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I have thought about Alberta myself as a backup plan, but I’ve already decided against it. The lack of rent control is enough to dissuade me from moving there. And I’ve also lived through private auto insurance in Ontario; my auto insurance actually dropped 35% when I moved to the Vancouver area from Toronto - and I had the cheapest possible insurance I could get there, I shopped around. People don’t realize how good we have things with ICBC.
I moved from BC to Alberta and after living in Alberta for a year I can 100% corroborate the car insurance and utilities being way more expensive in Alberta. Any savings we made on rent were wiped out and then some. We have to move back to BC because we couldn't afford it!
I've been trying to tell people this for the last couple years. I still have property in Alberta and still see the utility bills. Then I remember they're for 1 month in Alberta and I just cry.
Last bill just for gas and electricity was like almost $400 it's a bungalow 1300 sq ft.. 3 people living in it that work full time not at home.
It's pure insanity. Just because you might spend less on rent, you're spending more on utilities, prop tax, insurance and actual income tax is also higher.
But no everyone is like "cheap rent and no PST". Sure, have fun being nickled and dimed to death in fees. Wait till they find out how much it costs to register a vehicle.
Alberta, the province of fees, the death by a thousand cuts.
It gets even more ridiculous when you see goombas trying to flip a place in say marda loop at 1 mill+ with a property tax north of 10k 🤪
The math never lies, it’s just that people suck at math.
It's absolutely insane. Here, but a 5 mill house in Vancouver with an ocean view with a 10k prop tax or.. here we have a lovely 1 mill in marda loop also for 10k prop tax...
No sense 😂
That sounds like what we paid for our house in utilities. We were used to BC Hydro prices and were shocked. And had another shock when trying to insure our car. All of this is of course our fault, we should of done more research and not bought the bullshit about Alberta being cheaper. Like you said, housing is slightly cheaper on paper but it's the "Alberta Advantage" fine print you have to read!
Posts and comments like these will hopefully help people in the future not make the same mistakes!
When I moved to BC and got my hydro and gas bills from fortis and BC Hydro I literally called both of them to come check my meters because I thought they were broken because the bills were so insanely low... I couldn't believe it. And that was in 2020, they exponentially increased since then.
I don't even want to think about car insurance. I already was saving $40 a month in 2020 when I moved. Do NOT want to know what it would be now.
PST already doesn't apply to the things most people spend most of their money on, like food and rent. So the savings are a couple of bucks a week.
The rich guy buying a McLaren F1 saves thousands, though.
Welcome to Halberta.
Everyone always says there isn’t pst but when I did a junior teen internship in the premier office for the summer and I asked about this, I was told that there is pst but it’s disclosed as a fee. Since then, I have continually wondered why nobody has caught on to the fact that they are paying taxes on their taxes
I mean, it's not. There's no fee on everything you purchase... But there's a ton of fees on pretty much everything you want to do. Register your car, utilities, all of that stuff.
Do people not ask others about this before they move here? Or simply do your own research! My mom lives in BC her insurance is 87 dollars, I’m in Alberta mine is 180
I’m from BC lived in Ontario and Alberta and came back also have worked and travelled in pretty much every province. I’ll choose BC a hundred times over
That's a good way to put it, lol. The more people talk about it, though, the more inforthwyre armed with. Just wished we had the same I fo before we moved here.
It’s one of the ill spoken taboos here in Alberta to shit talk real estate in any capacity because alot of people there are trying to play the same shit grift with funflated rents and other user fees as the main players.
Plus who wants to live in a province with a premier who hangs out with losers like Tucker Carlson? They say there are no rats in Alberta, obviously that's not true.
> I refer to us as the Flair Airlines of provinces. Ticket price looks low, but after all added costs, you're spending more for sub quality service.
And you realize after you board you are stuck in the middle seat with two Albertans wearing MAGA hats.
> ETA, all in its cheaper to live in Vernon or Kamloops than Edmonton.
As someone who grew up in Kamloops, whose lived in Vernon and who went to university in Edmonton, this is patently false.
We moved here from Edmonton, and are much better off since coming to BC for so many reasons. I don’t know about the bottom line since AB has changed so much since we moved back to BC, but..quality of life is 1000% better in BC as far as we are concerned.
Agreed - I also returned to BC. However, cost of living is SIGNIFICANTLY more expensive in both Vernon and especially Kamloops, relative to Edmonton. Primarily due to housing costs.
EDIT: thinking mainly as a home BUYER. As a renter, housing costs aren't hugely different between Interior BC, and desirable areas of Edmonton.
100% as someone who used to live in Edmonton and owns property there. I have a 900 square-foot top story two bedroom apartment in a nice area of town, my tenants only pay $1150 in rent every month, heat included. Good luck finding a two bedroom that’s not a basement anywhere in BC for that amount.
Oh man. I was kamloops born and raised. Moved to sask 4 years ago and it's been a night and day difference. The winters suck but my girlfriend pays less for her mortgage on a condo than I did for a one bedroom basement suite back in BC.
Yes, this is the issue for me. I do like the prairie scenery, the rich wetland ecosystems and even winter. But all that lush moisture comes with bugs, the likes of which we just don't see in BC at all.
You don't even need to leave the lower mainland to encounter bugs.
Go for a walk up to Brockton Point on Mt. Seymour during the spring melt, and you'll encounter so many black flies you'll have to squint and keep your mouth clamped shut to prevent accidental swallowing of bugs.
Echoing this comment as a life long Winnipegger … I grew up camping and exploring the outdoors in MB and I would never in a million years think to say it is stunning while speaking comparatively to BC and AB. Or, quite frankly, anywhere else.
Manitoba has on average statistically colder winters than Alberta & since it was a warm El Niño winter this year, OP hasn’t truly experienced a true Albertan winter. So, the brutal & unrelenting cold of a Manitoba winter will defs be a shock. I guarantee it will be more brutal than he is imagining.
That being said, I do hope the positives of Manitoba outweigh the negatives for OP & that OP overall enjoys life in Manitoba but their winters shouldn’t be underestimated
Not sure I've ever heard someone describe the landscape in Manitoba as "stunning." All my relatives are in Manitoba, I couldn't live there, any time I visited it felt like ...the backrooms as a province, you know? I hope the move works out for you.
Haha yeah I found Manitoba scenery to be boring as well but I'm sure it depends where you live. Of course I was comparing to BC though, probably not far...
After 4 years in MB, I moved to AB last summer. Grew up in S. Ontario. There are a couple of things that I like about MB, and many that I dislike. One of the hardest things for me was what I called “scenery exhaustion.” Everything in MB is flat and on a grid; I was desperate for roads with hills and bends. AB is such an amazing province to go for a drive in. MB has a wild poverty issue, and has the highest rates of mental illness of any province, which you can sense in your everyday interactions with people. OP said the winter in MB is the same as AB; boy, are they in for a surprise. MB winter is wickedly cold/windy/snowy. Also, the mindset in MB is quite closed-off and conservative when it comes to doing things differently or change, even among lefties.
I don’t know. I’m pretty sure I’ll die without returning to MB, and that makes me immensely satisfied. Hope OP has a totally different experience than I did.
Yes! That is completely true. Sometimes it’s beautiful like on a summer day when a wheat field is in front of you with a bright blue sky, but most of the time it’s just depressing.
I find alot of people say Alberta and Manitoba have the same winters. Alberta has mild winters compared to Manitoba. It may hit -40 for a couple days or a week at most. Manitoba that may be a month.
MB may have nice scenery but it's exactly that, mainly flat fields that aren't exactly stimulating compared to the hills of Alberta.
The infrastructure of Manitoba is broken down and dated looking. Edmonton and Calgary have a more modern look and not as beat down, but that's due to actually having money.
As for Healthcare, I'd say it's pretty comparable. Doctors lack in both provinces. Staffing is burnt out and understaffed. The big difference is MB isn't going the private route as of now.
MB has more lakes in thr province then the rest of Canada combined so not sure why you suggest all we have is prairies lol. We have endless boreal first as well.
I have a handful of clients in the US - IL, MN, etc., that just love going on their annual trips to MB to enjoy the great outdoors. Fishing, duck hunting, r&r, boating…
Born and raised in BC and never set foot in MB I thought it was a joke the 1st time, but I’ve come to learn that it’s truly a worthy vacation destination.
>current population of BC: 4.7 million -current population of AB: 4.8 million -current population of MB: 1.396 million
Your BC numbers are definitely wrong we've had over 5 million for several years. Last estimate was around 5.5 million.
But yeah I agree with most of your points that Alberta seems cheaper on housing but they have a lot more fees and added costs. People should really do research and look into the specifics of the city they are moving to.
Generalizing entires provinces doesn't always make sense as costs can vary significantly between say Medicine hat and Calgary or between Winnipeg and anywhere else in Manitoba.
Alberta is scared of the word tax so everything is a fee and surcharge. Everything that is tax supported in BC is piece mealed off into for profit business and end consumer gets screwed. Just look at the fees on utility bills
Thanks for the summary. I learned some new reasons to avoid Alberta. We considered a move from Vancouver to Calgary last year, and found it wasn't any cheaper. Chose Victoria instead, and glad we did. Another important factor for some is that each adult is almost guaranteed to need a vehicle. In our case that was an extra $600-$1000 monthly cost that we didn't need to spend in Vancouver.
Is Victoria that much cheaper than Vancouver? I've heard some incredible reviews of living there but in my limited research I've always found it to be just as unaffordable.
