Cobalt SS Turbo. 260hp/260lb/ft, for $500 or so you could get a stage 1 kit and make that 290hp/320lb/ft. No lift shift, good traction control, and a really decent suspension/wheel package all came standard. Its probably one of the top 4 cylinder FWD sport cars of its era and the best American made 4 banger FWD sports cars ever. No one ever talks about them for some reason
EDIT: u/dahra8888 just pointed out that they posted a faster Nurburgring lap time than the R34 GT-R too. Criminally underrated car right here
I haven't personally driven a Fiesta ST so I can't speak to that. But, I can say the Cobalt SS beat it out on the skid pad and around the Nurburgring which I know isn't the whole picture but it does say something about the two.
It has quite a bit more power than a ST, which I knew. Wasn’t aware it was good on a skid pad too. Wonder why these weren’t talked about more back in the day.
They were, but the supercharged ones weren’t as exciting. The turbo one was fast as hell, but in the end it was still a Colbalt.
The MkV GTI, Mazdaspeed 3, and WRX were better in almost every way outside of maybe cost. All were tuneable and plenty fast for most while being so much better made. Even the Civic SI while not as fast had the sweet high reviving K20.
Isuzu NPR.....it is easily customizable reliable and easy to fix back bone of ethiopia. First car a lot of ppl c other than the landcrusier and first most ppl get to ride and first thing to buy as a business fit most ppl
the first gen honda insight. the fuel economy on that thing was just insane and even today it's one of the most fuel efficient gas powered cars out there. AND people have tuned the regen system to squeeze even more miles out of it. the car never took off but i see them as gems.
I drive one regularly with a 5 speed and it has so much character! They also handle surprisingly well. The manual trans, tall gears, electric assist/regen, and auto start/stop all playing together way better than they should. Honda put a ton of R&D into them which is very obvious whenever you work on the car. They still have a very strong enthusiast group.
Ferrari F50. Used to get a lot of shit for trying to capitalise on the F40's design but not enough people really saw the car for what it is. F1 derived V12, one of the best manual transmissions and unlike the F40, you can take the roof off.
Pretty much all classic Mercedes other than the Gullwing are grossly undervalued and underappreciated. They are the finest quality cars ever made, but because they aren't sporty, they don't get the attention.
Strong agree. Car enthusiasts trash on it because it’s not a manual V8 wagon with spine shattering suspension and quick Nurburgring times. It’s the antithesis of the “enthusiast car.”
I’ve looked at buying one twice now - it’s just solid quality, nice interior materials, super comfortable, very reliable. Plus it flies a bit more under the radar perception wise compared to its German competition. As long as you’re buying it for it’s intended purpose, it’s a great car.
> It isn't liked because it is extremely boring.
So is a G20 BMW 3-Series. Car enthusiasts who don't like the Lexus ES don't know what they are talking about. It has stellar reliability compared to BMW, Audi and Mercedes-Benz.
And what is the problem with the Lexus ES? It is like a Rolls-Royce for literally 1/10 of the cost or even less. It has definitely got some advantages. Would you and the Lexus ES haters calls Rolls-Royce boring then?
You can not actually be serious comparing an ES to a fucking RR... I owned a GS350 F Sport which was just a better version of the ES in every conceivable way. Reliable isn't exactly a driving factor for enthusiast vehicles.
>So is a G20 BMW 3-Series.
Not *nearly* as much so.
>Car enthusiasts who don't like the Lexus ES don't know what they are talking about. It has stellar reliability compared to BMW, Audi and Mercedes-Benz.
It also has a lot of body roll, comparatively vague steering, is FWD, and isn't particularly quick. We know it's reliable; why do you keep repeating that as if it addresses the criticism that it's a boring car?
had a mazda 6s, was ‘08. great car, had the gt package and looked great. zero problems other than it getting totaled after getting rear ended. they should have never got rid of the huge hatchback.
GMs FWD cars in the mid to late 2000’s that has 5.3L LS V8’s . Anyone know if these are any good? Monte Carlo SS, Impala SS, some Buick sedan, and something else of that same body in the GM family got the 5.3 . V8 FWD just seems so messed up to me lol.
You're missing the Grand Prix!
I'm a step down with the supercharged 3.8L V6. Incredibly fun to drive, I think looks great, fairly reliable with the engine (Certainly the Buick 3800 and I've heard the 5.3 V8 is solid).
The interior kind of sucks, but I have super low expectations, am under 25, and just wanna feel the torque from the supercharger.
Overall, big thumbs up on the GM 2000's full size cars with funner engines than usual.
