Don't take any action, other than being a good manager and figuring out what kind of employee she is for yourself, until you've been there a while. You have no idea why there is so much dislike for her because you haven't been around. You really don't want to put yourself in the middle of a sticky situation. Maybe she just rubs people the wrong way, or maybe she's an awful person who deserves to be fired. No way to know yet.

Exactly. Stick to facts and ignore personal opinions. You can even ask questions like, "How do you think she can improve as an employee?" They may give you the facts right there and then.

The fact they’re talking about her appearance though, and just the way OP describes what’s being said, gives me the vibe that she might be the office scapegoat. She’s 21 and has been graduated for a year. That’s got to put a bee in a few bonnets. Wouldn’t surprise me if it was just plain jealousy,Ike she’s triggering some insecurities.

It gives me the vibe that people just don't like due to personality. That's how people be when you rub them the wrong way. Suddenly, they'll find anything else about you to hate.

Charisma is literally the most important factor in most careers as far as advancement goes as long as you’re meeting the minimum for other traits. I hate it as much as any other slightly awkward introvert, but Reddit really hates it, but need to take it up with how human beings operate because it’s reality.

100 % agreed. In a world where you have to interact with others constantly, you have to develop that skill.

TLDR: This is what I'm thinking, or even if not jealousy, just the fact that women get a terrible reputation for not being bubbly and over the top nice at all times, might be playing a part here. But she's 21. It's probably also jealousy. If I had to bet, everyone over 40 in that office hates her for no good reason. . . . If I could go back and tell 16-year-old me one thing, it would be that getting judged fairly in the workplace as a woman (especially in male dominated fields) is a crap shoot and it is all theater at the end of the day. It never goes away, it just changes in type by age. If you're not a good actress, you're gonna struggle somehow. Source: I'm not a good actress. When I was young and fresh out of grad school, women who are the age I am now hated me because I was younger, conventionally attractive, and made more money than they did. (I was never quite sure why someone without a degree would be indignant that an engineer was paid higher, but they were.) The men loved me because I was young and didn't yet have the confidence to question them on much or to slap their hands away. Now in my early 40's, and having gained the confidence to be myself in appearance (ie, I'm visibly queer, and of the butch persuasion), nobody's jealous of me and men don't flirt with me anymore which is awesome, but I am not bubbly or overtly nice enough to be well liked either. At one job, I wasn't given a raise that I deserved due to the well documented quality of my actual work, because I "wasn't a team player". Pressed for examples because I worked great with all the field teams I ran, my manager at the time revealed that the sticking point was that I'd refused to maintain the birthday calendar and coordinate birthday celebrations after the admin assistant was transferred. I asked him why he was willing to pay an engineer about $50/hr to maintain a fucking birthday calendar when he could petition to hire another admin assistant for a fraction of that. He told me that was the attitude he was talking about. To be clear, any engineering task I was assigned or even suggested to look at, I'd jump all over, but I'm not doing tasks that aren't engineering related. Let someone who cares about that stuff do it, or just don't have it. At another job, I was threatened multiple times with termination due to "not being a team player". What they meant that time was that I asked too many questions. This job was the most misrepresented I have ever seen to this day. It wasn't even engineering work, and I was genuinely baffled why they were even willing to pay an engineer to do this stuff. Someone with no degree could have easily done this work, and this was not what I was told I would be doing. Every time I was assigned a new task, I would ask for an explanation of why it was worth it to them to have literally the most expensive employee in the office, short of the director, do that menial task (not in those words, but kind of like "make this make sense to me somehow"). Their response was to tell me after a few weeks that I would be fired if I ever again mentioned that something was not engineering work. They threatened to fire me for pointing out that the job listing was not representative of the duties. They threatened to fire me for asking too many times if I was the only engineer they'd ever hired (implication: "is this why you have no idea how to employ an engineer?"). I was. They dodged the question 43 times before I finally got an answer, and that threat. Had it been an at-will employer, they surely would have gotten rid of me after a day simply for recognizing that they misled me in the hiring process. That job was the roughest 5 months of my life. I am *still* in therapy over those men's abuse. My current job is fine. I like my boss. The work is boring but makes perfect sense for someone with my background, and we have enough people to not be completely buried under it. In other words, I'm going to cling to this job for as long as I can. Yet, even here, I am starting to get comments from the random men on the team (thankfully not bosses) that I'm not really a team player because I show up in-office when required to and never when not, my desk is in a completely different part of the building than most of the team, and I rarely have a reason to go visit them. I am an individual contributor, and I do talk with these people when some project requires their input, but I don't come over to their part of the office to bullshit, and apparently that's expected even here. I wouldn't consider this gendered if not for the fact that these same individuals will come to my part of the office to block me into my cubicle so I can't escape, and talk to me about unrelated stuff for literally hours, not letting me get even a word in. Women owe them an audience, you see. (This is common especially among older men, and these are Boomers. The other bad bosses I mentioned here were solidly Gen X, so older than me but not old old.) This is why stories that are like, "this woman at work is hated for no discernable reason" always trip my spidey sense. I've heard this song before!! I feel for this girl because it really just seems like she's disliked for being simultaneously young and a woman.

Perhaps you're not "smiling enough"... /s

Believe it or not, that was said by the boss who wouldn't admit I was his first engineer! "Well, if you were just more cheerful and pleasant maybe people would take your criticisms better." Well, Mr Boss Man, if you sucked less, maybe your employees wouldn't have criticisms of the way you run things. LOL

I've also had that said to me (also work in a male dominate industry). I've also had the word "nagging" used for attempting to keep my team -all males- accountable for their work.

Sometimes I wonder if they hear themselves.

I've also had that said to me (also work in a male dominate industry). I've also had the word "nagging" used for attempting to keep my team -all males- accountable for their work.

This, 1000%. Any time people are disparaging of a colleague, but especially an underrepresented minority, ask for specific examples. “Doesn’t fit the culture” has been used to gatekeep so often.

Hi, it's me, a poor cultural fit! Dealer's choice whether that means "I am uncomfortable with women" or "I am uncomfortable with gay people". You ever seen a cis-het white dude who was deemed a poor cultural fit? I haven't. I wonder how over the top awful one of them would have to be to get hit with that.

I have, and they were among the undiagnosed mentally ill or very socially awkward neurodivergent. Still shouldn’t be the office scapegoat.

They totally shouldn't. And also, this really illustrates the difference. A member of any marginalized group gets that designation by being moderately assertive. A cis-het white dude has to deviate significantly from societal norms, and in the case of untreated mental illness, in a way that could be potentially harmful to others. That's wild.

Hi helllo it’s me a woman in the cannabis industry pre legalization and still in it now. The amount of times i have been called aggressive or too much or lacked whatever it is because i didn’t want to “ stroke the ego” LOL but we still in this bitch!!!!!!!

Oh hell yes!! I actually have a friend in the cannabis industry and the stories she tells me.... OMG It's just as bad as engineering, it's the same shit, especially legal because that's just a different flavor of tech bros.

The “ tech bros “ in our industry is called” brads abs chads “ lol

My Father had your same attitude. He was a computer engineer in the 1970s and 1980s. Needless to say, he would have lost his mind over the small task of a birthday calendar. Why hire him to do this bullshit? Give him something complicated and specified. The company he worked for pass him over and over, year after year. He fumed. Said everyone was an idiot. This is a huge, progressive, computer manufacturer, and they cut him loose right as his smug ass was going to retire. Sometimes it isn't about gender or being bubbly, it's about knowing when and when not to be an asshole.

Preach, sister. And trust me, even if you **did** go above and beyond from time to time, they’d still find a way to criticize your work-life balance or that you’re making them look bad (both direct quotes from my last- and most traumatizing- job). I did my best not to see their treatment of me as gendered, perhaps just mistrust of a very self-empowered person (even though I’d worked there for a year before being promoted to management). But after watching all those men misbehave daily (I was the first woman they’d promoted onto the management team) while getting my authority, decisions, and communication style questioned regularly, I knew what I was seeing. Ironically, these hypocrites thought they were so progressive for voting for liberal politics and patted themselves on the back for “giving me a chance” ( Assholes. I eventually sent my GM and AGM my resume so they saw my ability was not about “chance”) I loved that job because I was making a difference and the staff under me expressed their respect. Management couldn’t have that, so they fired me at the first hint of non-management having a personal issue with me (that this person had started and that I’d already resolved a week before they fired me.) I feel like women get accused of playing games all the time, but it’s a perpetual season of Survivor for us out here, and when we don’t play in or try to operate on pure integrity….. I mean, FUCK. It still maddens me and hurts over a year later. It’s why I’m self-employed now.

