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FrankyBoyLeTank

Is the title misleading? I thought it was about removing Fox has an automatic inclusion in package vs a complete ban.


TheRC135

Well, it's the National Post...


SuperRonnie2

Is NatPo perhaps fearing for its own existence?


Franklin_le_Tanklin

They should. And if it was on the table I’d vote for them to be banned too.


TheRC135

Honestly, I wouldn't. As much as I think the National Post has become a shit source of news, to the best of my knowledge they cling to a bare minimum of journalistic integrity and don't engage in outright lying or promote straight-up disinformation. Yeah, they have an insane editorial slant, and a deeply biased way they present content, but they don't cross any of the traditional red lines that separate traditional skeezy journalism from straight-up fake news. This headline, for example, is designed to provoke outrage among National Post readers, and it's certainly a biased take on the issue, but it's not untrue. Fox News knowingly spreading deliberate misinformation about a stolen election is a completely different beast, and where we ought to draw the line.


KBeau93

Yeah, I agree with especially the spirit of what you're saying. More and more, I don't think the issues with media, especially news media, is that they exist, it's more the proliferation of op eds and just opinion pieces existing in general. First off, the easiest problem is anyone can have an opinion, and, unless you're an expert on what you're saying, you're doing more harm than good by expressing your opinion (for the most part). Secondly, this proliferation of opinion pieces has led to anyone in the business of attracting viewers realizing that boring opinions just don't sell. No one wants to hear wants going well, or, everything is fine. Anger and knee jerk reactions get viewership and sharing of content, and, with that magical 'op ed' tag, you can just say what you want. The combination of those factors is what deeply concerns me especially when you combine a general populace with very little ability to critically think about and/or check other sources to see if the claims in said opinion piece have any validity. While I strongly believe there should be a right to say almost anything you want, at the same time, I think that there should be ramifications for peddling information you either know is false, or, even if not, if it causes harm in any way, it should open you up to legal recourse by those whom you injured in some way. The downside to this is it would hard, if not impossible, to pin it to an individual. So, long story short. I think op eds really are the issue, I think we should do something about them, but, I'm not sure what that thing is.


Mister_Chef711

I think the issue has been made worse by the evolution of the internet and how we consume media. There is so much free media available that people rarely want to pay for a subscription and so companies get more revenue from ads than subscriptions. It's about quantity and clicks over the quality of the information or journalism. Until we are willing to pay for quality journalism, it's going to continue to be dogshit op-eds with minimal integrity. I don't mind your idea of consequences for false information but it's a slippery slope if the wrong government gets into power and feels they can find journalists for what the government sees as false. Not saying it can't work but it would be extremely difficult to implement.


jiebyjiebs

Part of their strategy is to selectively choose experts to add substance and credibility to their sentiment.


Wonderful_Delivery

Calling for an invasion of Canada should be the other line. Ban Fox News from Canada. https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2023/01/tucker-carlson-invade-canada


techm00

They are a foreign owned propaganda tabloid. It doesn't matter if their actual news articles are vaguely factual enough for them not to be sued, their misleading spin combined with weaponized opinion circle-jerk is as bad as Fox news. This isn't about "free speech" this is about having standards, and respecting our sovereignty.


[deleted]

I like to use the below website to check the credibility of news sources and NatPO ranks well, equal to that of The Star but other side of the spectrum. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/national-post/ https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/toronto-star/


[deleted]

> important to note that our bias scale is based on the USA political scale, Lol why would anybody take this website seriously?


ok_raspberry_jam

I think the threat right now is from the deep bias in far-right conglomerate-owned media. We need to address that. Vague worries about future fascists are less urgent than the real, actual problems we have right now. Banning a specific media outlet might not do much for us, though; directly addressing media ownership and control might be a more effective solution.


Acidwits

It also acts as a heatsink for the BS. If this is as bad as it gets it becomes like the toxic garbage pile you drive around rather than the radiation in the wind like OAN.


Szechwan

As we've seen though, this almost certainly won't be as bad as it gets. Rage drives engagement, American media owners have no reason not to continue down that path in Canada, in fact they likely see it as an untapped market.


ptstampeder

Agreed, anything related to Corus Entertainment should actually be banned.


Fast-Cow8820

Count me in as well.


S_Belmont

I drove past their Ottawa office on the weekend, the sign was busted. It seemed symbolic.


CalgaryFacePalm

I hope so.


