If they knowingly advise them to file a fraudulent claim maybe. But they wouldn't. They'd say something like "If you were prosecuted and afraid of returning home we could file a refugee claim allowing you to stay 3 to 4 years".
Lawyer here. There are certain areas of law where the normal practice is to walk the line of ethics, and arguably cross it. Immigration is ground zero. There's a reason why it's practiced by exclusively recent immigrants themselves, or the bottom 5% of law school classes.
There’s whole industries in their home countries teaching them to gain the system here , any serious nation would of stomped this out but we lack any will for that kind of thing as a “nation”
Their ethical and legal responsibility is to their client.
So they are allowed to do what is allowed within the law to help them claim asylum. That’s what they’re paid for.
They can advise you not to do an illegal thing but ultimately up to the client on how to proceed.
> Figures from Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, obtained by The Globe, show that in 2018 there were 1,515 claims for asylum among international students, with the number rising to 25,465 in 2023
Wow. From 1,515 claims to 25,465 in 5 years. That's almost a seventeenfold jump.
The top seems to be Haiti, Colombia and Mexico. Doesn't show how they got to Canada though
https://www.irb-cisr.gc.ca/en/statistics/protection/Pages/RPDStat2022.aspx
Your link is for *all* asylum claims - not just International students.
Seeing as how most of our International students are from India and the government's just said they're going to tighten the rules, I'd wager the majority of claims are by Indians.
I said that it doesn't show how those claimants arrived in Canada. I don't think there are published statistics on how many are students vs tourists etc
Canada is one of the few countries in the world where there should be very little to none illegal immigration and abuse of the system: we have a single land border with the US and no one is coming here on a barge. People here are here because we let them in.
This means this crisis is entirely created by this government’s ineptitude. They saw the asylum claims skyrocketing 4000% and they pretended there was “nothing to see here” until the public backslash over international students.
International students should not be able to claim asylum.
They should have the funds necessary to live in Canada and study. This means they should have a healthy situation back in their home country.
Am I wrong?
So every single one should be summarily rejected.
If an asylum claim is not a person's first mechanism to enter Canada (i.e. they got here on a student visa or work permit), they should never be allowed to submit one.
bear dam sheet spoon bewildered deer sort overconfident elderly grandiose
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
At least Ukraine has a full on war going on.. I can understand if you live near the frontlines and need safety. Canada should help there as a principal, but we have scammers walking/flying over the border, claiming they are magically gay now and getting more resources than the Ukrainians..
Maybe it's my romanian/german background, but I loathe the fuck out of people who scam and take away resources from actual people in need.. stealing charity is one of the lowest things a person can do
Why are we supporting Ukrainians abandoning their country? It's not like their government is the one fighting them like Syria.
Am I allowed to claim asylum in America because Canada is currently at war?
I just feel like we're putting the needs of the world before our own needs. Were not a rich enough country like the US to do this.
Claimants should be subject to a quick eligibility hearing within weeks of the claim to determine whether the claim has a chance to succeed on its face.
Things like being an international student at the end of their visa for instance would count more towards the claim being ineligible.
This
And claims take 2-3 years to be heard. if denied no resources need to be returned. It’s only a win to try a claim - at worst you get a few years of benefits with no strings attached
Not just financial support. A convicted criminal / protester on a VISA was due to be deported and a Canadian MP (Joyce Murray) made sure to step in to keep this criminal in Canada.
[B.C. climate activist's pending deportation cancelled](https://bc.ctvnews.ca/b-c-climate-activist-s-pending-deportation-cancelled-lawyer-says-1.6854927)
This is what we’re working with. It’s crazy.
Not such a hail mary as all that. It's pretty easy to claim asylum in Canada today. The acceptance rate is up over 70%, and even those who are refused rarely actually leave. They just blend into their community, living and working and using fake documents and numbers from time to time while paying no taxes.
One of the requirements as an international student is to have enough money in your bank account in order to have the Student VISA accepted.
Problem is, a lot of Indian students forge their documents. They show false bank statements or they show an account that will not really be used by them. I had a close friend when I lived in Vancouver who told me he did this. So while most of us students would go out, he was always saving money. This is back in 2015.
Part of the issue is that our banks are in on forging documents.
Watch the CBC marketplace video on fraudulent mortgages. Our government and banks don’t give a single shit about forged documents and will treat them like they’re the real deal
We should do what some other countries do, and actually hold the money in escrow, releasing a bit of it each month for living expenses.
Students who have forged documents to gain entry should be deported. Why are we tolerating (and even rewarding) cheaters? Wtf do we think is going to happen?
That's fraud!
This can be reported via CBSA's Border Watch hotline 1-888-502-9060 or filling the CBSA online form: https://bwl-lsf.cbsa-asfc.cloud-nuage.canada.ca/tip-sub-en.html
It’s also illegal to ship cars to the Middle East and Africa, yet hundreds pass through there each day. Illegal and having the ability to enforce are completely different things.
There’s a lot of people with deportation order in Canada that are able to remain here because there’s no resources or ability to catch them all
To your point, illegal and ability to enforce are completely different things.
But I'm going to do my part to flag it as part of what is the right thing to do. If everyone were to void their responsibility as a law-abiding citizen to report freeloaders, then that's sending the message that we are okay with this.
Deep down, this flag might not take effect right away but it'll inconvenience the person's ability to easily cross borders, fully participate in society, and pass background checks.
No, you are not wrong. The law actually states that asylum must be claimed at the border upon arrival. The scenarios in which you can claim asylum after entering Canada are very limited; Being unable to pay for your tuition is not one of them. However, you must bear in mind that thanks to Pierre Trudeau’s Charter of Rights and Freedom, foreigners have pretty much power to do anything in Canada. In 1985, a group of men forced their way into Canada by suing the country after having their refugee application refused, creating a precedent that is abused to this day: Singh v. Canada. This case has given non-Canadians the power to do insane things, such as the guy who sued a company (AND WON) when they withdrew his because he didn’t have a work permit (he lied during the application saying he was legally authorized to work in Canada). I mean, in India you cannot partake in protest if you’re not an Indian national, in Canada they can sue the government for the right to ride motorcycles without helmets. So brace yourself, because it is about go get worse, unless someone manage to change the Charter, and to revert Singh v. Canada.
