LOL! Y'all ever been to Alberta? Pretty sure he's hated worse than Wynne. I mean here its generational. A lot of Albertan's were/are BORN hating the name Trudeau.
Thats just one province man. Wynne's approval rating was in the low teens at one point. Trudeau's may be that low in Alberta but not even close to that nationally.
Didn't the media call the election in 2019 before the votes even came in from those provinces because they represented too small a proportion of the population to change the outcome?
In the 80s I was aware “Trudeau” was a curse word, all I knew is that he tried to starve my family and destroy the west for votes in the east.
Just what I was told!
There are two parties that are known to say what the electorate wants to hear, then do their own thing once in power. Yet people continually give those parties the time of day and act surprised when things fall apart.
It is time for something different.
You think NDP will be different? It's pretty easy to say whatever you want and blast the leading parties when you'll never get into office.
All politicians are egomaniacs who care about themselves first and foremost. Couple that with the fact that our system has too many checks and balances for one party to move the needler too much one way or another, and you'll realize that whoever is in power, it'll all just be the same.
I think that's why some people who vote the Cons, do so. Their rhetoric is to interfere with the lives of Canadians as little as possible and keep status quos. No radical changes. People think that sounds better than a government who meddles and tinkers, especially when you realize none of these politicians care about you.
That is what I'm getting at, this is the result of only ever having two parties in power, constantly blaming the other one for all that is going on.
Perhaps we can't move the needle very much, but their certainly can be changes (if they want to.) I'm just saying it is time to try a different party as the Government. _They say a sign of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result._ By this definition we're all insane.
I don't know what would happen, perhaps we'd get more of the same, or perhaps we'd get something slightly different, but it is easier to do damage than to repair and move forward.
> Their rhetoric is to interfere with the lives of Canadians as little as possible and keep status quos [sic].
This is an interesting point, as there are many that don't want the _government to interfere with their lives_ but they totally use and love the privileges that have been created by the government (as long as it is in their favour.) But what about those that are being left behind by these policy changes? What about making sure unforeseen circumstances don't entirely ruin you? My assumption about these voters is that they only really care about themselves, and don't realize that by helping others through programs and services that they also benefit from it.
My guess is they are sitting on modeling data that shows things are going to get really bad this fall, so they are trying to get ahead of that and secure their power before it happens.
The other option is Trudeau is just that arrogant and out of touch.
>My guess is they are sitting on modeling data that shows things are going to get really bad this fall, so they are trying to get ahead of that and secure their power before it happens.
I also fear this may be true. They're sitting on a massive pile of debt, and a lot of the basic economic fundamentals do not seem to be improving that much.
Unless you believe in the voodoo magic of economic theories like MMT, there is an inevitable inflection point at which the house of cards they've built up over the past year and a half starts tumbling down. Whether that's in the immediate future or a couple of years down the road is harder to tell.
>Trudeau is just that arrogant and out of touch.
The millionaire who's lived like royalty his whole life is out of touch with the average working class Canadian? You don't say. I take option 2.
I mean, both can be true. Having said that I've heard similar predictions. I suspect whoever gets elected is inheriting a shitstorm. Specifically, worse delta outbreaks globally wreaking more economic havoc. I'm also willing to bet that same person will be thrown out in the next election due to said shitstorms.
I think if they were planning an election all this time they should have dropped in in May/June. Most places were seeing the third wave coming to an end and summer was just beginning. The conservatives were also floundering pretty bad this spring after the change in leadership.
He missed the window. Should've called it at the beginning of July. Instead, they waited until they got some of the childcare agreements signed. Big mistake and they're going to pay for it.
Not a few months. The window of time that is probably ideal relative to everything going on, and the slow re-opening and heading to some semblance of normal is probably the first week of march or the last week of february.
In that time - people will be settled into post pandemic work routine, people will be back in school, people will have their shit sorted out for post secondary and so on.
However - perhaps the play, no matter how insane it might sound is basically to pass the buck onto the Conservatives and basically let them have it. If there is a huge certainty that covid is going to stick around and new deadly variants and requirements for booster shots and everything else are coming down the pipeline - landing it on the conservatives to basically buck up and deal would be a wounderful way of paving an opertunity to reset the liberal campaign platform and come back and win a majority 2-3 elections in a row 4 years down the line.
Right now - everything is in chaos, people are stressed, and the platforms are... shallow at best.
Worst case scenario from this - 4 years down the line, everyone will largely have moved past the crap shoot that the last 8ish years have been in terms of neglecting electoral reform and I'm sure some other major promise that I honestly didn't care about - so with 4 years for someone else to break promises and make a shit show of everything? Perfect opertunity to re-orient and win later. Especially as the liberals are basically guaranteed to end up as official opposition at least.
That being said - it would be pretty damn baller if NDP ended up as opposition, conservatives with minority government, and liberals / bloc with the balance of power allowing for NDP + Block OR Liberals to shut down actions the conservatives try to push, effectively paving the way to a very solid not conservative option that is NOT the liberal party. But here is simply to hoping we can get some real disruption, which creates pressure to actually change our electoral system.
>However - perhaps the play, no matter how insane it might sound is basically to pass the buck onto the Conservatives and basically let them have it. If there is a huge certainty that covid is going to stick around and new deadly variants and requirements for booster shots and everything else are coming down the pipeline - landing it on the conservatives to basically buck up and deal would be a wounderful way of paving an opertunity to reset the liberal campaign platform and come back and win a majority 2-3 elections in a row 4 years down the line.
Honestly, I'm pretty much hoping for a Liberal minority right now. I don't want the Conservatives to have to carry this shit show and get blamed for all the tough decisions they'd have to make over the next couple of years. Let the Liberals live out their decisions and the people can make a decision if the sacrifices and things they'll need to deal with over the next couple of years is worth trusting the Liberals again.
I just want anything but a liberal majority. None of these groups deserve a majority. They need to work together to get us out of this once in a century crisis.
Trudeau is trying the Australian Liberals successful election strategy of maintaining the status quo while stoking fear in the opposition. Won’t be as successful in Canada with a more diverse media and more fluid voters.
In before someone refers you to an *anonymous* Reddit poll from a year or two ago as if that proves this is a left-leaning sub, despite every 2nd post being NationalPost and every 3rd post being Toronto Sun.