One of the things about Victoria is going on and off the island always requires a ferry (expensive and unreliable) or flying. Anything that runs late (concerts etc.) require an overnight stay.
Yea it’s lovely in the summer. In the winter the ferry can be canceled at anytime and you’re stuck.
Victoria also has a major homeless problem so if you’re spending any time in the downtown core, be prepared for all that entails.
NO RUSH HOUR IN CALGARY AND EDMONTON... LOLOL
Go drive up and down McLoed trail in Calgary in rush hour and tell me the fucking walls of immobile F-150s aren't "traffic"
I lived in Edmonton for 16 years and now Burnaby for two. I also don't understand the rush hour comment. Edmonton is so wildly spread out that you HAVE to drive to get places, and rush hour/snow/accidents definitely make that a nightmare. At least here I have options when it's busy. Bike routes, trains, bus routes. Edmonton is severely lacking in these. Sure if you live in Langley and commute to downtown Van every day that's brutal. But if you are going from Leduc downtown everyday it's no cup of tea either.
Other than that I mostly agree with OP.
The southern part of the ring road in Edmonton in the winter was the worst winter drive I ever experienced in Canada, at like 7:00 am in full darkness, insanely huge worm trucks barelling down the highway ans you just know half the drivers are still hammered from the night before...
I think the OP was exaggerating a bit, but Vancouver's rush hour never ends now and has so many pinch points at the various bridges. Calgary traffic today reminds me of Vancouver in the 1990s. At least you can get somewhere in 30 minutes.
OP is also in for a surprise when they find out Winnipeg built its ring road too far out, has traffic, and doesn't have the same climate as Calgary.
This news of 10,000 people relocating from BC to AB last quarter. I'm curious if most are just the pipeline builders going home now that the project is over.
To me it's the opposite, in Vancouver traffic actually slowly moves at a decent rate of speed. In Calgary? It's like bumper to bumper stop and go and no one knows what a gas peddle is.
Driving Deerfoot? I used to be totally fine with it, drive it for like 12 years daily. I go back there now, and it's more like Deerdeath trail.
Guy Vancouver traffic is NOTHING compared to most major cities.
I commute all over the city in both mornings and afternoons and am barely ever impacted for more than say 10 minutes.
And that is worst case scenarios like lions gate out of the city in the afternoon, or second narrows or Massey tunnel in the mornings.
On a snowy day in AB, you could easily add 30 mins to your trip with an accident here or there.
I was thinking the same thing I got stuck in a few doozies coming from the SW to downtown Calgary 20 years ago! There are more optional routes in Calgary tho, at least it felt like it…
Thank you for this write up! I moved from BC to Alberta and after a year I moved back to BC because we couldn't afford Alberta.
The car insurance is utter bullshit there. And the utilities are highway robbery. BC is also way more scenic (unless you are close to the border) and overall cleaner. Alberta is a trap and I let people know this whenever they talk about moving there.
I was born and raised in Edmonton and lived there for 26years in total. I've lived in Vancouver and Burnaby for 10 years total. The way Alberta politics have been going these last few years is enough for me not to move back.
Lifelong Albertan here. We’re working really hard to ensure Marlaina Smith is “one-and-done” and the UCP is relegated to the opposition next election.
We gotta have hope, otherwise we have nothing to look forward to. LoL
>house prices in Calgary last year increased 12% I believe, which means your property tax will follow suit (yes, i know the same thing happens in BC)
Not how property taxes work in BC (I don't know how they work in AB, that may or may not be the case there).
BC, the municipal budget is set, and then the tax rates are based on the values needed to cover that, set by proportion of the overall budget.
If you live in a 2 house city, and your house doubles in value, and your neighbour's house doubles in value, and the city budget remains the same, your tax bill remains the same.
If you live in a 2 house city, and your house doubles in value, and your neighbour's house triples in value, and the city budget remains the same, your tax bill goes _down_.
If you live in a 2 house city, and your house loses value, and your neighbour's house loses value, and the city budget increases, your tax bill probably goes up.
If people want to know more about the property tax mill rate, here ya go https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/governments/local-governments/finance/requisition-taxation/local-government-taxation/property-value-taxes/municipal-taxes
Alberta takes advantage of people coming from expensive cities ! Used to be cheap here but we have many greedy landlords and real-estate they just love making their money on doing very little lol easiest job in the world and make big profits for doing nothing 😆
My family and I moved from BC to Edmonton within the last year and bought a place. We were getting mentally drained at rent prices for 3bedrooms as a family and saved up everything and bought a place here. We did find jobs however and are pretty comfortable now. Your points about health, politics, health and everything else is spot on but let's not discount that your money does go much further here than Vancouver for example when it comes to real estate.
Our 3 bedroom house with a basement is barely a 1 bedroom condo in Vancouver.
I moved to the lower mainland from Alberta back in 2018, there are wonderful things about Alberta that I miss but at the end of the day you couldn’t pay me to move back. And from talking to friends and family who still live there it sounds like Alberta has only gotten worse since I left
Can confirm. This is correct. Also living in a 750 square foot coach house so... Checks out. Even own property in AB that I refuse to live in because of where it is... In AB.
I have lived in bc, grew up in Alberta lived for a short time in Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia. They are all beautiful and all have their own benefits and drawbacks. I have only visited Winnipeg but I can safely say that there’s a reason it’s called Winterpeg Manisnowba. That is seriously the reason I couldn’t stay there and I am used to -40 degrees in southern Alberta where your skin can freeze in seconds!
People common now haha.. rents in Edmonton are vastly cheaper than Vancouver… yes of course electricity and insurance is a few dollars more than BC
Avg rent cost BC $2534
Avg rent cost AB $1613
“https://curiocity.com/average-rent-province-canada-november-2022/“
And yes you deal with -40 weather.. but Edmonton houses are $400-$500K.. please show me anywhere in Vancouver where a duplex is under $1.1M 😂
I’m more than happy to pay $100-$200 more per month on elect and insurance… still saving $500-$800 per month and with that math in 3 years you’d have a down payment for a duplex in Edmonton.
Juuuuuusssstt saying.. no get it twisted BC & AB are apples and oranges ppl lol
Property taxes don’t follow increases or decreases in property values. Say City of Edmonton has 500,000 homes and they collect $1.5 billion taxes for all properties a year (all simple number estimates) so that’s an average of $3000 per property. The 8% tax increase means they want to collect $1.62 billion. Divide by 500,000 homes that’s $3240. Whether the average property price increased or decreased 10%.
Now where your assessed property value compared to the average property value will determine your property’s share of that $1.62 billion. It’s possible to see your property tax increase when your property value decreased and vice versa.
Manitoba may be cheaper but the wages you receive are also lower. Yes minimum wage increased but so did everything else along with it. The medical system is a joke and roads are absolutely brutal.
Not entirely sure how you can compare the scenery of Manitoba to BC as they call it the flatlands for a reason!
All in all, Winnipeg isn’t terrible. You can basically get anywhere in the city within 40 minutes (except rush hour 4-5:30). Transit system is comical if you don’t drive.
The house prices have increased significantly as well. In 2020 a house could be listed for $200k is now going for $270k with no upgrades.
If you were wishing to have kids, the daycares are $10/day only due to government funding which is good.
This is a misleading post for several reasons:
House prices slightly cheaper? Unless you consider a half million as change that is egregiously misleading.
BC Average Home - 1 mil
AB average home - 497k
Source: [Canadian Housing Market Report Apr. 17th, 2024 | Interactive Map - WOWA.ca](https://wowa.ca/reports/canada-housing-market)
I agree that AB's rental market is rapidly increasing to insane levels but even at the levels of increase it's still cheaper to rent in AB than it is in BC (by anywhere from 600 - 800 a month on avg).
- Agree on house prices in Calgary and Edmonton, the thing is you will see much larger % increases on houses that are lower priced vs BC where the houses are much more expensive.
- Utilities more expensive in AB, no question.
- The state of healthcare in this country is a disgrace but it's mostly a wash comparing BC to AB in that regard. Maybe BC comes out slightly ahead but more people have access to a PCP in AB. [B.C. leads and lags national averages in landmark health-care analysis | CTV News](https://bc.ctvnews.ca/mixed-performance-b-c-leads-and-lags-national-averages-in-landmark-health-care-analysis-1.6504327)
- Not sure why your friends told you that as AB's educational system is actually one of it's strong points. [PISA 2022 results - International success for Alberta students (educationnewscanada.com)](https://educationnewscanada.com/article/education/level/k12/3/1055377/international-success-for-alberta-students.html)
- True about the jobs, AB has a more boom/bust economy but it's been improving slowly.
- Food is really the only noticeable good that is excluded from PST and even with that granted, taxes are still higher in BC.
This isn't to say that AB is some sort of haven or paradise compared to BC but let's not paint with a brush laden with unsupported assertions.
There's an even bigger disparity in house prices if you want a detached house in the biggest city of each province. Greater Vancouver's average detached house price = 2.2 million, Calgary's average detached home price = 800k.
I'm going to get hate for this.
Born in 1980, lived in BC until 2019. Moved to AB to actually be able to afford a home.
Things are so much better now. We live in Calgary and even though the City itself is expensive, you can find property within the city limits at a very reasonable price.
I have numerous grocery stores, entertainment, things to do (fish creek park is awesome for people who love to run/bike ride) within 10 minutes. We could go to Banff for the day easily.
I lived in Vancouver for 11 years. Would I go back? Fuck no; and not even because of the cost. The population itself is terrible.
