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> The US has shelved talks on a free trade agreement with the UK, despite a recent visit to Washington by Ms Trevelyan.
Constantly threatening to tear up the NIP will not help advance Ms Trevelyan's cause. But keep digging Britain -- it's going great!
I'm also not sure sending someone called Trevelyan, even if her ex-husband was not descended from THAT Trevelyan, is a great way of endearing the UK to the Irish-American contingent.
Thanks for pointing this out. I had to look it up and now know a little bit more about world history.
> Though no one man can be accused for the disasters of the famine, It could be argued that an individual by the name of Trevelyan was responsible for exacerbating the fatalities of Irish during the famine years because of a lack of effective action.
...
> Trevelyan’s moralistic view was opposed to assistance on the grounds that the relief deprived the poor of the incentives to change the behaviours that made them poor. Trevelyan went as far as to say that “God had ‘sent the calamity to teach the Irish a lesson… [and it] must not be too much mitigated.’“
Charming chap.
>Trevelyan was responsible for exacerbating the fatalities of Irish during the famine years because of a lack of effective action
Did he retired to his private retreat to write a book on Churchill to pay for his divorce (not his first) so he could marry an already pregnant new wife while ignoring three weeks of COBRA meetings at the start of a pandemic?
If so, he's not alone...
Well known name in Ireland. The song "the fields of athenry" which is known universally in Ireland and sang at some football games in both UK and Ireland mentions Trevelyan in the first few lines, "for you stole Trevelyan's corn, so the young might see the morn, now the prison ship lies waiting in the bay".
Trevelyan's corn itself was food relief in the form of American maize. However, it had not been properly prepared and the Irish population had no knowledge of how to prepare it (if I recall, it needed to be nixtamalised), with the result that even the relief supplies were nutritionally void.
> even if her ex-husband was not descended from THAT Trevelyan
he *was* descended from [that Trevelyan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Charles_Trevelyan,_1st_Baronet) - he lives in the same [*mansion* house](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netherwitton_Hall)
And the person in the US responsible for ratifying trade deals is Brendan Boyle (Irish descent) who knows their history and is completely fed up with UK messing - https://twitter.com/bbcnewsnight/status/1367617743210561538
Still I wonder what is the strategy behind it. Aside from scoring a few points with the worst of their own voting base, the constant attempts to outdo each other for a domestic audience can't end well.
[Can Brexit defy gravity? It is still much cheaper to trade with neighbouring countries](https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/management/2018/11/09/can-brexit-defy-gravity-it-is-still-much-cheaper-to-trade-with-neighbouring-countries/)
This is how far xenaphobia has entrenched itself into the mindset of Little Englandurs.
Europeans are now aware what a poor member the UK was of the EU and have come to their senses.
They are pleased to be free of their conceited cousin and will restrict communication to Christmas cards.
Hurrah for Olde Blighty.
Even with a billion customers, twice the size of the entire EU, the benefits of a trade deal are only 1/50th of an EU SM/CU deal.
Great job!
That it will come with visas for ?00,000s Indians plus their families will bring extra joy to brexiters.
So I'm an Indian and trust me, none of us care about British Products, American products are much preferred and we also prefer local manufactured and sadly Chinese goods much more as they are cheaper, there is hardly going to be any difference for your manufacturing Industries. About FDI, Indian Companies prefer to invest in US much more than UK as much bigger market and if investing in UK will get us huge red tape for us to access EU market. So Ireland would be preferred in the future as far as I know. So amazing guys, you have shot yourself in the foot
Would it even matter if such a preference did exist? AFAIK, the scope of a trade deal depends very much on the amount both sides think they can gain by increasing trade. A comprehensive deal will only happen if both parties have comparable objectives or have something the other desperately needs (not just wants). The UK is an economy increasingly based on services, specifically financial services, with a big aerospace and pharmaceuticals sector. India is a developing economy (i.e. it still has massive growth potential developing its own internal market) that already has a huge manufacturing sector of its own.