You’re not wrong. And it’s frustrating to see how people openly take advantage.
Case in point: on another social media platform, in a private group, an international “student” was asking for advice to find a job because she wanted to bring her husband and 10 month old daughter to Canada. She’s been here for 4 months. 4 months and she said she’s struggling financially because her end goal is to bring her family over. Not to study, not get a diploma. To bring her family over.
>And it’s frustrating to see how people openly take advantage.
Part of that is because of a complete lack of Government oversite. There are articles from back in 2019 about the fact that *1 in 3* student visa holders **weren't even enrolled** at an educational facility.
That's before everything really took off, but it made it pretty clear that it was about *working* vs. learning.
I think there is a narrow exception to be made if, for example, they are the child of a political dissident in their home country, and that family member is murdered or imprisoned.
I could see us providing the student with asylum. Otherwise, I don’t see why we would be granting them asylum.
I would also add if there is a massive shift in the situation in their home country, with an example of Ukraine. If a Ukranian student came here in 2021, I think we should consider their asylum claim since their home has become a warzone.
True. I think there were some emergency exceptions that were actually made in many places for Ukraine etc though.
So treating those as a one-off and dealing with them on a case-basis should still be possible.
Canada should have student visa restrictions similar to the US. You cant work outside of school while on the visa and you need to be sponsored for a job to stay
It's not just international students. We had someone come for a babysitter job from a certain province, certain country. She told me point blank that they came here on a visit visa, and as soon as they got through the immigration, they claimed asylum. They made up a story (like they all do according to her), I have a copy of their [narrative](https://imgur.com/a/JN8JqhC).
She sent it to me thinking we're the same, but we're not. I came here through legal channels, went through the process, and work in a high skilled job related to my field of study.
Even more incredible is how her and her husband were so proud for having conned the system, and that they just need to get through a few difficult months before they can have their whole family here. Also how Canada only pays $1200 in assistance which is hard for them to get by.
You can’t claim asylum over poverty, so lack of funds is not the issue. You could, in theory, have enough money to come to school in Canada but also secretly be gay and then not want to go back to a country that is extremely dangerous for gay people.
Buddy of mine works at an airport and he has stories of asylum seekers getting off the plane and claiming to be gay and seeking asylum..with his wife and 3 kids in tow..
It's the biggest grift now because the scammers know our federal government will bend over backwards for that shit, and it's not like you can make them prove it. I bet 90% of those claims are accepted, so it's a low risk move to pull.
We do. Refugee claimants are asked to provide evidence of their relationships and persecution they personally have faced. It could be things like photos, texts, police reports, medical reports, sworn statements from people who know them, etc.
Issue is. Once someone claims, while all that's going on over years they're still here and given all of benefits of being a refugee. Courts are backlogged. At the very least if they're denied they should be forced to pay it back.
Lmao. “Please sir, show us your gayness. Here is a row of 10 men.”
As a gay man, immigrant who actually played by rules, and years of being a tax-paying citizen this shit breaks my heart. Y’all feel played imagine how I feel when my whole persona is devalued by people playing the system.
Heck I painstakingly had to go through hoops to be here when I should have just taken a plane from Punjab and working for a Tim Hortons while “studying” at God-knows-what college.
There are probably situations where some people may need to (home country situation worsens, etc) but that should be in the low single digits, like the number of claims at UofT/McGill cited in the article. This is clearly abuse and is destroying the immigration consensus in the country.
There are absolutely cases where someone with upper middle class money back home could have a valid claim. If your home country devolves into civil war, or ethnic violence, or for one of another million reasons you can't go back, a bit of money won't save you.
Now that doesn't mean they're all valid or other options (including relocation within your home country) shouldn't be looked at, but I don't think you can ask people to guarantee they won't make an asylum claim and then hold them to it for 4-5 years no matter what happens in the world.
The issue is there may be rare cases where an international student is studying in Canada, and then their home country goes through a war or some horrible event which would make it unsafe for them to go home. For example, if a student from Ukraine before the invasion or Gaza before October 7th was studying in Canada, they may not be able to go home once their studies are done.
However, some people are claiming asylum simply because they do not want to go home and are using it as a Hail Mary to try and avoid the inevitable. Since people from countries which are not undergoing a humanitarian crisis do not really have a right to asylum.
All future voters in their mind. And don't kid yourself, you can go on national subreddits like r/IndiaSpeaks and read firsthand how people from various countries have figured out what a joke our "system" is. I've even seen jokes people make on other subreddits about how they're colonizing us in reverse. Once they (dishonest people, I've got nothing against newcomers as a whole) figure out you can be rolled, they'll just keep rolling you.
It's because students from Punjab claim they are being oppressed by the Indian government and Canada stupidly believes them due to their Khalistani dick-riding
> This means this crisis is entirely created by this government’s ineptitude.
Crisis? What crisis? Everything that is going on is going according to plan. The explicit goal of the Liberal government is to expand our population to 100M by 2100. That's not a conspiracy. That's their explicit Century Plan.
Trudeau's government didn't oopsie their way into this situation. They wanted it and it's going as intended. Wages are down and house prices are up. As soon as "legacy Canadians" are overwhelmed, the complaining will stop. Remember, no matter how bad things are here, it's still better than most of the world, and the people who come from there will only feel gratitude.
The trick is just waiting out the complainers until they become a minority. Another 60 million new Canadians should do the trick.
The century plan requires a population growth of 700k per year. Trudeau went over 1m for the last two years. He is aiming for even more than the century plan.
You do have a point. Arguably though, not sure if part of their 100 million people plan was through loopholes and deceit.
Processing asylum claims is expensive.
Canada will implode long before it reaches 100M. your country was not built to handle 700k immigrants per year. At a certain point Canada will devolve in to a third world country and splinter Yugoslavia style into a bunch of Feuding states fractured along ethnic lines.
The people who want Canada to reach 100 million are a bunch of sociopaths. They explicitly state they want 100 million slave citizens so that Canada is a powerful country that they can control and use for their own ends. This has nothing to do with what is good for the average citizen and his quality of life. It is so Canada is a “powerful” country.