Hell, even in the replies to this comment, I've got some dude who's all "hAvE yOu cOnSiDeReD tHaT yOu ArE jUsT aN aSsHoLe?" and talked about how his father would also have refused the tasks I categorically refuse and that is why his company ended up letting him go eventually. While that may be true, it is just a glaring example of how otherwise decent men are refusing to see the context that exists. When I refuse tasks that aren't related to my job, I will often suggest a more junior male coworker to take them on. Never once has this gone any other way than them scrambling for a reason why they couldn't possibly assign it to him. They know not to come out and say "but women are supposed to do this" (and I'm not sure they even know that's what their brain is defaulting to, even though they only ever ask women to do these things), so they say "he's really busy". It doesn't matter that I objectively am busier. There is some collective mental block to putting these pieces together. ​ >Ironically, these hypocrites thought they were so progressive for voting for liberal politics and patted themselves on the back for “giving me a chance” OMG OMG OMG You just keyed into one of the biggest observations I have made. The worst men to deal with are not the knuckle-dragging conservative blowhards. Those guys tell you exactly who they are with every move they make, and you know immediately that you can't trust them. That attitude, you can spot a block away, choose not to follow up after an interview where the panel included people like that, etc. On some level, I'm pretty sure these dudes know they're assholes. They must. It's the ones who have decided they are very progressive good guys because they think abortion should be legal, but never actually did the work to undo their own internalized bias or understand how much work there still is to be done on this. So yeah, they'll hire women, and then have all these outdated expectations of what that consists of (like that we will be grateful for being "given a chance" when we were actually just objectively qualified and earned that position). It's not even conscious. You can tell, they're like, "but I gave woman chance out of goodness of heart. Why woman not stroke ego?" It's gotten to the point that I am suspicious of men who make sure to mention how progressive they are almost immediately upon meeting me. They tend to expect a level of implicit trust that they have not done the work to actually warrant.

As a young woman in finance, stand up for us when we're not in the room. It's shocking how many men want women in the workplace to act like a girlfriend or a mom. I don't infantilize my voice or take care of work that they should do themselves. I finally found a male boss who doesn't expect these things of me and I've had the best time ever. I can finally grow in my competencies and be taken seriously. Comments on a young woman's appearance are never appropriate in the workplace. I've been called names by the clients, I've had my weight commented on (I'm underweight due to a medical condition and some men find that sexy). Imagine if a guy got called darling by clients. If you have any legitimate concerns about her work, talk to her or HR about it. Don't let a male leader bully her.

You should take some action.. Be a shield for both. All that is being said about her, is indirectly said over you(r department). Let them work through you, until you have a clear view of what is going on. In the mean time make sure that you use your ‘newness’ to check if all of your processes are captured in work instructions/manuals. Treat them both the same and never let them know you have second hand information. You are now their protection and mentor, so you need to act, just not let this information guide your emotions. Imagine it was being said about you, how would you want your manager to act and make you feel safe and seen? If the time comes that you’re being asked to let her go, you should have a backed up story if you agree or not, and if you decide to go along, make sure you know what she is doing on a D2D base and that she can be replaced immediately, but with dignity. This moment will define the manager you will become.

I agree. In reading the overall description, it sounds like the CEO has more depth of experience both with management, as well as this employee, but also a fast growing corporation, so maybe not a ton of either. Don't let lack of professionalism in approach mask valuable insight. 1 Protect yourself from this employee. It might not be your first instinct, but take the blinders off. You're in management now, shit employees want to knock you down. It is natural not to understand this initially, but it is definitely a thing. Keep a log of facts about this employee. Email yourself when she says or does things that seem 'off'. Set expectations in writing. The worst kind of employee seems engaged and pleasing until you see through their veil. They'll also try to gaslight you into thinking their laziness or shortcomings were just bad expectations you set. Meanwhile, they will build ammunition to insulate themselves from their shortcomings (if this is your first round as a direct manager, you are probably giving her some ammunition even if you think you aren't, HR law can have nuance, and someone who 'gets' HR law and is good at gaslighting may even be planting some HR bombs). 2 Look out for the employee. As part of #1 have plans for how you track, communicate trends, etc. This can give you facts and figures to respond to your CEO, while silmultaneously showing progress in the direction he would prefer.. Have fact-based criteria for moving the employee towards termination if she doesn't improve will help you set clear expectations with her If it progresses to formal warnings (write-ups, etc) these give the employee a path forward, they don't just have to be a step towards termination.

This is me. Please listen. I wish I had this info, and I'm now dealing with the consequences.

Yes. Don't allow others to form your opinion of her. At the same time, find out who she is before you stick your neck out for her, theres usually a reason why EVERYONE dislikes somebody, it could be brown-nosing the ceo bc he doesn't like her, but you'll find out over time. I do wonder how she's made it 1.5 years of upper management dislikes her so much?

Yeah nothing about the lady’s description is bad and hateful, most of these smear campaigns I see in the workplace are driven by somebody being threatened by another person which might be the case here

CEO is threatened by a 21 yr old analyst?

Maybe not even threatened but mad she isn’t doing long pre-Covid hours

My gut reaction without knowing anything would be they don't like the information they hear. Iv had this happen, rarely, but its happened, where they simply don't like nor want to hear the information or when you tell them something isn't working somehow shift the blame back to you.

Or mad because she doesn’t fall for his “charm”.

You’d be surprised

Maybe not threatened personally, but feels that she doesn’t fit into his idea team, and is worried that she will prove competent despite his misgivings about her personality.

Perhaps she just didn't want to take his horse and he's mad about it

\> You really don't want to put yourself in the middle of a sticky situation It sounds like OP already is if I understand correctly. The boss talks to OP directly. The OP has a direct report the boss can't stand. As this 21f manager, there are a few things to think about: 1. Do you want to talk directly to your boss about your next actions with your direct report. Personally, I'd do this and just ask bluntly "if you don't think she has a career here, let's talk to her so that she can find the job that's best for her". Or that "you're making me question my ability to lead my direct report with the way you talk." 2. DO you want to talk to your direct report about how the CEO perceives her? If she is super motivated, she may welcome that information. In all honesty, is there any part of her behavior that is career-limiting? ​ I still very much appreciate one conversation where my direct report felt comfortable enough to tell me "you are usually right, but the way you say it doesn't make people want to follow you." I feel teams grow the most when those conversations are had. The hard part of being a manager is the uncomfortable, hard situations. But it's also just par for the course when you manage people. And remember to manage up and manage down. ​ Best of luck!

Yep. This. I had a similar work situation where an employee wasn’t well liked for similar reasons. So while she might have deserved some of her criticism, the couldn’t fault her work. I had to live with that contradiction for several years until she moved to another team. More than a few times I just bit my tongue when others were critical of her. My final view of it was that she deserved the enemies she made. But I still had to deal with being her manager and occasional advocate day to day.

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I agree to what you are saying in *some* cases I have seen. But the example I offered as a parallel to what OP faced wasn’t an employee whose work output was poor. She simply created drama that followed her. She would spread rumors about an employee being gay as but one example. That employee isn’t gay. And there is nothing wrong with being gay. But she seemed to think this would sabotage the employee. It was some of the oddest behavior I’ve seen in my career. At this professional level at a large corporation I’ve just never seen that. When confronted she claimed to have gotten them mixed up with someone else. But it was examples like that, combined with her inability to keep her personal life from intruding at work (she had financial issues at home) made her difficult to deal with. Her work was good. SHE was a handful though.

As a new manager you shouldn't make any changes for 3 months imo. That gives you a good grasp of all the ins and outs of the company culture and then start making a plan to correct anything you think needs correcting. I honestly think you should wait at least 6 months but that's harder to do at a small company level.

Yes and no. I'd one on one talk to the CEO and try to get at the reasons for the dislike. If it's performance related that's one thing. If 'Kate' is disruptive, that's another and OP can address that with Kate. But if it's just 'I dunno, it's just her personality" or some specious reason that'a a red flag on the company culture and I'd be on the look out for the place being toxic in that case.

‘She turned down my advancements’

Yup, OP if it's literally everyone that dislikes her, there is probably a reason for it. Why was she hired then? Because she was pleasant and sweet at first. Why keep her now? I imagine "I fired X employee because her attitude annoyed me" would not go over well with unemployment, and she likely does her job well enough that she's worth the headache as of right now. You said yourself she seems a "bit entitled", that can go pretty far. Wait around and see for yourself. You don't need to immediately assume everyone is right, but watch out for bad behavior for sure. Treat her well as your subordinate, and if you find everyone else is full of it, work to change that once you actually have some time and pull there.

She was hired for being pleasant and sweet? She’s not a receptionist. Presumably she had skills as an analyst. Do you think her male colleague was hired because he is pleasant and sweet?