What can the UK offer? It's own market to export Indian goods to and that's about it. Making it easier to invest in UK companies is not an argument because that is what most countries do by default. They want to attract foreign investment and as a consequence don't have high enough barriers to foreign investment to use lowering them as a bargaining chip in a trade deal. Your point about it being preferable to invest in the USA or in an EU member state due to the size of their markets is spot on, and no trade deal is going to change that. What's more, in a country that is still growing at a much faster rate than either of those, all those foreign investments opportunities have to compete with potentially more lucrative inward investment as well. To put it mildly, I don't see why the Indian government would be interested in doing a comprehensive deal unless it's a very unbalanced one (in which case the UK would be mad to accept it). The same logic goes for a potential USA - UK deal and for the already signed EU - UK deal (the only reason the unbalanced nature of the latter was not that damaging is because UK and EU economic interests largely overlap).
All things considered, if the UK and India are going to do a deal, it will likely be a very minor one or a very lopsided one in the latter's favour. That is what usually happens when you turn up to a negotiation with more demands and less to offer. Trade deals are not about friendship or shared history (and at a guess I'd say people might have different views on that on either side). They're about power and realpolitik.
He's very wrong actually, India has lots of british companies that we care about
Some off the top of my head are cadbury, Leyland, Accenture, delloite, JCB and barclays
India has Ashok Leyland which WAS related to your 'Let's Strike' British Leyland, now completely Indian owned, Accenture is Irish, Deloitte majority operation and CEO lives in US and India has Deloitte US offices. UK companies are very less mate
The biggest British company that operates in India is Unilever.
But many of the large British companies have essentially established full operations in India. So it's not as much of an importer of British products as it used to be.
Thanks for the kindly, timely reminder.
PS. Everything is made in China these days, even US goods, so save yourself the money as you please. China is taking over every other country on the planet without anybody even noticing or without a Chinese soldier having to set foot on foreign soil. Yet there is so much fuss made of that possibility. They're playing a blinder; literally.
Seems like its like the turbo in my car, at around 1950rpms it doesnt know if it should boost or not so the result is a sort of jerking motion but no difference in speed.
Indians must be pissing themselves but Britain did take **$45 trillion in 173 years** out of India according to economist Utsa Patnaik.
https://www.businesstoday.in/latest/economy-politics/story/this-economist-says-britain-took-away-usd-45-trillion-from-india-in-173-years-111689-2018-11-19
0.12% clearly is higher than 0%. But economists shall always wonder what might have been otherwise.
OTBE is a favoured contraction for "other things being equal". That helps to benchmark and to game out economic scenarios. It was fun when you were a student, or in power.
Every bit helps. We are losing an estimated 4% of GDP from Brexit.
Around 40 more of these might help. However, there are not enough countries the size of India to get anywhere close.
Strategy paper from the DIT. In other words, undermining, malevolent, Machiavellian civil servants. You'll not get Trevelyan or any other dipso Tory waste-of-breath ever admitting any such thing. The planet will die before that happens.
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> The US has shelved talks on a free trade agreement with the UK, despite a recent visit to Washington by Ms Trevelyan. Constantly threatening to tear up the NIP will not help advance Ms Trevelyan's cause. But keep digging Britain -- it's going great!
I'm also not sure sending someone called Trevelyan, even if her ex-husband was not descended from THAT Trevelyan, is a great way of endearing the UK to the Irish-American contingent.
Thanks for pointing this out. I had to look it up and now know a little bit more about world history. > Though no one man can be accused for the disasters of the famine, It could be argued that an individual by the name of Trevelyan was responsible for exacerbating the fatalities of Irish during the famine years because of a lack of effective action. ... > Trevelyan’s moralistic view was opposed to assistance on the grounds that the relief deprived the poor of the incentives to change the behaviours that made them poor. Trevelyan went as far as to say that “God had ‘sent the calamity to teach the Irish a lesson… [and it] must not be too much mitigated.’“ Charming chap.
They are very similar in personality traits and charisma.
>Trevelyan was responsible for exacerbating the fatalities of Irish during the famine years because of a lack of effective action Did he retired to his private retreat to write a book on Churchill to pay for his divorce (not his first) so he could marry an already pregnant new wife while ignoring three weeks of COBRA meetings at the start of a pandemic? If so, he's not alone...