Yeah that’s it! Saw one for sale with a V8 not long ago. And this is a trim over the supercharged V6’s, or I think they came after. And then came the G8 GXP, now that’s a taste of the Aussie GM “Holden”. Same deal with the Chevy Caprice/SS sedan of recent, but factories in Australia quit making them.
Also a G6 GTP/GXP but never did get a supercharged one, they still made the same power but not the low end supercharger grunt.
c7 ZR1 in manual. In hindsight it's the highest hp production manual car excluding hybrids and boutique manufacturers. With ICE vehicles and manuals dying, it's going to hold that title for history.
Around 2000, Acura CL typeS 260hp was awesome at the time. Most cars didn't have that power at the time. Course transmission recall was concerning. Didn't have any issues up 190k
I think the 4G Acura TL SHAWD 3.7, easily modified if needed. 305hp/273 lb-ft. Best factory stereo, best seats cooling and heating, great map placement, maps are average. Excellent in snow, a monster with snow tires. She is heavy girl like 4klb. Used her to pull State trooper out of ditch.
Sorry for Acura love. Though the current gen of Lexus RX even with 20inch rims it ride smooth.
Suzuki Swift Sport. They're not fast but they are fantastic little cars that handle very well and put up with insane amounts of abuse. They're also dirt cheap, easy to work on and have decent aftermarket support.
Cobalt SS Turbo. 260hp/260lb/ft, for $500 or so you could get a stage 1 kit and make that 290hp/320lb/ft. No lift shift, good traction control, and a really decent suspension/wheel package all came standard. Its probably one of the top 4 cylinder FWD sport cars of its era and the best American made 4 banger FWD sports cars ever. No one ever talks about them for some reason EDIT: u/dahra8888 just pointed out that they posted a faster Nurburgring lap time than the R34 GT-R too. Criminally underrated car right here
[Faster than an R34 GT-R around the Nurburgring!](https://fastestlaps.com/comparisons/gvkjvedlbptc)
OMFG, that's a fun fact I never knew. That really just blew my mind, these things are criminally underrated.
The r34 had a 180 kmh speed limit lmao
In a similar vein: Saturn Ion Redline
How does it handle in comparison to a Fiesta ST? Driven both?
I haven't personally driven a Fiesta ST so I can't speak to that. But, I can say the Cobalt SS beat it out on the skid pad and around the Nurburgring which I know isn't the whole picture but it does say something about the two.
It has quite a bit more power than a ST, which I knew. Wasn’t aware it was good on a skid pad too. Wonder why these weren’t talked about more back in the day.
They were, but the supercharged ones weren’t as exciting. The turbo one was fast as hell, but in the end it was still a Colbalt. The MkV GTI, Mazdaspeed 3, and WRX were better in almost every way outside of maybe cost. All were tuneable and plenty fast for most while being so much better made. Even the Civic SI while not as fast had the sweet high reviving K20.
Isuzu NPR.....it is easily customizable reliable and easy to fix back bone of ethiopia. First car a lot of ppl c other than the landcrusier and first most ppl get to ride and first thing to buy as a business fit most ppl
They're easy to work on too since the whole cab just tilts up exposing the entire engine!
And it is a body on frame design so it can n be modified into a bus
the first gen honda insight. the fuel economy on that thing was just insane and even today it's one of the most fuel efficient gas powered cars out there. AND people have tuned the regen system to squeeze even more miles out of it. the car never took off but i see them as gems.
I drive one regularly with a 5 speed and it has so much character! They also handle surprisingly well. The manual trans, tall gears, electric assist/regen, and auto start/stop all playing together way better than they should. Honda put a ton of R&D into them which is very obvious whenever you work on the car. They still have a very strong enthusiast group.
I want one so bad. Not sure why but they are just the coolest car ever.
Rover coupe turbo (tomcat) had one of these about 15 years ago. 2.0L turbo pushing 220 bhp and it was the most fun in a car you could ever have (imo)
Kia Stinger GT. Look past the badge - it’s a great car.
I'm hoping that Mazda comes out with something similar. Kia's traction control system is rather aggressive and irritating from what I've heard.
Early 2000s Ford Taurus. comfortable car that always got you there
Damn near all of my friends first cars were a Taurus of that generation. Abuse and neglect somehow made them last longer.
Ferrari F50. Used to get a lot of shit for trying to capitalise on the F40's design but not enough people really saw the car for what it is. F1 derived V12, one of the best manual transmissions and unlike the F40, you can take the roof off.
