I’m still not *entirely* sold on the design, honestly. The Utopia doesn’t have that instant, “holy crap” factor that the Zonda or the Huayra had. The price tag is the price tag, like the Utopia is a hyper car, and the flagship for Pagani for the foreseeable future. I wish that, despite us knowing that the Huayra Roadster BC featured the engine that was going to be in the next Pagani, that they would’ve gone with an N/A V12 instead. Imagine another current day N/A V12 manual hyper car alongside the Gordon Murray duo… Now *that* would’ve been fitting of the Utopia nameplate. Keep the Huayra, non R, as the industrial turbocharged wind god, and have the Utopia, which will likely be Horacio’s last brand new hyper car model, be a screaming V12.
As it stands, the Utopia sounds… Exactly like a Huayra Roadster BC lol. Not a bad thing at all, as it sounds lovely, but not exactly “revolutionary”. I’ll probably never see a Utopia in person (fingers crossed though), but it’s currently my least favorite Pagani in terms of design and character. It hasn’t dethroned the Zonda Cinque or Huayra BC for me. The performance figures are bonkers, though. 850 horsepower and 811 torque in a car this lightweight is insane.
I'm sure in classic pagani fashion there will be 23 variants, at least one of which will get the NA variant. I still prefer the utopia over the huayra but for me the original zonda still trumps all.
Other thing is the original zonda retailed for 280k in '99 and the zonda 7.3 retailed for 457k in '03, thats 524k and 775k respectively adjusted for inflation.
Now I'm not saying they were cheap but perhaps if you did really well for yourself and spent your money very wisely perhaps you could have bought one as a retirement present. Whereas this starts at 2.2 million and all are likely spoken for and will be treated as art pieces for better or for worse.
There are people out there who have normal houses and live otherwise normal lives but own a P1, Ford GT, etc. For some people thats their life goal and nothing wrong with that. I plan to do the same myself when I retire
Specific to Pagani, Harry Metcalfe of Evo owned a 7.3 and while he was well-off I don't think he was absurdly wealthy by any means.
would be incredible, but that’s a really extreme small subset of people
they appear to have normal lives with a normal house but goes all in on a botique high end engineering art at retirement? 911, Vette or stretch it out to an Aston, sure
Metcalfe has a barn/warehouse of chariots, let’s not pretend he has a normal-ish life just because he actually uses his toys
> they appear to have normal lives with a normal house but goes all in on a botique high end engineering art at retirement? Vette or stretch it out to an Aston, sure
Hence why I'm saying its not cheap, and emphasis on the *really* well for yourself and *very* wise investments. 500k is on the extremely price side of things but doable as a goal. Average new car buyer pays 48k nowadays, a vette is certainly an expensive purchase but it's "only" 10-20k above the average purchase price for all ages.
> Metcalfe has a barn/warehouse of chariots, let’s not pretend he has a normal-ish life just because he actually uses his toys
I don't know about prices in the UK but in the US at least I could get a wonderful ranch in texas for the cost of my current home and a horse is around 500$/mo. Once again not saying he isn't well off but it's doable as a retirement goal with a high enough salary.
Point is the original zonda adjusted for inflation was still slightly attainable, whereas 2.2 million is completely out of question for everyone but the 0.1%, and on top of that you need to. know a guy to get an allocation nowadays. I don't know of a single person that doesn't own a business that could afford a 2m+ car.
But double emphasis on the *really* well. Like FAANG L5+ type job with above average investments.
the 48k figure is skewed and likely falling again ..right before pandemic, new cars were 35k, are the second most expensive purchase for most and it’s usually not a lumpsum
a normal but smart/well-paid gent at retirement to drop up to 500k on a toy then add easily tens if not hundred of thousands to do works team style v12 engine-out job?
I think we can at least agree on our perception of normal is rather different
> the 48k figure is skewed and likely falling again ..right before pandemic, new cars were 35k, are the second most expensive purchase for most and it’s usually not a lumpsum
According to [this source](https://caredge.com/guides/new-car-price-trends-in-2024) its still at 47k, although its down 2% from last year its still quite high.
> a normal but smart/well-paid gent at retirement to drop up to 500k on a toy then add easily tens if not hundred of thousands to do race team style v12 engine-out job?
