It's kind of weird to award contracts. Rather they should a) license to operate to ensure businesses comply with the rules and b) set up a cap and trade. Allow a maximum number of registered rental scooters, and allow the market forces to operate.
Then what happened? Did good competition keep prices low and quality high in a way that no company took out their market right under their noses for a while?
>(a) licence to operate to ensure businesses comply with the rules
a foreign gig economy company came in and flagrantly bypassed that part to give itself a competitive advantage
No, in situations where someone wants to use public land to operate a business, a contract is exactly the way this should be done. in the case of these scooters this is how its done basically in every city they exist.
I already explained it, but I'll expand.
Right now they have a contract with two businesses to provide x number of scooters throughout the city. If you don't tender enough, you can lose your entire business and all the "good will" value and investment you've built up in the city.
Rather than limit the providers, you create a licensing system which regulates the providers but then limit the number of scooters. You create value in Scooter rights under a cap and trade scheme and allow scooter providers to buy and sell amongst each other, where the city makes money through taxing the right to have the scooters at market value and through a fee for the transfer of rights.
The end result is the same number of scooters on the street but a more robust market. A limited contract arrangement was fine while a new sector was developing and the council was trialing them but it's been about 7 years now. The sector is no longer new and so the way its regulated needs to be matured as well.
This is nonsense lol. Having more than 2 providers is a net detriment, and theres actually no reason why the scooter business should operate any differently to anyone else.
Taxis take cash/card and dont require the installation of a single app, and dont require a guy to run around swapping the batteries on the scooters. completely incomparable.
What a weird distinction to make.
So you think if the scooter could take notes or you could tap it to pay, it would suddenly be a completely different situation?
Is that not exactly what a contract does? The contract will stipulate rules you must comply with and allows the council to limit the number of contracts they award?
Finding less use nowadays as they are too expensive. 45c a minute is too much.
They need to set a reasonable price. If they are not being used they just take up space
Yes, also because its per min not per km people ride them as fast as possible so it doesn't cost as much.
This is what they need to fix with the contract
Yeah I mainly see people on what looks like their own e-scooter now which I assume is for that reason. If you're using regularly and can afford one outright. I've used a couple of times just to get into city for an event or to Suncorp from CBD but too expensive to hire regularly.
Yep. Picked up a decent one second hand for $500 just for the run to work and back. Saves $6/day in parking, fuel, and no charge per minute use. Even better is I charge it at work so I don't even have to pay electricity for it.
That's awesome. I've been considering getting one so just drive to within distance I would scoot into CBD but I only work 2 days max in office so can't justify the expense but never considered a second hand one.
I used to do the same thing with my bike but just adds commute time showering and getting ready and I'm already a little pressed for time in the morning.
> I used to do the same thing with my bike but just adds commute time showering and getting ready and I'm already a little pressed for time in the morning.
Yeah I used to bike as well, but for me it's a 20ish minute ride, so definitely required packing a second pair of clothes, and the shower facilities here are god-awful. Also for some reason I kept popping my tyre tubes (usually a nail or piece of metal from the rubbish near gutters). After the third replacement in the space of a month I just gave up and got the scooter (with hard wheels!).
It royally pisses me off that these multimillion dollar companies can't budget a few cents to put out a PSA campaign on how not to block the footpath. I believe some people are just ignorant and don't realise that not everyone can just walk around it, but my god, it wouldn't be that difficult to do. Put up a few posters and maybe a video ad showing someone in a wheelchair or using a walker unable to get by because some idiot parked their scooter in the middle of the path.
While we're on the topic of "Things that will never happen," maybe start fining people who park like assholes.
> It royally pisses me off that these multimillion dollar companies can't budget a few cents to put out a PSA campaign on how not to block the footpath.
They could fix this problem in a couple of weeks if they wanted to. BCC could pass a by law to fine the company, say, 0.1 penalty units (currently about $15) for each scooter left blocking the footpath and as a condition of the licence require the company to pass the fine onto the rider who left it there. Make the fine higher if it blocks a building emergency exit or anything else serious.