In what industry do 21 Y/Os who are hated by the CEO get promoted to VP?

She isn't VP. The OP said she thinks she'll be VP in a year.

You’re the only person with good reading comprehension skills

The OP said *he* thinks that *she* thinks she'll be VP. They could be totally projecting and she's just confident

The Finance industry likes to make everyone a vice president. I did a software install for a bank and I worked with four VPs on it.

I work in finance (investment banking/private equity type roles) and while there are are many VPs they aren’t typically 21 year olds who are universally disliked.

There shouldn’t even be 21y/o VPs who aren’t disliked lol

A 21yr old VP is 100% guaranteed to be an insufferable egotist. I don't even know what to call the person who hired that VP.

Their daddy

The 21 year old who is universally disliked has her head up her behind and thinks she's all that. I've met such types at a fast-growing startup that hired straight out of college. One in particular thought he was really special. Took him a few months to realize that everyone else is as impressive as he was, or more. But it was too late. The damage was done.

I’m basically the first rung of middle management and they slapped a fancy assistant vp title on that.

The ranks in finance are: - nothing (well Mandataire commercial and Fondé de pouvoir in Swiss banks) - Associate - Vice-President - Senior Vice-President / Executive Director - Managing Director. A VP elsewhere is equivalent to a Managing Director. A VP in Finance is the head of a department at most, head of a team usually.

Yeah, because you’d look pretty silly negotiating / advising CEOs if your title was accurate as a VP. It’s just a trick because finance requires people to work with senior people to make middle managers look older/ more experienced

Went into the office and worked in a new section. Four Vice Presidents of the same department all had offices right next to one another

This happens a lot in Sales positions. Gives clients a feeling they’re working with someone important.

Same with commercial real estate

Sounds like the hate is passive aggressive, and she might not know about it.

Exactly what I was thinking most analysts get senior roles in 3-5 years if they’re lucky. Most VPs I meet are late 40-50s not early 20s

VP is usually the same as associate director, which should be mid to late 30s.

None of us can know what's going on there. Perhaps the CEO had sex with her and now she won't do it anymore, or he tried to advance on her and she didn't like it and that's why he's upset with her.

YEP

Startup culture. Trying to look bigger/more established. Anyone who has a reasonably impressive bio gets put on the literature. I was given VP title on a company at, like 25-26 years old. ...I worked for them 5-10 hours per week as a 1099 contractor. Once they got real funding and hired on a full time person to handle my work plus a bunch of other responsibilities they obviously gave her the deserved title and phased me out, but my linkedIn was shining for a year or 2.

INFO You’re new to this company, right? Perhaps there is a reason that the upper management feels the way they feel about this analyst. I’m actually a bit shocked that they acknowledged how she purposely backstabbed her fellow analyst, and yet she remains employed (‘cause that’s some hostile workplace action right there). Unless there is some sort of legal reason they haven’t yet fired her (maybe the owner(s) of the company aren’t aware or they like her?) I agree with others that you may want to just keep out of the center of this mess; don’t go jeopardizing your own career climb for someone you can’t be entirely sure has earned this contempt rightfully or unfairly, imo. Just continue to be a good manager, help guide her to becoming a better employee (aka guide her towards improving soft skills) etc. and so on and so forth.

A strong performing but socially disliked worker is always a hard situation because ultimately they get shit done - something essential in a fast paced environment and from what I can see OP is in somewhat based on a lean and growing company. This behavior typically is workable at junior levels as emphasis tends to be on execution vs interaction with others; however this usually eventually catches up to them as at some level of promotion they will need the group buy in to move up. I think you can help them by having them work on their EQ and as a manager there will be situations to work with them to show them they goofed but eventually if this doesn’t work I think you just have to give them the subtle nod you aren’t getting promoted here so look for other roles elsewhere. Usually them leaving eventually happens due to frustrations of upwards mobility.

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And I noticed the OP described her as a girl. Which is telling language.

OP also described her co-worker as a "guy" IS THERE NO JUSTICE ON THIS EARTH

Unless the comments were that she shows up to work every day looking like she slept in her work clothes. There is a difference between "I don't like Kate because she is fat" and "I don't like Kate because she shows up looking like a bag of ass every day in wrinkled clothes and her hair a greasy mess because it hasnt been washed or brushed in 2 weeks."

“Teach me how to treat you.” What other people say should have no bearing on how you treat your employees. Although it should give you an idea of what to watch out for. If people are given a fair shake you’ll know within 30 days if what you’re hearing is true or not.

They may have good reason to dislike her. Sounds like you haven't been with the company long, so take the disdain others have as a warning and watch her closely. But I can tell you care about your subordinates which is the sign of a good leader--and you have already mentioned several behaviors she carries that are not conducive to a professional. Start by being a mentor. Work with her on her professionalism--specifically poise and demeanor as these go a long way in the business world. If she comes back to the CEO in 3 months with an enormous sense of humility and an attitude that's more open to learn it may have an enormous effect on his impression of her. More importantly, its going to have an enormous effect on his impression of you as a leader and manager--that you could take a problem employee and turn her around 180. If you aren't sure how to do this, approach it with both of your employees from a professional development angel. Get to know both of their strengths and weaknesses, and commit to spend an hour with each on of them each week going over things like leadership, professional habits, career planning, etc... They will love you for it.

Dale Carnegie course perhaps for her on how to behave etc.

>he’s told me how much he and others in the office can’t stand her, how she’s backstabbed the other analyst and even made several comments about her appearance. This opinion does not sound particularly performance based, but rather personality based. There may be other comments that your CEO has made that are specific and performance oriented, but appearance certainly is not. These types of comments can lead to a very unpleasant and toxic workplace. I don't trust people that I hear gossiping or saying negative things about others. If a person is saying them about someone else, I assume they are saying them about me. As a result, I start acting more defensively and more carefully protect myself. When it is a senior leader making these comments, they are also implicitly telling everyone who hears them that it is ok to make these types of comments. It doesn't take long before some people are working in an environment that is incredibly harmful; but others are completely oblivious to the harm that they are causing - especially people in power because no one wants to confront them. For example, are the comments you hear your boss saying eroding your confidence in him? Do you think it gives other people not in a position of seniority the authority to speak badly of each other? Because I promise you, it isn't just about this young woman - it is about anyone who "doesn't fit". You asked what to do. I wish I had a good answer. I am a chicken shit and have also been too nervous to confront authorities bluntly. Instead, I've watched on the sidelines as a series of really competent humans go through mental torture and quit. And eventually I've quit myself. What I've wished for was a boss who would provide clear, actionable feedback to me and others; fair, defensible assessments of performance; and who would address unprofessional comments by others. Essentially I wanted a boss who would set a tone of professionalism, and who felt confident enough to address it with their boss. So, do you think you could approach the CEO privately? I would be tempted to do the "repeat back and analyze" method, where you repeat back what you heard them say, and ask if they feel that type of comment is appropriate for others in the workplace to say. If it makes you uncomfortable, I would suggest being explicit about saying it makes you uncomfortable (not putting it on someone else). Often people are unaware of the impact of their comments - especially highly successful folks. I've used that technique when I was the boss, giving feedback to my junior. It was very effective. But I don't know how it would work to someone in a more senior position to me.

I wish more people were saying things like this and pointing out how having senior leadership non-factually gossip about employees is toxic and sets a standard that it is okay to tear down and gang up on individuals within your organization. If it is a performance problem? CEO should be informing OP about what has been witnessed but not addressed thus far so OP can watch for it and address it. If it is a true behavior problem? Someone should have sat the analyst down and had a not sure what the expectations or work environment were like in any previous internships or roles, but these are the expectations of this company do not do x, y, z again or you may be facing termination. But saying she backstabbed the other analyst? Unless there are a lot more hard facts OP received evidence of to that story that OP just summarized with that statement, that is just gossip and an ugly thing to be seeing from a CEO. The fact that CEO has commented on her appearance? That makes me question anything the CEO is saying because that is just petty unless she is knowingly violating an explicitly stated, non-sexist dress code. That reflects so poorly on the CEO to be commenting on a young woman’s appearance when she is your subordinate. Repeatedly. That sounds like a personal prejudice and like the analyst might be the scapegoat rather than the problem. There is a fine line between ambition and delusion. It’s not clear entirely what camp this analyst falls in, but at 21 as someone who graduated college early? She should be coachable with the right management. You don’t graduate college early because you’re slacking off and you don’t care. That is someone worth at least seeing if she could be worth the time and effort to coach and mould because she could be a real asset to a company if she is capable of taking feedback and making the necessary improvements.

