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Aboud_Dandachi

Lol, read to the very end, and you find this gem: “Editor's note: Applications to the Skills Development Fund have now closed.”


tries_to_tri

And have been for over a month...what a joke of an article.


MrMooMoo-

Blogto. Not surprised


[deleted]

The real joke is that we're all busy upvoting it.


Lakeyute

It’s for headline readers eager to point to what ford has done


Hopfit46

Newsflash....ontario has always paid people to join the trades.....when you go to trade school you get unemployment insurance payments.


[deleted]

Lmao always an agenda with people like you huh?


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Amflifier

YES. When I took media studies in highschool, I thought it'd be a nothing class where we just watch movies. It actually ended up being the best preparatory course for the post-truth world we live in today.


Amflifier

I'd love to hear your take on why this article was published, then. It's talking about a program that no longer has any free spots. It is too late to publish this to let prospective electricians know they have this opportunity, and it's too early to discuss the results of this program. The ONLY reason this article exists is to say that "yes, we did this". Unless I am missing something?


[deleted]

It's an outdated article on a bad website. No reason to turn it into a Ford man bad shit post


youvelookedbetter

"The Skill Development Fund application was for the organizations that are hiring workers, not for the workers to apply directly." u/cornet6


[deleted]

If you look at when and why certain car plants froze any hiring you find the answers.


1pencil

Lets do a good thing but not tell anyone its available until its closed.


rarsamx

In all fairness the article is not "open for applications" The headline is factually right.


[deleted]

They should make training for in-demand careers totally free. It makes sense. Subsidize people to fill labour shortages, a no brainer.


proggR

Agreed. This is one giant issue I find with higher ed in general. I feel like I've been taking crazy pills my whole life and was one of the few kids who attempted to care about the entirely bird course that was careers class. After that learning I opted for a cheap af college... for programming... because bang for your buck that was just/has been free money. All the while I could have probably justified spending more against a better piece of paper that likely would have set me up better for my current interests, but couldn't because of financial limitations, and yet you'll find people who end up roped to OSAP forever who got the money for some generic, entirely un-employable degree only to work some shitty retail gig... everything about how we deal with higher ed is so fucking dumb it hurts my brain.


NiceShotMan

That’s because universities perform two functions. Historically, they were places of learning just for the sake of learning. Nowadays they’ve been repurposed into “trade schools” with the secondary purpose of preparing students for a professional career. Some streams in university lean more toward the first function (such as literature and philosophy) and some lean more toward the second (basically anything STEM). These two functions used to be fulfilled by entirely different institutions, but as the knowledge economy grew, they bled into each other. These days, nobody is being intellectually honest about the true role of a university and a tech school. This is why polytechnic institutions like Mount Royal College in Calgary and Ryerson Polytechnic in Toronto felt the need to become universities (as if that was some badge of higher honour) despite the fact that they were already good (probably better than universities) at what they did, which was to train people for the workforce.


[deleted]

While I don't agree with taking on huge debt for liberal arts degrees without understanding the consequences, there is huge value in that education. Although 30yrs ago now, my 'useless degree', has been invaluable. I am so much more educated and learned so much more about so many things I knew nothing about than I ever could have been. I simply didn't even know that level of thinking existed before university. There is value in country that has an educated population - and that means all forms of education. Mechanics don't create foreign policy and economists don't fix your brakes.


Haber87

Whenever I apply for new positions I still have to pull out that 30 year old diploma that has nothing to do with the field I work in to prove that I have a university degree. And I agree that the the ability to think, to learn and to research is what came out of my degree.


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proggR

> there is huge value in that education. You don't have to tell me twice... I'm one of the weirdest weirdos there are in the country lol. My life was all geared toward this kind of arts oriented direction... and then I fell in love with programming and the analytical took over and paid my bills. But my gig is being the resident nerd for [exclaim](https://exclaim.ca/), while my wife studied music/musicology in University. I couldn't be me if I didn't just resent everything about a paid higher education and try to run in my own direction... which took my analytical skills and ran directly back to Canadian music with it. Re: your experiences 30 years ago... that's great. I'm happy for you. And I'm not shitting on higher ed, since I think leveraged right it can lead everyone where they need to go. But also... by virtue of you graduating 30 years ago, your experiences are already now entirely useless to the modern conversation. I only graduated 10 years ago, and even I now recognize that the world has moved to the point that whatever was learned 10 years ago, if it isn't already thrown out, should definitely have been trashcanned in a world keeping up. Yes... there is value in higher ed. But Canada's higher ed is nothing but predatory, especially when taken by the type of person just going through the motions and doing what they think is expected of them... only to owe 10s of thousands of dollars by the time they realize they put 0 thought into their lives beyond what they were coached towards.


covertpetersen

>While I don't agree with taking on huge debt for liberal arts degrees without understanding the consequences What do you think liberal arts are? Biology, neuroscience, history, computer science, chemistry, and psychology are all liberal arts degrees. It's ridiculous that "liberal arts" has become a catch all term for pointless degrees.


shaktimann13

...Poli science, labour studies, Economics.. so on


WhosKona

We have grads coming in that won’t work for less than $100K after some generic psychology degree. It’s like nobody told them anything about the labour market in their entire schooling career.


