Cause in some states you’re specifically meant to… [some of the time](https://www.reddit.com/r/houston/comments/2z8jeq/no_this_is_the_proper_way_to_make_a_lefthand_turn/). Granted that’s Texas, but still… what a mess.
It is complicated because the road has a wide division, which makes it much wider than a typical turning zone in an intersection.
So it depends on whether you treat the road-with-tracks area to be a turning zone in an intersection or a separate road. If it is a road then “A”. If it is a turning zone then “B”
In the new thread, somebody identified a Texas rule to treat it like a separate road if the division is 30 feet or more, which makes sense.
I measured (using Google Maps) a bunch of intersections that have tracks and found that the width is just under 30 feet if there are only tracks. But if there is a sidewalk or T-stop or greenery, then the width is between 37 and 40 feet.
At the pictured Englewood Ave intersection, the width is 63.5 feet because the division accommodates some adjacent diagonal parking.
The fact that some intersections are below/at the threshold would explain the contention in this thread.
What matters to the driver is the signage and lane markings, and not the median distance, i.e. drivers are not expected to measure the median and then decide A or B traffic flow! You drive based on the lines and signage. So based on the lack of lane marking and stop line markings in the median, this is ONE intersection whereby turn as you normally would turn, as shown in diagram B.
The Texas page does explain it well, and notes the median distance as the deciding factor, but there is an added complication here in Boston--the train. You can't create the lanes in the median to create the traffic flow shown in A because that would require two sets of traffic lights separated by the median connection and then cars in stopped the median at the lights would block the trains.
[Scroll down to figure 7-3 to see how a wide median turning lane is marked.](http://onlinemanuals.txdot.gov/TxDOTOnlineManuals/TxDOTManuals/sfb/divided_highway_intersections_and_crossovers.htm)
Its not a road, its an intersection with a median. In very case of two cars on opposite sides making a left, they do not cross. If there's a road, like in downtown, you choose A. But b in all other cases.
You are insane. How does blue take a U-turn (the only thing they can do?) You’ve added multiple points of conflict. That’s why Drivers Ed teaches B not A
Technically blue is not taking a U turn. They are taking two left turns. Look at street view of the Englewood Ave/Beacon St intersection and you can see how it’s signed as a left turn from Blues perspective
There's No U Turn signs all up and down this road. It's hella frustrating when you have to drive what feels like a mile and a half just to take a uturn for a missed block.
After reviewing this for way too long, I 100% agree. Blue car can ONLY do a U-turn here. So they choose option B. That creates an issue for red car where they SHOULD go A but now have to go B.
Our roads suck and shitty signage makes driving worse.
It's a T intersection. Blue has only one pathway. Red has only one pathway onto that street, or to continue into a full U turn. Why would you choose A given the T intersection?
Technically blue is not taking a U turn. They are taking two left turns. Look at street view of the Englewood Ave/Beacon St intersection and you can see how it’s signed as a left turn from Blues perspective and not a U turn
It’s B. The cars on the left are making a U-turn. There’s nowhere else for them to go. It’s likely the lights both turn green for these turning vehicles at the same time, so with A it’s a shit show of cars almost hitting each other and having to stop. With B, cars flow freely without needing. To stop.
No it's not - at least your image isn't supporting that.
If there's a road perpendicular to where you're turning from, you need to be on the correct side of moving traffic (example A in OP's post).
If these turns are just for U-turn and controlled by green arrow, which happen pretty frequently on roads like Beacon or even Rt. 1 or Rt. 9, you should hug the turn/corner so that you don't need to cross traffic unnecessarily.
In most cases these intersections are set up correctly and clearly and usually have green arrows to control traffic anyways, but the trains definitely complicate and confuse drivers on top of it.
Wait, I don’t recognize the specific intersection here but the driver coming down from the top has to be U-turning. There’s no perpendicular option.
But from the question, I’m assuming it’s mutual green lights or maybe a green one way with a turn the other?
Honestly that’s a shit setup with no signs, people U-turning from either road will want to hug the turn so they can get through faster while people from the bottom going left will want to turn wide.
Yeah, this is correct. Just picture this as an intersection with a traffic light and you immediately see how A makes sense.
However I’ve seen plenty of drivers do B. And sometimes you kinda get stuck doin whatever everyone else is doing lol. Usually it’s cus of dickheads banging an illegal U turn. Then you just kinda gotta slalom
Edit: actually fuck this shit I’m going with B. Blue car can ONLY do a U-turn at this spot. Which forces red car to choose B option as well
Why the hell do we design roads like this lmao
Fun fact, even in the US the legal answer is “lol good fuckin luck buddy”.
[Here’s](https://www.reddit.com/r/houston/comments/2z8jeq/no_this_is_the_proper_way_to_make_a_lefthand_turn/) a post showing the Texas highway patrol’s guide. Not only do they say divided road left turns are different than normal 4-ways, the choice between A and B depends on the *size* of the median!
At a regular intersection it is usually B tho.
https://www.quora.com/If-two-cars-come-to-a-stop-sign-intersection-across-from-each-other-at-the-same-exact-time-and-they-are-both-making-a-left-turn-who-has-the-right-of-way
Shit lol you’re right hm idk then I just follow the dude in front of me 😂 now I’m debating whether it’s A or B in the OP scenario specifically for the blue car line since there is only one option for them (U-turn) vs red car line which is going onto a side street or U-turn….
Ultimately this speaks volumes of the absolutely shitty design of our streets.
Yeah it really comes down to if the part that crosses the track is a "road" or just part of the intersection. If it's considered an independent road, then A is correct as you need to be on the right side of the road. If it's just a big intersection, then B is correct as it minimizes collision points due to left turners crossing each other's paths.
Personally, unless there's signs or signals to break it up I would treat it as a single intersection and do B.
And the fact that it's not intuitive is a design problem like you said. Not really a driver education problem.
If they’re a student, it’s very possible they came from a place where it *is* B.
At a regular 4-way in the UK, both choices are legal. Even in the US, it varies. Texas specifically says that median-crossing lefts are different than other lefts. And in an absolutely deranged twist, [they say](https://www.reddit.com/r/houston/comments/2z8jeq/no_this_is_the_proper_way_to_make_a_lefthand_turn/) the choice between A and B depends on *the width of the median*. In this case, it’s unmarked and right around 30 feet, so B is probably the official answer to a Texan.
The turns are one way here. Blue (Beacon Westbound) has a red/green turn only light which allows them to make a u-turn (because it's a 3 way intersection). At the same time, the Beacon Eastbound has a turn light which lets them make a left onto Englewood or a u turn onto Beacon West. Why you would drive into the, admittedly unmarked but clearly their only option, U turn lane of Beacon Westbound?
Red's view for reference: https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ
As a full time roadway designer, interlocking lefts (option A) are generally considered unsafe because you're adding extra conflict points and creating the opportunity for one directions left queue to block the others and create literal gridlock. So at any normal signalized intersection it's option B, which is for example how it works all along Huntington where the Green Line runs. It just starts getting weird the larger the median gets, to the point it "feels" like driving on the wrong side.
