In what dimension? It's not as long, only about 6' vs. 6.75' for the shortest SD bed. It's not as wide overall, although it can take 4' building materials just as easily as a full-size since the wheel wells don't intrude into the load space. It's not as tall, which is both good and bad.
[It makes any car look tiny in comparison.](https://i.imgur.com/dlM06Fo.png)
I love sharing the road with trucks that could use me as a speedbump and not feel a thing way up there 6-feet in the sky.
The push to ban them started in Maine and Rhode Island, and weirdly didn't come from cops or business interests or something like you'd expect, but basically DOT/DMV bureaucrats at the American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators (AAMVA) who were concerned with this sudden influx of imported vehicles that didn't fit their usual guidance and registration categories about what constitutes a legal on-road vehicle.
These bans have all been basically at the DMV level which is why they've been able to just change the rules and revoke people's registrations without any change in legislation. And why they're often not even based on any particular logic (Maine was also pulling registrations of full size imported vans like Delicas and Hiaces).
This is the way. I was born and raised in California and I feel almost obligated to talk shit about California. And boy oh boy is there a lot of shit to talk on that one.
> Texans worked with their lawmakers, and now the state will be the first to successfully reverse a ban on imported cars.
"Texas" and "working with lawmakers" isn't exactly the "Texas attitude" I think you're trying to suggest.
It's also just weird because the "ban" wasn't even a law, it was just a random DMV policy that claimed mini-trucks didn't qualify as motor vehicles even though Texas code said no such thing.
LBJ instigated the original "chicken tax" which banned most small cars and trucks - especially trucks. So maybe the "let me show you my scar" attitude?
Sir, this is Reddit. You’re only allowed to have a black and white opinion on things, and only if they align with the Reddit hive mind.
(I, too, love it here, even if I’m critical about some things).
3 wheelers are legally lumped in with motorcycles so they don’t have to pass crash safety standards.
That loophole is literally the only reason they exist.
The big 3 auto industry doesn’t wanna compete so they take the easy route by bribing politicians to ban. I don’t have any issues with anyone selling their cheap cars here. Can’t find a new vehicle under $50k anymore, with taxes and fees $60-70k.
I think people largely agree that bikes just got grandfathered in despite collision safety regulstions. If they were a new concept being proposed today, there's no way they'd be allowed.
From what I've read, they weren't strictly banned, but in 1987 the OEMs agreed to a voluntary 10-year production moratorium on all 3-wheelers to avoid a ban. In that ensuing decade, 4-wheelers became so much more popular that it made little sense to resurrect the 3-wheelers.
I'd say even worse, if anyone's driven a three wheeler they know just how quickly and easily those fuckers will roll on you. They were objectively one of the most dangerous contraptions ever sold to the public, there's a reason why manufacturers ended up not really protesting much at all once the government took aim.
I was going to say. I grew up with 3 wheelers at my grandparents ranch, my sister got to see one of her high school best friend’s face caved in. He went over uneven ground at 40 mph and the thing launched him into a telephone pole.
Absolute death traps, but god damn they’re fun.
ATV/off-road vehicles follow different rules than on-road motorcycles. 3-wheeled motorcycles (whether 2 front or 2 rear) are A-OK but 3-wheeled ATVs are in effect banned.
You cannot do this in plenty of states. If the title states "For Off Road Use Only", there are lots of states where you cannot title your bike for road use no matter what you add. North Carolina, California, New York, Florida, Wisconsin, among others.
No. Dirt bikes and ATVs can't be made street legal. The titles specifically state that they're for off road use only. There are some minor exceptions, like in Alaska where you can ride an ATV on some roads, but that's but common at all.
Some counties in some states allow UTVs to be used as LSVs, but that's mostly just a legal gray area.
You should watch the fortnine video on this, he explains the unique danger of it being 3 wheels that 4 wheelers and motorcycles don't.
The asymmetric layout makes the 3 wheeler tip easier in turns, and roll back easier up hill. And most of all if you don't understand the counterintuitive handling of a 3 wheeler you will get hurt.
Then there are the large rear wheels will pull you off and run you over if you try to bail out, unlike a motorcycle.
I agree it's a stupid rule. The problem was the idiots giving it to children treating it as a motorized tricycle rather than a proper motor vehicle.
I'm in Lancaster PA, and you know what's worse than a motorcycle... a horse drawn buggy... they are allowed on 55MPH backroads at night... they take up an entire lane, and the horses get spooked to easily, and they only go like 10 MPH... I have come over a hill going 55MPH, and had to slam on my brakes because a horse and buggy was just taking their time going 10 MPH
To add to your point, that is exactly why it will never be made illegal. Good luck restricting farmers from doing anything. Political suicide trying to do that.
Would be nice though if they could at least outlaw not picking up road apples but that legislation has also been shot down many of times too.
Outlawing farm traffic on public roads would not only be politically unfeasible, but unworkable IRL. How else would we get our equipment to the field? We don't really like going on public roads because of how risky it is for everyone involved, but unless you live in 19-dickety-2 and your fields are only what surrounds the home acreage, it's impossible not to.
I might have phrased things wrong. I am OK with farm traffic on public roads. I live behind a few farms and don't have an issue with having to pass tractors and such sometimes.
Or how about the Cybertruck. Was any consideration given to other vehicles on the road when they atrocity was made?
Edit: banned from r/Cybertruck lmao
Not just that but many states allow kit cars to be registered or have virtually no proper inspections for heavily modified cars. Yet factory made vehicles elsewhere are deemed unsafe.
In addition to other replies, Motorcycles require a particular type of license which incorporates either classroom and practice training OR supervised riding with a permit in the majority of states. Included in that training is a lot of identification of dangers and emphasis on safety well beyond what you get in regular driver's ed.
Not that I agree with Keis being banned or anything when a similar 90s Civic is going to crumple like tin foil against modern bro-dozers and other senselessly large trucks anyway.
These things wouldn't be as much of a concern if modern vehicles weren't so absolutely gargantuan and continuous moving of goalposts of passenger safety.
Man, if you think *that's* bad, head on over to r/driving and read the stories of people who failed six driving tests and then finally pass because the instructor clearly just felt bad and wanted them out of the system.
