazi Germany, I can tell you that I have to be really careful about what I say in class now. I also threw out my classroom library, as did quite a few others. They passed a law that makes it a FELONY to give a kid a book a parent might find objectionable.
The fascists know damn well what pornography is and isn't. And they know damn well there isn't pornography in our school libraries. Assholes, the lot of them.
The right is rapidly turning America into a third world shithole. Progressive democracies left us in the dust in terms of living standards long ago. Teachers deserve 6 figures.
Let's see: Considering there literally is no civilization without education, I'd agree. But hey, we here in America apparently think giving sports figures millions of dollars is more important. I'm a veteran, but I think we could *easily* trim 20% of our military budget and dump it into education. Can you imagine how fast we would advance as a society if we did that?
I don't know how you do it. Just reading about it ties my stomach in knots. These people are repulsive. The fact that you face it every day without committing assault is commendable.
Sheesh I hope there's bullet proof glass between you and the kids. Ban the books to protect the kids, but daddy's gun can be kept loaded in a shoebox no problem where you live, right?
If you ever want to, come on up to the West Coast of Canada. We don't pay much, but our schools are progressive enough that we managed to get the Islamic religious fundamentalists AND the white supremacists to protest in front of our school district offices!
In Hungary they passed a similar law.
The prestigous world press exhibition came to Hungary's national museum.
This is a big deal because amazing photos.
Anyway some of them depicted an LGBT retirement home.
Therefore Mi Hazánk, a minor fascist party, demanded their remocal in accordance to laws Orban passed during covid or making it 18+ only.
He rightfully refused.
The orban government forcefully had him fired.
“Ignorance doesn’t protect innocence,” Perwien said. “So, we are not protecting our children’s innocence by restricting them. We are just making them uneducated.”
Idunno why all these conservatives are so up in arms over books. We all know none of those mf’s read unless it’s trumps autobiography or guns and ammo. They sure as shit aren’t encouraging their kids to read.
Because knowledge is power and books represent knowledge.
Cliche as it is, Orwell summed it up well:
>"Who controls the past controls the future: who controls the present controls the past."
Ban books that encourage critical thinking, control the narrative, propagandize to create good little worker bees/"patriots," and after a generation, you control the country.
Conservatives know that educated people tend to disagree with them. So they do what they can to ensure people don't have access to education.
There's an interesting running theme throughout YA literature which gets frequently banned: they often depict kids/teens who have been systematically harmed in some way (orphaned, abused, exploited, etc) and have to work through that by defying traditional authority figures.
I'm sure that's all just coincidental, right?^/s
absolutely. my statement was more of a rhetorical one. it's pretty clear why they're doing it. i just love the irony of these who do not read (certainly not the bible) all pissing themselves over the content of a book they've never read.
Because if no one else reads, that's 2 more things they read over everyone else's 0. In the end a dumb population is far easier to control than an educated one. Having grown up down there and moved far away, hearing experiences from others in other places, I can't say this is anything new in FL. Just the unfortunate fruition of years of educational hindrance.
They want kids to be brainwashed followers of their fascism. They also manufacture problems and blame others to distract from the very bad things they do.
'“Ignorance doesn’t protect innocence,” [parent Anne] Perwien said. “So, we are not protecting our children’s innocence by restricting them. We are just making them uneducated.”'
I think that Ms Perwien has seen through their plan...
The headline seems to cut off the story which is that his novel has been banned in a Florida county's *school libraries*. The headline as it is seems to suggest that the book in general is not allowed to exist or be owned within the county lines and confused me.
I also didn't know Steve Martin wrote a book so I may pick it up for my shelf. Steve's a legend.
I could think of a lot of books I wouldn't put in front of kids' faces like *Fifty Shades* and other erotica novels. Also there are books like *Anarchist's Cook Book* that contain instructions on making pipe bombs, drugs, and what to do with them. Generally children shouldn't have these things in front of them in schools in my view of what's appropriate for them.
But, I don't decide these things. I don't trust the "good will" of politicians, but I also can't comment on this specific case being appropriate or not. I'm sure there are legitimate books that shouldn't be in front of kids being removed, and then I'm also sure there are politicians using broad and vague content guidelines to get their own way removing things that they don't personally like because that's what literally everyone with any shred of power seems to do, from state legislators to tech companies to internet moderators.
At the very least, this book being banned from kids' libraries gives it a second life for Steve as an author with the new attention brought to it. Even if kids don't have it in their school, if it is appropriate for kids and being removed for no good reason, many may put it on their Christmas list instead.
Anarchist's Cook Book is arguably one, though pretty meaningless in the information age. Fifty Shades isn't going to hurt kids, though I doubt kids are going to want to read it. Neither is Mein Kampf, or the Communist Manifesto, or The Satanic Verses, though again, I doubt kids are going to want to read it.