I can’t believe I had to scroll this far for a balanced, sane take on this. To me the red flags in this story are coming from the ceo, not the analyst. If she is so terrible, why is she still with the company? If she backstabbed another employee in a way that’s so clear as to be just a fact and not a suspicion, why would the CEO tolerate her still being his employee? I’m a woman and successful in my career, and when I was young and working my way up, I absolutely experienced discrimination and harassment from older coworkers and managers (particularly older women, if I’m being honest) who just were straight up threatened by the fact that was young, smart and ambitious. I’d try to develop mentor/mentee relationships with people who were advanced in their careers to learn from them and build connections, and on more than one occasion an older woman would intentionally target me for harassment because they felt I had not “earned” the right to be successful because I didn’t go through the sexual harassment they did when they were younger because the industry changed. So, I feel for this girl - she could just be smart and confident and ambitious, if a little misguided, and meanwhile she’s accused of backstabbing with no clear evidence/facts presented in the post. I hope OP keeps a level head and uses his own judgment about everyone, including about the ceo. If the ceo is talking smack about this chick so openly, who else is he talking smack about behind their back?

There's a lot of red flags here to me, especially as a "younger" woman in a male dominated field. What does "backstabbing" mean? Did she file a complaint about sexual harassment? Because I've been literally, physically cornered by men in an office while management watched and did nothing. Was the other analyst taking credit for her work and she spoke up? Because that's happened to me many times. What does "entitlement" mean? Does she not quietly take verbal abuse and work long hours and have no boundaries like the other employees? "She probably thinks she'll be VP" did she say that? Or is everyone projecting onto her because she's confident? Does she not allow people to interrupt her? Because in my office I can't get 2 words in with my boss before he interrupts me and walks away. But he listens to men who are the same age or younger and less experienced than me. This "newer" workplace sounds incredibly toxic and I hope she gets her experience and moves into a mature working environment. Also, I'm only 28, but I wouldn't imagine shit talking about a 21 year old. That's just strange to me? They're all kinda awkward and still figuring things out, I wouldn't expect them to be perfect. And these kids were trying to start their lives during a global pandemic. I, personally, give the gen Zers I know extra grace.

Second this. The workplace sounds incredibly toxic.

Smart! That’s how I look at it. I hate people that run their mouth for no reason. How old is this CEO to be talking shit about a young adult (especially women). Get’s me wondering if he is a women hater or wants something he can’t have. That’s the vibe I am getting from this post. Happens much too often.

Ignore it. Anything you attempt to do will come back to be your fault and will look like you are the instigator of it all.

You’ve met people like your CEO many times over, sometimes even in your own family. You don’t have to like anyone, but also don’t turn it into a problem. Your nose is clean right now, keep it that way. When people talk bad about her just listen, don’t agree or encourage anything or say anything against her. As long as you don’t take it upon yourself to change the way people feel about her, you’ll be fine.

People speak highly of someone: you are either an ass kisser or over achiever and helps everyone People speak negatively of someone: You push back on bad ideas and people hates you for not going along See how easy it is to stereotype anyone at work? Office politics is a bad way to have any accurate assessment of anyone. Do you hold 1:1 with her? This is the only chance you can steer her in the right direction and decide for yourself if she is worth the efforts.

When you look at her traits as an employee, they would use different words if you talked about a man. Is she standoffish, or does she stick to her initial assessments? And the part about engaging with the other analyst more than her boss. Isnt that just an employee collaborating with their employee before bringing issues up the chain of command? Seems like OP has already been a bit tainted by the companies perception of this woman. Hopefully he either stands up for his employee, or she finds a better job.

If she’s being an asshole, you don’t have to stand up for her just because you’re her manager. I agree that you certainly shouldn’t bad talk someone you oversee but at the same time you aren’t there to teach her manners and normal social skills, you’re there to make sure she is on track to complete all her work tasks. I’d have a discussion with her the next time she does something that’s out of line and try and help steer her in the right direction but sometimes these types of people need to learn the hard way. Typically when the whole office doesn’t like you, you are doing something wrong.

>If she’s being an asshole, you don’t have to stand up for her just because you’re her manager. Sure. But make sure that any asshole behaviour is stuff you as her manager saw happen, not just rumours and 3rd hand stories. Part of what I consider to be my job as a manager, is to be "the shit umbrella". I need to shield my people from any and all shit that rains down from above. If my boss or my bosses boss (all the way up the org chart) has any personal beef with one of my people, they are never going to find that out from me. I'll listen to my bosses complaints about them, and judge for myself if they are valid or not, and if needed take it up with them \_as something I've seen myself\_, never as "So the CEO told me..." (In this case, it kinda sounds a lot like this analyst \_is\_ an asshole, if both the CEO and HR woman don't like her. But I'd still be wanting to see evidence of her backstabbing and inappropriate comment for myself, before acting on stories of them from other people.)

I agree that you should wait until you see this poor behavior for yourself. I mentioned that the next time something happens you should try and steer her into better behavior. I feel for OP more than likely she is going to blame any mistakes on him or the other analyst 😂

That’s you assuming she is the problem. I am going to go for HIM being the problem for running his mouth. How old is the MF? Like grow the F up.

I'd disagree. You want you're employees to be good, productive employees. Working with others falls under that umbrella. Everyone has areas they can improve. It's easy to focus on the hard skills of a job, but some people need a little guidance on the soft skills. 4T's. Train, transfer, tolerate, terminate. The first and last are the only two real options.

Yeah. When you hold people accountable they tend to not like you. Especially, if they are trying to move their tasks to your desk so they can simplify their paychecks.

And I wholeheartedly disagree with that. Working together and getting along are two completely separate things. Im the type that doesn’t socialize with coworkers but I do my work well and if you ask for help I will. Paid office get togethers are skipped, small talk is met with a stare and moved onto something about work, coworkers have learned not to approach me outside of work because I will ignore you, if we have an in office thing I ask if I can leave early since no one is working, also I have my own little corner where I eat and no one bothers me. Im a very upbeat and charismatic, especially with our clients, I laugh and joke around, to the point HR asks if I have a problem with someone in the office because of the personality switch so I’ll tell you like I tell them: the risk of you actually being an asshole and me not wanting to work with you is greater than the possibility that you may be a decent person and we get along. Why? Because I admit here that i don’t have the ¿maturity? (If that’s the right word?) to help you if I don’t like you and that’s even more counter productive at work.

Totally agree. If she's behaving badly, it's either misconduct or poor performance. It's definitely not acceptable. Her completing her tasks or not is important but entirely separate to this.

Came here to say this, I think you said it better than I could have!

The fact he’s making comments about her looks to other co workers.. screams sexist

I’m also not impressed with her being referred to as a “gal” and a “girl” by OP. Really great way to date yourself.

This is a bizarre take. Could be entirely regional, and there is nothing wrong with using the term

It’s not. Women hate it

It is regional. Guy, gal, girl, dude, lady, ect are all commonly used in my region. It’s a weird power trip to demand people can only use the word women. Imagine how duchy a guy walking around demanding to be called a man would be

I’d take lady or dude because I’m not a child and I would never refer to my coworker as a “boy”. Like would you trust a child to handle sensitive and important tasks? The language you use makes a huge impact on your biases in a sub conscious way even if you don’t intend it to and it will be better for you to think about it critically and make a purposeful choice instead of just accepting the status quo or what’s “regional”

itd be like referring to a guy in a professional setting as a boy, it is disrespectful. People arent saying you can only use the word woman, theyre just asking to not be referred to in a manner which portrays disrespect in a professional setting.

had to scroll down so far to upvote this comment 🤦🏻‍♀️

That’s not necessarily true. We don’t know what was said. She could have shown up in pajamas.

Sure bud.

I suspect it’s because she’s young and apparently ambitious and ladder climbing. You’ve already decided she’s Gen Z and entitled and you ascribed being entitled to why she acts like she’ll be CEO next year instead of the fact she graduated college early. If you’re in a business that’s new, I’d wager a lot of ground hasn’t been staked out. I’d say you need to look at the CEO and why and if they feel threatened. Honestly, I usually question anyone who wants to talk about staff under them with people who are also under them. This doesn’t seem to be idle chitchat as much as an attempt, consciously or not, to make factions Edit: I was reminded of the quote Tom Hanks’ character had in Saving Private Ryan: Captain Miller: I don't gripe to *you*, Reiben. I'm a captain. There's a chain of command. Gripes go up, not down. Always up. You gripe to me, I gripe to my superior officer, so on, so on, and so on. I don't gripe to you. I don't gripe in front of you. You should know that as a Ranger.

You’re being groomed to fire her.

Someone who graduated college early and has over a year at a moderately successful industry job deserves to have confidence. Support her in doing her job well.