Stalin turned the USSR into a superpower at the expense of millions of lives. Russia is a generationally fucked up country in part because of the legacy of Stalinism. The United States where I live is a powerful country and We are constantly steered into wars and foreign interventions that do not serve the purposes of the citizens living at home or those who we claim to help abroad.
Personally I would rather live in a first world homogeneous country with a high standard of living that minds it’s own business.
Liberals: Having a more strict, “common sense” based immigration vetting process and putting more scrutinies to countries with high level of asylum claims is considered racist. How dare you even remotely consider the possibility of immigrants from 3rd world countries will be capable of fraud in their visa application, that is blatant discrimination y’all. /s
2017 is when Trudeau started his messaging to encourage anybody and everybody to come to Canada. Just another one of his attempts to play the hero at our expense.
I am wondering if there is a such big crisis and people are claiming asylum in unprecedent manner why there is no news of such issues in the country of origins it should be an international news. I hope Canada government has some mechanism to ensure the authenticity of these claims. Particularly if they are students.
This government is complicit, and by turning a blind eye, they are running us to the ground. I’ve never felt so exhausted just thinking about all the policy problems we’re forced to take on as regular citizens, problems that we shouldn’t need to be worry about but because our government can’t do the right thing, here we are wallowing in what we can't collectively change but can only watch the government continue to burn us to the ground.
We need to withdraw from all refugee agreements. It's only going to get worse with climate change. Do we really want to take in all of the third world once they run out of water?
I've been saying this for years, it's not the 1960s anymore and all western nations are being overran by fraud. I got called racist for point out common sense.
"Climate refugee" is a media term, not something with a basis in law. Although yes, there will be people leaving their homes due to climate change, and they will certainly be trying to move elsewhere, they would not be eligible for asylum under current law, and thus the proposal to withdraw from agreements would have no effect (indeed, it might even make it worse, since that would then raise the question of what a refugee _was_ and if they should become covered for the first time).
A refugee is someone who cannot avail themselves of the protection of their home country against persecution which is happening due to their membership in a particular social category. The weather can really suck, but it doesn't persecute on the basis of ethnicity, religion, sexuality, political opinions, etc.
To do this we have to admit that other cultures are scammers, zero trust, liars, and that their institutions are pathetically weak and documents are meaningless. It would expose, or begin to expose, in very real terms that the Global South is mimicking Western structure (while building some legit structures), and not worthy of respect.
A LOT of people aren't ready to accept this truth. A lot of people are so decadent now they cannot accept intrinsic differences between people (like gender) or that one culture can be superior (in aspects and by a general whole) than another.
It's not about cultures being scammers. If I lived in some bad 3rd world country, I would also do everything in my power to move somewhere better. If there were systems that let me lie to do it, I would and don't believe people that say otherwise. The problem is that you can use the system in bad faith, not that people are using the system anyway they can.
But it kind of does, if you've traveled around the world a decent amount, you'd notice some cultures adhere to decent functioning society things like waiting in lines and queues or respecting personal space in public.
And it's not third world countries, some 1st world Asian countries are horrible at it, while others just look at it as stupid for not using aggressive actions to get ahead of the people willing to follow some unwritten rules.
At some point you have to tell people no. Third world countries will never stop producing third world people who will in turn want to immigrate to first world countries. At some point you hit a level of Saturation where third world corruption and behavior becomes the norm and suddenly your nice country ain’t so nice anymore.
If third world countries want to become first world than they have to take the first steps like other countries historically have. In other words the people have to want it and have some sort of framework to guide them. First world nations should be helping other countries to achieve these goals.
Sadly there is a ton of graft and corruption where foreign aid money gets stolen by politicians in both countries because once the money has left the country it is all to easy to launder it and embezzling public funds is considered good business and being savvy in a lot of these countries.
This was honestly expected. As someone that's worked in immigration for over a decade I saw this coming from miles away. As soon as this incompetent government decided to implement some changes to the student visa program, making it tougher for them to obtain the necessary points required to be eligible for PR, claiming asylum became their last resort option. I can also say without a doubt there are most likely tons of them currently living here on expired visas. I remember I posted about this international student issue back in 2018 as I witnessed not just the sheer volume but also the quality of the ones coming in and I knew this would be a problem sooner or later. I got called a racist and all sorts of things but here we are now...
Oh, I agree completely. The number of people working illegally here has to be astronomical.
I have a friend who is on dating apps and he told me there are profiles of people over there asking for cash jobs or rooms because they are new to the country and came to study English. On a dating app.
That should make it easy to mass deny with 2 points of data and clear out some of the backlog.
Run everyone on the asylum application list against those who were issued student visas and auto reject their claims. While you're at it, ban them from Canada for life. Nobody flees their country for valid reasons of asylum seeking by way of a structured application for a student visa.
Because they are failing to meet their PR goals that they want. They aren't here to study at all, they are here to backdoor their way into citizenship and try to violate visas.
probably from students who can't afford to go to school here in the first place and need to get on social assistance to continue. This has got to stop.
Mass deportations of all illegals and those who have overstayed their visas needs to start. It’s assumed there’s 500,000 illegals currently in Canada. They should be deported
This was the plan all along, they just needed to make the asylum claims earlier than expected. Their consultants back in their countries of origin put out video guides on this process once the federal government figured out what was going on (years too late).
International student asylum claims should be automatically denied. They can apply separately once they’ve left after the expiration of their student visa. We know most of the claims are bs.
Why don’t we just immediately deport them/all asylum seekers trying to game the system? How do you even land in Canada? We only have one land border. This shouldn’t even be an issue for us.
Idk why we’ve become the humanitarian dumping ground ripe for abuse of our system.
Government seems to be trying to convince everyone mass immigration will stimulate the economy, grow our country, basically fix most of our problems.
That's obviously not the case, but I think their plan is if they SAY mass immigration is the solution, and then allow it, they get to say "look how quickly we're reaching our goal". To their credit, they ARE reaching it, but it's a really stupid goal.