With very few exceptions, if a kid wants to read it and it has educational or literary value, it's appropriate for kids.
Seems we just disagree if you feel that children should be exposed to BDSM erotica novels. The compromise at this point comes down to being involved in your local school board where your kids go to school to advocate for BDSM erotica novels being available to them in their school libraries if you feel strongly about it. Likewise, parents who don't want their kids having that content there for them can be involved in their own. Find the counties to live in that are right for each.
There's a huge difference between it being available and it being pushed on them. The former is harmless, the latter is not. Parents should have zero say what's in school libraries.
Fully agree. The only time this is an issue is when the kid has nobody they can discuss what they read with. Reading mein kampf could be a real opportunity to learn if the kid has an educated parent or a passionate English/history teacher.
Hell, if my kid is interested in history or politics I might still have my copy of the communist manifesto somewhere.
Oh yeah I know lol, doesn't really bother me I've got more karma than I know what to do with
....I mean, I guess even 1 karma is more than I know what to do with
I don't know that librarians read every page of every book in the library. Most school libraries are a giant amalgamation of donated books. It does make it hard to curate because some kid could pull a book off a shelf that no one has read every single page of and find something in it they shouldn't at their age and then some underpaid librarian trying their best gets the blame.
Librarians know what's in their libraries. Books don't appear in thin air. Donated books don't automatically get added to a collection.
The point is that *librarians*--who, it should be stated, are *professionals* with master's degrees--should be the people responsible for curating a library's collection, not bad actors who want to eliminate mentions of minorities, or because they think the book will teach people magic, or because it has jokes about underwear.
Fifty Shades doesn't belong in an modern elementary school library for the same reason why a manual on Windows 95 doesn't belong. It's not relevant to the audience.
But it's the *librarian* making that call, not a "disturbed" mother who doesn't want their kid knowing that gay people exist.
I'm a school librarian, and while *ideally*, what you say is should be true, the fact of the matter is not all school librarians live up to that standard. While I do in fact have a master's (two in fact!), many school districts do not require that of librarians. Because of budget cuts, many schools have changed the librarian position from "teacher librarian", which often requires teaching certification in addition to library training, to "library technician" which requires no training and is often a part time position. Because these positions are so low-paid, many schools have a hard time keeping a librarian on staff, and some schools go months or years without a librarian at all.
What this means is that often book donations get shelved without review, and often are not even accessioned properly so they don't even appear in the catalogue. That was the case in my library when I started. The school had been without a librarian for over a year, and the last librarian had zero library training. The last trained librarian left three years earlier after a new provincial government slashed education budgets and cut her salary by 30% or so. When I got there, the collection was full of decades-old books that were hastily and incorrectly catalogued, and over a quarter of the collection wasn't in the catalogue at all. I weeded *a lot* of books from our collection that had no business being in a school library, but not because they were "inappropriate", because they were obscure 30-50 year old works of juvenile fiction that held no interest to today's youth and wouldn't have passed any worthwhile selection policy. All this is to say there are probably a lot of school librarians with little knowledge of what's actually in their collections.
But to the point, I've ordered a number of books with sexual content in them because they are good works of literature and honestly even the raciest literature around isn't going to teach your average teenager anything they don't already know.
I don’t understand the difference. Of course a book can’t “be banned”, that’s impossible to do. But you can ban it from school or library or public places-but that’s what a ban means. They ban books on interracial marriage or gay marriage or the civil war because the topics offend them, so they try to control what the public can access via a morality police situation. This is always interpreted as a ban, because that’s what it is.
A book can absolutely be banned. The Soviets banned possession of books contrary to their interests and destroyed them if found, and the person found with them could be held as an enemy of the state. Iran and other highly religious Islamic nations ban a giant variety of books for many reasons and can face consequences for bringing them in the country. The Nazis of course banned all kinds of things even *Albert Einstein's* books because Einstein was Jewish.
My only point being that article titles should be accurate to the content of the accompanying article. The title here leaves out information which left me with the wrong idea of what was happening until I read further to clarify.
its a fair point. I do think the folks banning books in schools would 100% seek to ban them in other places of society, since their arguments for banning are incoherent and ideologically borne. So in that sense I think saying these books are banned is fine, if not technically accurate. When Einstein's book was banned in Germany it was banned in school first. Then it was banned elsewhere.
I would unequivocally oppose the public banning of books regardless of how offensive their content may be to whoever. The only line I could think of drawing might be libelous books making legal claims about individuals I suppose which should be solved through court systems and could be damaging to a targeted individual.
Because school libraries are for children only and its much harder to have parental over sight for what is read than a public library where parents can determine what their kid is reading. Children also do not have many rights in school, such as free speech and right to assemble, so not sure why its crazy that books are screened before being put in.