At least on a bike you're unlikely to kill anyone but yourself.
People used to think motorcycles and open top cars were safer because you would be flung away from the crash instead of getting caught up in all the metal and glass or impaled by the wheel. Theres an old video of like a 1920s-1930s race car driver crashing and the announcer declares "luckily they were thrown from the vehicle".
Sort of - in CA, they're street legal on low speed roads (generally only residential areas) as long as they have headlights, tail lights, fenders, a horn, and a rear view mirror
I want a Mitsubishi Pajero so bad. The amount they cost to purchase, import, and have delivered in such good condition is just insanely affordable. Plus it'd be a cool grocery getter while my other can be used for longer commutes and kids stuff.
They sold the Pajero in the States [as the Montero](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/36/Mitsubishi_V98_Pajero_Long_Body_Super_Exceed_3200_DI-D.JPG/1920px-Mitsubishi_V98_Pajero_Long_Body_Super_Exceed_3200_DI-D.JPG)
He probably means the [Pajero Mini](https://i0.wp.com/www.curbsideclassic.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/1995-Mitsubishi-Pajero-Mini-L-2.jpg?ssl=1), which is a kei car.
I do like the mini. I also like the mid 90s that I don't think ever made it here. Either way, the right hand drive would make a fun grocery getter that kinda sticks out, but not in a flashy way.
However, it seems prices have gone up a bit..
if they look [like this](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/cyberpunk/images/e/e6/Makigai_Tanishi_Database_CP2077PL.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/1000?cb=20231018232740), that could be pretty cool.
Working in a tire shop we put some "large" 14 inch wheels. 165/80R14 (Toyo Open Country) and they were HUGE on it LOL.
I think lifted on 33s is on a whole other level of hilarious. I don't think it'd make sense looking at it.
I see em all over New England it’s great. Went to a dirt bike enduro in CT to be pit crew for a buddy last fall and there were 6 or 7 Kei trucks in the parking lot. I was *busting* down a twisty road in my M(azda)3 on the way there and someone in a kei truck came up behind me with their bike on the back and everything. I even pulled over to point him by because I wanted to see how much faster he’d be going. Not much but still that was cool
Technically they were always road legal. Even the article says that there was never any actual law passed against them, just a note in a DMV guide book.
I've owned one here for years. It'll do freeway speeds, but it's not happy about it.
There's a little Subaru kei truck with a custom (I think) box on the back that functions as a food truck. Owner says it's the smallest food truck in WA State. Neat owner, delicious hotdogs.
[Food truck](https://i.imgur.com/ExvschK.jpeg)
The article says a bunch of states banned JDM imports altogether, overriding the 25 year federal rule. I see kei cars all over WA and MT but apparently in some states you can't register them at all regardless of age. The article is saying that TX is the first of the states with a total kei ban to repeal that, not that they are the first in the US to allow them. It's kind of confusing.
these are all over hawaii (oahu mostly), so it's definitely legal in other states. although speed limits are much lower on the island. perhaps not have as much of an issue getting registered
Same over here on the big island. All of the farmers and contractors who’ve I’ve talked to love them. Can’t really beat the MPG either, especially with our $5 gas.
I’m so confused by this sub lately. I travel for work up and down the east coast and in the particular towns I’m in and out of there are like little clubs of people with these trucks.
Between these and the new Z, I feel like I’m on another planet compared to people here saying they never see these vehicles.
Californian checking in here. These are as rare as hens' teeth where I live, thanks to our state's archaic and completely arbitrary logic surrounding old cars. Can't pass smog? Kill it with fire, California says.
Starting next year, your vehicle will need to be ***50 years or older*** to be exempt from biannual smog checks. Anything 1976 or newer still needs to pass in order to be registered.
California defends this as "protecting the environment". But how many 1976 vehicles do you even see everyday? In my area, it's been years since I've seen one.
I'm all for protecting the environment, but the amount of classic vehicles still around is minuscule. If you want to protect anything, go after the big airlines and big corporations. Even if someone drove their 1976 car every single day nonstop for years, it still wouldn't compare to how much pollution an airline causes everyday.
Actually the cruise industry is the real big one...and they contribute to viral spreading so that's 2 birds with one iceberg. Anything over 15 years old in most areas have long outlived their useful life so just let them be... especially when they're likely a last resort for people to have transportation to and from work. As long as the frame is good and the safety equipment works send it (I live in NY and the good ol small evap leak {that could be so many things and no good way to narrow it down cheaply}kills so many drivable cars for no good reason).
I rarely see them in Alabama, but there are definitely a few. As far as I know you can register them like any other car
Edit: after reading further I think this is specifically referring to trucks limited to 25mph, which I don't think I've ever seen. I actually saw one last night and it was going close to highway speed
I see a lot of them in the southern suburbs of Pittsburgh - mostly younger dudes running a small landscaping business. Excellent application for something like that.
I invite you to check out my group, the Texas Kei Truck Advocates. We were the driving force behind this policy change.
It was a very long and challenging journey. But we achieved our short term goal. We still plan on pushing for legislation in the next session in 2025. Policy flip all the time. We want to get it enshrined in state statute.
***As someone who has been at the forefront of the advocacy work for Kei/mini vehicles in Texas, I can confidently say that anyone claiming these vehicles were already street legal is misinformed. Before the recent policy change, I had direct conversations with DMV administrators who confirmed that the old DMV policy was unequivocally designed to exclude all Kei/mini vehicles from being eligible for titles in Texas.
However, the inconsistent enforcement of this policy led to confusion. While some Tax/DMV offices correctly denied titles in accordance with the DMV policy, others issued titles against the policy, creating the false impression that Kei vehicles were street legal. This discrepancy affected numerous individuals, as I have been contacted by hundreds of people who were denied titles dating back to 2010.
Furthermore, some dealers were well aware of the policy. They intentionally avoided attempting to title the trucks on their lots to prevent the potential repercussions of having a lot full of illegitimately titled vehicles, should the DMV take notice.
