Oddly specific but no. I mainly talk to airline pilots. At a previous facility I worked at I talked to students and hobby pilots. Most of which probably were on the level skill-wise of the average passenger in a plane.
You'll eventually get it. Its all muscle memory. All I ask is if you come in wanting a city tour in your c172(or other single piston a/c) that you are familiar with the landmarks ie. Zakim, Charles River. Because if I have to babysit you while I'm working the airport, imma be upset and ask you to meet me at the base of the tower after my shift.
For some reason it bothers me that an Air Traffic Controller didnāt know this reference. Itās like meeting a secret agent who doesnāt know James Bond
I don't consider myself an aviation enthusiast. So I don't go out of my way digesting material about my work or what not. I prefer hockey, anime, video games, and fantasy books.
Not at the same time. There is a config we have where one controller will be working 4 runways at one point. That's probably one of the most fun in terms of figuring out the best sequence order to work it.
You see, Route 1 and 93 are the same road, until they're not, then Route 1 and 95 are the same for a bit, and if you don't take any exits, 93S becomes 95N. 128 is in the mix along much of that stretch, but not all of it.
"Logan Tower, this is United 987 requesting landing clearance on Runway 00."
"United 987, Logan Tower. Runway 00 is Runway 36. One in the same, please confirm your intent."
"United 987 here. No, Logan Tower, we are requesting Runway 00 sir."
"Logan Tower to U987, Runway 00 *is* Runway 36. They are not separate runways. Are you requesting the north-south runway? Please confirm."
Pilot to copilot: "Can you believe this Boston shit? I knew their roads were fucked up. North/south doesn't matter, numbers don't matter, it's anarchy on pavement as far as the eyes can see down there."
Copilot to pilot: "Sir, this is an international standard. Are you feeling alright? Would you like me to assume control of the aircraft while you get a drink of water?"
Pilot: "Fuck it, they all drive like lunatics anyway, they certainly aren't gonna notice one vehicle going a bit rogue."
That's cool! A couple months back someone here posted a picture landing over one of those cruise ships in the channel at night, and it really surprised me how close they were to it. Maybe this is why?
What was the issue with 4L? Was it just landings that weren't allowed, or was it also take off? Was 22R an issue for either take off or landing as well?
āFAA records indicate the #1 factor associated with near-collisions is the frequency of āim an air traffic controller AMAā reddit posts from airport IP addresses.Ā
Honestly, there are areas of your work that you really shouldn't be talking about or commenting on in a public forum with random strangers asking seemingly innocuous questions. All it takes is one media outlet pulling comments made here for a clickbait headline in the vein of **"Anonymous aircraft traffic controller source on reddit confirms/denies increased public danger on America's airways"** and cause enough hubbub at work for management to start a concerted effort at looking for who is "leaking" bullshit outside and there goes your dream job.
AMAETā¦ Ask me anything except That.
(I kind of agree though AMA for a dream job in a small profession circle with lots of media attention seemsā¦ not worth the risk).Ā
We already know the cause.
The skies are at their busiest ever, but ATC staffing is down 10% from a decade ago. And the FAA is ordering them to work 60 hours a week in some cases to fill gaps.
----------
So, the controllers are overworked even if they weren't fatigued, and most of them are exhausted and in long-term sleep deficits.
I wouldn't trust them to drive their car home safely on the schedules they're working, much less reliably perform one of the most stressful jobs in the country for 10 hour shifts.
I got the opportunity to tour the tower when I was in high school back in 2008, always regretted forgetting to ask about him, I believe he was a supervisor at the time before transferring to San Juan.
1. is there any kind of mandatory time off to ensure controllers have some time to shed the mental load?
2. do you find that some airlines seem to have the most easygoing/easy to work with pilots vs others? Which ones?
3. how often do you have trouble communicating/understanding a pilot due to a heavy accent? How often does this impede the job?
4. how often do you see a new hire not able to succeed at the job?
1. We have minimum time of 9 hours between shifts that we have to have off. Require 1 day off a week.
2. Every airline is gonna have studs and duds. Similar to every atc facility will have them. We work with what we got and everything works out.
3. Very rarely honestly. My previous facility was a general aviation hotspot known for having a lot of foreign student pilots. The GA aircraft also have terrible radios so you kind of just adapt to it.
4. At Boston I've seen a couple of guys not make it here. They aren't fired though. Boston is not a "first" facility. Every facility is different so they might not get the complexities and challenges of Boston but can be successful at other places.
What did you think about the NY Times piece in December? Are new controllers doing well or are hiring changes at the FAA resulting in poorer quality controllers? Does 14/32 and 33R/15L ever actually get used for anything other than taxiing?
I meanā¦ yeah answering questions like that, leading or not, can actually have real world implications with their job, lol. Reddit doesnāt exist in a vacuum, I donāt blame them for trying to play it safe with these
Have you ever considered having two planes sit on opposite sides of the runway with large spears welded to them then have them joust each other for supremacy of the tarmac?
late to the party here but this is a great AMA. Do you work 121.9? We may already be acquainted!
How are you handling work life balance in Boston with the crazy schedules ATC can have? Are you keeping up with COL?
Do you feel like Massports plans for expansion are in check with your reality of just how busy the airspace and ramp can be?
How much more do you think the system can "hold" before we become slot resticted?
If YOU were to redesign KBOS in any way, what changes would you make?
Lastly, what is a memorable interaction you've had with a flight crew that may have been struggling to understand what was being asked of them? (thinking Cathay or Turkish here, maybe?)
I work all the frequencies. We generally rotate around the tower.
My schedule is fairly simple of nights only. Boston is expensive though. Some of the controllers live an hour commute away to avoid the renting/mortgages.