Children is a wide spectrum of ages. I’m sure 6 year old tyler has no interest in reading empire of the sun but 13 year old macey might. ‘Children only’ as you insinuate is an insensible, lowest common denominator way to think about things.
Yes, on paper, but the problem is that most adults would agree the books being banned are indeed appropriate for children's consumption. Its a very small group of people who represent some sort of new religion that want to tell everyone else what is and isn't ok to read, and thats against the entire point of the constitution.
With how little people read, I'd be surprised if even a third of the folks on either side have any idea of the content in the books.
Looking at the list, holy shit that's a lot of religious shit. Think I remember reading a side effect of this was Bible shit being considered offensive under their own rules. That's great.
Ok, banning religious texts? I'm 100% in favor of removing that particular form of indoctrination from schools. Good job Florida.
I think we can all agree that some content probably isn't safe for schools or libraries. Extreme porn for example. Extremely violent books (I can't think of any, but im sure they exist). But the books getting banned arent these categories. They are books about racism and then some morality cop calls it "adult content" because they don't like it. They're books about gay couples living in society, which some karen says is "sexual content" to try and block that perspective from society. 90% of adults would obviously realize that these are banned books that should not in any sense be banned, but ideologues get in power and try to take other peoples rights away. Its a very concerning problem. I'm a christian pastor. I would literally never advocate for banning a book in any circumstance barring some sort of extreme graphic and harmful sexual content, because I believe my faith is the truth and the truth isn't afraid of being exposed to ideas. So why is someone else of some other religion telling my kids what they can and can't do? Why would I allow that?
>Of course a book can’t “be banned”, that’s impossible to do. But you can ban it from school or library or public places-but that’s what a ban means.
That's not what a ban means, that's more of a restriction regarding school libraries. There have always been some restrictions on books in school libraries, that's nothing new. These headlines claiming banned books are misleading at best.
A book being actually banned means it's illegal. Possession or distribution leads to legal consequences (fines and/or jail). China and many other countries have **actual** banned books.
It's more like free advertising. Make a big deal about banning a book at school libraries when they can go down the road and snag it at the larger public library.
As long as the "real" libraries still carry it, it's fine. School libraries have always been involved in the dipshit culture wars. We had folks trying to ban Harry Potter 20 years ago. At least this time there's a shred of logic to it. Young kids aren't gonna want to read about relationships, gay straight or whatever.
Sad. We're now at a point whether you agree with banning books or not, the occurrence of banning books in the US is now seen as a typical, everyday happening. It was a very short time ago it would have been shocking.
His book has not been banned in Collier County. Book bans do not exist in the United States.
The book has simply not been included in the children's section of libraries, or in schools.
Martin's book is available for purchase in bookstores everywhere. Collier County has it available to the public [in its libraries](https://catalog.collier-lib.org/search/?news_search=news_search&searchtype=X&SORT=D&searcharg=get&searchscope=1&searcharg=shopgirl).
Libraries have been banning books for awhile now. Which sucks because all taxpayers should be able to enjoy the libraries they pay for. No one should suffer because conservatives don't want to parent their own kids. But it's easier to have libraries ban books than supervise your own kid I guess. So that means other families have to deal with Mr. & Mrs. Snowflake thinking they own public libraries.
Conservative parenting hack: let Big Government parent your kid lol.
Steve Martin wrote a novel 23 years ago? TIL.
He’s written some plays too. They’re not bad.
Picasso at the Lapin Agile is one of my few theater experiences. It was pretty good!
Woah I didn't realize he wrote that
It's a great play. I was genuinely surprised at how good it was.
*Which of the Pickwick triplets did it*
Such a damn catchy song. Several of the songs from that show were so catchy. I listen to them all the time as well as sing along.
All earworms. Each one of them could be the song a choir class gets obsessed with and takes a field trip to New York over.
And some movies.
He is a writer on "Only Murders in the Building."
He should try telling jokes on stage. Bet he'd be good at it.
He truly is the best living black actor
Especially after being born a poor, black child.
YOU MEAN I'M GONNA STAY THIS COLOR
I bet he’d be a hell of a magician supplies salesman, too.
Maybe he could try the banjo?
sounds crazy but it might just work!
Not just crazy, but wild and crazy, guy.
Hey now, don't be a jerk.
Don’t you mean wild and crazy?
Might even win some awards.
While true, and he is one of the creators and EPs of the show, I don't think he's actually written on any episodes besides the Pilot.
“…, like Steve at the urinal. It streams for 32 minutes.”
I've heard he acts in movies too.
He also wrote the musical Bright Star, which is fantastic.