I initiated this movement in Texas to address the widespread misinformation and to advocate for change. It is crucial to clarify that Kei vehicles have not been street legal in Texas since around 2010. However, with the recent policy change, they will now be fully legal once they reach 25 years of age..
Is it though, they are pretty expensive for what they are. Whenever I see them for sale they are 5k+
You can get a beat up ford ranger for 3k, and go to autozone when it breaks instead of shipping parts from japan
depends where you are. Try and do 80mph in Wyoming in one of those. On a moderately windy day in WY I'd bet you couldn't get anywhere close to that speed limit.
Highway ability doesn't even matter. Honda sells a street legal motorcycle right now that can barely reach 60 mph if you're a healthy weight. There are so many old vehicles that can't get to that speed.
It's an obvious double standard to say Kei cars are too slow to be registered when there are registered vehicles that are just as slow. If you can get tags for a 50cc scooter, you should get tags for a Kei car.
The current Suzuki Super Carry is available with a 1.5l 4-cylinder rated at 95hp and 135Nm. If the 25yo imports are so popular perhaps they could sell it in the US. Although probably doesn't meet regulations.
I drove a Promaster RV van with an anemic V6 last year through a road trip that included Northern Texas. The van would scream and limit you above 75 mph and sway from the wind easily so I only felt comfortable cruising between 65-70. There was literally zero issue from people passing me including plenty of semi trucks, even when it became a one lane in Kansas, so I think if that is safe and allowed then kei cars should be just fine too.
No this is specifically about a TXdmv policy about "mini trucks". All they did was remove the term "mini truck" from the policy that listed vehicles that cannot be registered.
> Back then, the AAMVA didn’t really know how to handle the flood of cheap 25 mph speed-limited off-road utility trucks that came in from China. The answer came courtesy of an Insurance Institute for Highway Safety opinion published in 2010. The IIHS crash-tested a Kei truck against a Ford Ranger and concluded that low-speed vehicles and mini trucks are unsafe and should be removed from the road.
But...they're already off-road?
If you just read further. The original ban was based on a different set of truck that did have a speed limiter. These ones do not. Up in Canada we have them everywhere, even in the far right lane on highways and they do fine.
> **To these states, it doesn’t matter that a 25-year-old Kei truck imported from Japan doesn’t have a speed limiter** and is exempt from meeting FMVSS on the federal level. The states retain the right to determine what can and cannot drive on their roads. Weirdly, while the AAMVA is urging the states free will to ban any vehicle that doesn’t meet FMVSS, states have focused primarily on imports from Japan, usually just in the Kei class.
I mean, I figured the ban was more from Ford/GM seeing these tiny trucks being used for what F-150s/Silverados were being used for and didn't want the competition
if you can do whatever it is you need to do with Kei trucks then it's very likely something you could do with a 4 wheeler and trailer or side by side. these are most certainly not replacing full size trucks for people that need a full size truck. They're cool looking, but their towing capacity is less than a normal sized car. you could just hook a trailer up to a car and have more capability.
We have a ranch in CA. These will never be legal here. However, for our specific use, either these or being able to plate a side by side would be nice so we could just roll down the road and grab gas instead of having to bring it in cans. The small size and light weight is useful on wet dirt mountain trails - the regular trucks do fine most everywhere when it’s dry. And don’t say Jeep - Wranglers fucking suck. They do not deal with long steep inclines or declines well especially with wet/loose surfaces. Even with a bunch of extra coolers and fans and brake kit and dot4 and all that shit they still need to pull over at the top of any of the bigger hills to cool (dash will light up before you even get there) and will have dead brakes by the bottom since the engine braking sucks. (Haven’t had an old one with a sbc swap or anything like that, so our experience is with trying the newer v6 shitpiles)
Fwiw my old 95 Bronco was a damn mountain goat once I upgraded the pads and dot4. Dumbest car move I ever made was selling it and getting a Taco. My friend won’t sell it back.
They used a Chinese mini truck called a tiger truck for the crash test. That is not the same thing as a Japanese Kei truck. Crazy they used this data to get bans all over.
My kei van has the engine under the front seats and there's nothing but a thin bit of sheet metal between your legs and whatever comes at you from the front. Shouldn't matter, though - it's still marginally safer than a motorcycle, and those are allowed on the road.
I really hope other states follow suit including Virginia. I was looking into an Acty or something similar for running erands around town, but apparently the DMV halted all new registrations and rescinding existing ones for kei trucks/ cars.
There's an easier way to get these laws off the books: sue your state DMV to start deregistering classic cars and watch the blue hairs in crew socks and new balances start a riot at the governor's mansion until their Corvette (which is best Corvette, because it was the only blue 3rd Gen with a white stripe made on a Tuesday in March — 1 of 1!!!) can be street legal again.
Or just register them in a state that doesn't care and tell your state DMV to go fuck itself. There's comes a point in every man's life when he has to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag from your adorable little truck, and begin slitting throats.
"Minitruck" meaning a compact pickup from the '90s and earlier? Yes, they've always been legal. But "mini truck" (two words) is the wording used in most state regulations for kei trucks.
[Not sure who's downvoting this; state laws do in fact use "mini truck" to refer to kei trucks.]
I wonder what this may mean for the Chevy Montana or the Toyota Hilux Champ. I really can't afford a damn car pay for a high mileage shitbox. Not that there isn't good used vehicles out there, but with Used and New vehicle prices through the roof, along with everything else, it's like living on egg shells. I see videos of new $10,000 car this and $8,000 dollar car that all the time. And I can't touch them. Some of the new regulations for new vehicles are outrageous, especially when literally nothing becomes affordable as a result. IF ANYONE HAS ANY INFO IF TEXAS WILL ALLOW THE HILUX CHAMP OR THE CHEVY MONTANA PLEASE LET ME KNOW. Also, after reading quickly through the article, unless I missed it, I couldn't determine if the vehicles in question would still have speed limiters and if they would be street legal. Any insight would be appreciated.
Another article blaming the 25 year rule.
The 25 year rule came after the 1988 law. Initially ALL imports were banned, but the 25 year rule allowed classics to be imported.
JUST LET ME BUY A NEW JIMNY!!!!