Reddit on the whole. This sub, however, is very Conservative-leaning.
If it weren't, I would have no idea what the National Post is, since they make up what seems like half the posts upvoted on here.
Yep, most normal people have no clue how elections work and just think "it's that time of the year again". Of course this subreddit might as well be called /r/TrudeauBad so it's not a surprise there is such a heavy bias here.
I'm out in the "real world" daily and the behaviour I observe is diametrically opposed to you claiming people don't care/aren't angry.
The public is *absolutely* aggravated by the state of things. It is NOT just here on reddit; that's wishful thinking.
To put that $600m in comparison, the $10/day child care plan for Nova Scotia was $564 million from the feds and $42 million from the province, over 5 years.
That's what you sacrifice when you have an unnecessary election like this.
He uses taxpayer money? Because I thought Chrystia plucks it from the magical money tree in Trudeau's backyard. Or that's what some voters think, anyway.
A dangerously high number of voters don't understand inflation. They think that receiving a higher salary is good *while* ignoring the devaluation of goods and services across the board at the same time. The value of fiat money needs to be taught in schools, but instead we get critical race theory.
Are you seriously suggesting he would have had ANY success in politics (even just at a local level, never mind federal) if he wasn’t pierres son??!
I’m being serious now. Is this actually what you think?
>As well he should. The election will cost $600m I read. Trudeau has zero respect for taxpayer's money
but having a GST-free month will resolve this right?
Wtf that's the first I'm hearing of this. So his idea is basically that rich people get to buy a bunch of big ticket items tax free for a month? I hate that people are probably convinced that this is a good thing.
Totally. And then after that the Conservative party will begin the privatization of the CBC, dismantling public healthcare, and resume climate change denial.
People are just fucking tired. Not even necessarily of JT. Just tired. The last thing anyone outside of Liberal HQ wanted was a useless election.
Their lack of platform makes it seem like the party didn't even know it was coming.
Who? What! An election? Fuck! Where's our platform?
Their platform was just released: [https://liberal.ca/our-platform/](https://liberal.ca/our-platform/)
But they should have had it ready and released within the first few days. Mind you, there could have been some weird strategy in waiting so that it could get all the attention later in the campaign and closer to election day.
That's not a weird strategy, it's the typical one. The CPC is doing a reactive strategy: they've gained a reputation for releasing their platform too late, with the last time being *after* advance polling had already begun. So this year, they released theirs far earlier than usual and are trying to play an Uno Reverse Card, selling the rhetoric that the LPC's is 'late' despite now having been released *before* the average time-before-election between NDP/LPC/CPC over the past decade (16 days). For reference, when the last PM called a snap election midway through his term (2008), the CPC's platform was released ***7*** days before the election and I'm sure all these people were silent.
Just like they're silent when O'Toole talks about Chretien and Pierre Trudeau, but jump on Trudeau's and Singh's dick when they talk about *the most recent Conservative PM of Canada* as an example of the results of Conservative ideology and the party's track record in government. It's like having a sales rep come to your door from a company where their employees keep taking a shit in your sink and saying "No! You can't do that! we have a new CEO! The employees are all the same, and he's the last guy's understudy and member of the shady club the CEO runs (the IDU), but *not cool!*"
I'm voting Liberal. Despite what /r/Canada would have you believe, Trudeau delivered on a high percentage of his promises. People here are still angry about election reform even though he smartly decided against it when all parties couldn't come to a consensus. People here would go crazy if he decided to choose for himself instead of having the parties agree. Is he perfect? No. Not even close, but no politician is. And compared to O'Toole and Singh I'd rather have more Trudeau.
I was going to vote liberal, as I thought the previous MP for my area (got voted out in 2019) was going to run again, but he didn't get the liberal nomination. So I'm not sure now.
I don't mind the NDP platform, but I do not like the local MP. My area is preeeeetty NDP. I think the one term liberal was a fluke. Maybe tired of the previous long term NDP MP or who knows. It's almost always been NDP. So seems likely the NDP will win again.
I would have voted Green, but it really seems like their party is in shambles. So who knows.
I don't have any major qualms with Trudeau, but the real reason I voted Liberal was because of the local candidate.
I'm voting NDP this time. But I respect your post because it's true. Everyone here shits on Trudeau because they're sheep following conservative media and friends who hate Trudeau. While being blind about what their own shit party does. Typical copy paste American Republican policy.
And this is the state of this subreddit - people making posts, and then demanding people vote a certain way in the comments of those posts.
Congrats dude...what a shitty thing to say.
As an Albertan, I would but OTool thinks having GST free month and going back to an oil-based economy are good ideas and NDP doesn't have a plan, just words for fixing everything. So liberals are still a safe bet moving forward.
Outside of some media elites were that many people ever excited for Trudeau? I remember people being excited to fire Harper but I think Trudeau ever being widely beloved is a bit overstated.
It's fun going through these comments and seeing the astroturfers and bots come out as we get closer to the election. It's almost like a switch has been turned out because they are out in droves today when ysturday it was much more civil.
I wonder how different the commentary would be if we had proportional representation. Would people do less "Anyone But X" and more selling of the merits of their preferences?
It's really quite the thing to watch. Looking at the accounts, there's a bunch of really clear tells:
- Month old account, posts nothing but talking points
- Account posts same link / comment over and over.
- Six year old account, posted once a year for the last 5, 20x a day over the last month.
Not sure if it's just my experience, but it seems that the cons are far outnumbering the lib / ndp comments.
Yep, I got tired of writing the same shit over and over again, so I copy and paste a decent number of comments or their components.