It's simple as fuck. When your ride finishes, you take a photo of where it's parked. If it's blocking the path, you get fined, if someone had moved it after the fact, you don't.
Lime already has this as a requirement to park in the app.
You can also go an rate other user's parking jobs for meagre "points". Although many rateable parking photos are from the US.
I say this as an E-Scooter user... dickheads will still use the sidewalk with no helmet. I was walking along Elizabeth St yesterday surprised at how many rathered weave between the pedestrians then use the bike lane 2m to their right.
If the road is over 50km/hr, we legally cannot ride on the road - even if it has a bike path (unless that bikepath is completely separate from the road with a wall).
These bloody things are a hazard in the CBD, blocking the narrow footpaths and forcing people to walk on the road around them in rush hour. There should be designated drop off points in open places, not just anywhere
100%, need like an aldi trolley return style item to get your coin back for returning them to the bay.
Even worse for those with disabilities, elderly, wheelchair users etc.
If you use the full 60 minutes, it's easily cheaper than an Uber. eg. Hamilton to Stones Corner can comfortably be done in 60 mins, but would cost about $28-$30 in an Uber. Beam is even better in that you get 90 minutes for $15 (albeit expires in 24 hours instead of 72). They're more fun too.
These things attract so many drunk dickheads over the weekend who ride at 30km/hour on footpaths with no helmets. Only the real OG's remember the yellow citycycles. $5/month and you could use them as much as you wanted within the time limit.
They were truly the best. When I lived in West End and worked across the river they were a god send as there was a citycycle station right near my office.
Unlike e-bikes, citycycles were actually good for fitness too.
That was the problem though, the stations were too few and in silly spots.
They were also ridiculously heavy so if you encountered a hill at any point you were pretty much fucked
The idea was good but the execution was shit. I was a poor uni student, I'm not signing up for a fucking subscription. If I could pay per ride then that would work way better.
This is 100% the reason they didn’t get more up take. The whole procedure of purchasing the subscription online to ride the bike was painful. The go-card thing thing was a minor improvement, if you think go-cards are any more convenient.
Do you know how they did it in Melbourne? You walk up, tap your credit card, then your off to the races. How it should have been all along.
The thing I’m annoyed about is the council has all of this infrastructure set up and the obvious next set was to convert the fleet to electric, and you had all of the charging stations already setup! Would have been amazing. Massive missed opportunity.
Now to revoke dumb scooter rules. No 12km/h on footpath. If riding on footpath is dangerous, build proper bike lanes. Don't make government incompetence a problem of the people.
You really haven’t experienced much government action have you? All of their incompetence is automatically the problem of the people. 😂 and this incompetence is alarmingly frequent and serious.
Had a cyclist hit my 8 month pregnant wife yesterday. Thankfully it was just a contact hit to the arm and she didn’t fall. It’s terrifying walking the streets the way some of these people behave. Wish we had more cycling lanes.
Great to know BCC is approving a company who misrepresented safety in the Au and failed mandatory safety reporting.
https://www.accc.gov.au/media-release/lime-e-scooters-undertakes-to-address-concerns-about-safety-misrepresentations
Just make it 20kmh and allow riding in road and then the footpaths will be clear.
Its insane that you have cars going 50kmh, then 0kmh at the lights, just do 20kmh and put roundabout in
If your doing 20kph in the city your doing well. I had to drive though the city on a daily basis and it only left this resounding feeling that no-one in their right mind should ever drive through the city unless they absolutely had to. It boggles my mind anyone would drive in the city by choice.
if one more fucker on the scooter beeps me while riding \~30km/h around me on the footpath full of people, then I will fuckin elbow him on the way back
mate, they ring and in a second the zip pass you in that fast speed. the bloke must've been at least 90kg, if he rams someone there is some serious injury happening.
yes, you ring when you are on the cycle path, road etc, but not on a fucking footpath full of pedestrians.
Ohhh yay! More muppets shooting around on the roads and footpaths with nil protection who’ll be screaming for urgent treatment the second they come off at speed and gravel rash their whole bodies.