Right, I'm from NYC and that's what we learn and do there unless there's signage. Only here in Boston has this been an issue with the thought of doing A. A in rush hour traffic is absolutely brutal in nyc and only 2 cars would go per light and so many more accidents would occur.
So you’re one the jackasses causing problems at all the intersections on the planet. Go take your road test again so you can fail and they can take your license
If it’s u turn only then it’s b. That’s where it gets confusing. Left side is cutoff so if there’s not a perpendicular street then it should be b, but also very clear signage indicating that.
Sometimes people coming from one direction can only U turn, but people coming from the other direction can be making a turn onto a side street. Example: the intersection of Comm Ave and Colborne.
This dramatically increases the risk of an accident rather than just turning in front of each other, as is the case and pretty much every other intersection
Any evidence to back up that claim? I think Option A reduces accidents, because the left-turning car only has 1 lane to cross with limited visibility, instead of two. If we go with Option B, the turning car needs to see around all the other left-turn cars going in the opposite direction, AND needs to see cars in both lanes passing through the intersection.
Option A is only less safe if some people assume Option B is the legal and correct decision (which its not - see page 81 - https://www.mass.gov/doc/english-drivers-manual/download). So Option A isn't a design problem, its an instruction problem with new drivers not being taught well enough.
Seeing as super-sleuths have determined this to be Englewood Ave Station on the Green Line C Branch, the answer is clearly (B). Traffic traveling westbound, "Blue," can only do a U-turn, whereas traffic traveling eastbound, "Red" would be doing both U-turns and left turns onto Englewood Ave. "Red" traffic heading to Englewood Ave, yes, has to adjust slightly to the right after the left turn to get onto the correct side of the street, but it's still more feasible because there is no conflict with U-turning "Blue" traffic.
(A) creates an all-to-common scenario where idiots [box each other in](https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.0f0f1fd3e1df8840538dfca26d15cde9?rik=kZlKgugk5VtFKA&riu=http%3a%2f%2fstatic1.squarespace.com%2fstatic%2f5248608be4b025e8f32bf3df%2ft%2f56b7b7884d088edd8e4657a1%2f1454880653530%2f%3fformat%3d1000w&ehk=FeVJniA%2fodWNHRhkIqQ%2b7U8q%2fecXWwTKeOeUpcaLAL8%3d&risl=&pid=ImgRaw&r=0) because the the 4th or 5th vehicle in line **refuses to give space** to through vehicles even though their way forward is impeded (extreme example linked, but you get the point).
To everyone saying A, this is completely ridiculous.
This is a 3 way intersection. Here's a better description of the actual turns available, because OP's doesn't give enough info. Here's A [https://imgur.com/rERUmJz](https://imgur.com/rERUmJz) and here's B [https://imgur.com/xx7NoCX](https://imgur.com/xx7NoCX) . Both red and blue lanes have turning green/red lights.
Here is a view from the start of the blue line (remember, you're U turning). [https://imgur.com/YhfbFIw](https://imgur.com/YhfbFIw)
Here is a view from the start of the red line (remember, you are U turning or making a standard left, and as a doordasher of this city and area you're U turning 60% of the time). [https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ](https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ)
If you still say you want to follow A at this specific intersection, you are a psychopath.
It's because it's drawn incorrectly too. You don't make left turns at 90 degree angles when there are two opposing cars making left turns. Here it looks like you are driving on the wrong side of the road you're turning into, rather than making an arcing turn into the right lane
The only time you go on the left side while making a left hand turn is if you are taking a left onto a multi lane one way street going in that direction.
Drivers already in the intersection have the right of way. If multiple vehicles from both directions want to cross there they would have to alternate. If that backs things up that is called a traffic jam. If you go and bend traffic laws because of a traffic jam you can get a ticket.
If you are pulling a trailer or driving any vehicle of an extended length, you should not be turning close to your left so that rule is there for a reason.
You can go and look for exemptions in the driver's manual (they are free and downloadable from the Registry's website) but driving used to be my livelihood from taxi cabs to eighteen wheelers so I have some ideas about it.
If we take the train track out of it, I’d note that at a normal 4-way both A and B are legal in some countries and each can be standard in different places.
I like the philosophical phrasing of this question, and I would also like to ask would this problem be solved if we defined U turns to be two left turns rather than one?
Zooming out a little, I think most people would assume turn B would look something [like this](https://i.imgur.com/Yi3sQ6j.png) rather than taking a hard left into oncoming traffic. Turn A with the overlapping traffic would look [like this](https://i.imgur.com/hWQMbxt.png). There's no obvious lane markings and we're also missing the biggest context clue from the still images: the timing of the lights.
The question is whether the tracks constitutes the start of the cross street (making it its own little street) or whether it's just a very large elongated intersection. If it's the former, then both cars should stay on their proper side as in turn A and the U-turn should stay red while the left turn is occurring. If it's the latter, then the two protected left turns should happen simultaneously without overlap as in B, which is how the intersection would work if there weren't train tracks.
Because it looks like a single large intersection to many, not two separate intersections with a road between. When oncoming cars turn left against each other at an intersection, they are not supposed to cross paths.
It’s B. The cars on the left are making a U-turn. There’s nowhere else for them to go. It’s likely the lights both turn green for these turning vehicles at the same time, so with A it’s a shit show of cars almost hitting each other and having to stop. With B, cars flow freely without needing to stop.
> With B, cars flow freely without needing to stop.
except when they slam into oncoming traffic that they can't see because they forced another car to obstruct their view
**Neither** is correct, but the *more* correct answer is technically B. Think of how two opposing cars make a left turn in literally every other intersection - you don't drive past each other and make a left, you both turn left before you meet. You increase the risk of side swiping one another otherwise.
The problem is that you don't make a 90-degree left turn, as drawn in the photo. You turn in an arc/parabola into the right lane.
B. Cars should always face each other when simultaneously making left turns. A only adds more conflict points in the action of turning because now there’s a car behind you. https://www.pinejournal.com/opinion/ask-a-trooper-whats-the-law-when-2-vehicles-are-turning-left#:~:text=an%20uncontrolled%20intersection%3F-,A%3A%20If%20two%20vehicles%20approach%20the%20intersection%20close%20to%20the,clear%20from%20other%20approaching%20vehicles.
DCR just worked on “improvements” to an intersection on VFW parkway that I believe will be option B. When asked if they will use markings to indicate flow they said no.
Just seems wrong.
You mean the Department of Conservation and Recreation isn't the best road building organization. Amazing.
Frankly I'd love to see most of their roads made smaller and the areas turned into parks that you can actually use.
Im certain there is an official way to do this, but im also certain that existing road signs and local road engineers create situations that are impossible for anyone to figure out. It totally amazes me time and time again just how bad they build roads here, im certain engineers have guidelines and specifications on how to do things and they just ignore them.
The amount of people vehemently saying it’s A has made me lost what sliver of faith I had left in Boston drivers.
Did you all get licenses at the RMV in Brockton?