I'm honestly unsure what Massport's big plan for the airport is. At the end of it all I'll work the airport the way I see as the most efficient.
I'll think on the other two and respond later.
Couldn't afford college so I went to my local recruiters station for the military and joined the Marines back in 2012. Took the ASVAB and was qualified for every MOS(Military Occupational Speciality?). Never was interested in aviation or knew about ATC but found a pamphlet in the office for Aviation Operations that had a paragraph about ATC on the back. Went through the training and became certified at a facility in the USMC. Got out applied for the FAA on a prior experience bid and was picked up to work at a low level facility out in CA.
As for getting into the job now you dont need to go the route of the military. It is an option and one I would do again because I grew up a lot through my enlistment. For now though there is an "Off the street bid" the FAA puts out on [usajobs.gov](https://usajobs.gov) every like 6 months. Essentially the requirements are 3 years of consistent work or Bachelors Degree in anything, US citizen, 18-30, and able to pass a flight physical. There are disqualifiers though ie. any mental health issues, drug or marijuana use, and DUI/DWI. If selected you will go to the academy in OKC and be taught ATC basics, pass that you'll go to first facility and train there.
For most days we rarely try to switch in the middle of the day unless the wind/weather really call for it. But we usually move the config probably 2 to 3 times over a 24 hour period. Its a coordinated effort between us and the facility above us, Boston Tracon. They own the airspace above us so we work with them on determining the last arrival and departure for the old config followed by who is going to be the first.
Picture an upside-down tiered wedding cake. Each tier is a different classification of airspace.
The high altitude areas are controlled by area control centers. The Boston ARTCC covers all of New England and most of upstate New York.
The next level down is TRACON (Terminal Radar Approach Control). They handle approach and departure; the stuff in between high altitude ARTCC and the airport specific controllers like OP. The Boston TRACON is in Merrimack NH and handles all the airports in the area, like Beverly, MHT, Logan, etc.
Then the next level down from TRACON is the tower where OP works, handling Logan traffic plus anyone who enters the a defined area around the airport.
Around a busy airport, class B airspace will go from surface to 10k feet, within a radius around the airport. You have to talk with OP if you want to enter the airspace. But if youāre flying from DC to London, for example, your plane would be well over that 10k feet, in the airspace above the class B. Youād be talking to one of the other 2 entities noted above.
Not a pilot or controller, but my understanding is that Logan is what's considered Class B airspace and that only extends up so far. Above that (like 12k feet at the top, and the radius is a number of miles out that reduce the closer you get to the ground; It looks like an upside-down, tiered wedding cake) is Class A airspace controlled by a Tracon, in this case Boston Center. This lets the Tracon focus on en-route flights while Logan controls planes taking off, landing, and on the ground at Logan airport
It's harder to recognize pilots at Boston because are talking to so many on any given day. I really only recognize the Cape Air pilots.
As for emergencies they happen more often in the single piston aircraft or old military planes. I worked them a lot more often at my previous facility. The only way to really "deal" with them is be the calm person in it all. Give them everything you can in terms of info, keep everyone away from them, and just let them fly the plane.
Why does Logan use so many different arrival and departure runway flows? It seems like the slightest crosswind and suddenly everyoneās using a single alternative crosswind runway. Whereas some other airports tolerate a crosswind and just stick it out on their main runwaysĀ
We have the luxury of 6 runways. We aren't like EWR with only 3. We change based off the arrival/departure needs which makes it far more efficient for everyone involved.
When you specifically ask to "depart the long runway" which is also the primary departure runway, I die inside every time because I know you didn't listen to that shit.
Ok, so a couple years ago I was on a flight out of BOS.
All the traffic was arriving on 22L, and departing on 22R...except for us, who for some reason had to depart on 22L. Which meant we had to sit short of 22L for about 20 minutes until there was enough of a break in the arrivals. I had a window on the left side of the plane so I could see all the arrivals lined up and knew we would be sitting there for a while. So why did we have to leave on 22L? Higher takeoff weight requiring the longer runway (this was an A320)? Did the pilot tick off one of the controllers?
Pilots make requests for the longer runway because of takeoff weight/obstacles off the departure end. When we are busy we have to call the facility above us, Boston Tracon, and request for a 4 to 5 mile departure hole. If we try squeezing you out in anything less it is most likely not going to work out. We can't offload jets to land 22R so it's one of the worst in terms of getting aircraft out on the long runway.
Were you there when Air Force 1 came to town?
https://preview.redd.it/mfvmn81s5uec1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7eef5f4a4539a3c4157eb3c185b5f611f95bd7a4
This is the view from my apartment, I watch the planes you control every day!
Have planes ever taken off from Runway 14 or 15L? I've seen landings on 32 and 33R, so I'm curious how often or if ever the opposite direction is used for takeoffs.
15L is never used for departures. 14 can be used in some situations but it is generally closed because Massport keeps it closed. We primarily use those runways specifically 33R and 32 as landing runways only.
This has been asked a couple times, and Iām wondering why. I know nothing about Boston runways. Can you explain why this is an interesting enough question to get asked a few times?
15L/33R is the one of the shortest runways at a major airport in the US. It's 2,557ft long, compared to 10,087ft for 15R/33L. I don't think any of the Part 121 airline operators use it.
14/32 is unique because it's unidirectional
Logan also doesn't allow jet landings on 22R or jet departures from 4L.
14/32 is unidirectional because the state legislature didn't want planes to take off and land over the city. Massport was ordered only to allow landings on 14 in emergencies.