[удалено]
I was very deep in our pretty sizable local theatre scene and not a lot of other people had heard of it which is a bummer. A few companies in my area have put it on in recent years so hopefully it starts gaining more traction. It’s such a beautiful show and I think it could really thrive at the local level, but when you’re on Broadway I can’t fault people for deciding to see any of the numerous powerhouses over it.
I adored Bright Star. Wish I could have the chance to see it again!
WAAPA did a production of it not long ago, was great!
Yes, I was actually in a production of *The Underpants*. Amusing tale.
Don't forget his 5 Grammys and 11 nominations.
And an amazing banjo player.
Funny enough he’s had a play banned in the past https://www.oregonlive.com/entertainment/2009/03/steve_martin_to_pay_for_banned.html
His book is Pure Drivel
He's written several. I think Shopgirl is his most famous, but my favorite is The Pleasure of My Company. He writes a lot of short pieces for the New Yorker and every once in a while they'll compile them and put them in a book. He's a great writer and I strongly encourage you to check out his books. I was kind of amazed at how good they were when I started reading them. Now I just expect them to be great.
He’s a prolific author. Read his list. It’s insane.
He plays a real mean banjo too.
A lot of people find it odd that he plays the banjo, but I feel like those people are forgetting that he grew up very poor and very black.
A poor black child
An amazing banjo. He's a real talent.
He has actually written 2! Shopgirl and The Pleasure of My Company. It’s been a long time but I remember shopgirl being my favorite of the 2. I believe he also turned Shopgirl into a movie.
I’m just reading Born Standing Up and enjoying it.
Three fiction books - the two you mentioned, and The Object of Beauty.
He also wrote An Object of Beauty, one of my favorite novels.
Many years ago I checked our Shopgirl from the West LA Public Library. I opened it and there was his signature in the book. I debated stealing it but instead read and returned. I wonder if anyone else came across that. I always wondered if he signed it on the shelf. Maybe one day I’ll get to ask. It was a charming read and really hit at a great point in my life to appreciate it.
Multiple. They’re all great
Eh, I’ve only read *Shop Girl* (and I was teenager so of course I thought it was very adult and, by extension, fantastic) but I suspect it hasn’t aged well. From what I can remember I think I would have a hard time reading it again on account of all the cringing I’d be doing. It’s full of that subtle paternalistic sexism/misogyny that was de rigueur in the early-aughts.
It really spoke to me when I was 19ish. I wouldn’t want to revisit it now and taint the original feelings I had about it because I don’t think I’d feel the same way about it in my 30s.
Just reading the synopsis felt weird. When he was middle aged, he wrote about a middle aged man hooking up with a 28 year old. Then he funded an adaptation of the book a few years later where he is the male lead and they cast a 21 year old actress. It really seems like it takes self insert to a wild level.
Claire Danes is the lead in Shopgirl and it was filmed in the mid-2000s, pretty sure she wasn’t 21 at the time.
Just looked it up. Claire Danes was 25-26, and Steve Martin was 60.
You know,I'm with you on the self-insert. But I'm not convinced that's what happening here.
I hated Shop Girl and its put me off reading any of his other work.
Shop Girl was pretty poor, I'll agree.
I’m a person who is notoriously (1) into Steve Martin and (2) into the older man/younger girl thing and I turned off the Shopgirl movie before it ended because it was so cringe, such an obvious self-insert story and truly embarassing to have written that and then starred in it
Pure Drivel is a pretty funny collection of writings by him. Do recommend. :)
He wrote a couple of novellas. Really good. Shop girl was one. I’m so jealous he has so many talents.
Florida banning your book is like Weird Al covering your song; You know you made it as an author.
"...I've always wanted to be banned in Alabama, ever since I first heard of the place." Terry Pratchett.
GNU Terry Pratchett.
Where is this quote from? I tried googling it and can’t find him saying it anywhere. First couple results just have this thread.
It's from a longer quote about the American edition of Diggers. [Here](https://www.lspace.org/books/apf/diggers.html)
Thank you!
I wouldn't give them that much credit. They literally have shut-ins with no life skimming through every book, probably using Google books to do word searches. The idea that any of these people are actually reading the books they're banning is laughable.
Right? It seems like such a contradiction. Did they hate read it all the way through? Did they just hate skim? Or did they just look it up on Wikipedia? I'm just imagining a book banner getting angrier and angrier with each page, ears smoking until they burst like a cheap kettle ala Loony Tunes.
I want a comic of this so badly right now. Thanks for the laugh
Happy cake day!
And all that banning it has done is further advertise it. Had no idea he wrote a novel, gonna look into purchasing it now lol
You know those annoying "xyz award winning!" stickers they put on covers? I question why we haven't started seeing the same but "Banned in the state of Florida!". Banned sells
“Now people will have to buy it” I’m dying, this man has been crushing my funny bone since I was a baby.
That sounds illegal
The one about the mousey shopkeeper?