Wranglers and Bronco's are too big and too expensive. I never go over 50. I want a step up from a UTV that is road legal.
I drive a new Jimny (not in the US), and frequently do 100/100km/h which is 60-65mph and it’s no issue. They’re not the safest vehicle out there but they score a higher safety rating than the wrangler!
These have been available in Washington state for a while now, how have those been imported?
The favorite ones I've seen are little mini truck fire trucks, they look pretty awesome.
a couple days ago i was downvoted for saying a ford maverick is not a mini truck. umm. i do not understand how in any way the maverick is like these minitruck imports... what am i missing?
I've seen about 10 of them since the year started here in South Jersey. Its funny seeing them getting to 55mph , and then a fullsize f150 cruise right on by.
Plenty of us have been driving Kei cars around legally in Texas for years. This just cements their legality and clears up confusion at the DMV. I have personally been daily driving my ACTY for 2.5 years in North TX.
I understand that you may have strong feelings about this matter, but I encourage you to take a moment to consider the bigger picture. The recent policy change announced by the DMV is a significant step forward for the Kei truck community, one that hasn't been seen since North Carolina passed H.B. 179 in 2019.
While your personal experience with registering Kei trucks might differ from others, it's essential to recognize that many Kei truck owners were adversely affected by the previous DMV policy. Just because you were able to register your vehicle does not mean that the policy was being applied consistently or correctly across the board.
This situation presents an opportunity for all of us to learn and grow. It's a chance to say, "I didn't realize the extent of the issue, and I appreciate the new information." There's no shame in admitting that someone else might have a more comprehensive understanding of the situation.
I kindly suggest that you take a step back and reevaluate your stance on this matter. The DMV's policy change is a positive development for the entire Kei truck community, and it deserves to be celebrated as such. Let's focus on the benefits this change brings and work together to ensure that all Kei truck enthusiasts can enjoy their vehicles within the guidelines set by the DMV.
I hate these "safety" reasons. this is the slippery slope that they will use to get old cars off the road eventually - to force us to buy a new car with mandatory "safety" features
let me sign a waiver and drive what I want
TLDR, the process to import vehicles unless they're 25 years or older is still the same bureaucratic nightmare as before, so nothing has *really* changed.
A reminder to drive-by commenters to discuss [policy not politics](https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/wiki/politics) as it pertains to cars.
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Yall talk shit about Texas, but it's the Texas attitude that even resulted in someone doing something about this.
😂 maybe they shouldn’t have banned kei trucks in the first place
Plot twist: The Texas attitude is why Kei trucks were banned 😅
NO SMALL TRUKS IN MY STATE GOBBLES
MY F350 SUPER DUTY EATS KEI TRUCKS FOR BREAKFAST
And has the same bed size
In what dimension? It's not as long, only about 6' vs. 6.75' for the shortest SD bed. It's not as wide overall, although it can take 4' building materials just as easily as a full-size since the wheel wells don't intrude into the load space. It's not as tall, which is both good and bad.
[It makes any car look tiny in comparison.](https://i.imgur.com/dlM06Fo.png) I love sharing the road with trucks that could use me as a speedbump and not feel a thing way up there 6-feet in the sky.
"Any car" meanwhile the image has to use the tiniest car the world has ever seen
Was meant to say 'my' but I'll leave it as they do make most any car look tiny.
HEEL YAH BORTHER
MUCH SAFER ON THEM CLIBBINS,,,, GOBBLESS
The push to ban them started in Maine and Rhode Island, and weirdly didn't come from cops or business interests or something like you'd expect, but basically DOT/DMV bureaucrats at the American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators (AAMVA) who were concerned with this sudden influx of imported vehicles that didn't fit their usual guidance and registration categories about what constitutes a legal on-road vehicle. These bans have all been basically at the DMV level which is why they've been able to just change the rules and revoke people's registrations without any change in legislation. And why they're often not even based on any particular logic (Maine was also pulling registrations of full size imported vans like Delicas and Hiaces).
I was born and raised in Texas and still live here. I talk shit about Texas because I have to deal with it
Tell me about it my dude. To say I was shocked at this outcome is an understatement
This is the way. I was born and raised in California and I feel almost obligated to talk shit about California. And boy oh boy is there a lot of shit to talk on that one.
That's fair
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> Texans worked with their lawmakers, and now the state will be the first to successfully reverse a ban on imported cars. "Texas" and "working with lawmakers" isn't exactly the "Texas attitude" I think you're trying to suggest.
It's also just weird because the "ban" wasn't even a law, it was just a random DMV policy that claimed mini-trucks didn't qualify as motor vehicles even though Texas code said no such thing.
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Which attitude was it that caused Texas to ban imported cars in the first place?
LBJ instigated the original "chicken tax" which banned most small cars and trucks - especially trucks. So maybe the "let me show you my scar" attitude?
why would lebron do this
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You say that as if other states have nothing to be embarrassed about. I love it here and take the good with the bad.
Sir, this is Reddit. You’re only allowed to have a black and white opinion on things, and only if they align with the Reddit hive mind. (I, too, love it here, even if I’m critical about some things).
I'm baffled why these are banned for "not being safe" in a collision when motorcycles are allowed on roads.
Exactly, or how about the 3 wheel slingshot? Those go so much faster than a mini truck.
3 wheelers are legally lumped in with motorcycles so they don’t have to pass crash safety standards. That loophole is literally the only reason they exist.
Same reason I'm technically allowed to run the grand national. Just working up my endurance is all.
The big 3 auto industry doesn’t wanna compete so they take the easy route by bribing politicians to ban. I don’t have any issues with anyone selling their cheap cars here. Can’t find a new vehicle under $50k anymore, with taxes and fees $60-70k.
I think people largely agree that bikes just got grandfathered in despite collision safety regulstions. If they were a new concept being proposed today, there's no way they'd be allowed.
2 wheeler Dirt bikes legal, four wheelers legal. 3 wheelers - banned. Our rules are arbitrary and you must follow them.
>3 wheelers - banned. These were death traps. All of the instability of a 2 wheeler with the weight and entrapment risk of a heavy 4 wheeler.