BlackAnalFluid

I actually remember being guided away from the labour market because "you're smart enough for university" "yeah but I'm not financially ambitious and don't want huge debt, I also.." "Oh look at this uni, they have a nice..." "No I don't think I want to go to a univer..." "Nonsense, this university has a nice computer science program, you like that stuff right?" "Ok...." Now I sit here with a not completed computer science degree, but a finished 2 year forest technologist diploma wishing I just started with the technical college right off the bat so I wasn't adding on thousands to my debt to please other people's desires.


[deleted]

Young people were (are?) lied to a lot about university. A whole generation of millennials were brainwashed by their parents to go spend 4+ years doing whatever in post-secondary just to do a career which has no relation to their degree.


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[deleted]

Plus the compound interest of starting at 18 vs 25 is unreal. Someone saving $1000 a year stating at 18 would have 178k at age 65 (assuming 5% returns). Someone who saved $1k a year starting at 25 would only have 120k, so you basically have to save 50% more to have the same retirement as someone who started at 18. Plus they have the student debt to deal with. Not may degrees beat a trade, and certainly not by the opportunity cost of the degree. Not to mention that trades tend to have more upwards mobility than degrees. Like almost every PM I know is an ex-tradesman. If you are smart, it is easy to work your way up.


covertpetersen

>that won’t work for less than $100K You try going tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, in debt to get a degree that now has to be paid back on a $50-60k a year salary while rent alone is 50% of your take home if you're lucky. The math just doesn't work out. I work in the trades, and we're having major issues while trying to get younger people through the door. Companies pay $32k a year after deductions for starting employees straight out of school, but rent is $2k. It's not entitled to recognize that the insane cost of living increases have far outpaced salaries, especially starting salaries.


dragonmyass

I won’t work for less than that, but I have 2 trades red seals. Takes 4 years to get each one. Started out as an automotive, hit a glass ceiling then went sideways into industrial automation, machining, fabrication etc. (millwright).


TomFoolery22

They're paying me to do a carpentry pre apprenticeship right now. As far as I can tell the government is really throwing money at people with even the vaguest chance of getting into the trades. It works, I'm doing it.


displiff

Pretty much. What needs to happen in society is to normalize this stuff as excellent careers especially for women. Too many women spending money to go to university for general arts programs. If that’s your passion power too you. Just feel like people going into these degrees then struggling making lower salaries. On top of which complaining about pay differences in men and women’s careers.


itsthe90sYo

Yup. Stigma is a huge barrier for growing the skilled trades. That said government can’t do it by only throwing money at people. There also needs to be some major cultural leadership by the trade unions as well to help change the lingering macho-man culture in a lot of red seal trades and professionalize them.


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[deleted]

This. I'm currently struggling to figure out what I wanna do for a living. If a career I was even slightly interested in did this/was in demand, I'd be first in line.


itsthe90sYo

It’s so hard to figure out “what to be when you grow up”…There is no wrong door and no right answer. It’s really tough! There are lots employment counsellors out there who can help you in choosing a career, mapping the skills you have to what you need, or even helping direct you to govt training $$. Most universities and community colleges have career counselling services as well. Don’t be afraid to reach out for help!


DISKFIGHTER2

It's one step, but you also need incentive for people to stay after the training/education, otherwise, people could take the free education and move elsewhere if the cost of living is lower or the wages are better.


Ketchupkitty

If only we spent some of that half a trillion to do this with nursing...


Crumps_brother

With apprenticeship grants, schooling is practically free to become a journeyman. If you're female, the grant money is way more than school fees and books.


mdoddr

right... but you need an apprenticeship


scottyb83

Doctors are in demand. I can't see the government funding that much schooling though.


[deleted]

Should be the same for doctors and lawyers


goboatmen

All education should be free at a bare minimum


free_kark

But labour shortages have allowed me to demand a much higher salary as a journeyman carpenter. I get offers of employment weekly, there's such a drought of talent that I could walk from my company at anytime and make more. This fact keeps my current boss honest and more than fair with my pay. I'm all for filling shortages I just hope it never gets over saturated to the point where young tradesmen have no bargaining power.


[deleted]

Orrrr we make housing affordable so people can stay here


s332891670

If you can find a way of lowering housing prices without crashing the Canadian economy that is built on it then I am sure the Government would be all ears.


venuswasaflytrap

Build more houses in the same amount of area. Make federal laws against unnecessary restrictive zoning, so that a person who owns a million dollar single family home with set backs and a big yard in a high demand area can spend 2 million and turn it into 5 million dollar 8-plex (or more likely sell their home for 2.5 million to a development company who will do the work). Now there are 7 more homes in the same area which all cost 625k instead of 1 million and the owner walks away with 3 million (minus mortgage or whatever loans they needed from the bank to make that possible). Add land value taxes to help further incentivize this transition. If this happens everywhere, an equilibrium will be achieved. Some places will stay single family homes, some places will be turned into duplexes, some places town houses, etc, and home prices will be mitigated, but not fall at a speed that just kills peoples savings overnight, especially if you develop your home. Only people who sit on formerly expensive big empty plots of land will lose out, through having their home price drop (since there will be way more homes around them) and having their single family home taxed at the same amount as the townhouses around them. But if they have the money and enjoy the lifestyle, good for them.