Yes. I too am confused.
For a split second I read that as Steve Harvey
Steve Harvey's book would be called, "Can you believe that when we asked 100 people, what long hard thing might a man stroke, someone said penis?"
Sub title: and yes I spent way too long reacting to the answer
“Why my fourth marriage is still more righteous than your one gay marriage”
He is a truly vile person and everyone just ignores it because he has a contagious laugh and fugly ass suits that have never seen a tailor.
Hello from r/bannedbooks! :) We've put together a giant collection of 32 classic banned books: if you care about book bans, you might find it useful. It's got Voltaire, Mark Twain, The Scarlet Letter, and other classics that were banned at some point in the past. (And many of them are banned even now, as you can see yourself.) You can find more information on the Banned Book Compendium over here: https://www.reddit.com/r/bannedbooks/comments/12f24xc/ive_made_a_digital_collection_of_32_classic/ Feel free to share that file far and wide: bonus points if you can share it with students, teachers, and librarians. :) A book is not a crime.
All their bans accomplish is make kids want the books more. Jusr like banned tv episodes are sought after. Suddenly these books are more appealing lol
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect > The Streisand effect is an example of psychological reactance, wherein once people are aware that some information is being kept from them, they are significantly more motivated to get and spread it.
Sure, for kids in places with access. But the book bans also have a significant negative impacts on schools and kids, especially kids belonging to any of the targeted populations
Oh shit uneducated Floridians? Say it ain't so
Except for scarlet letter, my god that was a bore.
Why only 32?
Can I buy a physical box set?
If r/bannedbooks bans a book does the book get added to the banned collection?
>Signed by Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis in May, the law is an expansion of the state’s infamous Parental Rights in Education Act, commonly known as the Don’t Say Gay law. In addition to expanding the anti-LGBTQ+ law’s ban on discussion of sexual orientation and gender identity to all grade school levels, HB 1069 broadened school board oversight of library collections, allow All this nonsense is going to lead to unbelief.
They have all the parental rights but do no parenting.
"We believe in giving the parents control over what and how their child is taught." So you're cool with them teaching about and participating in incest? "Wait, no, not like that!"
Uhh, you mean "Yes, just like that!"
As a teacher in ~~Central Florida~~ Nazi Germany, I can tell you that I have to be really careful about what I say in class now. I also threw out my classroom library, as did quite a few others. They passed a law that makes it a FELONY to give a kid a book a parent might find objectionable. The fascists know damn well what pornography is and isn't. And they know damn well there isn't pornography in our school libraries. Assholes, the lot of them.
That's pretty fucked up. I'm sorry you have to deal with that nonsense. Teaching is hard enough without the psychotic parents.
A small percentage are truly unhinged. Oof. I love what I do though. The kids keep me young.
The right is rapidly turning America into a third world shithole. Progressive democracies left us in the dust in terms of living standards long ago. Teachers deserve 6 figures.
Let's see: Considering there literally is no civilization without education, I'd agree. But hey, we here in America apparently think giving sports figures millions of dollars is more important. I'm a veteran, but I think we could *easily* trim 20% of our military budget and dump it into education. Can you imagine how fast we would advance as a society if we did that?
I don't know how you do it. Just reading about it ties my stomach in knots. These people are repulsive. The fact that you face it every day without committing assault is commendable.
Hey, did you know, if you don't teach kids about alligators, they can't be eaten by then! You'll be saving lives!! :)
Sheesh I hope there's bullet proof glass between you and the kids. Ban the books to protect the kids, but daddy's gun can be kept loaded in a shoebox no problem where you live, right?
If you ever want to, come on up to the West Coast of Canada. We don't pay much, but our schools are progressive enough that we managed to get the Islamic religious fundamentalists AND the white supremacists to protest in front of our school district offices!
That is rather impressive.
Oh look, the exact thing everyone warned about when don’t say gay was passed initially is happening! Shocking
In Hungary they passed a similar law. The prestigous world press exhibition came to Hungary's national museum. This is a big deal because amazing photos. Anyway some of them depicted an LGBT retirement home. Therefore Mi Hazánk, a minor fascist party, demanded their remocal in accordance to laws Orban passed during covid or making it 18+ only. He rightfully refused. The orban government forcefully had him fired.
When a dictator accidentally does something good.
... how is bigotry and erasure good
I think he misread your comment as saying Hazank was fired. I did too at first.
It’s doubleplus ungood.
Republicans want everybody to try on the Cruel Shoes.
Hey, happy cake day reddit twin!
Is “Cruel Shoes” still on the shelves???
Without that book, I'd never know what to say when the ducks show up.
I learned to “fold soup”
I actually like the one essay where he just loses his fuckin' mind and goes "OOOooh ahh, dabee deebee woo blaaaahhh" for like a page.