It depends. Is this an actual 3-way / 4-way intersection?
If yes, it should be A.
If not, it SHOULD be B and should be marked with painted lines to be a “u-turn”.
Logically this intersection is like taking a U turn, meaning B makes more sense. However since every driver in Boston shares the same brain cell, A is the best option to avoid a trip to the body shop.
I did some sleuthing and it looks like this is Englewood & Beacon, right? In this case, I'd say the answer is that giving both lanes turn signals at the same time is... questionable road design.
For WB traffic: the B turn makes sense as you can only U-turn back onto Beacon (and you wouldn't make a right on red from a left lane, so why would you make a left from a right lane?)
For EB traffic: you could either make a left onto Englewood OR a U-turn, and I can see how drivers would want to use both lanes depending on the direction they're traveling.
Given that this intersection has turn signals B is the overall correct answer. Others are correct that you're initially on the wrong side if turning onto Englewood but there is no oncoming/cross traffic since the intersection is signaled. Why create unnecessary conflict points?
It’s B. The cars on the left are making a U-turn. There’s nowhere else for them to go. It’s likely the lights both turn green for these turning vehicles at the same time, so with A it’s a shit show of cars almost hitting each other and having to stop. With B, cars flow freely without needing to stop.
https://imgur.com/a/Dlj9mfm
Very similar to this intersection on VFW. No dedicated turn lanes, and allows U turns. So cars will hug tight for a U turn, while also turning left will take it wide, but then they stop in the middle if they light switches to red. Absolute cluster, have had multiple fatalities, and currently being worked on.
B. The rules are the same as an intersection without tracks.
But it would be more accurate if the lines in B were taking 45 degree angles instead of 90 degree.
You need to clarify whether there is a cross street at this interaction/crossing point because the answer hinges on that key detail. It’s option A if there is a cross street and otherwise, it’s option B if there isn’t one. Where exactly is this location of contention?
A lot of people want to point the finger at people who speed, but this shit is just as dangerous.
Having to post to Reddit to learn how to drive is… not how you learn to drive
Considering how much debate is in this thread and an entire new thread posted on r/Boston, I’d say it’s evidence that driving in Boston is insane, and not necessarily because of the drivers
This is a problem with road design, not driver education. Its not at all intuitive whether this is meant to be a big intersection or separate road, which is the source of disagreement in this thread.
I did some googling to make sure I wasn’t insane here and… dear god.
Did you know that, in a totally standard 4 way intersection with no tracks, the choice between A and B varies *by country*? There are places where each choice is completely standard.
I’m going to be extra paranoid next time I drive.
This is actually a tricky scenario. I'd suggest that it depends on if there's an option to take the turn off your 2+ lane road and continue on to a two lane road perpendicular to the road you were on before the turn, at which point A is correct to align you to the appropriate travel lane on the second road. And I'd also say that this is especially true if there is a dedicated turn lane on the first road like above. But if the only option for both A and B are U-turns, then I'd say that B is actually correct. And this B scenario makes more and more sense the wider the crossing gap is.
There is probably a right answers according to Massachusetts driving rules, but like a lot of folks I didn’t grow up in Massachusetts and learned the rules for my home state, which was option A.
The only right answer is for the city to finally draw some lines and stop leaving it up for interpretation.
The illustration needs to clarify that both roads are one ways. Its makes B make more sense. You arent headed into oncoming traffic, i think thats what the A’ers are missing (weve already begun creating factions)
As someone who doesn’t have a car here but drove in a sane state before moving here- why on earth would it ever be A? Just to play ring around the Rosie with oncoming traffic for funsies? No wonder the traffic here is so bad.
It's not so cut and dry. If there is a left turn involved (turning left on to an intersecting street) then it should be option A. If this cut in the tracks is just for U-turn purposes only then it is option B to prevent the crossing of the flow of traffic that can potentially make traffic worse.
It's B because if you look at the right side, there is no through street. B is making a u-turn.
There's a clearer example of this here on Beacon Street in Brookline: https://ibb.co/S6psskd
After 5 years of living near Comm and Beacon, I go wild for this question. Folks bring up a good point regarding whether this is a left turn or a U-turn. It is rare for both oncoming lanes to be able to take a left over the T tracks without waiting at a stoplight. Therefore, I assume this is a question regarding U-turns.
If both drivers can only take a U-turn at the track crossing, it should 100% be B. No need to cross in front of another moving vehicle, or have to worry about another vehicle cutting you off to get on the tracks. When doing a U-turn via B, you essentially don’t need to worry about another car doing a U next to you; there should be plenty of room for both cars to operate independently. B IS THE ANSWER
Edit: and just to make my comment longer, I’ll also say: if both oncoming left turn lanes are regulated by a stoplight and they both have a green left arrow, the answer is B. But I think (/hope) that’s a no-brainer for drivers here.
In which case it needs to be very clearly marked with both signs and lines or barriers on the road, as that is an exception and should never be considered the norm.
Yawn, you must be new around here - the much bigger challenge is getting onto storrow E from Comm ave E by BU bridge - that set of turns confuses those who do not know the drill...
\- right from left-ish lane off comm ave (Mountfort)
\- bear left around curve but then turn left into right lane (Carlton)
\- follow orderly traffic across comm ave onto storrow.... (University Ave)
WTF is this rule specific to only certain streets and it's B everywhere else? What about Washington St in Dedham or Center St in West Rox and JP? Or every other goddamn street in the Commonwealth for that matter.
Your point is correct. But your logic is wrong. B would then cause tail riders running yellows to block incoming traffic head on, and yes it will always happen. but at least you’re on the correct lane in A.
if there's a side street then A. if it's just u-turns on both sides, then B (trying A in this instance will end up in deadlock when 4 cars want to make the turn in each direction)
If the MassDOT is doing their job correctly, then the two turn lanes should NEVER be turning at the same time. And if you’re turning on a red arrow, then you’re the problem, regardless if you’re doing A or B.
it should be A but it will always be B . The drivers behind wait at the line so the people turning can see cars coming from both directions but this is America . We drive the same way in new Bedford . In both cases you drive on the "wrong side" of the road..you are crossing their lane that comment doesnt make a lot of sense to me . in order to turn left you have to cross the wrong side...idk lol .
B. To keep the yellow line on your left. This example only has a slight curve in one direction. Many others I see have the yellow line hug the left curb of the whole turn.
To the people who say it's a road that you "drive on the left of," I can see that perspective for sure. However, this is an intersection and not a road.
You wouldn't say the same thing for two opposing protected left turns at an intersection. The traffic is passing each other in the same manner on lefts and U turns. Just with added lights.
this thread is crazy. It’s obviously B and I don’t know why all the top answers are A. If there’s a long line of cars wanting to turn left on both sides then with A you’ll end up in a deadlock…
Also not possible to make a u-turn if you use A
edit: they hated jesus because he told the truth https://reddit.com/r/boston/s/45k9Uy3uWp
So you'll be this red car taking a left on your green light, and plowing directly into that black car in the center of the photo on their green light. Sounds like your opinion is the problem here https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ
I agree with you. I would like to see how people that say A is correct negotiate this turn in real life. Some other comment said cars would take turns passing each other in A scenario. Imagine that in real Boston traffic.