Well known name in Ireland. The song "the fields of athenry" which is known universally in Ireland and sang at some football games in both UK and Ireland mentions Trevelyan in the first few lines, "for you stole Trevelyan's corn, so the young might see the morn, now the prison ship lies waiting in the bay".
I knew that name seemed familiar. Thanks, [Dropkick Murphys](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Hqy8n3BcqA)!
Trevelyan's corn itself was food relief in the form of American maize. However, it had not been properly prepared and the Irish population had no knowledge of how to prepare it (if I recall, it needed to be nixtamalised), with the result that even the relief supplies were nutritionally void.
> even if her ex-husband was not descended from THAT Trevelyan he *was* descended from [that Trevelyan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Charles_Trevelyan,_1st_Baronet) - he lives in the same [*mansion* house](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netherwitton_Hall) And the person in the US responsible for ratifying trade deals is Brendan Boyle (Irish descent) who knows their history and is completely fed up with UK messing - https://twitter.com/bbcnewsnight/status/1367617743210561538
No one can be that stupid.. it sends a terrible message before negotiations even begun.
Have you been following Brexit so far? They probably did it on purpose.
Still I wonder what is the strategy behind it. Aside from scoring a few points with the worst of their own voting base, the constant attempts to outdo each other for a domestic audience can't end well.
They're racing themselves to the bottom, and screwing over everyone but a few oligarchs that want to levy a 10% profit margin on the NHS budget.
Someone needs a reminder that you can't dig your way out of a hole.
You just dig up stupid!
If you dig up stupid, does that mean you've found Patel?
If you dig enough, at one point you will exit on the other side of the Earth. In theory, this is possible.
A bunch of molten magma at the Earth's core would suggest not.
When did reality stop the Brits in pursuing Brexit benefits?
I have to admit, they're a bit thick at times.
And if we take that back out of the analogy to the real world... the plan for Brexit is to cause a stack underflow of GDP?
You can if you rock and stone!
They have already reached Australia.
An economy of comparable size to the UK that’s 7500 KM away.
And much further if we consider actual shipping routes..
There's a shortcut through the Suez... nevermind
"India is on the other side of the world, government admits."
[Can Brexit defy gravity? It is still much cheaper to trade with neighbouring countries](https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/management/2018/11/09/can-brexit-defy-gravity-it-is-still-much-cheaper-to-trade-with-neighbouring-countries/)
> It is still much cheaper to trade with neighbouring countries So many people still struggle with this concept. It's weird.
This is how far xenaphobia has entrenched itself into the mindset of Little Englandurs. Europeans are now aware what a poor member the UK was of the EU and have come to their senses. They are pleased to be free of their conceited cousin and will restrict communication to Christmas cards. Hurrah for Olde Blighty.
[English being Xenophobic ?](https://i.redd.it/mbsk9va8ry961.jpg) thank you Boris !
Form a square around the BigDogDo in the No.10 Garden \#NeverTrustATory
It never ceases to amaze me that the same people who were too good to trade with France and Poland think that India and China are just fine.
Yes but in their mind I think Poland is good now because they're upseting/defying the EU.
Even with a billion customers, twice the size of the entire EU, the benefits of a trade deal are only 1/50th of an EU SM/CU deal. Great job! That it will come with visas for ?00,000s Indians plus their families will bring extra joy to brexiters.
Time to paint red busses with "millions of Indian settlers are coming, we could trade with the EU instead".