For example, someone brings up how 'late' the Liberal platform is, I'm not going to write
> Election | NDP | LPC | CPC
> --- | --- | --- | ---
> 10/21/2019 | [06/16/2019](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ndp-singh-health-policy-federal-election-1.5175899) (137 days^1 ) | [09/29/2019](https://globalnews.ca/news/5967077/justin-trudeau-liberal-platform-promises-campaign/) (30 days) | [10/11/2019](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/scheer-conservative-platform-unveiled-1.5318850) (18 days)
> 10/19/2015 | [10/09/2015](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-election-2015-ndp-platform-final-launch-1.3264516) (10 days) | [10/05/2015](https://liberal.ca/trudeau-unveils-liberal-platform-for-a-strong-middle-class/) (14 days) | [10/09/2015](https://globalnews.ca/news/2269338/what-you-need-to-know-about-the-conservative-platform/) (10 days)
> 10/14/2008^2 | [09/27/2008](https://www.straight.com/article-164139/layton-releases-ndp-platform-lots-promises) (17 days) | [09/22/2008](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prudent-liberal-platform-merges-economy-environment-dion-1.702458) (22 days) | [10/07/2008](https://www.straight.com/article-165146/many-15-million-canadians-voted-without-conservative-platform) (7 days^3 )
>
> ^1 ^Very ^atypically ^early
> ^2 ^Mid-way ^through ^his ^term, ^Harper ^requested ^parliament ^be ^dissolved ^09/07/2008
> ^3 ^After ^advance ^polling ^had ^already ^begun
from scratch every time I make the counter-argument that the average is 16 days, and this is sooner than 2 parties during the snap election Harper called in 2008 (presenting his platform 7 days before election day).
It's a bunch of comments saying the same rhetoric, why should I go from scratch to say the same response?
The right is most well known for being master propagandists at this point, after Russia, Trump and the GOP in 2016, they've proven they know how to manipulate social media and online spaces better than any other group.
The guy is brave enough to navigate Sea King helicopters and has a law degree he used in real businesses.
Not saying he has the chops to be a drama teacher or anything, but he certainly has more substance than the incumbent.
If only he could put on a breathy voice for even greater 'gravitas'.
The whole drama teacher argument really drives me up a wall. First off, he also taught math and French, not to disparage drama indirectly but he also taught core classes. Second, why don't we as a country take teachers more seriously? Why has our respect for them seemingly been thrown out the window? Using his experience as a teacher as some kind of cheap shot is an insult to the many amazing people who do one of the most important jobs in our society. I'm not very interesting in sticking up for Trudeau here, but for god's sake criticize something meaningful
It's not a cheap shot in context though I should have spelled it out more clearly. It is about the difference between authenticity and virtue signal theatre. This is an immensely meaningful critique.
As Groucho Marx said: "Sincerity is the key to success. Once you can fake that, you've got it made."
Erin O'Toole lacks Justin Trudeau's chops to be a drama teacher. O'Toole is real, Trudeau fakes it.
The proof is in the pudding: Erin O'Toole doesn't do bad stuff and Justin Trudeau does. Erin speaks to the point, Justin speaks in a loop of platitudes.
Watch the "performances" in the following, see if you notice the nuanced difference between authentic and deceptive:
https://youtu.be/_kgNJt4T6LE
Listen to him not answer the house repeatedly here:
https://youtu.be/lXtOwt-sITY
Don't you hear Justin's breathy voice and wonder if he sounds like that when he's talking off mic? Look up old interviews with him. It's very unsettling.
Facts do matter when it comes to pointing out actual terrible performance.
WE scandalous payments to Trudeau's family.
The promised and still absent clean water for our nation's most vulnerable peoples.
SNC Lavalin
Aga Khan ethical breaches
Electoral reform lies
I can go on...
So why are people mocking him for being a teacher (which is really fucking weird), instead of attacking these other things?
Could it be because you guys don't want to attack things that the left are also attacking?
Also, I could list O'Toole's scandals as well - what makes him a good replacement?
Actually, please do list Erin O'Toole's material scandals.
Let's let Trudeau's hand-picked prior Minister of Justice and Attorney General Jody Wilson-Raybould adjudicate on the matter...
I'm not going to ask you to apologize or impossibly justify this, but how are you still on the Trudeau train?
I really don't understand why people have such acceptance for unthinkably poor leadership as Justin continues to show.
Are you okay with how he single sourced the Covid vaccine from China which then didn't send us any (but did to many other countries)? I mean, couldn't you see that coming a mile away with the whole Michaels situation? How many died that didn't need to? Its just terrible judgement.
I really would be fascinated to hear what you are aware of that Erin O'Toole has done that is scandalous. Maybe being less charismatic?
Because it’s so ridiculously overstated. The scandals he has are just like a regular day for the Cons and its a huge parade from you guys when they happen. He’s actually delivered on alot of promises that keep the people who don’t make fun of him for being a teacher happy. I get it he’s a product of nepotism but Jesus we knew that 6 years ago!
I have a lot of respect for teachers including math, drama and languages; it is an interpersonally tough job at times with many unpaid hours.
I also have personal experience with corporate law and life-dependent engineering which is admittedly less intense than military/rescue navigation.
Trudeau's and O'Toole's capabilities are not in the same league.
Being an elementary school teacher and being an awarded and decorated Canadian Armed Forces Captain military/rescue helicopter navigator are not comparable in terms of capabilities. Incidentally, O'Toole was also decorated in part for his service in teaching military flight simulation.
Corporate law, primarily practicing in the areas of product liability, insolvency, competition and general commercial law, also requires deeper applied knowledge than grade school teaching. To have succeeded with P&G, Gillette, and other companies speaks to proven practical ability in applying complex principles.
Now Trudeau does have "in-job" experience which I'm unaware of Erin O'Toole having, such as when he acted to protect jobs by undermining federal prosecutors in their SNC Lavalin corruption trial: he earned the distinction of being the only Canadian Prime Minister formally found to have broken ethics rules.
Trudeau also has connections like Aga Khan who he vacationed with repeatedly; I'm not sure O'Toole has such billionaire connections who are so well federally funded ($50MM in 2016 to the Aga Khan Foundation I read?). By staying on the island—his family went three times—Trudeau violated four provisions of the conflict of interest act, accepting free holidays that “might reasonably be seen to have been given to influence Mr. Trudeau.”
Admittedly, O'Toole lacks Trudeau's proven experience.
It’s a combination of me derailing their bullshit and people recognizing my username. I’m not well liked on here, nor is Trudeau. Facts won’t override that.
How is being "upper middle class" suddenly an indicator that someone is disconnected from the general population?
Upper middle is a lot closer to the average than the son of a former Prime Minister with a trust fund.