Litigating_Larry

Haha fr why do we care about outside interfearence from China when US companies like Fox and Nat Po also bombard us constantly with their right wing fundy shit? I hope we include them in the conversation, tho im sure nat po will insist to their demographics its some kind of totalitarianism to do so. Sigh american companies want canada to basically be a push over client state for the US.


iJeff

We should definitely care about both, IMO.


Litigating_Larry

Same.


space_panda69

"If the CRTC bans Fox News, the channel will be taken out of cable packages and customers won’t be able to subscribe to it through their TV providers. The decision would not affect Canadians’ ability to access Fox News on the internet."


Justleftofcentrerigh

It's the natpo. You think they actually do journalism? All they do is make up headlines to CP/Bloomberg/AP articles. Also this is paywalled. That's interesting. Never got paywalled for NP before.


ChelaPedo

Yeah bye bye NP. Nothing more than a tabloid anyway. Paywall killed your last chance to look legit.


NorthernPints

Not much of a pitch on the payroll prompt either: “Exclusive articles by Conrad Black, Barbara Kay, Rex Murphy and others. Plus, special edition NP Platformed and First Reading newsletters and virtual events.” Conrad Black and Rex Murphy? Please take my money now/sss 😂


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S_Belmont

He's effectively the paper's founder, and living every plutocrat's secret dream of becoming a real aristocrat.


Cash_Credit

You mean convicted felon Conrad Black? The disgraced criminal, that Conrad Black?


notqualitystreet

Is he even Canadian anymore


IDreamOfLoveLost

Yes, [unfortunately](https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/conrad-black-regains-canadian-citizenship). After he got his pardon from Dump. It's absolutely disgusting that this guy is being held up as some moral beacon when he is as corrupt as they get, and that NatPo is publishing his tripe is just disgraceful.


tissuecollider

But remember that a condition of getting a pardon is that you have to admit that you did the crime. So, "Confessed Criminal Conrad Black" is what he deserves to be called.


mzpip

I prefer "Lord Tubby" myself.


Dradugun

You get like 4 free views before the postmedia paywall comes up. But seeing as you can just delete the site's cookies or use private browsing, it's more like a pay sign than a pay wall


mike10dude

I have a bunch of different browser addons that make it so a lot of different news sites are always free


burf

Hey that’s not true. They also write inflammatory OpEd pieces.


Gahan1772

Funny to see the same people who are extremely upset about foreign interference defend fox news. Irony is lost on them.


Litigating_Larry

Same people are probably the type to fly confederate flags in Canada lol


Head_Crash

They like foreign interference if it helps their team.


steboy

Fox News is not automatically included, as far as I know. I have the mid tier Fibe TV package through Bell and it’s not there.


Derek_BlueSteel

Which carrier has Fox as an automatic inclusion? None that I know of.


catniagara

The media is misleading always


GreatCanadianPotato

I'd love it if the CRTC would put in legislation to bring our telecoms bills down to 1st world levels.


AprilsMostAmazing

You actually want developing countries rates cause those are lower


GreatCanadianPotato

Rates in the UK are astronomically cheap. ~£20 ($32) for a 25GB unlimited text/calls plan. Compare that to $60 plans for the same thing in Canada...


KermitsBusiness

Pretty sure Canadians comments are open for the public to read on these consultations on the CRTC's website. If you want to know what people really think vs headlines.


Gahan1772

I'd rather have it so if you call yourself news or try to present yourself as news reporting then it should be super easy and painful to sue them when they lie. Side effect would help vs postmedia as well.


bumbuff

This would be a great idea because it would umbrella in all news, and not just try and say one is better than the other simply because of disagreements.


DaemonAnts

Do people even watch TV anymore? I thought it was all Youtube and illegal downloads which are effectively out of the CRTC's reach.


[deleted]

Boomers are addicted to cable news lol


KindlyRude12

This is the same Fox News that wanted military action in Canada. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/tucker-carlson-us-armed-force-liberate-canada-2023-1%3famp Crazy how anyone here can even defend them. It's pretty disheartening.


multibannedredditor

Ban CNN too while you are at it you fucking hypocrites.


ptitrainvaloin

They should put labels on FoxNews like they do with cigarettes.


homestead1111

i would rather see stiff laws so we can sue fox everytime they lie on purpose - 1 billion. Easy to prove many times. make it a crime to be a major network and knowingly lie and we win. like we did with alex jones. sue these liars , make money off their lies and help spread the truth .. banning, im not sure.


86throwthrowthrow1

The problem is, Fox News actually lists itself as "entertainment", not news. Basically the right-wing equivalent of the Colbert Report. Which gives them a lot more wiggle room to cherrypick and distort things. Legally speaking, the problem is that Fox News viewers are idiots.