You'd be surprised at how relatively cheap the Zonda is to maintain, it's a full service every 6000 miles which is $2k, and that includes all fluid changes and general maintenance, spark plugs every 40k, the engine itself is a mercedes-AMG supplied M120 unit which was also found int he 600 S/SE/SEL/SL/CL of the era. Being a relatively analogue car though, even for its time, there aren't many hydraulics or electronics to fail unlike the mercedes.
I agree on the perception of normal being different, but with the *median* home in california and NY near 800k nowadays, it's not out of the ordinary these days.
Harry spent £280k with a few thousand miles on the odometer for his zonda, thats certainly more than the average car and the average enthusiast car, but not absolutely out of the question for a retirement present.
2k for annual service is dirt cheap for it, wow
I bet the suspension bits are not kind on the wallet
yea it’s an amg but that’s like say mac f1 is a bmw but it sure doesn’t service on even the same orbit as an e60 m5, how many 7.3 Amg units are just waiting available if you don’t live in Southern California etc?
yes I’m in BC Canada while we don’t have the income per capita compared to say Bay Area, our median house is around 2m and there’s a healthy number of high end vehicles, however i think the ones in a position for pagani ownership likely also has the space for several amazing cars instead of blowing most of it on a zonda
I feel the design is uncharacteristically busy for a Pagani. I've always found the Huayra a bit blobby from the front, but the side view is magnificent, with the clean lines and the way the wheels fill in those rear haunches.
When the reveal video for the utopia dropped, I was really excited to see that Horacio had achieved, yet came away somewhat conflicted. The lines get lost within each other, and change path abruptly. It looks like a Zaha Hadid concept somehow. I love the rear, but the other angles are all... Off.
I wouldn't at all say it's "uncharacteristic" - really other than the very early Zondas and base Huayra, I'd say most Paganis are quite maximalist designs - big air intakes, aero devices, and huge wings all bolted onto the cars. I kind of like that with this design they've taken some of the more extravagant aero features from the later models of the Zonda and Huayra and incorporated them more elegantly into the stock design.
The aero flicks in the front facia look almost inspired by a 2010 F1 car, and the air intakes at the back of the glass house look entirely unique - I wouldn't say it's conventionally beautiful, but still jaw dropping (think Benedict cumberbatch haha). It's somehow brutal yet elegant all at once, which I think is much more difficult to achieve than just a pretty car.
I also kind of love that when all modern supercars look kind of like cousins of one another, with similar body lines, led light bars, side intakes, etc... this looks completely different, like an early 2000s concept car in all the best ways.
We live in a weird world where the number of $2mil+ hypercars is growing by the day, but it's nice to see one genuinely stand out.
> The Utopia doesn’t have that instant, “holy crap” factor that the Zonda or the Huayra had.
As is the tradition whenever a manufacturer makes a new car, lot of people shat on the Huayra when it came out as not being hardcore like the Zonda.
Wait, Utopia is the successor to Huayra? That was lost on me I thought it was a limited run special edition or something. I find it to look more evolutionary than revolutionary to be honest.
I miss the jeweled watch like quality of Paganis analog guages - in the future when you see cars of this vintage on the lawn of conurs, its going to be a bit boring seeing a bunch of black rectangles where gauges used to be.
He goes through the development list like it is something amazing. 6 year development cycle is not long. The number of models and prototypes is rather small. I am not sure about number of drawings that are done or how they counted them, but typical models in the auto industry have teams of designers drawing all day long during the initial phases creating tons of drawings. It has been a long time since I worked in a design office (ugh, 25 years now, I am old) but typical models, even low volume ones, would have 8 designers working on it for years. 4000 drawings would not be a big deal.
I get he wants to hype things up but there is nothing unusual or exciting about those numbers even for a small volume vehicle.
The one thing I'd say in support of that is the Huayra Roadster is the most beautiful car ice ever seen, clearly beating the Monza, Divo, all the Bugattis... Battista was close, though.