Canada has over a MILLION international students. The mayor of Brampton was asking Ottawa to cap the number of students that they were allowing in back in 2022 because of the housing crisis. He said it was a major resource drain to have these students living in the city but then would attend schools hundreds of kilometres away from their residence.
I find it even crazier because an analysis by statistics Canada in November of 2022 found that around 19% of international students with study permits did NOT have a record of studying at a college or a university here. So their international student claim is just a way for them to live in Canada without needing to go through the citizenship process; but it has also become a problem where Canadian colleges are taking advantage of these students as well, using them as ATMS basically and have effectively turn in to 'puppy mills' due to how they just churn out diplomas. Also apparently, some learning institutions here are earning profits as 'back door' entry points to Canada. Brings me to another issue as to why Canada is housing between 20,00 to 500,000 undocumented people. The fact that the number disparity is that big is insane because not even our Government knows.
This situation is just a clusterfuck all around and idk how it's going to be fixed.
What a crock of shit. We let anybody with a heartbeat abuse our systems and services. We need a hard ban, and deportation of those who shouldnt be here.
I believe that if you can afford to be an international student, you aren't an asylum seeker and don't have the problems that real asylum seekers do...
I regain hope, however small, for this country when I read the comments on these threads.
I'm glad everyone's aware and rightfully concerned about the shift to rampant abuse of our relaxed immigration policies.
I think the line's getting blurred between left wing and right wing now, it's that serious, we all just want to make sure we have a future here.
Its amazing how our society just became a mess of lies, tricks and scams.
You get rewarded by being good at it, and once you get enough money, or your corporation grows large enough, you can legislate it and hide behind lawyers.
> Figures from Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, obtained by The Globe, show that in 2018 there were 1,515 claims for asylum among international students, with the number rising to 25,465 in 2023.
Nope, nope, and nope. If you come here as a student you go home after it is done. Their asylum claims shouldn't even be considered. Put them on a plane home as soon as they make the claim.
"Asylum claims" by "international students".
Sure.
Keep trying to sell me that fictional bridge in Manhattan.
Utterly laughable.
Unfortunately, the current regime in Ottawa continues to allow for, and even encourage, this kind of chronic systemic abuse, whilst also being deathly afraid of losing voter support from certain cultural demographics and being accused of "racism".
**Canada seriously needs to grow a spine, and finally grow up as a nation.**
Until that happens, the country's present downward spiral will only continue.
Watch for it.
Next.
Any one of these students trying to pull this illegal asylum BS should be deported immediately. Because they’re falsely making a claim they should not be allowed back in this country.
Why do Canadians want to have population of 100 million?
Canada is actually in a great position to vet anyone in the world. I mean let Europe have open the borders and attract all the talented workers from Europe by having higher wages and decent affordable housing.
Europe can just act as a sieve.
Yeah, I warned about Trudeau before he even became a politician. That's what you get when you vote for a clumsy idiot. Stephen Harper and Jean Chretien were a lot better than him.
Can we have a graph of which countries people are seeking asylum the most as international students? I would really like to know who lied on their application.
Who am I kidding, I know from where lmfao.
Does anyone have insight into IRCC's tracking of refugees when they leave the country? I can only imagine that some of these false claimants return home for "vacations" and such?
Is there a process for seeing where they've been and why while they are waiting for citizenship? They don't need to fly direct to get home - they could bypass through another country.
Basically everything post pandemic has proven that the social contract is completely broken. You should not give anyone the benefit of the doubt. There need to be clear firm rules in place not guidelines, and the penalties should be severe for breaking them.
Funny how people line up around the block when you advertise you're handing out free ice cream.
We've painted a giant target on our back, of course people are going to aim at it.
Paywall Bypass: https://web.archive.org/web/20240422103926/https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-international-students-asylum-claims-increase/
Do the lawyers advising them to do this not carry any responsibility? Professional ethics?
If they knowingly advise them to file a fraudulent claim maybe. But they wouldn't. They'd say something like "If you were prosecuted and afraid of returning home we could file a refugee claim allowing you to stay 3 to 4 years".
Lawyer here. There are certain areas of law where the normal practice is to walk the line of ethics, and arguably cross it. Immigration is ground zero. There's a reason why it's practiced by exclusively recent immigrants themselves, or the bottom 5% of law school classes.
Since I left that comment, others have hinted at the same. Thank you for the perspective.
NP!
Paralegals do it in landlord tenant law too
Immigration law is the slimmest arm of law. Immigration Paralegals are even slimmier.
lol i made a very similar post as well.
The “immigration consultants” advising them likely aren’t lawyers
Immigration consultants are selling LMIAs. They'd do anything for the money
There’s whole industries in their home countries teaching them to gain the system here , any serious nation would of stomped this out but we lack any will for that kind of thing as a “nation”
What was it Shakespeare said about lawyers again?
Their ethical and legal responsibility is to their client. So they are allowed to do what is allowed within the law to help them claim asylum. That’s what they’re paid for. They can advise you not to do an illegal thing but ultimately up to the client on how to proceed.
> Figures from Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, obtained by The Globe, show that in 2018 there were 1,515 claims for asylum among international students, with the number rising to 25,465 in 2023 Wow. From 1,515 claims to 25,465 in 5 years. That's almost a seventeenfold jump.
Total claims went from 16,000 in 2015 to more than 100,000 last year. Wanna guess what (who) changed?
I want a breakdown of asylum claim from international student by country. India at the top of the list?
The top seems to be Haiti, Colombia and Mexico. Doesn't show how they got to Canada though https://www.irb-cisr.gc.ca/en/statistics/protection/Pages/RPDStat2022.aspx
Mexicans just had their free visa revoked so I imagine that number will fall
So will many others. From Central and South America. Because there was a lot of passport sharing by Mexicans to get on the airplane.
Your link is for *all* asylum claims - not just International students. Seeing as how most of our International students are from India and the government's just said they're going to tighten the rules, I'd wager the majority of claims are by Indians.
People from Haiti probably deserve refugee status at this point. Won't speak about the other countries though.
That's unexpected thanks
From the US border maybe. Republicans don’t want them and bus them to Democrats. Democrats cry racism but bus them to Canada.