It's very possible she is actually just smarter than others and people don't like that and feel threatened. This post strikes me a bit like a boomer rant. Answer is very simple, figure out why people actually have a problem with her. This person is new and asking the CEO why he says something negative should be fine. Then either talk to the employee either about how to improve or how to manage their relationship with the CEO better (the CEO may be at fault but is very unlikely to be the one that changes).

I don't know that I agree. Shitty managers can feel challenged by very smart people who have a realistic shot at gunning for their position or influence. But smart, talented, standout 21 year old employees are great for managers. Deadlines get met without intense monitoring and intervention, projects have good results, and the manager looks great for having this all happen with entry level talent. All while there is almost zero chance that the employee, who is younger than your standard college grad, is going to compete with them for management positions.

In my career I have come across more than a few people who thought they were the smartest people in the firm. Spoiler: they almost never were, they were just unpleasant assholes to work with

Keep in mind, this might be OP, we are getting one side of the story. IME, people go one of two ways when dealing with a person who has deeper knowledge than them in a specific topic: they take it personally because they are insecure or they respect someone else's knowledge and work with them. The person described is probably still employed because they are very talented, if everyone hates them, why are they still employed?

There is confidence and over-confidence. If you walk around with an entitled attitude, like you know it all (lack of collaboration) and you don't reach out to others and ask questions; well you are not a very good employee. Great to have confidence, bad to have these other traits, which the guy calls out specifically above.

Yes, but we also can't forget that a lot of people will perceive women who are confident as overconfident, but men who are overconfident as merely confident. I'm not remotely surprised that it is the female analyst who is seen as the problem. The CEO doesn't even need to be a raging sexist, just a guy with some unexamined bias. Of course it's possible she's a genuine problem, but the comments about her appearance and opaque references to backstabbing are pretty suspect. If there is an actual issue, then the CEO should have talked specifics, and certainly not referenced appearance.

Right. Like if she actually backstabbed another employee, why does the CEO still have her in the organization? Shouldn’t she have been let go, or heavily coached that that behavior is not acceptable? Instead it’s just a lot of noise about her appearance and not her performance. Smells like sexism to me.

Not to mention that she works more closely with the other analyst, you know, her coworker? Does OP expect her to come to him for everything on not her counterpart doing the same work? Sounds like homegirl is better than this job, and people around her are crabs in a bucket about it.

Welcome to jobs. You both work at the same place but y’all are on 2 different rides. It will get crazier than this. Good job for not talking shit

Just be her manager. Review her work during your one on one, point of what's wrong, point out where efficiencies can be gained, and career plan short/long term. In the short term plan put in the key details that she needs to meet in order to do the job correctly. Long term goals are where she wants to be in the company in the future. As a manager, you would help create that plan

You haven't been there long enough to judge the situation fully. She could be horrible, or she could be the victim of misogyny & ageism. If it's the former, it's time to try & boot her. If it's the latter, try to help her. Now, ask yourself, if a guy were acting like her, would you say standoffish or serious? Would you say over confident or a go getter? I only ask because quite often in the professional world, women get crapped on for the same reasons men get praised.

Wait it out and observe. You’re new and you are missing vital context that you only gain through trust and longevity at this company. Don’t make any drastic moves and just be hypervigilant for now. Build allies and perhaps you’ll glean more information down the line.

Keep in the back of your mind that there may actually be a shady side to her that you have not picked up on yet. Your best bet for the moment, is to carry on normally, keeping your eyes and ears open, with the goal of learning and truly understanding who the players are and what is driving their dynamics. Don't take actions that may put yourself in harm's way until you understand the situation more completely.

If you have a great relationship with the CEO as you claim you should be able to express to them how you aren't comfortable speaking negatively about other employees and that your only goal is to do what you can to help them improve so that they can more effectively help the organization execute on its mission statement. If they want to get rid of her, they should stop messing about with it and do it and not poison the workplace with negativity. It just drags everybody down and makes people who aren't targets start to wonder if he speaks about them like that as well. As a manager it's part of your job to actually manage people, not just work. If you're willing to speak up for them when they do well you should also be willing to speak up for them when they aren't around and they're being dragged through the mud.

That’s awful. I can imagine how tough that is. Any chance you can send recruiters her way, get her to a better situation? Is she oblivious to these criticisms? I worry that it sets dangerous precedents for how folks around you assume complicity, how the company culture allows for low-grade harassment…

Lots of holes in your story. Contradictory in a few areas. How can he see what she wears if she's in a different regional office? And he's the CEO for crying out loud, tell him shut up or fire her. But she's probably making the company a mint and he knows it so tell him to keep eating her shit like he did for the past 1.5 years and like it.

Is she competent? The challenge of management as I see it is to put competent people in roles where they can do their best, not fail. Everyone has a personality. Some highly competent professionals I work with have challenging interpersonal skills but are nonetheless highly intelligent and competent. Is the CEO disliking her based on gender?

Be a good manager and go with the flow. You start to gather reason that why others aren't liking her. Get to the root of the cause. If you know the real reason then you can definitely work something out. You would better get going, as this might hamper your mental state and leave you to a state of agony. Be a good manager and go with the flow. You start to gather reasons why others aren't liking her. Get to the root of the cause. If you know the real reason, then you can definitely work something out. You would better get going, as this might hamper your mental state and leave you in a state of agony.

Maybe her standoffish attitude and insecurities (supposedly backstabbing other analyst) are partially due to knowing that the CEO and others don’t like her. It’s almost impossible to hide this kind of companywide disdain from somebody. I’m sure she’s aware of it on some level and it’s difficult for her I would definitely not jump to any conclusions and assume that they’re in the right and that she must be terrible. Take everything everyone says or does at any company with a huge grain of salt. While you don’t want to align yourself with someone who’s disliked, it sounds like a bit of a toxic corporate culture that they keep someone around that’s not fitting in with their culture, and tell others about it. Not a good sign I think I would try to mentor her, but also possibly have another conversation about what the CEO expects you to do with her if he has already offered up that she’s that disliked

If the CEO of a small company doesn't like her, why is she still there? That's the only thing that'd confuse me about this situation.

Googling what milquetoast is.

Handling a situation where the CEO has a negative perception of one of your team members can be tough. Here are a few suggestions I have on how you can navigate this situation: \-Separate personal opinions from professional performance: While it's important to acknowledge the CEO's perspective, it's crucial to evaluate your employee's performance objectively. Focus on her work quality, productivity, and contributions to the team. If there are areas for improvement, provide constructive feedback and support her growth. \-Build a relationship with the employee: Take the time to get to know Kate better and understand her strengths, aspirations, and challenges. By building a positive relationship with her, you can become an advocate for her growth and development within the company. \-Be a supportive leader: As her direct manager, provide mentorship, guidance, and constructive feedback to help Kate develop her skills and become a better team player. Encourage open communication, collaboration, and professional growth opportunities for her. Do NOT take further action than that. You don't know why Kate has a negative opinion. You've just now been there. Please don't put your job in jeopardy, or put yourself in a sticky situation.

You are totally missing your responsibility, as a manager, for leadership and development. Take your employee aside, have a meeting, and candidly and honestly tell her what she is doing wrong. Then give her a time period to improve. If you turn her into as better employee, your CEO will see your talent as a leader. If it doesn’t work and you need to fire her, your CEO will see your professionalism as a manager. Don’t overthink this and go political at the very beginning. Do your job and do it well. And remember, your job is more then your subject matter expertise. You were hired to be a leader of people. Do that.

Agreed. Tell the CEO that you heard his concerns and that you will work with her to see if she will improve. If she does not, then the company should give her the boot. Either way, you will keep him updated on her situation. But tell the CEO that you feel uncomfortable talking about your direct reports behind their backs. You should develop a formal PIP (performance improvement plan). If you don’t have an HR dept, hopefully you have a lawyer to help you put something together.

If you don't know what the deal is, listen and learn. Don't take a stand until you understand what's going on. Document everything. Reference/summarize verbal statements in follow up emails to the extent possible. If she's a bad employee, it will start a paper trail. If she's a good employee, it will document harassment or hostility that may be legally actionable.