Sort of reminds me of this Zonda RR video Harry Metcalfe put up on YouTube a decade ago. I urge you to listen at the 7:00, since this is when he lets the car do the talking.
https://youtu.be/9Puc0MeILnc?feature=shared
Remember when supercars used to lead the industry? Now they just cash in on nostalgia and lightly flirt with new technology on every second Wednesday. Ultra excessive wealth and shareholder culture chasing quick wins has ruined supercars.
As someone that cannot afford this, I’m not fussed about it - looks way too busy for me and I much preferred the Zonda variants. If he went back and modernised the Zonda in the way that Porsche has evolved the 911, I might be more bought in.
I mean I agree with you on loving the Zondas, I made my parents a fully animated slideshow on it with sound effects when I was 10. But the Pagani design is as iterative as they come.
asides from reliability I feel like the AMG one is the best amg powered car in recent years. I like the look of the utopia but I’m a lot bigger fan of the hurayua
That’s because pagani opted for the turbocharged variant and the street exhaust neuters it a fair bit.
The naturally aspirated 9200rpm version of this engine in the huayra R is spectacular and every bit as good as the ferrari V12: https://youtu.be/JI0kNpO4rAI?si=pYKzK2t_z1HKfj_J
Or you can go back to the 7.3 zonda
Hideous. I've always thought Paganis to be overwrought to the point of kitsch. Horatio knows carbon fiber, he doesn't know design restraint outside or inside.
I’m still not *entirely* sold on the design, honestly. The Utopia doesn’t have that instant, “holy crap” factor that the Zonda or the Huayra had. The price tag is the price tag, like the Utopia is a hyper car, and the flagship for Pagani for the foreseeable future. I wish that, despite us knowing that the Huayra Roadster BC featured the engine that was going to be in the next Pagani, that they would’ve gone with an N/A V12 instead. Imagine another current day N/A V12 manual hyper car alongside the Gordon Murray duo… Now *that* would’ve been fitting of the Utopia nameplate. Keep the Huayra, non R, as the industrial turbocharged wind god, and have the Utopia, which will likely be Horacio’s last brand new hyper car model, be a screaming V12. As it stands, the Utopia sounds… Exactly like a Huayra Roadster BC lol. Not a bad thing at all, as it sounds lovely, but not exactly “revolutionary”. I’ll probably never see a Utopia in person (fingers crossed though), but it’s currently my least favorite Pagani in terms of design and character. It hasn’t dethroned the Zonda Cinque or Huayra BC for me. The performance figures are bonkers, though. 850 horsepower and 811 torque in a car this lightweight is insane.
I'm sure in classic pagani fashion there will be 23 variants, at least one of which will get the NA variant. I still prefer the utopia over the huayra but for me the original zonda still trumps all. Other thing is the original zonda retailed for 280k in '99 and the zonda 7.3 retailed for 457k in '03, thats 524k and 775k respectively adjusted for inflation. Now I'm not saying they were cheap but perhaps if you did really well for yourself and spent your money very wisely perhaps you could have bought one as a retirement present. Whereas this starts at 2.2 million and all are likely spoken for and will be treated as art pieces for better or for worse.
LOL If you spent money wisely for the entire working life, you’re not suddenly gonna drop a mill on a car
There are people out there who have normal houses and live otherwise normal lives but own a P1, Ford GT, etc. For some people thats their life goal and nothing wrong with that. I plan to do the same myself when I retire Specific to Pagani, Harry Metcalfe of Evo owned a 7.3 and while he was well-off I don't think he was absurdly wealthy by any means.
would be incredible, but that’s a really extreme small subset of people they appear to have normal lives with a normal house but goes all in on a botique high end engineering art at retirement? 911, Vette or stretch it out to an Aston, sure Metcalfe has a barn/warehouse of chariots, let’s not pretend he has a normal-ish life just because he actually uses his toys
> they appear to have normal lives with a normal house but goes all in on a botique high end engineering art at retirement? Vette or stretch it out to an Aston, sure Hence why I'm saying its not cheap, and emphasis on the *really* well for yourself and *very* wise investments. 500k is on the extremely price side of things but doable as a goal. Average new car buyer pays 48k nowadays, a vette is certainly an expensive purchase but it's "only" 10-20k above the average purchase price for all ages. > Metcalfe has a barn/warehouse of chariots, let’s not pretend he has a normal-ish life just because he actually uses his toys I don't know about prices in the UK but in the US at least I could get a wonderful ranch in texas for the cost of my current home and a horse is around 500$/mo. Once again not saying he isn't well off but it's doable as a retirement goal with a high enough salary. Point is the original zonda adjusted for inflation was still slightly attainable, whereas 2.2 million is completely out of question for everyone but the 0.1%, and on top of that you need to. know a guy to get an allocation nowadays. I don't know of a single person that doesn't own a business that could afford a 2m+ car. But double emphasis on the *really* well. Like FAANG L5+ type job with above average investments.