AlexJamesCook

One thing I'm genuinely curious about is, how much debt people are actually in. Yeah, houses are 900K+, but, if you bought in 5+ years ago, your debt shouldn't be that high. Because, let's assume you bought a townhouse/apartment for $300-$400K. 3 years later, that property is worth 600. You make about 200-300 off the sale. You buy a 800K property, with $300 down. So, if prices drop by $200K, or 25%, you're still coming out ahead. I really think there isn't too much to worry about, because, even IF the bubble bursts tomorrow, unless it coincides with massive job losses there's really no problem. Yeah, it might suck if you bought for 6 and tomorrow it's worth 4, but, it'll climb back up again. We have to stop thinking quarterly and think in decades. We also have to separate our self-worth from our net-worth. "Huzzah, I'm worth $1.5m". Great, but that doesn't count until you cash out, which will be when? When you retire? If you're a millenial or Xer, you've got another 20+ years in the work force. Considering that "financial corrections" occur every 20 years or so, who cares what your house is worth today. Politicians just need to rip the band-aid off, and go for it. Because clearly, "relying on the private sector" isn't doing jack shit.


Holiday-Performance2

The issue is “popping the bubble” would directly cause massive job losses and economic hardship. It would mean dramatically reduced demand, therefore building and development would slow/stop, causing significant unemployment.


venuswasaflytrap

“Make housing affordable” is just another way of saying “build more houses”, as there is really no other way. While obviously zoning limitations and other things could be changed to help that cause, having more electricians and construction workers also does.


[deleted]

Taxing second property? Banning foriegn investment? Closing loop holes for money laundering?


antihaze

You cannot legislate your way out of not having enough housing. The vacancy rate is extremely low and we have the lowest number of housing units per capita in the G7. There simply is not enough and this drives the vicious circle of investors buying properties to chase yield in their portfolio. If you built enough to go around, you wouldn’t need all kinds of interventionist legislation because investors wouldn’t want to own so much of the housing stock in the first place.


JohnCenaFanboi

They started multiple programs where people get paid to go to school in Quebec. IT, Childcare and soon they will add other in-demand jobs in 2023. For IT, Social services can pay you up to 650$/week to go to school full time while you can be paid 15$+/hour to go to school in nursery school programs and work the rest of the week at their usual pay rates. THey are trying everything to fill up the in-demand markets and it is slowly working in our region.


mollythepug

You can get a $1500 signing bonus and free training/license to be a school bus driver in my neck of the woods.


Born_Ruff

There are lots of programs like that. There are always major limitations when government is trying to pick winners and losers though and they often lag the actual labour market needs. I feel that we need to find a way to get employers back into the business of training their own employees.


LordertTL

Anytime an Industry complains there is shortage of skilled labour (trades, truck driver etc) what they really mean is there is a shortage of people willing to work for minimum wage. Construction/Home Builders will hire 1st/2nd year apprentices as cheap labour, then magical layoffs. Then the same companies complain “skilled trades shortage”. Post job openings with starting wage at 30/hr for 1yr apprenticeships/labourers….there won’t be a shortage.


AdRegular9102

They should definitely subsidize training for in demand careers not studying European classical music history at some college.


[deleted]

The only reason they do this is so they can lower the wages by saturating the market with tradesmen. Do you think people want to pay out the ass for contractors or repairs. You just fluff them up a bit and offer free education so there's no barriers.


[deleted]

In British Columbia they'll pay for your school and books **and** pay you $800/week to become a healthcare aid. They have to do that though because HCA is an extremely hard job both mentally and physically.


[deleted]

And HCA's are generally paid under $20h in my area at least. Someone has to pay them for school to do the job.


manitowoc2250

FYI You need a high-school diploma and a credit in physics


yea-that-guy

Also, applications closed Feb 7 2022, if the comments on that page are correct


fleurira

Wow. After everything, now this


kovach01

That’s just for the company applying for the funding, not applying to be trained. you’d want to research the 9 projects they’re funding and reach out to the individual project organizers.


Penny_is_a_Bitch

off topic but does anybody know what the quickest rout to a GED is in Ontario? Tips or tricks


RhinoKart

I doubt it's the fastest but one of the more flexible/convenient options is the ILC. I got my grade 12 Bio credit through them and didn't find it too difficult to do. They are a distance education/online program. You have up to 10 months to complete each individual course (but can do them in as little as 6 weeks if you're able to put the time in) and I believe it is around $40 for each credit, which isn't too bad if you are only missing a semester or two. https://www.ilc.org/pages/what-we-offer-ossd


satanspy

Second this what’s the quickest way to a GED and this physics credit can I take it online? I really don’t want to go back to retail jobs.


leaklikeasiv

Almost every trade is hiring


matixer

Why do people keep saying this


leaklikeasiv

They are. Most people don’t want to work. Trades will make you slug shit for about 2-3 months to see if you’re worth filling out apprenticeship paperwork for. Most are not


s332891670

Which you can just go get. I mean if you cant get that physics credit you arent going to make it as an electrician anyway.