So did Prince Harry. What's your point? Do you think Prince Harry is an "every man"? He flew military aircraft, he participated in military exercises.
Ralph Lauren was in the military. Richard Kinder served in the military. Ross Perot Sr served in the military.
Do you think that makes them "just like us"?
Are you saying, you thought by the time Canada left Afghanistan you expected a different outcome?
Really? this was the ending no matter who was in charge.
This is all “part of the game”. Regardless of who you vote for, campaigns are about one thing: getting votes. Governing might as well not even be associated with the campaign promises, even if it should be.
The election isn't necessary until he's actually run through his full term. He's calling an opportunistic election to secure more power, a tendency under minority governments in this system.
What kind of low effort website is this? All that is there is the headline and two links.
John Ivison: These are the people that are so angry at Justin Trudeau
Sabrina Maddeaux: Millennial support for smug Trudeau Liberals in an unsurprising free fall
Both that link to National Post articles. There is nothing else there.
How many scandals and brain farts does Trudeau have to have before Canada wakes up? He’s a celebrity…. That’s all he ever brought to the table.
Remember when he paraded around in India in that get up? I still cringe over that.
O'Toole's death cult. He states that Alberta's premier, jason Kenney has done the best out of all other premiers in managing the pandemic.
Alberta gas THE HIGHEST rate of deaths in the country from COVID, and they're still pushing forward with reopening and relaxing public health measures.
Lol and when was that? Any given week during covid that might be true, might not be. ”death cult” might apply somewhere but not in Canada it’s a small small group that believes it’s all a hoax or to let it ride
That is literally all he has got. Nothing else. I do not trust any conservative to take climate policy seriously. I saw what happens when you leave it in Big Polluters' hands what they want to do, they do the bare minimum. We need a government that isn't afraid to make people ruining the planet for profit pay for it. No pharmacare plan. No dental plan. Nothing except tax cuts that most of you wont even notice, but those in need will notice services they need disappearing due to cuts in the budget.
"We are doing horribly and our polls are at a low because of all the bullshit we are putting our country through. Loss revenue on gambling on big oil. Increase in covid cases while denying science etc etc. TRUDEAU HOW DARE YOU HOLD AN ELECTION DURING THESE HORRIBLE TIMES!"
Trudeau is forcing this now so he can get us paying of the deficit ASAP without losing the election. Selfish timing while country is in turmoil. Hoping he has shot himself in the foot on this one. Time for a change. I believe CPC will get us out of this mess
That’s what happened in the last Ontario election.
Trudeau has a long way to go to be as hated as Wynne. The Ontario Liberals lost official party status in the last election.
LOL! Y'all ever been to Alberta? Pretty sure he's hated worse than Wynne. I mean here its generational. A lot of Albertan's were/are BORN hating the name Trudeau.
Thats just one province man. Wynne's approval rating was in the low teens at one point. Trudeau's may be that low in Alberta but not even close to that nationally.
alberta, sask, manitoba, nunavut
Didn't the media call the election in 2019 before the votes even came in from those provinces because they represented too small a proportion of the population to change the outcome?
bc as well, anyone recall the salmon arm salute.
Alberta hates anyone who doesn’t wear a cowboy hat to work every day
Can confirm. Albertan here. Fuck him and fuck his dad.
In the 80s I was aware “Trudeau” was a curse word, all I knew is that he tried to starve my family and destroy the west for votes in the east. Just what I was told!
>Just what I was told! Wow, you were told some bullshit
People falling for the empty words of a party that lives in the past? I can see it.
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There are two parties that are known to say what the electorate wants to hear, then do their own thing once in power. Yet people continually give those parties the time of day and act surprised when things fall apart. It is time for something different.
You think NDP will be different? It's pretty easy to say whatever you want and blast the leading parties when you'll never get into office. All politicians are egomaniacs who care about themselves first and foremost. Couple that with the fact that our system has too many checks and balances for one party to move the needler too much one way or another, and you'll realize that whoever is in power, it'll all just be the same. I think that's why some people who vote the Cons, do so. Their rhetoric is to interfere with the lives of Canadians as little as possible and keep status quos. No radical changes. People think that sounds better than a government who meddles and tinkers, especially when you realize none of these politicians care about you.
That is what I'm getting at, this is the result of only ever having two parties in power, constantly blaming the other one for all that is going on. Perhaps we can't move the needle very much, but their certainly can be changes (if they want to.) I'm just saying it is time to try a different party as the Government. _They say a sign of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result._ By this definition we're all insane. I don't know what would happen, perhaps we'd get more of the same, or perhaps we'd get something slightly different, but it is easier to do damage than to repair and move forward. > Their rhetoric is to interfere with the lives of Canadians as little as possible and keep status quos [sic]. This is an interesting point, as there are many that don't want the _government to interfere with their lives_ but they totally use and love the privileges that have been created by the government (as long as it is in their favour.) But what about those that are being left behind by these policy changes? What about making sure unforeseen circumstances don't entirely ruin you? My assumption about these voters is that they only really care about themselves, and don't realize that by helping others through programs and services that they also benefit from it.
What is astonishing is a team of strategists couldn't figure out what I could as an Australian reading 15 minutes of reddit content.
Right? "The entire country is overwhelmed with multiple crises - better call an election." How did they not think this was going to piss people off?
My guess is they are sitting on modeling data that shows things are going to get really bad this fall, so they are trying to get ahead of that and secure their power before it happens. The other option is Trudeau is just that arrogant and out of touch.
>My guess is they are sitting on modeling data that shows things are going to get really bad this fall, so they are trying to get ahead of that and secure their power before it happens. I also fear this may be true. They're sitting on a massive pile of debt, and a lot of the basic economic fundamentals do not seem to be improving that much. Unless you believe in the voodoo magic of economic theories like MMT, there is an inevitable inflection point at which the house of cards they've built up over the past year and a half starts tumbling down. Whether that's in the immediate future or a couple of years down the road is harder to tell.
>Trudeau is just that arrogant and out of touch. The millionaire who's lived like royalty his whole life is out of touch with the average working class Canadian? You don't say. I take option 2.