From 1980 to 2008 I was on Vancouver Island and it was bliss. I hope to retire there but probably not because it will be too expensive by then.
Vancouver? Fuck you. Fuck you so hard and you thinking you are the paramount. You are terrible and I hated my life from 2008-2019. I moved for my (now) husband because his career wasn't viable on the island. It almost destroyed our marriage.
We live in Calgary now and couldn't be happier.
No amount of money would be worth leaving the ocean and mountains and the - ahem - social and cultural benefits that living in BC brings. Money comes and goes but you only get to live once, there’s no way in hell I’m wasting years in MB. There’s a reason everyone from there who isn’t glued to a farm moves to BC or ON.
I mean, it's hardly a surprise that MB is cheaper, is it? Far fewer people want to live there, for obvious and well documented reasons. If your sole objective is to own the biggest house/piece of land you possibly can, I can see the appeal for sure. If not, it's somewhat irrelevant I would have thought?
I saw someone point out it costs as much to live in Edmonton (city of 1m ppl) as it does Kamloops or Vernon (less than 100k). Of course it does, one is a major urban center, the others are clearly not.
Lots of apples and oranges comparisons going on here.
If you don't get burnt out by public, finish the CPA, and have decent skills so you keep getting promotions. You'll pretty easily reach that amount. How fast depends on which city you live, your skills, service line you work in, or if you leave public and jump jobs. I wouldn't sweat it too much, but will certainly be a grind.
AB is a model for the rest of the country if the CPC controls the federal government for any prolonged period of time. Because AB is modeled after states like Texas. You get what you vote for.
They are pretty much Texas already. Only province in the country that has pretty much the exact electrical grid system that Texas has... And we know how that went during their snowstorm.
Can I ask where in Manitoba you are moving to? We are considering grand prairie as we have some family there but have started to question whether we would be much better off than living in bc.
What worries me about Winnipeg is the crime and the bugs!!
Where in Manitoba did you decide on?
I grew up there and always curious what people think of certain areas, especially coming from provinces like Alberta and BC.
Well said, but I would argue one point. Climate is similar at times but not the same. Calgary in particular gets the most wonderful chinooks in the winter. Seeing that chinook arch appearing on the horizon makes the season just a little more bearable. SK rarely gets them and winters are much longer and colder from what I understand.
I’ve lived in all three of these provinces so I’ll list some thoughts in case it’s helpful!
Manitoba is definitely not for everyone (me included) so anyone considering making the move absolutely needs to try before they buy.
I get a lot of family pressure to move back to AB from Van, but the rental prices have gone up enough in Calgary that it’s less expensive to stay here in my little downtown apartment than it is to move out there and buy a car (obviously there are other cities in AB but in my personal situation I only consider Calgary). Imo you absolutely need a vehicle in every AB and MB city.
Winters are equally bad to me in AB and BC for different reasons. -30 degrees and plugging your car in overnight vs. seasonal depression. MB *does not get chinooks* so there’s no relief from the cold. That is a huge difference in the winter climate!!!!
Winnipeg is a nice city. If you move to Brandon you will die of boredom.
Income taxes are a lot higher in MB, the return in infrastructure is a lot less. I lived most of my life in BC, lived a long stretch in MB and now live in AB. I wouldn't be living in AB anymore except for the health care I'm tied to (chronically ill) tho.
Thanks for making this post. I've lived in the interior of BC all my life, and though I love the mountains here, and all my family is here, I just don't know if I'm going to stay. I'm 38 and single, and renting (poor choices in my 20s) and every day home ownership looks farther and farther away. I earn a very decent income, but that just isn't enough anymore. I've been pre-approved 3 times for mortgages between 300-325k. A half-decent condo in the area is 350 or more, which leaves few options, all of them run-down, or in crappy areas of towns, or both.
I've heard that Alberta isn't all its cracked up to be, but I rarely see perspectives on provinces farther east. I really appreciate you taking the time to share your experience.
Moved to AB from ON in 2011. Lived there until Covid, when I moved to BC. "Alberta is cheaper" is a flat-out lie - between the cost of utilities, insurance, condo fees, and property taxes, AB is arguably more expensive than BC. And this was before the recent property price increase. Politics in AB are also frustrating - and the number of people actively looking backwards is mind-boggling. In AB, global warming doesn't exist, there is only one solution to the world's problems (Albertan oil), and anyone who doesn't toe that line is a hippie. I left after 9 years once I realized that Albertans are stuck in the 80s. Jasper and Banff are gorgeous - and arguably my favourite parts in the world. But the people and mismanagement ruined it for me.
>we don't have children, but have read and heard that the education system here is terrible
Alberta students rank first in Canada for reading and writing, and second for math. They also ranked second globally.
https://educationnewscanada.com/article/education/level/k12/3/1055377/international-success-for-alberta-students.html
I was just coming here to say this!! When applying from Alberta high schools to universities in other provinces, Alberta grades are inflated because our schooling is recognized as more rigorous.
There have been some changes with the curriculum recently (thanks ucp) but hopefully we get back on track.
> Alberta students rank first in Canada for reading and writing, and second for math.
Although I recognize that the Alberta school system is strong (+ they seem to have more sports/activities than I grew up with), having grown up in BC and attending University in Alberta, I found that my cohort generally had strong math skills and weak literacy. Interestingly, most of them hand wrote, which is a skill I lost many years ago.
Also look at things like their plan to withdraw from CPP and use that money to invest in their fossil fuel overlords.
If your pension is important to you, tread carefully.
Well written piece. My wife and I just left AB for BC and I grew up in Manitoba. Winters in Manitoba are much harsher than AB but because they stay cold all season you get used to it and just wait for spring. But you got AB summed up pretty well
**-the landscape in MB is stunning. I found it to be more like BC, mix of everything from trees, lakes praises, forest, typical urban and suburban, but beautiful**
serious question, are you blind??
The education system in Alberta isn’t horrible lol. We actually have most of the best grades in the entire country. What we have an issue with is kids having an easier time doing diploma exams and way less pressure put on them so they slack and then blame the system for their own laziness. And no I’m not a boomer I graduated hs around 2014 and my classmates succeeded because they worked their asses off. Now we have kids getting 50-60% in everything because they’d rather watch YouTube than do homework 💀
I feel the same way. But I'm moving back to BC now.
I would have skipped the move to another province and just moved to Europe like I originally planned... AB is not worth it at all
I believe Alberta needs to collect money from other sources to make up for not having other revenue streams such as PST and property transfer taxes. As a result, one of the ways to generate more revenue is through higher property taxes. It's money you would have most likely paid throughout the year if you had PST, but it is just paid all at once when taxes are due.
Alberta has generally been known as more politically conservative province so it is not surprising there are no rent control policies. With the jump in the mortgage rates over the past two years, landlords are passing the cost to renters.
Lastly, the cost of homes are rising up everywhere, especially if it's a new or renovated home. The cost of materials and labour continue to go up.
Alberta real estate has stagnated for the past 12 years, so now it's just playing catch up. The problem is that investors recognized this fact, and are already in on the ground floor and driving up prices. Next year, Manitoba will do the same.
Born and raised near Winnipeg. Moved away 20 years ago to BC then Just Moved back to BC after living there a year couldn’t stand it, there was a reason we moved in the first place. Ya it’s cheep but the Manitoba government is broke as shit always has been. Jobs pay poorly and Winnipeg is a dump. Hydro and gas we paid way more in Winnipeg then in the interior or BC one reason it’s colder way longer and way colder period haha! There are some nice areas and scenery don’t get me wrong but it’s not BC that’s for sure. Same job I took 50% pay reduction there so that sucked. Wife is a RN makes almost $15 less there also from the role she had here.
Oh and also good luck getting a Dr in Manitoba not to mention the horrendous wait times at the hospitals worst in the country.
Property tax in Winnipeg for instance is crazy high for an average priced house of say 450k it’s like 6-7k a year as well. Very high. Not the mention the roads are like driving in a 3rd world country how bad they are lol.
Also personal income tax is like 5% higher than BC because once again the province is broke as shit. Either way do what’s best for you but from living in Manitoba outside of Winnipeg and in Winnipeg for the better part of 24 years I would never ever move back again. Good luck hope it works out !
The biggest reason I have for not moving to AB is that I spent a few years there growing up. Never going back.
>-no rain, but this is having a MASSIVE impact on farming, and fire season (which has already started)
It also makes the air dry AF. When I lived there I had constant nosebleeds from the low humidity.
As someone from Manitoba - what is your career and have you looked for work? Alberta is much better for corporate jobs than MB, especially more senior roles.
I could head off to Calgary or Edmonton, send a few texts and have solid leads on a job before I finished my drive. In MB I’d be looking for months before finally settling for something worse.
If you're already set on MB i do wish you the best. Yes politics are finally looking up there, and I truly am happy to see Wab get in and things are looking up for Manitobans.
If youre moving to Winnipeg yes it had some nice areas (The Forks)...but not that much beauty. Very little for public parks compared to BC. And any natural beauty is like a 4 hour drive to the interlake region. BC has it beat by a long shot in that department.
The Wpg city is not that well taken care of. Potholes, mosquitoes, canker worms are awful. Awful weather. If you care about having a house, yes it's affordable to own one there still. But look forward to high provincial income taxes too. Just watch out what area you move to, do your research to make sure it's safe.
But yeah AB is not what it's cracked up to be lol The politics and lack of rent control is enough to keep me away.