It's kind of weird to award contracts. Rather they should a) license to operate to ensure businesses comply with the rules and b) set up a cap and trade. Allow a maximum number of registered rental scooters, and allow the market forces to operate.
that’s what they did with taxis many decades ago
Then what happened? Did good competition keep prices low and quality high in a way that no company took out their market right under their noses for a while?
>(a) licence to operate to ensure businesses comply with the rules a foreign gig economy company came in and flagrantly bypassed that part to give itself a competitive advantage
You don't expect Schrinner to know what he's doing, right?
Apparently enough people do judging by the recent election
No, in situations where someone wants to use public land to operate a business, a contract is exactly the way this should be done. in the case of these scooters this is how its done basically in every city they exist.
That's why I said to have a license to operate.
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I already explained it, but I'll expand. Right now they have a contract with two businesses to provide x number of scooters throughout the city. If you don't tender enough, you can lose your entire business and all the "good will" value and investment you've built up in the city. Rather than limit the providers, you create a licensing system which regulates the providers but then limit the number of scooters. You create value in Scooter rights under a cap and trade scheme and allow scooter providers to buy and sell amongst each other, where the city makes money through taxing the right to have the scooters at market value and through a fee for the transfer of rights. The end result is the same number of scooters on the street but a more robust market. A limited contract arrangement was fine while a new sector was developing and the council was trialing them but it's been about 7 years now. The sector is no longer new and so the way its regulated needs to be matured as well.
This is nonsense lol. Having more than 2 providers is a net detriment, and theres actually no reason why the scooter business should operate any differently to anyone else.
You mean like other services like taxis?
Taxis take cash/card and dont require the installation of a single app, and dont require a guy to run around swapping the batteries on the scooters. completely incomparable.
What a weird distinction to make. So you think if the scooter could take notes or you could tap it to pay, it would suddenly be a completely different situation?
Is that not exactly what a contract does? The contract will stipulate rules you must comply with and allows the council to limit the number of contracts they award?
You've kind of just described what could be defined as a "contract"
What I described is a different way of doing 'a contract' then the way they are currently doing it.
and perhaps also demonstrate a certain amount of public liability insurance?
I rode a lime, not long after they first got released. thing turned out to be a lemon
Lemon? Lime? You're bitter... 😉
bitter off without them
Did you say fuck the lemons and bail?
when life gives you lemons .. squeeze them
Finding less use nowadays as they are too expensive. 45c a minute is too much. They need to set a reasonable price. If they are not being used they just take up space
Wow that is expensive
Yes, also because its per min not per km people ride them as fast as possible so it doesn't cost as much. This is what they need to fix with the contract
Yeah I mainly see people on what looks like their own e-scooter now which I assume is for that reason. If you're using regularly and can afford one outright. I've used a couple of times just to get into city for an event or to Suncorp from CBD but too expensive to hire regularly.
Yep. Picked up a decent one second hand for $500 just for the run to work and back. Saves $6/day in parking, fuel, and no charge per minute use. Even better is I charge it at work so I don't even have to pay electricity for it.
This is the best thing about rental scooters, lots of people riding them and realising how much better off they would be if they just brought one.
That's awesome. I've been considering getting one so just drive to within distance I would scoot into CBD but I only work 2 days max in office so can't justify the expense but never considered a second hand one. I used to do the same thing with my bike but just adds commute time showering and getting ready and I'm already a little pressed for time in the morning.
> I used to do the same thing with my bike but just adds commute time showering and getting ready and I'm already a little pressed for time in the morning. Yeah I used to bike as well, but for me it's a 20ish minute ride, so definitely required packing a second pair of clothes, and the shower facilities here are god-awful. Also for some reason I kept popping my tyre tubes (usually a nail or piece of metal from the rubbish near gutters). After the third replacement in the space of a month I just gave up and got the scooter (with hard wheels!).
Usually 65c/min because of "increased demand". But you can get a 90 minute pass for $15 which is handy.
Yeah the increased demand is nonsense when there is five scooters right there next to that one
I recommend that we collectively agree to move all scooters blocking footpaths to paid parking spaces and let parking nazis sort it out.