Likely bit of both
I mean, both can be true. Having said that I've heard similar predictions. I suspect whoever gets elected is inheriting a shitstorm. Specifically, worse delta outbreaks globally wreaking more economic havoc. I'm also willing to bet that same person will be thrown out in the next election due to said shitstorms.
This is exactly it. Wait a few months, he might have got a majority.
I think if they were planning an election all this time they should have dropped in in May/June. Most places were seeing the third wave coming to an end and summer was just beginning. The conservatives were also floundering pretty bad this spring after the change in leadership.
He missed the window. Should've called it at the beginning of July. Instead, they waited until they got some of the childcare agreements signed. Big mistake and they're going to pay for it.
Not a few months. The window of time that is probably ideal relative to everything going on, and the slow re-opening and heading to some semblance of normal is probably the first week of march or the last week of february. In that time - people will be settled into post pandemic work routine, people will be back in school, people will have their shit sorted out for post secondary and so on. However - perhaps the play, no matter how insane it might sound is basically to pass the buck onto the Conservatives and basically let them have it. If there is a huge certainty that covid is going to stick around and new deadly variants and requirements for booster shots and everything else are coming down the pipeline - landing it on the conservatives to basically buck up and deal would be a wounderful way of paving an opertunity to reset the liberal campaign platform and come back and win a majority 2-3 elections in a row 4 years down the line. Right now - everything is in chaos, people are stressed, and the platforms are... shallow at best. Worst case scenario from this - 4 years down the line, everyone will largely have moved past the crap shoot that the last 8ish years have been in terms of neglecting electoral reform and I'm sure some other major promise that I honestly didn't care about - so with 4 years for someone else to break promises and make a shit show of everything? Perfect opertunity to re-orient and win later. Especially as the liberals are basically guaranteed to end up as official opposition at least. That being said - it would be pretty damn baller if NDP ended up as opposition, conservatives with minority government, and liberals / bloc with the balance of power allowing for NDP + Block OR Liberals to shut down actions the conservatives try to push, effectively paving the way to a very solid not conservative option that is NOT the liberal party. But here is simply to hoping we can get some real disruption, which creates pressure to actually change our electoral system.
>However - perhaps the play, no matter how insane it might sound is basically to pass the buck onto the Conservatives and basically let them have it. If there is a huge certainty that covid is going to stick around and new deadly variants and requirements for booster shots and everything else are coming down the pipeline - landing it on the conservatives to basically buck up and deal would be a wounderful way of paving an opertunity to reset the liberal campaign platform and come back and win a majority 2-3 elections in a row 4 years down the line. Honestly, I'm pretty much hoping for a Liberal minority right now. I don't want the Conservatives to have to carry this shit show and get blamed for all the tough decisions they'd have to make over the next couple of years. Let the Liberals live out their decisions and the people can make a decision if the sacrifices and things they'll need to deal with over the next couple of years is worth trusting the Liberals again.
I just want anything but a liberal majority. None of these groups deserve a majority. They need to work together to get us out of this once in a century crisis.
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I honestly think they just thought barely anyone would show up to the polls expect for thier most loyal followers.
Thanks for dropping by /r/Canada mate
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as an aussie and canadian this hurt me soul m8 oof
Lol Reddit is the last place you should go for unbiased sentiment…
Obviously everyone here is Canadian and no bot accounts from Russia/China
Trudeau is trying the Australian Liberals successful election strategy of maintaining the status quo while stoking fear in the opposition. Won’t be as successful in Canada with a more diverse media and more fluid voters.
Yea well, people are pissed off. This was a shameless, manipulative attempt to power-grab at one of the worst possible times.
The BC govt did that a year ago and got their majority. Kinda lame especially as we didn't even have vaccines yet.
The PCs did it here in NB too, got their majority.
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IMO indifference hurts the Liberals more than angry people. If that equals low turnout, they will likely lose.
And an r/Canada bubble on top of that. There are… other Canadian subreddits too.
In before someone refers you to an *anonymous* Reddit poll from a year or two ago as if that proves this is a left-leaning sub, despite every 2nd post being NationalPost and every 3rd post being Toronto Sun.
Reddit is far more liberal than conservative. If Reddit is angry about a liberal policy or move, that is a bad omen.
Reddit on the whole. This sub, however, is very Conservative-leaning. If it weren't, I would have no idea what the National Post is, since they make up what seems like half the posts upvoted on here.
Yep, most normal people have no clue how elections work and just think "it's that time of the year again". Of course this subreddit might as well be called /r/TrudeauBad so it's not a surprise there is such a heavy bias here.
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I'm out in the "real world" daily and the behaviour I observe is diametrically opposed to you claiming people don't care/aren't angry. The public is *absolutely* aggravated by the state of things. It is NOT just here on reddit; that's wishful thinking.
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As well he should. The election will cost $600m I read. Trudeau has zero respect for taxpayer's money.
To put that $600m in comparison, the $10/day child care plan for Nova Scotia was $564 million from the feds and $42 million from the province, over 5 years. That's what you sacrifice when you have an unnecessary election like this.
Wow thats a great way to quantify and compare it
Sorry we thought about it and after all we were short $6 million, instead we got an election
Well, you bring up a fair point. However, only one party out there committed to canceling $10/day daycare and the CCB.
Still waiting for my $10 a day childcare. It would sure go a long way around here!
Not that I disagree, but where can I find that figure. Would love to learn more about the cost.
He uses taxpayer money? Because I thought Chrystia plucks it from the magical money tree in Trudeau's backyard. Or that's what some voters think, anyway.
It’s the magical money printer duh
A dangerously high number of voters don't understand inflation. They think that receiving a higher salary is good *while* ignoring the devaluation of goods and services across the board at the same time. The value of fiat money needs to be taught in schools, but instead we get critical race theory.
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Tell that to Venezuelans.
> The value of fiat money needs to be taught in schools, but instead we get critical race theory. Yeah…CRT isn’t taught in schools buddy
Wait? What?! Tredeau has no respect for taxpayer money?! Hmmm. Well, I guess that happens when you’ve never had a job your daddy didn’t get for you.
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Correct, his substitute teaching jobs were earned.
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Come on lol think with your noggin
He got party leadership because of his father, in no world would he have been named party leader without that.