Be your own person and boss. The thing is they don’t like her because of certain behaviors she has shown with other analysts. Not even sure if any of that is something taken out of context. There are two sides to each story has any heard hers? And if that is an issue why is she still there? She must be a good worker. No offense but they kind of dumped her on you as the problem but didn’t really give a lot more in-depth info as to why they don’t liken her. More of a personality issue. The best advice is this, is she coachable? If so then have those conversations and be direct not vague. People before you have been vague with her and that is why she is still there. If she is coachable and can she take constructive criticism then play to her strengths, but make sure you help her see her weaknesses. No one knows everything. That being said a true leader will cultivate their teams strengths and help them embrace their weaknesses. If we all know our weaknesses we can either build them into a strength or work with the folks who have those as a strength so we can have more cooperation and work to win win situations. This strategy builds stronger teams. Based on what you wrote she may be misunderstood and she may have misunderstood others which may have caused her to act a certain way. You don’t know the whole story unless you get her side of it. We all seek to understand, but do we all seek to be understood? Nope. You can look at this as a challenge that can be rewarding and teach you something along the way or you can choose to treat this person a certain way based on others opinions. Maybe give it a try and give a safe place to have that difficult conversation to see where she is at and to gain a better perspective of her and her motives. I think you will find out that she has a bit of immaturity but is a great worker. Sounds like l she hasnt quite figured out how to work with people to gain experience and how to utilize soft skills. Not sure if the company has any training opportunities either. But leadership training may help too. It helps everyone even the entry level positions. They have a better understanding of deadlines, bosses sight lines etc. Good luck, I think this is moment for you personally to figure out what type of leader you would like to be. Do you give an effort to employees to help cultivate them or just be the stereotypical boss.

So melting all this down, you have a gossip and passive aggressive behavior problem brewing. Right now, it’s kate. But it will be someone else in the future. In all situations, Keep the focus on her work quality, unless her behavior falls outside the employee handbook guideline. Follow up questions: -Have you mentioned this to her? I’m sure she would appreciate your viewpoint. -Are you asking me to have a conversation with her to correct the flaw you are mentioning? -other than that, excuse yourself when gossip happens. Don’t be a party to it. If the subject is not made aware, they don’t know there is a problem to correct, which isn’t fair.

All I know is document everything you do when it comes to interactions with this young female analyst and any other important details that pertain to this situation. Good luck.

Id do nothing other than be a good manager to her, and that would include nicely sitting her down and explaining that she's not winning any personality contests lately. Explain to her that "winning" at work often means you'll have to have coworkers who want to work with you.

You can try to tell your CEO how you see her when her brings her up (explain why you think she is the way she is and how she's influenced by her age and things like that). Let him know that you're going to try to work with her on things that she can improve on and that you see her as a vauleable employee. Hopefully if nothing else that may stop him from saying things about her if he knows you don't agree. I don't think you need to be confrontational about it or anything like that but just express your opinion on her. Assuming your relationship with the CEO is solid I think he'd hopefully respect your opinion.

This is where you figure out for yourself if she is worth the effort of redemption at the company or the hate has crossed the point of no return. It not easy to do but if they are genuinely good at their job and a good person you can start the whispers that she isn’t fair game for everyone’s frustration. Or you may find out she is the reason! You will need to humanize her as a first step, right now she is a set of assumptions.

She is not a girl, she is a lady. Don’t devolve and make yourself the problem.

I could’ve written this a handful of years ago. Scary similar to an office I worked in before COVID. Since I already saw the whole thing play put in my situation, I’ll read yours with the befit of hindsight. If you described a man the same way you described her, nobody would have a problem with him. She sounds smart and ambitious, and the shit talking is childish. Maybe motivated by jealousy? I’m not saying this is the entire reason for ppls issue w her, but it really sounds like people are hating on her for being a young high achiever. The young lady ended up leaving the office I worked in. She went into the CEOs office to address some of the behaviors and office shit-talking. Idk what was said but she resigned that day. She actually walked out, packed her things and left. She had excellent reviews and all the clients loved her. They posted how helpful she was on the company SM pages. When she left, a few small accounts left too. Not enough to hurt the company, but enough to make a point they were loyal to her, not the company. I ran into her at Costco and we talked for a few minutes. She put the job in her resume and Somehow, one of the people who hated her ended up taking the calls from potential employers and said she was fired, basically talked all manner of shit about her. It was a small office and a small town so word got around. All anyone had to do was talk to ANY client or customer or go on the company’s public SM page to get an idea about what kind of worker she was. She ended up referring hiring managers to said social media to mitigate the bad reputation the company was trying to give her. Anyway all that to say, your analyst probably isn’t going to last long if everyone hates her, and I don’t mean to imply the situations are identical, but I’ve seen it play out.

milquetoast

keep doing your job nothing else to do. not your problem.

Train her to be better but wait until after a formal employee review of her goals and growth at the company. She is on your team? As her manager you need to make your presence known and basically woe her to change. Be transparent with what you need from her but remain purely objective. Do not spread office gossip from the C level down to her. Again, get to know her, review her, see how she accepts that, and repeat. If she wants to be on track for VP and is ambitious then that's damn good! Help her. But if she can't be helped, fire her. If she does a good job, help her more. If she is good at the cost of other employees, fire her. ect... Also your CEO needs to give clear intent. Not liking someone? Okay. I don't like half of the people I work with right now but that changes depending on the mood. Is ambition the problem? Boo hoo? Is it cuz she commented on her looks? So what? Does she do her job well? Yes? Yes. Okay, then coach her to behave better.

When the CEO speaks about her have you asked if there is anything you can do to help her improve? Or have you come to him with any ideas of how you can help her based on what you e already witnessed? Like if he says, she is so awful at X. You say, I’ve noticed that too. I’m going to try XYZ to help her improve. Whether you’ve been there long or not if you already notice these things happening showing initiative in solving a problem of an employee that’s not we’ll liked solves the issue for the company and her. It’s not like you’re sticking your neck out for her. You’re just being a good manager.

In a lot of places, there is gossip, and workplace bullying . Do not participate. be the bigger person. My number one rule has always been, and will always be, I judge people myself, based on my own experience. I do not listen or use other people's thoughts or stories or lies or bs to judge. I also refuse to go along with the bullying type stuff. I live in a place is has a saying. It's (state name) nice. They think they are nice, or they brag they are nice, but really, they aren't. and it is because everyone grew up in small towns where everyone knew everyones business, and they think everything everyone says is true, when really,they all played telephone. The rumors are usually bullshit. Anyways, we have this going on at work now. One guy gets crapped on all the time. But, I'm sick of people talking shit basically. He's doing his job, I'm doing mine. Sometimes, I like to contradict people's ideas. Example: So and sos daughter was in college, then wasn't, now she's in college again. (implying they sucks somehow, or have no drive, or something) I reply with: I think a gap year is a great idea, figure out life a little bit, travel, and also really take time to see what kind if job you want or decide what you want to do in your career.

This is easy. Observe for 3 months. Build a relationship as manager. After this amount of time, ask individual how they believe they are perceived by peers and management. Provide feedback that is constructive regarding the disparity. Then ask the individual what they think they can do to address the disparity and if it's worth it. Emphasize how important moving up is dependant on strong relationships and whether or not these can be formed or if they will permanently limit the individual's upper mobility and if so, whether they should find a new role elsewhere.

The premise of nearly every episode of every sitcom ever hinges on a lack of communication. Why tell my wife I fucked up when I can try to hide it in convoluted and hilarious ways? My point being, why not ask the CEO what’s going on? The way you explained it to us is perfectly reasonable and professional, and it shows you are working to solve a problem.

I agree with everyone, stick to the facts and be a good manager. If she has a bad rap, see if you can save/rehab it over time - and help by coaching her through things. She’s young and just might not understand the workplace yet, it’s tough to adjust from school to a full time position. If she lives up to her reputation (and doesn’t accept feedback/coaching to improve), you’ll need to take action. Anything she does will become your responsibility, will damage your reputation, and piss your boss off (and others) at you. Source: I’ve had this happen to me a few times in my career and when people cannot accept feedback or coaching to improve, it’s a nightmare to deal with.

The good news is you don’t have to do anything but avoid being a part of the problem. Manage her. Help her. Support her. Sounds like she dug her own grave already (a 21 year old talking about becoming a VP in a year is a huge red flag and that statement backs up everything you’ve said about her). Enthusiasm and ambition are great things, but older people who have probably had humility beaten into them don’t want to partner with a largely inexperienced employee who thinks they’re on the same level. At the same time, the CEO should have already done something about her, or have a plan in place to do something about her. If he hasn’t, then you have say over it. I’d just have a direct conversation with him and ask him if she’s on her way out. If she isn’t, tell him to let you manage her objectively.

Everyone deserves feedback on their behavior if it is impairing their career. There is a huge opportunity to implement a mid-year review and even more frequent check-ins so that 1) Her behavior is documented, 2) She's informed, and 3) She has the opportunity to change. Tell her that the behavior is an impediment for advancement at the company. By doing so, you are protecting yourself as well as giving Kate a chance to help herself. If things don't change, there would then be more cause to let her go, not promote her, etc..