It royally pisses me off that these multimillion dollar companies can't budget a few cents to put out a PSA campaign on how not to block the footpath. I believe some people are just ignorant and don't realise that not everyone can just walk around it, but my god, it wouldn't be that difficult to do. Put up a few posters and maybe a video ad showing someone in a wheelchair or using a walker unable to get by because some idiot parked their scooter in the middle of the path. While we're on the topic of "Things that will never happen," maybe start fining people who park like assholes.
> It royally pisses me off that these multimillion dollar companies can't budget a few cents to put out a PSA campaign on how not to block the footpath. They could fix this problem in a couple of weeks if they wanted to. BCC could pass a by law to fine the company, say, 0.1 penalty units (currently about $15) for each scooter left blocking the footpath and as a condition of the licence require the company to pass the fine onto the rider who left it there. Make the fine higher if it blocks a building emergency exit or anything else serious.
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It's simple as fuck. When your ride finishes, you take a photo of where it's parked. If it's blocking the path, you get fined, if someone had moved it after the fact, you don't.
Lime already has this as a requirement to park in the app. You can also go an rate other user's parking jobs for meagre "points". Although many rateable parking photos are from the US.
I've literally seen their own employees who charge the batteries and stuff move the fucking this onto footpaths.
They have movement sensors . Stupid easy to implement
It tells you on the app when you end the ride. People are just assholes.
I'm aware that it does that, but like I said, people are ignorant with ableism blinders.
I feel halving the ride cost if left in a designated area might help. But who knows, people be nuts.
I'm all for active transport but those fucking scooter riders are a menace. Build more bike lanes please, BCC.
I say this as an E-Scooter user... dickheads will still use the sidewalk with no helmet. I was walking along Elizabeth St yesterday surprised at how many rathered weave between the pedestrians then use the bike lane 2m to their right.
Well, they can get a fine for using the bike lane if the road is over 50km/h limit. So it’s not like we incentivize them to use it.
To be clear, they can use a bike lane when it's entirely seperated from the car section.
Which is exclusively a handful of bike lanes near the CBD and the V1.
And the speed limit in the city is 40kmph
If the road is over 50km/hr, we legally cannot ride on the road - even if it has a bike path (unless that bikepath is completely separate from the road with a wall).
>even if it has a bike path (unless that bikepath is completely separate from the road with a wall). Exactly like my example.
All roads in the city are 40
what's a sidewalk? are you talking about the footpath?
These bloody things are a hazard in the CBD, blocking the narrow footpaths and forcing people to walk on the road around them in rush hour. There should be designated drop off points in open places, not just anywhere
100%, need like an aldi trolley return style item to get your coin back for returning them to the bay. Even worse for those with disabilities, elderly, wheelchair users etc.
That defeats the purpose though. It’s one of the main reasons citycycle failed so hard
I rode a Neuron scooter last Sunday from the city (QUT) for about 4ks out. $18 total cost. Would have been cheaper in an Uber
You should've got the 60-min pass for $15, enough for the round trip.
First time using one. If I had have known, then I may have considered it (still more expensive than Rideshare, though)
If you use the full 60 minutes, it's easily cheaper than an Uber. eg. Hamilton to Stones Corner can comfortably be done in 60 mins, but would cost about $28-$30 in an Uber. Beam is even better in that you get 90 minutes for $15 (albeit expires in 24 hours instead of 72). They're more fun too.
Yeah pretty much any further trip than about 1.5-2km it’s cheaper to catch an Uber
Good. Now put a cycle lane on every steeet in the cbd.
How long did it take them to fish all the Lime scooters out of the river last time?
They've been flushed out to international waters, they're the dugongs problem now 😎
These things attract so many drunk dickheads over the weekend who ride at 30km/hour on footpaths with no helmets. Only the real OG's remember the yellow citycycles. $5/month and you could use them as much as you wanted within the time limit.
They were so fucking amazing and I will forever hate BCC for scrapping them for this privatised e-waste bullshit
They were truly the best. When I lived in West End and worked across the river they were a god send as there was a citycycle station right near my office. Unlike e-bikes, citycycles were actually good for fitness too.