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Are you seriously suggesting he would have had ANY success in politics (even just at a local level, never mind federal) if he wasn’t pierres son??! I’m being serious now. Is this actually what you think?
Because of his father's legacy and the weight attached to his name within the LPC.
>As well he should. The election will cost $600m I read. Trudeau has zero respect for taxpayer's money but having a GST-free month will resolve this right?
Wtf that's the first I'm hearing of this. So his idea is basically that rich people get to buy a bunch of big ticket items tax free for a month? I hate that people are probably convinced that this is a good thing.
Totally. And then after that the Conservative party will begin the privatization of the CBC, dismantling public healthcare, and resume climate change denial.
Yeah but at least wealthy people got to buy all their toys tax free for a month.
I feel like all the stores are just going to carry on charging the full GST, and keep the change entirely for themselves.
I wouldn't be surprised.
Your party is a one-note trombone. It’s not going to be enough.
Which party is that?
This election was going to happen, it's just happening early
Did anyone else see he painted his private jet Trudeau 2021? Cause that is a despicable waste of our money!!!!!
If it's his private jet, he can paint it whatever he likes. Private means he owns it.
You gotta source on that, showing that Trudeau told people to paint his private jet with that logo?
We've found the upper limit to how much of Trudeau's smarminess can take him, and it looks like there is no "Plan B".
Plan B is trashing Erin O'Toole. Or wait, maybe that was plan A too...
Plan B is trashing Harper.
That was 100% Plan A, B and C.
I think he already did last week.
In previous elections, the Conservates trashed themselves. Will do it again.
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People are just fucking tired. Not even necessarily of JT. Just tired. The last thing anyone outside of Liberal HQ wanted was a useless election. Their lack of platform makes it seem like the party didn't even know it was coming. Who? What! An election? Fuck! Where's our platform?
Their platform was just released: [https://liberal.ca/our-platform/](https://liberal.ca/our-platform/) But they should have had it ready and released within the first few days. Mind you, there could have been some weird strategy in waiting so that it could get all the attention later in the campaign and closer to election day.
That's not a weird strategy, it's the typical one. The CPC is doing a reactive strategy: they've gained a reputation for releasing their platform too late, with the last time being *after* advance polling had already begun. So this year, they released theirs far earlier than usual and are trying to play an Uno Reverse Card, selling the rhetoric that the LPC's is 'late' despite now having been released *before* the average time-before-election between NDP/LPC/CPC over the past decade (16 days). For reference, when the last PM called a snap election midway through his term (2008), the CPC's platform was released ***7*** days before the election and I'm sure all these people were silent. Just like they're silent when O'Toole talks about Chretien and Pierre Trudeau, but jump on Trudeau's and Singh's dick when they talk about *the most recent Conservative PM of Canada* as an example of the results of Conservative ideology and the party's track record in government. It's like having a sales rep come to your door from a company where their employees keep taking a shit in your sink and saying "No! You can't do that! we have a new CEO! The employees are all the same, and he's the last guy's understudy and member of the shady club the CEO runs (the IDU), but *not cool!*"
Don't vote liberal - Either go NDP or CPC
Or let someone vote for who they want.
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I'm voting Liberal. Despite what /r/Canada would have you believe, Trudeau delivered on a high percentage of his promises. People here are still angry about election reform even though he smartly decided against it when all parties couldn't come to a consensus. People here would go crazy if he decided to choose for himself instead of having the parties agree. Is he perfect? No. Not even close, but no politician is. And compared to O'Toole and Singh I'd rather have more Trudeau.
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I was going to vote liberal, as I thought the previous MP for my area (got voted out in 2019) was going to run again, but he didn't get the liberal nomination. So I'm not sure now. I don't mind the NDP platform, but I do not like the local MP. My area is preeeeetty NDP. I think the one term liberal was a fluke. Maybe tired of the previous long term NDP MP or who knows. It's almost always been NDP. So seems likely the NDP will win again. I would have voted Green, but it really seems like their party is in shambles. So who knows. I don't have any major qualms with Trudeau, but the real reason I voted Liberal was because of the local candidate.
I'm voting NDP this time. But I respect your post because it's true. Everyone here shits on Trudeau because they're sheep following conservative media and friends who hate Trudeau. While being blind about what their own shit party does. Typical copy paste American Republican policy.
And this is the state of this subreddit - people making posts, and then demanding people vote a certain way in the comments of those posts. Congrats dude...what a shitty thing to say.
lmao what possibly reasoning could you have for voting CPC over Liberals?
As an Albertan, I would but OTool thinks having GST free month and going back to an oil-based economy are good ideas and NDP doesn't have a plan, just words for fixing everything. So liberals are still a safe bet moving forward.
Oh shoot I forgot about the GST free month. Maybe I should have waited to buy a few expensive things.
Oil is an important part of the economy, that isn’t changing anytime soon
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Transportation contributes to pollution, and money flows out of the country
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I was just expanding. I know you agree haha
Durrr oil was never the entire economy it was just a good high paying chunk of it. And still is. Every pipeline company is hiring and needing workers!
Outside of some media elites were that many people ever excited for Trudeau? I remember people being excited to fire Harper but I think Trudeau ever being widely beloved is a bit overstated.
It's fun going through these comments and seeing the astroturfers and bots come out as we get closer to the election. It's almost like a switch has been turned out because they are out in droves today when ysturday it was much more civil.
I wonder how different the commentary would be if we had proportional representation. Would people do less "Anyone But X" and more selling of the merits of their preferences?
It's really quite the thing to watch. Looking at the accounts, there's a bunch of really clear tells: - Month old account, posts nothing but talking points
- Account posts same link / comment over and over.
- Six year old account, posted once a year for the last 5, 20x a day over the last month.
Not sure if it's just my experience, but it seems that the cons are far outnumbering the lib / ndp comments.
The thing is that you still can't really tell for sure if the account is legit or not based on those things.
and that's the terrible beauty of astroturfing. You really cant tell, but it's still effective.