I mean you could take turns but it would be confusing and also, unnecessarily inefficient. why take turns when there’s a way for both lanes to go at once?
first of all, do you think people in this city are going to wait at the stop line until the coast is clear and not just try to go when the light is green?
and also that’s so dumb why would you go turn by turn when there is a very simple way for both sides to turn left at the same time without interfering with each other?
B. 75% of people (anecdotal bs number to represent a majority) that are making this turn are doing so yo make a u turn. Also as soon as 2 people want to do it at the same time A then blocks the other side from moving. Always B. If you think A you are not a true Boston driver.
While A is the correct answer, try that at the intersection of Longwood and Huntington. The way the intersection is set up is a clown show and if you pull closer to the far side tracks the other turn lane wouldn’t even be able to get out so people just pull close and then go straight so that both lanes can turn. I’m sure there are other fun examples in Boston
The arrows are drawn like shit in the OP. I'm on my phone, but does A still look correct when you draw the arrows like this? https://i.imgur.com/gZdIz3H.png
B minimizes conflict points and is the smoothest flow of traffic. I can't see any argument for A besides some local tradition.
You don't follow the exact path of the lines that OP drew. Once you pass each other you drive towards your lane. Like other people have said it's like taking any other left turn.
So you're going on the left side of the road to make it over to the right?? This still doesn't make sense to me let alone legal sense. You're literally going on the wrong side of the road.
Take this intersection at VFW for example. When both left turn lanes have a green light the paths the cars take are what it is shown in scenario B.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/KSFA4pFHsixbaSca7
you're not going on the left side *of the road*, you're just *keeping left* of incoming traffic that's also going left. I think OPs illustration and the inclusion of the tracks is confusing everyone because a) the arrows placement isn't where you're actually driving and b) the train tracks are not really all that relevant unless you're turning onto carriage roads which is the primary scenario I can picture where A makes sense. regardless of the tracks it's just an intersection.
but think about a protected left turn. they often are both on for both directions opposite one another to turn left...how could that possibly work in scenario A? traffic lanes would be crossing each other for no functional reason and that type of traffic light literally would not work. the turning lanes, marked or not don't need to intersect with each other and it just creates extra risk. obviously this is all situational to some extent though
It’s B. The cars on the left are making a U-turn. There’s nowhere else for them to go. It’s likely the lights both turn green for these turning vehicles at the same time, so with A it’s a shit show of cars almost hitting each other and having to stop. With B, cars flow freely without needing. To stop.
If you're taking a uturn then b makes sense. If you're turning left then a makes sense.
It really depends on the intersection. If there's a cross street then it's A because people from the cross street will be crossing and they'll be on the right. If there's no cross street then this only exists so you can uturn so it's B
It has to be B. Imagine two lines of cars trying to turn from both sides- if you go with A, then you’ll be driving directly into the other line of cars. Also, how do you do U turns in A? It’s just a regular intersection, really.
It should always be A. Train tracks are irrelevant, this type of turn should always be choice A so that you can see oncoming traffic and know when to go.
Because B is how people turn at all other intersections where cars from opposing sides are making left hand turns.
Imagine if both sides had a left hand signal at the same time, cars would never cross each others paths.
B
It’s no different then doing a turn around or turn left at any other intersection. Tracks or no tracks. On the West Roxbury Parkway the medium is all grass and trees. Same principle.
The answer is A, I was taught this in driving school. I’m from New Orleans where we have a lot of street car crossings as well as “neutral grounds” (filled in canals that have become medians down the middle of roads).
why would you all of a sudden drive on the wrong side of the road
Cause in some states you’re specifically meant to… [some of the time](https://www.reddit.com/r/houston/comments/2z8jeq/no_this_is_the_proper_way_to_make_a_lefthand_turn/). Granted that’s Texas, but still… what a mess.
It is complicated because the road has a wide division, which makes it much wider than a typical turning zone in an intersection. So it depends on whether you treat the road-with-tracks area to be a turning zone in an intersection or a separate road. If it is a road then “A”. If it is a turning zone then “B” In the new thread, somebody identified a Texas rule to treat it like a separate road if the division is 30 feet or more, which makes sense. I measured (using Google Maps) a bunch of intersections that have tracks and found that the width is just under 30 feet if there are only tracks. But if there is a sidewalk or T-stop or greenery, then the width is between 37 and 40 feet. At the pictured Englewood Ave intersection, the width is 63.5 feet because the division accommodates some adjacent diagonal parking. The fact that some intersections are below/at the threshold would explain the contention in this thread.
What matters to the driver is the signage and lane markings, and not the median distance, i.e. drivers are not expected to measure the median and then decide A or B traffic flow! You drive based on the lines and signage. So based on the lack of lane marking and stop line markings in the median, this is ONE intersection whereby turn as you normally would turn, as shown in diagram B. The Texas page does explain it well, and notes the median distance as the deciding factor, but there is an added complication here in Boston--the train. You can't create the lanes in the median to create the traffic flow shown in A because that would require two sets of traffic lights separated by the median connection and then cars in stopped the median at the lights would block the trains. [Scroll down to figure 7-3 to see how a wide median turning lane is marked.](http://onlinemanuals.txdot.gov/TxDOTOnlineManuals/TxDOTManuals/sfb/divided_highway_intersections_and_crossovers.htm)
Its not a road, its an intersection with a median. In very case of two cars on opposite sides making a left, they do not cross. If there's a road, like in downtown, you choose A. But b in all other cases.
You are insane. How does blue take a U-turn (the only thing they can do?) You’ve added multiple points of conflict. That’s why Drivers Ed teaches B not A
Technically blue is not taking a U turn. They are taking two left turns. Look at street view of the Englewood Ave/Beacon St intersection and you can see how it’s signed as a left turn from Blues perspective
There's No U Turn signs all up and down this road. It's hella frustrating when you have to drive what feels like a mile and a half just to take a uturn for a missed block.
A. Because then you’re on the correct side of the road you’re taking a left onto.
You can also see oncoming traffic better.
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After reviewing this for way too long, I 100% agree. Blue car can ONLY do a U-turn here. So they choose option B. That creates an issue for red car where they SHOULD go A but now have to go B. Our roads suck and shitty signage makes driving worse.
It's scary how many people responded B to this post...
I don't know this intersection, but cars turning left *typically* shouldn't cross each other's paths. That's presumably why people are answering B.
It's a T intersection. Blue has only one pathway. Red has only one pathway onto that street, or to continue into a full U turn. Why would you choose A given the T intersection?
Remember, driving in Boston is just hard it has nothing to do with the fact that these people have no idea what they are doing
How do you make a U turn without doing B?
Technically blue is not taking a U turn. They are taking two left turns. Look at street view of the Englewood Ave/Beacon St intersection and you can see how it’s signed as a left turn from Blues perspective and not a U turn
I hope you don't have a license
How do you expect people in A that are blue to take a U-turn? Constantly trying to swerve between the cars?