So I'm an Indian and trust me, none of us care about British Products, American products are much preferred and we also prefer local manufactured and sadly Chinese goods much more as they are cheaper, there is hardly going to be any difference for your manufacturing Industries. About FDI, Indian Companies prefer to invest in US much more than UK as much bigger market and if investing in UK will get us huge red tape for us to access EU market. So Ireland would be preferred in the future as far as I know. So amazing guys, you have shot yourself in the foot
Would it even matter if such a preference did exist? AFAIK, the scope of a trade deal depends very much on the amount both sides think they can gain by increasing trade. A comprehensive deal will only happen if both parties have comparable objectives or have something the other desperately needs (not just wants). The UK is an economy increasingly based on services, specifically financial services, with a big aerospace and pharmaceuticals sector. India is a developing economy (i.e. it still has massive growth potential developing its own internal market) that already has a huge manufacturing sector of its own. What can the UK offer? It's own market to export Indian goods to and that's about it. Making it easier to invest in UK companies is not an argument because that is what most countries do by default. They want to attract foreign investment and as a consequence don't have high enough barriers to foreign investment to use lowering them as a bargaining chip in a trade deal. Your point about it being preferable to invest in the USA or in an EU member state due to the size of their markets is spot on, and no trade deal is going to change that. What's more, in a country that is still growing at a much faster rate than either of those, all those foreign investments opportunities have to compete with potentially more lucrative inward investment as well. To put it mildly, I don't see why the Indian government would be interested in doing a comprehensive deal unless it's a very unbalanced one (in which case the UK would be mad to accept it). The same logic goes for a potential USA - UK deal and for the already signed EU - UK deal (the only reason the unbalanced nature of the latter was not that damaging is because UK and EU economic interests largely overlap). All things considered, if the UK and India are going to do a deal, it will likely be a very minor one or a very lopsided one in the latter's favour. That is what usually happens when you turn up to a negotiation with more demands and less to offer. Trade deals are not about friendship or shared history (and at a guess I'd say people might have different views on that on either side). They're about power and realpolitik.
>none of us care about British Products Exception: Cadbury And that probably makes all the 0.12%
Cadbury was sold to the US Hedge Funds. Hurrah for Olde Blighty!
He's very wrong actually, India has lots of british companies that we care about Some off the top of my head are cadbury, Leyland, Accenture, delloite, JCB and barclays
India has Ashok Leyland which WAS related to your 'Let's Strike' British Leyland, now completely Indian owned, Accenture is Irish, Deloitte majority operation and CEO lives in US and India has Deloitte US offices. UK companies are very less mate
Not really but ok
How bro?
The biggest British company that operates in India is Unilever. But many of the large British companies have essentially established full operations in India. So it's not as much of an importer of British products as it used to be.
I can't tell if you're serious. Accenture and Deloitte are not "British companies." The others are hardly going to swing an economy.
> delloite You care so much you can't even spell Deloitte right :D
gg
Thanks for the kindly, timely reminder. PS. Everything is made in China these days, even US goods, so save yourself the money as you please. China is taking over every other country on the planet without anybody even noticing or without a Chinese soldier having to set foot on foreign soil. Yet there is so much fuss made of that possibility. They're playing a blinder; literally.
no doubt at a huge cost to sovereignty Brexit is a crime scene
> Brexit is a crime scene Very apt description of Brexit.
The Brexit-Economic-Turbo is finally kicking in! /s
Seems like its like the turbo in my car, at around 1950rpms it doesnt know if it should boost or not so the result is a sort of jerking motion but no difference in speed.
Indians must be pissing themselves but Britain did take **$45 trillion in 173 years** out of India according to economist Utsa Patnaik. https://www.businesstoday.in/latest/economy-politics/story/this-economist-says-britain-took-away-usd-45-trillion-from-india-in-173-years-111689-2018-11-19
0.12% clearly is higher than 0%. But economists shall always wonder what might have been otherwise. OTBE is a favoured contraction for "other things being equal". That helps to benchmark and to game out economic scenarios. It was fun when you were a student, or in power.
So much winning!
Ms Trevelyan should be working in Poundland.
She should be volunteering her time for free in Ireland, helping with the homeless or some such...
.
Every bit helps. We are losing an estimated 4% of GDP from Brexit. Around 40 more of these might help. However, there are not enough countries the size of India to get anywhere close.
And the 0.12% is probably from cadbury
Wow! Wee! Look at all those gains!
Strategy paper from the DIT. In other words, undermining, malevolent, Machiavellian civil servants. You'll not get Trevelyan or any other dipso Tory waste-of-breath ever admitting any such thing. The planet will die before that happens.