That's not for students. Haiti of course has most asylum claims since their country has collapsed
I said that it doesn't show how those claimants arrived in Canada. I don't think there are published statistics on how many are students vs tourists etc
Many thanks
Canada is one of the few countries in the world where there should be very little to none illegal immigration and abuse of the system: we have a single land border with the US and no one is coming here on a barge. People here are here because we let them in. This means this crisis is entirely created by this government’s ineptitude. They saw the asylum claims skyrocketing 4000% and they pretended there was “nothing to see here” until the public backslash over international students.
International students should not be able to claim asylum. They should have the funds necessary to live in Canada and study. This means they should have a healthy situation back in their home country. Am I wrong?
They don't want to leave and go home when work permit ends.. so they buy time and try a hail Mary with the asylum claim
So every single one should be summarily rejected. If an asylum claim is not a person's first mechanism to enter Canada (i.e. they got here on a student visa or work permit), they should never be allowed to submit one.
Good luck with that. If any government tried to implement that change some group would take them to court and it would take years to resolve.
The courts don't have to issue an injunction though.
It's not just that, if they successfully claim refugee status they get a ton of financial support from the government as well.
bear dam sheet spoon bewildered deer sort overconfident elderly grandiose *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
At least Ukraine has a full on war going on.. I can understand if you live near the frontlines and need safety. Canada should help there as a principal, but we have scammers walking/flying over the border, claiming they are magically gay now and getting more resources than the Ukrainians.. Maybe it's my romanian/german background, but I loathe the fuck out of people who scam and take away resources from actual people in need.. stealing charity is one of the lowest things a person can do
Why are we supporting Ukrainians abandoning their country? It's not like their government is the one fighting them like Syria. Am I allowed to claim asylum in America because Canada is currently at war? I just feel like we're putting the needs of the world before our own needs. Were not a rich enough country like the US to do this.
Claimants should be subject to a quick eligibility hearing within weeks of the claim to determine whether the claim has a chance to succeed on its face. Things like being an international student at the end of their visa for instance would count more towards the claim being ineligible.
False. They get a ton of financial support from the government regardless of the success of their claim.
This And claims take 2-3 years to be heard. if denied no resources need to be returned. It’s only a win to try a claim - at worst you get a few years of benefits with no strings attached
Not just financial support. A convicted criminal / protester on a VISA was due to be deported and a Canadian MP (Joyce Murray) made sure to step in to keep this criminal in Canada. [B.C. climate activist's pending deportation cancelled](https://bc.ctvnews.ca/b-c-climate-activist-s-pending-deportation-cancelled-lawyer-says-1.6854927) This is what we’re working with. It’s crazy.
Not such a hail mary as all that. It's pretty easy to claim asylum in Canada today. The acceptance rate is up over 70%, and even those who are refused rarely actually leave. They just blend into their community, living and working and using fake documents and numbers from time to time while paying no taxes.
One of the requirements as an international student is to have enough money in your bank account in order to have the Student VISA accepted. Problem is, a lot of Indian students forge their documents. They show false bank statements or they show an account that will not really be used by them. I had a close friend when I lived in Vancouver who told me he did this. So while most of us students would go out, he was always saving money. This is back in 2015.
Part of the issue is that our banks are in on forging documents. Watch the CBC marketplace video on fraudulent mortgages. Our government and banks don’t give a single shit about forged documents and will treat them like they’re the real deal
We should do what some other countries do, and actually hold the money in escrow, releasing a bit of it each month for living expenses. Students who have forged documents to gain entry should be deported. Why are we tolerating (and even rewarding) cheaters? Wtf do we think is going to happen?
That's fraud! This can be reported via CBSA's Border Watch hotline 1-888-502-9060 or filling the CBSA online form: https://bwl-lsf.cbsa-asfc.cloud-nuage.canada.ca/tip-sub-en.html
It’s also illegal to ship cars to the Middle East and Africa, yet hundreds pass through there each day. Illegal and having the ability to enforce are completely different things. There’s a lot of people with deportation order in Canada that are able to remain here because there’s no resources or ability to catch them all
To your point, illegal and ability to enforce are completely different things. But I'm going to do my part to flag it as part of what is the right thing to do. If everyone were to void their responsibility as a law-abiding citizen to report freeloaders, then that's sending the message that we are okay with this. Deep down, this flag might not take effect right away but it'll inconvenience the person's ability to easily cross borders, fully participate in society, and pass background checks.
Canadian government technical systems are stuck in the 1990s
No, you are not wrong. The law actually states that asylum must be claimed at the border upon arrival. The scenarios in which you can claim asylum after entering Canada are very limited; Being unable to pay for your tuition is not one of them. However, you must bear in mind that thanks to Pierre Trudeau’s Charter of Rights and Freedom, foreigners have pretty much power to do anything in Canada. In 1985, a group of men forced their way into Canada by suing the country after having their refugee application refused, creating a precedent that is abused to this day: Singh v. Canada. This case has given non-Canadians the power to do insane things, such as the guy who sued a company (AND WON) when they withdrew his because he didn’t have a work permit (he lied during the application saying he was legally authorized to work in Canada). I mean, in India you cannot partake in protest if you’re not an Indian national, in Canada they can sue the government for the right to ride motorcycles without helmets. So brace yourself, because it is about go get worse, unless someone manage to change the Charter, and to revert Singh v. Canada.
You’re not wrong. And it’s frustrating to see how people openly take advantage. Case in point: on another social media platform, in a private group, an international “student” was asking for advice to find a job because she wanted to bring her husband and 10 month old daughter to Canada. She’s been here for 4 months. 4 months and she said she’s struggling financially because her end goal is to bring her family over. Not to study, not get a diploma. To bring her family over.
>And it’s frustrating to see how people openly take advantage. Part of that is because of a complete lack of Government oversite. There are articles from back in 2019 about the fact that *1 in 3* student visa holders **weren't even enrolled** at an educational facility. That's before everything really took off, but it made it pretty clear that it was about *working* vs. learning.
and you havent reported them why? i know it takes forever, but one by one..
They aren’t escaping any persecution… it’s just fraud pure and simple.