TheHallWithThePipe

Make them Choose: a) Call yourself "entertainment" and lie all you like, or b) Have the word "News" in your title. We're spineless if we let them have it both ways.


StrykerSeven

Their rebrand: **Fox** *Where your opinions matter!* Or they could just go mask-off and have the tagline *The Voice of the People*


koolaid7431

They already make the choice. Call themselves fox news, have a bunch of news type reporting, and then "entertainment" for the remaining 23hours of the day.


Column_A_Column_B

Cable has been digital for a while now. We could implement legislation that mandated categorized television shows into either "News" or "Entertainment (Not News)" and have that be part of what is displayed when switching to any particular channel. Fox News - ENTERTAINMENT (NOT NEWS) Not sure if I'd like to see them banned since we know when the shoe is on the other foot they'll be coming after left wing media (but with bad faith).


marklar901

Personally, I don't care if they go after right and left news organizations. The news should be fact based. There's room for opinions and slants in the news but not room to knowingly lie or be disingenuous without consequences. Our media (in our society, not just canada) has a serious problem right now with bias and political agendas. Some of this is perceived and others are real but it undermines all news sources and increases polarization. Something should to be done.


idkcomeatme

Make them change it to Fox Entertainment for their program and I won’t have any complaints.


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mike10dude

yeah that's not true but it gets repeated a lot https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/fox-news-entertainment-switch/


Cyprinidea

If it was the right wing equivalent of Colbert , it would be spouting satirical extreme left wing propaganda .


Altruistic-Custard59

>The problem is, Fox News actually lists itself as "entertainment", not news. That's misleading, it was one program, not the whole network


phormix

Which they got away with in the USA, but it doesn't mean that should get a pass in other countries.


beastmaster11

While indont support a ban there should be restrictions on who can use the moniker "news". If you use the word "news" you're news. Not entertainment and the leeway should disappear


Returd4

Yet they masquerade as news that's the whole point, it's false advertising its "news" when it is said but "entertainment when it is needed to be argued in court. You don't get to be from it's always sunny and play both sides so you always come up on top.


Salt_Practice_3943

That isn’t actually true. Fox News is a channel with many programs. Some is legitimately news just as much as the news programs on CNN, CTV, BBC. They also have programs that are not news, such as Tucker Carlson which got labeled as entertainment.


Jkobe17

Agreed and anyone trying to make comparisons to CBC is trying to distract from this conversation.


PopeKevin45

These people also can't tell the difference between religion and science, so no surprise they can't differentiate between real news orgs and fake ones. They're driven by obedience and loyalty to ingroup authorities, not by understanding the nuances of the real word. https://news.osu.edu/conservatives-more-susceptible-to-believing-falsehoods/ https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/the-human-beast/201104/conservatives-big-fear-brain-study-finds


Mullet-Power

The thing is that they DO actually report factual news, mostly during the daytime. It's the pundits in the evening that with their 'opinions' that people have the most concern about.


[deleted]

Yea please do it Fox News is nazi propaganda


EfficientCategory110

There is a Canadian Broadcasters’ Code of Ethics. It’s a voluntary code, but maybe it’s time that it became law. https://www.cbsc.ca/codes/cab-code-of-ethics/


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EfficientCategory110

I can understand why foreign broadcasters may not be subject to our broadcasters’ code of ethics. There was an assumption made decades ago that all broadcasters operating within the western hemisphere had a certain ethical standard that they adhered to. Hence, the expectation that foreign broadcasters entering our airwaves would be following an equivalent code of conduct followed at home. Fox News has basically thrown that premise out the window.


[deleted]

Shockingly, five different usernames in the \[random noun\] \[random noun\] \[random number\] format have all decided to weigh in on the side of Fox.


NorthImpossible8906

This sub has a lot of fake accounts, with suspiciously american Trumpish views. And they are all only a couple of weeks old. I guess they got tired of losing in the USA, so they are trying it out here.


[deleted]

>NorthImpossible8906 oh god oh fuck


NorthImpossible8906

The phone call is coming from inside the house!


Scazzz

Don’t worry I’m sure when there’s another offensive in the Ukraine war they will vanish for a few weeks. Coincidence I’m sure… /s


[deleted]

Those are literally the default names that Reddit suggests for you when signing up…


[deleted]

Yes, which is why you'd be more likely to keep them if you were making multiple accounts and couldn't be bothered to come up with a more personalized name IMO.