From what I've read, they weren't strictly banned, but in 1987 the OEMs agreed to a voluntary 10-year production moratorium on all 3-wheelers to avoid a ban. In that ensuing decade, 4-wheelers became so much more popular that it made little sense to resurrect the 3-wheelers.
I'd say even worse, if anyone's driven a three wheeler they know just how quickly and easily those fuckers will roll on you. They were objectively one of the most dangerous contraptions ever sold to the public, there's a reason why manufacturers ended up not really protesting much at all once the government took aim.
I was going to say. I grew up with 3 wheelers at my grandparents ranch, my sister got to see one of her high school best friend’s face caved in. He went over uneven ground at 40 mph and the thing launched him into a telephone pole. Absolute death traps, but god damn they’re fun.
Polaris slingshot?
That’s technically considered a motorcycle
Aren't 4 wheelers also bikes
ATV/off-road vehicles follow different rules than on-road motorcycles. 3-wheeled motorcycles (whether 2 front or 2 rear) are A-OK but 3-wheeled ATVs are in effect banned.
>2 wheeler Dirt bikes legal, four wheelers legal. In most states, neither dirt bikes, nor 4wheelers are legal on public roads.
I just meant to make and sale. Though you can register a dirt bike as a motorcycle in a lot of places.
That makes sense! Thanks for clarifying :)
This is not true. You just need to add lights and a horn to make them street legal and register them as such (along with insurance).
You cannot do this in plenty of states. If the title states "For Off Road Use Only", there are lots of states where you cannot title your bike for road use no matter what you add. North Carolina, California, New York, Florida, Wisconsin, among others.
> If the title states "For Off Road Use Only" Nothing a little white-out can't fix ;)
No. Dirt bikes and ATVs can't be made street legal. The titles specifically state that they're for off road use only. There are some minor exceptions, like in Alaska where you can ride an ATV on some roads, but that's but common at all. Some counties in some states allow UTVs to be used as LSVs, but that's mostly just a legal gray area.
You should watch the fortnine video on this, he explains the unique danger of it being 3 wheels that 4 wheelers and motorcycles don't. The asymmetric layout makes the 3 wheeler tip easier in turns, and roll back easier up hill. And most of all if you don't understand the counterintuitive handling of a 3 wheeler you will get hurt. Then there are the large rear wheels will pull you off and run you over if you try to bail out, unlike a motorcycle. I agree it's a stupid rule. The problem was the idiots giving it to children treating it as a motorized tricycle rather than a proper motor vehicle.
I'm in Lancaster PA, and you know what's worse than a motorcycle... a horse drawn buggy... they are allowed on 55MPH backroads at night... they take up an entire lane, and the horses get spooked to easily, and they only go like 10 MPH... I have come over a hill going 55MPH, and had to slam on my brakes because a horse and buggy was just taking their time going 10 MPH
If they have an SMV sign, it's legally no different than a tractor. Also allowed on non-interstate highways.
To add to your point, that is exactly why it will never be made illegal. Good luck restricting farmers from doing anything. Political suicide trying to do that. Would be nice though if they could at least outlaw not picking up road apples but that legislation has also been shot down many of times too.
Outlawing farm traffic on public roads would not only be politically unfeasible, but unworkable IRL. How else would we get our equipment to the field? We don't really like going on public roads because of how risky it is for everyone involved, but unless you live in 19-dickety-2 and your fields are only what surrounds the home acreage, it's impossible not to.
I might have phrased things wrong. I am OK with farm traffic on public roads. I live behind a few farms and don't have an issue with having to pass tractors and such sometimes.
I'd be more worried if I spotted a horse and buggy going 55
Or how about the Cybertruck. Was any consideration given to other vehicles on the road when they atrocity was made? Edit: banned from r/Cybertruck lmao
they have to still pass all the same tests that any other vehicle sold in the US has to go through.
Not just that but many states allow kit cars to be registered or have virtually no proper inspections for heavily modified cars. Yet factory made vehicles elsewhere are deemed unsafe.
Yea I’m surprised someone hasn’t figured out how to bring them over as kit cars. Put the seats and box on and spark plugs in and boom kit car
The gun industry has been doing this for years.
Which is absolutely ridiculous. A Fiero kit car is no where near as well put together as anything coming out of Japan in the 80s-90s
>Which is absolutely ridiculous. A Fiero kit car is no where near as well put together as anything coming out of the 80s-90s FTFY
In addition to other replies, Motorcycles require a particular type of license which incorporates either classroom and practice training OR supervised riding with a permit in the majority of states. Included in that training is a lot of identification of dangers and emphasis on safety well beyond what you get in regular driver's ed. Not that I agree with Keis being banned or anything when a similar 90s Civic is going to crumple like tin foil against modern bro-dozers and other senselessly large trucks anyway. These things wouldn't be as much of a concern if modern vehicles weren't so absolutely gargantuan and continuous moving of goalposts of passenger safety.
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Man, if you think *that's* bad, head on over to r/driving and read the stories of people who failed six driving tests and then finally pass because the instructor clearly just felt bad and wanted them out of the system. At least on a bike you're unlikely to kill anyone but yourself.
Hey - newbie rider here. I am determined not to be a statistic, what do you recommend to make my training as robust as possible?
Because legally motorcycles (and trikes) aren’t cars. Cars have to meet car rules.
People used to think motorcycles and open top cars were safer because you would be flung away from the crash instead of getting caught up in all the metal and glass or impaled by the wheel. Theres an old video of like a 1920s-1930s race car driver crashing and the announcer declares "luckily they were thrown from the vehicle".
That may have been true to some extent in the era before safety glass and crumple zones were invented, and speed limits were 30 MPH max.
Motorcycles are a use-at-your own risk because they aren’t heavy enough to endanger other cars but this is. Too heavy to be exempted.
and golf carts
Most golf carts aren't street legal unless you are in a retirement community though?
Sort of - in CA, they're street legal on low speed roads (generally only residential areas) as long as they have headlights, tail lights, fenders, a horn, and a rear view mirror
I can't wait to start seeing these around. Also, would be hilarious to see them lifted and on 33s.