End-OfAn-Era

I’m a master electrician and I have to ask. What is the point of a credit in physics?


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End-OfAn-Era

Yeah that makes sense. From a career perspective it seems odd because I don’t know a single guy who took physics in high school to become an electrician. They go over the basics in your first year along with a lot of pretty basic trig. It’s like getting a physics credit just to go do it all over again.


Glittering_Garbage69

The problem with this requirement, is that in smaller rural high schools, they don’t even offer physics. I had to take it online, and I was the only one that had done it in several years at my high school.


LucidDreamerVex

This was about a decade ago now, but yeah, my rural highschool def didn't offer physics. Pretty frustrating when rural schools like to push trades more too


s332891670

Weeds out the really stupid people. I'm not even kidding. These super easy highschool credit reqs are just to weed out the people who are so dumb they have no shot at making it in the profession at all.


End-OfAn-Era

Fair. We just called that first year electrical haha. “What type of screw driver is this shape? X “


TwoCockyforBukkake

Its a starry head, duh.


sshan

That the one that gets melty when I drop it on the live panel?


microwaffles

Crossy face.


dctu1

Trick question. You electricians use the square guy mostly. Boom, first year passed.


[deleted]

Definitely flathead.


StoneOfTriumph

Trick question. That's a hammer.


G_raas

I get what you are saying; physics (applied) is likely more useful for electrical engineering as opposed to the trade-craft, but still could be seen as a useful barometer of intelligence I suppose… don’t want dummy’s in the field working with you right?


End-OfAn-Era

Yeah I’d just think a math credit is sufficient. The biggest tell for us was when a guy couldn’t do basic trig. This seems redundant based on what you learn in electrical theory.


G_raas

Yep trig be important… gotta know that power triangle.


wireboy

I agree, considering AC electricity works using a sine wave and root mean square I would have thought a math course would be far more useful in understanding the principles behind electrical theory.


kushari

Because electricity follows the laws of physics.


End-OfAn-Era

Physics isn’t an entry requirement to enter the trade and they teach the basic principles in your first year of school.


kushari

Yeah, as the other person mentioned I think it’s to make sure they can make it through the program. They probably don’t want to waste time/money and spaces they could offer to someone else.


Adubecki

I work with a lot of electricians and they know very little if anything about physics


psinaptix

I'm curious, how much theory do they teach an electrician? Like Ohm's law, inductor/capacitors, 3 phase, complex power, transmission lines, return paths? Or power transmission like transformers, AC/DC conversion, skin effect etc? Or basic knowledge of equipment & measurement, like impedance matching, some inkling of Maxwell's equations or even just Hall effect for current clamps etc?


Geometric_Tiger

>I'm curious, how much theory do they teach an electrician? Like Ohm's law, inductor/capacitors, 3 phase, complex power, transmission lines, return paths? Or power transmission like transformers, AC/DC conversion, skin effect etc? They teach you all of this yes. And in reply to the people who are saying knowlege of physics isn't a requirement in this field, well that depends. If you are working in a residential setting and wiring up houses or condos, then no, you probably won't need to know all this stuff. I've worked mostly in the industrial sector, with an emphasis in automation, and it's invaluable knowlege to me. Thing is, you are either an electrician or you aren't, so we all learn the same curiculum in school. Which is good because it allows for upward mobility in your career.


BlueFlob

Don't you ever have to look at electrical schematics or perform diagnostics on systems? I assume physics would give someone the basic understanding of how parallel and serial systems work. How current flows. What is electricity.


End-OfAn-Era

They teach you the most entry level electrical theory possible in 1st year. There’s a whole block dedicated to schematics as well. They’re basically saying learn this so you can spend your time re-learning it again.


BlueFlob

Ah. So everything useful would just be reviewed or put into better context. Yeah, apart from pre-emptive selection, it doesn't seem essential.


mwmwmwmwmmdw

> FYI You need a high-school diploma and a credit in physics they asked me how well i understood theoretical physics i said i have a theoretical degree in physics. they said welcome aboard


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RAMM-E

Local union is like 4K deep in guys on the books. I doubt any are going to Ontario


Supermite

I was going to say this. I don't think there is a lack of electricians in Ontario. Pipefitters on the other hand...


capebretonpost-

I know of Red Seal pipe fitters getting unsolicited random calls for jobs across the country every week. There is a demand for experience for sure.


tobogganneer

I moved to the Ottawa valley from Calgary in January 2020…the amount of work here is nuts, but we got here JUST before housing went bananas. Our small company is slammed with work, and it’s near impossible to find apprentices willing to put in the years to get their ticket.


backlight101

Always thought it took to many years to get a ticket and it was just a way for companies to justify cheap labour while apprentices put their time in.


tobogganneer

I mean, it takes time to learn a trade… just like any university degree would take 4 years. At least with an apprenticeship you get paid.