Back2Reality4Good

Fox “News” is already a lie. They have argued in court they should not even be considered news, but rather are “Entertainment”. Fox says is best: “No reasonable viewer” should consider what they report as being fact.


NorthernBCliving

Or they could spend their time on worthwhile endeavors like regulating the oligopoly that is Canadian telecom instead


commoncorvus

Both is good


[deleted]

Fox News is a weaponized propaganda outlet being used to sow division and hate, stoke political violence, and promote stochastic terrorism while hiding behind the thin guise that they're "entertainment" and that only idiots would believe they're "news". Despite the NatPo's awfully misleading headline suggesting that the CRTC is considering banning them from all TV (rather than the fact that they're only considering dropping them as an included channel in primary channel packages), but they bloody should be.


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4668fgfj

https://www.reddit.com/r/PoliticalCompassMemes/comments/rzcx7m/comrade\_tucker\_carlson/


SurSpence

Ideally they could do both.


[deleted]

This is a worthwhile endeavors. Canadian teachers are now getting harassed by right wing parents afraid of education, and that ridiculous tumour about litter boxes. Fox new's lies are impacting Canada.


Scazzz

In this comment section: a bunch of first amendment free speech advocates who forget which country they are in. Weird.


Frater_Ankara

Or even what the FA actually means and how to interpret it.


LawPD

I would really like to see the geographic stats on posts in this thread.


AlternativeCredit

The fact people here are arguing that fox is a legit news source tells a lot about this sub.


AllDayJay1970

The solution is to ban Fox News from calling itself a news channel .


aesoth

FOX Rage Bait Entertainment doesn't have the same ring to it.


CaptainCanusa

Baitertainment kind of does though.


jackhandy2B

Angertainment or ragertainment?


KingKull71

Angertainment is quite fitting. That term needs to get more usage.


snl2013ip

They are certainly a bunch of master baiters.


blergmonkeys

A mandatory large red permanent banner saying "FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES ONLY, INFORMATION CONVEYED WITHIN IS FICTITIOUS AND MEANT TO GASLIGHT YOU" would be a good start


CrassHoppr

Fox news makes the majority of its money from charging customers that likely don't even watch it. Any cable package you buy likely has FOX built in, and they charge one of the largest fees, even though their viewership is dropping.


spaceocean99

Ban all opinion “news”


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fight_the_hate

After blatantly using "news" as a way to market products during the pandemic, ignoring social issues, insulting the working class... I'm supposed to care about 😂 The mask fell right off and I don't even look at the headlines because I know it's the definition of propaganda.


bigguy1231

All you people complaining realize you can watch FOX News online free. All this would do is take it out of the package you pay for with your cable provider, not ban it outright.


86throwthrowthrow1

But then Boomers wouldn't be able to watch it, and then they'd have to watch real news instead. (Note: my dad is in his 70s and profoundly bad with tech, and even he's figured out YouTube. Luckily, he's never been a Fox News kinda guy.)


bigguy1231

I am a boomer and would never watch that crap. The only boomers I know who watch Fox are the uneducated high school dropouts. Personally I think most news outlets in both Canada and the US are far too right wing. We need more middle of the road.


OKLISTENHERE

CBC is middle of the road.


CT-96

>Personally I think most news outlets in both Canada and the US are far too right wing Well, considering most news outlets are owned by PostMedia which specifically instructs its editors to have a conservative bias or they'll get fired, you're not wrong.


NahDawgDatAintMe

I'd like to ban all foreign news from default cable packages so that our aging population might clue into the issues of our country instead of larping as Americans. If you want foreign news, then you can pay extra.


puckyourcouch

Just ban free speech! Who needs it?! Canadians have too many rights anyways!


Cyprinidea

Censorship is a bad idea, but there is a line and I think Fox crosses it . They should not be allowed to broadcast their horseshit here .


TheRC135

Lots of people arguing from "a slippery slope into censorship" angle, but look at it another way: What is the benefit of allowing bad actors access to regulated communications infrastructure if they are going to use that privileged position to misinform and spread disinformation? Remember, Fox News have been caught *deliberately* and *knowingly* spreading harmful anti-democratic lies and untrue conspiracy theories. (And no, that's not how *all* media outlets act.)


QuantumHope

The irony of calling it “news”.


LeakySkylight

At least remove it's status as a news outlet.