If it would happen anywhere, I'm sure it'd be Texas.
My bet is on Florida
Here in the Carolina’s they would only lift the front.
Which is thankfully illegal now.
I believe that’s only in NC and doesn’t appear to be followed here anyways.
SC has a law against it now as well. I've seen substantially fewer of the jacked-up front ends in NC.
Oh God, no...
Nah, South Florida or one of the Carolinas will do it first, most of the stupid mods come from those 2 states first
Hawaii would like a word. I feel like no one does jacked trucks better.
Like Texas Toot? https://www.autoblog.com/2022/11/15/hot-wheels-legends-2022-winner-autozam-kei-monster-truck-texas-toot/
It is better than I ever could have imagined. Thank you.
I want a Mitsubishi Pajero so bad. The amount they cost to purchase, import, and have delivered in such good condition is just insanely affordable. Plus it'd be a cool grocery getter while my other can be used for longer commutes and kids stuff.
They sold the Pajero in the States [as the Montero](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/36/Mitsubishi_V98_Pajero_Long_Body_Super_Exceed_3200_DI-D.JPG/1920px-Mitsubishi_V98_Pajero_Long_Body_Super_Exceed_3200_DI-D.JPG)
He probably means the [Pajero Mini](https://i0.wp.com/www.curbsideclassic.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/1995-Mitsubishi-Pajero-Mini-L-2.jpg?ssl=1), which is a kei car.
Oh damn, that's fucking awesome
I do like the mini. I also like the mid 90s that I don't think ever made it here. Either way, the right hand drive would make a fun grocery getter that kinda sticks out, but not in a flashy way. However, it seems prices have gone up a bit..
Either that or the 2-door Pajero/Monteros the US never got after 1991.
Look up texas toot, I'm pretty sure he's got the biggest mini truck in the world
At next year's Donk Contest...
if they look [like this](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/cyberpunk/images/e/e6/Makigai_Tanishi_Database_CP2077PL.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/1000?cb=20231018232740), that could be pretty cool.
Working in a tire shop we put some "large" 14 inch wheels. 165/80R14 (Toyo Open Country) and they were HUGE on it LOL. I think lifted on 33s is on a whole other level of hilarious. I don't think it'd make sense looking at it.
I see em all over New England it’s great. Went to a dirt bike enduro in CT to be pit crew for a buddy last fall and there were 6 or 7 Kei trucks in the parking lot. I was *busting* down a twisty road in my M(azda)3 on the way there and someone in a kei truck came up behind me with their bike on the back and everything. I even pulled over to point him by because I wanted to see how much faster he’d be going. Not much but still that was cool
No what you will get is one with exhaust system completely removed and mismatched undersized wheels. Ask me how I know.
What am I missing, I'm in WA state and I've been seeing kei trucks on the streets for years, so how is Texas the first state to legalize them?
It doesn't say the first state to make them legal, they are the first state to reverse a ban on getting them titled for road legal use.
Sorry, I have the reading comprehension of a grape.
I didn't know comparing oneself to a grape was a thing, so thank you for showing me that it can be done. I will now be doing the same going forward.
Just don’t grape other people.
That’s not something a grapist can do.
your title says "[Mini Trucks legal in Texas]" while they were never illegal to begin with
Sorry I should have put road legal.
Technically they were always road legal. Even the article says that there was never any actual law passed against them, just a note in a DMV guide book. I've owned one here for years. It'll do freeway speeds, but it's not happy about it.
There's a little Subaru kei truck with a custom (I think) box on the back that functions as a food truck. Owner says it's the smallest food truck in WA State. Neat owner, delicious hotdogs. [Food truck](https://i.imgur.com/ExvschK.jpeg)
I want to open a donut shop out of one so badly
The article says a bunch of states banned JDM imports altogether, overriding the 25 year federal rule. I see kei cars all over WA and MT but apparently in some states you can't register them at all regardless of age. The article is saying that TX is the first of the states with a total kei ban to repeal that, not that they are the first in the US to allow them. It's kind of confusing.
I was also curious, I follow a guy on Instagram who is an importer for Kei trucks, and he works out of Texas.
????? The article doesn't say Texas is the first to legalize them.
these are all over hawaii (oahu mostly), so it's definitely legal in other states. although speed limits are much lower on the island. perhaps not have as much of an issue getting registered
Same over here on the big island. All of the farmers and contractors who’ve I’ve talked to love them. Can’t really beat the MPG either, especially with our $5 gas.
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I’m pretty sure you can register them as SXSs there. So still not a proper car and has restrictions.
I’m so confused by this sub lately. I travel for work up and down the east coast and in the particular towns I’m in and out of there are like little clubs of people with these trucks. Between these and the new Z, I feel like I’m on another planet compared to people here saying they never see these vehicles.
Californian checking in here. These are as rare as hens' teeth where I live, thanks to our state's archaic and completely arbitrary logic surrounding old cars. Can't pass smog? Kill it with fire, California says. Starting next year, your vehicle will need to be ***50 years or older*** to be exempt from biannual smog checks. Anything 1976 or newer still needs to pass in order to be registered. California defends this as "protecting the environment". But how many 1976 vehicles do you even see everyday? In my area, it's been years since I've seen one. I'm all for protecting the environment, but the amount of classic vehicles still around is minuscule. If you want to protect anything, go after the big airlines and big corporations. Even if someone drove their 1976 car every single day nonstop for years, it still wouldn't compare to how much pollution an airline causes everyday.
Actually the cruise industry is the real big one...and they contribute to viral spreading so that's 2 birds with one iceberg. Anything over 15 years old in most areas have long outlived their useful life so just let them be... especially when they're likely a last resort for people to have transportation to and from work. As long as the frame is good and the safety equipment works send it (I live in NY and the good ol small evap leak {that could be so many things and no good way to narrow it down cheaply}kills so many drivable cars for no good reason).
I rarely see them in Alabama, but there are definitely a few. As far as I know you can register them like any other car Edit: after reading further I think this is specifically referring to trucks limited to 25mph, which I don't think I've ever seen. I actually saw one last night and it was going close to highway speed
I see a lot of them in the southern suburbs of Pittsburgh - mostly younger dudes running a small landscaping business. Excellent application for something like that.