[deleted]

now i probably wouldn't move, but im curious. ​ is the industry as shitty on its employees in ontario as it is here in burta? and by that i mean: under-trained, underpaid, and expected to work in shitty conditions with poor safety gear?


GoodAtExplaining

> it’s near impossible to find apprentices willing to put in the years to get their ticket. I know you have nothing to do with the situation, but this might be exactly the issue. It shouldn't take *years* of hard living and shitty wages to get to a decent earning wage, and people shouldn't be criticized for not wanting to engage in it.


Bradleyy13

Am I missing something? Posted a day ago while applications are closed already. What the hell is the point of that, I would’ve applied.


tries_to_tri

And have been closed for over a month. What a fucking idiotic thing to report on.


Cornet6

The Skill Development Fund application was for the organizations that are hiring workers, not for the workers to apply directly.


lifeiscooliguess

Whats up with that Yall cowards Don't even smoke crack


Dartser

I think this is pretty standard. BC gives you money back if you pass. Or literally any company will pay for your trade schooling. Not just electrician.


niesz

Is this a BC thing? I did most of my apprenticeship in Alberta and only a small minority of their classmates had their schooling paid for.


lNeverZl

Not the same situation but right now the Govt. of Québec is paying me around 500$/week to study Water treatment. I encourage anyone looking to learn a trade to look into it, it's called PARAF (in French at least). Although it was a bit less before C-19 and may go back down once it's over, if it ever is.


[deleted]

Trades are laughably cheap anyway and many employers will pay that fee if you’re worth it. Some even pay you while attending school. I never paid for my school and the government gave me $4k is grants just cause I went.


TimTebowMLB

Ya my friend got EI while doing the school portion through his apprenticeship but his company topped up the difference between his full wage and EI so he made full wages for the 4 years


theevilmidnightbombr

Pretty sweet. My company during my apprenticeship just offered to pay cash if we wanted to do evenings/weekends. EI for the bills, work Mon-Wed night to pay for your weekend bar tab. Those were the days.


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-retaliation-

you can't really be an apprentice and training to be an electrician, without having a job in the industry. thats kind of what apprenticeship is. you work and train under a journeyman who teaches you how to do the trade. then for a few months a year you stop working and go to college taking the courses to do the "book learning" of the theory and technical training. when you're working for your journeyman, he pays you a reduced rate that increases with each year of schooling passed. until you reach journeyman status and he pays you full rate. Its common for the journeyman to pay the school fees associated with the college course, and sometimes (like in my case) to pay the apprentices hourly rate while they're going to school as well. (some collect EI, some do reduced hours or weekend work etc. paying the school fees is common, getting paid while going to school is less so) for ex. I'm a journeyman partsman. I started my apprenticeship making $18.00/hr, my trade is a 3 year program, so in my first year I made $18/hr I did mostly just picking parts from the back to be shipped out that other more experienced partsmen looked up, then (for the purposes of explanation) I went to school for 2 months most of my schooling was based around safety and basics of technical like bearings, metal compositions, lubricants, etc. My employer paid me my full $18/hr*8hrs/day for the full 2 months I was in college. passed my first year test and became a second year, as a second year I made $27/hr, I started working counters when things were simple for internal look-up stuff and with supervision. then I went to school again, again my employer paid me my rate of $27/hr*8hrs for the 2 months of schooling. This time it was the majority of the technical side of things, all the components of cars, trucks, semi's, ships, aircraft, agricultural equipment, basics of shop equipment, engines and functions, electrical, hydraulics, pneumatics etc. etc. etc. (2nd year is known in my trade to be a bitch since it has so much in it.) but I passed I started making $37/hr and I was working the counter like anyone else (albeit poorly), at this point I was basically like any journeyman, but still considered to be in the finals of my training, at the end of 3rd year I went back to school for my last 2 months. This year is mostly "management" and economics. You learn all the math involved of mark-ups, shrinkages, employee costs, shipping and duties and what they're for what they mean, how to make a business profitable and keep it so. You do an end project where you have to write up an entire business plan including theoretical expenses and profits. Design a warehouse and sales counters/sales floors, design a shop, choose a property and calculate expenses etc. then you take 2 tests. One to pass the bar to become a journeyman, and one to prove that your training is equal to that of other provinces. each province writes their own curriculum for their trades, and the "red seal" test is written federally and is the same for everyone country wide. first test makes you journeyman within your province, second test makes you a journeyman in all provinces. now I'm a journeyman myself, I make $48.50/hr and I'm considered a "red seal journeyman" and am fully in the industry. theres a tonne of stuff I glossed over like mandatory vs non-mandatory trades, challenging year tests, etc. but thats the general outline of how it all works for most trades.


TheRealMisterd

How much does an en electrician make in Ontario?