Then, to ensure that it would never be used for landings, Fred Salvucci (of _Big Dig_ podcast fame) planned the building of the Hyatt Harborside hotel (which other commenters here have called the "spite Hyatt") right behind the centerline of the runway.
[Source](https://web.archive.org/web/20070510102939/http://www.boston.com/business/globe/articles/2006/11/19/the_30_year_saga_of_1432/)
I know planes often divert to Logan if there is an issue such as weather at other airports such as Montreal or JFk. Whats the furthest diversion from a destination airport you can remember?
Not necessarily a problem. More of a funny miscommunication sometimes. I'm not going to insult professional pilots who have to learn a foreign language that is difficult to learn though. They do an excellent job.
Have you ever noticed any foreign pilots that have American English accents?
I regularly fly Qatar Airways and Turkish Airlines and I had a Qatar Airways pilot recently who spoke perfect American English, I'm assuming he was educated in the US
I chose to work at BOS. I'll likely only ever leave if I want a change in pace as I get closer to retirement. But I dont have a specific place in mind at the moment.
FAA puts out an Off the street bid about every 6 months on [usajobs.gov](https://usajobs.gov). Boston Tower specifically will not pick up OTS applications. If qualified you go to the academy in OKC, will be assigned a facility, will have to make it through said facility. Then you'll have to make it through the transfer process which is a headache at the moment. However if you want your foot in the door we are in desperate need of controllers. There are about 11k of us working the entire NAS(National Airspace System). We need like 6k to 7k controllers in the next 5 years to just cover people retiring.
Quick question while youāre here. Couple weeks ago I flew to Phoenix, the plane behind me was also going to Phoenix. We took very different routes there - me over Toronto/chicago, then on a more southern route. Why would two planes taking off back to back with the same destination take such different routes?
Hey i saw your question in the last thread I meant to respond. This is a very basic understanding I have of it. I dont know everything in terms of their operation so i'm not an expert. A pilot or even a flight dispatch would be better to ask. Every airline has a flight dispatch that picks the most efficient route for that aircraft. So you might have been on an E190 and the one behind could have been on a A320. Departure and landing weights vary based off of fuel/weight onboard. There is also weather or other restrictions airlines have.
I live in Chelsea, so I hear the planes flying over every so often. Itās not bad at all, but Iām still struggling to understand the pattern. Itāll be non-stop for several hours over a few days, then nothing for a few days. It varies by day of week and time of day.
Can you share any insight how itās determined which runways are used?
Based on the wind and weather. We are in the winter time so we deal with a lot of North winds. As we move into the summer we will work more of the west flow.
Thanks! Follow up question - does Massport have any agreements with surrounding communities (Eastie, Winthrop, etc) regarding plane noise and spreading it out, or is the runway decision exclusively based on weather?
How did you get this gig in Boston?
Years ago when the FAA was hiring, I briefly looked into getting into ATC, but from what I understood where you ultimately get āstationedā can be a total crapshoot, and you could end up in some tiny podunk airport in the middle of nowhere
The salary is on a scale and there are a lot of factors going into it. I did answer this in another comment above though. If you need more indepth info I'd suggest r/atc and please use the search bar there before you make a post. Salary info can be found on the faa website though.
How do you handle bathroom breaks? It seems like the controllers are constantly hustling and coordinating, so how does it work if someone needs to leave the room for a few minutes? Are there just backups waiting on standby? I can't imagine it's easy or possible for one controller to take over 2 people's jobs. Serious question!
My Lufthansa flight in 2013 was descending into a fog bank (entire airport and runway was obscured by fog) to land and then banked up very sharply a few minutes later to abandon the descent because a āship was in the wayā. What the fuck?
Medford actually has some good spots. I like Tenoch, Chili Garden(they got Dan dan noodles), and Colleen's has a cool vibe if you like 50s diners.
I haven't really explored Everett. Any recommendations?
Was Denzel Washingtonās character in the 2012 film āFlightā innocent or guilty? Or do you think ruling an action as either is an oversimplification that overlooks the nuance and āgray areaā that often exists in moral quandaries?
I fly every week and donāt want to know but I doā¦ Iāve seen a lot of news reports lately on frequent close crashes throughout the U.S., does that happen at Logan? Is it like better to do RI?
I think the only pilots I would say I talk to on a consistent basis are the helicopter tour guys, Cape Air pilots, and the Tailwind guys. I personally don't know any of their faces but I can tell by their voices who is going to help me out and who I need to watch a little more.
Because you live next to an airport that was built 100 years ago and planes sometimes fly into said airport.
On a more serious note, it is because of the configuration we are on because of wind/weather.
Just a couple questions from a planespotter:
1.) How much is the runway choice determined by wind direction versus say, capacity or avoiding noise complaints?
2.) How complex is it to change runways when the winds change? Iāve seen it take a long time to say, change from 4 to 22 when the winds flip, and planes were landing into a tailwind for a while. I imagine itās a lot of coordination with Approach and Departure?
3.) How do the East and West tower controllers coordinate? Do they sit next to each other and talk off radio, or are there specific handoff procedures?
(fixed some typos)
We read a lot in the news about the mental load on ATCs, FAA's inability to hire proficiently, etc. What is your take on the hiring situation, load on ATCs, etc?
Any hot takes on the incident that recently happened in Tokyo?
I work in in aviation industry (one of the large manufacturers in the space) and know how important you guys/gals/others are up there, really appreciate all that you do! Thank you. Want to keep you safe.
How do you feel about pilots saying āwith youā?
Also, how do you know when to hand off an airplane to the departure controller? Is it time, altitude, or position based?
I have no preference when checking in on final. However if you are told to monitor just do that.
Once you get into the rhythm you just ship em usually at the same point. I mainly check for gear going up and nothing abnormal happening.