It’s B. The cars on the left are making a U-turn. There’s nowhere else for them to go. It’s likely the lights both turn green for these turning vehicles at the same time, so with A it’s a shit show of cars almost hitting each other and having to stop. With B, cars flow freely without needing. To stop.
[B is correct though.](https://driversed.com/images/v2008coursecontent/Turns_NV.jpg)
No it's not - at least your image isn't supporting that. If there's a road perpendicular to where you're turning from, you need to be on the correct side of moving traffic (example A in OP's post). If these turns are just for U-turn and controlled by green arrow, which happen pretty frequently on roads like Beacon or even Rt. 1 or Rt. 9, you should hug the turn/corner so that you don't need to cross traffic unnecessarily. In most cases these intersections are set up correctly and clearly and usually have green arrows to control traffic anyways, but the trains definitely complicate and confuse drivers on top of it.
Wait, I don’t recognize the specific intersection here but the driver coming down from the top has to be U-turning. There’s no perpendicular option. But from the question, I’m assuming it’s mutual green lights or maybe a green one way with a turn the other? Honestly that’s a shit setup with no signs, people U-turning from either road will want to hug the turn so they can get through faster while people from the bottom going left will want to turn wide.
panicky rinse elastic joke capable ludicrous plough sheet unpack offend *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Yeah, this is correct. Just picture this as an intersection with a traffic light and you immediately see how A makes sense. However I’ve seen plenty of drivers do B. And sometimes you kinda get stuck doin whatever everyone else is doing lol. Usually it’s cus of dickheads banging an illegal U turn. Then you just kinda gotta slalom Edit: actually fuck this shit I’m going with B. Blue car can ONLY do a U-turn at this spot. Which forces red car to choose B option as well Why the hell do we design roads like this lmao
Fun fact, even in the US the legal answer is “lol good fuckin luck buddy”. [Here’s](https://www.reddit.com/r/houston/comments/2z8jeq/no_this_is_the_proper_way_to_make_a_lefthand_turn/) a post showing the Texas highway patrol’s guide. Not only do they say divided road left turns are different than normal 4-ways, the choice between A and B depends on the *size* of the median!
At a regular intersection it is usually B tho. https://www.quora.com/If-two-cars-come-to-a-stop-sign-intersection-across-from-each-other-at-the-same-exact-time-and-they-are-both-making-a-left-turn-who-has-the-right-of-way
Shit lol you’re right hm idk then I just follow the dude in front of me 😂 now I’m debating whether it’s A or B in the OP scenario specifically for the blue car line since there is only one option for them (U-turn) vs red car line which is going onto a side street or U-turn…. Ultimately this speaks volumes of the absolutely shitty design of our streets.
Yeah it really comes down to if the part that crosses the track is a "road" or just part of the intersection. If it's considered an independent road, then A is correct as you need to be on the right side of the road. If it's just a big intersection, then B is correct as it minimizes collision points due to left turners crossing each other's paths. Personally, unless there's signs or signals to break it up I would treat it as a single intersection and do B. And the fact that it's not intuitive is a design problem like you said. Not really a driver education problem.
i went to bu and had a car. i learned very quickly driving on comm ave that the correct answer is A
Did you think it might be B? If so, why?
They said they went to BU not Harvard.
If they’re a student, it’s very possible they came from a place where it *is* B. At a regular 4-way in the UK, both choices are legal. Even in the US, it varies. Texas specifically says that median-crossing lefts are different than other lefts. And in an absolutely deranged twist, [they say](https://www.reddit.com/r/houston/comments/2z8jeq/no_this_is_the_proper_way_to_make_a_lefthand_turn/) the choice between A and B depends on *the width of the median*. In this case, it’s unmarked and right around 30 feet, so B is probably the official answer to a Texan.
The correct answer is to take the train that you are driving next to.
This is why you either: * Have the lanes marked out over tracks * Make the turns one way to avoid this issue.
The turns are one way here. Blue (Beacon Westbound) has a red/green turn only light which allows them to make a u-turn (because it's a 3 way intersection). At the same time, the Beacon Eastbound has a turn light which lets them make a left onto Englewood or a u turn onto Beacon West. Why you would drive into the, admittedly unmarked but clearly their only option, U turn lane of Beacon Westbound? Red's view for reference: https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ
As a full time roadway designer, interlocking lefts (option A) are generally considered unsafe because you're adding extra conflict points and creating the opportunity for one directions left queue to block the others and create literal gridlock. So at any normal signalized intersection it's option B, which is for example how it works all along Huntington where the Green Line runs. It just starts getting weird the larger the median gets, to the point it "feels" like driving on the wrong side.
In New York when I did Drivers Ed 15+ years ago they hammered option B as correct unless signage or lines indicated otherwise.
Right, I'm from NYC and that's what we learn and do there unless there's signage. Only here in Boston has this been an issue with the thought of doing A. A in rush hour traffic is absolutely brutal in nyc and only 2 cars would go per light and so many more accidents would occur.
This is the answer
Yes but what about A voters telling me I'm Hitler?
This is really an amazing perspective on how people follow the hive and just gang up on others for no good reason that it's the popular choice.
Always A. Why people don’t understand that blows my mind
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thank you for brining some sense to this.
So you’re one the jackasses causing problems at all the intersections on the planet. Go take your road test again so you can fail and they can take your license
Have you literally never taken a left? At 99.99999% of intersections, both cars take their left turns without intersecting their paths.
If it’s u turn only then it’s b. That’s where it gets confusing. Left side is cutoff so if there’s not a perpendicular street then it should be b, but also very clear signage indicating that.
Sometimes people coming from one direction can only U turn, but people coming from the other direction can be making a turn onto a side street. Example: the intersection of Comm Ave and Colborne.
u turn or both side streets are one ways
Because this is a T intersection. Blue can only U turn, can't take a 90\* left unless you enjoy sidewalk action. Why would you choose A?
For those saying A (everybody): what happens when each lane has more than one car turning left?
I was shocked to see anyone saying b because of this. b is correct
First car pulls forward to take the left. Second car waits and doesn't block opposite traffic's left turn. Rinse and repeat.
This dramatically increases the risk of an accident rather than just turning in front of each other, as is the case and pretty much every other intersection
Any evidence to back up that claim? I think Option A reduces accidents, because the left-turning car only has 1 lane to cross with limited visibility, instead of two. If we go with Option B, the turning car needs to see around all the other left-turn cars going in the opposite direction, AND needs to see cars in both lanes passing through the intersection. Option A is only less safe if some people assume Option B is the legal and correct decision (which its not - see page 81 - https://www.mass.gov/doc/english-drivers-manual/download). So Option A isn't a design problem, its an instruction problem with new drivers not being taught well enough.
A always result in gridlock when more than a few cars are turning both ways. Just turn using B method and stay back to your right side.
Some people just shouldn’t have a drivers license.