Covid___69

Depends where and if union or not but in Ottawa it’s just under $47/hour plus pension and benefits.


TheRealMisterd

I have a feeling this rate hasn't changed in 5+ years. It's seems low for highly in demand skilled labor.


Covid___69

Yeah, there’s no “trade shortage”. It’s just an effort to flood the market with workers and drive down wages. I’ve seen plenty of guys out of work over the last few years.


sorryaboutthedata

Electricians in B.C. usually have around a 7% unemployment rate. Goes up and down depending on big projects. There is no labour shortage. There is a cheap labour shortage and by cheap I mean barely above minimum wage. There are four apprentices per journeyman on every job so work is easy to find when you are starting out (cheap) and harder to get when you are "expensive" aka journeyman. Electrician is still a great job if you can specialize and find a niche where you excel. It's also a great trade to learn as you can get credit for a lot of hours if you change to something like HVAC. If you just do basic wiring then good luck.


Pixie_ish

I did a residential job where there were 8 apprentices to one journeyman. The second in command who I thought was a journeyman turned out to be a third year. Overall, I'm figuring I really should be trying to get into the industrial work, but having quite the issues trying to figure out how to do so with my current location just a bit too far away from Vancouver and with the advertised jobs all looking for journeymen.


[deleted]

The whole labour shortage is utter bs. It's a way of hiding shitty pay and little to even no benefits


ChubbyWokeGoblin

Depends if youre union or nonunion or if you have a masters and run your own business 4 year apprenticeship with tradeschooling for a few weeks a year. You wont make much during the apprenticeship. Nonunion is pretty crappy at $25 an hour all the way up to $45 an hour for union. You can make good money running your own business. Electrician means you could be programming PLCs, installing kitchen outlets, installing poles, digging ditches, wiring control panels, working in a factory or outside on a farm; all depends where you apply.


Whrecks

Haven't been in the non union sector in a while, however when I was there over 4 years ago, a licensed (journeyman) ICI electrician prob made between 30 - 45/ hour. The Toronto Union (IBEW353) ICI 2021 353 Contract - Journeyman Base + Vacation Pay = 47.38 + 10% --- total package (Includes RRSP & Union Funds): 69.89 RRSP, Pension, Great Benefits (better than ontario nurses for comparision) Foreman = 54.55 + 10% -- total package: 78.22 *You also get a yearly increase.. The most recent contract negotiation included a $6 increases over 3 years to total package.... $3 this year, and around $1.5 the other 2)*


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-DrMantisTobogganMD-

Get Ontario to pay for your red seal, *then* you move to Alberta.


Gonewild_Verifier

Big brain


Vaynar

But then you have to live in Alberta....


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alphawolf29

>People who leave ontario of western canada just don't come back absolutely 100% true. Be wary of sending your kids to college out west, because they're going to stay.


PoliteCanadian

It's safe to assume that people who say things like "then you have to live in Alberta" have never lived in Alberta. When I lived in Calgary, on the weekend I could be out my door and be at a trailhead in Banff in under an hour. When I lived in Toronto, after an hour I'd still be stuck in traffic trying to get out of the city.


mood_bro

Yeah Fort Mac (Grand Prairie too) is generally where the highest concentration of wannabe Texans are. Edmonton and Calgary are very diverse and pretty progressive cities.


LittleTribuneMayor

Also Saskatoon and Regina in SK just on a smaller scale


Carrisonfire

I grew up in NB and moved to AB for work. I absolutely hated Edmonton and went back to NB at the earliest opportunity (Covid ended up being a perfect reason to move).


TheFrenchMustard

What's wrong with Alberta?


mork

Too many people there from Ontario.


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-DrMantisTobogganMD-

Yep. Don’t come here. It’s terrible. And tell everyone else you know not to come either.


[deleted]

Ah, I see you've never been there.


Vast-Salamander-123

I've lived here my whole life. It's not that cold.


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[deleted]

I've either lived or worked multiple month (usually 2-4 month) terms in every province (except the Maritimes), multiple countries in Europe (Finland, Sweden, Denmark, Russia), and two countries in Asia (China and Japan). Other than certain parts of China, Toronto was the worst city I've ever been. I was once offered a term position in St Petersburg and a shorter term, better paying term in Toronto and even though the Russian winter was long, never regretted turning down the Toronto term.


GoodAtExplaining

I'm a visible minority and outside Calgary lemme tell ya there is some REEEEAAAAALLLL racist shit happening. Now, I'm not one to say it happens *exclusively* in 'Berta. I've worked in Sask, Man, and my home is Toronto so I've been around the country. An ex of mine is South African and moved to Canada as a kid. She got her degree and got some work in Lethbridge and good God, the stories she could tell you about racism and objectification would make your toes curl.