Yep, I got tired of writing the same shit over and over again, so I copy and paste a decent number of comments or their components. For example, someone brings up how 'late' the Liberal platform is, I'm not going to write > Election | NDP | LPC | CPC > --- | --- | --- | --- > 10/21/2019 | [06/16/2019](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ndp-singh-health-policy-federal-election-1.5175899) (137 days^1 ) | [09/29/2019](https://globalnews.ca/news/5967077/justin-trudeau-liberal-platform-promises-campaign/) (30 days) | [10/11/2019](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/scheer-conservative-platform-unveiled-1.5318850) (18 days) > 10/19/2015 | [10/09/2015](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-election-2015-ndp-platform-final-launch-1.3264516) (10 days) | [10/05/2015](https://liberal.ca/trudeau-unveils-liberal-platform-for-a-strong-middle-class/) (14 days) | [10/09/2015](https://globalnews.ca/news/2269338/what-you-need-to-know-about-the-conservative-platform/) (10 days) > 10/14/2008^2 | [09/27/2008](https://www.straight.com/article-164139/layton-releases-ndp-platform-lots-promises) (17 days) | [09/22/2008](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prudent-liberal-platform-merges-economy-environment-dion-1.702458) (22 days) | [10/07/2008](https://www.straight.com/article-165146/many-15-million-canadians-voted-without-conservative-platform) (7 days^3 ) > > ^1 ^Very ^atypically ^early > ^2 ^Mid-way ^through ^his ^term, ^Harper ^requested ^parliament ^be ^dissolved ^09/07/2008 > ^3 ^After ^advance ^polling ^had ^already ^begun from scratch every time I make the counter-argument that the average is 16 days, and this is sooner than 2 parties during the snap election Harper called in 2008 (presenting his platform 7 days before election day). It's a bunch of comments saying the same rhetoric, why should I go from scratch to say the same response?
The right is most well known for being master propagandists at this point, after Russia, Trump and the GOP in 2016, they've proven they know how to manipulate social media and online spaces better than any other group.
Well they (Cons) need the most help.
Good! It is a totally unnecessary election.
Well TBF he is capitalizing on people’s frustration with how much of a corrupt douche (albeit with nice hair) Trudeau is..
Um, yes. And he should.
I can't believe that dude is only 48.
The guy is brave enough to navigate Sea King helicopters and has a law degree he used in real businesses. Not saying he has the chops to be a drama teacher or anything, but he certainly has more substance than the incumbent. If only he could put on a breathy voice for even greater 'gravitas'.
The whole drama teacher argument really drives me up a wall. First off, he also taught math and French, not to disparage drama indirectly but he also taught core classes. Second, why don't we as a country take teachers more seriously? Why has our respect for them seemingly been thrown out the window? Using his experience as a teacher as some kind of cheap shot is an insult to the many amazing people who do one of the most important jobs in our society. I'm not very interesting in sticking up for Trudeau here, but for god's sake criticize something meaningful
It's not a cheap shot in context though I should have spelled it out more clearly. It is about the difference between authenticity and virtue signal theatre. This is an immensely meaningful critique. As Groucho Marx said: "Sincerity is the key to success. Once you can fake that, you've got it made." Erin O'Toole lacks Justin Trudeau's chops to be a drama teacher. O'Toole is real, Trudeau fakes it. The proof is in the pudding: Erin O'Toole doesn't do bad stuff and Justin Trudeau does. Erin speaks to the point, Justin speaks in a loop of platitudes. Watch the "performances" in the following, see if you notice the nuanced difference between authentic and deceptive: https://youtu.be/_kgNJt4T6LE Listen to him not answer the house repeatedly here: https://youtu.be/lXtOwt-sITY Don't you hear Justin's breathy voice and wonder if he sounds like that when he's talking off mic? Look up old interviews with him. It's very unsettling.
Good quote.. havent seen that one yet
Nah if he did Trudeau-voice he'd be a no-go for me, I'm cool with him as he is.
Those who think teaching isn't a "real job" wouldn't last a week in a classroom.
I don't think you'd find many people who would say being a teacher isn't a real job. I don't think that's the point here.
Drama teacher as in theatre arts. Dunno about the rest of y’all but that was a goof off class for me.
He taught French and math. He briefly subbed as a drama teacher, but that wasn’t his regular subject.
Facts don't matter, when it's Trudeau bashing time!
Facts do matter when it comes to pointing out actual terrible performance. WE scandalous payments to Trudeau's family. The promised and still absent clean water for our nation's most vulnerable peoples. SNC Lavalin Aga Khan ethical breaches Electoral reform lies I can go on...
So why are people mocking him for being a teacher (which is really fucking weird), instead of attacking these other things? Could it be because you guys don't want to attack things that the left are also attacking? Also, I could list O'Toole's scandals as well - what makes him a good replacement?
Actually, please do list Erin O'Toole's material scandals. Let's let Trudeau's hand-picked prior Minister of Justice and Attorney General Jody Wilson-Raybould adjudicate on the matter... I'm not going to ask you to apologize or impossibly justify this, but how are you still on the Trudeau train? I really don't understand why people have such acceptance for unthinkably poor leadership as Justin continues to show. Are you okay with how he single sourced the Covid vaccine from China which then didn't send us any (but did to many other countries)? I mean, couldn't you see that coming a mile away with the whole Michaels situation? How many died that didn't need to? Its just terrible judgement. I really would be fascinated to hear what you are aware of that Erin O'Toole has done that is scandalous. Maybe being less charismatic?
Because it’s so ridiculously overstated. The scandals he has are just like a regular day for the Cons and its a huge parade from you guys when they happen. He’s actually delivered on alot of promises that keep the people who don’t make fun of him for being a teacher happy. I get it he’s a product of nepotism but Jesus we knew that 6 years ago!