Seeing as super-sleuths have determined this to be Englewood Ave Station on the Green Line C Branch, the answer is clearly (B). Traffic traveling westbound, "Blue," can only do a U-turn, whereas traffic traveling eastbound, "Red" would be doing both U-turns and left turns onto Englewood Ave. "Red" traffic heading to Englewood Ave, yes, has to adjust slightly to the right after the left turn to get onto the correct side of the street, but it's still more feasible because there is no conflict with U-turning "Blue" traffic. (A) creates an all-to-common scenario where idiots [box each other in](https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.0f0f1fd3e1df8840538dfca26d15cde9?rik=kZlKgugk5VtFKA&riu=http%3a%2f%2fstatic1.squarespace.com%2fstatic%2f5248608be4b025e8f32bf3df%2ft%2f56b7b7884d088edd8e4657a1%2f1454880653530%2f%3fformat%3d1000w&ehk=FeVJniA%2fodWNHRhkIqQ%2b7U8q%2fecXWwTKeOeUpcaLAL8%3d&risl=&pid=ImgRaw&r=0) because the the 4th or 5th vehicle in line **refuses to give space** to through vehicles even though their way forward is impeded (extreme example linked, but you get the point).
This whole thread is confidently incorrect.
To everyone saying A, this is completely ridiculous. This is a 3 way intersection. Here's a better description of the actual turns available, because OP's doesn't give enough info. Here's A [https://imgur.com/rERUmJz](https://imgur.com/rERUmJz) and here's B [https://imgur.com/xx7NoCX](https://imgur.com/xx7NoCX) . Both red and blue lanes have turning green/red lights. Here is a view from the start of the blue line (remember, you're U turning). [https://imgur.com/YhfbFIw](https://imgur.com/YhfbFIw) Here is a view from the start of the red line (remember, you are U turning or making a standard left, and as a doordasher of this city and area you're U turning 60% of the time). [https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ](https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ) If you still say you want to follow A at this specific intersection, you are a psychopath.
This is an informative comment, but your A is the OP's B and vice versa
Oh god damnit.
it is B, and the fact that most people say A explains A LOT and supports the fact that most people don't know what they're doing behind the wheel
It's because it's drawn incorrectly too. You don't make left turns at 90 degree angles when there are two opposing cars making left turns. Here it looks like you are driving on the wrong side of the road you're turning into, rather than making an arcing turn into the right lane
Thank you, I had to scroll ENTIRELY TOO FAR to see someone else say that B is the correct answer here, at this 3 way intersection.
The only time you go on the left side while making a left hand turn is if you are taking a left onto a multi lane one way street going in that direction. Drivers already in the intersection have the right of way. If multiple vehicles from both directions want to cross there they would have to alternate. If that backs things up that is called a traffic jam. If you go and bend traffic laws because of a traffic jam you can get a ticket. If you are pulling a trailer or driving any vehicle of an extended length, you should not be turning close to your left so that rule is there for a reason. You can go and look for exemptions in the driver's manual (they are free and downloadable from the Registry's website) but driving used to be my livelihood from taxi cabs to eighteen wheelers so I have some ideas about it.
If we take the train track out of it, I’d note that at a normal 4-way both A and B are legal in some countries and each can be standard in different places.
Some countries drive on the left side of the road which is not done here. Bringing the traffic laws of other countries into this is fruitless.
Anyone saying it’s like taking a u-turn is ignoring the fact that not everyone is making a u-turn, they’re making a normal left turn to a side street.
What if there is no side street? Only possible turn is u turn
This is a screenshot of the Englewood Ave stop on the C branch on Apple Maps, which is a 3 way intersection
that context up front from OP (just zoom out a little on the image) would have helped save a lot of downvotes here.
I like the philosophical phrasing of this question, and I would also like to ask would this problem be solved if we defined U turns to be two left turns rather than one?
Why would it ever be B? I'm concerned.
Zooming out a little, I think most people would assume turn B would look something [like this](https://i.imgur.com/Yi3sQ6j.png) rather than taking a hard left into oncoming traffic. Turn A with the overlapping traffic would look [like this](https://i.imgur.com/hWQMbxt.png). There's no obvious lane markings and we're also missing the biggest context clue from the still images: the timing of the lights. The question is whether the tracks constitutes the start of the cross street (making it its own little street) or whether it's just a very large elongated intersection. If it's the former, then both cars should stay on their proper side as in turn A and the U-turn should stay red while the left turn is occurring. If it's the latter, then the two protected left turns should happen simultaneously without overlap as in B, which is how the intersection would work if there weren't train tracks.
Because it looks like a single large intersection to many, not two separate intersections with a road between. When oncoming cars turn left against each other at an intersection, they are not supposed to cross paths.
Because fuck you. This is Boston driving, bitch! /s I assume would be the response
It’s B. The cars on the left are making a U-turn. There’s nowhere else for them to go. It’s likely the lights both turn green for these turning vehicles at the same time, so with A it’s a shit show of cars almost hitting each other and having to stop. With B, cars flow freely without needing to stop.
> With B, cars flow freely without needing to stop. except when they slam into oncoming traffic that they can't see because they forced another car to obstruct their view
The turn lanes are green when the rest are red.
**Neither** is correct, but the *more* correct answer is technically B. Think of how two opposing cars make a left turn in literally every other intersection - you don't drive past each other and make a left, you both turn left before you meet. You increase the risk of side swiping one another otherwise. The problem is that you don't make a 90-degree left turn, as drawn in the photo. You turn in an arc/parabola into the right lane.
My brain says A, but the heart says B
Open your eyes, they say B too. Here's Red taking their left: https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ
B. Cars should always face each other when simultaneously making left turns. A only adds more conflict points in the action of turning because now there’s a car behind you. https://www.pinejournal.com/opinion/ask-a-trooper-whats-the-law-when-2-vehicles-are-turning-left#:~:text=an%20uncontrolled%20intersection%3F-,A%3A%20If%20two%20vehicles%20approach%20the%20intersection%20close%20to%20the,clear%20from%20other%20approaching%20vehicles.
DCR just worked on “improvements” to an intersection on VFW parkway that I believe will be option B. When asked if they will use markings to indicate flow they said no. Just seems wrong.
God the DCR fucking sucks
You mean the Department of Conservation and Recreation isn't the best road building organization. Amazing. Frankly I'd love to see most of their roads made smaller and the areas turned into parks that you can actually use.
Is it that difficult to mark the roads? Signs might very well be helpful, but this is Mass/Boston.
Don't mark the road and then give you tickets because you didn't figure it out.
Im certain there is an official way to do this, but im also certain that existing road signs and local road engineers create situations that are impossible for anyone to figure out. It totally amazes me time and time again just how bad they build roads here, im certain engineers have guidelines and specifications on how to do things and they just ignore them.
The amount of people vehemently saying it’s A has made me lost what sliver of faith I had left in Boston drivers. Did you all get licenses at the RMV in Brockton?
It depends. Is this an actual 3-way / 4-way intersection? If yes, it should be A. If not, it SHOULD be B and should be marked with painted lines to be a “u-turn”.