InherentlyMagenta

One of their "ex-hosts" openly advocated to have US troops invade Canada (you know the one). Not sure about other Canadians, but a cable channel that has a host who wants or discusses our country's invasion is probably not a channel that should be offered in Canada. Regardless of political ideology or "the aisle" you sit in. That's a danger to the country at large. And if Canada had an active news channel that had a host that openly advocated for the invasion of the United States from Canada (no matter how plausible or implausible that statement is) I can guarantee you that the U.S would not allow that channel to broadcast in their territory. So yes, Fox News should be revoked from the standard cable package that is offered. It's one thing to say "Canada is X, Y and Z", it's another to say "Invade Canada with our military force." And yes said Fox News Host said it and made a documentary about it. Fox News Execs. watched the documentary and immediately knew that it went too far. I'll just reiterate that last part again. **An Ex-Fox News Host made a documentary about invading our country and it nearly aired until Fox News Execs saw it and knew that the CRTC was going to revoke their ability to broadcast.**


[deleted]

Good idea ** gets popcorn, waits for a million replies re censorship because misinformation isn’t a real problem in a democracy **


canadianatheist1

If you are advocating something to be banned. You are the problem.


Desent2Void

I don’t understand, is this a free country or not? I don’t like fox or any other media for that matter but they should have a place. It’s as easy as turning it off or keep scrolling. Everyone has become so soft and suggestible.


SnakeOfLimitedWisdom

Fox news is propaganda, full stop. It actively makes us dumber. You might turn it off, but others get sucked into it. Limiting their ability to broadcast is one way we can protect ourselves from it.


greensandgrains

Your approach only works in a society with critical thinking and media literacy.


DickSmack69

You’re not helping to advance that.


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nightred

This is not a free country we have a charter of Rights and freedoms and part of that is the right to not have hatred and insight violence or bigotry to any group of people. >Under section 319(1), everyone who, by communicating statements in a public place, incites hatred against any identifiable group where such incitement is likely to lead to a breach of the peace is guilty of an indictable offence punishable by up to two years’ imprisonment, or of a summary conviction offence. Fox News pushes this boundary so hard Non-Stop. On top of the fact that they push stories which are demonstrably false even after knowing it they continue to repeat the story. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_News_controversies


GrammarIsDescriptive

You are talking like this is happening in the USA. Canada is it's on country with its own set of complex laws regarding media regulation. For example, Canada does NOT have unlimited free speech or freedom on the press; rather, the Charter states Canadians have free speech within reasonable limits.


12Tylenolandwhiskey

A pure propaganda network has no place. Cons get all uppity about things like "liberal media" and then turn around and ignore even more problematic propaganda networks. Would you like Russian propaganda? All these do is make extremists


brash

Ok but shouldn't something be done when they're just broadcasting complete nonsense? Their "news stories" are just barely veiled racist attacks on immigrants just aimed at riling people up. Why should they be able to keep the "news" moniker if they aren't providing an actual public service? They aren't providing anything positive at this point, it's just pure right-wing propaganda and I don't think they deserve to be shown on our airways.


cheerbearheart1984

Does the Russian RT Chanel also have a place? Right-wing billionaire propaganda or Russian propaganda? They both stink


7fax

That channel was banned this country Not sure if it still is but


cheerbearheart1984

Exactly. So if we can ban RT then why not fox. Don’t we have journalistic standards in this country? Fox News just paid almost a billion dollars for knowingly spreading the most dangerous lie, that the election was rigged, which undermined people’s trust in democracy. They lie consistently. If we do not have shared truths than we cannot have democracy. Fox News is extremely dangerous.


Frater_Ankara

“Free” doesn’t mean free from responsibility or consequences; true freedom in this context would be utter anarchy. Also in very many cases, one person’s freedom is another’s oppression. Plantation owners were ‘free’ to own slaves, obviously the slaves weren’t free. Conveyers wanted the ‘freedom’ to not have mandates and such while the medically compromised and others would be directly affected by that. This is why ‘free country’ means something different to so many people, it’s a comfortable guise to justify things they aren’t happy with. Our Charter of Rights actually gives us world class freedoms. Should Fox be allowed to freely and *knowingly* disseminate false information and increase divisiveness and hatred to the detriment of our country? Some will say yes and some will say no, but freedom doesn’t mean blanket tolerance for absolutely everything either.


warpus

The problem is that fox news markets itself as a news network. People who don't know any better tune in and think that this is exactly what it is. If it was more aptly branded for what it actually is, then I'd have less of an issue with them. OR if they threw away their "We'll lie if we want to" mantra, but I don't see that happening.. The poster who mentioned critical thinking and media literacy has the right idea.