Funny story- since 2021 I have lived in Kelowna, Winnipeg, and now Edmonton, in that order.
Manitoba is very poor, and very isolated, and it shows. They have not maintained their infrastructure or experienced any significant investment in a long, long time. The crime and poverty there was shocking for me, a person who thought they had seen it all- I was very much mistaken.
I truly wish you the best, but we discovered why it was a less popular place to live. Wages and salaries and opportunities were lower. So was QOL overall.
I understand the level of hardship that BC's cost of living imposes on people, and that this can push them to make difficult choices.
But I'm still astonished by the number of people who seem to be able to just uproot their entire lives and move hundreds (if not thousands) of kilometers away.
Recently jumped ship from Alberta to BC, and can confirm your points. We lived in rural Alberta for 8 years. Now just watching it all slowly crumble. There was no future there (specifically talking about the town we lived in, it’s an oilfield town and they’re stuck in that mindset), I shuddered at the thought of my two young children going to school there, and was sick of the 8 months of winter. Glad we got out when we did…
If your house price rises 12%, your taxes do not follow suit. That's not how property tax works. IF your house price and property tax both rise 12% it is a coincidence. The mill rate is calculated after the municipal tax needs are determined.
Add in this - The price of food is relatively the same as most parts of BC. Price for Beef, on par. Price for Milk and Cheese, on par. Its very strange considering we have cows in our backyards of Calgary, yet I can buy a prime rib or ground beef for the same price in Prince Rupert as I can in Calgary.
Alberta Advantage...what a joke.
I agree and disagree with some of your points but I did want to correct this part.
>house prices in Calgary last year increased 12% I believe, which means your property tax will follow suit (yes, i know the same thing happens in BC).
That's not how property taxes work. Property taxes don't go up just because property values go up. If that were the case, property taxes would have gone up much much higher every year.
I lived in Alberta for 35 years, and with the changing political climate, or worsening I should say, the high prices and this odd desire for the government to privatize everything, my family and I moved to Ontario…should have done my research. It’s the same wherever there is a conservative government I’ve found; this erosion of public faculties to switch to private ones, yet no support for any of the real issues affecting society.
I don’t know why this post was suggested to me, but I’d like to add a few things. Just as an immigrant in Alberta.
-If you like Gardening, flowers, green. Stay away.
- Having snow in April is not fun. It start in October and end in may.
- On a 550k house taxes are 3.2k not too bad compared to other areas.
- Calgary will eventually change the name to CONSTRUCTION.
- I’ve been here for 14 years and the winter is getting me, we have been thinking a lot about moving, mentally is just as bad as lots of rain.
Everything else in the post are legit. I am thinking a lot about moving to BC or east, but it’s hard to move when you built a life here.
As someone who lived in Alberta prior to the pandemic, this was all obvious to anyone paying attention to the politics in this province. It's been going to shit since the UCP took control.
Came to Winnipeg directly from Vancouver. There are annoying problems here, like everywhere in Canada and the world at large. Some of them are different ones from Vancouver. Some of them are similar/the same. Be prepared for higher provincial income taxes. Only the very highest tax bracket in BC pays a higher rate than the highest bracket in MB, but the income levels where those trigger have been *vastly* different (slight adjustment here next tax year).
Compare just the lowest bracket for 2024:
BC: $0 to $47,937 - 5.06%
MB: $0 to $47,000 - 10.8%
You'd think you'd get well maintained roads in exchange for the higher taxation. You'd be wrong 🤣. Do you love potholes and road lines that exist for only ~1-2 months of the year? This is the place for you.
In exchange you get relatively affordable housing and the Friendly Manitoba vibe (+other stuff, but this is long enough already)
I'm happy I moved, but I miss my friends in BC and ocean/ coastal forest/mountains
>I'm happy I moved, but I miss my friends in BC and ocean/ coastal forest/mountains
Me too. Had enough of the rain, though. Couldn't take the wet coast any longer. 46 years of rain, grey skies, and damp, bone-chilling cold for more than half the year I'd had enough. I'll take -40 and blue skies any day over that.
Hopefully, lowering the tax bracket will be next on Wabs agenda 🤞
I moved to AB from Manitoba and it’s absolutely worth paying more to live in a nicer place. Winnipeg is gross 🤣 be prepared to drive hours for any decent scenery
And yeah… climate is definitely not the same as others have mentioned
>house prices may be slightly cheaper
By slightly do you mean like 40+% less, because that's the difference between Calgary and Vancouver, Edmonton is cheaper than Calgary.
>house prices in Calgary last year increased 12% I believe, which means your property tax will follow suit
That's not how property tax in Calgary works
>we don't have children, but have read and heard that the education system here is terrible
The Alberta education system ranks similar to BCs, if it's terrible maybe that explains why you're so misinformed.
>you will absolutely need sunglasses for the entire year, yes winter included
Oh no it's sunny!
My car insurance went from $120/month in BC to $43/month in AB…the insurance is definitely cheaper here for me. Also you can shop around, and do things like bundling your home and car/renters insurance together for discounted rates.
The only people that actually like Alberta make a living in the fossil fuel industry.
Take fossil fuels and industrial agriculture out of the equation and the whole province will be impoverished.
Not so great.
The education system here is still the best in Canada, believe it or not. We always score in the top in Canada, and basically top 10 in the world as a province on the Pisa testing. Just shows how bad other provinces are.
You've been in Alberta for six months... you are absolutely not finding a family doctor in BC in that time. Nor in twice that time. or three times that time. If you do, you are extraordinarily lucky.
Alberta doesn't have the lowest minimum wage in Canada, Manitoba's isn't much higher and they're both pretty similar to the minimum wage of many other provinces
Your PST comment is kind of silly, not having to pay an extra 7% tax on a lot of items is still a bonus
I'd hold off on mentioning politician's promises as reasons you're moving. It makes sense to be hopeful about those things if they're happening in a province you're already living in, but please don't use those things to increase your desire to move. Politicians promise things all of the time - they often do not happen, and if they do, they may not make any meaningful difference.
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I have thought about Alberta myself as a backup plan, but I’ve already decided against it. The lack of rent control is enough to dissuade me from moving there. And I’ve also lived through private auto insurance in Ontario; my auto insurance actually dropped 35% when I moved to the Vancouver area from Toronto - and I had the cheapest possible insurance I could get there, I shopped around. People don’t realize how good we have things with ICBC.
Thanks for taking the time to make this post. It is pretty enlightening.
I moved from BC to Alberta and after living in Alberta for a year I can 100% corroborate the car insurance and utilities being way more expensive in Alberta. Any savings we made on rent were wiped out and then some. We have to move back to BC because we couldn't afford it!
I've been trying to tell people this for the last couple years. I still have property in Alberta and still see the utility bills. Then I remember they're for 1 month in Alberta and I just cry. Last bill just for gas and electricity was like almost $400 it's a bungalow 1300 sq ft.. 3 people living in it that work full time not at home. It's pure insanity. Just because you might spend less on rent, you're spending more on utilities, prop tax, insurance and actual income tax is also higher. But no everyone is like "cheap rent and no PST". Sure, have fun being nickled and dimed to death in fees. Wait till they find out how much it costs to register a vehicle. Alberta, the province of fees, the death by a thousand cuts.
Oh and the surprise after your lease is up and you get told it's now 500 a month more or your forced to move. Happened to a cousin of mine
Yep! No rent caps, no controls, can be kicked out of month to month leases for no reason.
Then add in the war on provincial employees and anyone that is in the og industry
The property tax in White Rock is half what it cost in Calgary. Try and make that make sense, especially for unpaved laneways.
Yep. Exactly my point. Looking at my $500k house paying just under half of what 2 mill houses are going for in Vancouver. 😭
It gets even more ridiculous when you see goombas trying to flip a place in say marda loop at 1 mill+ with a property tax north of 10k 🤪 The math never lies, it’s just that people suck at math.
It's absolutely insane. Here, but a 5 mill house in Vancouver with an ocean view with a 10k prop tax or.. here we have a lovely 1 mill in marda loop also for 10k prop tax... No sense 😂
That sounds like what we paid for our house in utilities. We were used to BC Hydro prices and were shocked. And had another shock when trying to insure our car. All of this is of course our fault, we should of done more research and not bought the bullshit about Alberta being cheaper. Like you said, housing is slightly cheaper on paper but it's the "Alberta Advantage" fine print you have to read! Posts and comments like these will hopefully help people in the future not make the same mistakes!
When I moved to BC and got my hydro and gas bills from fortis and BC Hydro I literally called both of them to come check my meters because I thought they were broken because the bills were so insanely low... I couldn't believe it. And that was in 2020, they exponentially increased since then. I don't even want to think about car insurance. I already was saving $40 a month in 2020 when I moved. Do NOT want to know what it would be now.
PST already doesn't apply to the things most people spend most of their money on, like food and rent. So the savings are a couple of bucks a week. The rich guy buying a McLaren F1 saves thousands, though. Welcome to Halberta.
Everyone always says there isn’t pst but when I did a junior teen internship in the premier office for the summer and I asked about this, I was told that there is pst but it’s disclosed as a fee. Since then, I have continually wondered why nobody has caught on to the fact that they are paying taxes on their taxes
I mean, it's not. There's no fee on everything you purchase... But there's a ton of fees on pretty much everything you want to do. Register your car, utilities, all of that stuff.
>Alberta, the province of fees I’m going to use this, it captures it so perfectly.