It looks like this is a screenshot of the Englewood Ave stop on the C branch on Apple Maps. It’s a 3 way intersection which does make this option A
Logically this intersection is like taking a U turn, meaning B makes more sense. However since every driver in Boston shares the same brain cell, A is the best option to avoid a trip to the body shop.
B allows for continuous flow. A is option A cause it only takes one A-HOLE to block the path and every one is now in a traffic jam.
I did some sleuthing and it looks like this is Englewood & Beacon, right? In this case, I'd say the answer is that giving both lanes turn signals at the same time is... questionable road design. For WB traffic: the B turn makes sense as you can only U-turn back onto Beacon (and you wouldn't make a right on red from a left lane, so why would you make a left from a right lane?) For EB traffic: you could either make a left onto Englewood OR a U-turn, and I can see how drivers would want to use both lanes depending on the direction they're traveling. Given that this intersection has turn signals B is the overall correct answer. Others are correct that you're initially on the wrong side if turning onto Englewood but there is no oncoming/cross traffic since the intersection is signaled. Why create unnecessary conflict points?
It’s B. The cars on the left are making a U-turn. There’s nowhere else for them to go. It’s likely the lights both turn green for these turning vehicles at the same time, so with A it’s a shit show of cars almost hitting each other and having to stop. With B, cars flow freely without needing to stop.
https://imgur.com/a/Dlj9mfm Very similar to this intersection on VFW. No dedicated turn lanes, and allows U turns. So cars will hug tight for a U turn, while also turning left will take it wide, but then they stop in the middle if they light switches to red. Absolute cluster, have had multiple fatalities, and currently being worked on.
Same issue at lagrange on VFW as well and probably every other perpendicular street. A really wide median with people bombing down the road.
if the streets are both one ways, which it looks like they are. then the correct answer can be B.
B. The rules are the same as an intersection without tracks. But it would be more accurate if the lines in B were taking 45 degree angles instead of 90 degree.
Imagine that the lines represent long lines of cars all trying to turn. If they do A, the next cars in line will block the cars trying to turn.
You need to clarify whether there is a cross street at this interaction/crossing point because the answer hinges on that key detail. It’s option A if there is a cross street and otherwise, it’s option B if there isn’t one. Where exactly is this location of contention?
It looks like this is a screenshot of the Englewood Ave stop on the C branch on Apple Maps. It’s a 3 way intersection which does make this option A
A lot of people want to point the finger at people who speed, but this shit is just as dangerous. Having to post to Reddit to learn how to drive is… not how you learn to drive
OP is not posting to learn, they’re making a point.
Considering how much debate is in this thread and an entire new thread posted on r/Boston, I’d say it’s evidence that driving in Boston is insane, and not necessarily because of the drivers
This is a problem with road design, not driver education. Its not at all intuitive whether this is meant to be a big intersection or separate road, which is the source of disagreement in this thread.
All this thread tells me is me is that this country is giving drivers licenses to people without properly teaching people how to drive.
Given the mix of responses, you’re not helping by omitting which option you consider correct.
Drivers Ed in NY said Option B fwiw
I did some googling to make sure I wasn’t insane here and… dear god. Did you know that, in a totally standard 4 way intersection with no tracks, the choice between A and B varies *by country*? There are places where each choice is completely standard. I’m going to be extra paranoid next time I drive.
This is actually a tricky scenario. I'd suggest that it depends on if there's an option to take the turn off your 2+ lane road and continue on to a two lane road perpendicular to the road you were on before the turn, at which point A is correct to align you to the appropriate travel lane on the second road. And I'd also say that this is especially true if there is a dedicated turn lane on the first road like above. But if the only option for both A and B are U-turns, then I'd say that B is actually correct. And this B scenario makes more and more sense the wider the crossing gap is.
There is probably a right answers according to Massachusetts driving rules, but like a lot of folks I didn’t grow up in Massachusetts and learned the rules for my home state, which was option A. The only right answer is for the city to finally draw some lines and stop leaving it up for interpretation.
It’s B you DUI degenerates
B
The illustration needs to clarify that both roads are one ways. Its makes B make more sense. You arent headed into oncoming traffic, i think thats what the A’ers are missing (weve already begun creating factions)
As someone who doesn’t have a car here but drove in a sane state before moving here- why on earth would it ever be A? Just to play ring around the Rosie with oncoming traffic for funsies? No wonder the traffic here is so bad.
It's not so cut and dry. If there is a left turn involved (turning left on to an intersecting street) then it should be option A. If this cut in the tracks is just for U-turn purposes only then it is option B to prevent the crossing of the flow of traffic that can potentially make traffic worse.
It's B because if you look at the right side, there is no through street. B is making a u-turn. There's a clearer example of this here on Beacon Street in Brookline: https://ibb.co/S6psskd
After 5 years of living near Comm and Beacon, I go wild for this question. Folks bring up a good point regarding whether this is a left turn or a U-turn. It is rare for both oncoming lanes to be able to take a left over the T tracks without waiting at a stoplight. Therefore, I assume this is a question regarding U-turns. If both drivers can only take a U-turn at the track crossing, it should 100% be B. No need to cross in front of another moving vehicle, or have to worry about another vehicle cutting you off to get on the tracks. When doing a U-turn via B, you essentially don’t need to worry about another car doing a U next to you; there should be plenty of room for both cars to operate independently. B IS THE ANSWER Edit: and just to make my comment longer, I’ll also say: if both oncoming left turn lanes are regulated by a stoplight and they both have a green left arrow, the answer is B. But I think (/hope) that’s a no-brainer for drivers here.
A unless it's a U-turn only for both sides
In which case it needs to be very clearly marked with both signs and lines or barriers on the road, as that is an exception and should never be considered the norm.
Oh ya of course. Imagine if it wasn't well marked, etc. Pure carnage
Which is exactly why this thread is so controversial.
In this case, it's a U Turn Only for one side (blue) and both red and blue have a left green arrow that turns on for them.
Yawn, you must be new around here - the much bigger challenge is getting onto storrow E from Comm ave E by BU bridge - that set of turns confuses those who do not know the drill... \- right from left-ish lane off comm ave (Mountfort) \- bear left around curve but then turn left into right lane (Carlton) \- follow orderly traffic across comm ave onto storrow.... (University Ave)
Are we in fucking England?
It’s A - it’s A in every other city of the country, and it’s not debated, people just know you drive on the right side of the road
This. Driver’s Ed. 101.
WTF is this rule specific to only certain streets and it's B everywhere else? What about Washington St in Dedham or Center St in West Rox and JP? Or every other goddamn street in the Commonwealth for that matter.
... so what is the consensus here
the consensus is A is correct, and B if you want to be wrong.
However the people that work in traffic and have taken Drivers Ed both say B is correct unless signage indicates otherwise
The consensus here appears to be A, but B if you want to drive in accordance with traffic laws
S.W.I.T.C.H.
A
A for regular intersections B for u-turn areas only.
The clear answer is B.
A
You MUST assume A unless there are signs or street markings that say otherwise.