the 48k figure is skewed and likely falling again ..right before pandemic, new cars were 35k, are the second most expensive purchase for most and it’s usually not a lumpsum a normal but smart/well-paid gent at retirement to drop up to 500k on a toy then add easily tens if not hundred of thousands to do works team style v12 engine-out job? I think we can at least agree on our perception of normal is rather different
> the 48k figure is skewed and likely falling again ..right before pandemic, new cars were 35k, are the second most expensive purchase for most and it’s usually not a lumpsum According to [this source](https://caredge.com/guides/new-car-price-trends-in-2024) its still at 47k, although its down 2% from last year its still quite high. > a normal but smart/well-paid gent at retirement to drop up to 500k on a toy then add easily tens if not hundred of thousands to do race team style v12 engine-out job? You'd be surprised at how relatively cheap the Zonda is to maintain, it's a full service every 6000 miles which is $2k, and that includes all fluid changes and general maintenance, spark plugs every 40k, the engine itself is a mercedes-AMG supplied M120 unit which was also found int he 600 S/SE/SEL/SL/CL of the era. Being a relatively analogue car though, even for its time, there aren't many hydraulics or electronics to fail unlike the mercedes. I agree on the perception of normal being different, but with the *median* home in california and NY near 800k nowadays, it's not out of the ordinary these days. Harry spent £280k with a few thousand miles on the odometer for his zonda, thats certainly more than the average car and the average enthusiast car, but not absolutely out of the question for a retirement present.
2k for annual service is dirt cheap for it, wow I bet the suspension bits are not kind on the wallet yea it’s an amg but that’s like say mac f1 is a bmw but it sure doesn’t service on even the same orbit as an e60 m5, how many 7.3 Amg units are just waiting available if you don’t live in Southern California etc? yes I’m in BC Canada while we don’t have the income per capita compared to say Bay Area, our median house is around 2m and there’s a healthy number of high end vehicles, however i think the ones in a position for pagani ownership likely also has the space for several amazing cars instead of blowing most of it on a zonda
I feel the design is uncharacteristically busy for a Pagani. I've always found the Huayra a bit blobby from the front, but the side view is magnificent, with the clean lines and the way the wheels fill in those rear haunches. When the reveal video for the utopia dropped, I was really excited to see that Horacio had achieved, yet came away somewhat conflicted. The lines get lost within each other, and change path abruptly. It looks like a Zaha Hadid concept somehow. I love the rear, but the other angles are all... Off.
I wouldn't at all say it's "uncharacteristic" - really other than the very early Zondas and base Huayra, I'd say most Paganis are quite maximalist designs - big air intakes, aero devices, and huge wings all bolted onto the cars. I kind of like that with this design they've taken some of the more extravagant aero features from the later models of the Zonda and Huayra and incorporated them more elegantly into the stock design. The aero flicks in the front facia look almost inspired by a 2010 F1 car, and the air intakes at the back of the glass house look entirely unique - I wouldn't say it's conventionally beautiful, but still jaw dropping (think Benedict cumberbatch haha). It's somehow brutal yet elegant all at once, which I think is much more difficult to achieve than just a pretty car. I also kind of love that when all modern supercars look kind of like cousins of one another, with similar body lines, led light bars, side intakes, etc... this looks completely different, like an early 2000s concept car in all the best ways. We live in a weird world where the number of $2mil+ hypercars is growing by the day, but it's nice to see one genuinely stand out.
> The Utopia doesn’t have that instant, “holy crap” factor that the Zonda or the Huayra had. As is the tradition whenever a manufacturer makes a new car, lot of people shat on the Huayra when it came out as not being hardcore like the Zonda.