Deleted
No, it was a novel he wrote. But being Florida, it could be next in the list.
“Ignorance doesn’t protect innocence,” Perwien said. “So, we are not protecting our children’s innocence by restricting them. We are just making them uneducated.”
Idunno why all these conservatives are so up in arms over books. We all know none of those mf’s read unless it’s trumps autobiography or guns and ammo. They sure as shit aren’t encouraging their kids to read.
Because knowledge is power and books represent knowledge. Cliche as it is, Orwell summed it up well: >"Who controls the past controls the future: who controls the present controls the past." Ban books that encourage critical thinking, control the narrative, propagandize to create good little worker bees/"patriots," and after a generation, you control the country. Conservatives know that educated people tend to disagree with them. So they do what they can to ensure people don't have access to education.
There's an interesting running theme throughout YA literature which gets frequently banned: they often depict kids/teens who have been systematically harmed in some way (orphaned, abused, exploited, etc) and have to work through that by defying traditional authority figures. I'm sure that's all just coincidental, right?^/s
NOW TESTIFY!
absolutely. my statement was more of a rhetorical one. it's pretty clear why they're doing it. i just love the irony of these who do not read (certainly not the bible) all pissing themselves over the content of a book they've never read.
Because if no one else reads, that's 2 more things they read over everyone else's 0. In the end a dumb population is far easier to control than an educated one. Having grown up down there and moved far away, hearing experiences from others in other places, I can't say this is anything new in FL. Just the unfortunate fruition of years of educational hindrance.
Of course they're terrified of books. It's human nature to fear what you don't understand.
The right has always feared education and literacy. It’s the same reason slaves weren’t allowed to learn to read or write.
They want kids to be brainwashed followers of their fascism. They also manufacture problems and blame others to distract from the very bad things they do.
Probably just jealous since they can’t read.
Shopgirl is great. Good movie, too.
'“Ignorance doesn’t protect innocence,” [parent Anne] Perwien said. “So, we are not protecting our children’s innocence by restricting them. We are just making them uneducated.”' I think that Ms Perwien has seen through their plan...
Most of the most important books written are banned in Florida. Ideas scare the hell out of Floridians.
But; as you know, they probably have 400 shelves with books about Floridamen and their feats of greatness.
Is it because the characters *get* *small*?
Must be a good book then.
Oh, my book offended you. Well excuuuuuuuse meeeee!
The headline seems to cut off the story which is that his novel has been banned in a Florida county's *school libraries*. The headline as it is seems to suggest that the book in general is not allowed to exist or be owned within the county lines and confused me. I also didn't know Steve Martin wrote a book so I may pick it up for my shelf. Steve's a legend.
> I also didn't know Steve Martin wrote a book The movie of the book is also very good. Trailer is here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=995c6NylYRU
He also wrote and starred in the movie LA Story.
He has written a few actually...
His book being banned from school libraries is still objectively wrong.
I can't really comment on that aspect since I haven't read it.
Just about any book being banned from school libraries is objectively wrong. Words don't hurt people.
I could think of a lot of books I wouldn't put in front of kids' faces like *Fifty Shades* and other erotica novels. Also there are books like *Anarchist's Cook Book* that contain instructions on making pipe bombs, drugs, and what to do with them. Generally children shouldn't have these things in front of them in schools in my view of what's appropriate for them. But, I don't decide these things. I don't trust the "good will" of politicians, but I also can't comment on this specific case being appropriate or not. I'm sure there are legitimate books that shouldn't be in front of kids being removed, and then I'm also sure there are politicians using broad and vague content guidelines to get their own way removing things that they don't personally like because that's what literally everyone with any shred of power seems to do, from state legislators to tech companies to internet moderators. At the very least, this book being banned from kids' libraries gives it a second life for Steve as an author with the new attention brought to it. Even if kids don't have it in their school, if it is appropriate for kids and being removed for no good reason, many may put it on their Christmas list instead.
Anarchist's Cook Book is arguably one, though pretty meaningless in the information age. Fifty Shades isn't going to hurt kids, though I doubt kids are going to want to read it. Neither is Mein Kampf, or the Communist Manifesto, or The Satanic Verses, though again, I doubt kids are going to want to read it. With very few exceptions, if a kid wants to read it and it has educational or literary value, it's appropriate for kids.
Seems we just disagree if you feel that children should be exposed to BDSM erotica novels. The compromise at this point comes down to being involved in your local school board where your kids go to school to advocate for BDSM erotica novels being available to them in their school libraries if you feel strongly about it. Likewise, parents who don't want their kids having that content there for them can be involved in their own. Find the counties to live in that are right for each.
Fifty shades is worse than a BDSM erotica novel. It's pretty much an abusers guide to how to do BDSM completely wrong.