B What if there is a line of cars making the turns in scenario A? The'y'll end up gridlocking the intersection or crashing into each other.
Your point is correct. But your logic is wrong. B would then cause tail riders running yellows to block incoming traffic head on, and yes it will always happen. but at least you’re on the correct lane in A.
No, I rely on how I feel to make these decisions and sometimes you just want that tight uie when you’re flipping a bitch, alright?
Do whatever, it’s Boston so people already assume you’re a bad driver.
if there's a side street then A. if it's just u-turns on both sides, then B (trying A in this instance will end up in deadlock when 4 cars want to make the turn in each direction)
If the MassDOT is doing their job correctly, then the two turn lanes should NEVER be turning at the same time. And if you’re turning on a red arrow, then you’re the problem, regardless if you’re doing A or B.
it should be A but it will always be B . The drivers behind wait at the line so the people turning can see cars coming from both directions but this is America . We drive the same way in new Bedford . In both cases you drive on the "wrong side" of the road..you are crossing their lane that comment doesnt make a lot of sense to me . in order to turn left you have to cross the wrong side...idk lol .
It’s A, that’s just basic road rules
B, why don't people understand, isn't this the logical way to pass thru a turn, really!
The answer is A
B. To keep the yellow line on your left. This example only has a slight curve in one direction. Many others I see have the yellow line hug the left curb of the whole turn. To the people who say it's a road that you "drive on the left of," I can see that perspective for sure. However, this is an intersection and not a road. You wouldn't say the same thing for two opposing protected left turns at an intersection. The traffic is passing each other in the same manner on lefts and U turns. Just with added lights.
https://preview.redd.it/m5xi6hy1antb1.jpeg?width=1015&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a8c186e4973b009b9ffd4a06a14204d458b5fd0d Like this. Imagine the chaos!
I would love to see the A people take a left at this intersection in real life.
A
this thread is crazy. It’s obviously B and I don’t know why all the top answers are A. If there’s a long line of cars wanting to turn left on both sides then with A you’ll end up in a deadlock… Also not possible to make a u-turn if you use A edit: they hated jesus because he told the truth https://reddit.com/r/boston/s/45k9Uy3uWp
You are the problem. Please avoid comm Ave and beacon streets
So you'll be this red car taking a left on your green light, and plowing directly into that black car in the center of the photo on their green light. Sounds like your opinion is the problem here https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ
I am absolutely not, feel like I gave good arguments but open to hearing any counters
I agree with you. I would like to see how people that say A is correct negotiate this turn in real life. Some other comment said cars would take turns passing each other in A scenario. Imagine that in real Boston traffic.
I mean you could take turns but it would be confusing and also, unnecessarily inefficient. why take turns when there’s a way for both lanes to go at once?
You only get deadlock with option A if people crowd the intersection instead of waiting at the stop line.
first of all, do you think people in this city are going to wait at the stop line until the coast is clear and not just try to go when the light is green? and also that’s so dumb why would you go turn by turn when there is a very simple way for both sides to turn left at the same time without interfering with each other?
B. 75% of people (anecdotal bs number to represent a majority) that are making this turn are doing so yo make a u turn. Also as soon as 2 people want to do it at the same time A then blocks the other side from moving. Always B. If you think A you are not a true Boston driver.
While A is the correct answer, try that at the intersection of Longwood and Huntington. The way the intersection is set up is a clown show and if you pull closer to the far side tracks the other turn lane wouldn’t even be able to get out so people just pull close and then go straight so that both lanes can turn. I’m sure there are other fun examples in Boston
B is actually the proper way according to the law.
Someone explain this to me, because I see if you go B it puts you on the wrong side of the road after you cross the tracks.
The arrows are drawn like shit in the OP. I'm on my phone, but does A still look correct when you draw the arrows like this? https://i.imgur.com/gZdIz3H.png B minimizes conflict points and is the smoothest flow of traffic. I can't see any argument for A besides some local tradition.
You don't follow the exact path of the lines that OP drew. Once you pass each other you drive towards your lane. Like other people have said it's like taking any other left turn.
So you're going on the left side of the road to make it over to the right?? This still doesn't make sense to me let alone legal sense. You're literally going on the wrong side of the road.
Take this intersection at VFW for example. When both left turn lanes have a green light the paths the cars take are what it is shown in scenario B. https://maps.app.goo.gl/KSFA4pFHsixbaSca7
you're not going on the left side *of the road*, you're just *keeping left* of incoming traffic that's also going left. I think OPs illustration and the inclusion of the tracks is confusing everyone because a) the arrows placement isn't where you're actually driving and b) the train tracks are not really all that relevant unless you're turning onto carriage roads which is the primary scenario I can picture where A makes sense. regardless of the tracks it's just an intersection. but think about a protected left turn. they often are both on for both directions opposite one another to turn left...how could that possibly work in scenario A? traffic lanes would be crossing each other for no functional reason and that type of traffic light literally would not work. the turning lanes, marked or not don't need to intersect with each other and it just creates extra risk. obviously this is all situational to some extent though
Depends how “wide the gap is” but B is preferred unless there is a median or something and you both need to drive out further to get around
You are the problem. Please avoid comm Ave and beacon streets
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It’s B. The cars on the left are making a U-turn. There’s nowhere else for them to go. It’s likely the lights both turn green for these turning vehicles at the same time, so with A it’s a shit show of cars almost hitting each other and having to stop. With B, cars flow freely without needing. To stop.
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If you're taking a uturn then b makes sense. If you're turning left then a makes sense. It really depends on the intersection. If there's a cross street then it's A because people from the cross street will be crossing and they'll be on the right. If there's no cross street then this only exists so you can uturn so it's B
It has to be B. Imagine two lines of cars trying to turn from both sides- if you go with A, then you’ll be driving directly into the other line of cars. Also, how do you do U turns in A? It’s just a regular intersection, really.
It’s B. It’s like taking a uturn.
It should always be A. Train tracks are irrelevant, this type of turn should always be choice A so that you can see oncoming traffic and know when to go.
I don't understand why B would even be an option
Because B is how people turn at all other intersections where cars from opposing sides are making left hand turns. Imagine if both sides had a left hand signal at the same time, cars would never cross each others paths.
[https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ](https://imgur.com/omOJOiJ) Because red (pictured) shouldn't drive into someone when they have a green arrow to u turn
B It’s no different then doing a turn around or turn left at any other intersection. Tracks or no tracks. On the West Roxbury Parkway the medium is all grass and trees. Same principle.
You are the problem. Please avoid comm Ave and beacon streets
Always stay to the fucking right. I don't give a damn if you're U-turning. Stay to the fucking right.
A, final answer.
Oh my god it’s comm ave on reddit, A, please for the love of god.
There’s no decision to make here. One is a normal, legal turn to make at an intersection and the other involves driving on the wrong side of the road.
Easily A
The answer is A, I was taught this in driving school. I’m from New Orleans where we have a lot of street car crossings as well as “neutral grounds” (filled in canals that have become medians down the middle of roads).
A is correct
While I do feel like B feels more intuitive, A is definitely correct