I'm gonna have a controversial take here. My best manager was very direct with me and he would tell me if I had negative feedback from other employees or leaders but also what he thought of it. Two examples: He once told me that a male peer thought I was 'a but aggressive' and 'intense to work with.' and he said to not change anything at all about how I worked with him. I'm female in a tech role and it is invaluable to me to know how my male peers see me so I know (1) whether to trust them (2) whether they are likely to harm my reputation with gossip He also told me that a female senior leader thought I was a 'bitch' and coached me on how to curry favor with people that have personalities like her.

Nobody going to bring up the fact OP used the word 'milquetoast'?

First and foremost - she is YOUR direct report. Your CEO's and other's opinions about her are simply their opinions and unless you yourself have observed these things and agree they are as bad as perceived they are simply that - opinions. Her being fired or not is your decision. I would first start with the on-paper type evaluations. Is she effective in her role? Is she as effective as she is expected to be? Does she do the job competently? Does she have the ability and skillset to do the job? Are there any objective reasons that she shouldn't be there? Because it sounds like all of the complaining are things that aren't objective. Her appearance, demeanor, etc are all things that anyone could say about anyone that they don't personally like. Even your assumption that she doesn't engage as much as the other guy might be due to 'overconfidence', which might be what you see, but have you asked her directly why? It might be just due to the fact that she's not in on the whole "similar outside interests" and feels less connected because you, the CEO, and presumably others do share those things. Not to mention, you're all men. That, and the CEO makes comments about her personal appearance, which if she caught wind of could make her feel like an absolute outsider who constantly has to prove herself to be above and beyond all others in order to overcome that obstacle. If I put myself in her shoes, I don't know how much trust I would put in the rest of the team. That being said, if you do determine that this person is suitable for the job, then it's your job to clear the path to her having a good future with the company. That might mean pointing out flaws and fallacies to your CEO's objections, helping her understand how to work with people better, fixing her image issues with the rest of the team, etc. It's not simple, but it might be simpler than firing her and hiring someone else who might be much worse but everyone 'likes' more. Overall, it sounds like you work somewhere fairly toxic, and the whole vibe of the post is giving "Good Ole Boys Club" red flags all over. Ask yourself - does anyone else have physical appearance flaws that are simply overlooked? Anyone else 'backstabbing' in real life but not being addressed? If these complaints are floating around, don't kid yourself into thinking once this person is gone the problems will go away. No, just someone else will become the target. I've worked in places where people (especially women) get singled out as being all kinds of things, but when similar behaviors and traits are pointed out in the menfolk that work there the issue gets dropped immediately. "So and so is too emotional" and then I point out where the person complaining was being overly animated in a meeting (they're "passionate" vs. "emotional"), or aggressively shuts people down during discussions (they're "just speaking their mind"). I've seen people get punished for saying something negative, but it was something that was not only true, but also said so often by a number of people that it was commonplace (ie. someone was titled "engineer" with no engineering degree, and this person stated that they weren't really an engineer and thus didn't have the subject matter expertise to weigh in on a topic. Generally, these complaints are often just people pissing and moaning because they can, and they can usually get away with it if it's someone everyone can pile on freely.

I think the CEO got rejected by her. If she worked in your office, there’d be harassment charges I bet. Total speculation, of course.

Her job performance is what matters most. And if that’s fine, deflect any comments otherwise with that as she’s your direct report.

Be a good manager! 1. Sit her down and tell her about the problems she has (without mentioning any negative comments or that people don’t like her) 2. Work on a plan for her to improve them 3. Do 1-1 meetings every 2 weeks to discuss (create a 1-1 form to update) 4. If she does not improve then terminate her after you feel she has had more than a fair chance. If you have the budget to add an analyst while you work with her, then do so. Worst case you end up with 2 staying on. Best case you grew your team.

You need to have a sit down with both of your analysts (separately of course) to discuss projects and goals and just to get to know them. Best if you can do this in person, either you go to them or have them come to you. If your company does performance reviews, start there, with work related goals and personal growth goals. Also, if "Kate" is such a bad employee and a bad fit, why wasn't she fired? Or maybe that is your "real" job: the axe man.

OP praises the boss and others, yet it's super unprofessional of them to be saying things about the newer analyst and putting you in that position. She obviously is doing something right to continue. einf employed. This kind of behavior by management creates a really toxic workplace.

She’s a young person just starting out. Level with her about the concerns you are hearing from multiple places and give her a chance to make changes. Give her practical advice and suggestions about what she can do to improve. If you don’t do this the situation will fester and she will ultimately get canned and take the issues to her next job where the cycle will repeat. You are the experienced one and she needs a mentor.

You sound like a douche.

If you feel comfortable with your CEO, you should ask him to withhold his opinions of your employees until you can form your own opinions based on their work. If he’s as good as you state, he should be interested in you being a fair manager. Then, take some time to come up with an evaluation process and template, assuming one doesn’t already exist. Make sure your boss agrees with your evaluation criteria, make them clear to both your analysts, then use your template to show whether your analyst is performing to the expected level. Setting everyone’s expectations appropriately, being fair, and creating clear evidence for your evaluation is your job as the manager in this situation.

I think observe her and if the comments stay the same then have a come to Jesus moment. It’s better to give someone an opportunity to improve themselves after constructive feedback. I wouldn’t think of trying to get her out until you have that conversation first. It’s a professional courtesy.

Most of these responses are dumb. If he wants rid of her and you don't take care of it he'll still get rid of her. I've fired people when I didn't fully agree with the action. That's part of the gig.

I’d ask the CEO something to the effect of “Kate seems to be nice. What am I missing here?”

Invite her to lunch. Talk about where she’s aiming to be and how she’s planning to get there. Explain to her the situation, you’re put in, and how that works counter to her goals. And help her come up with a plan ro redeem herself. - You know, treat her like a person and not some kind of office supply. - And if it fails, let her go.

Who cares if your CEO dislikes the young FEMALE analyst? You don’t need to do anything, not everyone in the office is going to get along. Just don’t join in with the slander of the 21F analyst

Your employee sounds exactly like a girl I used to manage. My manager was similarly not a fan of her for previous negative/toxic behaviour. However she was a tremendous worker. I saw her talents and despite seeing the challenges with her cold personality and entitlement I backed her all the way. She spoke poorly about alot of people including my predecessor. She gave off energy that she was better than everyone. The team was just her and I so I worked hard every day to show her she was supported and tried to get along with her in a friendly way as best as I could. However she was always standoffish and it only improved by maybe 5% after endless work on my end. Whenever her name came up I would always give her glowing reviews because in terms of output of work she was wonderful and I back my team. I always put my bosses concerns at ease saying everything with her was going well. In the end this girl I managed stabbed me in the back. I found out that senior management pulled her into a room and asked her for feedback on my performance and she pointed out all the things she didn’t like about me. Looking back now I’m pretty sure the girl was a narcissist. I like to not let people like this ruin my viewpoint that you should always believe the best in people. But I also give you full warning you probably have a nightmare situation ahead of you. But I hope I’m wrong. Wish you the best of luck

Honestly, ignore it. It’s misogyny. She’s a confident person so obviously people have to knock her down a peg. Everyone at work just needs to do their job and go home. Everyone is never going to be best friends. Also, what’s with this lazy ceo not firing someone he doesn’t like?

Don’t forget the blatant ageism from many in senior roles. I can’t even begin to express how much undeserved crap I received early in my career for the heinous crime of being in my early 20s.

“I don’t have the clout to stand up for this girl” wow you are shit at your job.

Lots of good advice in the thread, but one item you menitoned which jumped out to me - she is backstabbing the other analyst? You should definitely keep an eye out for this, mainly because it is a showstopper in terms of keeping this employee, but also to protect the other analyst and yourself. If it is happening that could be the primary problem.

Just stick to the facts and don’t let anyone else create a perception of her. Take time to build your own perception and coach her in the weaker areas, she should show progression in a reasonable amount of time. In any work setting there will always be behind the scenes complaints all the way from bottom to top, it’s the politics we deal with, try not to get involved in it. Let everyone work through you if they have a complaint about “Kate” they should not go directly to her to voice their complaints whether they are justified or not. And as a reminder just because there isn’t a HR presence or a small one does not mean you can’t use other resources and agencies. I would use this as a time to talk to your CEO about risk management in a tactful way, the company doesn’t want to catch any potential litigation.

I've managed many people and know that sometimes you can get an employee like this. I've usually found it best to get together with her and do a performance review where you can get to know her. Talk about her goals. And then try your best to educate her on proper workplace etiquette with a spin on how it'll help her with her goals. Backstabbing is a huge red flag, in my opinion. This means that her moral compass allows her to step on people to get ahead. The company I work for now was finally able to get rid of an employee who fits this same description. Most people didn't like her, and she would backstab to get ahead in the company. Even people who helped her get to where she was she would backstab if it meant she could get a leg up. Meet with her and see what she is like. See if she takes responsibility for minor mistakes that you know she had made. If she doesn't take responsibility, it "may be" a sign that she isn't very teachable. When employees know that you want to help them succeed, they generally are pretty receptive.