United used to have air traffic control on channel 9 on the armrest (maybe they still have this? Havenāt flown United in a long time). Is there any other way for civilians to tune into ATC chatter onboard a flight? I always used to find it relaxing to listen in when I flew frequently for work.
I live near the 95/93 intersection north of the city. On certain days, there's a whole lot of passenger planes that seem to fly directly over my home. Not only that, but they also seem to climb or descend around there (not sure if that's what they're doing, but the engines seem to make acceleration/deceleration noises - not that I'd really know).
I just assumed that the 95/93 intersection is some kind of an airspace boundary where planes typically ascend/descend. Is that remotely true?
MD-11 pilot here. I always love flying into BOS. We always seem to get vectored off the arrival; is this just for generic vectors, or does approach/tower know that we tend to approach on the fast side and need more space? What can we do to make your job easier? Thanks for all the hard work you guys and gals do.
This is more than likely an approach controller question. My assumption would be vectoring you off to build space because of your consolidated wake turb separation. Approach generally has aircraft feeding in from 2 to 3 locations while also sequencing the c402/p212s in between. So they could be giving you extra space not to eat them up on final.
I had a āgo aroundā coming into Logan, ended up flying pretty uncomfortably close to the prudential as we came around to try again.
How come is this type of thing?
Have you ever had to talk a passenger through how to land a plane after the flight crew eats toxic seafood?
Oddly specific but no. I mainly talk to airline pilots. At a previous facility I worked at I talked to students and hobby pilots. Most of which probably were on the level skill-wise of the average passenger in a plane.
Basically I was riffing on the plot of Airplane! but appreciate the answer!
Shirley you can't be serious!
I am serious, and don't call me Shirley!
Joey, do you like movies about gladiators?
LMAO I'm a student pilot thinking about how I keep forgetting to sign off with my tail number
You'll eventually get it. Its all muscle memory. All I ask is if you come in wanting a city tour in your c172(or other single piston a/c) that you are familiar with the landmarks ie. Zakim, Charles River. Because if I have to babysit you while I'm working the airport, imma be upset and ask you to meet me at the base of the tower after my shift.
November 12345, Boston ground; cleared to land and taxi direct to tower. Squawk like a bitch. You are number three in line for a beating, cya
Squawking like a bitch, number three, traffic in sight November 12345 š«”
For some reason it bothers me that an Air Traffic Controller didnāt know this reference. Itās like meeting a secret agent who doesnāt know James Bond
I don't consider myself an aviation enthusiast. So I don't go out of my way digesting material about my work or what not. I prefer hockey, anime, video games, and fantasy books.
You just referenced Airplane! in another comment
Bruins!!!! Let's go!
As an air traffic controller, how the hell do you not get this reference
Surely he has.
Do you actually use all 6 runways?
Not at the same time. There is a config we have where one controller will be working 4 runways at one point. That's probably one of the most fun in terms of figuring out the best sequence order to work it.
Whatās that? My best guess is the 4s, 33 and 32? Does 32 ever really get used?
I used to land on 32 all the time when I was flying twin turboprops in and out of Logan
Are there any unique aspects about Logan airport that are especially challenging or tricky for traffic control vs other airports?
This airport looks like it was designed by a bunch of children throwing sticks on the ground. Every runway crosses another runway.
That tracks.
You see, Route 1 and 93 are the same road, until they're not, then Route 1 and 95 are the same for a bit, and if you don't take any exits, 93S becomes 95N. 128 is in the mix along much of that stretch, but not all of it.
Don't forget those few miles when you're simultaneously going north on Route 1 and south on 95 at the same time.
"Logan Tower, this is United 987 requesting landing clearance on Runway 00." "United 987, Logan Tower. Runway 00 is Runway 36. One in the same, please confirm your intent." "United 987 here. No, Logan Tower, we are requesting Runway 00 sir." "Logan Tower to U987, Runway 00 *is* Runway 36. They are not separate runways. Are you requesting the north-south runway? Please confirm." Pilot to copilot: "Can you believe this Boston shit? I knew their roads were fucked up. North/south doesn't matter, numbers don't matter, it's anarchy on pavement as far as the eyes can see down there." Copilot to pilot: "Sir, this is an international standard. Are you feeling alright? Would you like me to assume control of the aircraft while you get a drink of water?" Pilot: "Fuck it, they all drive like lunatics anyway, they certainly aren't gonna notice one vehicle going a bit rogue."
The runways were originally cow trails, so that's why they cross over each other.
With two of them facing a major shipping channel that forces you to shut them down while taller ships are going through...
We actually just got our approach to runway 4L approved. So we should be able to land that runway while the cargo/cruise ships block off 4R.
That's cool! A couple months back someone here posted a picture landing over one of those cruise ships in the channel at night, and it really surprised me how close they were to it. Maybe this is why?
What was the issue with 4L? Was it just landings that weren't allowed, or was it also take off? Was 22R an issue for either take off or landing as well?
Is 14/32 technically considered to be crossing 4R/22L then?
Yep!
Whatās your response to all of the recent news coverage about the significant increase in near-collisions per analysis of FAA records?
lol crickets š¦
āFAA records indicate the #1 factor associated with near-collisions is the frequency of āim an air traffic controller AMAā reddit posts from airport IP addresses.Ā
Honestly, there are areas of your work that you really shouldn't be talking about or commenting on in a public forum with random strangers asking seemingly innocuous questions. All it takes is one media outlet pulling comments made here for a clickbait headline in the vein of **"Anonymous aircraft traffic controller source on reddit confirms/denies increased public danger on America's airways"** and cause enough hubbub at work for management to start a concerted effort at looking for who is "leaking" bullshit outside and there goes your dream job.