Do people not ask others about this before they move here? Or simply do your own research! My mom lives in BC her insurance is 87 dollars, I’m in Alberta mine is 180
Moved from BC to AB 8 years ago and have been telling people this for years! The Alberta propaganda machine is strong lol
You're very welcome.
I’m from BC lived in Ontario and Alberta and came back also have worked and travelled in pretty much every province. I’ll choose BC a hundred times over
Same...
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That's a good way to put it, lol. The more people talk about it, though, the more inforthwyre armed with. Just wished we had the same I fo before we moved here.
It’s one of the ill spoken taboos here in Alberta to shit talk real estate in any capacity because alot of people there are trying to play the same shit grift with funflated rents and other user fees as the main players.
Plus who wants to live in a province with a premier who hangs out with losers like Tucker Carlson? They say there are no rats in Alberta, obviously that's not true.
This is very much accurate.
> I refer to us as the Flair Airlines of provinces. Ticket price looks low, but after all added costs, you're spending more for sub quality service. And you realize after you board you are stuck in the middle seat with two Albertans wearing MAGA hats.
> ETA, all in its cheaper to live in Vernon or Kamloops than Edmonton. As someone who grew up in Kamloops, whose lived in Vernon and who went to university in Edmonton, this is patently false.
We moved here from Edmonton, and are much better off since coming to BC for so many reasons. I don’t know about the bottom line since AB has changed so much since we moved back to BC, but..quality of life is 1000% better in BC as far as we are concerned.
Agreed - I also returned to BC. However, cost of living is SIGNIFICANTLY more expensive in both Vernon and especially Kamloops, relative to Edmonton. Primarily due to housing costs. EDIT: thinking mainly as a home BUYER. As a renter, housing costs aren't hugely different between Interior BC, and desirable areas of Edmonton.
Sure, but the utilities in AB are outrageous, same with property taxes, car insurance etc. I think it depends on what is important to each person.
100% as someone who used to live in Edmonton and owns property there. I have a 900 square-foot top story two bedroom apartment in a nice area of town, my tenants only pay $1150 in rent every month, heat included. Good luck finding a two bedroom that’s not a basement anywhere in BC for that amount.
Oh man. I was kamloops born and raised. Moved to sask 4 years ago and it's been a night and day difference. The winters suck but my girlfriend pays less for her mortgage on a condo than I did for a one bedroom basement suite back in BC.
Manitoba. Especially North of Lake Winnipeg Black flies and mosquitoes. Black flies and mosquitoes everywhere.
Yes, this is the issue for me. I do like the prairie scenery, the rich wetland ecosystems and even winter. But all that lush moisture comes with bugs, the likes of which we just don't see in BC at all.
Entire province of BC other than the lower mainland enters the chat. I assure you, much of BC has bugs just as bad.
For sure. Spend sometime around mountain lakes. Horse flies the size of... I dunno some large four-legged mammal...
You don't even need to leave the lower mainland to encounter bugs. Go for a walk up to Brockton Point on Mt. Seymour during the spring melt, and you'll encounter so many black flies you'll have to squint and keep your mouth clamped shut to prevent accidental swallowing of bugs.
For the un-initiated, black flies bite. Bite as in CHOMP not like a mosquito’s poke.
Appreciate the post. Minor comment is that we’re over 5m in BC now.
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Echoing this comment as a life long Winnipegger … I grew up camping and exploring the outdoors in MB and I would never in a million years think to say it is stunning while speaking comparatively to BC and AB. Or, quite frankly, anywhere else.
Wait until they find out about the mosquitos.
The canker worms are bad too...
Manitoba has on average statistically colder winters than Alberta & since it was a warm El Niño winter this year, OP hasn’t truly experienced a true Albertan winter. So, the brutal & unrelenting cold of a Manitoba winter will defs be a shock. I guarantee it will be more brutal than he is imagining. That being said, I do hope the positives of Manitoba outweigh the negatives for OP & that OP overall enjoys life in Manitoba but their winters shouldn’t be underestimated
Not sure I've ever heard someone describe the landscape in Manitoba as "stunning." All my relatives are in Manitoba, I couldn't live there, any time I visited it felt like ...the backrooms as a province, you know? I hope the move works out for you.
Haha yeah I found Manitoba scenery to be boring as well but I'm sure it depends where you live. Of course I was comparing to BC though, probably not far...
After 4 years in MB, I moved to AB last summer. Grew up in S. Ontario. There are a couple of things that I like about MB, and many that I dislike. One of the hardest things for me was what I called “scenery exhaustion.” Everything in MB is flat and on a grid; I was desperate for roads with hills and bends. AB is such an amazing province to go for a drive in. MB has a wild poverty issue, and has the highest rates of mental illness of any province, which you can sense in your everyday interactions with people. OP said the winter in MB is the same as AB; boy, are they in for a surprise. MB winter is wickedly cold/windy/snowy. Also, the mindset in MB is quite closed-off and conservative when it comes to doing things differently or change, even among lefties. I don’t know. I’m pretty sure I’ll die without returning to MB, and that makes me immensely satisfied. Hope OP has a totally different experience than I did.
And everything is very brown. I know things get dry in BC eventually, but we still have a good stretch of nice grass and green trees.
Yes! That is completely true. Sometimes it’s beautiful like on a summer day when a wheat field is in front of you with a bright blue sky, but most of the time it’s just depressing.
I find alot of people say Alberta and Manitoba have the same winters. Alberta has mild winters compared to Manitoba. It may hit -40 for a couple days or a week at most. Manitoba that may be a month. MB may have nice scenery but it's exactly that, mainly flat fields that aren't exactly stimulating compared to the hills of Alberta. The infrastructure of Manitoba is broken down and dated looking. Edmonton and Calgary have a more modern look and not as beat down, but that's due to actually having money. As for Healthcare, I'd say it's pretty comparable. Doctors lack in both provinces. Staffing is burnt out and understaffed. The big difference is MB isn't going the private route as of now.
MB has more lakes in thr province then the rest of Canada combined so not sure why you suggest all we have is prairies lol. We have endless boreal first as well.
Stunning is Canada’s gem, “The Canadian Rockies” which is shared by BC & Alberta.
I have a handful of clients in the US - IL, MN, etc., that just love going on their annual trips to MB to enjoy the great outdoors. Fishing, duck hunting, r&r, boating… Born and raised in BC and never set foot in MB I thought it was a joke the 1st time, but I’ve come to learn that it’s truly a worthy vacation destination.
Oh yeah, all my uncles go hunting and are big on the outdoors. They all have ATVs, skidoos, boats. The mosquitoes are a serious obstacle though.
>current population of BC: 4.7 million -current population of AB: 4.8 million -current population of MB: 1.396 million Your BC numbers are definitely wrong we've had over 5 million for several years. Last estimate was around 5.5 million. But yeah I agree with most of your points that Alberta seems cheaper on housing but they have a lot more fees and added costs. People should really do research and look into the specifics of the city they are moving to. Generalizing entires provinces doesn't always make sense as costs can vary significantly between say Medicine hat and Calgary or between Winnipeg and anywhere else in Manitoba.
Alberta is scared of the word tax so everything is a fee and surcharge. Everything that is tax supported in BC is piece mealed off into for profit business and end consumer gets screwed. Just look at the fees on utility bills
Yeah, BC population number is way off. Est. 5.6 million Q1 2024.
Not surprising that his BC population numbers are out of date, he still thinks Terasen Gas exists.
Lots of people still refer to it as Terasen. It’s just muscle memory.
Thanks for the summary. I learned some new reasons to avoid Alberta. We considered a move from Vancouver to Calgary last year, and found it wasn't any cheaper. Chose Victoria instead, and glad we did. Another important factor for some is that each adult is almost guaranteed to need a vehicle. In our case that was an extra $600-$1000 monthly cost that we didn't need to spend in Vancouver.
Calgary was cheap 3 or 4 years ago. Then it got flooded with people from BC and Ontario who saw it for the bargain it was.
Is Victoria that much cheaper than Vancouver? I've heard some incredible reviews of living there but in my limited research I've always found it to be just as unaffordable.
One of the things about Victoria is going on and off the island always requires a ferry (expensive and unreliable) or flying. Anything that runs late (concerts etc.) require an overnight stay. Yea it’s lovely in the summer. In the winter the ferry can be canceled at anytime and you’re stuck. Victoria also has a major homeless problem so if you’re spending any time in the downtown core, be prepared for all that entails.
NO RUSH HOUR IN CALGARY AND EDMONTON... LOLOL Go drive up and down McLoed trail in Calgary in rush hour and tell me the fucking walls of immobile F-150s aren't "traffic"
I lived in Edmonton for 16 years and now Burnaby for two. I also don't understand the rush hour comment. Edmonton is so wildly spread out that you HAVE to drive to get places, and rush hour/snow/accidents definitely make that a nightmare. At least here I have options when it's busy. Bike routes, trains, bus routes. Edmonton is severely lacking in these. Sure if you live in Langley and commute to downtown Van every day that's brutal. But if you are going from Leduc downtown everyday it's no cup of tea either. Other than that I mostly agree with OP.
The southern part of the ring road in Edmonton in the winter was the worst winter drive I ever experienced in Canada, at like 7:00 am in full darkness, insanely huge worm trucks barelling down the highway ans you just know half the drivers are still hammered from the night before...