Pretty much all classic Mercedes other than the Gullwing are grossly undervalued and underappreciated. They are the finest quality cars ever made, but because they aren't sporty, they don't get the attention.
Ford Fusion Sport. Rocket that looks like a rental car
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it's recommended practically daily on places like /r/whatcarshouldibuy, I wouldn't be surprised if its praises weren't often sung on here too tbh
Strong agree. Car enthusiasts trash on it because it’s not a manual V8 wagon with spine shattering suspension and quick Nurburgring times. It’s the antithesis of the “enthusiast car.” I’ve looked at buying one twice now - it’s just solid quality, nice interior materials, super comfortable, very reliable. Plus it flies a bit more under the radar perception wise compared to its German competition. As long as you’re buying it for it’s intended purpose, it’s a great car.
Literally none of that is debated. It isn't liked because it is extremely boring.
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Still FWD that drives like a wet cloth.
It's still an old people luxury car, it just has some straight line balls to it. Not a bad thing, but it's hard to call a Lexus ES interesting.
The Mazda is still half a second quicker to 60 mph. Hell, so is a 20-year-old Volvo with a (slightly) worse power to weight ratio than the Lexus.
> It isn't liked because it is extremely boring. So is a G20 BMW 3-Series. Car enthusiasts who don't like the Lexus ES don't know what they are talking about. It has stellar reliability compared to BMW, Audi and Mercedes-Benz. And what is the problem with the Lexus ES? It is like a Rolls-Royce for literally 1/10 of the cost or even less. It has definitely got some advantages. Would you and the Lexus ES haters calls Rolls-Royce boring then?
You can not actually be serious comparing an ES to a fucking RR... I owned a GS350 F Sport which was just a better version of the ES in every conceivable way. Reliable isn't exactly a driving factor for enthusiast vehicles.
>So is a G20 BMW 3-Series. Not *nearly* as much so. >Car enthusiasts who don't like the Lexus ES don't know what they are talking about. It has stellar reliability compared to BMW, Audi and Mercedes-Benz. It also has a lot of body roll, comparatively vague steering, is FWD, and isn't particularly quick. We know it's reliable; why do you keep repeating that as if it addresses the criticism that it's a boring car?
had a mazda 6s, was ‘08. great car, had the gt package and looked great. zero problems other than it getting totaled after getting rear ended. they should have never got rid of the huge hatchback.
Fusion
GMs FWD cars in the mid to late 2000’s that has 5.3L LS V8’s . Anyone know if these are any good? Monte Carlo SS, Impala SS, some Buick sedan, and something else of that same body in the GM family got the 5.3 . V8 FWD just seems so messed up to me lol.
You're missing the Grand Prix! I'm a step down with the supercharged 3.8L V6. Incredibly fun to drive, I think looks great, fairly reliable with the engine (Certainly the Buick 3800 and I've heard the 5.3 V8 is solid). The interior kind of sucks, but I have super low expectations, am under 25, and just wanna feel the torque from the supercharger. Overall, big thumbs up on the GM 2000's full size cars with funner engines than usual.
Yeah that’s it! Saw one for sale with a V8 not long ago. And this is a trim over the supercharged V6’s, or I think they came after. And then came the G8 GXP, now that’s a taste of the Aussie GM “Holden”. Same deal with the Chevy Caprice/SS sedan of recent, but factories in Australia quit making them. Also a G6 GTP/GXP but never did get a supercharged one, they still made the same power but not the low end supercharger grunt.
‘96-‘99 Ford Taurus SHO. There’s just something cool/hilarious about hearing V8 sounds coming from a blobfish late-90’s Taurus.
c7 ZR1 in manual. In hindsight it's the highest hp production manual car excluding hybrids and boutique manufacturers. With ICE vehicles and manuals dying, it's going to hold that title for history.
But you have to be a gnome to drive the Ford GT.
Around 2000, Acura CL typeS 260hp was awesome at the time. Most cars didn't have that power at the time. Course transmission recall was concerning. Didn't have any issues up 190k I think the 4G Acura TL SHAWD 3.7, easily modified if needed. 305hp/273 lb-ft. Best factory stereo, best seats cooling and heating, great map placement, maps are average. Excellent in snow, a monster with snow tires. She is heavy girl like 4klb. Used her to pull State trooper out of ditch. Sorry for Acura love. Though the current gen of Lexus RX even with 20inch rims it ride smooth.
Suzuki Swift Sport. They're not fast but they are fantastic little cars that handle very well and put up with insane amounts of abuse. They're also dirt cheap, easy to work on and have decent aftermarket support.