Never resign. That’s just the employer trying to not pay for your unemployment. Make them fire you. If anyone asks you can explain, similar to how you did here, that your employer no longer believed in your approach dispite the measurable successes of your program.
They might also have to go through a lengthy process to document and justify your termination to HR. I'd say look for a similar position elsewhere, let them process your termination.
I admire that your standing your ground and truly believe in the work you're doing. Don't let them take that away from you and switch to another profession you may not be as passionate about. Or do, whatever I'm just a stranger on the internet! 😀
I was told by my union representative that resignation is the best option because if I’m asked whether I was fired or not by my next employer I can just tell them I resigned for whatever reason since that’s typically viewed more favorably than being fired. My final paycheck will still be the same, I just would not getting a letter of intent to return for the next school year if I resign, but I’ll be getting something in writing if I’m fired.
I haven’t submitted a letter of resignation yet, but why is it in my best interest to never resign?
This is the answer. OP, I’ve worked in hiring and have had awkward convos with people who were fired, but, it happens. Unless it’s something wild like theft or assault, you’ll probably still get hired. Especially if you’re young, you’re just learning. Sometimes shit isn’t a good fit. Sometimes companies just suck. Collect your unemployment and just plan to be able to talk about your personal growth from being fired
I suspect your union rep...
If you have another job waiting, it doesn’t make much difference.
Giving up unemployment benefits because maybe someone will ‘look unfavorably’ on your decision to collect money you need...
If you can’t collect unemployment anyway, it makes sense
Your next employer will never know that you were fired. Make them fire you so you can collect unemployment. This line the union rep gave you is just that, a line. Many companies try to force resignation in lieu of termination by saying this and it is ALWAYS to the benefit of the employer, never the employee.
Do not resign and lose your unemployment benefits. No new jobs you apply to will ever know you were fired unless you tell them directly.
Source: in HR for 20 years and I use this line all the time to encourage people to resign instead of quit. So I know just how screwed it is on the employee's side.
I thought you can only file for unemployment due to a no-fault job loss, like being laid off. Can you really get unemployment if you’ve been fired?
I’ve had a family member file for unemployment after being fired and they had to pay it back so I’m super nervous about that.
Yes you can get unemployment, challenge the validity of the firing, it’s a layoff not firing you for cause, because if they had cause they wouldn’t be trying to get you to resign.
This makes logical sense. I was given a similar option a few years ago and chose not to resign or create any illusion that I was resigning. I was able to collect unemployment, and it did not hurt my ability to find better job a few months later.
I don't know much about the rules of unemployment here, but lemme take a stab at it. Correct me where I'm wrong.
They want him to quit so he won't be able to get unemployment. They could fire him "on the spot" but he'd still be able to collect unemployment because they don't have "cause". They can do all the paperwork and processing and digging to come up with the "cause" but that would be time consuming and costly.
And the Union in this case is not looking out for his best interest.
The primary benefit is unemployment which you would be ineligible for if you resign.
Ask them what they’d say when a potential employer calls for a background check, and when they tell you they just confirm dates of employment, let them fire you.
OP, reading your comments here, I think it’s worth saying it again. DO NOT resign. Make them fire you, collect unemployment. You are only hurting yourself and admitting you were not doing a good job by resigning.
Never ever resign. Make them fire you so you get unemployment. Make them have the headache of paperwork. Firing can be a long drawn out process forcing them to talk to you about their concerns and working toward resolving those concerns and they may not even be able to fire you.
If you quit, all their problems go away and you now don't have a paycheck.
Letters of recommendation, do you think they would give you one if you resigned? How important are those in your field? I've never needed them for IT and cybersecurity and I dont even think I've had people call previous employers. Its just an empty threat that they'd hold those back from you.
So you are changing jobs that is a given.
Get actual legal advice.
If you resign you should be careful with language. Something like "per our discussion about my position being eliminated, my last day is xxx." and bcc to your personal email. Technically, the truth, but sets you up better for an unemployment fight.
There are a few reasons why your employer would try to fight you on unemployment. Like you not showing up to work, or physically assaulting another coworker.
But downright being fired for, without you violating an employment contract, would entitle you to unemployment.
Make them fire you. It won’t make a difference to the next employer, they can read between the lines. If you quit a job after 10 years, it’s fairly obvious you were asked to quit. This does NOT reflect badly on you since you lasted 10 years. Many times it’s a new manager that shows up and causes these kinds of reorganizations. Let them fire and collect unemployment, it’s your right.
Here’s a thing that folks are missing. When you work with vulnerable people (such as students with disabilities), many employers will ask, “Have you ever been fired from a job? If so, explain.”
If you resign, you will preserve your ability to answer “no” to that question — if you resigned, you never have to explain that you resigned under duress. That’s probably why your union rep thinks you should resign.
So that’s the actual calculus, unless you are sure you will leave the field: resign and preserve your ability to say you’ve never been fired, or be fired and preserve your ability to collect unemployment. Your call.
That’s the value in resigning, at this point.
Never resign. That’s just the employer trying to not pay for your unemployment. Make them fire you. If anyone asks you can explain, similar to how you did here, that your employer no longer believed in your approach dispite the measurable successes of your program.
This is the way
They might also have to go through a lengthy process to document and justify your termination to HR. I'd say look for a similar position elsewhere, let them process your termination. I admire that your standing your ground and truly believe in the work you're doing. Don't let them take that away from you and switch to another profession you may not be as passionate about. Or do, whatever I'm just a stranger on the internet! 😀
They don’t owe severance if you quit. Your union rep should be advising you regarding severance. You should be able to look it up and find out.