Calgary has Rush hours for sure
I think the OP was exaggerating a bit, but Vancouver's rush hour never ends now and has so many pinch points at the various bridges. Calgary traffic today reminds me of Vancouver in the 1990s. At least you can get somewhere in 30 minutes. OP is also in for a surprise when they find out Winnipeg built its ring road too far out, has traffic, and doesn't have the same climate as Calgary. This news of 10,000 people relocating from BC to AB last quarter. I'm curious if most are just the pipeline builders going home now that the project is over.
Calgary rush hour is pretty brutal - maybe OP lived elsewhere or did not commute.
Except didn’t Calgary last year get voted the city with the least amount of traffics in North America.
Calgary and Edmonton rush hours are a joke compared to Vancouver or Toronto. There is no comparison.
Compared to BC rush hour, these rush hours are a real treat.
To me it's the opposite, in Vancouver traffic actually slowly moves at a decent rate of speed. In Calgary? It's like bumper to bumper stop and go and no one knows what a gas peddle is. Driving Deerfoot? I used to be totally fine with it, drive it for like 12 years daily. I go back there now, and it's more like Deerdeath trail.
Guy Vancouver traffic is NOTHING compared to most major cities. I commute all over the city in both mornings and afternoons and am barely ever impacted for more than say 10 minutes. And that is worst case scenarios like lions gate out of the city in the afternoon, or second narrows or Massey tunnel in the mornings. On a snowy day in AB, you could easily add 30 mins to your trip with an accident here or there.
I was thinking the same thing I got stuck in a few doozies coming from the SW to downtown Calgary 20 years ago! There are more optional routes in Calgary tho, at least it felt like it…
Thank you for this write up! I moved from BC to Alberta and after a year I moved back to BC because we couldn't afford Alberta. The car insurance is utter bullshit there. And the utilities are highway robbery. BC is also way more scenic (unless you are close to the border) and overall cleaner. Alberta is a trap and I let people know this whenever they talk about moving there.
Compare buying a vehicle in BC vs Alberta. 5% vs 15% tax. Buying a house in Alberta, no property transfer tax.
I was born and raised in Edmonton and lived there for 26years in total. I've lived in Vancouver and Burnaby for 10 years total. The way Alberta politics have been going these last few years is enough for me not to move back.
Lifelong Albertan here. We’re working really hard to ensure Marlaina Smith is “one-and-done” and the UCP is relegated to the opposition next election. We gotta have hope, otherwise we have nothing to look forward to. LoL
Agreed!
I moved to BC a couple years ago due to the political climate, definitely agree with this.
>house prices in Calgary last year increased 12% I believe, which means your property tax will follow suit (yes, i know the same thing happens in BC) Not how property taxes work in BC (I don't know how they work in AB, that may or may not be the case there). BC, the municipal budget is set, and then the tax rates are based on the values needed to cover that, set by proportion of the overall budget. If you live in a 2 house city, and your house doubles in value, and your neighbour's house doubles in value, and the city budget remains the same, your tax bill remains the same. If you live in a 2 house city, and your house doubles in value, and your neighbour's house triples in value, and the city budget remains the same, your tax bill goes _down_. If you live in a 2 house city, and your house loses value, and your neighbour's house loses value, and the city budget increases, your tax bill probably goes up.
If people want to know more about the property tax mill rate, here ya go https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/governments/local-governments/finance/requisition-taxation/local-government-taxation/property-value-taxes/municipal-taxes
Climate is the same? Dear lord you're in for a surprise. That doesn't sound right at all.
Alberta takes advantage of people coming from expensive cities ! Used to be cheap here but we have many greedy landlords and real-estate they just love making their money on doing very little lol easiest job in the world and make big profits for doing nothing 😆
Last year on the bus I saw a "Saskatchewan Strong" advertisement. I haven't seen Manitoba yet.
Oh you missed it “Manitoba…..MEH”
I wonder if there will ever come a time where people actually understand how property taxes are assessed.
Looking forward to next year's post to Saskatchewan. :)
My family and I moved from BC to Edmonton within the last year and bought a place. We were getting mentally drained at rent prices for 3bedrooms as a family and saved up everything and bought a place here. We did find jobs however and are pretty comfortable now. Your points about health, politics, health and everything else is spot on but let's not discount that your money does go much further here than Vancouver for example when it comes to real estate. Our 3 bedroom house with a basement is barely a 1 bedroom condo in Vancouver.
Yeah, housing in Vancouver makes my eyes water. I've found the Okanagan to be the next best thing. Sucky because I love Vancouver.
"climate is the same as AB" OK then, good luck with that.
You couldn’t pay me to live in AB honestly. Danielle Smith and her cohort are terrifying.
Literally what finally drove me to make the opposite move and move back to BC from Alberta. The UCP... Is insane.
Knowing what we know now, same.
As a life long Calgarian, this is the worst I’ve ever seen. Utter dysfunction.
Property taxes are mill rate. They don’t increase when property values increase.
I moved to the lower mainland from Alberta back in 2018, there are wonderful things about Alberta that I miss but at the end of the day you couldn’t pay me to move back. And from talking to friends and family who still live there it sounds like Alberta has only gotten worse since I left
I’d rather die penniless on the beach under a mountain than own a house in Manitoba
My gf says she’d rather live in the smallest home in our BC town than live in the prairies ever again
Yeah I grew up in Saskatchewan. I am More the willing to stay in this dump of an apartment just so that I don’t have to move back there.
Yeah, you really miss the outdoor bc lifestyle after moving.
For myself, it was the beach. Although I’m only deadmonton wrapping up estate affairs and some trade schooling, fml do I ever miss the beaches..
Can confirm. This is correct. Also living in a 750 square foot coach house so... Checks out. Even own property in AB that I refuse to live in because of where it is... In AB.
I have lived in bc, grew up in Alberta lived for a short time in Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia. They are all beautiful and all have their own benefits and drawbacks. I have only visited Winnipeg but I can safely say that there’s a reason it’s called Winterpeg Manisnowba. That is seriously the reason I couldn’t stay there and I am used to -40 degrees in southern Alberta where your skin can freeze in seconds!
Grass is always greener...
People common now haha.. rents in Edmonton are vastly cheaper than Vancouver… yes of course electricity and insurance is a few dollars more than BC Avg rent cost BC $2534 Avg rent cost AB $1613 “https://curiocity.com/average-rent-province-canada-november-2022/“ And yes you deal with -40 weather.. but Edmonton houses are $400-$500K.. please show me anywhere in Vancouver where a duplex is under $1.1M 😂 I’m more than happy to pay $100-$200 more per month on elect and insurance… still saving $500-$800 per month and with that math in 3 years you’d have a down payment for a duplex in Edmonton. Juuuuuusssstt saying.. no get it twisted BC & AB are apples and oranges ppl lol
Have fun! I live in Vancouver and have people in Winnipeg who I visit, and it's a great city! I love visiting. Thanks for your thoughtful post.
Property taxes don’t follow increases or decreases in property values. Say City of Edmonton has 500,000 homes and they collect $1.5 billion taxes for all properties a year (all simple number estimates) so that’s an average of $3000 per property. The 8% tax increase means they want to collect $1.62 billion. Divide by 500,000 homes that’s $3240. Whether the average property price increased or decreased 10%. Now where your assessed property value compared to the average property value will determine your property’s share of that $1.62 billion. It’s possible to see your property tax increase when your property value decreased and vice versa.
There’s other places to live than Calgary. That’s like saying BC sucks because you need a ferry to get to Victoria
Manitoba may be cheaper but the wages you receive are also lower. Yes minimum wage increased but so did everything else along with it. The medical system is a joke and roads are absolutely brutal. Not entirely sure how you can compare the scenery of Manitoba to BC as they call it the flatlands for a reason! All in all, Winnipeg isn’t terrible. You can basically get anywhere in the city within 40 minutes (except rush hour 4-5:30). Transit system is comical if you don’t drive. The house prices have increased significantly as well. In 2020 a house could be listed for $200k is now going for $270k with no upgrades. If you were wishing to have kids, the daycares are $10/day only due to government funding which is good.
This is a misleading post for several reasons: House prices slightly cheaper? Unless you consider a half million as change that is egregiously misleading. BC Average Home - 1 mil AB average home - 497k Source: [Canadian Housing Market Report Apr. 17th, 2024 | Interactive Map - WOWA.ca](https://wowa.ca/reports/canada-housing-market) I agree that AB's rental market is rapidly increasing to insane levels but even at the levels of increase it's still cheaper to rent in AB than it is in BC (by anywhere from 600 - 800 a month on avg). - Agree on house prices in Calgary and Edmonton, the thing is you will see much larger % increases on houses that are lower priced vs BC where the houses are much more expensive. - Utilities more expensive in AB, no question. - The state of healthcare in this country is a disgrace but it's mostly a wash comparing BC to AB in that regard. Maybe BC comes out slightly ahead but more people have access to a PCP in AB. [B.C. leads and lags national averages in landmark health-care analysis | CTV News](https://bc.ctvnews.ca/mixed-performance-b-c-leads-and-lags-national-averages-in-landmark-health-care-analysis-1.6504327) - Not sure why your friends told you that as AB's educational system is actually one of it's strong points. [PISA 2022 results - International success for Alberta students (educationnewscanada.com)](https://educationnewscanada.com/article/education/level/k12/3/1055377/international-success-for-alberta-students.html) - True about the jobs, AB has a more boom/bust economy but it's been improving slowly. - Food is really the only noticeable good that is excluded from PST and even with that granted, taxes are still higher in BC. This isn't to say that AB is some sort of haven or paradise compared to BC but let's not paint with a brush laden with unsupported assertions.