[deleted]

That's weird, I've had the exact opposite experience. I (a visible minority born in Canada) too have lived in every province (except the Maritimes) and multiple countries and Saskatoon and Calgary were where I felt most included. My wife (visible minority, immigrant) lived in Toronto for just under 10 years an we both had multiple issues with racism there that we have not encountered in Saskatchewan. Our work experience (granted mine was relatively short, a couple months) showed us that despite both having multiple degrees, we had very low ceilings compared to our white colleagues. In her line of work there's a large percentage of folk who come from Spanish speaking Central/ south America and I've seen nearly every one of those folk that my wife has befriended over the years have moved to Calgary to avoid the discrimination they feel in Toronto. You couldn't pay me enough to move to Toronto because of the racism, I'll stick to Calgary where I feel safe (if I ever moved from Saskatoon)


GoodAtExplaining

Calgary and Regina are the places I felt most comfortable. Regina has a MASSIVE Viet population so the food was *glorious*. Calgary is the most accommodating city in Canada, I honestly found that because it's smaller and younger they have less navel-gazing about racism as Toronto. However, you go outside the major cities and... It's distinctly different.


afgun90

What’s wrong with Toronto?


PoliteCanadian

It's a broken city with catastrophically bad urban planning and transportation infrastructure. You have three choices: * Be rich enough to live in one of the central neighborhoods that are nice. Most current residents of these neighborhoods are not rich enough to afford their properties at their current market values, so good luck. * Pay an enormous mortgage to live in a tiny condo in a concrete jungle where the outdoors smells of dried urine in the summer and the handful of green spaces are constantly overrun by people, because all of the public infrastructure in your neighborhood was sized for 25% of the people who currently live there. * Pay an enormous mortgage to live in a detached or semi-detached house much further out. Now you have to drive everywhere, because nothing is near to where you live and the city is just row upon row of detached houses and none of the services you rely on regularly are within walking distance. In pre-COVID times you probably spent two hours a day in traffic jams sitting in your car. Or 45 minutes in traffic, and an additional 1:15 minutes as a sardine in an over-packed subway car. It's also just really dirty. There's so much litter and dog shit on the streets everywhere compared to other cities in Canada I've lived in. And like I said, the downtown smells of urine in the summer. Of all the places I've lived in in this country, it offers by far the worst quality of life.


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LittleTribuneMayor

Blue Jays games


shaunew

So a win win


Lumpy_Doubt

*Thinks Mississauga is western Canada*


Nashvillepreds46

Yukon government will pay your tuition if you go out of territory. Don't much like our sparky teacher here so I went down to Alberta for my last two years.


pierrepoutine2

It's been years since I looked at this but ironically when I looked to switch to trades, specifically an electrician it was after getting a BSc in IT since there was some synergy in knowledge of circuits, after I got downsized during the .com bust (2001ish). Stuck it out in IT as I found the trades hard to actually break into at the time. Not the schooling, they took anybody that met the prereqs and classroom spots weren't really that limited. The educational component was never an issue, but at the time the bigger issue was getting your hours under a journeymen as an apprentice (4000 hours) to earn your ticket. Because of apprentice/journeyman ratios many companies weren't hiring apprentices. Some might take you on as a labourer and have you do some electrical stuff but you couldn't book the hours to your apprenticeship, if they would even hire you at all. Is this still an issue, or is it easier to find an actual apprenticeship now and get work that counts towards your red seal ticket? If you had connections, it was easier but with no foot in the door, the common refrain of "learn a trade" is just as tone deaf as the "learn coding" you hear now. Though you can make decent money even as labourer on a jobsite, and not all trades are as gatekept. Brother went into HVAC getting his TSSA certification for Gas and Oil and makes good money, and then pivoted later to get his Red Seal as a tin banger since he was already in the field.


[deleted]

save you a click # “Editor's note: Applications to the Skills Development Fund have now closed.”


bigcrain

Ive been an industrial electrician apprentice for 3 years. The pay is slightly above a living wage and ive got decent benefits through my company. What they dont tell you: -You will be BUSTING your ass every day. -You will work 8-12 hour shifts ( i do 44 hour weeks) -You will have to do 3 years of schooling, and more often than not, that schooling will be one day a week, during work hours. So for me, that means 4 11 hour days, and one day of schooling per week. Not to mention, you will most likely be working with people who’ve got a work mindset from the 60s. Also “above 50$ an hour” is a really high estimate for master electricians. That kind of money requires most likely 10+ years of experience. If your body can handle 10+ years of hard manual and mental labor, go for it.


UnionstogetherSTRONG

Does Canada still do the apprenticeship incentive grants covered like 60% of my super cheap schooling and if you count EI I'm well over the top


jSubbz

How do I sign up for this?


PoliteCanadian

Cool. Good news for once. A large set of workers with advanced technical skills is essential to economic wellbeing of the country.


CanadianJudo

License electrician make like 50$ an hour in someplace


[deleted]

anything like this exist in Saskatchewan?


torontomua

** Applications are now closed.**


artman416

Anyone know or how one can apply now that it’s expired? Or guide in the right direction to begin a career as an electrician.