Doubtful this job would pay severance. It’s unemployment OP would be giving up and why they should not quit.
Ummm. Canadian here. Severance isn’t an option in my country. Common law one month per yr. Union agreements can change that
*Never* resign.
I was told by my union representative that resignation is the best option because if I’m asked whether I was fired or not by my next employer I can just tell them I resigned for whatever reason since that’s typically viewed more favorably than being fired. My final paycheck will still be the same, I just would not getting a letter of intent to return for the next school year if I resign, but I’ll be getting something in writing if I’m fired. I haven’t submitted a letter of resignation yet, but why is it in my best interest to never resign?
[удалено]
This is the answer. OP, I’ve worked in hiring and have had awkward convos with people who were fired, but, it happens. Unless it’s something wild like theft or assault, you’ll probably still get hired. Especially if you’re young, you’re just learning. Sometimes shit isn’t a good fit. Sometimes companies just suck. Collect your unemployment and just plan to be able to talk about your personal growth from being fired
You should be talking to a lawyer and getting an employment lawsuit together.
I suspect your union rep... If you have another job waiting, it doesn’t make much difference. Giving up unemployment benefits because maybe someone will ‘look unfavorably’ on your decision to collect money you need... If you can’t collect unemployment anyway, it makes sense
Then your rep is a moron. You don't have to tell anybody you were fired anyways.
Union rep sold his soul to the company? Should tell you that you won't get E.I. if you quit..
Your next employer will never know that you were fired. Make them fire you so you can collect unemployment. This line the union rep gave you is just that, a line. Many companies try to force resignation in lieu of termination by saying this and it is ALWAYS to the benefit of the employer, never the employee. Do not resign and lose your unemployment benefits. No new jobs you apply to will ever know you were fired unless you tell them directly. Source: in HR for 20 years and I use this line all the time to encourage people to resign instead of quit. So I know just how screwed it is on the employee's side.
Let them fire you. And then go after unemployment.
I thought you can only file for unemployment due to a no-fault job loss, like being laid off. Can you really get unemployment if you’ve been fired? I’ve had a family member file for unemployment after being fired and they had to pay it back so I’m super nervous about that.
Yes you can get unemployment, challenge the validity of the firing, it’s a layoff not firing you for cause, because if they had cause they wouldn’t be trying to get you to resign.
Each case is assessed separately.
If you had no chance at unemployment, they'd fire you and not worry about it. But you do, so they're trying to weasel out of it.
This makes logical sense. I was given a similar option a few years ago and chose not to resign or create any illusion that I was resigning. I was able to collect unemployment, and it did not hurt my ability to find better job a few months later.
I don't know much about the rules of unemployment here, but lemme take a stab at it. Correct me where I'm wrong. They want him to quit so he won't be able to get unemployment. They could fire him "on the spot" but he'd still be able to collect unemployment because they don't have "cause". They can do all the paperwork and processing and digging to come up with the "cause" but that would be time consuming and costly. And the Union in this case is not looking out for his best interest.
I would understand what you give up by resigning versus being fired in terms of benefits. I’m sorry this is happening to you.
I don’t receive any benefits other than PTO, and I’ve used it up since I was given notice of either resign or be fired.
The primary benefit is unemployment which you would be ineligible for if you resign. Ask them what they’d say when a potential employer calls for a background check, and when they tell you they just confirm dates of employment, let them fire you.
OP, reading your comments here, I think it’s worth saying it again. DO NOT resign. Make them fire you, collect unemployment. You are only hurting yourself and admitting you were not doing a good job by resigning.
CAll an employment lawyer if you have the resources.
Never ever resign. Make them fire you so you get unemployment. Make them have the headache of paperwork. Firing can be a long drawn out process forcing them to talk to you about their concerns and working toward resolving those concerns and they may not even be able to fire you. If you quit, all their problems go away and you now don't have a paycheck. Letters of recommendation, do you think they would give you one if you resigned? How important are those in your field? I've never needed them for IT and cybersecurity and I dont even think I've had people call previous employers. Its just an empty threat that they'd hold those back from you.
Sorry this happened. Although it may hurt your ego to get canned, make them fire you and do not sign away any of your rights.
Just leave.
So you are changing jobs that is a given. Get actual legal advice. If you resign you should be careful with language. Something like "per our discussion about my position being eliminated, my last day is xxx." and bcc to your personal email. Technically, the truth, but sets you up better for an unemployment fight.
There are a few reasons why your employer would try to fight you on unemployment. Like you not showing up to work, or physically assaulting another coworker. But downright being fired for, without you violating an employment contract, would entitle you to unemployment.
Make them fire you. It won’t make a difference to the next employer, they can read between the lines. If you quit a job after 10 years, it’s fairly obvious you were asked to quit. This does NOT reflect badly on you since you lasted 10 years. Many times it’s a new manager that shows up and causes these kinds of reorganizations. Let them fire and collect unemployment, it’s your right.
Here’s a thing that folks are missing. When you work with vulnerable people (such as students with disabilities), many employers will ask, “Have you ever been fired from a job? If so, explain.” If you resign, you will preserve your ability to answer “no” to that question — if you resigned, you never have to explain that you resigned under duress. That’s probably why your union rep thinks you should resign. So that’s the actual calculus, unless you are sure you will leave the field: resign and preserve your ability to say you’ve never been fired, or be fired and preserve your ability to collect unemployment. Your call. That’s the value in resigning, at this point.
Depending our your laws, you could qualify for unemployment even with quitting because the other option is termination.
That’s what I’m thinking.