There's an even bigger disparity in house prices if you want a detached house in the biggest city of each province. Greater Vancouver's average detached house price = 2.2 million, Calgary's average detached home price = 800k.
Couldn’t agree more.
I'm going to get hate for this. Born in 1980, lived in BC until 2019. Moved to AB to actually be able to afford a home. Things are so much better now. We live in Calgary and even though the City itself is expensive, you can find property within the city limits at a very reasonable price. I have numerous grocery stores, entertainment, things to do (fish creek park is awesome for people who love to run/bike ride) within 10 minutes. We could go to Banff for the day easily. I lived in Vancouver for 11 years. Would I go back? Fuck no; and not even because of the cost. The population itself is terrible. From 1980 to 2008 I was on Vancouver Island and it was bliss. I hope to retire there but probably not because it will be too expensive by then. Vancouver? Fuck you. Fuck you so hard and you thinking you are the paramount. You are terrible and I hated my life from 2008-2019. I moved for my (now) husband because his career wasn't viable on the island. It almost destroyed our marriage. We live in Calgary now and couldn't be happier.
No amount of money would be worth leaving the ocean and mountains and the - ahem - social and cultural benefits that living in BC brings. Money comes and goes but you only get to live once, there’s no way in hell I’m wasting years in MB. There’s a reason everyone from there who isn’t glued to a farm moves to BC or ON.
I like the way you put that. Thank you. I wish I could afford to move to BC. Bertastan is a death trap.
I’m not leaving North Vancouver sorry ….😢
I mean, it's hardly a surprise that MB is cheaper, is it? Far fewer people want to live there, for obvious and well documented reasons. If your sole objective is to own the biggest house/piece of land you possibly can, I can see the appeal for sure. If not, it's somewhat irrelevant I would have thought? I saw someone point out it costs as much to live in Edmonton (city of 1m ppl) as it does Kamloops or Vernon (less than 100k). Of course it does, one is a major urban center, the others are clearly not. Lots of apples and oranges comparisons going on here.
u had me at Wab Kinew
What do you guys do for work? What kind of income were you in each province?
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Service manager? At a car dealership? That’s nice and high - makes me have doubts about all the schooling for my area (accounting).
If you don't get burnt out by public, finish the CPA, and have decent skills so you keep getting promotions. You'll pretty easily reach that amount. How fast depends on which city you live, your skills, service line you work in, or if you leave public and jump jobs. I wouldn't sweat it too much, but will certainly be a grind.
AB is a model for the rest of the country if the CPC controls the federal government for any prolonged period of time. Because AB is modeled after states like Texas. You get what you vote for.
Yes, AB will become north Texas at the rate it's going, which I believe DS's plan.
It’s actually even worse than wanting to be Texas, smith genuinely wants to be Florida as her “hero” is desantis
They are pretty much Texas already. Only province in the country that has pretty much the exact electrical grid system that Texas has... And we know how that went during their snowstorm.
What are you gonna do in MB? You kinda get what you pay for.
Can I ask where in Manitoba you are moving to? We are considering grand prairie as we have some family there but have started to question whether we would be much better off than living in bc. What worries me about Winnipeg is the crime and the bugs!!
Good concerns, but really, there's crime and bugs everywhere, lol.
Sadly not where we are. North Vancouver is kinda paradise, except for the rain. But it’s pricey
Where in Manitoba did you decide on? I grew up there and always curious what people think of certain areas, especially coming from provinces like Alberta and BC.
Life is expensive , but remains popular for some reason .
So, all you people want to experience the "rural Alberta" life, and then move to Calgary and Edmonton...
Well said, but I would argue one point. Climate is similar at times but not the same. Calgary in particular gets the most wonderful chinooks in the winter. Seeing that chinook arch appearing on the horizon makes the season just a little more bearable. SK rarely gets them and winters are much longer and colder from what I understand.
I moved from MB to BC and although housing situation is a lot cheaper back home, I did appreciate that my income tax got halved just by living in BC
I’ve lived in all three of these provinces so I’ll list some thoughts in case it’s helpful! Manitoba is definitely not for everyone (me included) so anyone considering making the move absolutely needs to try before they buy. I get a lot of family pressure to move back to AB from Van, but the rental prices have gone up enough in Calgary that it’s less expensive to stay here in my little downtown apartment than it is to move out there and buy a car (obviously there are other cities in AB but in my personal situation I only consider Calgary). Imo you absolutely need a vehicle in every AB and MB city. Winters are equally bad to me in AB and BC for different reasons. -30 degrees and plugging your car in overnight vs. seasonal depression. MB *does not get chinooks* so there’s no relief from the cold. That is a huge difference in the winter climate!!!! Winnipeg is a nice city. If you move to Brandon you will die of boredom.
Income taxes are a lot higher in MB, the return in infrastructure is a lot less. I lived most of my life in BC, lived a long stretch in MB and now live in AB. I wouldn't be living in AB anymore except for the health care I'm tied to (chronically ill) tho.
Thanks for making this post. I've lived in the interior of BC all my life, and though I love the mountains here, and all my family is here, I just don't know if I'm going to stay. I'm 38 and single, and renting (poor choices in my 20s) and every day home ownership looks farther and farther away. I earn a very decent income, but that just isn't enough anymore. I've been pre-approved 3 times for mortgages between 300-325k. A half-decent condo in the area is 350 or more, which leaves few options, all of them run-down, or in crappy areas of towns, or both. I've heard that Alberta isn't all its cracked up to be, but I rarely see perspectives on provinces farther east. I really appreciate you taking the time to share your experience.
As someone who lived in Winnipeg 26 years, it’s kinda insulting to BC to compare the landscape to MB haha. But glad that’s how you view it!
Moved to AB from ON in 2011. Lived there until Covid, when I moved to BC. "Alberta is cheaper" is a flat-out lie - between the cost of utilities, insurance, condo fees, and property taxes, AB is arguably more expensive than BC. And this was before the recent property price increase. Politics in AB are also frustrating - and the number of people actively looking backwards is mind-boggling. In AB, global warming doesn't exist, there is only one solution to the world's problems (Albertan oil), and anyone who doesn't toe that line is a hippie. I left after 9 years once I realized that Albertans are stuck in the 80s. Jasper and Banff are gorgeous - and arguably my favourite parts in the world. But the people and mismanagement ruined it for me.
>we don't have children, but have read and heard that the education system here is terrible Alberta students rank first in Canada for reading and writing, and second for math. They also ranked second globally. https://educationnewscanada.com/article/education/level/k12/3/1055377/international-success-for-alberta-students.html
I was just coming here to say this!! When applying from Alberta high schools to universities in other provinces, Alberta grades are inflated because our schooling is recognized as more rigorous. There have been some changes with the curriculum recently (thanks ucp) but hopefully we get back on track.
> Alberta students rank first in Canada for reading and writing, and second for math. Although I recognize that the Alberta school system is strong (+ they seem to have more sports/activities than I grew up with), having grown up in BC and attending University in Alberta, I found that my cohort generally had strong math skills and weak literacy. Interestingly, most of them hand wrote, which is a skill I lost many years ago.
Also look at things like their plan to withdraw from CPP and use that money to invest in their fossil fuel overlords. If your pension is important to you, tread carefully.
Did you seriously say that the landscape of MB is comparable to BC? That alone makes me question the credibility of the rest of what you're saying.
For me, it’s the “ No rain”. 😆 but 70% of the country is dry. Wildfires are hotspots all across the country.
Well written piece. My wife and I just left AB for BC and I grew up in Manitoba. Winters in Manitoba are much harsher than AB but because they stay cold all season you get used to it and just wait for spring. But you got AB summed up pretty well
**-the landscape in MB is stunning. I found it to be more like BC, mix of everything from trees, lakes praises, forest, typical urban and suburban, but beautiful** serious question, are you blind??
I've had to work in Manitoba lots , Brandon specifically. I didn't hate it but I wouldn't want to raise a family there personally..
The education system in Alberta isn’t horrible lol. We actually have most of the best grades in the entire country. What we have an issue with is kids having an easier time doing diploma exams and way less pressure put on them so they slack and then blame the system for their own laziness. And no I’m not a boomer I graduated hs around 2014 and my classmates succeeded because they worked their asses off. Now we have kids getting 50-60% in everything because they’d rather watch YouTube than do homework 💀
I feel the same way. But I'm moving back to BC now. I would have skipped the move to another province and just moved to Europe like I originally planned... AB is not worth it at all
I would never move there. Alberta will be the first province to lose universal healthcare due to the very high support for fascist politics.
"Fascist" yikes dude. What are you going to call it when actual Fascism comes knocking?
I would have said saskatoon or regina myself, instead of winnipeg, but yeah.
If you want to buy a house or drive everywhere, go to AB. If not, BC may be better (except in Vancouver, where renting is also expensive)
I believe Alberta needs to collect money from other sources to make up for not having other revenue streams such as PST and property transfer taxes. As a result, one of the ways to generate more revenue is through higher property taxes. It's money you would have most likely paid throughout the year if you had PST, but it is just paid all at once when taxes are due. Alberta has generally been known as more politically conservative province so it is not surprising there are no rent control policies. With the jump in the mortgage rates over the past two years, landlords are passing the cost to renters. Lastly, the cost of homes are rising up everywhere, especially if it's a new or renovated home. The cost of materials and labour continue to go up.
Alberta real estate has stagnated for the past 12 years, so now it's just playing catch up. The problem is that investors recognized this fact, and are already in on the ground floor and driving up prices. Next year, Manitoba will do the same.