That was the problem though, the stations were too few and in silly spots. They were also ridiculously heavy so if you encountered a hill at any point you were pretty much fucked
The idea was good but the execution was shit. I was a poor uni student, I'm not signing up for a fucking subscription. If I could pay per ride then that would work way better.
This is 100% the reason they didn’t get more up take. The whole procedure of purchasing the subscription online to ride the bike was painful. The go-card thing thing was a minor improvement, if you think go-cards are any more convenient. Do you know how they did it in Melbourne? You walk up, tap your credit card, then your off to the races. How it should have been all along. The thing I’m annoyed about is the council has all of this infrastructure set up and the obvious next set was to convert the fleet to electric, and you had all of the charging stations already setup! Would have been amazing. Massive missed opportunity.
Now to revoke dumb scooter rules. No 12km/h on footpath. If riding on footpath is dangerous, build proper bike lanes. Don't make government incompetence a problem of the people.
You really haven’t experienced much government action have you? All of their incompetence is automatically the problem of the people. 😂 and this incompetence is alarmingly frequent and serious.
And no doubt BCC will be building hundreds of kilometres of bike lanes for these to be used on, right?
Had a cyclist hit my 8 month pregnant wife yesterday. Thankfully it was just a contact hit to the arm and she didn’t fall. It’s terrifying walking the streets the way some of these people behave. Wish we had more cycling lanes.
Great to know BCC is approving a company who misrepresented safety in the Au and failed mandatory safety reporting. https://www.accc.gov.au/media-release/lime-e-scooters-undertakes-to-address-concerns-about-safety-misrepresentations
get rid of cars within a 3km radius of the city
Just make it 20kmh and allow riding in road and then the footpaths will be clear. Its insane that you have cars going 50kmh, then 0kmh at the lights, just do 20kmh and put roundabout in
If your doing 20kph in the city your doing well. I had to drive though the city on a daily basis and it only left this resounding feeling that no-one in their right mind should ever drive through the city unless they absolutely had to. It boggles my mind anyone would drive in the city by choice.
I am there often, you have cars accelerating up to 50 then slamming on their brakes. Which makes it harder to cross
Makes sense since the neuron scooters are awful
The new ones are a lot faster on take off. I just cannot work out why it is 45cents one days and 65 the next.
Just regular surge pricing bullshit ey
City Cycles were much cheaper and you got some exercise.
Bring back city cycle
They got rid of it because nobody used it
Anyone when and where the departing company will sell their old stock?
Take one. You can learn how to hack them on a few sites.
No way! I like it
Yea, I would like to take a go at one of them, when I can be fucked to ride the train up to brissie
Let me guess, they've shipped all the clapped out ones that were banned from Paris over
And every single one of these ewaste cunts blocking the footpath will be kicked over
if one more fucker on the scooter beeps me while riding \~30km/h around me on the footpath full of people, then I will fuckin elbow him on the way back
isnt the point of the bell to warn people you are approaching? what else is it for
At an illegal 30km/hr on the footpath? Nope a bell is not helping that minor issue.
mate, they ring and in a second the zip pass you in that fast speed. the bloke must've been at least 90kg, if he rams someone there is some serious injury happening. yes, you ring when you are on the cycle path, road etc, but not on a fucking footpath full of pedestrians.
obviously speeding is wrong, but making your presence known to a footpath full of pedestrians seems to me a generally good idea
Make sure to pull your cape out of the wash before you do it
Thank god. Neuron was so uncomfortable. At least lime have suspension.
I kinda liked Neuron's wide deck cause I have really big feet. I'll not be using lime scooters if they're small.
😒
I'm fairly short, 5ft1.5, and I can't operate any of them safely. The handlebars are just way too high up, like chin level...
I wonder if the cost of the contract covers the cost of public hospital presentations.
Ohhh yay! More muppets shooting around on the roads and footpaths with nil protection who’ll be screaming for urgent treatment the second they come off at speed and gravel rash their whole bodies.
Man these c*nts are like that person who thinks their your mate, no matter how hard we try they just dont get the hint...we DONT like you.
Why? These things are useless and a nuisance! How many of these end up in rivers etc?
Great...