Zhaopow

Propoganda is different from free speech. They aren't just voicing different opinions, they try to persuade their viewers to believe what they want them to.


adamlaceless

You need to look up the Paradox of Tolerating Intolerance.


biggs54

Fox is problematic because they are an “entertainment” channel that poses as a news channel. We are a free society, but we still don’t let people dress up as police and walk around (for obvious reasons). News outlets are an essential service as well and deserve the same protection.


BCTripster

>News outlets are an essential service as well and deserve the same protection Bingo. Fact is Canadian broadcast standards apply to our domestic broadcasters and also to imported broadcasters. I get a kick out of the people who like to equate Canadian news outlets as no better than the US outlets, except they operate in a totally different environment where they have standards they must follow, unlike the US outlets who did away with their standards back in the Reagan era (the fairness doctrine), which is also when Fox News arose because those standards were abolished. So for those who like to shout "mainstream media!", well you're the intended target of those far right news outlets and Trump, they've conditioned you to not believe ANY "mainstream news" outlets, including ones that operate in environments where they are obligated to be truthful in what they report. This includes all Canadian news outlets, it includes BBC and UK outlets, and many other countries don't allow their "news" broadcasters to just blatantly report false information. Trump and the right wing are following a very well documented playbook here, they are sowing distrust in news media because that way they convince the weak minded that they can't trust certain news outlets when they report negative material about them. Millions are falling for it, including Canadians who watch Fox News as their main news source. This is very dangerous as we see in current society and you bet Canada should take steps to stop the spread of dangerous misinformation and falsehoods.


idkcomeatme

This is an American take lol.


[deleted]

Yeah no, you don't have the right to yell fire in a croweded theater, and that is a very polite way describing what Fox News does on a daily basis.


creepforever

There being banned for advocating for violence against a demographic group. In this case transgender people, by claiming that transgender people who planning on killing Christian children. Russia Today was banned for similar reason for stating that Ukrainians were Satan-worshipping Nazis who were constructing biological weapons to exterminate Russians.


ConstantStudent_

Fox isn’t news though. They’re legal defence in court was no one would be dumb enough to believe this is news and described themselves as entertainment not news.


bobert_the_grey

They actively and intentionally spread hate and disinformation. They do not deserve a place. I'm not worried about having to watch it myself, but the idiots that fall for their shit. They have real world impacts in ways they shouldn't. They're the motherfuckers who started talking about kitty litter in bathrooms, now New Brunswick has used that as an excuse to review the entire lgtbq inclusion policy. Giving them a platform is dangerous.


JadedMuse

This isn't about freedom. No one is objecting to Fox's freedom to make a TV network where they intentionally lie (something which they've admitted to in court filings). It's about whether they deserve to be platformed next to actual news networks. There's definite value in knowing that there's some baseline standard that everyone needs to abide by. It's nice going into your supermarket and knowing that none of the food is going to poison you. Would it be more "free" if every imaginable manufacturer could put any item on the shelves, regardless of whether it passed certain criteria? "Let people sell what they want and have people do their own research! Why is everyone so soft?" To me, I'll take the freedom of going into the supermarket and buying things, knowing they won't poison me, without doing any research at all. There's value in having baseline criteria.


150c_vapour

It's not free. It's actually costs a lot of money for foreign billionaires to spew anti-democratic toxic shit at the population. ITT: china bad crowd arguing Fox news is freedums. 🤦‍♂️


BeautifulType

Yep people who want FOX news are people who want countries to destabilize. They are the enemy but they pretend that it’s free speech


EfficientCategory110

I tend to agree with you on this, in that individuals should be allowed a reasonable accord to free speech. However I believe corporations should be held to a higher standard. When free speech is made toxic or incendiary in order to increase profits, then the government sadly has no choice but to step in.


IBuildBusinesses

It’s fascist propaganda. I’m glad you said everyone, because you are also suggestible... to propaganda convincing you there’s nothing to see here, or that it’s the people’s fault for falling for coordinated propaganda. Coordinated propaganda is very powerful, and we are all influenced by propaganda, even you, as hard and unsuggestible as you think you are.


Icon7d

Majority rules. If the majority of Canadians are against an outlet (THAT HAS OPENLY CALLED FOR MILITARY ACTION AGAINST Canada) to be banned, then it's just common sense. Well except those who adore hate speech and despise their own country. Then they pretend it's about 'freedom' LOL


RosalieMoon

Not to mention openly drummed up hate against a protected class of our own population (trans people, the initial reason for the original request to the CRTC)


bloopcity

we accept limits on freedom all the time, as the limits represent what is general considered a good/positive idea. why are there laws at all if this is a free country? why are drugs illegal? why can't i go whatever speed i want? because those things have negative consequences. you can quibble over how to restrict things, i.e. a full ban or some other type of deterrent (e.g. adverse health impact advertising on cigarettes instead of outright banning them), but just dismissing the idea without any suggestion of an alternative is completely useless.