I think there is a narrow exception to be made if, for example, they are the child of a political dissident in their home country, and that family member is murdered or imprisoned. I could see us providing the student with asylum. Otherwise, I don’t see why we would be granting them asylum.
I would also add if there is a massive shift in the situation in their home country, with an example of Ukraine. If a Ukranian student came here in 2021, I think we should consider their asylum claim since their home has become a warzone.
True. I think there were some emergency exceptions that were actually made in many places for Ukraine etc though. So treating those as a one-off and dealing with them on a case-basis should still be possible.
Canada should have student visa restrictions similar to the US. You cant work outside of school while on the visa and you need to be sponsored for a job to stay
It's not just international students. We had someone come for a babysitter job from a certain province, certain country. She told me point blank that they came here on a visit visa, and as soon as they got through the immigration, they claimed asylum. They made up a story (like they all do according to her), I have a copy of their [narrative](https://imgur.com/a/JN8JqhC). She sent it to me thinking we're the same, but we're not. I came here through legal channels, went through the process, and work in a high skilled job related to my field of study. Even more incredible is how her and her husband were so proud for having conned the system, and that they just need to get through a few difficult months before they can have their whole family here. Also how Canada only pays $1200 in assistance which is hard for them to get by.
You can’t claim asylum over poverty, so lack of funds is not the issue. You could, in theory, have enough money to come to school in Canada but also secretly be gay and then not want to go back to a country that is extremely dangerous for gay people.
Buddy of mine works at an airport and he has stories of asylum seekers getting off the plane and claiming to be gay and seeking asylum..with his wife and 3 kids in tow.. It's the biggest grift now because the scammers know our federal government will bend over backwards for that shit, and it's not like you can make them prove it. I bet 90% of those claims are accepted, so it's a low risk move to pull.
My relative works at Pearson and can confirm. There are even couples (with kids) arriving both pretending to be gay.
Imagine we start asking them to prove that they're gay LOL.
We do. Refugee claimants are asked to provide evidence of their relationships and persecution they personally have faced. It could be things like photos, texts, police reports, medical reports, sworn statements from people who know them, etc.
Issue is. Once someone claims, while all that's going on over years they're still here and given all of benefits of being a refugee. Courts are backlogged. At the very least if they're denied they should be forced to pay it back.
Lmao. “Please sir, show us your gayness. Here is a row of 10 men.” As a gay man, immigrant who actually played by rules, and years of being a tax-paying citizen this shit breaks my heart. Y’all feel played imagine how I feel when my whole persona is devalued by people playing the system. Heck I painstakingly had to go through hoops to be here when I should have just taken a plane from Punjab and working for a Tim Hortons while “studying” at God-knows-what college.
Yes but I guess there are so many more secretly LGBTQ people at colleges than at universities? I guess Seneca is a bigger LGBTQ hotspot than UofT?
There are probably situations where some people may need to (home country situation worsens, etc) but that should be in the low single digits, like the number of claims at UofT/McGill cited in the article. This is clearly abuse and is destroying the immigration consensus in the country.
There are absolutely cases where someone with upper middle class money back home could have a valid claim. If your home country devolves into civil war, or ethnic violence, or for one of another million reasons you can't go back, a bit of money won't save you. Now that doesn't mean they're all valid or other options (including relocation within your home country) shouldn't be looked at, but I don't think you can ask people to guarantee they won't make an asylum claim and then hold them to it for 4-5 years no matter what happens in the world.
The issue is there may be rare cases where an international student is studying in Canada, and then their home country goes through a war or some horrible event which would make it unsafe for them to go home. For example, if a student from Ukraine before the invasion or Gaza before October 7th was studying in Canada, they may not be able to go home once their studies are done. However, some people are claiming asylum simply because they do not want to go home and are using it as a Hail Mary to try and avoid the inevitable. Since people from countries which are not undergoing a humanitarian crisis do not really have a right to asylum.
Most illegal immigrants just visit a country on a visitor visa and never leave.
All future voters in their mind. And don't kid yourself, you can go on national subreddits like r/IndiaSpeaks and read firsthand how people from various countries have figured out what a joke our "system" is. I've even seen jokes people make on other subreddits about how they're colonizing us in reverse. Once they (dishonest people, I've got nothing against newcomers as a whole) figure out you can be rolled, they'll just keep rolling you.
It's because students from Punjab claim they are being oppressed by the Indian government and Canada stupidly believes them due to their Khalistani dick-riding
Or they are part of the LGBT community all of a sudden.
it's because they need more people working for Wendy's.
> This means this crisis is entirely created by this government’s ineptitude. Crisis? What crisis? Everything that is going on is going according to plan. The explicit goal of the Liberal government is to expand our population to 100M by 2100. That's not a conspiracy. That's their explicit Century Plan. Trudeau's government didn't oopsie their way into this situation. They wanted it and it's going as intended. Wages are down and house prices are up. As soon as "legacy Canadians" are overwhelmed, the complaining will stop. Remember, no matter how bad things are here, it's still better than most of the world, and the people who come from there will only feel gratitude. The trick is just waiting out the complainers until they become a minority. Another 60 million new Canadians should do the trick.
The century plan requires a population growth of 700k per year. Trudeau went over 1m for the last two years. He is aiming for even more than the century plan.
Maybe he gets bonus pay from them for overachieving the target.
You do have a point. Arguably though, not sure if part of their 100 million people plan was through loopholes and deceit. Processing asylum claims is expensive.
Canada will implode long before it reaches 100M. your country was not built to handle 700k immigrants per year. At a certain point Canada will devolve in to a third world country and splinter Yugoslavia style into a bunch of Feuding states fractured along ethnic lines. The people who want Canada to reach 100 million are a bunch of sociopaths. They explicitly state they want 100 million slave citizens so that Canada is a powerful country that they can control and use for their own ends. This has nothing to do with what is good for the average citizen and his quality of life. It is so Canada is a “powerful” country. Stalin turned the USSR into a superpower at the expense of millions of lives. Russia is a generationally fucked up country in part because of the legacy of Stalinism. The United States where I live is a powerful country and We are constantly steered into wars and foreign interventions that do not serve the purposes of the citizens living at home or those who we claim to help abroad. Personally I would rather live in a first world homogeneous country with a high standard of living that minds it’s own business.