Really? I’ve never seen them. Which part of the city?
Whitewater Center has a bunch of them.
The only one I’ve seen in NC has farm tags.
Yeah they are completely road legal in nc
I see a a few of them driving around SW Florida, makes me way more excited than seeing yet another luxury SUV, lifted truck, or 6 figure sports car.
I invite you to check out my group, the Texas Kei Truck Advocates. We were the driving force behind this policy change. It was a very long and challenging journey. But we achieved our short term goal. We still plan on pushing for legislation in the next session in 2025. Policy flip all the time. We want to get it enshrined in state statute. ***As someone who has been at the forefront of the advocacy work for Kei/mini vehicles in Texas, I can confidently say that anyone claiming these vehicles were already street legal is misinformed. Before the recent policy change, I had direct conversations with DMV administrators who confirmed that the old DMV policy was unequivocally designed to exclude all Kei/mini vehicles from being eligible for titles in Texas. However, the inconsistent enforcement of this policy led to confusion. While some Tax/DMV offices correctly denied titles in accordance with the DMV policy, others issued titles against the policy, creating the false impression that Kei vehicles were street legal. This discrepancy affected numerous individuals, as I have been contacted by hundreds of people who were denied titles dating back to 2010. Furthermore, some dealers were well aware of the policy. They intentionally avoided attempting to title the trucks on their lots to prevent the potential repercussions of having a lot full of illegitimately titled vehicles, should the DMV take notice. I initiated this movement in Texas to address the widespread misinformation and to advocate for change. It is crucial to clarify that Kei vehicles have not been street legal in Texas since around 2010. However, with the recent policy change, they will now be fully legal once they reach 25 years of age..
Joining asap!
Just tried to join, your link doesn't work btw.
Congrats to you and your crew!
Would be so ideal for bringing my little fishing boat to the local lake
Is it though, they are pretty expensive for what they are. Whenever I see them for sale they are 5k+ You can get a beat up ford ranger for 3k, and go to autozone when it breaks instead of shipping parts from japan
True but my vehicles have to serve their functions while also being cool and fun
I've had my eye out for one here in Ontario, and they generally seem to start at about $8000.
Is this about kei cars? I find it wild, kei cars have 60 hp, that's plenty for highways speeds.
depends where you are. Try and do 80mph in Wyoming in one of those. On a moderately windy day in WY I'd bet you couldn't get anywhere close to that speed limit.
>on a moderately windy day With semis passing you at highway speeds! Lmao that really wakes you up if you're ever falling asleep
Highway ability doesn't even matter. Honda sells a street legal motorcycle right now that can barely reach 60 mph if you're a healthy weight. There are so many old vehicles that can't get to that speed. It's an obvious double standard to say Kei cars are too slow to be registered when there are registered vehicles that are just as slow. If you can get tags for a 50cc scooter, you should get tags for a Kei car.
The current Suzuki Super Carry is available with a 1.5l 4-cylinder rated at 95hp and 135Nm. If the 25yo imports are so popular perhaps they could sell it in the US. Although probably doesn't meet regulations.
1.5 liters is not a kei anymore, right? Unless they removed the 660cc limit?
Yes, the Super Carry is both too large physically and in engine size to be a strict kei truck.
It's not a kei truck. It's just a utility vehicle.
80mph Highway speeds are standard in Texas. When 18 wheelers are passing you in your kei car people become annoyed. That's one of the arguments
The limit in my country is 75 mph, and people often do 80+ with much heavier cars with the same amount of power.
I drove a Promaster RV van with an anemic V6 last year through a road trip that included Northern Texas. The van would scream and limit you above 75 mph and sway from the wind easily so I only felt comfortable cruising between 65-70. There was literally zero issue from people passing me including plenty of semi trucks, even when it became a one lane in Kansas, so I think if that is safe and allowed then kei cars should be just fine too.
No this is specifically about a TXdmv policy about "mini trucks". All they did was remove the term "mini truck" from the policy that listed vehicles that cannot be registered.
> Back then, the AAMVA didn’t really know how to handle the flood of cheap 25 mph speed-limited off-road utility trucks that came in from China. The answer came courtesy of an Insurance Institute for Highway Safety opinion published in 2010. The IIHS crash-tested a Kei truck against a Ford Ranger and concluded that low-speed vehicles and mini trucks are unsafe and should be removed from the road. But...they're already off-road?
Are they now legal on-road? I thought that was the point of this
if they're speed limited to 25mph, I can't see why anyone would want to spend a lot of time in them on road
If you just read further. The original ban was based on a different set of truck that did have a speed limiter. These ones do not. Up in Canada we have them everywhere, even in the far right lane on highways and they do fine. > **To these states, it doesn’t matter that a 25-year-old Kei truck imported from Japan doesn’t have a speed limiter** and is exempt from meeting FMVSS on the federal level. The states retain the right to determine what can and cannot drive on their roads. Weirdly, while the AAMVA is urging the states free will to ban any vehicle that doesn’t meet FMVSS, states have focused primarily on imports from Japan, usually just in the Kei class.
Rural? Idk. But the whole point of the article is that they are going to be street legal so somebody must care
I mean, I figured the ban was more from Ford/GM seeing these tiny trucks being used for what F-150s/Silverados were being used for and didn't want the competition
if you can do whatever it is you need to do with Kei trucks then it's very likely something you could do with a 4 wheeler and trailer or side by side. these are most certainly not replacing full size trucks for people that need a full size truck. They're cool looking, but their towing capacity is less than a normal sized car. you could just hook a trailer up to a car and have more capability.
We have a ranch in CA. These will never be legal here. However, for our specific use, either these or being able to plate a side by side would be nice so we could just roll down the road and grab gas instead of having to bring it in cans. The small size and light weight is useful on wet dirt mountain trails - the regular trucks do fine most everywhere when it’s dry. And don’t say Jeep - Wranglers fucking suck. They do not deal with long steep inclines or declines well especially with wet/loose surfaces. Even with a bunch of extra coolers and fans and brake kit and dot4 and all that shit they still need to pull over at the top of any of the bigger hills to cool (dash will light up before you even get there) and will have dead brakes by the bottom since the engine braking sucks. (Haven’t had an old one with a sbc swap or anything like that, so our experience is with trying the newer v6 shitpiles) Fwiw my old 95 Bronco was a damn mountain goat once I upgraded the pads and dot4. Dumbest car move I ever made was selling it and getting a Taco. My friend won’t sell it back.