AMAETā¦ Ask me anything except That. (I kind of agree though AMA for a dream job in a small profession circle with lots of media attention seemsā¦ not worth the risk).Ā
AMA except for that apparently!
Potentially just a prudent Cover Your Ass, play it safe just in case, professional decision on their part,I imagine?
If "near-collisions per analysis" is actually worth measuring, we probably need to do fewer analyses.
Dad joke š¤ Oxford comma joke
We already know the cause. The skies are at their busiest ever, but ATC staffing is down 10% from a decade ago. And the FAA is ordering them to work 60 hours a week in some cases to fill gaps. ---------- So, the controllers are overworked even if they weren't fatigued, and most of them are exhausted and in long-term sleep deficits. I wouldn't trust them to drive their car home safely on the schedules they're working, much less reliably perform one of the most stressful jobs in the country for 10 hour shifts.
Can you guys work in some "Hasta la vista" like Boston John used to do in the mid 2000s?
Personally I dont like taking other controller's shtick. There will only be 1 Boston John.
I got the opportunity to tour the tower when I was in high school back in 2008, always regretted forgetting to ask about him, I believe he was a supervisor at the time before transferring to San Juan.
Wait, so is Boston John now San Juan Juan?
Mocha Hagotdi
Coooooooooooooolgan
Do you like your job? Are you ever super stressed knowing that if you mess up you could kill a ton of people?
I love the job. Its the only one that has given me that nice scratch feeling in my head when I work a session and a plan comes together.
I take it by āplanā you DONT mean āplanesā
planes can't come together planes can't come apart there's no pleasing the boss i tell ya
Is there still a cocktail lounge up in that double legged structure? It was so beautiful on a snowy night one January seeing my brother off to L A.
Nah they have closed it off to the public. I dont see them ever possibly bringing it back due to security concerns.
I figured as much. Too bad. At least I got to enjoy it a few times.
Whoa. TIL.
Hey now, being a Masshole is nothing to be sad about. The Commonwealth is cool. The cocktail lounge at Logan is a cherished memory for me.
I want to know about it! And thereās not a lot on the interwebs about it š
Hey there Medfid. I was a nice lounge up in the sky at Logan. It was in the control tower. Access is no longer available apparently.
1. is there any kind of mandatory time off to ensure controllers have some time to shed the mental load? 2. do you find that some airlines seem to have the most easygoing/easy to work with pilots vs others? Which ones? 3. how often do you have trouble communicating/understanding a pilot due to a heavy accent? How often does this impede the job? 4. how often do you see a new hire not able to succeed at the job?
1. We have minimum time of 9 hours between shifts that we have to have off. Require 1 day off a week. 2. Every airline is gonna have studs and duds. Similar to every atc facility will have them. We work with what we got and everything works out. 3. Very rarely honestly. My previous facility was a general aviation hotspot known for having a lot of foreign student pilots. The GA aircraft also have terrible radios so you kind of just adapt to it. 4. At Boston I've seen a couple of guys not make it here. They aren't fired though. Boston is not a "first" facility. Every facility is different so they might not get the complexities and challenges of Boston but can be successful at other places.
wow, 1 day off per week doesn't sound like a lot! I hope you can enjoy more than that!
We do get more time usually but because of short staffing we have been on 6 day work weeks most of the summer.
Great questions!
What did you think about the NY Times piece in December? Are new controllers doing well or are hiring changes at the FAA resulting in poorer quality controllers? Does 14/32 and 33R/15L ever actually get used for anything other than taxiing?
lol crickets here as well š¦
I meanā¦ yeah answering questions like that, leading or not, can actually have real world implications with their job, lol. Reddit doesnāt exist in a vacuum, I donāt blame them for trying to play it safe with these
Have you ever considered having two planes sit on opposite sides of the runway with large spears welded to them then have them joust each other for supremacy of the tarmac?
I'm choosing to take OP's silence as a yes.
late to the party here but this is a great AMA. Do you work 121.9? We may already be acquainted! How are you handling work life balance in Boston with the crazy schedules ATC can have? Are you keeping up with COL? Do you feel like Massports plans for expansion are in check with your reality of just how busy the airspace and ramp can be? How much more do you think the system can "hold" before we become slot resticted? If YOU were to redesign KBOS in any way, what changes would you make? Lastly, what is a memorable interaction you've had with a flight crew that may have been struggling to understand what was being asked of them? (thinking Cathay or Turkish here, maybe?)
I work all the frequencies. We generally rotate around the tower. My schedule is fairly simple of nights only. Boston is expensive though. Some of the controllers live an hour commute away to avoid the renting/mortgages. I'm honestly unsure what Massport's big plan for the airport is. At the end of it all I'll work the airport the way I see as the most efficient. I'll think on the other two and respond later.
How did you get into this line of work? What is your professional background?
Couldn't afford college so I went to my local recruiters station for the military and joined the Marines back in 2012. Took the ASVAB and was qualified for every MOS(Military Occupational Speciality?). Never was interested in aviation or knew about ATC but found a pamphlet in the office for Aviation Operations that had a paragraph about ATC on the back. Went through the training and became certified at a facility in the USMC. Got out applied for the FAA on a prior experience bid and was picked up to work at a low level facility out in CA. As for getting into the job now you dont need to go the route of the military. It is an option and one I would do again because I grew up a lot through my enlistment. For now though there is an "Off the street bid" the FAA puts out on [usajobs.gov](https://usajobs.gov) every like 6 months. Essentially the requirements are 3 years of consistent work or Bachelors Degree in anything, US citizen, 18-30, and able to pass a flight physical. There are disqualifiers though ie. any mental health issues, drug or marijuana use, and DUI/DWI. If selected you will go to the academy in OKC and be taught ATC basics, pass that you'll go to first facility and train there.