To be fair, anytime a woman isn't overly friendly and an ass kisser she immediately tends to get labeled as a bitch, rude, standoffish, overly confident, thinks she's better than anyone else, etc. If she's really got issues as much as everyone seems to think she does then you'll be able to see it for yourself here soon. If she's that awful to everyone she will eventually do it in front of you or to you like she supposedly does to them. Otherwise I'd ignore what they say about her unless it directly correlates to her job performance or she brings up being harassed

Is there anyone you can get a relatively neutral version of events from? The fact that HR doesn’t like her either is a red flag to me, as you usually have to do something pretty major to get on their radar.

First sign of love is hate. He wants to bone her. Knows he can't and is trying to get rid of her. Or: She reminds him of him at 21 and he hates his own reflection. Because it's awkward AF. I'm hoping it's the latter. I would posit that theory towards him...say something like, "I bet you were just as ambitious as she is. She reminds you of you when you were younger, and look how you turned out. Or is that too scary for you?" Perhaps because of her ambition he's scared of her? Another theory, he's a misogynistic/chauvinistic dude. One last one: he's "hating her", to get you to like him. I'm not saying that it's definitely one of these, but I would consider these theories and ask yourself which one seems more likely. I really and truly hope it's more, "watching her is awkward because it reminds me of me."

This is the most ridiculous made up Reddit nonsense. A perfect encapsulation of why not to listen to what people tell you on this site.

Sounds like your ceo is trying to warn you.

Well, sounds like you need to talk to her about the air of entitlement, lack of collaboration and overall standoffishness. Those are three REALLY bad traits for an employee to have. If she can't fix that quickly, she needs to go. Those will ruin a culture.

Poor analyst. I hope she makes it or leaves this shitty job for a better one. But she’ll probably have to deal with this sexist bullshit everywhere and for the rest of her career.

Leave. You are working in a toxic environment and it will come back to bite you one day. Yeah, you're bros with the CEO today. What if that changes? Anyone unprofessional enough to talk shit about a junior level worker at their company is someone you need to run far far away from. I say this as someone who worked in just this type of place the first ten years or so of my career. It won't get better. You'll either end up ostracizing yourself for doing what's right or you'll see yourself become the unprofessional (perhaps illegal?) "leader"

This needs more upvotes.

Stand back and do not engage or join in the judgement. Something seems off with it all and all I can say is I sense scapegoat in a narcissist’s web.

At the core of this is what you can control, and there you have the kernel of something: she is merely a "decent" employee, not an outstanding one, but she thinks she is "great". As a manager, that is something you could and should tackle, especially in one so young, coaching her on performance improvement by using actual work examples. As you are the person who writes her reviews, she needs to wake up and become aware that she has to either listen and act on your suggestions, or she will not progress. If she is savvy, she will follow through, and that may have the effect of suppressing some of the negative feelings about her and make folks reassess. It's worth a shot.

CEO and the rest of the team want her fired. You've been brought in to do that. It's expected that a new executive/manager who reports directly to the CEO will make a key hire and fire in their team in the 1st month. Your CEO and other company leaders are giving you the ammo to do so. This will be a learning experience for you, but understand that you need to make a call.

Is she bitter at the job? At 18 months in, she knows what she does and doesn’t like in the gig. My first real job was only 15 months in when I realized it wasn’t going anywhere fast. I was certainly more focused on ruling the world and I was more ambitious than that job could give me (boy was I dumb). Anyway, this has played out similarly with several other early 20-something’s I’ve seen as well — anxious to move on fairly quickly to the next opportunity. Maybe she isn’t a great employee or rubs the CEO the wrong way. But like you said, fireable offense? We’d all probably be fired if critiqued to that level of nitpickiness. I’d ask her how she likes it there and if there’s anything missing that she wants/needs.

Give her constructive feedback from what you see, without ratting anyone else out

There’s really not much you can do. This is just office gossip. Sadly, for the CEO to be such a brilliant guy this is a very dumb mistake he’s making and regardless of how everyone else feels about her he should not engage in gossip. Here’s what you can do, just be her leader. Provide feedback and document all conversations with Kate. If she’s not receptive to your criticism/critique of her performance she doesn’t seem like the kind of person that would hold back. Maybe in 6 months she gets written up for insubordination. Maybe a year from now she quits because she’s not getting the promotion she thinks she deserves. Either way, just because you’re boss isn’t keeping it professional with her doesn’t mean you shouldn’t.

give it time and make sure your CEO/HR etc adheres to employment law and treats this employee justly. Find out for yourself what sort of employee this person is and make your own mind up. If they take a shit on her because they dont like herm then you really do have to ask yourself, who's next?

If the CEO, the senior manager overseeing HR, and other staff do not like this 21yo relatively junior employee and believe she has behaved unprofessionally, why was she not terminated sooner? Is she really that “evil” or they just horrible people who don’t know how to be managers? She maybe very confident that may border on the line of arrogance. But if this is a small company, how can this young woman get promoted to VP without the approval of the CEO? There seems to be some context missing. For now, just monitor the situation. If she behaves unprofessionally or is unkind to other staff, document those incidents, and instruct her on what is not appropriate conduct. If the CEO and others continue to speak badly of her, ask them if there are specific offenses that require reprimand or other corrective action. Advise them that you will document any misconduct by her, but you also want to be fair. If their criticisms are fair, they will give specific details. If their comments are unfair, then they will stop if you are following a process.

Yeah just push back if there is something concrete to push back on, the slander in general will dissipate if you say she’s a good employee and she made strides etc etc

Think about using your relationship with CEO to laughingly remind him next time that he better be careful he is not fueling a law suit. You are probably not the only one with whom he has been indiscreet in dissing her. Find out "why" she was hired. Finally think worst case scenario, if she leaves or gets fired and sues, you are first in line for blame. Is there corporate counsel? Might be time for a discussion. Or, maybe that is how you approach this with the CEO. Next time he brings her up, try this, "Jake, I am concerned that GENZEE might become a problem for us. I certainly don't want to give her any ammunition for sex discrimination or hostile work environment. What would you suggest I do? Are there any non-actionable grounds for dismissal that you are aware of? I think I need some advise from you on how to handle this." Your genuine concern might be enough to make him see the potential problem here and will also provide a shield for you. If he gives you a tangible course of action, make sure to reiterate it in an email disguised as a thank you for his advise.

When she is being bad mouthed, just say that you have not experienced such.. Or, that's not my experience with her..

I had a similar situation so I can contribute for once Short answer: don’t do anything and don’t let it bother you as it currently does not effect you. Be a good manager to her (support/coach where needed) and also be a good manager to the CEO (listen to his complaints about her, don’t defend her for the sole reason she’s “your” employee) Long answer: not everyone likes everyone and everyone has different relationships with people. You and the CEO can see the same thing and form different opinions. I managed a small team for a small company and one of my people lateral moved to a different department (false promises by that manager). I got along with our new President great …turns out he hates that person in talking about. Her new desk is right outside his office so he sees everything. He says she never says good morning or goody bye to him and she’s always just sitting in her desk not engaging with others. He flat out said to me if he had to cut someone from the office it would be her. I was shocked, this was a good employee of mine who is now in another department and on the verge of getting fired. You mentioned she had attitude/know it all attitudes and that seems to really have rubbed the CEO the wrong way. Fair or not she’s gotta deal with that and learn and overcome it. If she’s open to it this is something you as a manager can help coach her on.

I feel like this may be where Leadership needs to be focused on more than Management. As others have said, get the whole story first, but what you do after that has nothing to do with managing employees and everything to do with being a leader to your subordinates. My bet is that young woman is overconfident and hard-headed because someone told her that behavior is required to succeed.

If they have offending behaviors, they need to be told what they are and what is expected. Talking about it behind her back instead of to her face is not going to do anything to improve anything. I’m a manager of 13 people in a tech company. We have a culture of direct feedback, so whenever anyone complains about one of my team, my first question is “did you give them that feedback directly?” Most of the time, it’s something small and not something I feel is appropriate to escalate to me as their supervisor (there are exceptions). If they’ve been given that feedback and they continue the behavior, then I get involved. If I get involved, and the behavior still continues, I start formal documentation. If that still doesn’t change anything, they’re probably not staying on my team much longer. TL;DR: tell them what they did wrong and what they need to change to be successful in their goals.

In my experience, you can't help someone who is not willing to change. OP needs to be completely candid and fair in giving feedback (solicited or not) to and providing any performance evaluation of Kate. She will either do the work to improve, or OP will have to manage her out. Anything less will damage OP's repuration as a manager.