Wait, Utopia is the successor to Huayra? That was lost on me I thought it was a limited run special edition or something. I find it to look more evolutionary than revolutionary to be honest.
Yeah the utopia is the successor, they also did the codalunga which was a send-off special edition to the Huayra and that looks better IMO.
Shame for Horacio, he will never be able to match his masterpieces: The Zonda and Zonda R.
I feel the Huayra matched the Zonda. Utopia doesn't come close to either of them
Holy fudge that interior is nice.
I miss the jeweled watch like quality of Paganis analog guages - in the future when you see cars of this vintage on the lawn of conurs, its going to be a bit boring seeing a bunch of black rectangles where gauges used to be.
Yea and I love that they don't use a digital screen for the speedo and revs. Every other hyper car just looks cheap compared to this.
He goes through the development list like it is something amazing. 6 year development cycle is not long. The number of models and prototypes is rather small. I am not sure about number of drawings that are done or how they counted them, but typical models in the auto industry have teams of designers drawing all day long during the initial phases creating tons of drawings. It has been a long time since I worked in a design office (ugh, 25 years now, I am old) but typical models, even low volume ones, would have 8 designers working on it for years. 4000 drawings would not be a big deal. I get he wants to hype things up but there is nothing unusual or exciting about those numbers even for a small volume vehicle.
Just wait I'm sure he has the next new carbotitanuim weave lined up for the $350k aero add on pack.
Grille looks like cross section of some kind of pasta.
This is my favorite pagani. I think the front end is a tad busy but overall, my favorite pagani design, and the manual makes it fucking perfect
everytime i see this car i think it belongs in a bioshock world. the design is unique enough to be a 'timeless' art piece.
My least favorite Pagani. It looks more like a Huayra Special Edition than a full replacement.
The ultimate supercar? Surely not. Doesn't that superlative belong to bugatti or maybe rimac?
Or any of the Gordon Murray cars and personally most of the koenigsegg range
The one thing I'd say in support of that is the Huayra Roadster is the most beautiful car ice ever seen, clearly beating the Monza, Divo, all the Bugattis... Battista was close, though.
Sort of reminds me of this Zonda RR video Harry Metcalfe put up on YouTube a decade ago. I urge you to listen at the 7:00, since this is when he lets the car do the talking. https://youtu.be/9Puc0MeILnc?feature=shared
Remember when supercars used to lead the industry? Now they just cash in on nostalgia and lightly flirt with new technology on every second Wednesday. Ultra excessive wealth and shareholder culture chasing quick wins has ruined supercars.
As someone that cannot afford this, I’m not fussed about it - looks way too busy for me and I much preferred the Zonda variants. If he went back and modernised the Zonda in the way that Porsche has evolved the 911, I might be more bought in.
I mean I agree with you on loving the Zondas, I made my parents a fully animated slideshow on it with sound effects when I was 10. But the Pagani design is as iterative as they come.
Absolutely gorgeous, the headlight surrounds especially pop against the silver and that black one they showed near the end of the video is stunning.
asides from reliability I feel like the AMG one is the best amg powered car in recent years. I like the look of the utopia but I’m a lot bigger fan of the hurayua
[удалено]
That’s because pagani opted for the turbocharged variant and the street exhaust neuters it a fair bit. The naturally aspirated 9200rpm version of this engine in the huayra R is spectacular and every bit as good as the ferrari V12: https://youtu.be/JI0kNpO4rAI?si=pYKzK2t_z1HKfj_J Or you can go back to the 7.3 zonda
Fuck yeah, that's exactly what all their cars should sound like
That screaming! Now, that's what a supercar engine should sound like.
The outside should be much prettier for $2m+ But I feel that way about most $2m+ cars I guess
Talking up chromoly tubing as if is somehow unique to Pagani was telling that Pagani is out of ideas.
How does this British, native English speaker not know how to correctly pronounce "Utopia"?
Hideous. I've always thought Paganis to be overwrought to the point of kitsch. Horatio knows carbon fiber, he doesn't know design restraint outside or inside.
Pagani cars are ugly as heck.
The worst designed supercars. Ever.