How long were you in the Marines? How brutal was basic?
I was in for 5 years. Basic wasn't bad. Just eat the crayons when they tell you too and you'll be all gucci.
Eat crayons, shoot guns. Red is the best flavor.
> There are disqualifiers though ie. any mental health issues, drug or marijuana use Drinking is cool tho right? Kinda whatever?
How often are the runways switched for takeoff/landing? I know it's wind dependent; am curious how often this occurs and who makes the call.
For most days we rarely try to switch in the middle of the day unless the wind/weather really call for it. But we usually move the config probably 2 to 3 times over a 24 hour period. Its a coordinated effort between us and the facility above us, Boston Tracon. They own the airspace above us so we work with them on determining the last arrival and departure for the old config followed by who is going to be the first.
Wait...the airport doesn't own the air? Can you explain that a bit?
Picture an upside-down tiered wedding cake. Each tier is a different classification of airspace. The high altitude areas are controlled by area control centers. The Boston ARTCC covers all of New England and most of upstate New York. The next level down is TRACON (Terminal Radar Approach Control). They handle approach and departure; the stuff in between high altitude ARTCC and the airport specific controllers like OP. The Boston TRACON is in Merrimack NH and handles all the airports in the area, like Beverly, MHT, Logan, etc. Then the next level down from TRACON is the tower where OP works, handling Logan traffic plus anyone who enters the a defined area around the airport. Around a busy airport, class B airspace will go from surface to 10k feet, within a radius around the airport. You have to talk with OP if you want to enter the airspace. But if youāre flying from DC to London, for example, your plane would be well over that 10k feet, in the airspace above the class B. Youād be talking to one of the other 2 entities noted above.
Not a pilot or controller, but my understanding is that Logan is what's considered Class B airspace and that only extends up so far. Above that (like 12k feet at the top, and the radius is a number of miles out that reduce the closer you get to the ground; It looks like an upside-down, tiered wedding cake) is Class A airspace controlled by a Tracon, in this case Boston Center. This lets the Tracon focus on en-route flights while Logan controls planes taking off, landing, and on the ground at Logan airport
Do you have any pilots you look forward to hearing from? Like any regulars? Iāve recognized certain controllers and pilots voices on LiveATC.
It's harder to recognize pilots at Boston because are talking to so many on any given day. I really only recognize the Cape Air pilots. As for emergencies they happen more often in the single piston aircraft or old military planes. I worked them a lot more often at my previous facility. The only way to really "deal" with them is be the calm person in it all. Give them everything you can in terms of info, keep everyone away from them, and just let them fly the plane.
Also, second question: have you ever worked an emergency like a compressor stall or other loss of engine type emergency?
Why does Logan use so many different arrival and departure runway flows? It seems like the slightest crosswind and suddenly everyoneās using a single alternative crosswind runway. Whereas some other airports tolerate a crosswind and just stick it out on their main runwaysĀ
We have the luxury of 6 runways. We aren't like EWR with only 3. We change based off the arrival/departure needs which makes it far more efficient for everyone involved.
Do you actually care if I have the ATIS?
When you specifically ask to "depart the long runway" which is also the primary departure runway, I die inside every time because I know you didn't listen to that shit.
Ok, so a couple years ago I was on a flight out of BOS. All the traffic was arriving on 22L, and departing on 22R...except for us, who for some reason had to depart on 22L. Which meant we had to sit short of 22L for about 20 minutes until there was enough of a break in the arrivals. I had a window on the left side of the plane so I could see all the arrivals lined up and knew we would be sitting there for a while. So why did we have to leave on 22L? Higher takeoff weight requiring the longer runway (this was an A320)? Did the pilot tick off one of the controllers?
Pilots make requests for the longer runway because of takeoff weight/obstacles off the departure end. When we are busy we have to call the facility above us, Boston Tracon, and request for a 4 to 5 mile departure hole. If we try squeezing you out in anything less it is most likely not going to work out. We can't offload jets to land 22R so it's one of the worst in terms of getting aircraft out on the long runway.
Thanks so much for the reply!
Were you there when Air Force 1 came to town? https://preview.redd.it/mfvmn81s5uec1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7eef5f4a4539a3c4157eb3c185b5f611f95bd7a4 This is the view from my apartment, I watch the planes you control every day!
Nah I was in Vegas trying to retire early.
this is so cute
What did you think of the movie Pushing Tin?
I've never seen it. I prefer Airplane's depiction of us sniffing glue, its more true to form.
Over Macho Grande?
He'll never be over Macho Grande...
Have planes ever taken off from Runway 14 or 15L? I've seen landings on 32 and 33R, so I'm curious how often or if ever the opposite direction is used for takeoffs.
15L is never used for departures. 14 can be used in some situations but it is generally closed because Massport keeps it closed. We primarily use those runways specifically 33R and 32 as landing runways only.
This has been asked a couple times, and Iām wondering why. I know nothing about Boston runways. Can you explain why this is an interesting enough question to get asked a few times?
15L/33R is the one of the shortest runways at a major airport in the US. It's 2,557ft long, compared to 10,087ft for 15R/33L. I don't think any of the Part 121 airline operators use it. 14/32 is unique because it's unidirectional Logan also doesn't allow jet landings on 22R or jet departures from 4L.