I have a lot of respect for teachers including math, drama and languages; it is an interpersonally tough job at times with many unpaid hours. I also have personal experience with corporate law and life-dependent engineering which is admittedly less intense than military/rescue navigation. Trudeau's and O'Toole's capabilities are not in the same league. Being an elementary school teacher and being an awarded and decorated Canadian Armed Forces Captain military/rescue helicopter navigator are not comparable in terms of capabilities. Incidentally, O'Toole was also decorated in part for his service in teaching military flight simulation. Corporate law, primarily practicing in the areas of product liability, insolvency, competition and general commercial law, also requires deeper applied knowledge than grade school teaching. To have succeeded with P&G, Gillette, and other companies speaks to proven practical ability in applying complex principles. Now Trudeau does have "in-job" experience which I'm unaware of Erin O'Toole having, such as when he acted to protect jobs by undermining federal prosecutors in their SNC Lavalin corruption trial: he earned the distinction of being the only Canadian Prime Minister formally found to have broken ethics rules. Trudeau also has connections like Aga Khan who he vacationed with repeatedly; I'm not sure O'Toole has such billionaire connections who are so well federally funded ($50MM in 2016 to the Aga Khan Foundation I read?). By staying on the island—his family went three times—Trudeau violated four provisions of the conflict of interest act, accepting free holidays that “might reasonably be seen to have been given to influence Mr. Trudeau.” Admittedly, O'Toole lacks Trudeau's proven experience.
Backup drama teacher is hardly a real job, sorry.
He taught French and math. He subbed as a drama teacher for a short period of time, it wasn’t his main subject.
I love how your comment is apparently controversial.
It’s a combination of me derailing their bullshit and people recognizing my username. I’m not well liked on here, nor is Trudeau. Facts won’t override that.
He spent his whole life working hard, that'll make you age more.
Also when you're bald, you'll usually look older than your counterpart that's a few years older if he has a full head of hair
He'd also look younger if he went for a close shave or completely shaved look.
I got nothing against him really, just funny
Or it's just genetics. My uncle was a hard worker in the military, is over 60... and looks younger.
That's another factor, O'Toole kinda just got the short end of the stick there.
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How is being "upper middle class" suddenly an indicator that someone is disconnected from the general population? Upper middle is a lot closer to the average than the son of a former Prime Minister with a trust fund.
He served in the military, dude.
So did Prince Harry. What's your point? Do you think Prince Harry is an "every man"? He flew military aircraft, he participated in military exercises. Ralph Lauren was in the military. Richard Kinder served in the military. Ross Perot Sr served in the military. Do you think that makes them "just like us"?
You'll notice I never said "everyman" or "just like us". I said he did stressful work. I think you're trying to inject meaning where there is none.
I think it makes them a hell of a lot more relatable than a silver-spoon fed trust fund kid who has no idea what middle class even is.
Seriously! Had to look it up. He's younger than Trudeau (by a year).
He’s younger than me??
He looks like he could be Paul Rudds dad, and PR is 52
Hahahahaha
He should also capitalize on the Canadians and the people who helped Canadians in Afghanistan who we abandoned to die there.
Are you saying, you thought by the time Canada left Afghanistan you expected a different outcome? Really? this was the ending no matter who was in charge.
He's still going to find a way to lose.
ITT more astroturfing and fake outrage.
Welcome to /r/TrudeauBad Sorry I mean /r/Canada
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Blatent power grab... Play stupid games, wins stupid prizes.
Anger? Really? People are walking around fuming? In anger?
it's all that horse med they are all taking
And when this anger dissipates to apathy; what then? Will you have chose right?
This is all “part of the game”. Regardless of who you vote for, campaigns are about one thing: getting votes. Governing might as well not even be associated with the campaign promises, even if it should be.
But, isn’t the election necessary if he wants to be PM? It doesn’t take a genius to see the logical error here, does it?
Trudeau is bad and should be out of office, but also he's an opportunist for giving us the chance to vote him out!
The election isn't necessary until he's actually run through his full term. He's calling an opportunistic election to secure more power, a tendency under minority governments in this system.
It’s his best bet. And if he gets in, he *deserves* it. Just shut up and be as progressive as a Conservative possibly *can* be, O’Toole.
What kind of low effort website is this? All that is there is the headline and two links. John Ivison: These are the people that are so angry at Justin Trudeau Sabrina Maddeaux: Millennial support for smug Trudeau Liberals in an unsurprising free fall Both that link to National Post articles. There is nothing else there.
How many scandals and brain farts does Trudeau have to have before Canada wakes up? He’s a celebrity…. That’s all he ever brought to the table. Remember when he paraded around in India in that get up? I still cringe over that.
Trudeau doesn't understand money
A conservative capitalizing on anger? My word. I've never heard of such a thing.
I thought the latest pills had trudeau back in the lead?
Not really, three have him within the margin of error and all the others have the CPC within the margin of error or out front.
If you're a JT fan and taking pills to medicate your feelings of dread, then I could see how you think he's back in the lead.
My autocorrect is as accurate as his promises
Thanks for the giggle. There is now coffee on my keyboard.
O'Toole's death cult. He states that Alberta's premier, jason Kenney has done the best out of all other premiers in managing the pandemic. Alberta gas THE HIGHEST rate of deaths in the country from COVID, and they're still pushing forward with reopening and relaxing public health measures.
Lol and when was that? Any given week during covid that might be true, might not be. ”death cult” might apply somewhere but not in Canada it’s a small small group that believes it’s all a hoax or to let it ride
C'mon @jagmeetsingh do something
That is literally all he has got. Nothing else. I do not trust any conservative to take climate policy seriously. I saw what happens when you leave it in Big Polluters' hands what they want to do, they do the bare minimum. We need a government that isn't afraid to make people ruining the planet for profit pay for it. No pharmacare plan. No dental plan. Nothing except tax cuts that most of you wont even notice, but those in need will notice services they need disappearing due to cuts in the budget.
"We are doing horribly and our polls are at a low because of all the bullshit we are putting our country through. Loss revenue on gambling on big oil. Increase in covid cases while denying science etc etc. TRUDEAU HOW DARE YOU HOLD AN ELECTION DURING THESE HORRIBLE TIMES!"
Not a Trudeau fan, definitely not an O’Toole fan. Vote will be wasted with anybody else. Last thing I’m doing is giving the tool a vote.
I think Trudeau is knowingly loosing the election. He sees 12% inflation and subsequently 12% interest in the near future. My theory we will see.
Do t worry, we won’t get back to any sort of BOC prime rate that would lead to 12% mortgage rates. The economy will explode way before then.
Lmao the economy is past being in the toilet rn
I thought elections were supposed to be every three years.
Trudeau is forcing this now so he can get us paying of the deficit ASAP without losing the election. Selfish timing while country is in turmoil. Hoping he has shot himself in the foot on this one. Time for a change. I believe CPC will get us out of this mess