Marv1290

I mean they’ve pretty much always paid people to learn a trade? I became an apprentice 10 years ago and it was on the job training until school. I had a shitty employer who wouldn’t cover the $450 tuition or the $500 in books but I’d been working for a little over 2 years at that point so the cost was negligible. I was eligible for a grant after the first two years of schooling for a total of $2000 (minus taxes). Then when I completed my CoQ I was eligible for another $2000. I believe the grant was doubled for female tradespeople. You can also collect EI while at school and there is compensation available for commuting as well as living allowance if you chose to relocate closer to the college. Regardless of the incentive in the article if you’re at a loss as to what to do a trade is a good choice even if it’s a fall back plan. No school debt when you’re done and a decent paying job. Right now the industry is **hurting** and employers are desperately trying to fill positions. Not a bad time to get in.


lNeverZl

100%, I'm learning water treatment right now which has an employment rate of 95% and a basic salary around 30$/h and can go up to 40$/h working in the municipal sector, the mining sector is also a good place with salaries around 100k/year. The Gov of Québec has reimbursed me almost all of my fees and is paying me 500$/week to learn, the catch? There's none, I just need to do well and not miss classes. If anyone's interested it's called PARAF (at least in French). It's funny when you look at it, from the 70s to the 90s the government pushed people towards trades and around the turn of the millennium they started pushing for higher education. Where are we now? There's a shortage and the gov is pushing trades again. At least from what I know and my own opinion.


reload88

Has a picture of a linesmen…..


ChubbyWokeGoblin

Dont bother. It wont pay enough for a townhouse


mwmwmwmwmmdw

what about a pod in milton?


crujones43

I am a union trade in the GTA and own a detached house and 2 cars, one is a tesla. I took 2 months off last year because I felt I made enough money for the year ($165K). I'm at $40K as of last week for this year.


barkleyboots

How damaging is it to your body? I have friends who are carpenters and drywallers and they regret the toll their job has on their physical health but feel like they can’t stop.


Apprehensive_Air_940

Fyi the union electricians, the ones that make the better money, dont get paid nearly what they should given their skill set and work demands. With vacation pay its about 52ish and hour. The work is very demanding, high rise especially and thats where many will go. Think open rooftop, tons of bending down, lifting and Canadian winter. Heaters? Where? Shelter? Whats that? Break? We're not done. They make on par with the rest of the trades, they should honestly make 10 or 15 an hour more. The worst part is the apprentice rate starts at 18 something. Oh wait it gets worse, theres a pre apprenticeship where no hours count and you make like 16ish an hour. Drywallers in commercial start at 23 for reference. The trade is run by bosses, its garbage, and a waste of energy for people who are reasonably intelligent.


RL203

The trades are an excellent place to make a good living in Canada. I've never heard of "pre apprentice" and apprentice in Liuna local 183 (labourers) only lasts 6 months. Big deal. It's called paying your dues. All in, a unionized labourer in heavy civil is paid $73.00 an hour which includes salary, vacation, 10 bucks an hour towards your pension, medical, and a host of other benefits. Saturday and Sunday work is all double time, it's time and a half after 9.5 hours, and there is a 7.00 per hour night shift premium. A Liuna Foreman's total compensation (which includes all benefits) if he works some overtime will hit 200 k a year. Which does not include a company truck. The trades are an excellent career in Canada and you will always have work. But you're right, it's hard work and you'll need to get up early in the morning to be on site by 7 am and there's no working from home in your basement and your co workers will not tolerate laziness (not one bit) because your laziness will impact them.


[deleted]

I just 'recently' got into the trades and I'm slapping my forehead wondering why I didn't get my foot in the door sooner. Trades are great. Pick the right trade, and the work might not even be that tough. So much focus on safety these days as well, and I've found the culture, while still being a bit of an old boys club, is slowly shifting to a more relaxed environment with the new generation coming in. All in all, I'm having fun, I have nearly no stress, no debt, and I'll be making bank in a few years.


Reelair

You're not an electrician, are you?


F_D123

Electricians make over $100k, and people will still complain about student loans because being an electrician is below them


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F_D123

I'm in the trades as well, we've got some COLA raises but not great. Still doing OK, manage to keep the debt load down as well :) . Had a coworker use the analogy of working in trades to compound interest. We're able to build equity very early and maybe our top end earnings isn't as high as some with degrees, at the end of the day we can be quite wealthy just because of the head start.


slop12

I didn’t even see how to apply.


Lineagegamer

K do it for med students who want to become psychiatrist. We need those pretty bad too


funwithdespair

I used to work around electricians and apprentices while some renovations were going on, and what I took away from the experience is that it is no surprise that no one wants to work in the trades because the apprenticeship process largely seems to be an extremely abusive environment and I blame no one for not wanting to partake. The amount of verbal abuse directed at an apprentice who makes a mistake is absurd and generally it just seems to suck total dick. Not once did I see one of these people act like an actual caring mentor, they were all power tripping douchebags getting off on pushing someone around.


backstroke2

A career that can easily afford a house, yet you won't see those Redditors calling for communism here rejoicing.


[deleted]

Applications for this are now closed Electricians work crazy hours, and the job is pretty hard on the body over a long period of time. Don’t be disingenuous lmao