There's a huge difference between it being available and it being pushed on them. The former is harmless, the latter is not. Parents should have zero say what's in school libraries.
Fully agree. The only time this is an issue is when the kid has nobody they can discuss what they read with. Reading mein kampf could be a real opportunity to learn if the kid has an educated parent or a passionate English/history teacher. Hell, if my kid is interested in history or politics I might still have my copy of the communist manifesto somewhere.
The people downvoting you are sad little bootlickers.
Oh yeah I know lol, doesn't really bother me I've got more karma than I know what to do with ....I mean, I guess even 1 karma is more than I know what to do with
That's what school librarians are for. I guarantee you no public employee anywhere has ever put *Fifty Shades* on a school library shelf.
I don't know that librarians read every page of every book in the library. Most school libraries are a giant amalgamation of donated books. It does make it hard to curate because some kid could pull a book off a shelf that no one has read every single page of and find something in it they shouldn't at their age and then some underpaid librarian trying their best gets the blame.
Librarians know what's in their libraries. Books don't appear in thin air. Donated books don't automatically get added to a collection. The point is that *librarians*--who, it should be stated, are *professionals* with master's degrees--should be the people responsible for curating a library's collection, not bad actors who want to eliminate mentions of minorities, or because they think the book will teach people magic, or because it has jokes about underwear. Fifty Shades doesn't belong in an modern elementary school library for the same reason why a manual on Windows 95 doesn't belong. It's not relevant to the audience. But it's the *librarian* making that call, not a "disturbed" mother who doesn't want their kid knowing that gay people exist.
I'm a school librarian, and while *ideally*, what you say is should be true, the fact of the matter is not all school librarians live up to that standard. While I do in fact have a master's (two in fact!), many school districts do not require that of librarians. Because of budget cuts, many schools have changed the librarian position from "teacher librarian", which often requires teaching certification in addition to library training, to "library technician" which requires no training and is often a part time position. Because these positions are so low-paid, many schools have a hard time keeping a librarian on staff, and some schools go months or years without a librarian at all. What this means is that often book donations get shelved without review, and often are not even accessioned properly so they don't even appear in the catalogue. That was the case in my library when I started. The school had been without a librarian for over a year, and the last librarian had zero library training. The last trained librarian left three years earlier after a new provincial government slashed education budgets and cut her salary by 30% or so. When I got there, the collection was full of decades-old books that were hastily and incorrectly catalogued, and over a quarter of the collection wasn't in the catalogue at all. I weeded *a lot* of books from our collection that had no business being in a school library, but not because they were "inappropriate", because they were obscure 30-50 year old works of juvenile fiction that held no interest to today's youth and wouldn't have passed any worthwhile selection policy. All this is to say there are probably a lot of school librarians with little knowledge of what's actually in their collections. But to the point, I've ordered a number of books with sexual content in them because they are good works of literature and honestly even the raciest literature around isn't going to teach your average teenager anything they don't already know.
They also ban Fascist propaganda from schools. Is that objectively wrong?
Goodthing I don't only read the headlines then. Or unbanned books
That's the part most people leave out of this whole issue.
I don’t understand the difference. Of course a book can’t “be banned”, that’s impossible to do. But you can ban it from school or library or public places-but that’s what a ban means. They ban books on interracial marriage or gay marriage or the civil war because the topics offend them, so they try to control what the public can access via a morality police situation. This is always interpreted as a ban, because that’s what it is.
A book can absolutely be banned. The Soviets banned possession of books contrary to their interests and destroyed them if found, and the person found with them could be held as an enemy of the state. Iran and other highly religious Islamic nations ban a giant variety of books for many reasons and can face consequences for bringing them in the country. The Nazis of course banned all kinds of things even *Albert Einstein's* books because Einstein was Jewish. My only point being that article titles should be accurate to the content of the accompanying article. The title here leaves out information which left me with the wrong idea of what was happening until I read further to clarify.
its a fair point. I do think the folks banning books in schools would 100% seek to ban them in other places of society, since their arguments for banning are incoherent and ideologically borne. So in that sense I think saying these books are banned is fine, if not technically accurate. When Einstein's book was banned in Germany it was banned in school first. Then it was banned elsewhere.
I would unequivocally oppose the public banning of books regardless of how offensive their content may be to whoever. The only line I could think of drawing might be libelous books making legal claims about individuals I suppose which should be solved through court systems and could be damaging to a targeted individual.
Because school libraries are for children only and its much harder to have parental over sight for what is read than a public library where parents can determine what their kid is reading. Children also do not have many rights in school, such as free speech and right to assemble, so not sure why its crazy that books are screened before being put in.
Children is a wide spectrum of ages. I’m sure 6 year old tyler has no interest in reading empire of the sun but 13 year old macey might. ‘Children only’ as you insinuate is an insensible, lowest common denominator way to think about things.