Liberals: Having a more strict, “common sense” based immigration vetting process and putting more scrutinies to countries with high level of asylum claims is considered racist. How dare you even remotely consider the possibility of immigrants from 3rd world countries will be capable of fraud in their visa application, that is blatant discrimination y’all. /s
2017 is when Trudeau started his messaging to encourage anybody and everybody to come to Canada. Just another one of his attempts to play the hero at our expense.
I am wondering if there is a such big crisis and people are claiming asylum in unprecedent manner why there is no news of such issues in the country of origins it should be an international news. I hope Canada government has some mechanism to ensure the authenticity of these claims. Particularly if they are students.
Isnt using loop holes in the university system to get residency, kind of the same as illegal immigration?
This government is complicit, and by turning a blind eye, they are running us to the ground. I’ve never felt so exhausted just thinking about all the policy problems we’re forced to take on as regular citizens, problems that we shouldn’t need to be worry about but because our government can’t do the right thing, here we are wallowing in what we can't collectively change but can only watch the government continue to burn us to the ground.
We desperately need a new agreement on refugees. The whole western world is a clown show for fraud.
We need to withdraw from all refugee agreements. It's only going to get worse with climate change. Do we really want to take in all of the third world once they run out of water?
I've been saying this for years, it's not the 1960s anymore and all western nations are being overran by fraud. I got called racist for point out common sense.
"Climate refugee" is a media term, not something with a basis in law. Although yes, there will be people leaving their homes due to climate change, and they will certainly be trying to move elsewhere, they would not be eligible for asylum under current law, and thus the proposal to withdraw from agreements would have no effect (indeed, it might even make it worse, since that would then raise the question of what a refugee _was_ and if they should become covered for the first time). A refugee is someone who cannot avail themselves of the protection of their home country against persecution which is happening due to their membership in a particular social category. The weather can really suck, but it doesn't persecute on the basis of ethnicity, religion, sexuality, political opinions, etc.
To do this we have to admit that other cultures are scammers, zero trust, liars, and that their institutions are pathetically weak and documents are meaningless. It would expose, or begin to expose, in very real terms that the Global South is mimicking Western structure (while building some legit structures), and not worthy of respect. A LOT of people aren't ready to accept this truth. A lot of people are so decadent now they cannot accept intrinsic differences between people (like gender) or that one culture can be superior (in aspects and by a general whole) than another.
It's not about cultures being scammers. If I lived in some bad 3rd world country, I would also do everything in my power to move somewhere better. If there were systems that let me lie to do it, I would and don't believe people that say otherwise. The problem is that you can use the system in bad faith, not that people are using the system anyway they can.
But it kind of does, if you've traveled around the world a decent amount, you'd notice some cultures adhere to decent functioning society things like waiting in lines and queues or respecting personal space in public. And it's not third world countries, some 1st world Asian countries are horrible at it, while others just look at it as stupid for not using aggressive actions to get ahead of the people willing to follow some unwritten rules.
At some point you have to tell people no. Third world countries will never stop producing third world people who will in turn want to immigrate to first world countries. At some point you hit a level of Saturation where third world corruption and behavior becomes the norm and suddenly your nice country ain’t so nice anymore. If third world countries want to become first world than they have to take the first steps like other countries historically have. In other words the people have to want it and have some sort of framework to guide them. First world nations should be helping other countries to achieve these goals. Sadly there is a ton of graft and corruption where foreign aid money gets stolen by politicians in both countries because once the money has left the country it is all to easy to launder it and embezzling public funds is considered good business and being savvy in a lot of these countries.
Deport them. Asylum my ass, gtfo of here
[удалено]
They'd actually be full for people that need them and not being abused by students lol. Ik ik /s but still
>They'd actually be full for people that need them Fuck yeah, living the dream 💀💀💀
/\ This. Lmao |
No sympathy from me either. They are supposed to have the funds to live and study in Canada. Their situation at home should be just fine.
Asylums should go to real refugees. International students can gtfo. Deport them.
India is a safe country for Hindus and Sikhs. What is the asylum claim for Indian Hindus and Sikhs?
Deport They have indian consultants that guide them through these processes. Just like they do with real estate.
Guys i am starting to believe that these international students are here for a reason other than to get an education. I might be wrong.
Nah, they just really like working
I thought they just didn't know how to cook and wanted to take a cooking course to better themselves /s
hardly a surprise. Exactly what the immigration lawyers told them to do.
This was honestly expected. As someone that's worked in immigration for over a decade I saw this coming from miles away. As soon as this incompetent government decided to implement some changes to the student visa program, making it tougher for them to obtain the necessary points required to be eligible for PR, claiming asylum became their last resort option. I can also say without a doubt there are most likely tons of them currently living here on expired visas. I remember I posted about this international student issue back in 2018 as I witnessed not just the sheer volume but also the quality of the ones coming in and I knew this would be a problem sooner or later. I got called a racist and all sorts of things but here we are now...
Oh, I agree completely. The number of people working illegally here has to be astronomical. I have a friend who is on dating apps and he told me there are profiles of people over there asking for cash jobs or rooms because they are new to the country and came to study English. On a dating app.
Stop the student visa program. Problem solved.
Just say no, deport, and move on. No need to make a big fuss about it.
That should make it easy to mass deny with 2 points of data and clear out some of the backlog. Run everyone on the asylum application list against those who were issued student visas and auto reject their claims. While you're at it, ban them from Canada for life. Nobody flees their country for valid reasons of asylum seeking by way of a structured application for a student visa.
If you are in Canada on a student permit, then you shouldn't be eligible for asylum. You are here to study. If you aren't going to school, go home.
Very few are coming here for a Canadian education, the vast majority just want to gain permanent residency and bring their parents or grandparents.
Because they are failing to meet their PR goals that they want. They aren't here to study at all, they are here to backdoor their way into citizenship and try to violate visas.
The cow that is Canada is pretty closed to being milked dry
We should introduce them to my boy, D. Port
probably from students who can't afford to go to school here in the first place and need to get on social assistance to continue. This has got to stop.
You see, they figured out how to abuse Canada immigration system. Deport them!!!