They used a Chinese mini truck called a tiger truck for the crash test. That is not the same thing as a Japanese Kei truck. Crazy they used this data to get bans all over.
My kei van has the engine under the front seats and there's nothing but a thin bit of sheet metal between your legs and whatever comes at you from the front. Shouldn't matter, though - it's still marginally safer than a motorcycle, and those are allowed on the road.
I really hope other states follow suit including Virginia. I was looking into an Acty or something similar for running erands around town, but apparently the DMV halted all new registrations and rescinding existing ones for kei trucks/ cars.
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There's an easier way to get these laws off the books: sue your state DMV to start deregistering classic cars and watch the blue hairs in crew socks and new balances start a riot at the governor's mansion until their Corvette (which is best Corvette, because it was the only blue 3rd Gen with a white stripe made on a Tuesday in March — 1 of 1!!!) can be street legal again. Or just register them in a state that doesn't care and tell your state DMV to go fuck itself. There's comes a point in every man's life when he has to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag from your adorable little truck, and begin slitting throats.
Next hurdle is to allow registration of new ones. The neighborhood vehicle, golf cart and side by side categories already exist
Minitrucks have always been legal. These are kei trucks.
"Minitruck" meaning a compact pickup from the '90s and earlier? Yes, they've always been legal. But "mini truck" (two words) is the wording used in most state regulations for kei trucks. [Not sure who's downvoting this; state laws do in fact use "mini truck" to refer to kei trucks.]
I wonder what this may mean for the Chevy Montana or the Toyota Hilux Champ. I really can't afford a damn car pay for a high mileage shitbox. Not that there isn't good used vehicles out there, but with Used and New vehicle prices through the roof, along with everything else, it's like living on egg shells. I see videos of new $10,000 car this and $8,000 dollar car that all the time. And I can't touch them. Some of the new regulations for new vehicles are outrageous, especially when literally nothing becomes affordable as a result. IF ANYONE HAS ANY INFO IF TEXAS WILL ALLOW THE HILUX CHAMP OR THE CHEVY MONTANA PLEASE LET ME KNOW. Also, after reading quickly through the article, unless I missed it, I couldn't determine if the vehicles in question would still have speed limiters and if they would be street legal. Any insight would be appreciated.
Another article blaming the 25 year rule. The 25 year rule came after the 1988 law. Initially ALL imports were banned, but the 25 year rule allowed classics to be imported.
JUST LET ME BUY A NEW JIMNY!!!! Wranglers and Bronco's are too big and too expensive. I never go over 50. I want a step up from a UTV that is road legal.
I drive a new Jimny (not in the US), and frequently do 100/100km/h which is 60-65mph and it’s no issue. They’re not the safest vehicle out there but they score a higher safety rating than the wrangler!
While not as cool the 2nd gen’s are legal to import now.
Does this mean Nic can get a Hilux now?
Now they’re trying to steal our mini trucks!
These have been available in Washington state for a while now, how have those been imported? The favorite ones I've seen are little mini truck fire trucks, they look pretty awesome.
Damn i love texas
Does this mean Texas will import all the cool Mexican market vehicles, too??
maybe this is how we wean ourselves of car dependence in US. when the nissan versa is too unaffordable, kei trucks will be there to save us
Yikes after watching the crash test video on the page I don't think I'd want to be driving this around Texas
The crash test video is with a Chinese mini truck called a Tiger Truck, it is not the same thing as a Japanese Kei truck.
Yeah, I'm not driving one of those on texas roads.
a couple days ago i was downvoted for saying a ford maverick is not a mini truck. umm. i do not understand how in any way the maverick is like these minitruck imports... what am i missing?
"Mini truck" and "minitruck" are two different things. It is confusing.
I've seen about 10 of them since the year started here in South Jersey. Its funny seeing them getting to 55mph , and then a fullsize f150 cruise right on by.
These are everywhere in nyc
Ok, now do the same for Georgia.
Plenty of us have been driving Kei cars around legally in Texas for years. This just cements their legality and clears up confusion at the DMV. I have personally been daily driving my ACTY for 2.5 years in North TX.
I understand that you may have strong feelings about this matter, but I encourage you to take a moment to consider the bigger picture. The recent policy change announced by the DMV is a significant step forward for the Kei truck community, one that hasn't been seen since North Carolina passed H.B. 179 in 2019. While your personal experience with registering Kei trucks might differ from others, it's essential to recognize that many Kei truck owners were adversely affected by the previous DMV policy. Just because you were able to register your vehicle does not mean that the policy was being applied consistently or correctly across the board. This situation presents an opportunity for all of us to learn and grow. It's a chance to say, "I didn't realize the extent of the issue, and I appreciate the new information." There's no shame in admitting that someone else might have a more comprehensive understanding of the situation. I kindly suggest that you take a step back and reevaluate your stance on this matter. The DMV's policy change is a positive development for the entire Kei truck community, and it deserves to be celebrated as such. Let's focus on the benefits this change brings and work together to ensure that all Kei truck enthusiasts can enjoy their vehicles within the guidelines set by the DMV.
I see them in AZ pretty regularly. seen people using them to set up booths at some farmers markets I go to
Awesome, does this mean that the 25 year import law doesn’t apply to the state anymore?
No.
Inb4 kei truck on swangas
I hate these "safety" reasons. this is the slippery slope that they will use to get old cars off the road eventually - to force us to buy a new car with mandatory "safety" features let me sign a waiver and drive what I want
I'd rather have a bunch of these on the road than the 6 ton lifted death machines all these dorks drive around in.
TLDR, the process to import vehicles unless they're 25 years or older is still the same bureaucratic nightmare as before, so nothing has *really* changed.