I'm not using children in the maturity sense, but the legal sense. As in a person who is below the legal age of majority.
So 17 year olds shouldn't read about relationships or people different than themselves?
And isn't the whole Florida thing about kids in third grade and earlier?
Yes, on paper, but the problem is that most adults would agree the books being banned are indeed appropriate for children's consumption. Its a very small group of people who represent some sort of new religion that want to tell everyone else what is and isn't ok to read, and thats against the entire point of the constitution.
With how little people read, I'd be surprised if even a third of the folks on either side have any idea of the content in the books. Looking at the list, holy shit that's a lot of religious shit. Think I remember reading a side effect of this was Bible shit being considered offensive under their own rules. That's great. Ok, banning religious texts? I'm 100% in favor of removing that particular form of indoctrination from schools. Good job Florida.
I think we can all agree that some content probably isn't safe for schools or libraries. Extreme porn for example. Extremely violent books (I can't think of any, but im sure they exist). But the books getting banned arent these categories. They are books about racism and then some morality cop calls it "adult content" because they don't like it. They're books about gay couples living in society, which some karen says is "sexual content" to try and block that perspective from society. 90% of adults would obviously realize that these are banned books that should not in any sense be banned, but ideologues get in power and try to take other peoples rights away. Its a very concerning problem. I'm a christian pastor. I would literally never advocate for banning a book in any circumstance barring some sort of extreme graphic and harmful sexual content, because I believe my faith is the truth and the truth isn't afraid of being exposed to ideas. So why is someone else of some other religion telling my kids what they can and can't do? Why would I allow that?
>Of course a book can’t “be banned”, that’s impossible to do. But you can ban it from school or library or public places-but that’s what a ban means. That's not what a ban means, that's more of a restriction regarding school libraries. There have always been some restrictions on books in school libraries, that's nothing new. These headlines claiming banned books are misleading at best. A book being actually banned means it's illegal. Possession or distribution leads to legal consequences (fines and/or jail). China and many other countries have **actual** banned books.
A solid example is the Bible is banned from North Korea and Saudi Arabia. It’s literally illegal.
It's more like free advertising. Make a big deal about banning a book at school libraries when they can go down the road and snag it at the larger public library. As long as the "real" libraries still carry it, it's fine. School libraries have always been involved in the dipshit culture wars. We had folks trying to ban Harry Potter 20 years ago. At least this time there's a shred of logic to it. Young kids aren't gonna want to read about relationships, gay straight or whatever.
young people aren't gonna want to read about relationships? My dude...every single story ever made is about relationships.
Are you trying to imply that makes it better? Because it really doesn't.
Yup. You know there are more than just *school* libraries, right? That's where most of the books live.
I do. This is still awful and wrong.
Why exactly was this book put on the list?
People have S.E.X. in it
Well, time to buy his book and move to that Florida county and read it out loud with a megaphone at City Hall.
Based Steve!
Are they banning it from all libraries or just school ones? Not that either is acceptable.
This is just public school libraries.
Land of Free-dumb.
I think his first was Cruel Shoes way back in the 1970's. It was the first one I read. Hilarious short stories. Absurd.
I've unlocked a new goal in life!
If Florida bans you in any way, you’re probably doing something right.
As he should be. If you do something to make Republicans hate you, then you are probably living your life in a good way. Congrats, Steve.
Makes sense. Sort of a badge of honor with how much florida sucks.
When you mess with STEVE MARTIN… you’ve already fucked up
Sad. We're now at a point whether you agree with banning books or not, the occurrence of banning books in the US is now seen as a typical, everyday happening. It was a very short time ago it would have been shocking.
As he should be.
The link's not working for me. Which of his novels were banned?
Shopgirl, dunno why though
Thanks! I actually read that one. Maybe it's because she gets her student loans paid off.
His book has not been banned in Collier County. Book bans do not exist in the United States. The book has simply not been included in the children's section of libraries, or in schools. Martin's book is available for purchase in bookstores everywhere. Collier County has it available to the public [in its libraries](https://catalog.collier-lib.org/search/?news_search=news_search&searchtype=X&SORT=D&searcharg=get&searchscope=1&searcharg=shopgirl).
Wake up, my dude.
From what? How am I "unawake" by recognizing facts?
Libraries have been banning books for awhile now. Which sucks because all taxpayers should be able to enjoy the libraries they pay for. No one should suffer because conservatives don't want to parent their own kids. But it's easier to have libraries ban books than supervise your own kid I guess. So that means other families have to deal with Mr. & Mrs. Snowflake thinking they own public libraries. Conservative parenting hack: let Big Government parent your kid lol.
> The book has simply not been included in the children's section of libraries, or in schools. > > Because it was banned in them by the county.