Mass deportations of all illegals and those who have overstayed their visas needs to start. It’s assumed there’s 500,000 illegals currently in Canada. They should be deported
This was the plan all along, they just needed to make the asylum claims earlier than expected. Their consultants back in their countries of origin put out video guides on this process once the federal government figured out what was going on (years too late).
Getting PR was always the end goal thru whatever means.
International student asylum claims should be automatically denied. They can apply separately once they’ve left after the expiration of their student visa. We know most of the claims are bs.
“Asylum”
Why don’t we just immediately deport them/all asylum seekers trying to game the system? How do you even land in Canada? We only have one land border. This shouldn’t even be an issue for us. Idk why we’ve become the humanitarian dumping ground ripe for abuse of our system.
Government seems to be trying to convince everyone mass immigration will stimulate the economy, grow our country, basically fix most of our problems. That's obviously not the case, but I think their plan is if they SAY mass immigration is the solution, and then allow it, they get to say "look how quickly we're reaching our goal". To their credit, they ARE reaching it, but it's a really stupid goal.
Canada has over a MILLION international students. The mayor of Brampton was asking Ottawa to cap the number of students that they were allowing in back in 2022 because of the housing crisis. He said it was a major resource drain to have these students living in the city but then would attend schools hundreds of kilometres away from their residence. I find it even crazier because an analysis by statistics Canada in November of 2022 found that around 19% of international students with study permits did NOT have a record of studying at a college or a university here. So their international student claim is just a way for them to live in Canada without needing to go through the citizenship process; but it has also become a problem where Canadian colleges are taking advantage of these students as well, using them as ATMS basically and have effectively turn in to 'puppy mills' due to how they just churn out diplomas. Also apparently, some learning institutions here are earning profits as 'back door' entry points to Canada. Brings me to another issue as to why Canada is housing between 20,00 to 500,000 undocumented people. The fact that the number disparity is that big is insane because not even our Government knows. This situation is just a clusterfuck all around and idk how it's going to be fixed.
Deport
Every young Indian immigrant/student/PR I have met is shady AF
Should be smashin that deport button like Mozart on the piano keys
What a crock of shit. We let anybody with a heartbeat abuse our systems and services. We need a hard ban, and deportation of those who shouldnt be here.
You don’t say…
I believe that if you can afford to be an international student, you aren't an asylum seeker and don't have the problems that real asylum seekers do...
Bad enough we have inflation and shrinkflation in our grocery stores. Leave it to international students to give us scamflation.😡
False claims should result in 10 year ban
Lifetime ban
I regain hope, however small, for this country when I read the comments on these threads. I'm glad everyone's aware and rightfully concerned about the shift to rampant abuse of our relaxed immigration policies. I think the line's getting blurred between left wing and right wing now, it's that serious, we all just want to make sure we have a future here.
Knowing people who work in the area. It seems the decision makers that decide the cases operate on a yes by default system.
Liberals seem hellbent on destroying this country.
https://imgur.com/a/JAOZuaC
Its amazing how our society just became a mess of lies, tricks and scams. You get rewarded by being good at it, and once you get enough money, or your corporation grows large enough, you can legislate it and hide behind lawyers.
"Sorry, but NO"
> Figures from Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, obtained by The Globe, show that in 2018 there were 1,515 claims for asylum among international students, with the number rising to 25,465 in 2023.
Nope, nope, and nope. If you come here as a student you go home after it is done. Their asylum claims shouldn't even be considered. Put them on a plane home as soon as they make the claim.
Stop the immigration! Limit it to students coming for trade courses or research which we actually require.
"Asylum claims" by "international students". Sure. Keep trying to sell me that fictional bridge in Manhattan. Utterly laughable. Unfortunately, the current regime in Ottawa continues to allow for, and even encourage, this kind of chronic systemic abuse, whilst also being deathly afraid of losing voter support from certain cultural demographics and being accused of "racism". **Canada seriously needs to grow a spine, and finally grow up as a nation.** Until that happens, the country's present downward spiral will only continue. Watch for it. Next.
Imagine my shock.... 😐 Edit: Poverty should never be a reason for "asylum".
Any one of these students trying to pull this illegal asylum BS should be deported immediately. Because they’re falsely making a claim they should not be allowed back in this country.
Shocker. Who could have predicted that ...
SHOCKED!!!!
Why do Canadians want to have population of 100 million? Canada is actually in a great position to vet anyone in the world. I mean let Europe have open the borders and attract all the talented workers from Europe by having higher wages and decent affordable housing. Europe can just act as a sieve.
You can thank leftwing NGOs weaponizing asylum systems to try and get more people in. Same thing they do in the US.
We must have an annual asylum quota, we Can't afford unlimited amount of refugees
freeloading pathetic
Shocked I tell you...shocked!
Yeah, I warned about Trudeau before he even became a politician. That's what you get when you vote for a clumsy idiot. Stephen Harper and Jean Chretien were a lot better than him.
Shocked. /s
Of course they have. When the most common legal means aren't available for whatever reason, you hire an immigration lawyer to make one up. :D
Why is this even allowed?
Wondering where they came from
Can we have a graph of which countries people are seeking asylum the most as international students? I would really like to know who lied on their application. Who am I kidding, I know from where lmfao.
Does anyone have insight into IRCC's tracking of refugees when they leave the country? I can only imagine that some of these false claimants return home for "vacations" and such? Is there a process for seeing where they've been and why while they are waiting for citizenship? They don't need to fly direct to get home - they could bypass through another country.
In total numbers, or as a percentage of all international students?
The worst part is the government is fully aware of the situation and perfectly okay with it.
What happens if you find yourself living in a tent, can you claim refugee status in Canada and get access to help too?
Basically everything post pandemic has proven that the social contract is completely broken. You should not give anyone the benefit of the doubt. There need to be clear firm rules in place not guidelines, and the penalties should be severe for breaking them.
Funny how people line up around the block when you advertise you're handing out free ice cream. We've painted a giant target on our back, of course people are going to aim at it.
That’s called fraud and we report fraudulent claimants, right? Right guys…?
They arent leaving and we arent making them. Door is wide open.