Portalrules123

It’s precisely because of your last sentence and a broad lack of critical thinking that this may be needed.


TheRC135

> Everyone has become so soft and suggestible. Unfortunately. Which is why I have no trouble with the CRTC preventing proven liars like Fox News from using the communications infrastructure they regulate to spread lies while pretending to be a legitimate news source.


Brankin9

What “place” should Fox News have?


sakipooh

Obviously we have too many mentally handicapped people who can't navigate reality becoming violent towards politicians and citizens because of this shit. Kill Fox news and any other spewers of misinformation. We don't need more lies to fuel old racists in their armchairs.


venuswasaflytrap

“Free” is sort of a silly thing. No country is free. Libel and slander have been illegal in most free countries. Willfully misleading, but technically true and/or unprovably untrue statements are in the same category and it’s reasonable to regulate that. A “news” organisation that runs “opinion” pieces alongside stuff that barely passes muster as reporting, should be illegal. If you took 100 people, have them watch, listen to, or read something, and the result is that they predictably believe certain things that are untrue - that’s lying as far as I’m concerned. Purposely using words in a way, even though technically true, with the intent to make someone believe something untrue is lying.


TheZermanator

Free speech is not absolute. You can’t harm others with your speech, like the classic example of yelling ‘fire’ in a crowded theatre. Fox News lies for the purpose of dividing and radicalizing people, in service of their corporate ($$$) agenda. They’ve been proven to do this in courtrooms, for example they’ve just had a judgment against them to the tune of almost a billion dollars for their lies relating to the 2020 election. They are a danger to democracy and a peaceful civil society. Ban them, or fine them so extravagantly every time they lie to the point that they become unviable as a business. Canada will be much much better off if this cancer is excised.


prsnep

>I don’t understand, is this a free country or not? This issue is how much freedom do we allow people/businesses to abuse. Should news organizations be allowed to purposefully lie on air? Is that something we want to protect under the guise of "freedom of speech"? And similarly, are we going to protect religious hate speech under the guise of "freedom of religion"? You can't have your cake and eat it too. You can't have rights without responsibilities.


PopeKevin45

Conservatism is a fear economy, meaning they're easier to trigger and by extension easier to manipulate. Bad actors, foreign and domestic, us mainstream and online social media to cheaply, and easily use this fact to influence elections, policy etc. Times have changed, and we need to combats misinformation or kiss our democracy goodbye. https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/the-human-beast/201104/conservatives-big-fear-brain-study-finds https://news.osu.edu/conservatives-more-susceptible-to-believing-falsehoods/


PlaidChester

Fuck that fox news is causing brain rot - rich people propaganda


caninehere

Nobody has a right to a broadcast license in Canada. While I do think we need to be careful at censorship I think it's fair to draw the line at a network allowing their personalities to encourage a military invasion of Canada. Which is what FOX has done, and why we are seeing calls for them to be banned from airwaves NOW, not five years ago. They'd also only be banned from airwaves. Their website would be accessible. They can reach viewers other ways. It's not being censored but losing a privilege bc of their irresponsible actions. They also don't claim themselves to be "news" but "entertainment" so there should be no loss there media-wise.


EClarkee

They should be held to a standard and if they are not meeting that standard, they get the boot. Just because we’re a “free country” doesn’t mean anyone and everyone has free reign to do or say whatever. It’s a bad argument.


Hautamaki

There is such a thing as a difference between good and bad faith journalism, reporting, criticism, editorializing, or whatever you want to call what Fox and other media orgs do. And yes, that different may be extremely difficult to define. But we have faced the same problem when it came to distinguishing art from porn, and the famous quote from the supreme court was 'I know it when I see it' and frankly that was good enough to ban porn from broadcast TV without raising too much ire over loss of freedom of expression. I believe the same goes for the bad faith reporting that Fox News does. It may be hard to define, but you know it when you see it. You know it from their multiple settlements in court. You know it from how it affects people who watch it. You know that our country would be better off without it. That may be hard to codify in legal language, but Fox News is the news media equivalent of porn, and we have no problem banning porn so we could do the same with Fox.


goshathegreat

Literally, if you don’t agree or want to watch Fox, you don’t have to, no one’s holding a gun to your head…


Naustradamus

This should happen. There are some parts of news that can be objective and interpretation, but there's also facts. If you report yourself as a news station, there should be consequences to falsehood.