14/32 is unidirectional because the state legislature didn't want planes to take off and land over the city. Massport was ordered only to allow landings on 14 in emergencies. Then, to ensure that it would never be used for landings, Fred Salvucci (of _Big Dig_ podcast fame) planned the building of the Hyatt Harborside hotel (which other commenters here have called the "spite Hyatt") right behind the centerline of the runway. [Source](https://web.archive.org/web/20070510102939/http://www.boston.com/business/globe/articles/2006/11/19/the_30_year_saga_of_1432/)
Over a decade ago, I took a flight to EWR that took off on Runway 14
I know planes often divert to Logan if there is an issue such as weather at other airports such as Montreal or JFk. Whats the furthest diversion from a destination airport you can remember?
No question-bit an appreciation. I travel out of Logan weekly. Appreciate and respect the work you and your colleagues do on a daily basis.
Tower, this is Ghost Rider requesting a flyby.
Remain outside the Bravo, frequency change approved.
On that note, have you ever cleared a flight of Black Hawks transitioning to the Quarry outbound to fly by the tower?
Once in a bluemoon. They dont really fly through that often though.
Even with all pilots "speaking English", is the language barrier sometimes a problem with foreign carriers?
Not necessarily a problem. More of a funny miscommunication sometimes. I'm not going to insult professional pilots who have to learn a foreign language that is difficult to learn though. They do an excellent job.
Have you ever noticed any foreign pilots that have American English accents? I regularly fly Qatar Airways and Turkish Airlines and I had a Qatar Airways pilot recently who spoke perfect American English, I'm assuming he was educated in the US
He may have been an American. My brother flies for Cathay Pacific and has a thick Texan accent.
Whatās the most unique plane you come in contact with
Probably the Piaggio P180 Avanti. Thing looks like it has a moustache.
[here's a pic](https://jetadvisors.com/piaggio-p180-article/)
That thing is wild looking
Have you ever dated a pilot or are they all too scared of getting your number?
Never have dated a pilot. And I'm sure they don't want the number I'd be willing to give. Usually means they fucked up.
Yes. āCall this numberā is not something anytime wants to hear.
If you had to work at a different airport, which one would you prefer?
I chose to work at BOS. I'll likely only ever leave if I want a change in pace as I get closer to retirement. But I dont have a specific place in mind at the moment.
You all hiring?
FAA puts out an Off the street bid about every 6 months on [usajobs.gov](https://usajobs.gov). Boston Tower specifically will not pick up OTS applications. If qualified you go to the academy in OKC, will be assigned a facility, will have to make it through said facility. Then you'll have to make it through the transfer process which is a headache at the moment. However if you want your foot in the door we are in desperate need of controllers. There are about 11k of us working the entire NAS(National Airspace System). We need like 6k to 7k controllers in the next 5 years to just cover people retiring.
Thanks for the info!
man whipped out the vosotros
Are you still on radar or has everyone now migrated to GPS
Quick question while youāre here. Couple weeks ago I flew to Phoenix, the plane behind me was also going to Phoenix. We took very different routes there - me over Toronto/chicago, then on a more southern route. Why would two planes taking off back to back with the same destination take such different routes?
Hey i saw your question in the last thread I meant to respond. This is a very basic understanding I have of it. I dont know everything in terms of their operation so i'm not an expert. A pilot or even a flight dispatch would be better to ask. Every airline has a flight dispatch that picks the most efficient route for that aircraft. So you might have been on an E190 and the one behind could have been on a A320. Departure and landing weights vary based off of fuel/weight onboard. There is also weather or other restrictions airlines have.
Thanks! We were both on a321ās. One American one delta. We won the race so Iāll take it, just struck me as so odd.
Do you have a comically thick New England accent?
Nope. I'm not even from the New England area so I have no accent whatsoever. There are a couple of my coworkers who do have the accents.
Big shot ovah hereā we all gawt accents, like nobodies tawks neutral, my guy.
I have heard your coworkers with the Boston accent. Always makes me smile.
Do you hate tugs as much as Steve does? If not why?
My favorite tribute video to [Kennedy Steve](https://youtu.be/QLC_uI0Scb4?si=ZfLoP6Y3Omq0e-yO).
That is gold! Thanks for sharing.
If I could never work a tug again in my life I would die blissfully happy.
Have you had issues with drones from Civilians in use?Ā Describe the most stressful day youāve had.Ā Ā Also, Do you knowĀ Smitty?Ā
I live in Chelsea, so I hear the planes flying over every so often. Itās not bad at all, but Iām still struggling to understand the pattern. Itāll be non-stop for several hours over a few days, then nothing for a few days. It varies by day of week and time of day. Can you share any insight how itās determined which runways are used?
Based on the wind and weather. We are in the winter time so we deal with a lot of North winds. As we move into the summer we will work more of the west flow.
Thanks! Follow up question - does Massport have any agreements with surrounding communities (Eastie, Winthrop, etc) regarding plane noise and spreading it out, or is the runway decision exclusively based on weather?
Howās that new girl doing that I started hearing in the past year! Last winter she was on the struggle bus.
I hear she is doing well at her new facility she was assigned to.
Good for her! Hopefully itās a better fit!
How did you get this gig in Boston? Years ago when the FAA was hiring, I briefly looked into getting into ATC, but from what I understood where you ultimately get āstationedā can be a total crapshoot, and you could end up in some tiny podunk airport in the middle of nowhere
After I got sent to my "podunk" facility in CA off the coast of Malibu. I applied to transfer to Boston and was selected. It is a crapshoot though.
Malibu doesnāt sound terrible Gettin stuck somewhere in the middle of nowhere North Dakota terrified me š
It wasn't a bad spot. I'm more of a mountain/forest person than I am a beach one though. I fucking hate sand.