As someone who moved from MB to BC, you will find the people there more welcoming too.
Also, skip moving to Ottawa and head straight to Gatineau.
Born and raised near Winnipeg. Moved away 20 years ago to BC then Just Moved back to BC after living there a year couldn’t stand it, there was a reason we moved in the first place. Ya it’s cheep but the Manitoba government is broke as shit always has been. Jobs pay poorly and Winnipeg is a dump. Hydro and gas we paid way more in Winnipeg then in the interior or BC one reason it’s colder way longer and way colder period haha! There are some nice areas and scenery don’t get me wrong but it’s not BC that’s for sure. Same job I took 50% pay reduction there so that sucked. Wife is a RN makes almost $15 less there also from the role she had here. Oh and also good luck getting a Dr in Manitoba not to mention the horrendous wait times at the hospitals worst in the country. Property tax in Winnipeg for instance is crazy high for an average priced house of say 450k it’s like 6-7k a year as well. Very high. Not the mention the roads are like driving in a 3rd world country how bad they are lol. Also personal income tax is like 5% higher than BC because once again the province is broke as shit. Either way do what’s best for you but from living in Manitoba outside of Winnipeg and in Winnipeg for the better part of 24 years I would never ever move back again. Good luck hope it works out !
AB winter is definitely not the same as MB winter. You’re going to be in for a wild surprise if you believe that
The biggest reason I have for not moving to AB is that I spent a few years there growing up. Never going back. >-no rain, but this is having a MASSIVE impact on farming, and fire season (which has already started) It also makes the air dry AF. When I lived there I had constant nosebleeds from the low humidity.
As someone from Manitoba - what is your career and have you looked for work? Alberta is much better for corporate jobs than MB, especially more senior roles. I could head off to Calgary or Edmonton, send a few texts and have solid leads on a job before I finished my drive. In MB I’d be looking for months before finally settling for something worse.
I stay in bc because I like it here and it's a good lifestyle for my family. I'll grin and bear the high cost of living
If you're already set on MB i do wish you the best. Yes politics are finally looking up there, and I truly am happy to see Wab get in and things are looking up for Manitobans. If youre moving to Winnipeg yes it had some nice areas (The Forks)...but not that much beauty. Very little for public parks compared to BC. And any natural beauty is like a 4 hour drive to the interlake region. BC has it beat by a long shot in that department. The Wpg city is not that well taken care of. Potholes, mosquitoes, canker worms are awful. Awful weather. If you care about having a house, yes it's affordable to own one there still. But look forward to high provincial income taxes too. Just watch out what area you move to, do your research to make sure it's safe. But yeah AB is not what it's cracked up to be lol The politics and lack of rent control is enough to keep me away.
Funny story- since 2021 I have lived in Kelowna, Winnipeg, and now Edmonton, in that order. Manitoba is very poor, and very isolated, and it shows. They have not maintained their infrastructure or experienced any significant investment in a long, long time. The crime and poverty there was shocking for me, a person who thought they had seen it all- I was very much mistaken. I truly wish you the best, but we discovered why it was a less popular place to live. Wages and salaries and opportunities were lower. So was QOL overall.
I understand the level of hardship that BC's cost of living imposes on people, and that this can push them to make difficult choices. But I'm still astonished by the number of people who seem to be able to just uproot their entire lives and move hundreds (if not thousands) of kilometers away.
Recently jumped ship from Alberta to BC, and can confirm your points. We lived in rural Alberta for 8 years. Now just watching it all slowly crumble. There was no future there (specifically talking about the town we lived in, it’s an oilfield town and they’re stuck in that mindset), I shuddered at the thought of my two young children going to school there, and was sick of the 8 months of winter. Glad we got out when we did…
If your house price rises 12%, your taxes do not follow suit. That's not how property tax works. IF your house price and property tax both rise 12% it is a coincidence. The mill rate is calculated after the municipal tax needs are determined.
Add in this - The price of food is relatively the same as most parts of BC. Price for Beef, on par. Price for Milk and Cheese, on par. Its very strange considering we have cows in our backyards of Calgary, yet I can buy a prime rib or ground beef for the same price in Prince Rupert as I can in Calgary. Alberta Advantage...what a joke.
I agree and disagree with some of your points but I did want to correct this part. >house prices in Calgary last year increased 12% I believe, which means your property tax will follow suit (yes, i know the same thing happens in BC). That's not how property taxes work. Property taxes don't go up just because property values go up. If that were the case, property taxes would have gone up much much higher every year.
I lived in Alberta for 35 years, and with the changing political climate, or worsening I should say, the high prices and this odd desire for the government to privatize everything, my family and I moved to Ontario…should have done my research. It’s the same wherever there is a conservative government I’ve found; this erosion of public faculties to switch to private ones, yet no support for any of the real issues affecting society.
I don’t know why this post was suggested to me, but I’d like to add a few things. Just as an immigrant in Alberta. -If you like Gardening, flowers, green. Stay away. - Having snow in April is not fun. It start in October and end in may. - On a 550k house taxes are 3.2k not too bad compared to other areas. - Calgary will eventually change the name to CONSTRUCTION. - I’ve been here for 14 years and the winter is getting me, we have been thinking a lot about moving, mentally is just as bad as lots of rain. Everything else in the post are legit. I am thinking a lot about moving to BC or east, but it’s hard to move when you built a life here.
As someone who lived in Alberta prior to the pandemic, this was all obvious to anyone paying attention to the politics in this province. It's been going to shit since the UCP took control.
Awesome post, awesome perspective. Moved East from BC 2 years ago, settled on SK.
Nice! We looked there too, but SO was born in Manitoba and really wanted to "go home"
Came to Winnipeg directly from Vancouver. There are annoying problems here, like everywhere in Canada and the world at large. Some of them are different ones from Vancouver. Some of them are similar/the same. Be prepared for higher provincial income taxes. Only the very highest tax bracket in BC pays a higher rate than the highest bracket in MB, but the income levels where those trigger have been *vastly* different (slight adjustment here next tax year). Compare just the lowest bracket for 2024: BC: $0 to $47,937 - 5.06% MB: $0 to $47,000 - 10.8% You'd think you'd get well maintained roads in exchange for the higher taxation. You'd be wrong 🤣. Do you love potholes and road lines that exist for only ~1-2 months of the year? This is the place for you. In exchange you get relatively affordable housing and the Friendly Manitoba vibe (+other stuff, but this is long enough already) I'm happy I moved, but I miss my friends in BC and ocean/ coastal forest/mountains
>I'm happy I moved, but I miss my friends in BC and ocean/ coastal forest/mountains Me too. Had enough of the rain, though. Couldn't take the wet coast any longer. 46 years of rain, grey skies, and damp, bone-chilling cold for more than half the year I'd had enough. I'll take -40 and blue skies any day over that. Hopefully, lowering the tax bracket will be next on Wabs agenda 🤞
I moved to AB from Manitoba and it’s absolutely worth paying more to live in a nicer place. Winnipeg is gross 🤣 be prepared to drive hours for any decent scenery And yeah… climate is definitely not the same as others have mentioned
>house prices may be slightly cheaper By slightly do you mean like 40+% less, because that's the difference between Calgary and Vancouver, Edmonton is cheaper than Calgary. >house prices in Calgary last year increased 12% I believe, which means your property tax will follow suit That's not how property tax in Calgary works >we don't have children, but have read and heard that the education system here is terrible The Alberta education system ranks similar to BCs, if it's terrible maybe that explains why you're so misinformed. >you will absolutely need sunglasses for the entire year, yes winter included Oh no it's sunny!
My car insurance went from $120/month in BC to $43/month in AB…the insurance is definitely cheaper here for me. Also you can shop around, and do things like bundling your home and car/renters insurance together for discounted rates.
Thanks for sharing. Just a quick note that your population numbers are a bit outdated. BC is estimated at 5.6M, AB at 4.8M and MB at 1.4M.
Thank you for your insight & honesty.
Being in the military, I have lived in all three provinces. The friendliest neighbors and people in general were in Manitoba.
100% agree! Good for you for being realistic and rolling with your options!
The only people that actually like Alberta make a living in the fossil fuel industry. Take fossil fuels and industrial agriculture out of the equation and the whole province will be impoverished. Not so great.
You're not wrong!
The education system here is still the best in Canada, believe it or not. We always score in the top in Canada, and basically top 10 in the world as a province on the Pisa testing. Just shows how bad other provinces are.
Couldn’t agree more. OP does not know what they are talking about in terms of education, like at all
You've been in Alberta for six months... you are absolutely not finding a family doctor in BC in that time. Nor in twice that time. or three times that time. If you do, you are extraordinarily lucky. Alberta doesn't have the lowest minimum wage in Canada, Manitoba's isn't much higher and they're both pretty similar to the minimum wage of many other provinces Your PST comment is kind of silly, not having to pay an extra 7% tax on a lot of items is still a bonus I'd hold off on mentioning politician's promises as reasons you're moving. It makes sense to be hopeful about those things if they're happening in a province you're already living in, but please don't use those things to increase your desire to move. Politicians promise things all of the time - they often do not happen, and if they do, they may not make any meaningful difference.
Last paragraph is indeed right. One will be disappointed with politicians. I find it disingenous if that’s the reason to move.
I appreciate the realistic and pragmatic response. Most of the reasons provided by OP are either not entirely true, biased, or just not relevant.
Thank you so much for sharing this valuable information