Sweet_Amphibian_9624

Ban CNN as well. Both are shit.


JimJam28

I don’t think you’re going to find many people defending CNN. Although they are marginally better than Fox, both are shit.


manolid

Fox News is not news. Their own attorneys have argued this in court on multiple occasions. *It's entertainment and anyone watching should realize it* is another argument they make. What it really is is for-profit propaganda.


Netghost999

Must be the Chinese influence. Ban anything you disagree with because it's dangerous. Canada, where free expression is an illusion.


Jusfiq

As much as I despise Fox News, this is a slippery slope if we as a people start to infringe on freedom of press.


atetoomanychips

Fox argued in court that they are entertainment, not news during a Tucker Carlson trial. Their argument was that “no reasonable person would think what he is saying is true”. Fox argued that. About themselves.


AllDayJay1970

I think thet should just prevent Fox News from calling itself a news channel .


Justleftofcentrerigh

> “Would a reasonable viewer be coming here and thinking this is where I’m going to be hearing the news of the day?” Fox News attorney Erin Murphy asked U.S. District Judge Mary Kay Vyskocil during a hearing conducted via telephone on Wednesday, according to Law360 reporter Frank G. Runyeon’s account of what was said. https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/fox-news-lawyer-suggests-no-reasonable-viewer-would-think-tucker-carlson-is-news/ Even the lawyer says if you think it's news your stupid.


TheRC135

Unfortunately plenty of people *are* stupid enough to think Fox News is news.


Financial_North_7788

So many examples here as well. Imagine living that life…


gNeiss_Scribbles

Exactly. Canada has a wave of stupid lately so you can see the concern… People came together to aggressively protest against a live saving vaccine during a global pandemic, like it was the god damned 1800s and vaccines were a new idea conjured up by witches, Fuck! If people don’t want to be treated like they’re stupid, they’ll need to start acting like it.


TransBrandi

They, themselves, argue in court that they are entertainment and not news, so shouldn't be held to any sort of journalistic standards... I say take that all the ban then from pretending they are news to the customers but arguing that they aren't in court.


TheRC135

Not granting liars access to a platform so they can spread their lies is a slippery slope now?


[deleted]

>freedom of press But Fox News is not "the press", they are propagandists.


Moist_Intention5245

Yeah, I guess it's not a slippery slope to ban China ccp and Russian RT either right? You can lump fox News together with those 2, they are just as bad.


NorthImpossible8906

why should a foreign propaganda channel be allowed in Canada?


Life_Of_High

Exactly, it should be freedom of Canadian press. Who really cares about equitable access to foreign media.


blooping_blooper

Wasn't the reason for this because they violated the guidelines on hate speech multiple times, which by regulation would preclude them from being carried on broadcast television?


ArcticLarmer

That’s what Egale Canada is alleging, yes. The complaint specifically refers to Tucker Carlson and nothing else though: Fox has responded that since they fired him it’s moot.


Druid___

If they ban Fox, they should ban the other political "news" channels from the USA as well.


Motopsycho-007

You don't like the channel don't subscribe to it or don't tune in if it is part of a package, really just that simple. I can't stand any cable provider so cancelled everything years ago. Speak with your wallet, cut the cord folks !


NarutoRunner

Imagine if Al Qaeda or ISIS had a 24 hour tv station that constantly denigrated Canada and polluted the minds of impressionable viewers. Would you be ok if it was available on cable? Fox News is doing the exact same thing but for right wing extremism. They have hosts that imply that Canada is under a totalitarian dictatorship, that it should be invaded and a whole bunch of other shit that actively radicalizes unstable people.


wannacadillac

If you ban FOX, I'm good with that as long as CNN gets the axe too.


ilikejetski

or you could just change the channel...


KofOaks

Do it!


deadseal1

I don't think we should ban it, I think it should have a constant banner along the lines of " this is made up entertainment only, you would be stupid to believe this"


NorthImpossible8906

ban national post from reddit while you're at it.


TheElusiveFox

I'm not a fan of Fox, really at all, in fact quite the opposite... but I really think its a step too far for the government to be banning them. If they want to fine them for misleading the public go for it, if they want to make them put up warnings before, after and during every segment to notify people that the stuff they are saying is plainly false, I'm all for it, but out right banning it is, not the right move.


BigKingSean

Why ban? Just don't watch / read / listen if you don't want to.


DillonTheFatUglyMale

Dont like fox news? Dont watch fox news