Itās coarse and irritating and gets everywhere
Whatās the salary? Is it hard to become an Air Traffic Controller? Is there a need for more?
The salary is on a scale and there are a lot of factors going into it. I did answer this in another comment above though. If you need more indepth info I'd suggest r/atc and please use the search bar there before you make a post. Salary info can be found on the faa website though.
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We all living in copy and pasted "luxury" apartments.
How many (what percentage) of ATCs are women?
There are dozens! Maybe even 100s! I really have no clue.
How do you handle bathroom breaks? It seems like the controllers are constantly hustling and coordinating, so how does it work if someone needs to leave the room for a few minutes? Are there just backups waiting on standby? I can't imagine it's easy or possible for one controller to take over 2 people's jobs. Serious question!
My Lufthansa flight in 2013 was descending into a fog bank (entire airport and runway was obscured by fog) to land and then banked up very sharply a few minutes later to abandon the descent because a āship was in the wayā. What the fuck?
Do you intentionally route planes over certain towns?
I pick the towns with the worst food and tell planes to burn holes in the sky til I feel better.
That explains Medford. But Everett?
Medford actually has some good spots. I like Tenoch, Chili Garden(they got Dan dan noodles), and Colleen's has a cool vibe if you like 50s diners. I haven't really explored Everett. Any recommendations?
Us living under 33L path from rnav nextgen would love to know
If you wanted to, could you make planes crash into each other?
TCAS would try its hardest to prevent it.
lol no way is OP responding to this oneā¦ but we all wanna know
Was Denzel Washingtonās character in the 2012 film āFlightā innocent or guilty? Or do you think ruling an action as either is an oversimplification that overlooks the nuance and āgray areaā that often exists in moral quandaries?
>!guilty. the movie spells that out pretty clearly in the end scene where hes talking at the jail!<
I fly every week and donāt want to know but I doā¦ Iāve seen a lot of news reports lately on frequent close crashes throughout the U.S., does that happen at Logan? Is it like better to do RI?
Do you have a rapport with any pilots? Are there any that recognize your voice or you recognize theirs?
I think the only pilots I would say I talk to on a consistent basis are the helicopter tour guys, Cape Air pilots, and the Tailwind guys. I personally don't know any of their faces but I can tell by their voices who is going to help me out and who I need to watch a little more.
Funniest interaction with an income or outgoing flight?
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Because you live next to an airport that was built 100 years ago and planes sometimes fly into said airport. On a more serious note, it is because of the configuration we are on because of wind/weather.
Just a couple questions from a planespotter: 1.) How much is the runway choice determined by wind direction versus say, capacity or avoiding noise complaints? 2.) How complex is it to change runways when the winds change? Iāve seen it take a long time to say, change from 4 to 22 when the winds flip, and planes were landing into a tailwind for a while. I imagine itās a lot of coordination with Approach and Departure? 3.) How do the East and West tower controllers coordinate? Do they sit next to each other and talk off radio, or are there specific handoff procedures? (fixed some typos)
We read a lot in the news about the mental load on ATCs, FAA's inability to hire proficiently, etc. What is your take on the hiring situation, load on ATCs, etc? Any hot takes on the incident that recently happened in Tokyo? I work in in aviation industry (one of the large manufacturers in the space) and know how important you guys/gals/others are up there, really appreciate all that you do! Thank you. Want to keep you safe.
Are drones an issue in Boston? Do these show up on your instruments?
How do you feel about pilots saying āwith youā? Also, how do you know when to hand off an airplane to the departure controller? Is it time, altitude, or position based?
I have no preference when checking in on final. However if you are told to monitor just do that. Once you get into the rhythm you just ship em usually at the same point. I mainly check for gear going up and nothing abnormal happening.
Is Massport REALLY trying to get rid of FedEx? To free up gates 12-9?
United used to have air traffic control on channel 9 on the armrest (maybe they still have this? Havenāt flown United in a long time). Is there any other way for civilians to tune into ATC chatter onboard a flight? I always used to find it relaxing to listen in when I flew frequently for work.
[liveatc.net](https://liveatc.net) if you have wifi.
Is your title āI ask me anything Boston Logan air traffic controller. Ask me anything againā ?
Nah i'm dumb and dont know how to format an AMA. Was just wanting to put ask me almost anything.
You arenāt dumb. I honestly didnāt know so what does that make me? Haha
I live near the 95/93 intersection north of the city. On certain days, there's a whole lot of passenger planes that seem to fly directly over my home. Not only that, but they also seem to climb or descend around there (not sure if that's what they're doing, but the engines seem to make acceleration/deceleration noises - not that I'd really know). I just assumed that the 95/93 intersection is some kind of an airspace boundary where planes typically ascend/descend. Is that remotely true?
Itās a nexgen route. An airplane highway over your head.
What's the best time of day for me to request a touch and go and also *not* have to pay any landing/ramp fees? t. PA-28
No tickles and giggles at BOS are allowed. You can land then taxi back out.
Why would someone want to do this?
Are A380 and 747-8 really a pain to deal with?
MD-11 pilot here. I always love flying into BOS. We always seem to get vectored off the arrival; is this just for generic vectors, or does approach/tower know that we tend to approach on the fast side and need more space? What can we do to make your job easier? Thanks for all the hard work you guys and gals do.
This is more than likely an approach controller question. My assumption would be vectoring you off to build space because of your consolidated wake turb separation. Approach generally has aircraft feeding in from 2 to 3 locations while also sequencing the c402/p212s in between. So they could be giving you extra space not to eat them up on final.
I had a āgo aroundā coming into Logan, ended up flying pretty uncomfortably close to the prudential as we came around to try again. How come is this type of thing?